# possible awkward topic



## Peter Cavallaro (Dec 1, 2010)

This topic near got me banned from the ol LB that and i questioned a statement ME made in a vid. 

Absolutely no baiting or stirring i would like to know what other educated responsible dog owners would do if; 

What provisions you have made in the advent you passed before your dogs did???


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## Faisal Khan (Apr 16, 2009)

Why don't you start?


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## Peter Cavallaro (Dec 1, 2010)

cause i know what my plans are, just want to gauge where i am rel the average. Fais given u most likely fully remember the thread i am guessing u are baiting. I said i wasn't.


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## Thomas Barriano (Mar 27, 2006)

Peter Cavallaro said:


> This topic near got me banned from the ol LB that and i questioned a statement ME made in a vid.
> 
> Absolutely no baiting or stirring i would like to know what other educated responsible dog owners would do if;
> 
> What provisions you have made in the advent you passed before your dogs did???


I've contacted my barrister or was it my barista? To set up a trust fund for all my dogs. I am currently interviewing prospective female Trust administrators between the ages of 18-30


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## Peter Cavallaro (Dec 1, 2010)

so u are making financial arrangements, what about their living arrangements??


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## Bob Scott (Mar 30, 2006)

Thomas Barriano said:


> I've contacted my barrister or was it my barista? To set up a trust fund for all my dogs. I am currently interviewing prospective female Trust administrators between the ages of 18-30


18-30 :-o Your dogs will be getting their new home shortly....cause your gonna die! :lol: :wink:


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## rick smith (Dec 31, 2010)

great post and have discussed this often with myself, wife and many other owners.....also doing it as we speak with a gsd owner who has terminal cancer
life is getting in the way of the keyboard rite now but jump in with my yen worth..... and can't imagine how this coulda gotten anyone banned ????


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## Melissa Thom (Jun 21, 2011)

I put a pet protection clause on my will with my Mother - with my sister as a backup as the decision maker on the process. 

1) Any contracts which state the dog will be returned to breeder/first right of refusal will be satisfied
2) A very short list of breeder/friends will be given the opportunity to claim up to two dogs with the agreement that they sign a contract stating that the dogs will not be resold as breeding animals and must be spayed or neutered before any further ownership transfers. 
3) All of my remaining dogs at this point will be spayed or neutered and evaluated for adoption and put up for public adoption through SPDR or another reputable private rescue.
4) Any dogs unlikely to find adoptive homes due to age, health, or temperament will be humanely euthanized. 

My intent with this is to do right by my family - my hobby should not be their prison, do right by the breed - if I put in years of work I am not going to burn it to the ground on my exit from this world, and do right by my individual dogs. 

I do not want my dogs lotted out to lord only knows where, I do not want them dispersed like cattle in an auction house, and I do not want to put making sure that doesn't happen on my family who aren't as dog community savvy as I am.


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## Laney Rein (Feb 9, 2011)

I know several people that have stated in their wills, should they pass before their pets, specifically only dogs, the pet be humanely euthanized and buried or cremated with owner. Another friend has made a trust for her dogs and made arrangements for them to remain in their home til their passing with a live in caretaker. My will has provisions for my horses, willing them to my vet (best friend) who knows the value and training level and health of the horses, knows what they mean to me and will find appropriate new owners - she gets to keep some of the proceeds - rest goes back to my husband. My husband is required to keep my 2 little dogs until they pass and we have not discussed the mallie, but I'm sure he would stay, also.


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## Thomas Barriano (Mar 27, 2006)

Bob Scott said:


> 18-30 :-o Your dogs will be getting their new home shortly....cause your gonna die! :lol: :wink:


Especially if my wife finds out about the "interviews" ;-)


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## Connie Sutherland (Mar 27, 2006)

rick smith said:


> .... have discussed this often with myself, wife and many other owners.....


Me too. The person who will take my dogs for the few days it might take to get here for my relative who will adopt them but who lives 3000 miles away is lined up, as is the relative (who knows the dogs very well); the house key is the right hands, and the care costs, the lines of communication, and everything else I can thinks of, are detailed in written info in my wallet and will.

