# Walking your working dog



## Jennifer Coulter (Sep 18, 2007)

Jeff O said in another thread:

*Another view that will change if you ever get out of the retard stage with working dogs is the "taking a dog for a walk" .*

A couple of other comments on the board of late have me curious on how many of you "walk" your working dogs. State your dog's "work".

On or off lead? Rural/Urban?

Why or why not?


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## Anne Vaini (Mar 15, 2007)

Service Dog in Training

The walking we do is while working. For example. right now training her to pull a wheelchair. And she gets a heck of a walk on shopping days. 3 or 4 hours of walking through shops and supermarkets. 

Keeping the pup's mind tired and a little moderate activity works to exercise this particular dog. No need to "walk the dog." If there was need, I'd have her hop on a treadmill.

I agree with the above statement. I can't imagine having an ordinary (not useful) dog and taking it for walks, etc.


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## Chris Wild (Jan 30, 2008)

Our dogs do SchH primarily, though we're now also getting involved in SDA and a couple are also crosstrained in PP.

We walk our dogs. Rural areas often, since that's where we live. But we also occasionally take them for walks downtown, to outdoor festivals and fairs, and into stores that allow dogs (the local Borders, pet stores, farm stores, outdoor stores, etc..) Usually off leash or with ecollar in rural areas. Always on leash in urban areas.

Why? Because it's fun. We enjoy having them along, they enjoy coming along, and its nice to allow people to see some well temperamented, well trained GSDs sometimes.


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## Chris Michalek (Feb 13, 2008)

Jennifer, I bring my schH dog when/where ever I can. He walks just fine on or off lead. In fact we just returned from Lowes where he walked at my side with only an OB tab. We have outdoor malls here and several times a month I [and wife] walk the dogs around the 100s of people. Good mental exercise as well.

My wife goes running with him on most evening or early mornings.


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## susan tuck (Mar 28, 2006)

My dog is a schutzhund sport dog. I walk him everywhere I can. I love to go hiking and can't imagine not taking him. In So Cali we have leash laws, so I keep mine on a leash when hiking or walking, plus it's a good way to keep him away from the rattlers.

When we are in Washington we let him have the run of our acerage during the day, when we are outside with him. We do have cougars as well as other critters so we take a few precautions, like dogs are inside from dusk through dawn. If they need to relieve themselves during those hours it's on a short line on the drive way. The only people up there who leave their dogs outside have covered runs. Once we finish building we will do the same.


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## Mark Horne (Oct 12, 2006)

I walk my working dog alone (schutzhund). Generally we do 15 minutes training, then go for a 40min walk in the countryside. I go jogging a couple of times a week with the dog too.

In the UK, K9 handlers are instructed to exercise their dogs for three separate 20mins sessions per day.

In terms of mental or physical development, dogs like people need a bit of down time. Its a question of quality and timing. You wouldn't take your K9 for an hour in woods prior to starting a Night shift. 
The day after we go shutzhund training my dog has an easy day, bit of exercise and fun, then the cycle begins again.

I know of some people who only take there dog out to train, then lock it away with out any stimulation. I would respect them more if they were consistent and did the same with their familes, especially children.


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## Gerry Grimwood (Apr 2, 2007)

Since he was about 10 months we go for a walk every day, usually at night after work, about a 5K loop with some OB about halfway in a field we stop at, then a swim at the river.

Mostly in a rural/park area, weekends we are always out until we get hungry.


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## Geoff Empey (Jan 8, 2008)

Jennifer Coulter said:


> Jeff O said in another thread:
> 
> *Another view that will change if you ever get out of the retard stage with working dogs is the "taking a dog for a walk" .*


I agree with Jeff to me there is no taking a working dog for a walk. 

To me everything is a training opportunity and even taking your dog to the store or a hike around the neighborhood should be at the very least filled with training on some level even if it is asine obedience to slamming a saddle pack on the dog to carry a couple of 6 packs with ice over to buddy's place. 

Mindless walks to make the dog crap and pee are wasted time to me. I do like to bring the dog around people but even then she is working OB no matter how little, she has to work. All what you want to make of it I guess. 

A walk around the block for a dog like a Malinois is like never taking your Ferrari out of 1st gear. If I want to exercise her cardio and give her some fun time bring out the chuck it or eGGe, hell even better send her on a blind search or a few flee attacks on the field.


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## susan tuck (Mar 28, 2006)

Before I f'ing shattered my stupid arm I took my dog hiking up a mountain 8 miles, 5 days a week. That was just what we did in the morning after tracking. Now to me, THAT'S a nice walk! Walking/hiking with your dog is a great way for dogs to relax and smell the roses/grass/trees, whatever.


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## Gerry Grimwood (Apr 2, 2007)

Geoff Empey said:


> I originally wanted to have a pet but ended up trying Tracking, Sheep herding, Obedience, Agility, and we have started French Ringsport as well.


