# second SCH bitework



## Joby Becker (Dec 13, 2009)

HEY....don't play with the equipment while a dog is out there..
Second time out....a little play at the end...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OSWvJkq139g


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## Alice Bezemer (Aug 4, 2010)

Nice vid ! pretty dog to see, nice build and enthousistic to do its thing...

always nice to see some work and then some play...

thanks for sharing :mrgreen:


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## Joby Becker (Dec 13, 2009)

thanks....

too enthusiastic sometimes..  Hoping we CAN fit the mold in the future..


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## Shane Woodlief (Sep 9, 2009)

Really nice work - when the dog comes around the blind 3rd time the dog really sets up nicely on the bark and hold. You can tell that dog enjoys the work!


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## Jerry Lyda (Apr 4, 2006)

I pictured you as being a much smaller guy, oh well. The dog is awesome, good work.


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## Gerry Grimwood (Apr 2, 2007)

At 2:11, I thought that guy was gonna catch one right in the tit :razz: Nice dog !


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## Joby Becker (Dec 13, 2009)

Jerry Lyda said:


> I pictured you as being a much smaller guy, oh well. The dog is awesome, good work.


thanks jerry.. for reminding me 
used to hover around 180...now 215

I just listed a nice 38d Victoria's Secret Bra for sale on ebay...cause I couldn't lose the weight...it's nice and never worn....
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dl...91000&ssPageName=STRK:MESELX:IT#ht_500wt_1154


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## Christopher Smith (Jun 20, 2008)

Why does the helper tell the dog to sit?


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## Joby Becker (Dec 13, 2009)

Christopher Smith said:


> Why does the helper tell the dog to sit?


not sure...I obviously don;t know much about sch...I assume he wants her to contain herself, she can really get pretty nasty, not playing around much as I see it..I think I know what you mean, we should go back to the line, let her do what she does, as long as she doesn't bother.....without the sit.

I did mention about going back to the line, he said he can clean her up without it..

I submitted to let him command the dog, to help her/us, whatever works, as I have never done sch before, he is fair with her and she does have some respect for him...

if you have time...let me know what you would do in this case...and what is bad about the sit. He's an easy going guy, will do what I want if I want to try new things...


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## Diana Abel (Aug 31, 2009)

Joby Becker said:


> not sure...I obviously don;t know much about sch...I assume he wants her to contain herself, she can really get pretty nasty, not playing around much as I see it..I think I know what you mean, we should go back to the line, let her do what she does, as long as she doesn't bother.....without the sit.
> 
> I did mention about going back to the line, he said he can clean her up without it..
> 
> ...


 
We are just starting Revo on his B&H and Im not sure why Matt tells him to sit when he comes in, but they told me for now to shut up and stay back till time to come get him once he gets his bite.  So I do. lol Said I can give it a word later, but not to worry about it now. I need to ask him why he tells him to sit. This is all new to me.

Not to highjack your thread Joby, but my dog seems to want to do a down guard. Doesnt want to bark much right now. He will be a year old soon but is this down guard a bad thing? Dont the judges want a good close up bark so I'm hoping he will eventually bark more.


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## Christopher Smith (Jun 20, 2008)

Joby Becker said:


> if you have time...let me know what you would do in this case...and what is bad about the sit. He's an easy going guy, will do what I want if I want to try new things...


I think that the helper is telling the dog to sit so that she stays clean. But if the dog is getting dirty you should put her on a line so that you can correct the behavior or block it from happening in the first place. I think you may be going too fast in your training. 

But that just my opinion. Don't go alienating your helper over something some jackass said on the internets.:wink:


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## Christopher Smith (Jun 20, 2008)

Diana Abel said:


> He will be a year old soon but is this down guard a bad thing?


Are you saying that the dog lays down and barks?


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## Mike Scheiber (Feb 17, 2008)

Christopher Smith said:


> I think that the helper is telling the dog to sit so that she stays clean. But if the dog is getting dirty you should put her on a line so that you can correct the behavior or block it from happening in the first place. I think you may be going too fast in your training.
> 
> But that just my opinion. Don't go alienating your helper over something some jackass said on the internets.:wink:


Keeping the dog clean is my guess also rhythm is better when there sitting that's a nice guard My preference is no lines to clean often just loads the dog more I have no problem with the helper cleaning the dog he best be good at it in some dogs it makes for some nice rage :mrgreen: Electric can work well makes it less personal if you want or need that less conflict with the handler also.
How many reps on the blind total?


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## Diana Abel (Aug 31, 2009)

Christopher Smith said:


> Are you saying that the dog lays down and barks?


Yes, but he isnt barking a lot yet. They're calling it a down/guard. Like I said, it's all new to me. Im assuming it isnt all that bad or I guess we would be trying to fix it.


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## Christopher Smith (Jun 20, 2008)

Diana Abel said:


> Im assuming it isnt all that bad or I guess we would be trying to fix it.


