# breeder inquiry by email?



## kenneth roth

I read some threads about breeders complaining about people inquirying about pups/dogs.

Can you give some advice about how to email breeders, what basic information you need to ask and tell a bout yourself to a breeder?

I usely ask for price, bloodlines/pedigre info, health testing,sometimes i confuze the breeder with my questions #-o](*,)

Thanks for your time,help


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## James Downey

Ken,

I was one of the people bitching about getting ridiculous e-mails from people on pups or dogs. 

I am not hard to please. But basically emails like:

"how much for the dog" and that's it.

Or" I am looking for a national level dog" Well If I could pick the winners at 8 weeks I would be rich. And generally these are from trainers I have never heard of...so the chances of them taking a national level dog to a nationals....slim.

" I am looking for a hard dog"....really, at 8 weeks.

Generally, I do give a hoot where the dogs go. I do not need to know your vets name, is your yard fenced, Or are you a clicker trainer, I get not everyone trains like me. A name would be nice. What your looking to do with the pup. and a little effort in telling me why I should sell you a puppy. I know that sounds egotistical...but it's not. I get the owner is looking for something specific...they want to have success. I will take all the time in the world with someone on that. So long as they get that I, like them, know a dog is 12+ year commitment. I want to give the pups the best chance at having a successful relationship with thier new owner. I really could care less if they are trainer of the year. What I care about is are they going to give the puppy an enriching life. It never hurts to add accomplishments but those are secondary.


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## Gerald Dunn

so James, what do you want for a pup ](*,)


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## James Downey

Chase a ball, bite a rag, like his food. And be able to do it every where. If I see insecurity, All I care about is if they gain confidence over it. If we go to a store with a pup and he is a bit hesitant about going in. Just as long as he sees there is no real danger, and he gains confidence quickly. I think that's pretty normal. 

I think a lot of working dog people put insane expectations on puppies. Puppies act like puppies. They are little, they are new to the world. And little Malinois pups have some weirdoness in em'. As long as they keep gaining confidence.... Thier drive keeps growing. 

The Vion pups I had. All of them were really equal till about 12 weeks. I did not know which one to pick. In the end I kept the dog no one else wanted. Dudes awesome. As a baby, he would chase ball...but he would get bored quick, he would bite good...but he would be the first one done with it. He ate the least....Now he's got crazy ball drive. He cannot get enough biting something, and he's got that insane back to his ears grip like A'tim had. And he eats every meal like he's starving. I did not see what I would call real drive in any of the pups till they were between 4-6 months. The two girls I had, both were ball monsters, and good griping dogs....nerve was there, but not as strong as thier brother (he's something special). The other boy...at 7 weeks old, he climbed the door of one crate to get the crate on top of it for a piece of kibble. He had food drive, I would consider special..his mother was like that. But all the dogs, from what I hear are awesome. But none of them when they were babies, showed me anything where I went "holy moly" look at that. Nor have any of the Malinois I have seen in person as babies. They all just act like malinois...they bite, they chase things, they eat...then they get tired and sleep. Now, I did hear my dogs father was a wild man at 8 weeks old. But I saw videos of him...and thought he looked like my pups.

So, After that...I am not to critical on babies. So if the parents are good, the ped looks nice, the pups chase a ball, bites a rag, and likes his food....I am good. I think I am pretty good at fostering the things I like. I also....an I believe this in my heart. That many, many good pups get squashed. And you see them as adults and are like "meh"....But really it's the handler. I think pups from good parents....it's 25% the dog, 75% the handler. 

I am big on not doing anything with a puppy except building a exciting relationship and building that paycheck with the dog, And by that I mean just getting addicted to that ball and that rag....I also make food valubable by not making at a buffet everyday at 9 am and 8 pm. my pups learn that food is not guanteed...so eat why it's here.

I don't know if I am going to write any books soon, but it's working for me.


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## mike suttle

I gotta say I agree with you James.

I get calls almost everyday from someone looking for an 8 week old pup who will be 90 plus lbs as an adult, have huge bone, huge head, black brindle color, small black eyes, small ears, super dominant aggressive temperament, will be an extreme dog in all areas, etc, etc, etc..........I usually just say, "its a puppy, when he's 2 years old we will know if those things will be there or not". He's $1200 now, when he's 2 years old and he's all of those things and I still have him, he'll be a little more expensive! LOL


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## jim stevens

No doubt if we could pick puppies at 8 weeks, we'd be picking lottery numbers instead. It payz better. My pup didn't have much till about 6 months then her drives tripled. Actually she was more like she had ADHD until then, couldn't focus long enough on one thing to do her job. The only thing she did well was retrieve and lost interest in that quickly.


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## Maren Bell Jones

You can make a good first impression if you take a moment to spell or pronounce the breed right. Mallomars, Rockwelders, and sheppards are all good examples of purebread dogs.