I wish I could say all this was simple to arrange, but it was worth it. (Actually, making and delivering that extra key was probably the task I put off longest. :lol: )


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## Charlotte Hince (Oct 7, 2010)

Cattle dog back to the woman who rescued her as per contract. She's so laid back (by cattle dog standards) she won't have trouble finding a home. 

The shih tzu has people fighting over him (and I've been offered cash for him in the past so he will have no trouble getting a home) but he'll go to my aunt who will likely re-home him. 

The terriers would be put down because they are very old with waning health and some conditions which are being managed with their vet. I don't know anyone who I would want to take them or who would want to take them, period.


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## vicki dickey (Jul 5, 2011)

Peter I dont mind answering this very valid question. I have a paper drawn up and notorized that lists each dog and directions what is to become of each. Since I do not know when I will die, I have had to generalize some of the instructions according to the dog's age. Any of my dogs 10 years and older I have asked to be put to sleep by my vet as I feel it would be kinder to them than to have to adjust to a new home at an older age. My show dogs if they are young enough will go to my friend who not only shows but has a rescue and will either keep them or place them in a good home. Zak will go to my daughter who I have asked and she wants him. Indy would return to his breeder who also wants him. It is better that there is some sort of instructions rather than have them all end up at a high kill shelter.


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## rick smith (Dec 31, 2010)

so the topic of PTS comes up ...

so, have any of you specified exactly how that should be done for your dogs ?
hint : not talking about the mix of drugs to use 

there are better and bad ways to kill your dog imo, no matter how "humane" you consider the event


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## rick smith (Dec 31, 2010)

i've seen a lot of ten year old dogs that are healthy and happy .... why would you use ten years as a limiting number ? that may not be fair to the dog imo


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## rick smith (Dec 31, 2010)

don't think i'm jumping on you Vicky....

what i mean is i think dogs are more adaptive than we often give them credit for, and i don't think they will "grieve" as much as we would like to think they would. many people tell me i have a strong "bond" with my current dog, but in the right hands, i think my dog would bounce back after a few good meals and some play sessions rather than set up a vigil next to my box of ashes 

and obviously anyone who would be a good match for adopting an adult or older dog w/ any med issues would have to have the right hands and heart to do it well


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## Jim Duncan (Jan 19, 2009)

This is a good topic. My wife and I have a living will. If something happens to us I have a friend that has agreed to take my dogs. I have provided a sizable amount of my estate (not that it's large) to go to the person who cares for my dogs. I didn't tell the person how much I am leaving him, I didn't want to give him any funny ideas. OR to hasten my untimely departure. But it's plenty to compensate him for dealing with my PITA dogs. 

Jim


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## maggie fraser (May 30, 2008)

It's a no brainer for me.

Any of my animals (not too many now), that aren't taken and cared for by either close family or friends, I would like pts. Too many assholes out there...even when well intentioned sometimes.


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## Melissa Thom (Jun 21, 2011)

rick smith said:


> so the topic of PTS comes up ...
> 
> so, have any of you specified exactly how that should be done for your dogs ?
> hint : not talking about the mix of drugs to use


I have it specified that a vet must do the job.


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## Ingrid Rosenquist (Mar 27, 2006)

I personally like pet trusts. Here is a basic FAQ on them:

http://www.professorbeyer.com/Articles/Animals.htm

I have specific placements for all of my dogs and I have a friend listed as trustee who will carry out my wishes (and a backup if first friend is deceased or unable to act as trustee for some reason). I have allocated a specific amount of money to support the care of each dog upon my passing. 

I have only one dog that I have a euthanasia clause about. However, that only comes into play if neither of the two people listed for that specific dog are unable to care for her. With that said, the dog in question is 14 right now so in all likelihood I will outlive her. 

