# nerve issues and breed



## Julia Norton VMD (Sep 11, 2008)

Hi. I have a very novice question , not meant to be provoking. I'm the owner of the tail chasing shepherd. Now I constantly see mention that breeds such as dobes/rotties have nerve issues and make weak candidates for police work. I have definitely seen a decline in nerve strength in the show line rottie but assumed the German ones were still maintained w good nerve strength. I bought a working line shepherd w the thought that I would get stronger nerves for both obed/family/protection. I'll admit I wasn't looking for a real civil dog since I have kids. However my shepherd would probably be around the block at the first sighn of trouble. I still think my mild show rottie would at least bark whereas the shepherd would remove herself to the next county. A friend who is an obed instructor and top ob competitor(OTCH level dogs) has commented on nerve issues/excessive defense issues on the shepherd she sees incl working line dogs. Interestingly at least from an obed ring stability aspect she thinks the dobes do better. So how many working line shepherds are nerve baskets and how do you get around it when purchasing. My breeder told me my pup had great nerve strength and yet she seemed rather unsure of herself the day I picked her up.Frankly she barks constantly if out at night in the yard and I am quite sure this is a nerve issue. So if you want a strong stable dog for protection/obed/novice sch but don't want bouncing off the walls what would you get. I sure miss the rottie male I had 20 yrs ago. Loved everyone, nothing ever unnerved him and when challenged on a temperament test by a helper nearly dragged me after the guy. If cloning were a little cheaper.


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## todd pavlus (Apr 30, 2008)

Who was the breeder of your dog


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## Jeff Oehlsen (Apr 7, 2006)

PUT THE STUPID DOG DOWN FOR ****S SAKE. 


Give us all a break. It is almost as bad as the dog having a seizure in it's sleep and the dumb asses call it sleep walking.......wait, did you diagnose that dog ????


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## Julia Norton VMD (Sep 11, 2008)

I did look at that video. It was not typical of any seizuring dog I have seen. Perhaps there is some other neuro abnormality. Years ago I saw a terrier that when the weather became cold the dog would walk on its front legs. It was pretty cool to watch. But it appeared to be doing it because the back legs would slowly seize up. However this progressed and the dog was euth. O did not wish to pursue a neuro work-up. Prob neuromuscular degeneration. Maybe the owner gave some psychotropic drugs to it. Did not look like pot so not sure about other possibilities. Have only seen pot cases in the es I work in.


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## Connie Sutherland (Mar 27, 2006)

Julia Norton VMD said:


> I did look at that video. It was not typical of any seizuring dog I have seen. Perhaps there is some other neuro abnormality.


When I posted that the dog needed a neuro workup, the owner emailed me I was "silly."


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## Connie Sutherland (Mar 27, 2006)

I also want to add that I've seen a dog have seizures almost exactly like that, from the paddling to the long moments of standing and slightly swaying, dazed-looking, to the walking into things. The only variation was that she used to wet herself and she did not crash into the wall with that level of violence.

Seizures in dogs happen most often when the dog is lying relaxed or asleep.

If she had had the events more often than two or three times a year, she'd have been PTS. It wasn't diagnosed any better than "non-primary."

There are probably at least half a dozen common canine seizure triggers besides epilepsy, and many more variations on the form the seizure takes.

In fact, it can look like nothing more than a blank look and release of urine, followed by disorientation.


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## Terrasita Cuffie (Jun 8, 2008)

I haven't seen the video but Connie what you describe happens a lot with some of the border collies. 

Terrasita


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## James Degale (Jan 9, 2009)

The simple truth is some dogs will protect some dogs won't, whatever lines they come from. 

You cannot make a dog want to protect its pack, it either does or doesn't. OTT civil training is not recommended.

Maturity is an issue, how old is it. Some DDR dogs take longer to get it all together. WG lines these days generally show less defense more prey. Too much sport breeding. This sounds like the problem to me.

My personal favourite choice for PPD is a mix of Czech and DDR. Some WG lines are great but they have over the top drives sometimes, be warned.


