# Aggressive dog class



## Tammy St. Louis

So this is not a class we normally have at my classes but we ended up with 5 great owners that had dogs with all the same issues,
fear aggression or aggression due to insecurity
it was amazing to see the transformation as soon as the owners left the room the dogs were powerless and did nothing
some of these dogs needed more muzzle training , but some of the buggin with them was stress too

I just love watching dogs and observing behaviours

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MiuwGAJV47k&feature=player_embedded


----------



## Joby Becker

Pretty interesting to watch yes, but not surprising really. It's interesting what happens when the people are taken out of the picture with most dogs.

thanks for sharing


----------



## Anne Vaini

Nice video. Fun to watch.


----------



## Anne Pridemore

What a great example of how the handler dictates the behavior of the dog. 

I watched this twice. Once to watch the dogs and their body language. Then again to watch the human body launguage. Even on camra I could pick up the stiff nervousness of the handlers- taking that into account- it is no wonder the dogs are acting out.

I hope follow ups are planed on this. :wink:


----------



## Tammy St. Louis

yes we plan to meet up once a week , and we can see where this goes !


----------



## Donna DeYoung

thanks for sharing, nice video. I have a relative in Grand Rapids MI who is afraid to take their adopted yellow lab mix out in public bec the dog has possible fear agression to other dogs. the dog is very sweet and submissive w/ people. any trainers in that area or clubs that you could suggest she get in contact w/? thanks.


----------



## Konnie Hein

Interesting video, Tammy. Thanks for sharing. How do you proceed from this point? What's the next step?


----------



## Chris McDonald

That was really cool, whole bunch going on there I don’t understand.


----------



## Tammy St. Louis

sorry Donna I dont know any trainers in the states at all really , 
Konnie, hmmm whats next, I dont know I am not much of a planner i train alot by how i am feeling from whats going on with the dogs, I know that i want them in the room with the dogs so i will probably send them out again away from thier dogs, make sure the dogs are still acting the same, then call them in and see if they change


----------



## Jeff Oehlsen

What happens when you actually get a dog aggro dog, and not little **** like these ?? That is what I would like to see. I have seen this many times in the past. I don't really call this dog aggression anymore. 

However it is cool to watch the tards leave and the dogs go "oh shit".


----------



## Tammy St. Louis

trust me , I work with dog aggro dogs , the real ones, I dont use this type of training to work with them , with some it would make them more powerfull , i saw this done before with 12 dogs some had fear aggro and some real stuff, there was a pit bull there who took out ALL 12 dogs with her muzzle on including a 120lb malimute, she wrestled all of them to the ground went around the room and pinned all of them one by one, I talked to the trainer after that and asked her what next with the pit, that dog walked in thinking it was all that and walked out KNOWING it was! not a good senario , 
with dogs with real dog aggro , I use correction and treats when they ignore, my goal is for them to ignore other dogs , if they try to fight there willl be a consiqence by me, if they choose to ignore then they get praise or treats, 
there are alot more phony dogs like this in the world though for sure, 
this is owner induced moslty .


----------



## Tammy St. Louis

>>>However it is cool to watch the tards leave and the dogs go "oh shit".>>

i hope you are not meaning tards as retards,, 
there is no need for this , these people are good people, good students and are trying thier best, 
no need for name calling really ,, REALLY!


----------



## Jack Roberts

Hi Tammy,

Is it really fair to try to take the dog aggression out of a pitbull? 

The pitbull has been bred for aggression towards other dogs. It seems like punishing a labador for retrieving. I'm not saying all pitbulls bred today have aggression towards animals and most of them look nothing like some of the pits that I saw in the 80s and the early 90s. 

My pitbull had aggression towards other dogs. It did not surprise me. I never punished her for it but just kept her away from other dogs. I taught her to out early and she would let go of a dog if I gave her an out command. 

