# standard schnauzer x malinois



## Jim Leon (Jan 21, 2010)

Just posing the question here, I am not a breeder so please don't everyone flame out on me;

Would there be any validity to crossing a standard schnauzer with a malinois.

My premise is; for many people in urban areas, New York for example, the mal is a little too big on the street. The standard however has the right temperment but lacks the size by just a few inches
I have to admit ,I'm not impartial here as I own a standard.

Again, just posing the question and seeking informed opinions.

thanks.


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## Shane Woodlief (Sep 9, 2009)

Jim Leon said:


> Just posing the question here, I am not a breeder so please don't everyone flame out on me;
> 
> Would there be any validity to crossing a standard schnauzer with a malinois.
> 
> ...


WTH! ](*,) ](*,) 

Why would you want to do that? Jim are you smoking an illegal substance? #-o


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## mike suttle (Feb 19, 2008)

What is it that you feel the standard schnauzer would bring to the table? other than decreasing the size of the dog? I have seen too many Malinois that are already too small in my opinion. And what does "too big for the streets" even mean?


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## Charlotte Hince (Oct 7, 2010)

What would be the point? Would you want a sport dog or a city companion or some kind of protection dog? A well trained schnauzer could fit the bill on all of those, as could the right mal I imagine (though an apartment would be a stretch I think). You can find big and little examples of both breeds. I don't have a working dog yet and I still don't see this as a practical choice. 

You'd be just as likely to get a small dog with the "wrong" temperament as the right one and there's no clear end goal. Probably in the most practical sense there's no real market for mutts who haven't been bred for a set purpose. I'm sure you could find something similar in the pound.


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## Harry Keely (Aug 26, 2009)

I am from and still visit NYC and LINY 2 - 4 times a year and have malis and dutchies that have been in the streets there ( talk about good enviromental testing ), what are you getting at. There is 100,000's of dogs ( all sizes ) in the five boroughs that make up NYC along with close to 8 million people there so excuse me if I'm a little confused.


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## Mike Lauer (Jul 26, 2009)

please dont breed. 
There are plenty of good dogs out there.
I have seen as many full grown malis going 35-40# as I have the 80-90# behemoths
if you look around you can find a small one easy


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## Dave Martin (Aug 11, 2010)

I work in NYC and we have our working Rott and German Boxer here every week.. I really don't feel there is any reason you couldn't own a Malinois, or any other breed for that matter, in Manhattan if you were 100% committed to getting them their proper outlets and exercise every day.. My girlfriend still lives in Manhattan with the Boxer and she even trains him on the city streets regularly, as I did with the Rott. As Harry pointed out, no better place for training them to ignore distractions.

So some people feel they must clear the way when we're walking down the sidewalk.. I look at that as a plus!


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## Matt Grosch (Jul 4, 2009)

my (inexperienced) thought, cross breeding is a crap shoot when the best do it, and a terrible idea if anyone else does


and, if you are going to cross something to a working dog , even hypothetically, make sure the other dog is at least a working dog also


a working mal to a working pit, people may be curious and question it....


a working male to a show dog, schnauzer or otherwise, and they will punch you right in the gut


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## Ashley Campbell (Jun 21, 2009)

Like someone else mentioned, I've seen some Mal's that are smaller than my GSD bitch, who is pretty small (60 lbs). In fact, they have a MWD here at Fort Carson that is a Mal, it's maybe 40ish lbs, has an ugly floppy ear and a bobbed tail. But obviously she works so the fact that she's ugly as sin doesn't count. I don't see the necessity in cross-breeding to make a breed smaller just to accomodate city living.


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## Jim Leon (Jan 21, 2010)

well, thanks everyone for your opinions. Like I said to begin with, I am not a breeder, never have been and have no intention of it. I was just speculating.
My standard schnauzer does work. He guards and alerts extremely well during the day at my job and at home. And, he works very well as a pack dog. He did enough to earn a Working Pack Dog title two years ago in the adirondacks.

What I meant by "too big for the streets" is that I don't want a dog that stands out as an obvious protection dog and draws attention. I prefer a dog more like what I have. One that sort of flys under the radar but when senses a bad actor is quick to let me know with an alert stance and a low growl. I can take of the rest myself.

I live in NYC. Walking around, jogging, shopping etc. I have my dog with me all the time. Every trip out the building door there are literally 1000 distractions encountered. My dog handles them all with style and grace.


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## Ashley Campbell (Jun 21, 2009)

I don't think a Mal gets the same automatic stereotype as say, a GSD or a Dobe does.

Ask the kids at my sons school, every one of them knows that mine is a German Shepherd or just say "oh a police dog" she's a standard black and tan, there is a person who brings a white GSD to pick their kids up and none of the kids know what it is and even a lot of the adults ask her if it's a Husky mix. 
But, as far as I've seen, most Mal's just a get "what breed of dog is that" since they haven't been popularized on TV like Rin-Tin-Tin or "Jerry Lee" from K9.


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## Edward Egan (Mar 4, 2009)

Personally I'd rather have a dog that deters people from even thinking about screwing with me. I don't really see a value in an undercover protection dog.


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## Anna Kasho (Jan 16, 2008)

I wouldn't want one. I don't see any value to a cross like this, you'll be reducing the size and drives of a mal and adding a ton of extra grooming issues. If you want a yapper to alert, get a yapper of whatever variety. If you like Schnausers in particular, get a small giant schnauser or an oversized standard one, they're out there.