You got hardcore pretty quick.


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## susan tuck (Mar 28, 2006)

Gerry Grimwood said:


> Since he was about 10 months we go for a walk every day, usually at night after work, about a 5K loop with some OB about halfway in a field we stop at, then a swim at the river.
> 
> Mostly in a rural/park area, weekends we are always out until we get hungry.


I sure wish I had access to a lake where I could swim my dog when we are in So Cali. It's such a great form of exercize.


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## Bob Scott (Mar 30, 2006)

I take walks with my wife. :wink:
I have my dogs with me most of the time when I'm rehabbing houses, working in my wood shop (garage) or just kicking back . they rarely have even a collar on. The two GSDs often spend time wrestling with one another unless I'm on break. Then they focus on me. I do take lots of breaks\\/ . I'm retired and earned the right! :grin: :razz: 
During those breaks I train, play fetch and just have fun with the dogs. 
That, with three days a week at club training, give them plenty of exerxcise. 
I've said it in the past. I'd rather play with my dogs then get free Super Bowl and/or World Series tickets. 
They get plenty of exercise.


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## Alegria Cebreco (Jul 25, 2007)

Since that comment was directed towards me I will respond. Walking is in no way even close to the amound of exercise my dog needs DAILY. Let's see today, we went swimming hiked for about 4-5 miles, played two ball twice about 20-25 minutes each session, worked on focus and basic OB, and had some spring pole fun (very low to the groud to keep him from jumping). 

When we are hiking or in a secluded area, Mace is off leash, which IS a training opportunity. Around my neighborhood he's on leash for safety issue (cars, loose dogs, ect). My dog is my companion first, working dog second. :-$


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## Gerry Grimwood (Apr 2, 2007)

susan tuck said:


> I sure wish I had access to a lake where I could swim my dog when we are in So Cali. It's such a great form of exercize.


And it's fun, there is nothing wrong with a dog enjoying its life.

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=kIm8GdgoEzE


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## susan tuck (Mar 28, 2006)

Now I'm confused. Alegria what comment are you talking about and why would you think it was directed at you? Isn't this thread just about whether or not we walk our dogs not our daily training and conditioning schedule? I think you will find all of us who frequent Working Dog Forum do a lot of training, that's pretty much a given. 

For myself, although I love dogs, I choose a dog that can do well in sport, the fact that he makes a fantastic companion is gravy.


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## Catalina Valencia (Feb 20, 2008)

> I agree with Jeff to me there is no taking a working dog for a walk.
> 
> To me everything is a training opportunity and even taking your dog to the store or a hike around the neighborhood should be at the very least filled with training on some level even if it is asine obedience to slamming a saddle pack on the dog to carry a couple of 6 packs with ice over to buddy's place.
> 
> ...


Me too. I never walk my working dog to go to the store or just to go around the block. She's usually with me in the car, so every chance I have we stop and train, wich means she is used since a little pup to work everywhere and not only in one or two training fields. When she gets off of the car she know the routine is to pee and then work, work, work, she doesn't even wander around, but ask for me to start training.

Sometime we go hiking or to swim to the river, but to me that is not in the same category as the walk of a house pet.


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## Carol Boche (May 13, 2007)

I walk for myself, for a variety of reasons....exercise, to unwind after a stress filled day, to check the pond on the south end of the property....ect...

so....one or two dogs go with me each time. Depends on which dog needs it, or needs some on-lead "behave" work. \\/


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## Alegria Cebreco (Jul 25, 2007)

susan tuck said:


> Now I'm confused. Alegria what comment are you talking about and why would you think it was directed at you? Isn't this thread just about whether or not we walk our dogs not our daily training and conditioning schedule? I think you will find all of us who frequent Working Dog Forum do a lot of training, that's pretty much a given.
> 
> For myself, although I love dogs, I choose a dog that can do well in sport, the fact that he makes a fantastic companion is gravy.


The comment Jeff O made was directed towards me in the prong collar thread. Seeing as I'm in a "retard" phase, maybe there is something I'm not doing compared to you all. Yes, I take walks, whats so wrong with that? What harm can come from a walk?


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## Gerry Grimwood (Apr 2, 2007)

Alegria Cebreco said:


> I take walks, whats so wrong with that? What harm can come from a walk?


No harm at all, some people are just too caught up in themselves and their egos to ever think that a dog could benefit from something so simple.


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## Lee H Sternberg (Jan 27, 2008)

Gerry Grimwood said:


> No harm at all, some people are just too caught up in themselves and their egos to ever think that a dog could benefit from something so simple.



AMEN!!!!


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## Alegria Cebreco (Jul 25, 2007)

[-o<  


I mean, its sad that its actually funny. Its just a walk, lol.


