# What Would Your DOG Do During A HOME BREAKIN



## Lee H Sternberg (Jan 27, 2008)

This is a 2 phase question. The first is if you were present the second is if you were not home. That Jean Claude thread got me remembering. He helped me with these 2 monsters of mine. 

I know how mine would react in either circumstance. Been all through that training prior to going to Costa Rica. Throwing them dog yummies would not matter. The male would lead. I observed that exercise from a distance many times. The bitch is a MOFO in her own right but she would come in latter because the male is more dominant. 

Nothing stops a gun to their head. But I'm confident that's what it would take. 

I've spent some lengthy efforts trying to chill them out now that I'm back in the US. 

Partially successful but old habits die hard. ☺


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## Lee H Sternberg (Jan 27, 2008)

I want to add no DREAMING about what a hardass you puppy is. I'm talking what you really believe to be the real truth. 

I can verify mine.


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## Joby Becker (Dec 13, 2009)

my stuffed animal would defend the house vigorously.. 

when I do have dogs for home protection purposes I always have said:

"If someone breaks into my home, they are going to NEED a gun, to save their own asses." (from the dog(s))

Forget using it for intimidation.


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## Lee H Sternberg (Jan 27, 2008)

Joby Becker said:


> my stuffed animal would defend the house vigorously..
> 
> when I do have dogs for home protection purposes I always have said:
> 
> ...


With mine they need to aim for the brain twice at 2 dogs. ☺That half Dick and Selina bitch is hard for me still to control after these years of living with her.


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## Matt Vandart (Nov 28, 2012)

One of my dobes has cornered and held with aggression 'uninvited guests' on two occasions, dobe 2 didn't go to near but showed aggression. She didn't go near because she knew if she did dobe 1 would nail her from frustration and as a misdirection to dobe 2's aggression.

My malinois would without a doubt nail anyone and anything who came through the door/window uninvited, this is why she gets kept in her pen.


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## Lee H Sternberg (Jan 27, 2008)

Matt Vandart said:


> One of my dobes has cornered and held with aggression 'uninvited guests' on two occasions, dobe 2 didn't go to near but showed aggression. She didn't go near because she knew if she did dobe 1 would nail her from frustration and as a misdirection to dobe 2's aggression.
> 
> My malinois would without a doubt nail anyone and anything who came through the door/window uninvited, this is why she gets kept in her pen.


I'm working hard on not crating the male when guests arrive. I'm half way there. He is actually sociable off premises. The female is never sociable but more easily controlled in that kind of home environment... 
.


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## susan tuck (Mar 28, 2006)

deleted sorry,


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## Joby Becker (Dec 13, 2009)

I have owned several dogs that literally would chew on the doorknob if someone was at the door... (if allowed) 

trying to help people come in, to get attacked.

but I almost always seem to find the perfect dogs for what I want out of them...


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## Lee H Sternberg (Jan 27, 2008)

Joby Becker said:


> I have owned several dogs that literally would chew on the doorknob if someone was at the door... (if allowed)
> 
> trying to help people come in, to get attacked.
> 
> but I almost always seem to find the perfect dogs for what I want out of them...


Okay you win, Joby. I'm not sure my dogs like doorknobs. They would have the manners to let someone in before loosing it.


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## Ben Thompson (May 2, 2009)

Lee I am not convinced AZ is as safe as you think. We get a lot of criminals coming up from the southern border. I would not tone the dogs down anymore.


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## Joby Becker (Dec 13, 2009)

Lee H Sternberg said:


> Okay you win, Joby. I'm not sure my dogs like doorknobs. They would have the manners to let someone in before loosing it.