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## Ted Efthymiadis (Apr 3, 2009)

You said he guards and alerts.... but has he actually protected you or your property?
Barking is one thing, stopping a large man is another....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pTUwVWO8qO0





Jim Leon said:


> well, thanks everyone for your opinions. Like I said to begin with, I am not a breeder, never have been and have no intention of it. I was just speculating.
> My standard schnauzer does work. He guards and alerts extremely well during the day at my job and at home. And, he works very well as a pack dog. He did enough to earn a Working Pack Dog title two years ago in the adirondacks.
> 
> What I meant by "too big for the streets" is that I don't want a dog that stands out as an obvious protection dog and draws attention. I prefer a dog more like what I have. One that sort of flys under the radar but when senses a bad actor is quick to let me know with an alert stance and a low growl. I can take of the rest myself.
> ...


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## Jim Leon (Jan 21, 2010)

Hi Ted,
Dog did protect me once in my automobile. Stopped at a red light, unbeknown to me a man had approached rear passenger side open window. Dog was lying in back seat. I heard commotion, a growl and a man yelping. Dog had bit him on the hand and he was jumping around in the street holding his hand. His buddies at the curb ran off. I'm not trying to say my dog is a manstopper. He only weighs 45 lbs. But he does go all out, and teeth first.

Giassou Manga.
Demetris Efthimiou Pantoleon


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## andreas broqvist (Jun 2, 2009)

Ther are some realy smal Mali bitshes as ther are now. 19-23 Kgs. That is a smal dog. If you want anything smaler the "stoping" power gets kind of usless


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## Cesar A. Flores Dueñas (Oct 1, 2009)

according with what i can read on your dog needs

Select a good Jagd Terrier and a good protection trainer 

A malinois no matter the size, will allways look like a Protection dog

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ifHROzWrchI


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## Jennifer Coulter (Sep 18, 2007)

One of the nice things (to me) about the mal as a working breed vs a show breed is that there IS a lot of variability in size. There is a size for everyone already really, with working drives to boot.


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## Ryan Venables (Sep 15, 2010)

Edward Egan said:


> Personally I'd rather have a dog that deters people from even thinking about screwing with me. I don't really see a value in an undercover protection dog.


I agree fully with this. I'm a former police officer and trained in CPTED (Crime Prevention Through Environmental Design) and the whole point of having a dog (in this instance) that will protect you is so that they will in the event that it happens. But how much better if your dog alone deterred any potential robbery (I think you guys call it mugging in the US).

That being said, I think this is one of the reasons people have Pit Bulls. They look intimidating and for the most part, they're probably all go and no show, unless otherwise trained.

My female Mal is 23 inches and 60 lbs (55 trialling weight - she's like a fighter I cut her down before the weigh in... but all jokes aside) and although she's not PP trained, there is nothing overly menacing about her.

Other, that what I've said, the only thing I could think of for what you'd want an unassuming dog that would take a chunk out of somebody is for the pure satisfaction of knowing "what if...". But hey, why not get a Mal or even a Giant Sch (we have a couple at my club and they hit HARD!) train it so it not only looks but does the part, and hope that the look of the dog will be enough to deter anything. After all, is it not better to not have something happen, than to have something happen and risk you and your dogs life?

JMO


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## Don Turnipseed (Oct 8, 2006)

One of the reasons I like the airedale so much is they are totally unassuming looking and don't wig people out on sight. Most people don't even know what they are. Old timers that have been around them give them a fair birth until I tell them it is OK. The size alone is a deterent.


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## Maren Bell Jones (Jun 7, 2006)

Jim Leon said:


> Hi Ted,
> Dog did protect me once in my automobile. Stopped at a red light, unbeknown to me a man had approached rear passenger side open window. Dog was lying in back seat. I heard commotion, a growl and a man yelping. Dog had bit him on the hand and he was jumping around in the street holding his hand. His buddies at the curb ran off. I'm not trying to say my dog is a manstopper. He only weighs 45 lbs. But he does go all out, and teeth first.
> 
> Giassou Manga.
> Demetris Efthimiou Pantoleon


You can find a 45 lbs Malinois out there no problem. My female is 48 lbs.


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## Don Turnipseed (Oct 8, 2006)

I do think if the cross was nice you may get $2500 for a nice schnauzinois. Other than that, if your schnauzer does the job, breed standard schnauzers with protection in mind. Why add the mal.


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## Gillian Schuler (Apr 12, 2008)

The "Mittel Schnauzer", i.e. Standard Schnauzer never seemed to have the problems that were experienced with the Giant Schnuazers a good few years ago which were mostly health problems. Haven't seen one in this area for a good number of years though, but always liked them.

Sorry, just sounds like a "Bier-Idee". Schnauzers x Malinois?? I like Schnauzers, Dwarf, Standard and Giant but they are not as easy to train as the Shepherds.

However this isn't breeding, just crossing one breed with the other, thank God. 

Why not cross a St. Bernard to a Greyhound? If you were stuck in the snow, you'd be sure of a brandy delivered at high speed \\/ \\/ \\/


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## Jim Leon (Jan 21, 2010)

Thats a good point Don. Trouble is I'm not a breeder and have no such facilities. Someday maybe I will. I was seeking a Giant Sch pup for working purposes some time last year. I looked at a few litters and saw nothing notable. I contacted a very well known Sch'tzhund trainer for advise. He told me Giants just dont have it anymore.He said the last time he bred a litter of true working quality Giants they were monsters and hard to handle. Too much for most people to handle, so Giant breeders, even working dog breeders have some show dog blood in their lines.
From the Giants I've seen in action, my Standard shows more grit and tenacity. I'd love to breed a 50-55 lb. Standard with just the amount of fight and tenacity my dog has. Trouble with that would be finding stock to begin with. Standard breeders dont breed for PP qualities. But they seem to be there just under the surface. Much more in Standards than Giants.


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