# Campaigne or however it is spellled.



## Jeff Oehlsen (Apr 7, 2006)

I have trouble figuring why this sport is dying off.

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xawc2r_blackos-a-motz_sport


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## Kadi Thingvall (Jan 22, 2007)

Campagne takes a HUGE amount of space to do properly, it's my understanding that's why it's dying off. Think of the requirements for an MR/BR and Sch trials all rolled into one sport. There are also terrain requirements, so just because you have acres of open land it might not be enough, there is water work so a pond of some sort is needed. There is tracking, so tracking fields are required and since some of the tracks are run off leash they can't be placed as close together as Sch tracks can (not that Sch tracks are super close). I've seen videos of Campagne where the search exercise is taking place in an area that looks like it's 5 acres. 

This is one sport I'd love to train for if it was available in the US, the scenario and environmental work of MR and BR, with FR style decoy work and the scent work of Sch, I'm there. But so far attempts to bring it here haven't been successful.


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## Tim Lynam (Jun 12, 2009)

eff,

Spelled: Campagne (I'm sure Geoff can help us with the meaning)

After I certified in Ring, I asked for the Campagne rule book so I could study to also certify in it. Two of my mentors (both certified Campagne decoys) just snickered. They said it was more like a pamphlet, and I would be just fine with what I already knew, based on my scenario work history and my wild imagination. Basically no 2 trials are the same layout, the jumps can be anything "natural" and of course there is the tracking. It used to be, GSDs ruled Compagne. As it was explained to me, it was their different mind set from the Mal. The running joke was, "If you send a Mal to bite a shadow on the wall it will come back with plaster in it's teeth. Send a GSD and it will look for what is causing the shadow."

Here's my take on why it's not thriving (in no particular order):

1.) Any dog not holding a French Ring III title need not apply. Just plain too few of them.
2.) The tracking.
3.) Requires large areas for a trial. I remember one trial in France that the town was closed down to use as the trial field. There was a bite scenario in the bar and as the dog handler exited the bar a decoy rode by on the street on a bicycle firing a pistol for another send! Then there was a search of the horse stables, among the horses, for a decoy hiding in the rafters. When found the decoy jumped down for the bite. You never know what's going to happen in Campagne...
4.) It therefore takes a large number of dedicated people to put on a trial. The logistics can be a nightmare.
5.) Requires a body of water.
6.) Requires imagination.
7.) Most PP Trainers are too narrow minded (stupid?) to see it's real world value and testing relevance. I know, generalizations...
8.) If you are training for Campagne, you don't have time to train"Ballerina Healing."
9.) French Ring (at least in the USA) is a means to it's own end. Training for Campagne as the ultimate goal isn't even a consideration.
10.) Because of #9, the fact that a mid scoring Ring dog may well be the best Campagne dog is lost on the 200 USA folks involved in Ring. They have lost sight of the fact that a Ring III is just a qualification for Campagne. (see #9!)
11.) Dog Sports Politics.

That's my opinion...

All of that said, I believe Campagne is the ultimate in dog training. A Campagne Champion dog and Handler, the ultimate team. Maybe that's the real reason after all!

By the way, how's the seminar bruises doing? No pain, no gain, eh?

Tim


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## Tim Lynam (Jun 12, 2009)

Hi Kadi,

If indeed space is the "excuse" being used as to why it's dying, that's pathetic. One thing we have in the USA, is space! Although it is a significant thing, it would seem that it would be one of the last reasons that would be used. Like France is a BIG place...

I'd come to a Campagne trial just to watch you compete! I'd wager you would do well! Fun would be had by all. If a trial was held in the USA, (even un-official) would you show up?

Tim


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## Geoff Empey (Jan 8, 2008)

Tim Lynam said:


> Spelled: Campagne (I'm sure Geoff can help us with the meaning)


:lol:

Basically "Campagne" the translation literally means "Country"

Nous allon en "Campagne" pour la fin de semaine .. Meaning 'We are going to the country for the weekend" .. Like a farm or cottage, hunt camp thing. 

Sorta like "Homme D'Attaque" .. Litterally it means "Attack Man" in English we'd never use 'Attack Man' to describe our decoys. Campagne is one of those words that are hard to translate directly from French to English. I think the meaning they are using it for is more than just 'Country' 

I think most high level FR Judges can judge Campagne. The Judge in the video Camille Tisserand I understand has done some FR events for both the CRA and NARA. 

Damn cool sport. I have a buddy who has a 250 acre farm that isn't used anymore. It's 1/2 bush dotted with beaver ponds and overgrown fields now. That would be blast to use that property.


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## Kadi Thingvall (Jan 22, 2007)

Tim Lynam said:


> Hi Kadi,
> 
> If indeed space is the "excuse" being used as to why it's dying, that's pathetic.


