# Puppy Squirts



## Ryan Venables (Sep 15, 2010)

Hey all, back for some more suggestions.

The new pup I have is working out great, except that his poops have gone from normal to liquid in the span of the last 24 hrs. I was initially concerned about parvo, but he's showing no other signs other than the diarrhea.

I'm thinking food is the problem. He was on http://www.bestbreed.com/ but since getting him I've been switching him to Orijen Large Puppy Breed. Prior to us getting him he was eating .5 cup x3 a day, and I upped that to 2/3 cup 3 times a day (starting today).

We've also been doing training and he's been getting dried liver, and Zukes. And lastly, when we leave him in his crate he can knaw on a Bully Stick (Bull penis).

In the last 24 hrs, he's pooped 8 times, and thankfully he's essentially house broken, so accidents. But in the last 3 hrs, he's gone 3 times.

I've been told that the Orijen can cause this, but I've also been told, everything is just too much for him (food, relocation, new people, surroundings, etc...).

I'm looking for your thoughts on this. I want to fix this asap, and I've been making sure he gets lots of water, so he doesn't get dehydrated.

I've read about giving pumpkin and slippery elm to harden him up... which is my number one priority at this point.

I'd also like to put him on a raw diet (which I know little about at this point), which I'll save for another thread.

Another problem is that I only have limited amount of his old food, and we don't get it here in Canada. He'll be getting some pumpkin in his diet for tomorrow morning.

So any suggestions on how to harden his poops up?


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## Laney Rein (Feb 9, 2011)

You've changed alot of things - especially diet - which normally should be done slowly - over a period of time. Fast fix is pepto bismol or imbodium. Perfectly safe. Give with a syringe and give depending to size of pup. Also, give the dog some rice cooked up - when the stool starts to take more shape or the dog slows down on times going, back off on giving diarrhea meds. If you haven't had the stool checked for worms, you might consider having it done, as pup could have coccidia or giardia which can cause diarrhea. You can also look up answers on www.peteducation.com
written by veterinarians


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## brad robert (Nov 26, 2008)

orijien went right thru my dogs as well.its too rich for just about everydog i have tried it on.


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## Gillian Schuler (Apr 12, 2008)

Fuller's Earth sprinkled over his food (they say don't use metal spoon or, in that case, metal dish).


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## Tammy St. Louis (Feb 17, 2010)

changed too much too fast, and the treats are really rich that you choose, 
I would take him off everything, just give cooked white rice for a few days to harden stuff up , no treats, 
if you need to treat, you can try charlie bears there is pretty much nothing in them , dogs seems to like them,, 
slowly put him back on his food, you choose


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## Carlos Machado (Dec 28, 2008)

I fed my dog Orijen for the first year runs came and went so I switched to there other brand Acana less protein my dog didn't get runs from that food. the bully stick are very rich and can give dogs the runs on there own your better off with raw bones.


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## Kellie Wolverton (Jan 16, 2009)

The Bully sticks do that to all of my dogs if they haven't had them in a while. 

The canned pumpkin works great....make sure it isn't pumpkin pie filling...just straight pumpkin.

Good luck. I am sure things will get "firmed up" in a hurry :mrgreen:


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## Ryan Venables (Sep 15, 2010)

Thanks all... I'm hearing over and over again that it's the Orijen... The other stuff has been removed as well. I'll switch him today as I just ran out of what the breeder gave us and we can't get it here in Canada... stupidly I didn't buy a bag on my own... ahh well... 

White rice and pumpkin it is for the little guy, and heading to find a new kibble... or I may just switch him to the Honest Kitchen's Embark.


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## Carlos Machado (Dec 28, 2008)

You can get Acana at the same place you get Orijen same company with great ingredients without the runs.


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## Connie Sutherland (Mar 27, 2006)

Ryan! STOP! :lol:

AS others have told you, you have done way too much way too fast!

Some dogs don't do great on Orijen, but you have no way to know at this point.

With kibble, too much food too fast is by far the most common diet-related diarrhea trigger. 

I would fast this guy. Regardless of the initial problem, he now has a very inflamed gut. I'd go 12 hours with plenty of body-temp water (bait it if you have to; do NOT let him become dehydrated).