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## Louise Jollyman

If you contact me about a pup, I want to know that you have looked at my website and have done a little bit of homework about your chosen breed. Don't say how great you think my dogs are, then ask me for a black and red dog.............

If you have looked at my website, you already know the pedigree, the health testing and price.....


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## Kadi Thingvall

Louise Jollyman said:


> If you contact me about a pup, I want to know that you have looked at my website and have done a little bit of homework about your chosen breed. Don't say how great you think my dogs are, then ask me for a black and red dog.............
> 
> If you have looked at my website, you already know the pedigree, the health testing and price.....


Gotta agree with this. It's all out there on my website, upcoming breedings, pedigree, titles, health checks, pictures and videos of the dogs, price of pups, etc. 

When I get an email that says "I am looking for a Malinois pup, what do you have available" or "How much are your pups" I know the person hasn't even done the absolute basics in looking at the available information, and they probably won't get much more effort back from me than they put into it. If I reply, the email will be something like "Information on my upcoming litters, prices, etc is on the website at ..." I'm not going to retype in an email something I already put out there for the world to see.

Course my other favorite is when I get emails from people that are addressed to someone else. Nothing screams "form email sent to every breeder you can find" like an email addressed to another breeder, but sent to my address [-X


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## Jennifer Coulter

mike suttle said:


> I gotta say I agree with you James.
> 
> I get calls almost everyday from someone looking for an 8 week old pup who will be 90 plus lbs as an adult, have huge bone, huge head, black brindle color, small black eyes, small ears, super dominant aggressive temperament, will be an extreme dog in all areas, etc, etc, etc.........


Might as well say: "My dick would look much bigger with this on the end of the leash".


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## Sue DiCero

Kadi Thingvall said:


> Gotta agree with this. It's all out there on my website, upcoming breedings, pedigree, titles, health checks, pictures and videos of the dogs, price of pups, etc.
> 
> When I get an email that says "I am looking for a Malinois pup, what do you have available" or "How much are your pups" I know the person hasn't even done the absolute basics in looking at the available information, and they probably won't get much more effort back from me than they put into it. If I reply, the email will be something like "Information on my upcoming litters, prices, etc is on the website at ..." I'm not going to retype in an email something I already put out there for the world to see.
> 
> Course my other favorite is when I get emails from people that are addressed to someone else. Nothing screams "form email sent to every breeder you can find" like an email addressed to another breeder, but sent to my address [-X


We get some of those, some in bunches and same exact phrasing, so you know the other breeders in the area checking out. 
As a person emailing, tell the breeder who you are, what you want and what your experience is. Timeframe is good as well.

If you want a national level dog, explain how you are a national level trainer and handler and have the support team to help you.


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## David Frost

mike suttle said:


> I gotta say I agree with you James.
> 
> I get calls almost everyday from someone looking for an 8 week old pup who will be 90 plus lbs as an adult, have huge bone, huge head, black brindle color, small black eyes, small ears, super dominant aggressive temperament, will be an extreme dog in all areas, etc, etc, etc..........I usually just say, "its a puppy, when he's 2 years old we will know if those things will be there or not". He's $1200 now, when he's 2 years old and he's all of those things and I still have him, he'll be a little more expensive! LOL


Mike, if ya have one that will, in addition to everything you've already listed, instinctively hunt for and respond to drugs and with a different response for explosives (perfectly of course) save a couple for me??????

DFrost


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## mike suttle

David Frost said:


> Mike, if ya have one that will, in addition to everything you've already listed, instinctively hunt for and respond to drugs and with a different response for explosives (perfectly of course) save a couple for me??????
> 
> DFrost


LOL, Will do David. When I get several of those here together I will give you a call and you can come test them. Do you also need them to carry chickens and tires?


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## David Frost

mike suttle said:


> LOL, Will do David. When I get several of those here together I will give you a call and you can come test them. Do you also need them to carry chickens and tires?


Sure, why not throw that in as well. Ya just never know. 

ha ha

DFrost


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## Jeff Wright

Now I will give you the other side of the coin.
I have been watching a very nice KNPV German Shepherd Bitch for a future breeding.
I know a LOT about her pedigree.
I have seen many of the Dogs in her pedigree and talk to their former owners in Holland.
I notice she has been imported in whelp to someone whose email is [email protected] .com in Florida.
I politely call her ,tell her my background/knowledge and that I had even seen her IPO3 sister in Dallas that weekend.
She is completely and totally clueless.
She has decided to Breed Malinois and German Shephards because she cant ride and breed her Saddlebred horses anymore.
I ask her about the 2 former litters this bitch she just paid for has had.
She is clueless about the number whelped or how they are doing.
She does like the fact that this bitch has a strong looking back like her horses.
I politely thank her and hang up.
Now that I think about it , She is not really a breeder..just a nice person with a checkbook.
There are quite a few of those around also.


