# Recall question



## Don Turnipseed (Oct 8, 2006)

Ok, I have been asked something I can't answer. I have recieved a couple of PM's asking about the recall on these two dogs in the picture. Neither has had any recall training, they are loose in 1000's of acres, and 200 yards away. I never gave it a thought before being asked but there being two dogs seems to complicate things.

Now, here is the deal, this is the fourth day in the field for them. They learned to come in on the 3rd day. In all honesty, they would do this if there were 4 or 5 dogs. I have never used leashes or shock collars to bring them in. Now, I am being asked how I do it and I honestly don't have an answer...I just do what I have always done. So, since I have been told so many times how trainig has progressed light years from what it was in my day, I thought maybe someone could hazzard a guess as to why they come in with a simple "HUP". I never analyzed why they do it....they just do. 

So the question is why? Hopefully the PM's are reading.


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## Chris McDonald (May 29, 2008)

You mean you get your non hyper spas dogs to come to you and don’t train with a ball or a treat?


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## Jennifer Michelson (Sep 20, 2006)

Mine naturally come back to me with a whistle...not sure why, didnt train it. I guess they like the sound. 'course, I now reward it to make sure they are more enthusiastic about coming back. Granted if I have a ball in my hand, I get a very intense recall and sometimes a dog in my chest.....


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## Bob Scott (Mar 30, 2006)

Most people that have recall problems have created it themselves. Either chasing a puppy when it runs. "Correcting" a dog for running away after you chase it or worse, after it finally comes back. Jerking the dog to make it come, yadda, yadda!
if the dog hasn't had and negative association created when it's came up to you "I believe" the recall just happens.
You could probably holler "HEY" and the dog will come just to see what the noise is about. 
In 50 + yrs of training my dogs I've never had one I raised that I had to put any effort into teaching a recall.
Formal recall with a sit front and all the other stuff may take a bit more time but just getting the dog to come, no!


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## Don Turnipseed (Oct 8, 2006)

Chris McDonald said:


> You mean you get your non hyper spas dogs to come to you and don’t train with a ball or a treat?


Nothing Chris. I was sitting in the truck when I took the picture. Boy, they didn't want to call,it a day either. Took them forever to make that walk. Didn't know they could move that slow.


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## Don Turnipseed (Oct 8, 2006)

Bob, they don't sit in front but they do get in the truck and into their crates....which BlackJack has never been in one before.


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## Jim Nash (Mar 30, 2006)

Don Turnipseed said:


> Nothing Chris. I was sitting in the truck when I took the picture. Boy, they didn't want to call,it a day either. Took them forever to make that walk. Didn't know they could move that slow.


Mine did that once . I just started driving off on him . Really sped up the recall . Funny as hell too .


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## Bob Scott (Mar 30, 2006)

Don Turnipseed said:


> Bob, they don't sit in front but they do get in the truck and into their crates....which BlackJack has never been in one before.



It doesn't suprise me! Again, if there has been no negatives that create aversion to you, the truck, crates, etc, I think it just happens with a clear dog with good nerve. 
I also believe that running a younger dog with an older dog that has already formed those habits make it easier for the younger dog to pick them up.
When I first start giving simple come commands it's either when the pup is with an older dog OR when I know the pup isn't distracted. Calling a distracted pup is another common mistakes people make. That just teaches them the first "come" or whatever means squat.

Example; With all the dogs I've had I only recall teaching one to honor the boundaries of my front yard, at my older house. I simply told that pup "NO" when he got close to the street, driveway or neighbors property. Every dog after that just seemed to follow suit or honor the other dog buy not passing it. 
They basically learned by imitation. 
I've never looked at "training" basics manners as anything more then exposing them to the world and expecting them to listen. 
Training is easy. Breaking bad habits sucks! :lol:


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## Laney Rein (Feb 9, 2011)

Don, Airedales? I'm really impressed. First nice dogs and most people don't do this nice of a job with tough terriers like this breed. All the ones I have ever been around were not well trained because they were smarter than their owners!