So I would fast for twelve hours and then give small frequent meals of very overcooked white rice (like gruel .... almost indistinguishable grains)* with a little plain (not pie filling) pumpkin.


As for marker rewards, for the time being I would use tiny bits of cooked white skinless chicken or turkey. Eraser-size bits. 


How long has the poop been liquid? Please post back. Liquid poop with a puppy is not in the same category as pudding. It cannot continue safely.

You know how to watch for hydration?



*
Don't drain the overcooked rice. Overcooking it releases some of the binding property into the cooking water, so it too is a binding agent, and it gets into the system quickly in liquid form.


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## Tabatha Farnel (Sep 7, 2008)

My Mal pup has been doing great on Orijen since I got her at 9 weeks. 

For the diarrhea you might want to try some probiotics.... http://www.natural-dog-health-remedies.com/probiotics-for-dogs.html

My pup had a bout of diarrhea and vomiting last week after eating a new brand of bully stick. She was up sick most of the night, and I just gave her plenty of water the next day, with about a quarter to half the amount of her normal food intake, supplemented with probiotics, and she was absolutely fine by the evening.


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## Connie Sutherland (Mar 27, 2006)

Tabatha Farnel said:


> My Mal pup has been doing great on Orijen since I got her at 9 weeks.
> 
> For the diarrhea you might want to try some probiotics.... http://www.natural-dog-health-remedies.com/probiotics-for-dogs.html
> 
> My pup had a bout of diarrhea and vomiting last week after eating a new brand of bully stick. She was up sick most of the night, and I just gave her plenty of water the next day, with about a quarter to half the amount of her normal food intake, supplemented with probiotics, and she was absolutely fine by the evening.



You were smart to partially fast her.


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## Kellie Wolverton (Jan 16, 2009)

just because I have been through the parvo thing:

I would highly recommend monitoring the dog's temperature. IIRC the average temp is about 101. I would call the vet if it starts to rise.

You can also watch the poo for any red scaly type of matter. If you see this , you need to call the vet ASAP. This is a sign that the lining of the intestines is shedding and the dog needs treatment ASAP.

Not trying to be a wet blanket, better to have the info and not need it:grin:


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## Joby Becker (Dec 13, 2009)

good advice...

when switching brands of kibble I do it over a period of 6-8 weeks to make full switch...slightly increasing concentration of new food mixed with old food every week or so..

too much to fast probably, and watch out for dehydration as stated...


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## Marta Wajngarten (Jul 30, 2006)

Way too much too fast, Connie gave you really good advice. I too would fast first before bombarding the poor pup with even more new stuff (ie pumpkin). My pup is doing perfectly fine on Orijen so don't jump to conclusions. Your pup has been through so many changes just about all of which could have brought on the runs. Some dogs can get runs just from moving locations (stress of relocation, different surroundings, different water, you name it).

For training, if the pup has good food drive, use his kibble. Save the rich stuff for only special times. 

And I would blame the Bully Sticks for the runs over the Orijen any day. Why does he even need them? You can give him other things to chew on like Nyla bones.

I would put this pup back to basics in terms of any food intake. Nothing but his kibble for meals and training until the runs go away. Then slowly start to introduce new things one at a time, and this way you will know for sure if any of them causes runs.

I will also second sending a poop sample to your vet to test for parasites just to rule any thing out.


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## Ryan Venables (Sep 15, 2010)

Connie Sutherland said:


> Ryan! STOP! :lol:
> 
> AS others have told you, you have done way too much way too fast!
> 
> ...


The poop went liquid yesterday at about 10:30pm - he pooped every hour until about 8 this morning. I made sure he got water almost every time after. It went from puddle to liquid with a TON of gas at about 2am. I could literally hear him exhale in relief as he passed the gas...

I really don't think it's parvo, but I'm keeping an eye out. His poop is green, smells like poop I guess (not the metallic smell I was told to smell for), and has no blood in it. He's still full of energy, eating and drinking...

