# Broken teeth?



## Britney Pelletier (Mar 5, 2009)

I didn't want to post this in the Diet & Health section, as I thought it might be more applicable here.


My young female (2 years) is an absolute nut case. She goes bananas on her crate door in the car if something sets her off, she can't have a bowl left in her crate with her or she'll go mental on it, and she is just generally very reckless in everything she does.

She broke one of her top canines right before Christmas and I stopped doing bitework with her immediately after and she had a root canal on that tooth about a week and a half ago. I brought her out to training yesterday with the intention of doing bitework with her for the first time in about 6 weeks, and while I was playing tug with her in OB, I noticed one of her bottom canine's was a little bloody. Sure enough, it was broken and bleeding from the pulp hole.

I'm going to bring her to my vet on Monday to look at it, but this is literally breaking my heart. I'd really love to hear from folks who've dealt with broken teeth, root canals, no root canals, how many root canals to do, how all of these things affected (or didn't affect) their bitework, etc.


Thanks in advance!


----------



## Harry Keely (Aug 26, 2009)

I had a DS with 4 broke canines, the dog had a problem sometimes grabbing on the bite but didnt really matter because the dog was always trying to swallow you and would get you on the second if he didnt get you on the first. 

I have also sold a mali too that broke his canine after delievery but never had a issue before delievery, could of been many of reasons, whos to say if you dont see the dog ever wake and second.

I have also had titanium in there to and those were a waste of money because they eventually would break as well, so wouldnt waste money on them again, would either get them fixed or pulled in the future.

Sounds like your dogs teeth might just be weak, could be genetics ( dont know, have heard that before but I tend to think thats more of a old wise tale ), could be poor decoy / handler which no one wants to hear that ever, oh well ( dont know that ). Another words it could be a shit load of reasons. It sucks that it happens but you just need to move on or get ya a new dog, I would probally just move on with the dog.

As the owner you might need to have a kennel built or buy one where the dog cant hang its teeth up ( vertical only bars ), as far as metal bowls go, thats your job to take them out after feeding, you might have to water the dog. It sucks but your not hte only one down this road.


----------



## Kadi Thingvall (Jan 22, 2007)

I've done root canals, not done root canals, done the titanium thing, not done it.

In the future I'll do 1 of 2 things. Nothing, just keep an eye on the tooth to make sure it doesn't get infected until the pulp receeds and the hole fills in, or I'll have it capped and do all 4 teeth at the same time. But I'll probably just do nothing, when I've done that in the past I've never had a problem with the tooth down the line. When I've done the root canals, capped a tooth, etc I've had issues later. Including the supposedly impossible to break capped tooth breaking.


----------



## Britney Pelletier (Mar 5, 2009)

Thanks Guys!


Harry, she didn't break them doing bitework, she has broken them in her crate in the car on the door.. I'm currently trying to devise some sort of contraption to keep her from being able to bite the bars. 


Kadi - it's very relieving to hear your point of view, as I know there are far more people than I am aware of that just do nothing as well. My vet even made me fully aware when we did her first root canal that it could, in fact, break again, and I just don't know how often I'm supposed to go through this. I don't want her to be out of commission all the time.

Have any of your dogs ever seemed to suffer any adverse side effects in their bitework for the times you've done nothing vs. the times you did root canals?


----------



## Daniel Lybbert (Nov 23, 2010)

Muzzle her when she is in the car or crate.


----------



## Bob Scott (Mar 30, 2006)

If the upper canines are broken at or below the gumline it can create a very serious sinus infection that can be a real pia to get rid of.


----------



## Howard Gaines III (Dec 26, 2007)

Kadi Thingvall said:


> I've done root canals, not done root canals, done the titanium thing, not done it.
> 
> In the future I'll do 1 of 2 things. Nothing, just keep an eye on the tooth to make sure it doesn't get infected until the pulp receeds and the hole fills in, or I'll have it capped and do all 4 teeth at the same time. But I'll probably just do nothing, when I've done that in the past I've never had a problem with the tooth down the line. When I've done the root canals, capped a tooth, etc I've had issues later. Including the supposedly impossible to break capped tooth breaking.