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## Chris McDonald (May 29, 2008)

The ball thing was supposed to be sarcasm Don. I never thought of it but what Bob says sounds real good to me


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## Tanith Wheeler (Jun 5, 2009)

I attended a seminar once with a rather odd sheepdog trainer who believes that puppies come with a set of 'pre-programmed' behaviours - partly influenced by the bitch.
Some of those being, follow the 'leader', come back when told and wait. Think there's a fourth but I can't remember it. Any deviation from those behaviours is down to human influence.

Puppies come back when called, they do tend to follow the human around / follow the actions of a trained dog and I've always used body language to teach pups not to come into the kitchen when I'm in there cooking etc. All with little/no training

From what I've read from Dom he seems to raise his pups within a pack structure with minimal training, until he takes them out to get used to the environment and then to work. It seems like his 'method' is far more natural than modern training - like the type we did for thousands of years. He expects the dogs to come back and so they did.

I think most people have recall problems because they expect to have them.


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## Don Turnipseed (Oct 8, 2006)

Chris McDonald said:


> The ball thing was supposed to be sarcasm Don. I never thought of it but what Bob says sounds real good to me


 The answer was equally sarcastic Chris. :grin: You got to be carefull with that Bob, Chris. He 's been around the block a few times and knows training didn't used to be as complicated as it has become with new terminology, drives, redirection, etc, etc. I actually think I know why the dogs respnd so well but really Chris, I don't know how to explain it to where it can be understood. I don't know the vernacular.

Personally, my favorite answer is Laneys. Down to earth, objective, and showed a lot of insight into the breed. :grin: :grin:


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## Bob Scott (Mar 30, 2006)

No sarcasm here! I believe what I posted. 
It probably does have a lot to do with the terminology today but most, if not all of that came from folks Like Scott, Fuller, Fox, Skinner, Pavlov, etc and the competition world picked it up and ran with it. 
The difference in training for competition and just having a good truck dog is light yrs apart and being good at one doesn't necessarily mean the other can be accomplished. That's quite often by choice.
I've seen way to many high level competition dogs that weren't worth a crap as truck dogs and they will swipe the turkey off the table in a heart beat. There are as many good truck dogs that have no clue what precision in obedience means. 
My first "want" is a good truck dog. The formal training is something I enjoy but I do understand both sides of it. I enjoy both sides of it! 
I've had good hunting terriers that were great truck dogs and did whatever I asked. I've also had (one in particular) high level OB competition dogs that couldn't find there way home if they were standing in the drive way but he still was a good truck dog also. 
I wouldn't have a competition only dog. That serves no purpose "for me"!


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## Kerry Foose (Feb 20, 2010)

Jim Nash said:


> Mine did that once . I just started driving off on him . Really sped up the recall . Funny as hell too .



haha, I am glad i am not the only one who did this! it worked so well, I did it again and again over the years with different dogs and it totally concreted recalls, lol.


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## Don Turnipseed (Oct 8, 2006)

Bob Scott said:


> No sarcasm here! I believe what I posted.
> It probably does have a lot to do with the terminology today but most, if not all of that came from folks Like Scott, Fuller, Fox, Skinner, Pavlov, etc and the competition world picked it up and ran with it.
> The difference in training for competition and just having a good truck dog is light yrs apart and being good at one doesn't necessarily mean the other can be accomplished. That's quite often by choice.
> I've seen way to many high level competition dogs that weren't worth a crap as truck dogs and they will swipe the turkey off the table in a heart beat. There are as many good truck dogs that have no clue what precision in obedience means.
> ...


I was just giving you a bad time there Bob. I figure, even though you use positive for the precision work, you still make good solid dogs out of them with the same methods you used years ago. Myself, I do but I don't look for precision, just a dog that fits in with me. Sorry I didn't qualify this before, but, I had more pressing things going on. :grin:


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