# Banding vs Cutting Tails



## Howard Gaines III

Didn't see anything on this and wanted some *current information*. Where I live, most vets will not crop the dog's ears and only a few want to dock tails. Is there any current information out there on which technique is the best? 

On sheep, we band the tails and testicles. The European ban on this practice makes animals in their nature form look a little different. I have two Bouviers and one has the tail and one doesn't.


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## Julie Ann Alvarez

I have freinds who have done both. My girl friend banded her boxer pups using a special elastic string and they all turned out nicely. The great thing about banding is if it looks to long/short you can redo it.

I have another friend who snips them off at 3 days and some times they look like crap. 

Incidently another person I knew took a litter in to the vet for cropping and the vet actually stitched the tails and they ended up looking funky.


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## Maren Bell Jones

Julie Ann Alvarez said:


> Incidently another person I knew took a litter in to the vet for cropping and the vet actually stitched the tails and they ended up looking funky.


The old rural vet I shadowed that docked tails and did declaws on cats did it this way. He used a pair of sharp scissors style nail clippers for both tail docks and declaws and put a suture in the tail. I thought it was gross personally...I know it's not advisable to do it under general anesthesia of course, but I wonder if you could for local?


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## Kadi Thingvall

I banded a litter pups years ago, and didn't like the results. They all had a bald spot on the end of the tail and some scar tissue. After that I had my vet do the tails, and they always turned out nice. The trick is to make sure they pull as much of the skin on the tail towards the rear end before they cut the tail, so their is plenty to cover the stump. He'd put a few stitches in, and they had nice tails, completely covered with hair.


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## Howard Gaines III

I have heard both stories and wasn't sure the method to go with. The bald spot at the tail base would be an issue if the skin wasn't gathered.


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## Will Kline

Howard, check out the photos section under "smudge". Did you know that docking was illegal in the UK? I was actually surprised to hear that but wondered what people thought about that kind of thing happening here in the US?


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## Will Kline

When you said the European ban on this practice makes animalslook a little different I thought you meant one or the other not that docking in general was banned. Quite surprised to learn this.


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## Will Kline

NVM, Ian gave me the run-down on when and how this came to be. As I told him, still surprised this came to be but happy to learn something new always! Cheers. :wink:


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## Howard Gaines III

I am glad we don't have it here. It make those breeds that are docked look strange with tails. I have a Bouvier that I imported from The Netherlands and it has a natural tail. My female was born here and had her tail cut.


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## mark chase

2-5 days old. push the skin down toward the body. crunch it with a hemostat. cut the skin then twist and pull. with a cuticle clipper remove the last part of the vertibrea. some antibiotic let the skin come back up and clamp it with the hemostat. 
the dew claws are done with a cuticle cutter. clip it off then open the wound and clip out the rest of the claw. some skin cement pinch it closed done next. 
you will see those with good hearts and those with bad when you do this. the gums and nose you will see.

it is a two person job. one to operate and one to hold.
no scars the mother leaves the tails and legs alone no foriegn material (sutures)

mark chase


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## Melissa Blazak

In some European countries it is banned. Some countries also ban dogs from competing in international/world events if the dog is docked/cropped, even if in the dogs home country it is not banned. Something that came up last year I think with the World Agility Championships. 2007 they were held in Hamar, Norway. There were a couple of U.S. mini poodles, super fast, that I believe qualified, but couldn't compete because of the ban.


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## Jamielee Nelson

Maren Bell Jones said:


> The old rural vet I shadowed that docked tails and did declaws on cats did it this way. He used a pair of sharp scissors style nail clippers for both tail docks and declaws and put a suture in the tail. I thought it was gross personally...I know it's not advisable to do it under general anesthesia of course, but I wonder if you could for local?


Puppies are too young to go under any type of anesthesia local or not. At my hopsital we do them around 5 days and we just cut them quick wrap and put medicated lotion on the area.


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## Howard Gaines III

An update on this post. 

I banded the tails my Bouvier puppies with the help of a friend. All the tail sets were short, as I wanted and all look good. Within 5 days, the first tail was off and at about 10 days the rest were off. I used alcohol (70%) and watched for infection. 

The vet wanted $50. for the first tail and $40. for each pup after that. Teah I saved money, the pups don't have any issued, and the job looks great. I would do this on my next breeding. It was done at two days of age.


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## Maren Bell Jones

Jamielee Nelson said:


> Puppies are too young to go under any type of anesthesia local or not. At my hopsital we do them around 5 days and we just cut them quick wrap and put medicated lotion on the area.


I did some looking on VIN and this is absolutely *not* true. Local nerve blocks with Lidocaine are quite common for dew claws and tail docks in neonates. This is the only way I'd do them. 

I've personally used isoflurane on 1 day old inch long mouse pups to do castrations and ovariectomies. Definitely doable, just more risky. I'll stick with the local blocks for dew claws and tail docks.


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## Jamielee Nelson

Maren Bell Jones said:


> I did some looking on VIN and this is absolutely *not* true. Local nerve blocks with Lidocaine are quite common for dew claws and tail docks in neonates. This is the only way I'd do them.
> 
> I've personally used isoflurane on 1 day old inch long mouse pups to do castrations and ovariectomies. Definitely doable, just more risky. I'll stick with the local blocks for dew claws and tail docks.


Interesting! Sorry about the mix up. My vet said he couldnt put any pups that young under... but maybe he meant HE doesnt


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## Terrasita Cuffie

We band corgi tails and my breed mentor snips off dew claws and uses silver nitrate. The only issue with banding came when my smarty pants mama dog took the bands off with her first litter and we had to re-band. 

Terrasita


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## Howard Gaines III

I banded the tails on my Bouviers. Well my Rottweiler friend, Andy Larrimore. The tails are short, clean, and as good as cutting. And there is no blood. The tail tip has hair and looks great. Next time it will be the same technique. Andy used thin rubberbands cut and tied on.


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## Maren Bell Jones

Jamielee Nelson said:


> Interesting! Sorry about the mix up. My vet said he couldnt put any pups that young under... but maybe he meant HE doesnt


In medicine, you _can_ do just about anything. Should you is the question. :wink: A nerve block isn't putting them under, it's just local. Just takes some good knowledge of where the nerves are (which sucks learning, by the way) and where to inject. :smile: My foster Rottie right now looks like she had a bad dock. It's too short.


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## Natureschild

Terrasita Cuffie said:


> We band corgi tails and my breed mentor snips off dew claws and uses silver nitrate. The only issue with banding came when my smarty pants mama dog took the bands off with her first litter and we had to re-band.
> 
> Terrasita





How far down do you band the corgis tails and do you have any issue with lack of hair growth?


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