 Agree, my male Bouvier has his broken from doing dumb stuff. Hasn' changed his bitework or pressure.


----------



## Harry Keely (Aug 26, 2009)

Britney Pelletier said:


> Thanks Guys!
> 
> 
> Harry, she didn't break them doing bitework, she has broken them in her crate in the car on the door.. I'm currently trying to devise some sort of contraption to keep her from being able to bite the bars.
> ...


I'm confused so forgive me, so theres a crate in the car, but shes breaking them on the car door, what bars, the crate or I am assuming the bars on the window as such in a cruiser. Trying to understand so maybe I can help ya more.


----------



## Joby Becker (Dec 13, 2009)

I know you are talking about the tooth issue, but what about the whole chewing the crate issue that has led to this dog breaking 2 teeth now...

You seem like a very astute dog person, with lots of experience.

Much more than myself.

I am sure you are aware that they make dog boxes that are very difficult for dogs to bite at all.

If that is not an option then I would try to rig something up.. 

Two options that I would implement if I had to keep using that crate, if the door was the only concern, would be to wrap the front door in sheet metal, or if more airflow was needed, I would have a piece of nice fairly thick acrylic sheet or lexan sheet cut to the shape of the door and affix it on the inside. with airholes cut into it..

If you are talking about a plastic vari-kennel type crate, I have used the acrylic sheet in the past. Not sure what something like that would cost someone to get, I had access to a laser cutter that could cut out the shape and airholes, and mounting holes all at once, so I only had to by the acrylic...

On most plastic type crates there is nothing on the inside of the door that would prohibit some sort of fix, along these lines..

I did this to keep the weight down and too avoid having to spend 400.00+ for a box, that would not be easy to move...

I am sure there are other crate options out there as well. I would not continue to let this happen again. 

I made changes not because of broken teeth, but because of broken crates doors..

maybe others have some sort of fix for a crate door to stop this, if so share them, I would like to hear about them for further consideration.


----------



## Harry Keely (Aug 26, 2009)

Joby Becker said:


> I know you are talking about the tooth issue, but what about the whole chewing the crate issue that has led to this dog breaking 2 teeth now...
> 
> You seem like a very astute dog person, with lots of experience.
> 
> ...


You dont need a laser cutter although nice to have joby, but we have used routers for the same thing ( but not for that idea but would work fine ).


----------



## Joby Becker (Dec 13, 2009)

Harry Keely said:


> You dont need a laser cutter although nice to have joby, but we have used routers for the same thing ( but not for that idea but would work fine ).


yeah...good call, a drill would work too, for the holes...


----------



## Gerald Dunn (Sep 24, 2011)

so what does a root canal cost? not trying to get into your business but just wandering


----------



## Maren Bell Jones (Jun 7, 2006)

Probably the best option is a crown amputation and vital pulpotomy. This takes the point of the crown (the visible part of the tooth) down to where it's like a peg, so they can still bite with it. It also keeps the root alive. The root canal would be the next best as the tooth root is no longer alive, but it fills in the hole to prevent an infection from coming down the canal and into the bone of the jaw. The root is left in place and serves as a place saver. An extraction is what is cheapest and typically recommended for pet dogs, so the whole crown and root is removed. The problem with an extraction for a bite work dog is that bone is removed to facilitate the extraction of the tooth, so with the force that our biting dogs put on their jaws, there is a risk of a fractured jaw without the bone and the root in place. I never would recommend not doing anything for a dog with an exposed root, especially on a dog doing bitework. The nerve is exposed (dental pain is extremely painful, just because "it doesn't seem to bother them" doesn't mean it isn't) and infection can go down there and erode the bone of the jaw. It ends up being a hard to fix infection and there is also a risk of fracture of the upper or lower jaw particularly with a biting dog.