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## Ben Thompson

Jeff Wright said:


> Now I will give you the other side of the coin.
> I have been watching a very nice KNPV German Shepherd Bitch for a future breeding.
> I know a LOT about her pedigree.
> I have seen many of the Dogs in her pedigree and talk to their former owners in Holland.
> I notice she has been imported in whelp to someone whose email is [email protected] .com in Florida.
> I politely call her ,tell her my background/knowledge and that I had even seen her IPO3 sister in Dallas that weekend.
> She is completely and totally clueless.
> She has decided to Breed Malinois and German Shephards because she cant ride and breed her Saddlebred horses anymore.
> I ask her about the 2 former litters this bitch she just paid for has had.
> She is clueless about the number whelped or how they are doing.
> She does like the fact that this bitch has a strong looking back like her horses.
> I politely thank her and hang up.
> Now that I think about it , She is not really a breeder..just a nice person with a checkbook.
> There are quite a few of those around also.


 How does someone that clueless get a dog of that caliber?


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## Kadi Thingvall

Ben Thompson said:


> How does someone that clueless get a dog of that caliber?


Easy. Usually they have a checkbook and are willing to write the biggest check. And someone told them the dog was something special (not saying it isn't, just that "it's special" is all they know about it) so they bought it.


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## tracey schneider

the more information you can give about yourself, your experience, and what you are looking for or not (specifics) the better, that should give a great start to whether or not conversations need to proceed. People who just ask how much or have obviously not done any homework or even been through my website... I dont spend much time wasting my time with them.

t


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## Sue DiCero

Kadi Thingvall said:


> Easy. Usually they have a checkbook and are willing to write the biggest check. And someone told them the dog was something special (not saying it isn't, just that "it's special" is all they know about it) so they bought it.


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## Peter Cavallaro

Gee thats integrity, people that spent years developing their skills and doing right by their dogs wont even get a shot at the top litters and everyone knows it cos they will go straight to the names, pull out a fat wallet though and the breeders will bend over for ya and spread real wide for anyone.

Sux





Kadi Thingvall said:


> Easy. Usually they have a checkbook and are willing to write the biggest check. And someone told them the dog was something special (not saying it isn't, just that "it's special" is all they know about it) so they bought it.


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## Jeff Wright

Kadi Thingvall said:


> Easy. Usually they have a checkbook and are willing to write the biggest check. And someone told them the dog was something special (not saying it isn't, just that "it's special" is all they know about it) so they bought it.


Bingo Kadi.
Just makes me sick because how could I even trust a person this green to even know how to objectively evaluate a litter.
She did tell me that she want's people like me to get first crack at them.Oh well...


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## Ben Thompson

Kadi Thingvall said:


> Easy. Usually they have a checkbook and are willing to write the biggest check. And someone told them the dog was something special (not saying it isn't, just that "it's special" is all they know about it) so they bought it.


Too bad they could sell to a person who will actually make the dog reach its potential. What a waste.


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## James Downey

Actual E-mail recieved today.

Hello, 
I came across your ad while looking for a Male Belgian Malanois. We live in Utah, and I was wondering if shipping was included. If not, would you know anybody advertising a Male Belgian Malanois under 1,000 dollars, shipping included?


No name...... Malalinois?.....Shipping included? Its a 100 mile round trip to the airport, a crate, a health cert and plane fare for free? And if not, will I refer to someone who will?....WTF!!!!


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## Joby Becker

shame on you for trying to rip somebody off


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## John Nolan

If the first question is 'how much?', you can't spell the name of the breed correctly, you don't give me some information on your experience with dogs, you can't take the time to tell me what you want that breed of pup for, then you're wasting your time contacting this breeder.


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## Gerald Dunn

James Downey said:


> Actual E-mail recieved today.
> 
> Hello,
> I came across your ad while looking for a Male Belgian Malanois. We live in Utah, and I was wondering if shipping was included. If not, would you know anybody advertising a Male Belgian Malanois under 1,000 dollars, shipping included?
> 
> 
> No name...... Malalinois?.....Shipping included? Its a 100 mile round trip to the airport, a crate, a health cert and plane fare for free? And if not, will I refer to someone who will?....WTF!!!!




I'll take 2 and would you train them before you send them.:-\":-\"


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## kenneth roth

thanks everyone its educational for me and other people


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## Laura Briggs

I followed the advice that Tracey listed when I was looking to buy a GSD pup late last year and received helpful responses from everyone who I contacted. 