It can't die here, it never got started LOL I was talking about in France, the reason I have heard it's becoming smaller is the space requirements. We do have space here, although I could see it being a problem finding the right space for a trial, I think it would be possible. Especially if they do the tracking at one time and the rest of the trial another like Sch does, so you can drive from the tracking location to the obedience/protection location.



> I'd come to a Campagne trial just to watch you compete! I'd wager you would do well! Fun would be had by all. If a trial was held in the USA, (even un-official) would you show up?


Thank you. If it was doable with my work schedule and $$, and I had a dog that at least had an idea of all the exercises, I'd show up. Right now I have FRIII dogs that don't know how to track, and Sch dogs that don't know the FRIII exercises, but I'm sure some of them can be cross trained 

One thing I've heard differently about Campagne is it being a step above FR. What I have always heard is that it's where the FR dogs go to compete when they retire from FR. This actually makes sense to me, it's a more casual type of handling, the jumps look a little easier, but it's still got good heavy distraction/pressure to it. A good place for a dog who may be slowing down a little physically but still has the heart to do the work. I suspect some people train to go straight into Campagne, some view it as something to do after FR, kind of the way people here view FR, MR, Sch, etc. I'm pretty sure dogs without FRIII titles can trial, I have video of lower level Campagne dogs competing that aren't FRIII dogs.



Geoff said:


> The Judge in the video Camille Tisserand I understand has done some FR events for both the CRA and NARA


Camille is actually flying to CA in a week to judge the NARA National Championship.


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## Richard Rutt (May 14, 2009)

Actually the term "Homme D'Attaque" is a misnomer. The correct term for H.A. is Homme Assistant or Femme Assistant for F.A. basically man or woman assistant in reference to the fact that what we call a "decoy" is an assistant to the judge. There are only about 15 judges allowed to judge Campagne trials in France and Tisserand is one of those as well as a Ring judge. i have a good friend on the GTC (governing body for Campange) as well as a formative judge for Campagne, and we have talked about the possibility of him coming over, for a seminar in the future. this could be interesting as he is also a Judge for Ring, Mondio, and Pistage (Tracking) which is a sport all by itself in France. I have several friends that are also selected decoys for all of the disciplines mentioned. If there is enough interest, I would be happy to put together a seminar, and mock trial (maybe even a real one would be possible) for Campagne, and any other sports that there is enough interest in. just let me know, and maybe we can do it in 2010!


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## Tim Lynam (Jun 12, 2009)

Thanks for the linguistic help Geoff! If you ever get even a mock trial going, I volunteer to help any way I can.

Kadi,

_I was talking about in France, the reason I have heard it's becoming smaller is the space requirements._

OOPS! Definitely makes sense in France!


_One thing I've heard differently about Campagne is it being a step above FR. What I have always heard is that it's where the FR dogs go to compete when they retire from FR. This actually makes sense to me, it's a more casual type of handling, the jumps look a little easier, but it's still got good heavy distraction/pressure to it. A good place for a dog who may be slowing down a little physically but still has the heart to do the work. I suspect some people train to go straight into Campagne, some view it as something to do after FR, kind of the way people here view FR, MR, Sch, etc. I'm pretty sure dogs without FRIII titles can trial, I have video of lower level Campagne dogs competing that aren't FRIII dogs._

I'd rather believe your explanation and take on it! That opens it up to many more clubs and teams.

_Camille is actually flying to CA in a week to judge the NARA National Championship._

Would you do us a HUDGE favor and, if possible, ask a few her questions about Campagne for us? Maybe post the answers? I understand the Nationals may not be the time for it...

Good luck at the Championships Kadi!

Tim


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## Tim Lynam (Jun 12, 2009)

Hey Richard,

Put me on your volunteer list for it! I'd be glad to help.

Tim


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## Geoff Empey (Jan 8, 2008)

Tim Lynam said:


> Thanks for the linguistic help Geoff! If you ever get even a mock trial going, I volunteer to help any way I can


Oh it is more my lovely French Canadian wife of Scottish heritage that helps me with the linguistics! Though training in Montreal has helped my Francais immensely. I was able to translate a lot for Jimmy Vanhove in Vancouver for the CRA championships for at least 2 days then my other fully bilingual club members from Montreal came. 

I'd love to do a Campagne trial for sure but the planning would take many months if not years. I need to work on my FRII first though. 




> Would you do us a HUDGE favor and, if possible, ask a few her questions about Campagne for us? Maybe post the answers? I understand the Nationals may not be the time for it...


That would be so cool Kadi!


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## Kadi Thingvall (Jan 22, 2007)

Tim Lynam said:


> Would you do us a HUDGE favor and, if possible, ask a few her questions about Campagne for us? Maybe post the answers? I understand the Nationals may not be the time for it...


Camille is a guy  If there is time I'd be happy to ask him some questions, there should be some down time for him during open field, the question will be if there is any for me LOL



> Good luck at the Championships Kadi!