----------



## Maren Bell Jones (Jun 7, 2006)

Gerald Dunn said:


> so what does a root canal cost? not trying to get into your business but just wandering


I don't do any dental work (I don't have gas anesthesia and you have to be specially trained to do endodontic work like root canals), but around here, it'd typically be $300-600. Includes anesthesia, cleaning, the root canal procedure itself, and radiographs.


----------



## Britney Pelletier (Mar 5, 2009)

Maren Bell Jones said:


> Probably the best option is a crown amputation and vital pulpotomy.



I was told by my vet/dentist that a vital pulpotomy can only be done within the first 24-48 hours after the tooth is broken, which is why we didn't do it on the last one either. He said that is his preference as well, but it wasn't a viable option for that tooth and I don't believe it will be for this one either.


Harry - she is biting the bars of her crate door. A plastic vari kennel with metal door.

Joby - I am working on coming up with some sort of physical barrier type solution to prevent her from continuing to do this, but unfortunately that doesn't change the fact that she's already done it. :/


----------



## Nancy Jocoy (Apr 19, 2006)

I can tell you that my dog killed, not broke her upper canine and I did not know until she started screwing up scent discrimination problems and could not figure out the problem. Shortly after that the tooth turned brown. Antibiotics, root canal, problem solved.


----------



## Kadi Thingvall (Jan 22, 2007)

Britney Pelletier said:


> Have any of your dogs ever seemed to suffer any adverse side effects in their bitework for the times you've done nothing vs. the times you did root canals?


No. I will add each time I didn't do a root canal I did drop by my vets every week or two for a month or so to have the dogs tooth checked. Just quick peek to make sure there wasn't any infection issue until they were satisfied with how the tooth looked. And these were breaks that were above the gum line. I don't remember paying anything for the quick checks, which is probably a side benefit of being a "frequent flyer".

When I had the root canal and cap done it was 3000.00 The root canal was on a broken tooth, the cap was on the one that didn't break, to prevent it from breaking since the dog was a chain link chewer before I got him, and had grooves on the back side of all of his teeth from it. The cap didn't work though, it actually ended up killing the tooth and the whole thing snapped off a few years later. In addition, same dog broke a 3rd tooth along the line because of the grooving, which I never did anything with. Now, the broken one I never touched looks better than the one that had the root canal, or the capped/broken one.


----------



## Ang Cangiano (Mar 2, 2007)

We've had dogs with broken teeth as well, we don't normally do anything unless there's a problem, vet's fine with that, one even told me it was a waste to cap them as the caps pop off frequently. We've actually never had a problem with broken teeth bothering the dogs, even during bitework, playing tug, frisbee, etc. Britney, I don't know if you ever met Charlie or not but one of his dogs broke all four (I think) canines and he got them titanium capped, we once ended up searching the field for those caps after a bite session  

Ang


----------



## tracey schneider (May 7, 2008)

Kadi Thingvall said:


> I've done root canals, not done root canals, done the titanium thing, not done it.
> 
> In the future I'll do 1 of 2 things. Nothing, just keep an eye on the tooth to make sure it doesn't get infected until the pulp receeds and the hole fills in, or I'll have it capped and do all 4 teeth at the same time. But I'll probably just do nothing, when I've done that in the past I've never had a problem with the tooth down the line. When I've done the root canals, capped a tooth, etc I've had issues later. Including the supposedly impossible to break capped tooth breaking.


still reading but I was hoping to find something like this. my dog recently broke his bottom canine, to the gumline. my vet today, thinks s root canal it's our best option.... She referred us to s specialist and insisted it was only a matter of time for an infection....
So in reading further if I decide to forgo the rootcanal, any recommended carefor the best outcome? should I throw him on antibiotics as a preventative? etc.


----------