I found that breeders seemed to like knowing who recommended that I contact them (ie. Jack Burger from BC suggested that one of your dogs might be a good fit for my family, etc.) and what attracted me to their dogs (eg. I saw the mother at the Ontario Regionals and loved ....). I was suprised to learn that all of the breeders who said "strongly prefer working homes" on their websites or ads still viewed me as a suitable home even though I consider myself more of an active pet home. However, I did explain in detail what I do with my dogs, what specific qualities I was looking for in a dog, and where I train in obedience. The only odd thing I asked was whether their dogs were good eaters but I explained that I had a very picky eater (who absolutely is not accomodated) and I sure didn't want another.


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## Don Turnipseed

Companys have paperless billing by email today, people pay their bills on the computer, look for cars, homes, shop for everything. People spend half their life on computer, why not inquire about dogs? Sign of the times people. You don't have to respond to any of them if you choose. $$$$$


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## Selena van Leeuwen

I have another, other than the already said: 
don't e-mail twice a day/ call 3 times per evening, when you already have all the info you asked for AND when I explained that I can't always reply directly 'cause I just started a new full time job ( so exhausted when I get home), have 2 toddlers and 15 dogs to take care for.

After 2 wks of the above, and multiple promises to send me a deposit, the guy sends me an e-mail he don't want Ziva any more. Reason: lack of communication (I spoke to him on the phone 4 times, and had e-mail conversations every other day....) SIGH

So any one intrested in a VERY nice young female? See the ad I just placed...


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## Ryan Venables

Jeff Wright said:


> Bingo Kadi.
> Just makes me sick because how could I even trust a person this green to even know how to objectively evaluate a litter.
> She did tell me that she want's people like me to get first crack at them.Oh well...


...and into the show ring they go.


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## Ryan Venables

I'll post on the buyers side of things as well. When were looking for our first pup and figured out what kind we wanted, Malinois, I started calling around local breeders here in Ontario. Now, I didn't really have any intention of getting a working dog, like Laura, I wanted a pup for an active home, and we'd take it from there. Hell, I hadn't even heard of SchH or FR before.

There were three kennels in Ontario: Malinger, Arek, and Fontaine d'Or, who were actively breeding. We ended up heading to Malinger b/c they were the closest and had a litter on the ground. The communication w/ the other two was poor, and despite a few attempts in trying to come by to see their dogs, it didn't end up happening. Probably b/c I didnt want to work the puppy, and these were working kennels. We saw Indi as a 5wk pup, and despite wanting a male, ended up putting a deposit down. That was four years ago, and now that I'm training in FR, I'm very happy on what I have w/ Indi. Despite her being sold to me as a pet, she's working out nicely. Although knowing what I know now, I would never have taken a pup from that kennel... But I will say, they make great pets/show Malinois.

When we ended up thinking about a second pup, I contacted Kadi, we spoke a few times. Was she the quickest in getting back to me? No, but she was also prepping and trialling Kita all over the place. As a potential buyer, you want to know right away, b/c you have puppy fever, but I'm assuming as the breeder you guys get tons of similar emails a week. Every email I had w/ Kadi was very informative and we had actually agreed on a pup when it was time to breed... but in the end, it didn't work out as I was hoping for one sire and she ended up using another. Despite not getting a dog, I was pleased w/ our interaction.

I also emailed James about a pup from him. He was quite close to me when he was in MI, but things didn't work out. His emails were good, to the point, and when we decided it wouldn't work out, was helpful in suggesting other kennels. It was THAT experience, that I really liked. Get a dog, or don't get a dog from me, it doesn't matter. 

We ended up getting Mako from de Las Flores in Seattle, and again, I'm sure I was probably pretty annoying, but the stars aligned and we had puppy fever. Again great experience.

Although my experiences have been positive, I can see how you guys (as breeders) could get quickly annoyed if somebody emails about stupid facts and information they could easily find out. For me, when I'm emailing around, I like to know how tall/big the dam/sire is, and a couple other things if it's not readily available on a website.

All this puppy talk makes me want a 3rd!


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## kenneth roth

Kadi kennel is great has some good info on the site but i havent looked indepth yet, its about 6 hour drive from where i live, if i was into mal's i would contact them for a pup for sure.


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## Peter Cho

hmmmm, why would you go to a "breeder"? What is a breeder? What does that word mean? Means you have two dogs and a website. 

Buy dogs from people that can SHOW YOU END PRODUCT YOU WANT, not tell you about ancestors. LOL. See it NOW. 
Buy dogs from people who are COMPETING and WINNING and know what (traits) is needed for that sport or service. This is a VERY small number.

legit breeders get annoyed because it is the typical macho male dudes that want "toughest and hardest" dog. Most don't even know what hard means.

If you want a working dog, join a club, ask the training director. Real simple. No fantasy tales about fabulous dogs on the internet. LOL. Trust me. I learned the hard way.


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