It's bad. There is no way a legit judge is going to give you full points for the exercise. Also dogs have a difficult time barking or coming into drive when they are laying down. 

Will your dog stand at the end of the line and bark constantly at a helper or bark at you for a ball?


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## Nicole Stark (Jul 22, 2009)

Joby, every time you put up videos of her it makes me smile. I'm amused by her. Nice bitch.


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## Joby Becker (Dec 13, 2009)

Christopher Smith said:


> I think that the helper is telling the dog to sit so that she stays clean. But if the dog is getting dirty you should put her on a line so that you can correct the behavior or block it from happening in the first place. I think you may be going too fast in your training.
> 
> But that just my opinion. Don't go alienating your helper over something some jackass said on the internets.:wink:


not gonna alienate him..I agree...probably too fast.

so is the sit a bad thing points wise? 
aside from using it to clean up a dirty dog, is it bad? Is it a preference thing? or a points thing? I'm asking cause I don't know...upon watching the vids over, I did notice when she was cleaner he was not asking for the sit...and she was coming up some...whether that was conscious or not I am not sure...I'll find out.
appreciate the advice, really I do...




Mike Scheiber said:


> Keeping the dog clean is my guess also rhythm is better when there sitting that's a nice guard My preference is no lines to clean often just loads the dog more I have no problem with the helper cleaning the dog he best be good at it in some dogs it makes for some nice rage :mrgreen: Electric can work well makes it less personal if you want or need that less conflict with the handler also.
> How many reps on the blind total?


The dog gets very loaded when restrained. popped an eyeball recently in tie out work. ]eye was blood red for almost 2 weeks..I don't think we want the "rage" right now .. 9-10 reps in the blind total..one session about 4 months ago, second time was last weekend, third time on sunday...they are all on video..
1st http://www.youtube.com/profile?user=joby1#p/u/9/m-pFbDKuvY4
2nd (last part of vid) http://www.youtube.com/profile?user=joby1#p/u/3/mn0OuUVI548
3rd time was this video..
Less confict with the handler is preferred (by the handler):-o, I did use the ecollar a few times, finally made me put it in my pocket..dinged her too hard a couple of times...it was really making her pissed...



Nicole Stark said:


> Joby, every time you put up videos of her it makes me smile. I'm amused by her. Nice bitch.


That's why I'm here..for your amusement, Angie...#-o#-o#-o seriously though thanks...


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## Diana Abel (Aug 31, 2009)

Christopher Smith said:


> It's bad. There is no way a legit judge is going to give you full points for the exercise. Also dogs have a difficult time barking or coming into drive when they are laying down.
> 
> Will your dog stand at the end of the line and bark constantly at a helper or bark at you for a ball?


 
Yes, He will bark constantly at the end of the line, but this is new to him and it may just be that he isnt sure what he is supposed to do yet. Once he does bark, he gets rewarded with a bite right away. Not making excuses for the dog, but this is just how he is doing right now. Like I said, he has only done it once, but he does seem to like to do a down guard in front of the decoy. :-k


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## Chris Michalek (Feb 13, 2008)

does he lay down outside of the blind?


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## Diana Abel (Aug 31, 2009)

Chris Michalek said:


> does he lay down outside of the blind?


I feel like Im hijacking Joby's thread. Sorry Joby. Maybe I should do this by PM. 
We havent take him to a blind yet. He just stood against something the first time. But at this point, I believe wherever he is, sometimes he is going to lay down. Dont get me wrong, he isnt cowering, it's like he's waiting for the right moment or something. Sometimes, even when he isnt doing a B&H, he will lay down in front of the decoy and watch for movement, decoy moves, then he hits the sleeve.


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## Joby Becker (Dec 13, 2009)

it's ok ..really it is ...better to get the focus off of me anyhow lol....I'd like to hear this one....too...
I know what I would try...but I don;t know jack about SCH...what does he do on a tie-out with an active decoy? real active...


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## Diana Abel (Aug 31, 2009)

Joby Becker said:


> it's ok ..really it is ...better to get the focus off of me anyhow lol....I'd like to hear this one....too...
> I know what I would try...but I don;t know jack about SCH...what does he do on a tie-out with an active decoy? real active...


OK. lol I dont know jack about it either. Thought I would be doing PSA but there are no PSA decoys here now so Im going to give SchH a try, I guess. Maybe not if he sucks. lol

I havent back tied him for awhile now but with an active decoy, he's active. Come to think of it, when the decoy becomes more passive, the dog acts as if "Ehhh, he's no worry, I'll just lay here & wait for him to do something interesting" Perhaps he's just lazy or sneaky? lol


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## Joby Becker (Dec 13, 2009)

Diana Abel said:


> Yes, He will bark constantly at the end of the line.....


that is your "key"..I assume he is NOT laying down, while he is constantly barking at the end of the line.....forgive me if I am wrong as I am new to the sport...


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## Diana Abel (Aug 31, 2009)

Joby Becker said:


> that is your "key"..I assume he is NOT laying down, while he is constantly barking at the end of the line.....forgive me if I am wrong as I am new to the sport...