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## Al Curbow (Mar 27, 2006)

Contact Betty there's a litter on the ground right now www.littlerivercanine.com or Jason www.vonsidener.com , instant good puppy! Excellent stand up people and they'll back up their dogs


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## ann schnerre (Aug 24, 2006)

i would also like to know the breeding on your dog--consider it a public service! 

seriously, when buying a puppy, research, research, research!! you should be good at this  and communication with the breeder is essential--but in order to do this effectively, you MUST know what you want/need in a dog, your goals (if any) for the dog. a good breeder will tell you upfront if they have a pup that fits your needs, if not, they will (possibly) refer you to a breeder that has a pup more suited to you and your lifestyle, etc.

certainly, different bloodlines bring different qualities to the table; your job, as a buyer, is to think thru what you need in a dog. and you can certainly walk away from anything that doesn't seem "right". i personally have had a DDRxWG dog and now have a heavily line-bred Czech dog. very different animals--but i love the differences, makes life interesting


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## James Degale (Jan 9, 2009)

Ann

What are the differences?

Which do you prefer for PPD?


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## Michelle Reusser (Mar 29, 2008)

ann freier said:


> i would also like to know the breeding on your dog--consider it a public service!
> 
> seriously, when buying a puppy, research, research, research!! you should be good at this  and communication with the breeder is essential--but in order to do this effectively, you MUST know what you want/need in a dog, your goals (if any) for the dog. a good breeder will tell you upfront if they have a pup that fits your needs, if not, they will (possibly) refer you to a breeder that has a pup more suited to you and your lifestyle, etc.


Totally agree and would also like to know but didn't ask because I'm sure she wont be that forthcoming. 

That the breeder said the pup had strong nerves and you noticed she didn't right out of the crate and did nothing, says volumes. Why would you keep a dog you know is uncorrect, not what you asked or paid good $ for? Now your willing to sink more time and $ inot it? 

This breeder sounds like a crook and the lines need to stop here. I'd just like to know the lines and if the breeder is well kown or just a BYB.


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## ann schnerre (Aug 24, 2006)

James Degale said:


> Ann
> 
> What are the differences?
> 
> Which do you prefer for PPD?


james, the differences are mainly that Brix (the DDRxWG) was much more quiet (!) for one. he was also a more aloof dog socially; he was happy to meet ppl, but not all that interested in them--i was his world, other ppl weren't. he was also a bit slower in maturing (i think, but i'm no expert), ie, he didn't bark at anything until he was 18 mo old. my new pup, at 5 mo old, raises cain at anything that's out of place around here. he is also a person-slut, he wants to get close to and get some hands on him at every opportunity. 

now some of the differences are in how the 2 were raised, some obviously genetic (to me). 

as far as PPD, well, i'm not into it formally. so i don't know. the pup definitely has a lot more defense in him, but Brix was one of those quiet, smart dogs that would come up on you and just bite. Edge will give you a verbal warning first. i think. but again--he's just 5 mo old, so we'll see. meanwhile, we're working on tracking (both are GREAT), socializing, new experiences, etc., now that the weather's a bit better.


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## ann schnerre (Aug 24, 2006)

Michelle Kehoe said:


> Totally agree and would also like to know but didn't ask because I'm sure she wont be that forthcoming.
> 
> That the breeder said the pup had strong nerves and you noticed she didn't right out of the crate and did nothing, says volumes. Why would you keep a dog you know is uncorrect, not what you asked or paid good $ for? Now your willing to sink more time and $ inot it?
> 
> This breeder sounds like a crook and the lines need to stop here. I'd just like to know the lines and if the breeder is well kown or just a BYB.


i'm with you (again). sounds like a combination of, at best, a breeder that doesn't know their dogs/pups, and a newbie buyer. not a good combination.

julie, in the interest of the breed, i really urge you to post your dog's pedigree. as a professional in the business, it will only help you and your clients/patients in the long run. and just to start, here's Edge's pedigree:

www.pedigreedatabase.com/gsd/pedigree/568890.html


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