I find it interesting in the video of the number of Australian Shepherds. I know of an Australian Shepherd that shows the same behaviors. The Australian shepherd as a breed seems to have become a real nervy dog.

Handlers and making dog nervy:

I do not agree about people making the dog nervy. It is more of a myth in my opinion or something breeders use to make excuses for their poorly bred dogs. I think it is a genetic issue in most dogs. My house is a mad house with small kids running around. The dog is still calm and does not mind the kids stepping on him, pulling him and usual kids' behavior with dogs. Now, if you put one of those dogs in your class in my house then the dog would be a nervous wreck. The genetics are just bad in these dogs. 

The handlers did not make the dogs nervous but may have made the behavior more prominent but if the genetics were good than the dogs would have never showed these behaviors no matter how nervy the handler may be.


----------



## Tammy St. Louis

i am not trying to take aggression out of any breed, just teach them how to control it , and yes even pit bulls, 
I have owned the breed for 9 yrs now , I have 2 am staffs and one APBT, 2 of them were in the video as helper dogs , the ones with no muzzles on 
my staff has some serious dog aggression , and YES i have trained him how to control it , he is not allowed to act on it just cuz its in his genetics, I have seen a few of his relatives and all are dog aggressive, so its in him , i get it , but i still expect what i want from him , CONTROL 
he is not a dog i would use right away with dogs like this, but eventually he will be in this group to teach the others appropriate behaviour, He is not allowed to fight , period, i will correct but mostly i have spent yrs treating appropriate behaviour, so he makes some really great choices on his own now, it has been alot of work but worth it, do i believe he will never fight again, no,, thats not reallity but ,as of now i have had him with up to 20 loose dogs , and he has been behaved, i am very carefull what type of dogs he goes with though as he likes a dog that will challange or unstable dogs are a trigger for him , like the ones who are super hyper and out of control , 
so yes i think it can be done , it takes alot of work , not just one session like this
I do belive that alot of this fear stuff has to do with gentectics also , for sure, but i have seen some nice dogs ruined by nervous owners too , 
the dogs try stuff, and the people take it out of context, like if the dogs barks or lunges at another dog or person , ( normal stuff most dogs will try at one time , doing it in a friendly manner or not ) owners take it wrong, get nervous and feel the dog has a probelm , they then , make a problem ..
I dont fall into the breed stuff , breeds for sure have pre disposition for certain behaviours but that does not mean you must allow it or isolate .. work with it


----------



## Tammy St. Louis

>>>I find it interesting in the video of the number of Australian Shepherds. I know of an Australian Shepherd that shows the same behaviors.

there is only one auzzie in the video ?


----------



## Jack Roberts

I see one pure bred Australian Shepherd and it looks like the fatter merle colored dog is also mix with AS.


----------



## Tammy St. Louis

no its a fat sheltie, purebred


----------



## Jeff Oehlsen

Quote: i hope you are not meaning tards as retards,, 
there is no need for this , these people are good people, good students and are trying thier best, 
no need for name calling really ,, REALLY!

I have 2 friends that are retarded, one just sorta, and the other is about average. They would call those people retards. They just paid your ass for no reason, and caused all this shit to happen. They would REALLY make fun of them, because to them, if you do something dumb, you are gonna get it.


----------



## Tammy St. Louis

>>>I have 2 friends that are retarded, one just sorta, and the other is about average. They would call those people retards. They just paid your ass for no reason, and caused all this shit to happen.

Well nobodys perfect Jeff, not all people are born knowing how to train dogs thats why trainers are there to help, I think calling these people you dont know retards, is really childish , but if you dont think so and neither do your retarded freinds, well to each his own, 
have you never needed help with something in life, that you werent born knowing?
like not nesscarily dog training, just life, fixing something perhaps that you had to ask someone who knew how, and found out how easy it really was to fix IF YOU KNEW HOW, but you didnt , so you ask for help right?
thats what these people are doing, they are not retards, they are asking for help, it is easier to go and be normal general public and get rid of the dogs , but they are wanting to work with it, so I will help .
but thanks for your comments they were very helpfull and usefull ,,lol


----------



## Joby Becker

Jeff is a tard when it comes to computers  And yes he admitted it.