Another thing that some people do not consider is your dog gear, books, etc. Many dog folks have family members who are not "dog people" and do not know the value of some collector items or even dog equipment and will dump them in a garage sale or the garbage when their relative dies. 

Many times there are valuable books that a dog person will collect and hold onto. I know I have several rare dog books that valued at hundreds of dollars. Because of this I have outlined who my dog gear, rare books, and collector items will go to.


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## Bob Scott (Mar 30, 2006)

My kids know who gets what dog. Simple as that for me.


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## Sidney Johnsen (May 31, 2009)

I have specific instructions for what happens to my dogs; my mother, boyfriend, and best friend all hold copies of this information.

Most dogs go back to their breeders/people I bought them from as they are all folks I trust and am friends with. The older dogs stay with my mom at her request. My best friend keeps two that she picked out. 

On a related note, a handful of my dogs actually came to me after the death of a friend who wanted me to have them.


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## Melissa Thom (Jun 21, 2011)

Ingrid Rosenquist said:


> Another thing that some people do not consider is your dog gear, books, etc. Many dog folks have family members who are not "dog people" and do not know the value of some collector items or even dog equipment and will dump them in a garage sale or the garbage when their relative dies.
> 
> Many times there are valuable books that a dog person will collect and hold onto. I know I have several rare dog books that valued at hundreds of dollars. Because of this I have outlined who my dog gear, rare books, and collector items will go to.


Ooh... good idea. I hadn't mulled much beyond handling of my debts, my vehicles, and my dogs.


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## maggie fraser (May 30, 2008)

Melissa Thom said:


> Ooh... good idea. I hadn't mulled much beyond handling of my debts, my vehicles, and my dogs.


 
Come on people, we're talking about fkn dogs, not books !!!


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## tony mason (May 4, 2008)

I have made a specific request in my will that my mother in law has all my dogs.


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## Timothy Stacy (Jan 29, 2009)

tony mason said:


> I have made a specific request in my will that my mother in law has all my dogs.


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## ann schnerre (Aug 24, 2006)

good topic. i had "kinda" thought about this in the past, but never really done anything about it. time to talk to the kids. my Gracie i would have PTS as she's old, no one would adopt her from a shelter (even though she's a plumb sweetheart, her hips are BAD) unless one of the kids was in a position to have her. Ikon would go back to his breeder, again, unless one of the kids was in a position to keep/work him.

fortunately, his breeder is GREAT and would take him in a heartbeat. Gracie is a rescue so i don't have that fallback. yep-better have a talk..........but i thought i was gonna live forever???..


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## ann schnerre (Aug 24, 2006)

Bob Scott said:


> My kids know who gets what dog. Simple as that for me.


leave me off the "Pete" list, would ya??


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## Alison Grubb (Nov 18, 2009)

If something were to happen to me, my Pit Bull mix would go live with my father on his farm.
Both ABs will go back to their breeder to be kept and used in the program or rehomed as he sees fit.

I'm good with that.


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## rick smith (Dec 31, 2010)

sorry if i seem like a pit on a spring line, but the PTS question again ...

so, have any of you specified exactly how that should be done for your dogs ? 
hint : not talking about the mix of drugs to use 

the only "specifications" i've read is that a vet do it 
PTS happens unfortunately 
if you were alive how would you do it ?
if you were dead and gone, how would you have someone else do it for you ?
iow, the Q pertains to either situation and i don't think people put enuff thought into how to kill their dogs when they have to
....if you were your dog, how would YOU like to check out ?

that's the reason i worded it the way i did......"have you specified exactly"

any VETS want to take a stab at it ?

