# UScA Working Dog Championship



## susan tuck (Mar 28, 2006)

A link to the results posted so far:
http://www.usaawdc.com/page05.html

At this point the top scores are Mark Saccoccio and Joker du Loups du Soleil: 99-96-95 290


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## Bob Scott (Mar 30, 2006)

Thanks Susan!


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## Kadi Thingvall (Jan 22, 2007)

A friend was telling me Mike Diehl earned a 100 in tracking, but I don't see it on the results page. Anyone know if this is true?


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## Jeff Oehlsen (Apr 7, 2006)

What is with all the disqualifieds ??? They never say for what.


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## Laura Bollschweiler (Apr 25, 2008)

Kadi Thingvall said:


> A friend was telling me Mike Diehl earned a 100 in tracking, but I don't see it on the results page. Anyone know if this is true?


There was a posting on another forum that said he got 99-97-97. 

There's just a couple pictures from the event on the "photos" page of the site. And it would be nice if they said "DQ-no out" or something like that!

Laura


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## Gillian Schuler (Apr 12, 2008)

I can't be sure but as far as I know, if the dog doesn't out in protection, the scores for the whole trial are deleted.

If the handler is inebriated or carrying food in OB, the scores for this discipline only are deleted.

The reasons are to be found in the score book and signed by the judge as to their accuracy.

If the dog leaves the field and doesn't return on one, plus 2 more commands, disqualification from trial follows.


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## David Frost (Mar 29, 2006)

If this is the one in Nashville, I attended parts of it on Thursday and Friday. Thursday I think was just practice. I saw a couple of dogs DQ'd, or pulled not sure which. One wouldn't out, one wouldn't engage. I'm kind of lost at those events, so I don't know about scoring all that much. 

DFrost


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## Jose' Abril (Dec 6, 2007)

Congrats to Mike Lorraine and his dog Sepp(HOT) for achievng a 100 pts. in tracking!!

Right now the one to beat is Mike Diehl with Erri with a score of 99-97-97 total of 293.


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## Dale Pitts (Apr 18, 2009)

Very nice, Mark lives here in our area, and I get to train with him from time to time, Joker is an incredible dog and Mark is a great handler/trainer, I wish him the best of luck and hope he takes it, very nice scores.


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## Mike Scheiber (Feb 17, 2008)

susan tuck said:


> A link to the results posted so far:
> http://www.usaawdc.com/page05.html
> 
> At this point the top scores are Mark Saccoccio and Joker du Loups du Soleil: 99-96-95 290


In a month he will be in the Czech Republic. http://www.fmbb2009.com/en/?IPOList_of_competitors
Marina headed for Albany today to train with Greg for a couple of weeks of tuning then there off to Slovakia.
The US has a exelent chance of taking the team Championship maybe more.


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## Jesus Alvarez (Feb 6, 2009)

Jose' Abril said:


> Congrats to Mike Lorraine and his dog Sepp(HOT) for achievng a 100 pts. in tracking!!


 Not to bad for a ghetto kid and and his Pitbull. :wink:


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## Dale Pitts (Apr 18, 2009)

Mike Scheiber said:


> In a month he will be in the Czech Republic. http://www.fmbb2009.com/en/?IPOList_of_competitors
> Marina headed for Albany today to train with Greg for a couple of weeks of tuning then there off to Slovakia.
> The US has a exelent chance of taking the team Championship maybe more.


 
Maybe its just me, but I didnt see him on that list of competitors, am I just blind? I do know he is going there though, He was talking about it a few weeks ago at training.


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## Mike Scheiber (Feb 17, 2008)

Dale Pitts said:


> Maybe its just me, but I didnt see him on that list of competitors, am I just blind?


Look again


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## Dale Pitts (Apr 18, 2009)

Mike Scheiber said:


> Look again


LOL, Ok that picture wasnt up there earlier when I looked. #-o


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## susan tuck (Mar 28, 2006)

Dale Pitts said:


> Very nice, Mark lives here in our area, and I get to train with him from time to time, Joker is an incredible dog and Mark is a great handler/trainer, I wish him the best of luck and hope he takes it, very nice scores.


Briska, the GSD bitch he also is currently handling/training is a really fine dog too. She was high bitch at the trial, finished 5th (I think).