----------



## Jeff Oehlsen

Yeah, welcome to the new "sensitive when it goes in my favor" dog world.


----------



## Sanda Stankovic

> my staff has some serious dog aggression , and YES i have trained him how to control it , he is not allowed to act on it just cuz its in his genetics, I have seen a few of his relatives and all are dog aggressive, so its in him , i get it , but i still expect what i want from him , CONTROL


how did you do it, I would really like to know because it might help me with my dog? at one point in the video I have to say I thought he was going to go after that other dog... Is it a good idea putting him with dogs like that in the first place if he can go off?


----------



## Tammy St. Louis

HE is not in the video , those are my 2 dog freindly pits who have alot of experince doing this, they were not or would not go off, i wont put my DA pit in there until i have everything under control


----------



## Tammy St. Louis

part 2 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0-XNW1xRynM


----------



## Sanda Stankovic

I am confused... Why did Rudy break up the fight rather than join in? Is this a trained behaviour, as to me it doesn't seem natural for a dog to step in between two random dogs with the sole purpose of dissolving the conflict... This question is just me trying to understand their behaviour...


----------



## Ted Efthymiadis

Tammy St. Louis said:


> So this is not a class we normally have at my classes but we ended up with 5 great owners that had dogs with all the same issues,
> fear aggression or aggression due to insecurity
> it was amazing to see the transformation as soon as the owners left the room the dogs were powerless and did nothing
> some of these dogs needed more muzzle training , but some of the buggin with them was stress too
> 
> I just love watching dogs and observing behaviours
> 
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MiuwGAJV47k&feature=player_embedded


I'll be passing this along to my clients to watch, thanks.


----------



## Tammy St. Louis

some dogs do not like conflict and feel the need to break it up, i have 2 fun police at my house , anyone starts having fun my dobe and DA staff are there to make sure that doesnt happen, they feel things are getting out of control and are both control freeks , and like things a certain way , 
saying that Rudy my red APBT is the one ususally trying to have some fun , not breaking up fun 
but i noticed a few yrs back that if dogs were trying to fight or getting too rough with each other , he would jump in and split them up , alot of dogs do splitting behaviour, just not to this extreem 
he is a truly amazing and gifted dog, and i hope to have him for a very long time , he is now 9 yrs old
I didnt teach this behaviour, but i sure as hell have reinforced it , always telling him he is good or giving him treats ..


----------



## Geoff Empey

That Dane sure looks likes the instigator. He is pretty young I bet, 18 mos or so? The Shar-Pei I sure see a lot of improvement over last week but the handler sure panics though when the poo hits the fan, that can't be good. After your pitty told the 2 of them off, there again was a big positive change again in the Shar-Pei. I saw all sorts of positive body language as the session progressed. Well done Shar-Pei! Keep working on the handler Tammy if she can keep it together and become old hat at it the dog is going to be all right.


----------



## Ben Colbert

Rudy needs to give that Dane a good ass whoopin. But I imagine that wouldn't help much.


----------



## Tammy St. Louis

the dane is under a yr she adopted him from our local shelter about 4 months ago , he was about 8 months or so then ,, yes the shar - pei owner is deffinalty a worrier, she is trying to relax,, lol 
but its hard, she is also scared of other dogs , so this class is hard for her, but she is trying


----------



## Geoff Empey

No doubt but I bet this class will do lots to help the Shar-Peis handler's confidence as that is part of it as well. I've got a good feeling about the dog though. The Dane I'm not sure about though. Keep on them Tammy.


