# Kids Decoying



## Howard Gaines III (Dec 26, 2007)

At what age do you feel it's appropriate for kids to learn how to decoy and for what sport or venue?


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## Terry Devine (Mar 11, 2008)

Too many factors. It depends on the childs maturity and the intelligence of the people teaching the child how to decoy. My daughter started doing some light decoy work when she was about 13, but I was completely confident in the club members that were showing her how to do it. My son started doing decoy work when he was 17 and he had an awesome mentor who invited him to gonto Canada to take part in Lance Collins work week. Marvin is a greatbteacher and my son greatly benefitted from the lessons.


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## Adam Swilling (Feb 12, 2009)

It has to do with the maturity of the child, as Terry said, but it also has to do with how the dog sees the child. My oldest son is as big as I am, literally, at 12. Dogs don't see him physically as a child. IMO, it's not so much an age thing with the child as it is what the child appears like to the dog, if that makes sense. I'm not near as worried about my son learning to catch a dog safely as I am allowing others' dogs to think it's okay to bite a child. Now that he's as big as he is, I've let him take a couple of bites. What I'm more impressed with as far as my son goes is how his ability to watch and read a dog has developed. Sorry, had to brag just a touch.


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## Jessica Kromer (Nov 12, 2009)

It also depends on the dog... 

We had a kid that came to the club with his grandma; about 12.... He was really into dog training and even handled his grandma's tracking bitch for a TRIII. For this kid, the TD would get up behind him and help show him the works, BUT would only put him in front of two out of the 15 or so dogs at the club. Both were mature/retired dogs that knew the "game" and weren't out to prove anything, just out for a bite. It helped to teach the kid good mechanics (no surprises and it wasn't about "teaching" the dog anything) and confidence in himself in the face of a big barking dog. There are a number of dogs that I would NEVER put in front of my boys. Just like a pup, you want to build a bunch of good experiences and wins while they are developing the skills....


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## Howard Gaines III (Dec 26, 2007)

I'm also thinking about liability issues, as a parent can't sign away a child's liability. And IF something goes wrong or the kid falls, would they have the mindset and skills to KNOW what to do for protection?


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## Terry Devine (Mar 11, 2008)

Whenever my kids were on the field to catch a dog we always had other decoys close just in case something went sour. We always were careful in choosing the right dog and made sure that Zachary and Clara were taught what to do. It was all very controlled and appropriate to their skill level. The club I was part of when my daughter was catching decided that the insurance liability was too great and ended her decoying opportunities.

Terry


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## Terrasita Cuffie (Jun 8, 2008)

Howard Gaines III said:


> I'm also thinking about liability issues, as a parent can't sign away a child's liability. And IF something goes wrong or the kid falls, would they have the mindset and skills to KNOW what to do for protection?



Because of this, I wouldn't send mine on a kid. You never know what can happen. 

T


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## sam wilks (May 3, 2009)

you could always work the dog on a backtie that way the kid can just give the dog a simple bite and the handler can be right next to him without having to worry about leash control. And yes a great point to make sure the dog is not seeing the kid as a child and that it is ok to bite children.


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## Joby Becker (Dec 13, 2009)

depends on the dogs first and foremost...

then the kids...

I have seen some 8 week old pups I would not let near a small kid..


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## Kadi Thingvall (Jan 22, 2007)

Depends on the kid, depends on the dog.

My son started catching dogs at 9 or 10, this video is from 2002 and he's 19 now.
http://www.workingdogphotography.com/videos/dax_kelson.mpeg

But it was only with my dogs, and only with dogs that were "level appropriate" The dog in that video is fairly young also, right about 1 year old, totally sleeve sure, and not strong enough to hurt my son. But he learned how to safely catch dogs, do stick work, etc with dogs like that one.

Fast forward a few years, to 2004, same kid, different dog.









Fast foward another 2-3 years, same kid, different dog. At this point he was working much stronger dogs, because he was physically able to handle them, and even did some hidden suit work with some dogs. But still in controlled settings, with me hovering right there just in case. 










Unfortunately he really isn't that interested in working dogs anymore, but who knows, maybe some day he'll get back into it.

I let him work other people's dogs once in awhile as he was growing up, but it was always dogs I knew well, with close supervision. A strong dog can easily hurt a physically immature kid without even meaning to, just a good hard thrash of the head from a powerful dog can do damage to their bodies that wouldn't happen to an adult.


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## Howard Gaines III (Dec 26, 2007)

I guess if you had BAD kids it doesn't matter! =;

The back tie idea and working real safe dogs is a sure winner. At some point after you've taken ALL REASONABLE safeguards, the lessons though hard knocks must set in. Teaching any helper NOT to lean down is important and with kids already low to the dog...they don't have to work that hard to get them.

I think a very important tool is* video*. As a former wrestling coach, you can use this "tool" to help folks see the good and bad mechancis which were used. Body positioning, sleeve angle, eye contact...all are areas that decoys/helpers reflect upon at certain times.


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## Kathy Barker (Nov 8, 2011)

And again, it depends on the kid. We had a teenager at our club that wanted to learn to work the dogs. Our trainer started to walk the kid through some basic, fundamental safety and the kid kept cutting him off, "I know, I know, I know". Needless to say, no decoy work for Jr. If you are mature enough to listen and learn you just want to goof around.


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## Howard Gaines III (Dec 26, 2007)

Kathy Barker said:


> And again, it depends on the kid. We had a teenager at our club that wanted to learn to work the dogs. Our trainer started to walk the kid through some basic, fundamental safety and the kid kept cutting him off, "I know, I know, I know". Needless to say, no decoy work for Jr. If you are mature enough to listen and learn you just want to goof around.


 Sounds like me in the classroom teaching woodshop safety and the same kids who said they knew, showed it at test time, sometimes failed to do it and got cut! You can't be safe enough.


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## Jhun Brioso (Dec 28, 2009)

Kadi Thingvall said:


> Depends on the kid, depends on the dog.
> 
> My son started catching dogs at 9 or 10, this video is from 2002 and he's 19 now.
> http://www.workingdogphotography.com/videos/dax_kelson.mpeg
> ...


Kadi, 

Seems that you've put a very good training foundation w/ your son! How i wish that i've started / exposed in working dogs at that age.. Very nice!


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## Amy Swaby (Jul 16, 2008)

LOL I know I was spoiled getting to work with the k9 unit back home in the Bahamas but I sure wish I had been that spoiled to be able to learn some decoy work, girl or not.


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