THE DUTCHIE WOULD NOT DO THAT, SHE CHARGED THE DOOR AND WAITED..

never tested her in a blind home protection test, but I would bet money she would definitely bite.

probably real similar to your bitch


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## Jay Quinn (Apr 1, 2012)

i am not sure if my dogs would bite someone in a home protection scenario but then that is not their primary purpose... one is now in training for USAR and the other 3 are civilian patrol dogs, they are required to be social or at least neutral and not try to tear into anyone who comes near them... 

right now i don't really have clear fencing... the boundary of the property is definitely marked as far as a human is concerned but as the fencing is only post-and-strand it's not so much as far as the dogs are concerned... they see it more of an obstacle than a boundary... 

put my old boy behind a clear fence and he will nail anything that comes through or over it without authorisation, he has had live bites in the past... i believe were he loose in the house and someone broke in it would be a similar story, but i have not tested him... oh, don't even think about touching his car, LOL... that being said someone who walked in the gate without a boundary between them and him i'm not sure what his reaction would be, or if they walked through the almost-always open back door (closed and locked when i am not home, though)... if i am home and he is commanded to bite, i *know* he will bite and fight for all he is worth, regardless of what the person may be doing... 

the next eldest would definitely aggress towards a stranger on the property but if they did not fight back i think it would all be gnashing of teeth and not really a proper bite... i'm not sure if he would bail out or commit if the fight was returned to him... i have seen him aggress against welcomed guests who have been in the yard unexpectedly but as i said it's all been gnashing of teeth, i have been close by to call the dog off immediately, and the 2 guests involved have had the smarts to stand still and not try to fight the dog... he is another where if i am home and he is commanded to bite i have every confidence that he would, and once he is on the bite he is now pretty hard to get off it again until outed... 

next dog down is my SAR dog, you could walk into the place and he'd help you load the car, find the keys for you and ask to come for the ride lol... 

youngest dog who is now 2.5, i really don't think would bite anyone if i wasn't around... when he is on a leash or at least nearby with me, he is becoming an excellent patrol dog, but if i am not in the picture he won't let anyone else near him... a good friend of mine owns boarding kennels where i leave my dogs from time to time, i always take my own bark collars when i board the dogs and my mate has full permission to put them on the dogs if they are being excessively noisy... he can never get near enough to my young dog to catch him to put a collar on him... the dog just barks and darts about and keeps his distance... my work asked to borrow a dog for the supervisor to use on a shift as they were really desperately in need of people to cover shifts one weekend, so i volunteered the pup... everything was fine until the bloke made the mistake of turning the dog loose in the yard after he had fed him, 5 different people couldn't get anywhere near the little prick, or entice him in to them even with roast chicken and other assorted yummies, and i had to go for a 60 mile drive to pick him up again... >_< he is definitely the first to let me know if there is anyone hanging around, though...


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## Mark Herzog (Aug 22, 2013)

Lee H Sternberg said:


> This is a 2 phase question. The first is if you were present the second is if you were not home. That Jean Claude thread got me remembering. He helped me with these 2 monsters of mine.


I've tested my two personal dogs in a variety of scenarios... Individually they are quite capable but together they are devastating. My male is more controlled and thinks more... My female is crazed when it comes to protecting the house (which is her primary function). 

I've been raising a third dog to work with these two... She's young and still learning but already shows high protective instincts towards the house and surrounding property... Learning from my older female.

I have zero doubt about their reaction to a break-in, push-in, finding someone hiding in the house, or variations of these scenarios. There is very little difference in their reactions and responses whether I'm present or not present. The female "goes" without hesitation while the male tends to look to me for an indication of what I want him to do... If I don't stop him he will go to join the female, but if I tell him to wait he will stay by my side. If I'm not there they both go.

Usually they alert before entry can be made so they're there to greet the intrusion with teeth. On the few occasions we've managed to surprise them in the house their reactions are instantaneous, regardless of how the decoy presents (aggressive, non-aggressive, retreating, motionless, etc.).

I've been told my female is a little "too sharp" but honestly I have come to appreciate it.


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## Lee H Sternberg (Jan 27, 2008)

Ben Thompson said:


> Lee I am not convinced AZ is as safe as you think. We get a lot of criminals coming up from the southern border. I would not tone the dogs down anymore.


I'm up in Prescott area so there isn't much going on in the way of crime. At least not until they steal enough to buy cars to drive here. ☺

There is only one access to the area where I live so it's not the ideal situation for thieves. 

My attitude would be a bit different if I was down in southern AZ.