----------



## Anne Pridemore

I don't see a truely aggressive dane. He is socialy retarded for sure- but most of his actions seemed to start as an atempt to play/interact. I have 4 Danes in my pack - 2 were severe neglect cases, of the two one of them acted very much like the Dnae in the video, the other had real aggression issues. The differance to me is there is no break in the behavior the first few times working the issue. With the socialy retareded Dane just getting him with stable dogs and teaching him the rules of dog interaction (much like the videos are showing) has him 5 months later loose with the pack and no issues to speek of - even out in public. The other Dane has been worked for 9 months and is stable within the pack- but has not made it to outside world yet.

I think with this Dane being younger- if his owner steps up and puts on her big girl panties he will be fine. Also the play and the sound of a Dane having a good time can be VERY intemidating if you do not know what your looking at or hearing.

I think the Shar-pei and owner are the biggest issue in the class. Watching the body language and reactions of both dog and handler say alot. The owner is tight as a drum and the dog keeps a stong posture troughout.

(Watch the videos with the sound off- it will sometimes change what your looking at. :wink: Body language is a powerful thing.)


----------



## Tammy St. Louis

the dane is not trying to play i would say , he has taken jump bites ( which is what he is doing in the video ) at his 2 pack members ( both danes) and put stitches in both of them on thier sides, so i dont think he is trying to play , but i also dont belive he is truly aggressive either, he just donest know what to do , he is deffinalty insecure also


----------



## Anne Pridemore

Tammy St. Louis said:


> he just donest know what to do , he is deffinalty insecure also


An insecure dog needs a Master not a mommy. I delt with a very insecure Doberman over the past year. History of 3 human bites and 7 dog bites - most needing medical attention. He had been through clicker classes and two behaviorist before comming to my training partner and I. Basicly we helped him or he died, there were no more options for him. As all the new more positve methods of training did not work- we put him on the Kohler Method. (Don -? I think- is doing a great thread on this Method)

The bigest thing I see is that this method truely makes you the dogs leader. The dog is shown how to do a behavior and then held responceable for the behavior. Parise for good, correct for bad. At 6 months out in his training the doberman tested safe in public and safe with 18 of 19 dogs in the house. He is no longer insecure because he knows I and my partner are in control of the situation. He even plays with many of the dogs in the pack now.

I've seen alot of people give up on reactive Danes. They are BIG dogs that can do BIG damage in a short amount of time. People take for granted that they are gentle giants- but these monster dogs used to hunt in packs and bring down wild bore. They are only going to be as gentle as they are socailized and trained to be. 

I hope you can help all these guys get over their issues Tammy.Good luck, I'll be keeping an eye on their progress.


----------



## Tammy St. Louis

i agree, he needs a master, i use correction in training , he is trained on e- collar so she can have conrtol over him , she is a very good owner and i am sure she will be able to work this out with my help


----------



## Tammy St. Louis

part 3 the dane starts to play near the end,, only 2 dogs came this week , the other 2 owners were working and one dog got heatstroke , 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=72jyyW_WQF8


----------



## Anne Pridemore

I am always amazed how many people stop showing up to classes. Down to 2 from 5-6 from the first video? I can understand heat-stroke, but the other owners clearly have more important things to do than deal with their reactive dogs. Personal pet peeve of mine.

Any how - the Dane is doing well. The aussie seems to be calming down too. This is such a neet class to watch. I have delt with dog on dog aggression many times, but it is often two waring family dogs or last chance shelter dogs. This is interesting as they are all "unrelated students".


----------



## Tammy St. Louis

ya , heat stroke from the one dog, the sheltie owner works at the police station and they were understaffed boss made her go in, she was pissed, but hopefully they all show up this week


----------



## Nicole Stark

Tammy St. Louis said:


> some dogs do not like conflict and feel the need to break it up, ...but i noticed a few yrs back that if dogs were trying to fight or getting too rough with each other , he would jump in and split them up , alot of dogs do splitting behaviour, just not to this extreem he is a truly amazing and gifted dog, and i hope to have him for a very long time , he is now 9 yrs old I didnt teach this behaviour, but i sure as hell have reinforced it , always telling him he is good or giving him treats ..


