# Schutzhund Question



## todd pavlus (Apr 30, 2008)

I was interested to know if anyone here has titled their dog all by themselves. What I mean is, with no help from a club or trainers, with the exception of a helper. Maybe just done all the training at home and then went to a trial to get the title.


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## Mike Scheiber (Feb 17, 2008)

The helper is a trainer


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## Chris Michalek (Feb 13, 2008)

gotta have a good helper


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## Bob Scott (Mar 30, 2006)

Numerous AKC competion dogs by myself. 
I have no idea how it could be done for Schutzhund without a helper.


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## Howard Gaines III (Dec 26, 2007)

With Schutzhund having 3 areas to train for, how would you do it without a decoy? Can't read a book and then be an all knowing handler...learn for others mistakes and save time!!!


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## Melody Greba (Oct 4, 2007)

Quite some time ago, there was a guy that bought a puppy from a breeder in our area. He didn't have a sch club within a decent drive of him and had no prior involvement in the sport. He bought the puppy, read a bunch of books, bought a bunch of Leerburg tapes and started training. 

I watched him doing his first Sch1. I can't remember if his dog failed tracking or not. I know it was close to 70 or not quite the points. I think he barely passed obedience. And his bitework received a satisfactory rating. 

His wife did the helper work for him at home and between the 2 of them and a dog with strong genetics, they did the best they could. 

It was really a testimony to what someone can do if they set their mind to it, regardless. The German judge was quite impressed and they received accolades for their effort and courage to trial. 

I'd bet that I have an old magazine with their scores. I'd have to really search. They didn't pass but they really tried hard to train their dog for the sport.


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## Butch Cappel (Aug 12, 2007)

At the Albuquerque, N.M. USA trial I believe in 1988 one lady brought her Blue Heeler down from the mountains and titled, she had trained by herself. 

And the first person to bring me into Mexico for a seminar, had a scarecrow like figure he had used to work his Mal for F. Ring. I don't know if the dog was bought already trained or he did it himself, but he was definitely doing all the maintenance bite work without another human helper.


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## Eros Kopliku (Jan 30, 2008)

Melody Greba said:


> Quite some time ago, there was a guy that bought a puppy from a breeder in our area. He didn't have a sch club within a decent drive of him and had no prior involvement in the sport. He bought the puppy, read a bunch of books, bought a bunch of Leerburg tapes and started training.
> 
> I watched him doing his first Sch1. I can't remember if his dog failed tracking or not. I know it was close to 70 or not quite the points. I think he barely passed obedience. And his bitework received a satisfactory rating.
> 
> ...


Melody, 

If the person you're talking about tried this past January, the scores were 12/77/81.


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## todd pavlus (Apr 30, 2008)

I have a helper/ trainer who I work with that is very good, and has SCHIII dogs, but no club close to me. He helps me with all aspects of the protection routine, but that's it. Unless I want to pay more. I would love to join a club, just to have the input from multiple people, and I imagine it has to be cheaper than paying my trainer every 8 weeks. Debbie Zappia has aclub a couple hours away, but there not ecepting anymore people, not to mention I have heard she is not a very nice person (Allegadly)


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## Melody Greba (Oct 4, 2007)

Eros:

No this guy that I mentioned, trialed for his Sch1 in the early 90's, so that was some time ago.


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## Chris Michalek (Feb 13, 2008)

todd pavlus said:


> I have a helper/ trainer who I work with that is very good, and has SCHIII dogs, but no club close to me. He helps me with all aspects of the protection routine, but that's it. Unless I want to pay more. I would love to join a club, just to have the input from multiple people, and I imagine it has to be cheaper than paying my trainer every 8 weeks. Debbie Zappia has aclub a couple hours away, but there not ecepting anymore people, not to mention I have heard she is not a very nice person (Allegadly)



If you know what you are doing and have a good helper then you don't need a club.

I'm not part of a club because of all the BS that surrounds them. I'm lucky though that I have great relationships with people who have titled multiple dogs to a national level. I can't say that I haven't made mistakes but there is no doubt I could title my dog tomorrow. I'm waiting for a local trial in Nov.

Outside of being able to properly catch a dog you don't need much more than a dude in a sleeve to work on trial stuff. You do however need a good training helper that knows how to progress a dog. 

Because I'm not in a club and didn't always have access to certain equipment, I did other things to compensate. Like making my dog hurdle fences or park benches. He doesn't care what he jumps over, if I point to something and say HOP he'll jump it. I was always care to make sure he always comes back the same way and that the object was never too high that he had to use his feet to get over.

I didn't have access to blind but I taught him to run around a microphone stand at first. Now, he'll run around anything I point at. This methods works perfectly for the send out too. All I have to do it point in a direction and he'll run thinking that he has to run around whatever he sees at the end of the field. Then I just say Platz before he get's there. The point isn't how *I* do it but rather to be creative in lieu of being part of a club.


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## tracey schneider (May 7, 2008)

I did all my own ob and tracking............had a trainer for protection. Took us to a Regional I with a 95-88-93a and at the three level got my highest overall score of 88-91-95 (highest ob for the breed in Amer.).........all on my first Full on Sch dog and an american bulldog. Had the chance to use fields in the area if need be but most in the backyard, kitchen, and park. I would ask questions if really stuck and go back and implement. I wont be doing it on my own again....gonna hit some seminars, watch some vids etc this time  ....just a stubborn chick who wanted to learn on my own and read my dog to understand training and communication better, never thought Id get past a Sch I.

t


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## Bob Scott (Mar 30, 2006)

l agree that tracking and obedience can absolutely be done by yourself.


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## Mike Scheiber (Feb 17, 2008)

Butch Cappel said:


> And the first person to bring me into Mexico for a seminar, had a scarecrow like figure he had used to work his Mal for F. Ring. I don't know if the dog was bought already trained or he did it himself, but he was definitely doing all the maintenance bite work without another human helper.


Dean Calderon talk's about Fritz Biehler using some scarecrow thing with a sleeve


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## todd pavlus (Apr 30, 2008)

I agree with Chris, I improvise whenever, and wherever I can. Even My trainer left his club due to to many dominant egos. It made training unpleasant and not worth the time. The people that are members of good clubs I guess are pretty lucky.


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## Chris Michalek (Feb 13, 2008)

todd pavlus said:


> I agree with Chris, I improvise whenever, and wherever I can. Even My trainer left his club due to to many dominant egos. It made training unpleasant and not worth the time. The people that are members of good clubs I guess are pretty lucky.


I think it makes for a "better" dog come trial time. So many dogs are "keyed" by the equipment and wouldn't do it otherwise. 

I practice heeling in a crowd by going to the mall and actually heeling around in a real crowd. You just can't beat real world application for some of this stuff.

"If you can dodge a wrench, then you can dodge a ball."


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## Kristina Senter (Apr 4, 2006)

I took 3 High in Trials in American Street Ring (titled Entry through ASR2) with VERY little help with a dog I'd raised from 7 weeks old. I trained him almost entirely in my backyard, we went to a "club" for the decoy MAYBE twice a month at most. The most help came from the trial decoys and other competitors on the training day before the trial. I wouldn't recommend it...but thanks to an incredible dog, we did very well.


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## Jerry Lyda (Apr 4, 2006)

Gator.............Nice to the tee.


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## Kristina Senter (Apr 4, 2006)

Jerry Lyda said:


> Gator.............Nice to the tee.


yeah, I'll keep him around a little longer


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