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## Michael Murphy (Nov 27, 2010)

Lee H Sternberg said:


> With mine they need to aim for the brain twice at 2 dogs. ☺That half Dick and Selina bitch is hard for me still to control after these years of living with her.


at what age did your bitch start showing that behaviour


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## Gillian Schuler (Apr 12, 2008)

If it got past the cat, I do not now what my dog would do.


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## Kevin Cyr (Dec 28, 2012)

Michael Murphy said:


> at what age did your bitch start showing that behaviour


It can be any age, but Michael you ruined your last two dogs already, instead of listening to the advice given by many......you still do what you do. You will never learn and the day you get into contact with the civil non social beast dog you often talk about, your gonna get hurt.


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## Lee H Sternberg (Jan 27, 2008)

Michael Murphy said:


> at what age did your bitch start showing that behaviour


Immediately when I got her at 8 weeks. She has always been nuts but a pussycat with the family.


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## Lee H Sternberg (Jan 27, 2008)

Lee H Sternberg said:


> Immediately when I got her at 8 weeks. She has always been nuts but a pussycat with the family.


I was on the road when I answer Michael's post. I will give you a example Michael. I started.socializing her right away. I would take her downtown and sit on the park benches they have there. She would hang over the rear backrest of the bench trying to bite people passing by. This was at 8 weeks old. WTF


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## Dave Colborn (Mar 25, 2009)

Gillian Schuler said:


> If it got past the cat, I do not now what my dog would do.


Is the cat a monster?

If so you should post the pedigree...


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## Matt Vandart (Nov 28, 2012)

Lee H Sternberg said:


> I was on the road when I answer Michael's post. I will give you a example Michael. I started.socializing her right away. I would take her downtown and sit on the park benches they have there. She would hang over the rear backrest of the bench trying to bite people passing by. This was at 8 weeks old. WTF


Exactly like my Sali mali, PIA, lol


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## Lee H Sternberg (Jan 27, 2008)

Matt Vandart said:


> Exactly like my Sali mali, PIA, lol


There was just a thread on JC Balu. A funny story with the dog and him. He and I were working on getting these guys pp trained for Costa Rica. He knew her quite well from training sessions. We had a chance meeting at a local strip mall while I was doing some training with her. He held his hand out to shake hands with me and she nailed him.


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## catherine hardigan (Oct 12, 2009)

I think the majority of working dogs would not bite an intruder without backup from their person, and quite a few wouldn't bite either way. Maybe a nip to the ankle or back of the leg... but a full on bite as performed in training? No.


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## Lee H Sternberg (Jan 27, 2008)

catherine hardigan said:


> I think the majority of working dogs would not bite an intruder without backup from their person, and quite a few wouldn't bite either way. Maybe a nip to the ankle or back of the leg... but a full on bite as performed in training? No.


I agree with that statement. I've seen lots of ankle and back of leg bites. Eyeball to eyeball can get a much different respose from a dog.


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## Christopher Jones (Feb 17, 2009)

Mine would be wondering what all the commotion is about from their outside kennels.


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## Faisal Khan (Apr 16, 2009)

Only 1 way to find out  Dogs that bite without equipment have no issues.


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## Mark Herzog (Aug 22, 2013)

Faisal Khan said:


> Only 1 way to find out  Dogs that bite without equipment have no issues.


It's a real challenge finding volunteers to take bites without suit or some form of protection.


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## mel boschwitz (Apr 23, 2010)

Lee H Sternberg said:


> I agree with that statement. I've seen lots of ankle and back of leg bites. Eyeball to eyeball can get a much different respose from a dog.


I used to have a dog that would go for the "jewels". :twisted:


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## Faisal Khan (Apr 16, 2009)

Mark Herzog said:


> It's a real challenge finding volunteers to take bites without suit or some form of protection.


Believe it or not but "shit" happens. Other than that it is only what you wish or believe the dogs will do.


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## Mark Herzog (Aug 22, 2013)

Faisal Khan said:


> Believe it or not but "shit" happens. Other than that it is only what you wish or believe the dogs will do.