Its an interesting behavior to observe for sure. My first Dogue de Bordeaux did the same type of stuff but on a number of fairly unexpected levels. The first time I saw it was when my male attempted to bite my husband for walking past him while he was eating. Seemed like out of no where she came. She roughed him up, but not in the way you'd classify as a fight but more of way to indicate "your out of line". 

Another time our neighbors dog had some pedestrians cornered who also had a child in a stroller. There was a lot of history with this particular dog between her owner and I, but finally I had had it. I sent my dog after her and she did the most unexpected thing. She ran full speed and plowed into the dog, as she did at the last second she grabbed her by the scruff of her neck as she went over her and flipped that dog 360 and slammed her on the ground. All I needed to do was call her back to get her out of the road. My cousin just stared at me wide eyed and said that was the coolest thing I have ever seen a dog do. I gotta admit, I've seen a lot of cool things posted here but this still stands out in my mind as being one of the most impressive.

She did this "moderating" type behavior several times throughout her life but the last was just weeks before I realized she had lymphoma at around 2 1/2 years old. My cousins dog and the male noted above started fighting. At first she went after the one winning, then she changed when the table turned and the other dog was on top. It sounds like from your description this isn't unusual behavior. Regardless, there's no question that she was one of my most interesting (curious) dogs I've ever owned. I can't begin to tell you how deeply hurt I was to lose that dog to cancer and so quickly. I got the Dx on Wed and she was gone (needed to be PTS) by Saturday. In just one week she had lost 12 lbs, previous to then I had no idea she was sick.

I haven't thought about her for quite a while, but thanks to your story I got a chance to reflect back about some of the things she did during the short time she was here.


----------



## Marta Wajngarten

Tammy thanks for taking and sharing those vids. I run a doggy daycare and get to experience this owner/no owner behaviour difference with a lot of dogs in all sorts capacities, not just aggression. I have also seen a lot of dogs capable of integrating perfectly into our group, while their owners had dog aggression issues while on their own. 

It's very nice for you to put a class like this together, dealing with an aggressive dog can be so hard for the average person, being able to see other people also try to cope with it can be encouraging. So many people give up on their dogs and just accept them as being aggressive and unchangeable instead of putting in the effort to do the necessary training. Mind you, some dogs will never get to the point of perfect, but a lot of them are capable of improvement. I don't think all dogs need to be taught to love other dogs, that's a ridiculous concept, but to be able to walk past another dog without acting out is certainly a good goal for most.


----------



## Tammy St. Louis

Well last weeks class was full of fights, this was the first time we had ALL the dogs there, so there was alot of sorting out to do between them , video to come 

THIS week we went on a group walk with all the dogs muzzled ,it was  fantastic, just missing the sheltie but there was a new Border collie who joined the group, 
Walk was fantastic, no fighting at all on it 
here are some pics, videos to come

















this pic was from last week the shar - pei came out with just me and my dogs and got into some mud


----------



## Kristen Cabe

So, do you think this class is actually going to be productive as far as these dogs not having to be muzzled when taken out in public? The reason I ask is because you say there were lots of fights last week because there were new dogs (or dogs that had not been there much previously) present. It sounds like the dogs that have been regulars have gotten to know each other, but as soon as a new/different dog enters the mix, they revert back.


----------



## Tammy St. Louis

I am sure some of them will never be ok with all dogs at all times
but i am giving the owners the tools and information, on how to introduce thier dogs to others safely , what to look for and such, we are only one week 4 so 4 hrs of working with a dog will not make miracles, this stuff takes time, for the dog to learn how to act appropiatley , and its hard with people not showing up, keeps changing dynamics,,


----------



## Anne Pridemore

I have found the best way to work reactivity is daily. Do you have them do any work at home or are they just working the dogs in class once a week?

