# Desert Dog trial footage



## Tim Martens (Mar 27, 2006)

This was the protection routine:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nkiz3VMTdfo

Amazing at how many dogs were unable to go through the hose (not one GSD made it). The decoys were pretty brutal with the hose. In years past if the dog was not able to go through the distraction (hose, leaf blower, etc), the decoy would put it down and give the dog an easy bite. This year the decoys were told to run the dogs if they could. One dog came very close (within a few inches) and the decoy just kept putting water in the dog's eyes and the dog finally bugged out. Only 7 dogs bit the guy. There were 55 teams entered, but after they got to number 19, the announcer asked for all teams that had not gone to go down to the locker room and get ready to go. I heard that a number of teams bowed out of the protection after watching so many dogs get run.

Through the course of the trial the decoys normally pick 10 dogs to compete in the Tough Dog contest (which is the KNPV stick attack without the stick). This year they only picked the dogs that completed the courage test. This was Camo's attack:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BRtihpmbqPw

Could never successfully convert the .MOB file so no cool music or editing...


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## virginia reed (Mar 10, 2009)

where was this?


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## Tim Martens (Mar 27, 2006)

Scottsdale, AZ


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## Chris Michalek (Feb 13, 2008)

awesome!! I was there both days


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## ann schnerre (Aug 24, 2006)

see virginia, you have some "real" ppl there in AZ! Pm tim, but watch out for chris --he IS in another dimension...lol


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## Kyle Sprag (Jan 10, 2008)

Nice Video and nice dog.

Several years back a friend and I were at Adlerhorst tesing some dogs with several distractions including a Hose. Many a snicker from the K9 peanut gallery, makes you wonder. :roll:


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## Tim Martens (Mar 27, 2006)

ann freier said:


> see virginia, you have some "real" ppl there in AZ! Pm tim, but watch out for chris --he IS in another dimension...lol


i'm in california. i make the trip every year to compete in this trial. fun trial for sure. much better than the ones we have around here..


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## Jeff Oehlsen (Apr 7, 2006)

He looks better than the last time. Good stuff Tim.


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## Khoi Pham (Apr 17, 2006)

Why the heck would they want to run a PSD at a trial? If this is a trial then they shouldn't do that, much confident is lost after something like that, it will take alot of time to rebuild his confident, if they were trying to washout some weak dog then maybe, but that water hose, I think most did not see it and trained in it or have not been exposed to it that is why they ran, still doesn't mean a weak dog but to ran the dog that a K9 officer life might depended on later is not smart to me, but I wasn't there, I can only go by the statement that they try to ran the dog instead of giving the dog a prey bite if the dog can't go through it.


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## Tim Martens (Mar 27, 2006)

Khoi Pham said:


> Why the heck would they want to run a PSD at a trial? If this is a trial then they shouldn't do that, much confident is lost after something like that, it will take alot of time to rebuild his confident, if they were trying to washout some weak dog then maybe, but that water hose, I think most did not see it and trained in it or have not been exposed to it that is why they ran, still doesn't mean a weak dog but to ran the dog that a K9 officer life might depended on later is not smart to me, but I wasn't there, I can only go by the statement that they try to ran the dog instead of giving the dog a prey bite if the dog can't go through it.


while that certainly is a valid point and one side of the coin, look at the other side of the same coin. there are plenty of shitter PSD's out there and plenty of those dogs' handlers think they have the toughest thing on four paws. would you rather find that out in a trial or on the street? for a program that is run very well, this isn't an issue. the trainer should know the dog is weak. unfortunately, not all trainers or PSD programs were created equal. there are poor programs with poor trainers that put out shit dogs and because the handler doesn't know any better, they think their dog is badass. i guess i'd rather see it happen to a guy in a trial than on the street. again, this wasn't that hard of a courage test. the dogs didn't have to walk over hot coals to get to the decoy.

i dunno. i can see where you're coming from, but i like a trial that is tough on the dog. i don't want some GSD that has JUST enough drive to go out and bite walk away with a trophy...


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## Jim Nash (Mar 30, 2006)

That looked like fun . Gives me an idea for a training scenerio . Good job.


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## Khoi Pham (Apr 17, 2006)

I see your point, but the way I look at this is, if the dog don't want to engaged or came off the bite because of the pressure from the water or whatever, then he should failed and the judge should point out the problem and issues to the handler, no need to ran the dog off the field and make it worse, some dogs it could be just training issues, you ran the dog off the field you could ruined him for good, if a K9 officer see that his dog refused to engaged or came off the bite, I'm sure that will humble him and put his feet back on the ground and will question his training or his dog, and if he is still thinks his dog is bad ass then he shouldn't be a K9 officer then, but either way, as soon as the dog refused to engaged, the judge should know that there is a problem with the dog and gives a prey bite and then failed them, there is no need to run the dog.


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## Ted Efthymiadis (Apr 3, 2009)

Tim Martens said:


> Only 7 dogs bit the guy. ..


 hahaha, that is terrible. 
"DON't send the dog officer! I'v got a garden hose and I'll use it!"


P.S Loved the videos, your dog is great.


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## Jeff Oehlsen (Apr 7, 2006)

Quote: I think most did not see it and trained in it or have not been exposed to it that is why they ran, still doesn't mean a weak dog but to ran the dog that a K9 officer life might depended on later is not smart to me

How the **** is a dog that will run from water supposed to be a "life saver"????