He's going to the vet tomorrow regardless. I had made an appt this morning. He hasn't pooped since about 10:30... which is 3 hrs, and the one before then was 2 hrs...We're keeping a log. So I'm assuming the Orijen is just working itself out... all over my lawn.

Dehydration from what I've read - dry mouth/gums, and the skin on the back of the neck doesn't return immediately to it's normal position.

He will be fasted for the rest of today, until dinner time... so about 10 hrs or so. I'm going to do the rice/pumpkin mix.


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## Guest (Dec 1, 2008)

I have switched overnight, cold turkey and never really had a problem.......


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## Marta Wajngarten (Jul 30, 2006)

Ryan Venables said:


> I'm going to do the rice/pumpkin mix.


Why? You're only asking for more trouble. Too many changes, let his system settle and get a break before you put him through more. If you already ran out of his old food and have switched him to the Orijen, keep him on that for at least a couple weeks. You can also soak the kibble in some hot water for a few minutes before feeding it to help the pup's system break it down. What on earth is the rush to swap foods on him? He's going to be with you for at least a few years, you'll have plenty of time to experiment with food. Give the poor little guy a break.


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## Marta Wajngarten (Jul 30, 2006)

Jody Butler said:


> I have switched overnight, cold turkey and never really had a problem.......


I get my dogs used to a variety of different foods and some times give them mixes for this very reason. I can switch foods over night on them and the poops are exactly the same the next day. But that's not something you do to an 8wk old pup who has just been through a flight, is getting used to all sorts of new things and already has major runs.


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## Ryan Venables (Sep 15, 2010)

Marta Haus said:


> Why? You're only asking for more trouble. Too many changes, let his system settle and get a break before you put him through more. If you already ran out of his old food and have switched him to the Orijen, keep him on that for at least a couple weeks. You can also soak the kibble in some hot water for a few minutes before feeding it to help the pup's system break it down. What on earth is the rush to swap foods on him? He's going to be with you for at least a few years, you'll have plenty of time to experiment with food. Give the poor little guy a break.


There is no rush... but the food that came with him only lasted since we got him (Sunday)... and they don't sell it in Canada. So unless I make a run to the border, he can't get it.


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## Connie Sutherland (Mar 27, 2006)

Marta Haus said:


> *I get my dogs used to a variety of different foods and some times give them mixes for this very reason. I can switch foods over night on them and the poops are exactly the same the next day.*
> 
> But *that's not something you do to an 8wk old pup who has just been through a flight, is getting used to all sorts of new things and already has major runs.*




I agree with this a million percent. Both parts.


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## Joby Becker (Dec 13, 2009)

I always switch over time, just to avoid possiblities of a problem...

this dog is funny with big hunks of meat though, just gave her big hunk of chicken the other day, she carried it over to a pile of leaves and buried it and guarded it...like an idiot...

she has been boarded at places that feed raw, she plays with the food alot, and eats little....maybe, because she missed me...


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## Connie Sutherland (Mar 27, 2006)

Marta Haus said:


> Why? You're only asking for more trouble. Too many changes, let his system settle and get a break before you put him through more. If you already ran out of his old food and have switched him to the Orijen, keep him on that for at least a couple weeks. You can also soak the kibble in some hot water for a few minutes before feeding it to help the pup's system break it down. What on earth is the rush to swap foods on him? He's going to be with you for at least a few years, you'll have plenty of time to experiment with food. Give the poor little guy a break.



He has no more Orijen available, I gathered.

Rice (overcooked!) has a binding/firming quality, as does a little plain pumpkin. 

But I do think the O.P. understands the fast now. And then tiny overcooked-rice meals but plenty of water. 

And not adding a new dogfood tonight. Or even thinking about a new food until he has log poops.


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## Connie Sutherland (Mar 27, 2006)

Joby Becker said:


> I always switch over time, just to avoid possiblities of a problem...




Always good!

Mine get so much variety that there is never an issue, but if I fed kibble I would make switches gradually too. (I would also always feed a combo or rotation of kibbles ..... but that's another thread ..... :lol: )


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## Joby Becker (Dec 13, 2009)

Connie Sutherland said:


> Always good!
> 
> Mine get so much variety that there is never an issue, but if I fed kibble I would make switches gradually too. (I would also always feed a combo or rotation of kibbles ..... but that's another thread ..... :lol: )


yeah I agree with that, but with this one it has pretty much always just been one brand of kibble for food or another....with a few extra things here and there...