You are correct. But right now, Matt just wants me to let him come in on his own. Also, Matt is being passive, waiting for him to bark, sometimes the dog just lays there, gawking at him, waiting for him to move, when he doesnt get any movement, he barks, then gets rewarded with the sleeve. Your no more new to the sport than I am so I think we are both learning. lol Im not worried about the dog. Im sure if he was having some sort of bad issues, I would have been told. We both have a LOT to learn.


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## Joby Becker (Dec 13, 2009)

Diana Abel said:


> You are correct. But right now, Matt just wants me to let him come in on his own. Also, Matt is being passive, waiting for him to bark, sometimes the dog just lays there, gawking at him, waiting for him to move, when he doesnt get any movement, he barks, then gets rewarded with the sleeve. Your no more new to the sport than I am so I think we are both learning. lol Im not worried about the dog. Im sure if he was having some sort of bad issues, I would have been told. We both have a LOT to learn.


you have an entirely different set of quote uqoute "issues" than I do...I wish us both luck..](*,)


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## Diana Abel (Aug 31, 2009)

Joby Becker said:


> you have an entirely different set of quote uqoute "issues" than I do...I wish us both luck..](*,)


 LOL, I know! We'll get it worked out. No worries. :twisted:


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## David Feliciano (Oct 31, 2008)

Nice bitch! Where did you get her? How old is she?


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## Tim Bartlett (May 21, 2007)

Nice dog Joby. I especially like the interation she has with you at the end of the video. It makes training much easier when the dog thinks you are as much fun as the tug is. :-D

I have met Steve a few times and he is good with dogs. I am sure with his assistance you can achieve your goals with this dog.


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## Christopher Smith (Jun 20, 2008)

Joby Becker said:


> not gonna alienate him..I agree...probably too fast.
> 
> so is the sit a bad thing points wise?
> aside from using it to clean up a dirty dog, is it bad? Is it a preference thing? or a points thing? I'm asking cause I don't know...upon watching the vids over, I did notice when she was cleaner he was not asking for the sit...and she was coming up some...whether that was conscious or not I am not sure...I'll find out.
> appreciate the advice, really I do...


No problems points wise. The helper telling stuff to the dog is a red flag to me. I have just noticed a few things, over the years, about helpers telling the dog to sit. One of those things is that if the helpers needs to tell the dog anything verbally when it comes into the blind you may need to go back a few steps. I also believe that most helpers that are doing this are making the dog weak. He is asking the dog to comply and obey. I never want a dog to bend to the will of the decoy. He needs to always do the opposite. If the helper screws with him he should become more aggressive.

This dosen't mean that I don't like decoy correction. I just don't like the way it's done in your video. For me all decoy corrections should be accompanied by a command from the *handler*. What i would do in your situation (on the video) is to put a line to you on a flat collar. Put a line and pinch to the helper. You bring the dog right up to the helper and make her sit. Hand the helper his line and you hold yours. Tell the dog his bark command. If he touches the helper *you* give the dog his negative marker and tell him to bark. Your negative marker is a queue to the helper to correct the dog with* a few *checks on the line. 

The helper telling the dog to sit also dosen't make sense because when we tell a schutzhund dog to sit he should put his butt on the ground and shut up.


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## mike suttle (Feb 19, 2008)

David Feliciano said:


> Nice bitch! Where did you get her? How old is she?


She is from my breeding, she an Arko X Truusje daughter, born July 5th 2008. She was here a few months ago with Joby, I really like her.


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## David Feliciano (Oct 31, 2008)

I agree with Chris regarding decoy help in the blind. I like for a dog to be very capped before sent into the blind so that it explodes when it starts barking. 

You might try holding her back by the agitation collar and letting her fire up at the decoy. Then you send her straight in and correct her clean on a long line on a pinch. If done properly this will keep her clean while building frustration. Later you cap that drive by asking for a sit right before sending her into the blind. So she goes from firing up on the agitation line to sit and quiet then is allowed to charge into the blind and explode with barking. It takes some feel and is hard to explain over the net. 

I like to condition this behavior before any off leash work which leads me to believe you may have moved a little quickly. Just my .02


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## Timothy Stacy (Jan 29, 2009)

That's a nice dog Joby


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## Joby Becker (Dec 13, 2009)

thanks for the advice and compliments, I'm not gonna relay them to the dog though, her head is too big as it is..

..I love the dog...we got her for her good looks, the rest was a bonus...or is that the other way around???? thanks again Mike...


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## Christopher Jones (Feb 17, 2009)

Nice female Joby. I really like her. Great looking, great drives, great bloodline.


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## Amanda Caldron (Mar 2, 2009)

Good job with her joby and steve... can't wait to see you guys work again.


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## Johannes Gilbertson (Jul 4, 2009)

*Beautiful bitch with super drive. I'll definitely be getting a DS from Mike some day! :mrgreen:*


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