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## Becky Shilling (Jul 11, 2006)

Congrats to Mike and Mark!


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## John Wiitanen (Feb 25, 2009)

Is there any video of the trial? Anyone post some on youtube?


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## Dale Pitts (Apr 18, 2009)

susan tuck said:


> Briska, the GSD bitch he also is currently handling/training is a really fine dog too. She was high bitch at the trial, finished 5th (I think).


Yea Briska is a nice bitch, He had her out about a month ago doing some work, I like her alot.


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## Sue DiCero (Sep 2, 2006)

Gabor pulled Enzo (partial broken canine) and Carl Smith pulled (major borken ankle week before) 1 week prior to the draw. All the other pulls were no-shows at the draws, which sucks as the coordinators have to scramble to re-arrange the flights on a moment's notice and hold up the draw selection. Kevin with Gismo was a pull for the FH.

Isco and Gismo were no outs on the bitework. Jazzmine was a "do not engage": she ran into the 6th blind, looked and ran out. Handler sent in again, but she went around the blind and the judge. DQ'd.

If the dog DQ'd in one phase, new rule (?) is that they do not go to the next phase. 

Very happy for Mike. He has done consistently well with Arci. Gabor works this dog on a consistent basis and gets to see him in all types of situations. 

The OG Indy club and Mike are great. The members, not matter what level, are in it for a sport and handle/work their own dogs. They support each other.


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## Sue DiCero (Sep 2, 2006)

Forgot to add:

Of the podium dogs, only 1 was a HOT dog (Lisa J). The others were all previously titled, but handled by owners (Harry's dog by Lisa J, Erri already competed at the WUSV) and Joker and Briska were handled by Mark for their owners.

Hopefully, you will start to see some of the handlers with HOT dogs. Mike is training and titling his street dog, Kutter. Lisa has done it, and I think Harry at some point.


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## Laura Bollschweiler (Apr 25, 2008)

Sue DiCero said:


> Isco and Gismo were no outs on the bitework. Jazzmine was a "do not engage": she ran into the 6th blind, looked and ran out. Handler sent in again, but she went around the blind and the judge. DQ'd.
> 
> If the dog DQ'd in one phase, new rule (?) is that they do not go to the next phase.
> 
> Very happy for Mike. He has done consistently well with Arci. Gabor works this dog on a consistent basis and gets to see him in all types of situations.


 
Hi, Sue!

Thanks for the info and insights!

I don't have my rulebook handy, but I thought the handler gets three sends to the blind to get the dog to bark before the judge calls it. Just wondering why he only got two attempts.

Also, I think it's an important distinction to make that you're talking about a DQ and not an NQ. I know you said "DQ," but I think some people don't realize there's a big difference between the two!! I don't think it's a new rule. It makes sense if the dog shows "lack of control" to not continue with the trial.

Laura


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## Gillian Schuler (Apr 12, 2008)

Laura Bollschweiler said:


> Hi, Sue!
> 
> Thanks for the info and insights!
> 
> ...


Laura, the handler has only one command to send to the hide - he is allowed two additional commands (with score reduction).

I've just read the German rules VPG which state that a disqualification in any of the three disciplines leads to 0 points in that discipline.

In IPO, disqualification in any one discipline leads to 0 points in all 3 disciplines. If the disqualification occurs in the first discipline, the handler is not permitted to finish the trial.

I'll have another check tomorrow but this seems to be pretty clear. IPO I know, I'm in the scoring office usually and I doubt whether I and my "Bucking Bronco" will make the next trial at the end of June so scoring office here I come!! Someone has to do it.


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## Gillian Schuler (Apr 12, 2008)

BTW, most but not all judges, are familiar with the rules.

I have seen otherwise and the handler is allowed recourse.


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## Sue DiCero (Sep 2, 2006)

The dog avoided the blind and the helper; on the 2nd attempt was technically off the field as she was right next to the goal posts.


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## Julie Blanding (Mar 12, 2008)

I thought you could only send the dog in again, if the dog didn't see the helper (i.e the dog runs around so fast not paying attention). If the dog notices the helper, and leaves I think it's an automatic DQ. That being said, I've seen it both ways. The judge allowing a second and third 'voran' and one just calling it right away.