Oh I know about "shit happens"... Wishes and beliefs aside... My dogs have already proven themselves in the ONLY way they can.

As I said earlier... Finding volunteers to help the dogs "practice" without equipment has been quite hard (obviously I'm being sarcastic as I don't expect anyone to "voluntarily work" the dog without protection), but I even have a hard time finding decoys who will use my lightweight suit... Too "real" for most of them. But that's a whole other topic.


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## Rob Maltese (Jan 8, 2014)

Dog would bark when he heard something happen, go investigate and most likely lick the person to death.


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## Bob Scott (Mar 30, 2006)

My older GSD (10+) has been trained in a couple of different venues and being "social" to the public was important to me. He had a little bit of an edge as a pup so I worked hard on it. 

He still can "show" a nasty side to those he doesn't know when at home, in the car and surprisingly when he's alone with the wife at home when anybody he doesn't know comes. 

He's done well in Schutzhund, AKC OB, herding, SAR, and most anything I put in front of him but I can only "believe" different training could have brought out a completely different dog.
Truth is, who knows!

My younger GSD (6+) has a dark side but is more clown then GSD so he would be less inclined to bite for real. He doesn't get upset when strangers approach. Barks in the yard very little and makes friends easily with strangers I've introduced him to. 
Then again, who knows with different training other then making him a nice pet with excellent manners. 
He is more reactive to stimulus then the older dog simply because of his slightly nervy nature.


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## Tiago Fontes (Apr 17, 2011)

Older male - 3 years old - security dog has proven himself in real life two times. 

Younger male - 17 months old - has kept two guys away from a friend of mine at a bar fight that was extended into the parking lot. I was holding the leash and pretty sure he would have bit hard. Guys backed down and it was a great experience, since the dog won without actually having to fight. 

Disclaimer: Im not a troublemaker. My drunk friends are... but I wouldnt bail out on them, lol ;-)


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## Catherine Gervin (Mar 12, 2012)

Tiago Fontes said:


> Disclaimer: Im not a troublemaker. My drunk friends are... but I wouldnt bail out on them, lol ;-)


yep, you have to back your friends!


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## Tiago Fontes (Apr 17, 2011)

Catherine Gervin said:


> yep, you have to back your friends!


Wouldnt be a good friend if I didnt.


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## Ben Thompson (May 2, 2009)

Weird how people will get in fist fights with guys that out weigh them by 50 pounds or more but are scared of a 80 pound dog.


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## Jay Quinn (Apr 1, 2012)

thing is you have a chance of beating the bigger guy, and probably won't get too hurt.... but as far as the dog goes even if you do win you're still going to get mighty torn up in the process!!


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## Catherine Gervin (Mar 12, 2012)

hey, getting bitten REALLY hurts and then you have to deal with cleaning a puncture wound--or many--and stitches could be necessary...my Stepmother's Old English Sheepdog bit me once and, though it wasn't a bad bite, just the dog being cranky because i believe she had arthritis, but that woman didn't stay up to date with shots on the dog so i had to get rabies shots in the stomach. totally horrible, and i knew the dog wasn't rabid but the doctor did not care--seven shots in the stomach. worse than the bite. i think now it is only a few shots, but back then it was many.


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## jim stevens (Jan 30, 2012)

Faisal Khan said:


> Only 1 way to find out  Dogs that bite without equipment have no issues.


Mine will bite without equipment, but I'm not so sure that has anything to do with 'area' protection. I am pretty sure mine would take a bite. Recently I had a friend working on my AC (he is fortunately a dog person), when I came home from work, he had been waiting about 15 minutes in the driveway, my mali was really amped up about that. She was bad enough that I muzzled her before I let him in, walked her up and let him touch her. She seemed ok, so he went out to his truck to get some equipment, when he walked back in the front door, she hit him chest high...hard. I still don't think it is ever a sure thing.


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## Ben Thompson (May 2, 2009)

Probably should kennel or crate the dog when they are that fired up.


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## jim stevens (Jan 30, 2012)

If it had been anyone else, she would have been crated.


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