# Proper Bite Presentation by Decoys



## Mari Steward (Mar 3, 2008)

I have read up on and observed a number of dog sports and notice that different sports have different bite presentation techniques with various levels of pressure. I would like to receive comments on the various sports and what is considered proper bite presentation for that sport...(i.e. bicep presentation (only), forearm presentation (only), Leg, body, back, etc)


Thanks...just here to learn.


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## Howard Gaines III (Dec 26, 2007)

Mari we offer the dog an almost endless set of targets of K-9 PP training. Leg bites any place, front or back. The front and back of the jacket, "love handles" to shoulder blades, I don't care for man part bites. Even with a cup the pressure still hurts. For sport Schutzhund, you have one basic target, center mass of the sleeve.


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## Will Kline (Jan 10, 2008)

French Ring is the same: dog should bite whatever presents itself and HANG ON! Granted people prefer legs/arms bites but in truth, so long as the dog gets ahold of you its a good bite!


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## Howard Gaines III (Dec 26, 2007)

Will Kline said:


> French Ring is the same: dog should bite whatever presents itself and HANG ON! Granted people prefer legs/arms bites but in truth, so long as the dog gets ahold of you its a good bite!


OMG! It's the Oscar Meyer song...#-o


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## Mari Steward (Mar 3, 2008)

Will Kline said:


> French Ring is the same: dog should bite whatever presents itself and HANG ON! Granted people prefer legs/arms bites but in truth, so long as the dog gets ahold of you its a good bite!


So in French ring the dog must be trained to find it's target versus schutzhund where a dog must target the sleeve.


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## Will Kline (Jan 10, 2008)

Mari..the short answer is yes. In FR the job of the decoy is to "impress" the dog with confrontation and take away as many points as possible from the dog by making him either, miss, let go, or refuse to bite. So the dogs are taught to bite wherever they have a target and as I said...to hang on until told to out by the handler. You can check out some of the videos Kadi has posted as well as a plethora of videos on youtube on FR.


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## Mari Steward (Mar 3, 2008)

Will Kline said:


> Mari..the short answer is yes. In FR the job of the decoy is to "impress" the dog with confrontation and take away as many points as possible from the dog by making him either, miss, let go, or refuse to bite. So the dogs are taught to bite wherever they have a target and as I said...to hang on until told to out by the handler. You can check out some of the videos Kadi has posted as well as a plethora of videos on youtube on FR.


 
Will thanks for the info...I know that there are all kinds of sports out their with different kind of bite presentations. I will be getting a new puppy and want her to be well rounded. I am not sure what sport I will have her trained in but I like ring.


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## Will Kline (Jan 10, 2008)

I am the first to admit that I am a newbie to the ring sports but did research my breed choice as well as sport choice for over a year prior to making a decision.

In my area there are really only two "sports" to participate in: SchH or FR. I chose FR because I was stunned by the amount of self control displayed by the dogs as well as the complexity of the routines.

I would like to cross train my guy at some point in the future but feel that it is important for me to get the FR ring down first and then venture out to try other things. I would rather be very good at one thing than half a$$ed at a few!


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## Howard Gaines III (Dec 26, 2007)

The FR decoy has a few basic jobs. Make the dog miss as long as possible. The other is to try and drive the dog off the bite. And good FR decoys can runn a dog off the field. 

Schutzhund has a few stick hits, nothing like FR.


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## Mari Steward (Mar 3, 2008)

Howard Gaines III said:


> The FR decoy has a few basic jobs. Make the dog miss as long as possible. The other is to try and drive the dog off the bite. And good FR decoys can runn a dog off the field.
> 
> Schutzhund has a few stick hits, nothing like FR.


Wow, it seems like you need a pretty hard, athlethic dog for French ring...their seems like their is a lott of possiblities of missing the target .


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## Catalina Valencia (Feb 20, 2008)

As for SchH, thisvideo made by the United Schutzhund Club of America shows propper presentation.

http://www.germanshepherddog.com/members/Helper%20Program/helpervideo.htm


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## Howard Gaines III (Dec 26, 2007)

Catalina Valencia said:


> As for SchH, thisvideo made by the United Schutzhund Club of America shows propper presentation.
> 
> [URL="http://www.germanshepherddog.com/members/Helper%20Program/helpervideo.htm"]http://www.germanshepherddog.com/members/Helper%20Program/helpervideo.htm[/URL]


One should also be mindful that even Schutzhund decoys can have BAD form. If you watch video segments of some trials, you can see decoys catching dogs and swinging them in the air...then setting them for the drive with the stick hit. Some "decoys" do a great job of jamming dogs, giving no space between the sleeve and the helper! Not fully sold on any "authority" group. =; 
These are two great ways to screw up a dog, end its career, and the poor handler is helpless to do anything. This is another reason why I am very careful who works my dogs...


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## Bob Scott (Mar 30, 2006)

I've always felt that a good decoy, is a good decoy, is a good decoy. If the can catch in one sport/venue it shouldn't be to hard to cross over with a bit of sport/venue specific training. 
It's no different then any other athletic event. Speed, timing and....well......a couple of ballet lessons would hurt. :grin: :grin: :grin: ;-)


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## Howard Gaines III (Dec 26, 2007)

Bob Scott said:


> I've always felt that a good decoy, is a good decoy, is a good decoy. If the can catch in one sport/venue it shouldn't be to hard to cross over with a bit of sport/venue specific training.
> It's no different then any other athletic event. Speed, timing and....well......a couple of ballet lessons would hurt. :grin: :grin: :grin: ;-)


Bob I agree to a point. This is one ballet lesson, The Nut Cracker, I really will not do! #-o And my point...;-)


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## Bob Scott (Mar 30, 2006)

Howard Gaines III said:


> Bob I agree to a point. This is one ballet lesson, The Nut Cracker, I really will not do! #-o And my point...;-)


I'm guessing that's what makes them dance on their toes.  
I can remember trying to step over a hot wired cattle fence.........but that's another story! :grin: :grin: :grin:


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## Howard Gaines III (Dec 26, 2007)

Bob I'm all ears..lets hear more!!!


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## Phil Dodson (Apr 4, 2006)

> Hey Bob try running into one about 01:00 in the morning tracking a perp off lead, woke up all the animals!


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## Bob Scott (Mar 30, 2006)

I think my form was excellent but my brother, who I was hunting with, said my attempt to imitate a squalling rabbit was pretty pathetic.  :grin:


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