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## Howard Knauf (May 10, 2008)

Here's how I see it.....If the dog is a PSD there is no need to take him for a walk. That dog should get plenty of exercise at work, and plenty of rest at home. On top of that...you are not the owner of the dog. The PD is responsible for anything that might happen to the dog or what the dog might do 24/7. Why take the risk of something bad happening when you don't have to?

If the dog is your personally owned animal, have at it. Hell, put him in a tutu for all I care. 

Howard


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## Howard Gaines III (Dec 26, 2007)

Howard Knauf said:


> Here's how I see it.....If the dog is a PSD there is no need to take him for a walk. That dog should get plenty of exercise at work, and plenty of rest at home. On top of that...you are not the owner of the dog. The PD is responsible for anything that might happen to the dog or what the dog might do 24/7. Why take the risk of something bad happening when you don't have to?
> 
> If the dog is your personally owned animal, have at it. Hell, put him in a tutu for all I care.
> 
> Howard


 A tutu??? If I did that, my dog would eat me up, spit me out, and never speak to me again...[-X


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## Lisa Maze (Mar 30, 2007)

Alegria Cebreco said:


> The comment Jeff O made was directed towards me in the prong collar thread. Seeing as I'm in a "retard" phase, maybe there is something I'm not doing compared to you all. Yes, I take walks, whats so wrong with that? What harm can come from a walk?



Hi Alegria,

One of the things you will find in discussing dog training is that many seemingly innocuous words and phrases will cause an emotional reaction in dog people. Just look at any thread about corrections, training tools etc..

When we are referring to dogs and dog training the word "walk" takes on a whole new meaning. To me the word walk brings to mind the all inclusive training/exercise/socialization/environmental enrichment/pack bonding walk that your average pet dog gets daily, if lucky. It makes me think of all the under stimulated, over weight dogs who lack a real opportunity for social interaction who are living in pet homes and being labeled as problem dogs when they chew, bark, dig etc. to alleviate the stress caused by their impoverished living conditions.

Not that any of this excuses our poor social behavior but maybe it will give you a little more perspective into the "Secret Life of the Dog Person." A good exercise for any "newbies" planning on joining the forum (or the world of dog people in general) would be to sit back and read the threads for a week or two before posting. If you did, you would see a fairly predictable pattern of behavior concerning certain topics (name calling, flame throwing, emotional outbursts, etc.) and then if you still felt brave enough to post you would be less likely to take it as a personal attack.

Lisa


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## Geoff Empey (Jan 8, 2008)

Gerry Grimwood said:


> You got hardcore pretty quick.


It was all about the dog Gerry. She demanded it. It was either that or she was going back to the breeder as she was destroying my house and herding my kids. Basically she was driving me nuts! 

I bought a Malinois thinking it would magically be a Lab. :lol: Silly me!! 

This is what my bitch does to unwind instead of a walk. Gets her out of first gear you know! Wears out my son too! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kl1xwN0OIgY

IMHO walking isn't a bad thing .. my only thought is that it is lost training time. If you just look at it as a walk.


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## Lee H Sternberg (Jan 27, 2008)

Geoff Empey said:


> It was all about the dog Gerry. She demanded it. It was either that or she was going back to the breeder as she was destroying my house and herding my kids. Basically she was driving me nuts!
> 
> I bought a Malinois thinking it would magically be a Lab. :lol: Silly me!!
> 
> ...


There you go, Geoff. That explains it well. I try to combine any walks into other things. I try to walk in many different areas to expose my dogs to lots of environments. I try to due short obedience sessions as well as free them to relax and look around. 

I try to keep it fun and interesting and great for ongoing bonding.

On non bitework days I also due plenty of Chuck It throwing to calm the older maniac down. I do limited 2 ball with the little pup.


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## Carol Boche (May 13, 2007)

<sigh> okay, I admit it....I fall into the "tard" category too.\\/ 

But, I do have SAR dogs that need to be friendly and behaved around people. I think it would fall into a "training opportunity" as well, but sometimes I just feel like taking them out and letting them "be a dog" too.

I do not take Jeff's comments to heart, but rather, I learn from his posts where he talks about training. Sometimes I agree, sometimes I don't and sometimes I laugh A LOT!!!!
He does not know many of us personally so I think his comments are meant in a "generalized" way and that is his style. 

I have a trainer that I work with that smacks people with a baseball cap and says "WTF?" 
At first that was hard to take, but I have learned much and have good dogs to show for it. SO, a little ribbing does not bother me at all. 

I have no issues with anyone doing anything with their dogs, that is their choice. Just as I ignore people when they think what I do with my dogs is incorrect, unless it is a training issue and then I listen and usually learn something that works better OR that I can put in my toolbox for later.