yes i feel strongly there ARE better ways to kill your dog if it has to happen, and the last thing i would ever do is allow someone to pack up my sick and dying dog and truck em to their "favorite" vet clinic and then load em on a stainless steel slab under the glaring lights to get put down with you and a vet tech holding their paw.
- for most of my dogs, vet clinics were NOT one of their favorite places to visit :-(

so ALL my dogs get PTS at THEIR home (aka MY home) and in their favorite sleeping spot, AFTER any of their friends who got invited have had a chance to give em their favorite treat (if they still eat) and do whatever they liked to do together etc etc
In fact we may even have a little "last supper party" or whatever else might make em happy one last time and make a special effort to keep our eyes dry doing it, including feeding em whatever junk food they loved but weren't allowed to have

fwiw, i always get this issue cleared up front with any new vet that will be caring for my dogs. many were surprised when i first asked about home euthanasia. some wouldn't, and i move on, but most would when asked. those who would, often mentioned it might cost "more", especially if it was "after hours", etc - i knew that - not a problem for the "extra expense" involved and i tell them in most situations it could be planned "during hours"
- some mentioned that it could be messy if the dog emptied after it died.....thank you, i already knew that, and would have no problems cleaning up pee/poop one more time since i had already done it for years and wouldn't expect the vet to do it etc 

i was kinda surprised no vets have mentioned this option .... 
.... but i think it is an often overlooked fact of life/death that might just give your dog a better way to check out of this world that is well worth the few extra bucks it might cost.
- in my dumb logic i think the dog would feel better this way and maybe not even know how it was gonna be killed and go out happy, but who knows for sure ?

and if i was a farmer type and had to routinely put down my farm animals i'd probably do it myself in the same way mentioned above. but that is a slightly different topic i'd rather not get into since it has pros/cons

the main point was, i was looking to see if others felt the way i did about home euthanasia. it's important to me for my dogs and cats......am i being overly sensitive and anal about this whole PTS/ "humane" euthanasia, put em down issue ? 
....ask me if i care what others think 

anyway, off the soapbox


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## Ingrid Rosenquist (Mar 27, 2006)

Rick -

I am the same as you. All my dogs are euthanized at home and this is also specified in my will/trust documentation. I also do a similar last supper deal with my dogs. I lost one dog at a young age due to kidney issues and it was winter time when he had to be euth'd but his favorite thing in the world was snapping at the sprinkler. Obviously no sprinkler with snow outside so I set up a "sprinkler" in the bathtub and gave him a last chance to snap away. Yeah my bathroom got soaked but it was worth it.


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## rick smith (Dec 31, 2010)

and for the fortunate few with no mother in law, who should be next on the hit list ?


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## ann schnerre (Aug 24, 2006)

another great point, rick. the "where". this could be troublesome if i were dead and gone. all the vets in my area (and as far as i know only one will make a house call for dog/cat euthanasia) are extremely sensitive to the process for both clients and patients.

i have one child (well, they're both grown-ups now) who would be able to be there in the vet's office and help the animal ease on down the road by being there for them. the other--i'm not so sure. i think it tears him up too much in a way he has to shut himself down and therefore can't ease the animal. it's not that he couldn't DO it, it's more that it would hurt him so much he couldn't support the dog. does that make sense? 

so another thing i'll have to think about . this is gonna be fun conversation with the kids.....


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## rick smith (Dec 31, 2010)

good imagination Ingrid !! .... the trademark of a good trainer


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## rick smith (Dec 31, 2010)

re: kids
sometimes going thru the process of losing a pet can be used as a positive along their road to growing up.....i can still remember the first pet i lost
.....it was a baby chick ... i stepped on it :-( .....maybe that warped my views and i have an subconscious guilt trip that has stayed with me all these years


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## Betty Landercasper (Dec 2, 2010)

If it's going to be IV, I recommend home euthanasia if the humans can tolerate it. I think veterinarians can be found in most places who will do this for a client with whom they have a good relationship. Someone does have to be able to control the dog well so that an IV can be placed w/o a fight.

Shooting the dog in the head is humane, assuming that the dog is not gun shy, does not fear the gun itself, does not "see it coming", and it can be done by a competent person safely.

I have put animals to sleep (IV) at the bedside of terminally ill patients at their request. A grim business, but seemed to give the owners some peace.