Love the muddy buddy pic.


----------



## Anna Kasho

What's the thinking behind allowing the "sorting out between them" in muzzle? I don't get it?


----------



## Tammy St. Louis

they are all in obedience classes once a week to , and hopefully practice at home also , there is a couple who are now walking thier dogs togehter, but there is not many people willing to work with these guys out of the school because not alot of people want to volunteer thier dogs to be the guina pigs,

What's the thinking behind allowing the "sorting out between them" in muzzle? I don't get it?

some of it is to teach them to try something else, they fight , it doesnt work they try something else , like maybe sniffing, we praise , and teach them what is more approriate, most cannot or will not continue to fight on going with a muzzle on , so they learn to tolerate each other better, 
now i am introducing , interupting so seeing when the dog is thinking it, to redirect, and so on, 
most of these guys did not know what their dogs were capable of prior to this nor did they see all the pre warnings before a fight as they never let thier dogs get this far


----------



## Nicole Stark

That Shar-pig has made quite a mess of things. He/she looks a little like a weird cage fighter in that get up. 

I figure if for nothing else these sessions teach the owners the possibility of what other behaviors could take place with the right moderation either of their own behavior or that of their dog.


----------



## Kristen Cabe

I look forward to hearing more about their progress.


----------



## Tammy St. Louis

we are missing a few weeks video , but they will come 

here is what i got today 
growl walk was amazing today , took everyones muzzles off except for amber the shar- pei , 

beggining of walk 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ikiozRA32Fs 
went to lake 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B_MtzVca1mw 
end of walk 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UbMwuhu5HnA


----------



## Tammy St. Louis

week 5 ,, the dogue on the left is a rescue I pulled from our local shelter , she is stellar temperment and was the tole model


----------



## Anne Pridemore

=D> Not a bad run at all for 5 weeks out! Great videos. You can tell that the aussie and dane handlers are doing their homework! Super.


----------



## Nicole Stark

I don't know why I find it humorous that the Sharpei still has the muzzle on. Reminds me a little of when I was in the 6th grade and spent what seemed like a month in the corner of the classroom with my desk facing the wall.


----------



## Tammy St. Louis

the shar - pei is a bit more of a serious fighter than the rest, she got ahold of the sheltie before with her muzzle on and took a chunk of hair out
today she was playing chase with the auzzie and then it turned from play to prey , so i was happy to still have her muzzle on then , i think next week we will try her off it , at the end of the walk when she is more tired


----------



## Tammy St. Louis

so this is week 8 of the growl class 
dogs are off leash off muzzles except for the shar pei still , she needs more work but has come a long way , 
the sheltie in here has his muzzle on in this video , but buy the end of the day it was off, he has not been to alot of the classes so i was being on the safe side for a bit longer
it has been a incredible experience , watching the dogs change , AND THE PEOPLE change, 
a different vibe was deffianlty on this last walk , everyone was calm and had ideas on what they were looking for in their dogs, ( triggers) and were seeing stuff i was seeing, which was great
I am in the process of making these all into better movies like the first few, but my person who is doing it has been really busy , but we will get there, 
this is just a clip


----------



## Tammy St. Louis

here is the link 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FFeOpE41QW4

PS the dogue in there is not mine, I just pulled her from our local shelter 2 weeks ago , she is staying with the owner of the dane, she has the most amazing temperment, nothing gets to her , so right away we took her out with all the problem dogs and she was amazing!


----------



## Joby Becker

Tammy St. Louis said:


> What's the thinking behind allowing the "sorting out between them" in muzzle? I don't get it?
> 
> some of it is to teach them to try something else, they fight , it doesnt work they try something else , like maybe sniffing, we praise , and teach them what is more approriate, most cannot or will not continue to fight on going with a muzzle on , so they learn to tolerate each other better,
> now i am introducing , interupting so seeing when the dog is thinking it, to redirect, and so on,
> most of these guys did not know what their dogs were capable of prior to this nor did they see all the pre warnings before a fight as they never let thier dogs get this far


Who knows.... One might think it would be better to not let them try to sort it out, when they can't actually sort it out...but who knows...