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## Kadi Thingvall (Jan 22, 2007)

I went for a walk the other day. And I took a dog. :-o So did the friend who went with me :-o :-o And we wandered around downtown checking out all the little shops and chatting.

Although I probably don't go for as many walks as I should, to danged busy with a job, household, and dog training, when I do I always take a dog. And for the most part all we are doing is going for a walk. Nice casual head down the street type walk. For me it's down time. A chance to get out, stretch my legs, and relax. I don't want to turn it into a training opportunity, other then maybe a little "don't pull on the leash", "come to heel so these people can pass us on the sidewalk", etc I don't expect it to be any real exercise for my dog, unless we walk somewhere that I can take them off leash and throw the ball for awhile, it's just supposed to be some casual interaction. Kind of like having them hang out in the house with me while I'm on the computer, or watching TV. Except we are moving instead of sitting.

I don't think this type of thing is a requirement of life to be a good working dog, but I also don't think it's going to hurt my working dog in any way. And if my dog is supposed to be any sort of protection for me, it can't really do it's job if it's at home while I go for a walk by myself.

Then again, if I had a tutu I might also be tempted to put it on my dog LOL So maybe I am just a "tard"


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## Howard Knauf (May 10, 2008)

Tiny bubbles............Which one is Don Ho? Nice pic. Some Mals just won't stand still for the humiliation. They'd rather shred the accoutrements. \\/


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## Rachel R Phelan (May 26, 2008)

We walk our Dutch Shepherd pup (5mths) 3x's a day, swimming 2-3 hours per week more if time allows, and around an hour of hardcore "fetch" everyday. He will be starting his pre-agility training classes soon, so we will throw that into the mix soon, and when he is old enough he will be doing trail running with me. We also take him to every store we can actually take a dog to, and during all the items I mentioned there is always some sort of training/obedience exercise taking place. 

Have a great day!


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## Kadi Thingvall (Jan 22, 2007)

Howard Knauf said:


> Tiny bubbles............Which one is Don Ho? Nice pic. Some Mals just won't stand still for the humiliation. They'd rather shred the accoutrements. \\/


LOL The dogs are Echo - SchIII, FR lvl I and Cali - FRII I find that dressing my dogs up really isn't a big deal to them, probably because they are used to wearing various training gear throughout their lives, like agitation collars, harnesses, etc. So tossing something else on them isn't a big deal. I sure wouldn't put them in a crate or kennel like this, the outfits would come off pretty darned quick. But if I give them something to do after I put them on, like play tug or in Echo's case Brenda took him out and ran entire Sch routine afterwards, they are to focused on what they are doing to care about looking stupid.

This was actually a Schutzhund breast cancer fund raiser with a Hawaiian theme, so almost all the dogs there were dressed up, and about 1/2 did their routines in costume. But I've been known to dress my dogs up in stupid costumes for many reason, not just this one \\/


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## Jennifer Coulter (Sep 18, 2007)

Appreciate everyone's insights on "walking the dog" and the different reasoning according to what the dog's work includes.

My dog's life is quite structured, especially when he comes to work with me in the winter . In the winter I like to try to get my dog's exercise and training in "on the clock" when possible. Not much in the way of walking....

In the summer I hike for a living and for fun, I like to bring the dog along when the objective is suitable... sucker for exercising him while I get paid. Somedays he walks all day...sometimes half a day...some not at all and spends the day in his work kennel. 

I like to do some kind of more formal search a couple of days a week on average, but it is not a daily thing. We do some ob sessions and toy play at home almost daily, but in our down time we walk a lot (off lead). And by walk I mean walking, running, mountain biking, ski touring....not just walking.

WHY:

*I *like* to walk/ride in the bush, often alone, I like having the dog with me. 

*If I am going to be bringing my dog along with paid hiking clients the dog better be acustom to that activity and have some trail manners, not chasing wildlife, knocking people over, throwing sticks at their feet....

*I learn things about him that are useful for his SAR work by having him out like: 
-how long can he walk on sharp rock in the alpine all day with out shreading his pads(not to mention conditioning him to the conditions we work in)
-how does he handle 8 hrs of full sun in the alpine with no shade, what about stinking high winds, thunder, hail...?
-how does the dog look smelling fluffy bunnies (real ones not the Jeff kind) on the air, how about a bear?
-and so on...

*There are training opportunites out there like doing a short ob session in front of a harem of elk:razz: 

*Sometimes I am lazy and don't want to do any training of any kind (OMG was that outloud 8-[ ), but want the dog exercised because he will piss me off in the house and pace at night otherwise..

Though I appreaciate all of the training/socilaization opportunites "walking the dog" can include, I am in favor of the dog having time to just be a dog and NOT have to always focus. When we just go for a casual walk in the woods sometimes I even try to NOT give a single command or talk to the dog AT ALL. It is not that easy for me The dog likes it just fine:mrgreen: 

That he is comfortable ranging, investigating things on his own and not just hanging off of my every word/move is important to me.