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## ann schnerre (Aug 24, 2006)

IDK rick--i have never been able to look at the loss of a dog as other than a loss. vs we're killing a beef/hog etc. my kids know the dif, but i just don't know how they REALLY feel about the dogs (especially) we've had to bury in their lifetime. well, i know, i just have a problem (myself) with getting past the loss and making it positive. other than the animal is better off dead, to be blunt.

of course i don't put it quite like that to the kids. what a morbid turn i've taken. excuse me please.


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## Faisal Khan (Apr 16, 2009)

Peter Cavallaro said:


> cause i know what my plans are, just want to gauge where i am rel the average. Fais given u most likely fully remember the thread i am guessing u are baiting. I said i wasn't.


What are you talking about?


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## ann schnerre (Aug 24, 2006)

Betty Landercasper said:


> If it's going to be IV, I recommend home euthanasia if the humans can tolerate it. I think veterinarians can be found in most places who will do this for a client with whom they have a good relationship. Someone does have to be able to control the dog well so that an IV can be placed w/o a fight.
> 
> Shooting the dog in the head is humane, assuming that the dog is not gun shy, does not fear the gun itself, does not "see it coming", and it can be done by a competent person safely.
> 
> I have put animals to sleep (IV) at the bedside of terminally ill patients at their request. A grim business, but seemed to give the owners some peace.


when i was working as a vet assistant, i hated, in a way, having to assist in euthanasia for the good old dogs (and cats, BTW), but i always felt privileged to make their end as painless and comfortable (emotionally) as i could. and i always cried. 

however, i have to add that there were animals that NEEDED to be PTS for reasons other than old age--behavioral reasons. and those i felt i was relieving of overwhelming mental stress; peace at last. 

rant over. but it's never an easy decision and i'd better get something in writing...


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## Maren Bell Jones (Jun 7, 2006)

ann schnerre said:


> good topic. i had "kinda" thought about this in the past, but never really done anything about it. time to talk to the kids. my Gracie i would have PTS as she's old, no one would adopt her from a shelter (even though she's a plumb sweetheart, her hips are BAD) unless one of the kids was in a position to have her. Ikon would go back to his breeder, again, unless one of the kids was in a position to keep/work him.
> 
> fortunately, his breeder is GREAT and would take him in a heartbeat. Gracie is a rescue so i don't have that fallback. yep-better have a talk..........but i thought i was gonna live forever???..


Ann, shame on you! Either me or my parents up in Omaha would take Gracie for you if you needed it. 

On the topic of at home euthanasia, this will be a large part of my practice. I outline the basic process on my website:

http://www.rightathomevetcare.com/endoflifecare.html

The euthanasia fee includes a physical exam, a counseling session (some clients are very sure they want to proceed, others are not and like to talk it out as a second opinion), sedation/general anesthetic, an IV catheter, the euthanasia solution, and a clay paw to keep. I will do it just about anywhere that is relatively reasonable: in the home, backyard, a quiet park, in a car (Jim Nash's story of his patrol dog being euthanized in the patrol car was always very touching), etc. If it was quiet, I would certainly do it on a performance/working dog's training field. Really, it's up to the owner as long as there's not a lot of gawking from passerbys. 

I sedate them with an IM sedative and talk with the owner about what to expect while it takes effect. I place an IV catheter in the back leg (preferably) with an 2.5 foot extension set so I'm not hovering around the pet's head. I make a clay paw print from the pet that they can keep and bake. Once the owner is ready, I give an injectable induction agent identical to what is used to induce general anesthesia before surgery, so the animal cannot feel anything at this point, but falls asleep quite quickly in the owner's arms. At that point, if the owner wishes to stay with the pet for the final injection of euthanasia solution, they can or they can choose to step out. I do offer emergency at home euthanasia (about my only true emergency service) and it is an additional fee.


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## Betty Landercasper (Dec 2, 2010)

I second the IV in the back leg (if you can), let the owners be at the head. 
I do believe that gunshot may be the most humane, however. Some dogs fight sedation, are frightened by the feel of the drug "coming on". Especially old dogs IME. 
I've been retired nearly 15 yrs and folks still call me for this work. There is a huge demand for home euthanasia.