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## Marta Wajngarten (Jul 30, 2006)

Connie Sutherland said:


> He has no more Orijen available, I gathered.
> 
> Rice (overcooked!) has a binding/firming quality, as does a little plain pumpkin.
> 
> ...



I thought he ran out of the food the puppy came with, switched him to Orijen (which he still has), and now that the pup has the runs wants to switch to yet another food.


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## Jen Henriksen (Dec 21, 2010)

Bully sticks, rawhide and marrow bones all made Riley throw up and/or have the runs. Took me a while to catch on, but it was a hallelujah moment when I did! He only got Nylabones as a puppy and graduated to antlers when he was done teething.


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## Kellie Wolverton (Jan 16, 2009)

Ryan,

Do you think you could humor me and take your pup's temperature?

I am kind of surprised that the vet office didn't ask you when you called for the appt.

Just an FYI...my dog never had uncontrolable bloody runs...just "normal" runs with 3 or 4 flecks in it. And only once. She did not smell. She was a little lazy, still ate a bit and drank. When I got her to the vet her temp was 105!! I never thought to take her temp. And felt REALLY stupid when I got her there and found out how much danger she was in.:-o


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## Ryan Venables (Sep 15, 2010)

Connie Sutherland said:


> He has no more Orijen available, I gathered.
> 
> Rice (overcooked!) has a binding/firming quality, as does a little plain pumpkin.
> 
> ...


I'm introducing the Orijen. He was being fed BestBreed. They don't sell BestBreed in Canada, and I only had a number of days worth. I didn't realize they didn't sell that stuff in Canada or I would have picked it up in the US... I know is takes weeks to switch a food.

Anyway the point is kinda moot. He'll be getting a rice/pumpkin concoction along with some baited water to make sure he doesn't get dehydrated. He hasn't pooped in just over 3 hrs... which is great. Once he's solid, I'll transition him putting him on The Honest Kitchen with some RMB's.


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## Ryan Venables (Sep 15, 2010)

kellie wolverton said:


> ryan,
> 
> do you think you could humor me and take your pup's temperature?
> 
> ...


101.3


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## maggie fraser (May 30, 2008)

I'm gonna throw in my 2 cents, boil him up some rice and some white fish after you have given his guts a rest. Once he starts binding, start adding a little of the food of your next plan, bearing in mind that may not suit him either. Trial and error with pups, and that's before you start throwing in all of these changes you are subjecting him to.

I don't think it wise to think rmbs or raw is going to sort out your problem overnight, I also think it a little paranoid to be considering parvo as a possible cause at this stage, but that's just me. 

Welcome to puppyhood!


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## Ryan Venables (Sep 15, 2010)

Thanks.... yeah, I'm trying to be overly paranoid... which is why I just went and bought a digital thermom.

I really don't think it's anything serious, I believe it's the food... but I'm kinda stuck w/ what I have, so I'll rice him up and see where he goes. He hasn't pooped in almost 5 hrs now... so I think we're past everything... we'll see how he does when he goes next.


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## Kellie Wolverton (Jan 16, 2009)

Ryan Venables said:


> 101.3


GREAT!

where puppies are concerned ,IMHO, you cannot be too paranoid about parvo. The temp is an easy inexpensive way to check and rule out a more serious problem.

Sounds like you have gotten some good advice about settling the gut. Good luck!


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## Ryan Venables (Sep 15, 2010)

I think the gut worked itself out... he just pooped and it was solid, like one solid piece from bum to ground then it broke at the ground.

Christ what a long 16 hrs it's been though...

I'll take it very slow from here on in

Thanks for help all!


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## Jen Henriksen (Dec 21, 2010)

Glad to hear he's doing better!!


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## Ryan Venables (Sep 15, 2010)

You and me both... holy crap (pun totally intended) though... it's about time, I'm completely wiped though...


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