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## Alegria Cebreco (Jul 25, 2007)

Lisa Maze said:


> Hi Alegria,
> 
> One of the things you will find in discussing dog training is that many seemingly innocuous words and phrases will cause an emotional reaction in dog people. Just look at any thread about corrections, training tools etc..
> 
> ...


Thankyou Lisa for your reply. I didnt take it personally, its just childish to me and not a good way to gain respect, at least not with me. 

A walk is more so for me not my dog. Most of his daily exercise is just him moving, not me (like I mentioned before). I have the ENTIRE day with my dog, most of the time so a walk is not going to waste time and why NOT take my dog. He gets tons of stimulation everyday, and all I know is that everynight as I sit on this computer, I've got a happy tired pup laying at my feet. =D>


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## Geoff Empey (Jan 8, 2008)

Jennifer Coulter said:


> Though I appreaciate all of the training/socilaization opportunites "walking the dog" can include, I am in favor of the dog having time to just be a dog and NOT have to always focus. When we just go for a casual walk in the woods sometimes I even try to NOT give a single command or talk to the dog AT ALL. It is not that easy for me The dog likes it just fine:mrgreen:
> 
> That he is comfortable ranging, investigating things on his own and not just hanging off of my every word/move is important to me.


I did that last week the dog and my 2 boys went about 8km down the Transcanada trial. I put a long line on her collar with a bear bell she did carry h20 for us in a saddle-pack but I let her have the run of everything. She chased chipmunks and squirrels up trees and dug a few gopher holes bigger. I still thought of it as a training exercise though. Sort of like all the dogs toys are actually the handlers toys not the dogs. She is free and having fun but it is still on my terms not the dogs. 

Maybe I'm a weirdo but I just can't fathom the thought of having the dog NOT having 'some' focus on me and me having some control over any given situation. I have to much time and money invested in her to let her run off to get lost/stolen or humped by a coyote or killed by a bear. Stranger stuff has happened.


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## Howard Knauf (May 10, 2008)

When we were in NC in July we took the dogs to a large state park with multiple waterfalls. It was great exercise for them, as well as us. The place was a target rich enviroment. Lots of horses, wild critters, people and of course, strange dogs. It was a great way to get them out, and work on recall and OB under distraction. The swimming in the mountain lakes was the best of all though. Good times with the boys. I have to say...they were TuTu-less=D>

Howard


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## Jennifer Coulter (Sep 18, 2007)

Geoff Empey said:


> Maybe I'm a weirdo but I just can't fathom the thought of having the dog NOT having 'some' focus on me and me having some control over any given situation. I have to much time and money invested in her to let her run off to get lost/stolen or humped by a coyote or killed by a bear. Stranger stuff has happened.



You are correct there is SOME focus. I just try not to turn a casual peice of exercise into obedience ALL the time. TRUST me this kind of :-$ comes after the dog has learned not to eat poop, chase bears, kill squirrels....the fact that I can get through a walk (sometimes, not always) with out saying "NO or LEAVE IT" is a function of repetition, anticipation and previous training. The idea is similar to what Kadi was talking about on lead in town when she might just ask the dog to not pull or the odd heel to get out of people's way. The dog has already learned the manners about not eating garbage off the ground, chasing kids on skateboards and so on (sorry..guessing here Kadi)

My dog that I have spent A LOT of time and money on is going to be out of my sight in the wilderness at times when working on a SAR callout so it better not cause me any panic on a daily basis and he better not run away. The dog ranges, check things out, sniffs around, but waits up a head around bends, or races back to me from behind. To say that the dog is not focused on me is not completely true, just not the intense focus I expect when he is off leash at winter work around the skiing public, or the kind of focus he expects from ME when we are playing some kind of game with a toy ...


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## Jeff Oehlsen (Apr 7, 2006)

Quote : My dog is my companion first, working dog second.










That sentence pretty much describes 95% of everyone here on this board. How many of you compete at all???? It is all nice to show up at club and flop around and then come on the board and talk about walking your dog bla bla bla, but seriously, how many of you do anything at all ??????

How many of you belong to a club ? ? ? ? 

How many of you without a club could still train in the sport you are in ? ? ? ? 

Look, most of you are just pet owners, and that is just fine. I do not recommend taking pups out for a walk as it just teaches them bad habits, habits that you have to correct with force.

Stop being so ****ing sensitive. Not the end of the world if I tell you you are a retard LOL If I didn't suck at typing so much, AND you actually knew who the **** I really am, you would find that I call myself retard quite a bit as well. The difference is that I actually know what I am doing, and still manage to **** it up.......you guys are still really new.


