# Mal or DS for PSA



## Martin Doan (Jul 27, 2011)

I researched and read all the forums about DS vs Mals and i know that DS and Mals have a big variety in temperaments etc but I am still torn between the two. I am wanting to compete in PSA and I'm on the verge of getting a DS pup (sire is Black Mal- Dulan Ningbers ph1 440pts and dam is DS). The pups look awesome, very drivey, seems handler oriented(affectionate), very high level energy, biting very well and hard for their age. I am trying to decide between those pups and A pup out of Ivo (ph1 438pts) at LoganHaus. I have been looking at results of KNPV and PSA and the majority, 90%, of those that title are Mals. DS and GSD are at the low low end. So would that mean I would have a better chance competitively if I waited longer to for a good Ivo pup instead of getting this DS pup. I know it also depends lots on handler and training, but if those variables were held constant. from what I understand, both Dulan and Ivo are both social so that's a plus.


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## Larry Krohn (Nov 18, 2010)

It's the same dog, different color


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## Martin Doan (Jul 27, 2011)

That is what I keep reading and that's what I believed too from seeing them work, but I also ask myself "if that was the case wouldn't the results in KNPV titling be 50% mal and 50% DS instead of 90% mal and less than 8% DS."?


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## Darryl Richey (Jul 3, 2006)

Martin, tough to compare by ratio due to the number of Ds competing are nowhere near the Mals competing in PSA. Flip a coin.


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## Jonathan Katz (Jan 11, 2010)

I say get the Dulan x Penny puppy!


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## Martin Doan (Jul 27, 2011)

That is one thing I figured. That there are lots more mals competing. But then comes the argument there must be a reason why there are so many mal entries.

Is it because male are more popular/abundant? You are a PSA judge right Daryl?


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## Martin Doan (Jul 27, 2011)

Jonathan Katz said:


> I say get the Dulan x Penny puppy!


Lol you know Rick personally. No offense but I need an unbiased opinion.


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## Marta Wajngarten (Jul 30, 2006)

If you're down to these two litters, I don't think you should be so worried about the breed considering how similar they are. Decide which breeding you think will suit your sport and your handling style better. Why murky things up with statistics of unrelated dogs?


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## Joby Becker (Dec 13, 2009)

Unbiased opinion..

If you are talking KNPV Lines..the Mal X and DS X are the same, often coming from the same litters...lines and dogs will differ, but it has nothing to do with coat color..

Purebred Malinios in general...there are lots of different types of dogs.

Purebred Dutchies, different than KNPV bred.

The mali's in PSA may be coming from all manners of Mali type dogs...

there may be some FCI lined Dutchies competing, and some KNPV lined dogs, and crosses of both...

There is just a much Higher population of Malinois worldwide than the brindle colored "cousins"...

If you see a litter with both Mals and DS in it, some may be better than others, but it will not be because of coat color...
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Just get a mal...or flip a coin...more importantly get a dog from lines / parents that you want to get a dog from...


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## Diana Abel (Aug 31, 2009)

I say get the pup you like the best and forget about percentages & all that. Your buying a puppy, who's to say what it will mature into regardless. Just cause parents did this or that doesnt guarantee the pup will excel. Stripes or solids, both are good dogs. I'd take either.


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## Dave Colborn (Mar 25, 2009)

Good luck. I know both guys, but have only caught Dulan.

Mike is a straight shooter. Rick is a straight shooter also and shows his dogs for PSA. That should have some bearing as you aren't doing KNPV. It really comes down to personal preference though.

Good luck.


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## Darryl Richey (Jul 3, 2006)

Martin, yes I'm a judge in PSA. You seem to have done your research on the litters. Like someone else mentioned I would pick from the litter you think produces the type of dog your looking for. Its still a crap shoot being a puppy.


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## Matt Grosch (Jul 4, 2009)

start doing some thread searches, the "differences" have been discussed a lot I remember one thread that addressed the difference between, french, belgian, and dutch mals


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## Shane Woodlief (Sep 9, 2009)

Martin what is your experience with dogs? 

I am not setting you up for anything just curious. If you are a new/novice handler than there are somethings you need to consider as to the type of pup you would want? Again not setting you up just curious.


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## Doug Lovern (May 16, 2011)

Martin,

Both guys are straight up Rick and Mike so call them and talk to them and tell them what you are looking for and go from there.


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## Martin Doan (Jul 27, 2011)

Yeah I heard great things about both person. I'm not necessarily new at dogs... but working dogs yes i'm New. Totally different than everything I have experienced before. I have only been into dog sports about a year, and have been working my GSD. I got some great people that I train with and I know I will make mistakes but I know they'll help me along the way. 

Hopefully I'll meet you Daryl for my PDC in a few years. lol 

Doug, Have you worked AJ's new Dulan x Penny pup?


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## Martin Doan (Jul 27, 2011)

I have got a few PM from different users giving me advice and leading me in the right direction. I would also like to thank everyone that helped me out. Thank you.

I think I have made up my mind.. it's a crap shoot anyways right? even for the most experienced handlers. Hope I get a good one. keep my figures crossed...


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## Joby Becker (Dec 13, 2009)

good luck..


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## Doug Lovern (May 16, 2011)

Martin,

Yes i did work the pup and like him very much but there again it is pup . Good luck with your training your club is a good one to work with so just listen and it will work out.


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