Julie


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## susan tuck (Mar 28, 2006)

Julie Blanding said:


> I thought you could only send the dog in again, if the dog didn't see the helper (i.e the dog runs around so fast not paying attention). If the dog notices the helper, and leaves I think it's an automatic DQ. That being said, I've seen it both ways. The judge allowing a second and third 'voran' and one just calling it right away.
> Julie


Here is what the UScA rule book says (SchH/VPG III):

"If the dog does not find the helper in the blind, the handler may resend it, after being sent unsuccessfully 3 times to the helper, protection is terminated. Fighting drive rating will be noted as a dash (-).

LEAVING THE HELPER: If the dog leaves the helper after having found him, and before the handler leaves the mid line on the judges signal, the handler may, on the judges signal, send the dog in again. If the dog then stays close to the helper, the hold exercise will be rated 'insufficient. If the dog refuses or leaves the helper again Phase C is terminated & the fighting drive will be rated 'Not Sufficient'.

If the dog comes to the handler when he approaches the blind or the dog returns to the handler prior to verbal command, a partial score is given, reflecting a rating of 'insufficient' but the protection work is allowed to continue."

With regards to the rule book and IPO3, the difference is it says:

"When the dog reaches the helper blind, the handler is required to stand still. At this point no further verbal commands are permitted."
There is nothing about resending if the dog does not find the helper in the blind.


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## Julie Blanding (Mar 12, 2008)

Thanks Susan.


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## Sue DiCero (Sep 2, 2006)

Dog did see the helper the 1st time.


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## Jeff Oehlsen (Apr 7, 2006)

If a bear farts in the woods, does it still stink ????


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## David Frost (Mar 29, 2006)

Sue DiCero said:


> Dog did see the helper the 1st time.


I saw that one. that dog had absolutely no interest in the helper. He did indeed see him and elected to go sniff by the goal line, then over to the goal post. Wasn't all that excited about coming back to the handler initially. 

DFrost


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## susan tuck (Mar 28, 2006)

Oh ouch. The dog who failed to engage was the bitch Jazzmine v Ausland?


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## Mike Scheiber (Feb 17, 2008)

susan tuck said:


> Oh ouch. The dog who failed to engage was the bitch Jazzmine v Ausland?


She also has 21 pups walking the earth :x


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## Jeff Oehlsen (Apr 7, 2006)

Now that hit so hard the owners head snapped back. NICE.


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## Chris Keister (Jun 28, 2008)

I personally trained a dog out of Jazzmine and Too Fast Enzo for 12 months of it's life. He has a PSA PDC title. I have been a training decoy for over 10 years in venues from FR to PSA to Police Service. This particular dog from the time he came off the plane @ 8 weeks till the time I quit training him, was the hardest biting dog for his age i had ever worked. 

Herve Mavague (world level french ring decoy) worked him @ just under 5 months and said to me, "Dis dog is good." and preceded to put ring 2 stick work on a 5 month old puppy. A french trainer saying that about an american bred, trained, and handled GSD speaks volumes. Joel Monroe worked the dog @ 9 months and said, "That dog bites like a [email protected]&king alligator." 

I have no interest in this dog (other than the pride of helping raise him and doing his foundation training) or have any ties to his owner or breeder. However I must speak up when people say smart ass remarks regarding a dog they probably have never seen other than a video on a bad trial day. 

Anyone who has ever competed in more than a few trials, knows anything can happen come trial day. I know enough about Jazzmine to be fairly confident whatever happened was not a problem with her courage or temperament. Training maybe, not genetics.

Sorry don't want to de-rail a thread but had to speak up here.


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## Jeff Oehlsen (Apr 7, 2006)

You just go ahead mister, we will have our fun anyway. I had my turn at bat a few months ago, when my dog forgot how to do.........everything. : )


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## Chris Keister (Jun 28, 2008)

Not directed at you Jeff. Everyone knows your a jack !*s that just likes to bust balls, but can take it when someone gives it back

It irks me when people make snide remarks about dogs they have probably never seen that are for no other reason but to attempt to discredit someone's dogs or breeding program. Petty crap. Usually from people who are not attempting to compete at the level of the dogs they are trying to bash.[-X

Ok done high-jacking threads for now.......