----------



## Tammy St. Louis

joby becker said:


> who knows.... one might think it would be better to not let them try to sort it out, when they can't actually sort it out...but who knows...



what???


----------



## Anne Pridemore

Great video. They came a long way in 8 weeks, awesome what a little human training can do for a group of dogs. More than anything I think this class shows that in most reactive cases the handler dictates the dogs behavior. The Shar Pei seems to me the only dog with a real aggression issue, but it is not as extreeme as it could be. Working the behavior will end it. 

Good work Tammy!\\/


----------



## Tammy St. Louis

this week video very short but this time i brought almost all my dogs including my pup Vandal , to intro the dogs to new dogs 
they all did well 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nXkmz113uOY


----------



## Tammy St. Louis

since i last wrote in we have added 2 more dogs on the walk 
Grayls a mixy guy and Prince a black lab was added today 

today we had 16 dogs on the walk we have been walking together once every 2 weeks since last post



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8iiEfUqh710

part 2 of today 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BkEGLe665JA


----------



## Lloyd Kasakoff

Tammy, 

After a few great ideas from a Mondio Judge, your thread kinda motivated me to try to do some things with our dogs who were accused of "aggression" over 2 years. 

Here's the story - thank you! Your thread gave me that last "kick" to get this thing done...


http://www.workingdogforum.com/vBulletin/f30/yessssss-myth-dog-aggression-done-17452/


----------



## Butch Cappel

Really great training. Thanks for taking the time to put it all up, can't nothing but good come from things like this, for dogs AND people.


----------



## Tammy St. Louis

today oct the shar- pei was FINALLY ready to have her muzzle off, 7 months of work , pays off!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WcijTchHctY


----------



## Stacy Fleming-Walker

Sanda Stankovic said:


> I am confused... Why did Rudy break up the fight rather than join in? Is this a trained behaviour, as to me it doesn't seem natural for a dog to step in between two random dogs with the sole purpose of dissolving the conflict... This question is just me trying to understand their behaviour...



I have an elderly female Malinois that will also jump in and break up a fight. She always has.


----------



## Stacy Fleming-Walker

Tammy St. Louis said:


> today oct the shar- pei was FINALLY ready to have her muzzle off, 7 months of work , pays off!
> 
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WcijTchHctY


Thanks for sharing the progress. I have been getting alot of fear aggressive dog clients lately, and I have enjoyed reading this thread!


----------



## Nicole Stark

Pretty cool. Looks like a nice walk for everyone. I never noticed this before but has your DDB always paced?


----------



## Tammy St. Louis

not sure what you mean by pace, like pacing in a trot , or just walking walking walking and so on, 
she is from a puppy mill bust , so she did alot of pacing back and forth circles circles circles, for a very long time, she does it now occasionally when she is unsure of something , it comes back ,,


----------



## Tammy St. Louis

just bumping this for some newbies


----------



## Chris Keister

I think that is a nice approach for that group of dogs and a very well run class. 

I don't see any sever DA, fear Agression, or unstable temperaments. I see a bunch of slightly insecure dogs, inappropriate prior socialization, and inexperienced owners. 

None of these dogs are like mine or the one Maren was describing in my opinion. 

Nice class and job with that group though.


----------



## Tammy St. Louis

there is no serious DA i said that in the posts up top, but there is deffinalty fear aggression, and no unstable temperments, just uneducated people and dogs , and insecure all around lol


----------



## Gena Ratcliff

Thanks Tammy!

As one of those "newbies" I always appreciate seeing the ways of dealing with particular behaviors.

Good job (pat-pat and cookie thrown in your direction)

Gena


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD


----------