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## Jeff Oehlsen (Apr 7, 2006)

Maze, are you actually saying that you take your dogs for a walk for enrichment ? ? ? ? Nice word tard LOL=D> =D> =D> =D>


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## Anne Vaini (Mar 15, 2007)

I love you, Jeff. :lol:


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## Jeff Oehlsen (Apr 7, 2006)

Gosh thanks, 



I am still laughing at the idea of Maze taking her dogs for a walk.


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## Jennifer Coulter (Sep 18, 2007)

Jeff Oehlsen said:


> Quote : My dog is my companion first, working dog second.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I don't advocate that everyone walk their dog. I don't compete in dog sports, what do I know about raising a good sport dog?

That is why I asked what people do with their dogs for "work" and "why" they do or don't walk their dogs.

You answered the question very well, you feel it will teach bad habits that will be a detriment to your competition dog, Howard K was able to speak to how he feels about walking a PSD, Carol to her SAR dogs, Kadi to her Hula dogs and so on....


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## Jennifer Coulter (Sep 18, 2007)

Anne Vaini said:


> I love you, Jeff. :lol:





Jeff Oehlsen said:


> Gosh thanks,



Anne I think you made him blush:lol:


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## Lisa Maze (Mar 30, 2007)

Jeff Oehlsen said:


> Maze, are you actually saying that you take your dogs for a walk for enrichment ? ? ? ? Nice word tard LOL=D> =D> =D> =D>


If you actually read and understood my post you would realize I was saying that many dog trainers associate the word walk with the bare minimum we can get the average pet owner to do with their dog everyday. The poor pet dog has to squeeze all of its exercise, enrichment, socialization and interaction with the handler out of that 30-40 minute walk.

Not that I am accusing Algeria of this.

No, I do not walk with my dogs but before I moved to San Antonio I hiked, swam, let them run with the horses etc. for conditioning and the psychological release that comes from letting dogs be dogs. My greatest pleasure is watching them in this approximation of their natural state while I huff and puff behind them.

I never "walk" my dogs in the pet dog sense since the get their exercise, enrichment, training and socialization in other more goal oriented forms.

In this case, I do agree that walking the dog is likely doing more harm than good. I use as evidence the fact that Algeria is using a prong/pinch collar to inhibit her dog from pulling on the leash. Very likely she is raising her dog's threshold for physical correction. The goal when using a pinch collar in obedience is to sensitize the dog to correction so very little leash pressure is required to communicate to the dog. My end goal is be able to work the dog in a slip lead or flat collar. 

I prefer that puppy folks find off leash ways to exercise their pups including ball play, swimming, hiking or just a game of hide and seek in the local baseball field. For socialization, I like them to take their hungry pup to a variety of locations for short intense sessions of focus and training where the puppy is never given the chance to pull on leash. 

There are some things I do with my dogs that are for me and not my dogs such as take them to street fairs, outdoor cafe's etc.. I know they would prefer a more dog centered activity but I love their companionship and the oohs and aahs I get as people admire the beautiful well trained dogs.

Lisa


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## Erin Sullivan (Jul 24, 2007)

my working dog's a pit bull (we train in schutzhund). i used to walk him farily often, but i don't walk him often at all anymore. not because i was worried about encouraging bad habits so much as that i hate the idea of running into other dogs that want to start crap with him. 

so now he has a treadmill at home for heavy exercise and conditioning, and in the mornings after tracking, he gets some time off-leash time to chase the ball in a secluded field. 

and i do take him out with me when i'm running errands to do some socializing and obedience in public . . . i think it's good for him to remember how to behave in the real world, and learning to ignore people going about their business is a good exercise as far as i'm concerned.


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## Jeff Oehlsen (Apr 7, 2006)

Quote: If you actually read and understood my post

Yes Lisa, all those big words like "enrichment" were making it difficult. I actually read and understood your post quite well, but nice try. It took a while as I could not see you walking your dogs, and was laughing my ass off.

For those of you that do not know, San Antonio is pretty much a ****ing oven, and I have no doubt that a walk here for people with normal hours would cook the dang thing like a thanksgiving turkey. That is why I thought it was funny. I worry about the dogs in the middle of the night. The humidity here is rediculous, yet all the plants look all deserted up. Weird. Can't wait to leave.


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## Gerry Grimwood (Apr 2, 2007)

I'm still going to go for walks with my dog, I don't care what Jeff calls me :lol: 

I also have a gut feeling that alot of the serious sport trainers couldn't keep up.


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## Kristen Cabe (Mar 27, 2006)

I belong to a club, have competed, am currently training for our December trial, and absolutely could not train in the sport I'm training in without a club.

I take my dogs for a walk _occasionally_, but not on any specific schedule or anything, and really only when I feel like it (which isn't often :lol. Usually they are pretty short walks, too, so the dogs probably don't get much out of them other than just being out with me. I always keep them leashed on walks.