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## vicki dickey (Jul 5, 2011)

Rick I chose 10 years because having worked in rescue for over 10 years I know that there are very few people willing to take a senior dog into their life and homes only to lose it in a few years or take on a medical expense that can occur in their older years ie arthritis meds. I also have fostered older dogs or have picked them up from shelters where the deceased family members have "got rid" of them and know how they can mourn their lost owners and homes for weeks. I only have one daughter who has several dogs of her own and my immediate family is small and many of those have pets of their own as well and cannot take on another. 
When my mom passed away she wanted her pets put to sleep. The job was left to me. I did not do as she asked but I did do want she would have wanted-I kept them all until they died. It was a hardship for me trying to work in her 2 dogs and 3 cats but I did it. I do not expect my daughter to go through what I did and so I made the arrangements. Maggie is so right about people and I would rather have them die a couple years sooner than be mistreated.


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## leslie cassian (Jun 3, 2007)

Maren Bell Jones said:


> The euthanasia fee includes a physical exam, a counseling session (some clients are very sure they want to proceed, others are not and like to talk it out as a second opinion), sedation/general anesthetic, an IV catheter, the euthanasia solution, and a clay paw to keep. I will do it just about anywhere that is relatively reasonable: in the home, backyard, a quiet park, in a car (Jim Nash's story of his patrol dog being euthanized in the patrol car was always very touching), etc. If it was quiet, I would certainly do it on a performance/working dog's training field. Really, it's up to the owner as long as there's not a lot of gawking from passerbys.
> 
> I sedate them with an IM sedative and talk with the owner about what to expect while it takes effect. I place an IV catheter in the back leg (preferably) with an 2.5 foot extension set so I'm not hovering around the pet's head. I make a clay paw print from the pet that they can keep and bake. Once the owner is ready, I give an injectable induction agent identical to what is used to induce general anesthesia before surgery, so the animal cannot feel anything at this point, but falls asleep quite quickly in the owner's arms. At that point, if the owner wishes to stay with the pet for the final injection of euthanasia solution, they can or they can choose to step out. I do offer emergency at home euthanasia (about my only true emergency service) and it is an additional fee.


Maybe some people want this and are comforted by it, but when I make the decision to euthanize my animals, I just want it done quickly and humanely. I've done it before, I know what's going to happen, there's is no need to be overly delicate about it, though I do appreciate the sensitivity that my vets and techs have shown. Just kill my dog for me and be done with it.

Always gone to a vet's, but that's never been particularly stressful for any of my dogs. Not sure I could cope with a bullet to the brain, just seems to violent to me, though the end result is the same.


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## Connie Sutherland (Mar 27, 2006)

Maren Bell Jones said:


> ... sedation .... an IV catheter, the euthanasia solution .... I place an IV catheter in the back leg (preferably) with an 2.5 foot extension set so I'm not hovering around the pet's head. Once the owner is ready, I give an injectable induction agent identical to what is used to induce general anesthesia before surgery, so the animal cannot feel anything at this point, but falls asleep quite quickly in the owner's arms. At that point, if the owner wishes to stay with the pet for the final injection of euthanasia solution, they can....


I choose everything as described. I stay. I also arrange in advance that the vet leaves us after it's over (as well as before the final injection) for a bit, too, so I don't have to ask at the time.

I am fortunate so far in not having faced euthanasia for a dog who would fight the catheter.


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## Maren Bell Jones (Jun 7, 2006)

Betty Landercasper said:


> I second the IV in the back leg (if you can), let the owners be at the head.
> I do believe that gunshot may be the most humane, however. Some dogs fight sedation, are frightened by the feel of the drug "coming on". Especially old dogs IME.
> I've been retired nearly 15 yrs and folks still call me for this work. There is a huge demand for home euthanasia.