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## Sue DiCero (Sep 2, 2006)

Chris,

No one made any petty comments about the dog or stated the name. I was there at the fence and taking pictures and answered about the DQ's.

This can happen at an event, no matter what. You have a pretty good idea normallly before you step on the field.


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## Clark Niemitalo (Jan 21, 2009)

Everyone crashing here for the most part all the dogs were good here..Quality of dogs and training has gotten better in the last few years..I should know i work the majority of the big events in Sch aswell as play with alot of the big ring guys..And for people that want to for say bust balls or crap on dogs or question a judge, show at a championship with your dog..Then lets talk, congrats to all on this board who have the tenasity to compete high level..Remember dogs dont forget we train.

Clark Niemitalo


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## Jeff Oehlsen (Apr 7, 2006)

Which ring guys are you training with ?? Have you come to your senses ??

By the way, I will always bust balls. There is no stopping me. LOL If Buko's performance in Colorado didn't shut me up, you guys have no hope.


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## Clark Niemitalo (Jan 21, 2009)

Jeff i know your attentions are not meant harsh and you put your self in the spot aswell, but a little consideration should be given to handlers too..

I have trained with John Brown, Ellis, Mario, Max, Ivan, Byan C and some nobody's. I do sch do to the availibility..I trained in Holland for along time doing KNPV.And have a pretty good back ground in suit work for sport..

No matter the outcome on the field everyone deserves cudos..I wish you and your dog all the luck on the field and during training..To me the sport is to small and tough to crackin on people and there dogs..A trainer in holland once told with all rude remarks comes a bit of truth and dispair..

Clark Niemitalo


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## Mike Scheiber (Feb 17, 2008)

Sue DiCero said:


> Chris,
> 
> No one made any petty comments about the dog or stated the name. I was there at the fence and taking pictures and answered about the DQ's.
> 
> This can happen at an event, no matter what. You have a pretty good idea normallly before you step on the field.


Since I tossed the first stone I should say we have one of K9 Imports Sue& Gabor young dogs in our club I would die for this little bitch. We had a 1/2 brother to my Jett that I think I would :roll: ahhh.
Breeding is a crap shoot I buy puppy's and think I have been VERY LUCKY with my choices. Would I get a pup from this bitch prolly not are the 21 pups she produced not good prolly more good than not I looked at the pedigrees all looked like thoughtful well planed breeding's.
Jazzmine seems to be bred well.
We have a fellow in the club going to start looking for a new pup I mentioned K9 imports he had allready had them on his short list. My next pup they will be on my list also for a look see.


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## Chris Keister (Jun 28, 2008)

Wasn't directed at you either Sue. You just stated what you saw. Yes a handler should have a pretty good idea of what will likely happen on a trial field and probably not the best decision to put a dog out there 12 weeks after a litter of pups. 

It was the 21 pups comment that irked me so I just wanted to clairfy that I have first hand knowledge of Jazzmine's B litter and it was a very, very nice litter. 

Clark about sums it up. People will take one comment and run with it. We are all sport people and should support each other.


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## Sue DiCero (Sep 2, 2006)

Chris,

Did not take personally. Heck, Isco (our dog) was one of the DQ's on the no out . I have already heard comments from people in our area about it- I just ignore them and smile, as they do not train or trial. Rather have that then canine bites....

Mike,

Thank you. Summer has done a great job and has a great support system, nice club. That is one of the most important things to us.


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## Chris Orkies (Sep 25, 2006)

Just some thoughts from the owner/handler.

Firstly I dont think Sue said anything wrong. She reported the results of the trial nothing more nothin less. 

First - Bitch in question was given 99pts by the same judge that was judging the C phase at regionals. Even he said it wasnt same dog.

Second - Never went to the goal post i dont think. But did run in the blind and then left and was having none of it. Cant say I blame her based upon my actions prior to event for not running blinds correctly.

Third - There were lots of owner/handler mistakes made before and while attending wdc for that it is my fault.

For those that have taken a bitch just off of having a litter to a national event without having a Sch3 or for that fact more than 7 trials under her belt my hat is off to you it is not easily done. In the end it is what it is.


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## Chris Orkies (Sep 25, 2006)

one more thing.....

I urge all of the handlers who have not competed at this level to do so. Pass or Fail the experience from the event is priceless.


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