I used to take Jak just about everywhere with me, including Home Depot/Lowe's and Tractor Supply Co. I never had to worry about him if a kid were to run up on him or whatever. I don't take Deja out in public much, unless I'm going to be training, and I don't let people interact with her. She runs a little on the civil side, espECIALLY when she's in the car - I have seen her come halfway out the window (which I didn't think she could fit her head through, but she did) after someone before, and she wasn't playing.


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## Gerry Grimwood (Apr 2, 2007)

(In my best Andy Rooney voice)

Didja ever wonder why in the PPD threads, where people are supposed to be training dogs to protect their lives/property and well being, dogs are expected to be family members as well, probably go for walks as part of their job description.

Then, in Sports where really the focus is the presentation of a manufactured behaviour, the dogs appear to be more restricted in what they are allowed to do or participate in. Because lets face it there are only 3 spots on a podium be it Regional/National or Worlds, most people wont get there, and after 3rd isn't that just like almost winning a lottery ? 

Why then do some get their shorts in a knot trying to prove they don't or wont walk with their dogs ?? Like your dog is so serious he can't do something meaningless just for the hell of it, Like it will really screw up years of work and training :lol: People say it's all about the dog/genetics bla bla bla. How could going for a walk/hike/run/drunken crawl with a dog screw it up ??


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## susan tuck (Mar 28, 2006)

" My greatest pleasure is watching them in this approximation of their natural state while I huff and puff behind them." (Lisa)

hahahaha That's me - huffing and puffing behind'em! What's that old joke about the view for all the sled dogs except the lead dog? :-o

Jeff: To answer your questions, ME ME ME!!! I belong, I compete - that is when I'm not all broken and shit. What with my current situation I'm afraid my dog might be 4 years old before I'm able to put a schHI on him, and that's not funny, but nevertheless I don't give up, just like other people I know.:-D :-D :-D


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## Michelle Reusser (Mar 29, 2008)

I'm with Gerry, I walk my dog. Not as much as some people and more than others I suppose. I do it to enjoy time with my dog in a less formal way and to get myself some excersize.(my dog gets his durring training and playing ball) I hardly ever have a leash on him unless we are going full on into stores or the vet. I live in town but it's a smallish old school town ad cops just wave instead of throwing a fit about my obviously controled dog, being offleash. A few weeks ago we walked over the bridge and into the next town over with just the E on him. My daughter had my female pup who we were desensetizing to traffic. My dog was just along for the ride, to get him out of the kennel for part of the day. No bad habbits formed and we all had a good time. Usually I like walking/hiking in the country but it's just easier to frequent the neighborhood, so I can just walk outside my door and not have to start up the gas guzzler.Been to hot to do much walking for fun but when fall comes, I love just being outside and why shouldn't I let my dogs enjoy it too?

Right now we are training in PSA but he will be my PPD after he is done trialing.


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## Ann Putegnat (Mar 11, 2008)

I do walk my Malinois. I try to use the 'walking' process to allow the dogs to practice just walking at my side in 'touch' position. Right now, I am walking two at a time. It isn't about peeing and pooping. It isn't about getting exercise. It is about learning to amble along in touch position for extended periods of time through a myriad of circumstances. Through downtown Brussels on Saturday night. Around the walking park on the east bay of San Francisco for 3 miles. Walks aren't for the dogs. They are for me..........
Ann


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## Alegria Cebreco (Jul 25, 2007)

LOL Jeff, if you knew me you would know I'm not sensitive and can be a crude bitch, but I choose not to portray myself in a childish manner  .

Lisa, your right, a walk to me is not exercise for the dog if that was his only source of exerise I would be really skinny by now, lol. Like I mentioned earlier my dog gets tons of stimulation daily. And for the most part he is off leash, unless we are in a crowded area or near a big street (he is still a puppy, and I wont risk that).


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## Howard Gaines III (Dec 26, 2007)

Gerry are you saying that you go for drunken crawls with your dog? HEHEHE! Got video? I think that if the area in which you live is safe, walks and talks with your dog can only help make the bond stronger. I walk on leash with mine because of the heavy traffic on my NASCAR road. 

My male Giant Schnauzer was always on guard, looking for the bad guy or the "attack squirrel" racing near. I don't support the idea of PPDs being walked off-lead as the risk can out weigh the pleaser if there is an accidental bite. And I know some of this also goes to the idea of all PPDs should be hugged and kissed by any dog loving person...sorry huggs and kisses are restricted.


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## Gillian Schuler (Apr 12, 2008)

I used to go biking with the Briard and the Fila - I liked doing it and the Briard thought he was on the Yukon Trail. I did train Search and Rescue (competition only) for a while and found it kept them fit.

For schutzhund, to keep them fit for schutzdienst, the only way is to train schutzdienst, as jumping, jumping. Football keeps them on their toes, too.