Betty, which drug were you using for the sedation? You can PM me if you'd like as I'm interested to hear your experience. I would use acepromazine/telazol IM, but business has not picked up yet to the point where the telazol is cost effective (ouch, it's jumped in price!). I've currently got ace, xylazine, ketamine, telazol, midazolam, and dexmeditomidine to work with for pre-med, propofol to induce. I really need to order the new propofol 28. Sounds like great stuff!


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## Maren Bell Jones (Jun 7, 2006)

Connie Sutherland said:


> I choose everything as described. I stay. I also arrange in advance that the vet leaves us after it's over (as well as before the final injection) for a bit, too, so I don't have to ask at the time.
> 
> I am fortunate so far in not having faced euthanasia for a dog who would fight the catheter.


Right...I'll go step out and go sit in my car and wait for the client to text message me that they are ready at any point where they want the time. Even though the process can take less than 20 minutes, I schedule a two hour block of time for euthanasias, so no hurry on time. If good sedation drugs are used, the dog should not be fighting the catheter as they are at the same dose as before putting a catheter for surgery.


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## Maren Bell Jones (Jun 7, 2006)

leslie cassian said:


> Maybe some people want this and are comforted by it, but when I make the decision to euthanize my animals, I just want it done quickly and humanely. I've done it before, I know what's going to happen, there's is no need to be overly delicate about it, though I do appreciate the sensitivity that my vets and techs have shown. Just kill my dog for me and be done with it.
> 
> Always gone to a vet's, but that's never been particularly stressful for any of my dogs. Not sure I could cope with a bullet to the brain, just seems to violent to me, though the end result is the same.


That's an interesting perspective, Leslie. It's generally better to be overly sensitive than under sensitive. I've seen very masculine men who at first say "just get it over with" just sob and sob (which is totally okay!), so you may be surprised who is emotional and who's not.  Especially doing a house call for an at home euthanasia where I may have never met this person before, it will be more difficult to read their emotions than in a regular hospital where I might have seen their animals for a long time. In this circumstance, I feel like I have to particularly thorough in explaining the process as I don't know what their previous experiences are. Hope that makes sense.


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## Connie Sutherland (Mar 27, 2006)

Maren Bell Jones said:


> Right...I'll go step out and go sit in my car and wait for the client to text message me that they are ready at any point where they want the time. Even though the process can take less than 20 minutes, I schedule a two hour block of time for euthanasias, so no hurry on time. If good sedation drugs are used, the dog should not be fighting the catheter as they are at the same dose as before putting a catheter for surgery.


Oh, I see. I have had only the experience of the sedative being administered via that catheter. I see what you mean: the sedative can be pre-catheter. This is reassuring.


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## Tyree Johnson (Jun 21, 2010)

tony mason said:


> I have made a specific request in my will that my mother in law has all my dogs.



nice lol


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## leslie cassian (Jun 3, 2007)

I know, Maren. It has to be difficult to be the vet doing the deed, and better to err on the side of too much. Everyone responds differently. I know people who have told me they can not even be there - I can't not be there. It's not a lack of emotion, its just having made the decision, I don't want to prolong the moment any more than necessary. I don't want pawprints. I've said goodbye and I'm not changing my mind. I don't want to think any more about what I'm doing, it's painful enough even if it is the right or only option.


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## Connie Sutherland (Mar 27, 2006)

leslie cassian said:


> I know people who have told me they can not even be there - I can't not be there.



I've learned that the other dogs in my house will always have the opportunity to see and sniff the body, too, regardless of where it takes place.

Not to take this into a whole other direction, I'll say very briefly that reactions from dogs who have lived with the dead dog for maybe ten years or more have been, to my eyes, much better when they have seen the body.


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## Maren Bell Jones (Jun 7, 2006)

Connie Sutherland said:


> Oh, I see. I have had only the experience of the sedative being administered via that catheter. I see what you mean: the sedative can be pre-catheter. This is reassuring.