Thanks, I'm only trialing my FRI, and we are just hoping for a Q score (he's failed 3 or 4 times for not outing) so it will be relaxed on that end. On the flip side I'll be helping the host club a LOT so it will be BUSY on that end.


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## Tim Lynam (Jun 12, 2009)

Sheesh! OK, him. I'm not even going to be embarrassed about that one. LOL I wasn't paying attention to the JUDGE in the video...

Anyway, I'd appreciate any of your efforts!

Your dog will out this time![-o<


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## Jennifer Coulter (Sep 18, 2007)

J'aime beacoup la campagne. Peut etre un jour je jouerai ce sport fantastique!


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## ann schnerre (Aug 24, 2006)

ever since i saw my first campagne video, i've thought it looked like the ultimate sport. i would LOVE to at least see one b/f i die.

i would think there would be plenty of places to hold one in the US: if space and water obstacles are needed, just do what the the retriever field trials do--get access to a state-run wildlife mgm't area. think of the great distractions for tracking, and the off leash work in general.


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## Jeff Oehlsen (Apr 7, 2006)

Rick, you have a lot of room out there to do it, it would definately be fun to do a mock trial someday.


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## Richard Rutt (May 14, 2009)

Like i said before, you get the people in the US interested and I will hold the seminar and Trial, and i have no problem doing it at my place


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## Francis Metcalf (Oct 10, 2009)

Here is some Campagne footage I shot at the Championships in Bois le Roi outside of Paris. With a cross reference to the neo realism of the classic Italian film the Bicycle Thief. Campagne is kind of dog sport Neo Realism and all. The dog is a 2 Pottios female, and I will need to check my notes to figure out her name. I think Ivan d2P was her father if my memory serves. 

http://www.youtube.com/user/masterofhounds#p/u/0/pA-YJKRp1ic

Francis


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## Kadi Thingvall (Jan 22, 2007)

I can't watch the video right now, but was the dog Roma 2P, call name Puma? She was a very well known MR dog "back in the day".


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## Francis Metcalf (Oct 10, 2009)

Nope not Roma/Puma. Guess again! I do have excellent footage of Puma that I took while on the field with Rocky during a dog in white. 

F


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## Richard Rutt (May 14, 2009)

I made a few calls and I can have a Campagne judge and decoys here pretty much any time, for a seminar and or trial, as long as we give them sufficient notice, and there are no scheduling conflicts. Stay away from the beginning of Oct. as that is the time of the French Campagne Championship. So Tim and Jeff start getting a list of people interested, and committed, and pick a date and I will take care of the rest. 

Jeff check your P.M.


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## Sheldon Little (Aug 26, 2009)

Rick where about are you located (or where you would be host the seminar/mock trial?)


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## Lisa Geller (Mar 29, 2007)

Richard Rutt said:


> Actually the term "Homme D'Attaque" is a misnomer. The correct term for H.A. is Homme Assistant or Femme Assistant for F.A. basically man or woman assistant in reference to the fact that what we call a "decoy" is an assistant to the judge. There are only about 15 judges allowed to judge Campagne trials in France and Tisserand is one of those as well as a Ring judge. i have a good friend on the GTC (governing body for Campange) as well as a formative judge for Campagne, and we have talked about the possibility of him coming over, for a seminar in the future. this could be interesting as he is also a Judge for Ring, Mondio, and Pistage (Tracking) which is a sport all by itself in France. I have several friends that are also selected decoys for all of the disciplines mentioned. If there is enough interest, I would be happy to put together a seminar, and mock trial (maybe even a real one would be possible) for Campagne, and any other sports that there is enough interest in. just let me know, and maybe we can do it in 2010!


Hi Rick
I would have interest in this -- seminar followed by trial?
what type of sanctioning would a US team need to compete?


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## Geoff Empey (Jan 8, 2008)

Lisa Geller said:


> Hi Rick
> I would have interest in this -- seminar followed by trial?
> what type of sanctioning would a US team need to compete?


I'd be all over this as well but my dog my health permitting would be only FR2 next year.


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## Lisa Geller (Mar 29, 2007)

Geoff,
I asked about this before, and I think it's the same as mondioring. your dog can cross over as a level 2 or 3 from any of the ringsports.
you would not need to do the level 1.

I have been fishing about this sport for awhile, I am told most of the very few people who do this, do this as the only sport. 
Most times - like mondioring, it takes a lifetime of the dog to truly understand all of the routines.


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## Richard Rutt (May 14, 2009)

> Rick where about are you located (or where you would be host the seminar/mock trial?)


South Western PA



> what type of sanctioning would a US team need to compete?


 I will have an answer on this as soon as i know if there is to be an actual trial, if it is only a mock trial we don't need any sanction



> I asked about this before, and I think it's the same as mondioring. your dog can cross over as a level 2 or 3 from any of the ringsports.
> you would not need to do the level 1.


that's correct or you could stay in Campagne 1, A FR 3 or Mondio 3 could go direct to Campagne 3 or 2 if they wished (See the attachment)


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