I bought these 2 GSDs especially for sport - had I wanted a nice leisurely life, walking through the park, sitting at the ice cream parlour, I would not have chosen them. I can keep them under control but for what? The Briard was a fantastic all rounder but still a nuisance in the town so I didn't stress myself.

I know you can have working line dogs that are as happy waiting for you to finish your coffee at a restaurant - I just don't happen to have them. I sometimes envy people who go out with their dog, without a lead and don't have to watch them. My Landseer would wait on the 1st floor of a deparment store, without a lead, whilst we roamed the whole store. When I look back on what I did, I squirm


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## Lee H Sternberg (Jan 27, 2008)

Jeff Oehlsen said:


> Quote: If you actually read and understood my post
> 
> Yes Lisa, all those big words like "enrichment" were making it difficult. I actually read and understood your post quite well, but nice try. It took a while as I could not see you walking your dogs, and was laughing my ass off.
> 
> For those of you that do not know, San Antonio is pretty much a ****ing oven, and I have no doubt that a walk here for people with normal hours would cook the dang thing like a thanksgiving turkey. That is why I thought it was funny. I worry about the dogs in the middle of the night. The humidity here is rediculous, yet all the plants look all deserted up. Weird. Can't wait to leave.



Jeff, your description of San Antonio makes it sound like HELL. Are you the DEVIL?:-D


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## Jeff Oehlsen (Apr 7, 2006)

I have loved reading these answers. 

I am not the Devil, although I am sure I have seen him here and there.

I have taught way too many OB classes to even think about advocating taking walks with a puppy as a new handler.

I also love the way some of you are lying about walking your dogs. You know who you are. LOL Sure you walk your dogs.AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH

Why then do some get their shorts in a knot trying to prove they don't or wont walk with their dogs ?? Like your dog is so serious he can't do something meaningless just for the hell of it, Like it will really screw up years of work and training







People say it's all about the dog/genetics bla bla bla. How could going for a walk/hike/run/drunken crawl with a dog screw it up ??

90% of the people here have never had a decent dog, and the other 10% it is their first dog. The largest problem I have ever had to deal with with pet owners, like the majority here is heeling, or I should say just getting their dog to not pull them down the road. That is who my answers are for. For those of you that do not have this problem, you really do not need this thread, now do you??????????


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## Chris Michalek (Feb 13, 2008)

Jeff, can you do anything about my bitch dragging me down to road to the mall?





Jeff Oehlsen said:


> I have loved reading these answers.
> 
> I am not the Devil, although I am sure I have seen him here and there.
> 
> ...


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## Carol Boche (May 13, 2007)

Jeff Oehlsen said:


> 90% of the people here have never had a decent dog, and the other 10% it is their first dog.


Better make it 80% never had a decent dog, 10% first dog and 10% have good working dogs or people will wonder which category you fall into Jeff....LOL:mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: 

(meant with a joking around manner):lol:


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## Connie Sutherland (Mar 27, 2006)

Jeff Oehlsen said:


> The largest problem I have ever had to deal with with pet owners, like the majority here is heeling, or I should say just getting their dog to not pull them down the road. That is who my answers are for. For those of you that do not have this problem, you really do not need this thread, now do you??????????


OH! 

Ding ding ding!

You're saying that a handler who can't walk the dog without being pulled along and who therefore uses a prong or a ton of leash corrections* should not be walking the dog -- really, working dog or not. 

I get it! :lol:


*or just goes along with being the follower -- almost left that one out


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## Ann Putegnat (Mar 11, 2008)

<<eff, can you do anything about my bitch dragging me down to road to the mall?>>

Too funny!!!!


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## Jeff Oehlsen (Apr 7, 2006)

Quote: Jeff, can you do anything about my bitch dragging me down to road to the mall?


Chris that was pretty funny. I find that if your bitch is not satisfied with you emotionally, that they tend to use malls as a substitute for what they are missing. There are a couple of toys that will get your bitch trained properly, PM me for the manufacturer, and use, I can't say **** on this board, GOD KNOWS what they would do with this information........although I am pretty sure many here really really really need to get laid.


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## Chris Michalek (Feb 13, 2008)

Jeff Oehlsen said:


> Quote: Jeff, can you do anything about my bitch dragging me down to road to the mall?
> 
> 
> Chris that was pretty funny. I find that if your bitch is not satisfied with you emotionally, that they tend to use malls as a substitute for what they are missing. There are a couple of toys that will get your bitch trained properly, PM me for the manufacturer, and use, I can't say **** on this board, GOD KNOWS what they would do with this information........although I am pretty sure many here really really really need to get laid.


Thanks for the advice. I've deduced the same as and urge many to read

http://www.workingdogforum.com/vBulletin/f8/things-say-during-sex-8574/


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