Yes, you can ask your vet if they can just give an IM injection of the sedative before the catheter. That way they take about 5-10 minutes and get nice and relaxed and sleepy so they don't feel the catheter being put in after. I tell the client that way they only have to feel one quick needle poke the whole time. That time when the sedation is working is a good time for me to step out so they can be alone with the pet if they like, or I can stick around and hear stories about the pet if they like. Really, it's whatever they want to do. No rush. It's also much easier doing it that way if I don't have an assistant so that I don't have to use the owner to hold off for a vein or something (which in a normal circumstance, most people don't mind, but I wouldn't ask them to do that during the euthanasia).


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## Maren Bell Jones (Jun 7, 2006)

leslie cassian said:


> I know, Maren. It has to be difficult to be the vet doing the deed, and better to err on the side of too much. Everyone responds differently. I know people who have told me they can not even be there - I can't not be there. It's not a lack of emotion, its just having made the decision, I don't want to prolong the moment any more than necessary. I don't want pawprints. I've said goodbye and I'm not changing my mind. I don't want to think any more about what I'm doing, it's painful enough even if it is the right or only option.


Right, I understand. If people want to be there, that's okay. If they don't, that's fine too. I actually rather like using the anesthesia induction drug in the IV catheter because that way the dog falls asleep in their arms and is then under general anesthesia, so that's a good time for them to step out if they like before the euthanasia solution is given. 

To some extent, it's their show and if they want it quick and matter of fact, I can do that. If they want to cry on my shoulder, show me puppy pictures, or chant, pray, and burn incense to send their dog's spirit to the happy hunting grounds, that's okay too. It's one of those things that you just have to be able to read and most owners appreciate more sensitivity than less, particularly when their emotions are understandably very volatile.


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## ann schnerre (Aug 24, 2006)

Maren Bell Jones said:


> Ann, shame on you! Either me or my parents up in Omaha would take Gracie for you if you needed it. ]
> 
> mea culpa maren, mea culpa! i honestly never thought about you and sam or your mom and dad. but now that you offered.....at least i have another option for the old girl if needed. who, BTW, is feeling PRETTY fiesty with this cooler weather


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## Kadi Thingvall (Jan 22, 2007)

I have a couple of friends and family who will take on whatever dogs I currently have at the moment, and handle them as needed. I'm not going to change my will every time I get a new dog, or sell one, or have one die or whatever so this works the best for me. It's people I talk to on a regular basis, who know what I would like done with each of the dogs, and I can trust to carry out my wishes. Which are pretty simple, keep the one(s) they want, find the rest appropriate homes, or euthanize if neccessary due to age, health, etc.


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## Betty Landercasper (Dec 2, 2010)

As pre-euth sedation I generally used Ace or Ace/Rompun for a dog where I would not have good help -- better cocktails available today. IME patients fighting to hang on, ie. hit by car, struggling to breathe, were least helped
by pre-sedation. Too deep, especially if shocky, it can be hard to find a vein.
Clients reactions are totally unpredictable, big men sobbing, teenagers might laugh should the dog defecate, rarely there can be a violent reaction by the client. 
The emergency call, 3 am, highly charged emotional atmosphere, client possibly hammered, it can be scary if you are all alone with the dead dog and the person you don't know. One reason some will say, "Bring him to the clinic". It's safer, for the vet.


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## Maren Bell Jones (Jun 7, 2006)

Not a big ace fan, especially by itself, but it has its place. I like to add in a little glycopyrrolate for the pre-med to help along things with the blood pressure if it's iffy and since dexmeditomidine makes the BP and heart rate drop. I've used dexdomitor/nalbuphine/glyco before and I might sub in the midazolam in place of the nalbuphine. It's a nice smooth pre-med.

My husband has already suggested I get a CCW for really late emergency at home euthanasia, but I feel like I would likely leave it in the car where it wouldn't help. I may do those really late ones only for good established clients. Sadly it's another reason why I charge $300 for emergency euthanasias to hopefully deter some of the crazies... 8-[


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## Peter Cavallaro (Dec 1, 2010)

hi all, thanks for sharing your thoughts on this topic, much appreciated.


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