# I really messed it up now



## Anne Vaini (Mar 15, 2007)

UGgh!

OK - STILL working on sit to down with front feet planted. Guess what I got now. She moves forward into the down, then scoots her whole body back so her feet are in the same spot they were in the when she was sitting.

I don't even know what to do at this point.


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## Anne Vaini (Mar 15, 2007)

I was interrupted.

I worked with Em at the top of stairs. Perfect. Beautiful. Away from the stairs - nothing.

So I trained her to plant her feet on a marker on the floor. Very nice. 

The hop back is caused by using a food lure. I haven't used a food lure since she started doing it.

If the sequence is sit-stand-down, she's fine. The problem seems to be she hasn't learned to move her hind end backwards.


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## Jeff Oehlsen (Apr 7, 2006)

OK..........WTF are you asking here????? Is it the hopping thing with the food lure obviously done incorrectly??? Or is it the order of the change of positions, for which there are none????


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## Anne Vaini (Mar 15, 2007)

Ugh! I don't know. I do know that it's not looking pretty and that I can't think of another way to go back and retrain her to plant her front feet and pop back her butt.


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## Kadi Thingvall (Jan 22, 2007)

Work the change of positions in the kitchen on linoleum or on a wood floor. Some sort of slick surface. You may need to lure at first, have her in a sit and then move your hand down under her ribcage while telling her to down. The goal is for her to slide her butt backwards, the floor facilitates this. Once she's got the movement down, you will see her start to actually move her butt backwards vs just letting it slide. Fade the lure until she's doing it with you standing up. It doesn't hurt to stand right in front of her so going forward isn't an option.

Then you can move her to a surface with some traction, but go back to luring to encourage the butt movement.


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## Mike Schoonbrood (Mar 27, 2006)

Block her feet from going forward with something. Make a piece of wood on a stand 8" tall, you can stand on it on one side, put the market for the paws on the other side right up against it, teach her she needs to put her paws there and when she downs she wont have any option but to go backwards. Either she will do something stupid, or she will get it.


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## will fernandez (May 17, 2006)

I like to teach this on a small table. Elevation and no where to go


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## Anne Vaini (Mar 15, 2007)

Ooo! Apparently I did not have the right motivation! 

Emma got into the canned cat food and was going totally nuts over it. So I got out the can cat food for training treats and she did it PERFECTLY. I use the command "splat" so it's pretty funny to see her hit the deck when I say it.

Da*n stupid puppies. 

We'll see where this goes. Thanks for the ideas.


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## Hil Harrison (Mar 29, 2006)

Anne Vaini said:


> Ooo! Apparently I did not have the right motivation!
> 
> Emma got into the canned cat food and was going totally nuts over it. So I got out the can cat food for training treats and she did it PERFECTLY. I use the command "splat" so it's pretty funny to see her hit the deck when I say it.
> 
> ...


Over the canned cat food Anne........ I understood ( here anyway)not to give it to dogs. Cats are fine with canned dog food but dogs not with cats food. It can really throw their intestines and stools and make them pretty sick.


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## Bob Scott (Mar 30, 2006)

Hil Harrison said:


> Over the canned cat food Anne........ I understood ( here anyway)not to give it to dogs. Cats are fine with canned dog food but dogs not with cats food. It can really throw their intestines and stools and make them pretty sick.


I've heard the same thing. To much ? in cat food for a dog. 
Connie?!


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## Lynn Cheffins (Jul 11, 2006)

Canned cat food is usually higher in protein than dog food but I don't really see why it would cause any horrid symptoms in dogs. I think it might be a hold over from the "too much protein is bad for dogs and will kill them - so feed them Science Diet cereal" thing. I have used canned cat food to tempt dogs for years and have never had any problems with it. I use good quality cat kibbles for dog training treats as they are very small pieces and the dogs really like it. A large amount of canned cat food might cause runs in a dog that has a really sensitive stomach but that is true in any change in food for that kind of dog.


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## Jeff Oehlsen (Apr 7, 2006)

She is using it as a ****ing treat people. Jeez, solve the training issue and stop it with the stupid food issue. Not like it was raisins and chocolate.

Keep using the cat food, only a tard thinks that scavengers like dogs are gonna be affected.

Part of the reason that dogs have problems is that they are fed the same diet all the time. when they get fed whatever is handy, then it is suprising how little anything affects them..........including catfood.

I do not like the raised platform idea, as I have used it, and it did not transfer for shit on the ground. Dog still moved.


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## Connie Sutherland (Mar 27, 2006)

Lynn Cheffins said:


> Canned cat food is usually higher in protein than dog food but I don't really see why it would cause any horrid symptoms in dogs. I think it might be a hold over from the "too much protein is bad for dogs and will kill them - so feed them Science Diet cereal" thing. I have used canned cat food to tempt dogs for years and have never had any problems with it. I use good quality cat kibbles for dog training treats as they are very small pieces and the dogs really like it. A large amount of canned cat food might cause runs in a dog that has a really sensitive stomach but that is true in any change in food for that kind of dog.


I agree 100%.


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## Connie Sutherland (Mar 27, 2006)

Jeff Oehlsen said:


> only a tard thinks that scavengers like dogs are gonna be affected..


Only a tard can't word that any better.


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## Connie Sutherland (Mar 27, 2006)

Jeff Oehlsen said:


> Part of the reason that dogs have problems is that they are fed the same diet all the time. when they get fed whatever is handy, then it is suprising how little anything affects them..........


True.

VARIETY is as important to dogs as it is to people.

We discuss elsewhere how to create variety even within a kibble diet.

And back to regular programming:

<<< I do not like the raised platform idea, as I have used it, and it did not transfer for shit on the ground. Dog still moved. >>>


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## Anne Vaini (Mar 15, 2007)

> I do not like the raised platform idea, as I have used it, and it did not transfer for shit on the ground. Dog still moved.


I had the same experience training at the top of a staircase and then moving away from the staircase. It didn't work for us.



> Part of the reason that dogs have problems is that they are fed the same diet all the time. when they get fed whatever is handy, then it is suprising how little anything affects them..........including catfood.


Yeah - I had a vet tell me that my dog would get loose stools because I was giving a hamburger as a treat. :???: Apparently MEAT is too high in protein for a meat-eating animal to digest.  

On the cat food, it's high in ash. Which is suppossed to be bad for dogs in high amounts.


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## Jeff Oehlsen (Apr 7, 2006)

I know a curb works pretty good as a start. There is something about being off the ground that does not transfer. I went to the whore depoo and got a length of pvc and made a little half square with a raised center so I can see it from a distance.

I also worked the positions as a "stay" exersize to keep shithead from trying to self reward by changing them himself.


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