This goes back to the firebreather arguement on the KNPV thread. I don't want a dog that runs from water to trust my life to.

THis is not directly at you Koi, but this way of thinking needs to stop. Toss the ****ing dog in the shitter on your way out. There is no fixing "cur"

I play at a sport. So do you. But the bar for what is acceptable shouldn't drop and bounce all over the place so that "trainers" can fix the dogs boo boo.


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## Ted Efthymiadis (Apr 3, 2009)

The thing that boggles me is:

Knowing that the year before, the dogs were being sprayed down with a hose.... why did these dogs who could not take the hose even make the trip?


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## Chris Michalek (Feb 13, 2008)

I was really surprised at how undertrained I thought the most of the dogs were. Some were soooooo sloppy and lacked intensity it was hard to believe they were real working dogs. Some wouldn't go into the long tunnel and I find it hard to believe the handler wouldn't train for that. I do that stuff with sewers pipes every chance I get just for fun.

There were some very very nice dogs though.


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## Khoi Pham (Apr 17, 2006)

By all mean shit dog shouldn't be on the street working with the officer, I'm all for that, but dog are still dog, they are not superman, if something suprised them and that they have not seen before, it will get into their nerve a little, all it takes is a little training and they will learn to deal with the stress and overcome it, that is if you have a decent dog, so why ruin a dog? now I wasn't there so there could be some really bad dog that shouldn't be there or on the street in the first place, but I'm sure there could be some that just need some more training, I've seen many trainers go through so many dog before they keep one, many time it is not the dog. if the dog came off the bite from being pressured, that is enough to terminate the exercise and failed the dog, why run him off the field?


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## Tim Martens (Mar 27, 2006)

Ted Efthymiadis said:


> The thing that boggles me is:
> 
> Knowing that the year before, the dogs were being sprayed down with a hose.... why did these dogs who could not take the hose even make the trip?


last year was a leaf blower. two years ago there was a hose. there was no way of knowing this year would be a hose again.


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## ann schnerre (Aug 24, 2006)

tim-your dog just keeps getting better every year! great job!


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## Jeff Oehlsen (Apr 7, 2006)

Quote: I'm all for that, but dog are still dog, they are not superman, if something suprised them and that they have not seen before, it will get into their nerve a little

OR, you just get one that just does the job. There are dogs out there that just do the job. Can't un-train pussy.


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## Selena van Leeuwen (Mar 29, 2006)

Jeff Oehlsen said:


> Quote: I'm all for that, but dog are still dog, they are not superman, if something suprised them and that they have not seen before, it will get into their nerve a little
> 
> OR, you just get one that just does the job. There are dogs out there that just do the job. Can't un-train pussy.


Just like Jeff already wrote, THAT'S what a policedog should be about. In the streets every time is the first time. 
You come across situations that are new over and over again.
They should have the courage and "fight" to solve every new situation.

Ofcourse you should train the dog by bringing him in new situations each time. If you see the dog having trouble with that, because you have to help the dog every "first" time, than you know the dog is not suitable as a working policedog.

If the handler or instructor won't/can't see that than you come across problems like your dog is running away from a hose.

That is called; learning the hard way..... 

You should know if you enter a contest like, this is what the risks are. 

Its like entering the ring in a K1 fight. You know you can go down/out. The only good remedy is to train hard and have the right spirit. (there is not so much difference with how to prepaire a working policedog...)

Dick


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## Ted Efthymiadis (Apr 3, 2009)

Jim Nash said:


> That looked like fun . Gives me an idea for a training scenerio . Good job.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9KTPmPGRgFg&feature=channel_page

Now this is a distraction!


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## Carlos Machado (Dec 28, 2008)

That was a great distraction many dogs wouldn't go near that thing. I used the hose on my pup once to train her to stay in the yard when the gate was open she just took it full blast in the face she just stood at the gate.


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## Guest (Apr 30, 2009)

....:-s.....


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## Jim Nash (Mar 30, 2006)

Ted Stated ;

" Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim Nash 
That looked like fun . Gives me an idea for a training scenerio . Good job. 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9KTPm...e=channel_page

Now this is a distraction! "

Yes that is . I'd be a little worried the dog's eyes might get hurt doing that . 


Tim , have you ever thought about doing Las Vegas' trial ?

We got the OK to build the obstacles they use to practice and go on our own dime but things got too busy around here the past few years in preparation for hosting the Republican National Covention last year so it all went out the window . It looks like a cool K9 event .


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## Connie Sutherland (Mar 27, 2006)

Tim Martens said:


> i'm in california. i make the trip every year to compete in this trial. fun trial for sure. much better than the ones we have around here..


It was great last year and it's great again. 

I'm glad you posted this!


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## Tim Martens (Mar 27, 2006)

Jim Nash said:


> Ted Stated ;
> 
> " Quote:
> Originally Posted by Jim Nash
> ...


i have heard that the las vegas trial is very good as well. i have never competed in it and i would love to, but honestly, one boys only trip a year is probably all i can get away with.

hey do you know if mark is coming up this way again at the beginning of june for eden's conference?




thanks connie


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## Jim Nash (Mar 30, 2006)

When I was married I only had a few trips like that I could attend . Now that I'm single I'm too broke to have fun like that . Most of my fun now is watching my kids play sports . I got to win the lottery or something . 

I don't know , Mark and I don't talk much anymore . I know he's graduating a new patrol dog class around then and there is a K9 trail on the 6th here also .


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