# The reason to breed...



## Howard Gaines III (Dec 26, 2007)

*Okay folks here's yer sign...And yet another stupid call about Bouvier puppies and this one's from Salisbury, Maryland. Understand I am NOT making this up...here's the call:*

A woman called yesterday and wanted a female Bouvier puppy. I asked what she planned to do with this female as it was from working lines and has lots of drive and she replied," Oh, I want to have one litter of puppies. I think it is very important for kids to see that type of thing. This is why I want a female." As near to her reply as I could keep it! :-o 

At that point my business nature kicked into overdrive and the salesman in me went..."Why don't you take your kid to the local SPCA? There you will find *LOTS* of puppies and examples of the process of K-9 life. In addition, you can schedule an appointment to watch them *KILL OFF* hundreds of fluffy little puppies each week. You will save yourself $1,500 and I won't have to worry about something from *MY* breeding going into the *WRONG* hands!"  

The call ended as quickly as I took it. Do you think she will order one from me?  [-o< [-( 

So why do you breed? To take the endless stupid calls, from mindless folks, who don't have a clue in this world about *K-9 ANYTHING!*


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## Selena van Leeuwen (Mar 29, 2006)

That's almost as stupid as the following conversation on the phone:

"hello, i want a breeding of one of your males, my female is in her 11th day of her heat so it has to be this week" (never talked to the person before)

me: "Which male, what are your females bloodlines, is she healthy, have you x=rays on her?"

"a nice dark male, I don't know bloodlines, she's a pet, x ray ahhh not necessary, just want to show the kids how nice it is to have a litter"

me: " Well thank you for your intrerest, but your female won't be bred by one of my males, she isn't worth it"

We dont use our dogs if females aren't suitable by bloodline or health requirment, people just think well you can make 200 euro, so why don't use your male.
There are enough stud owners who does, we just don't. Have the same high standard for using my male, than for breedings we do.


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## Geoff Empey (Jan 8, 2008)

Howard Gaines III said:


> I asked what she planned to do with this female as it was from working lines and has lots of drive and she replied," Oh, I want to have one litter of puppies. I think it is very important for kids to see that type of thing. This is why I want a female." As near to her reply as I could keep it! :-o


That's funny as at first that is the same reason why my wife would consider breeding our bitch!! 

Thank god I'm here to temper the need to have National Geographic in our living room. 

If and I mean *'IF'* we would breed her it would have to be for the right reasons. Meaning she'd have to pass all OFA tests and then be at least 3 years old to make sure there is no hidden health issues that could crop up. Plus she needs to be titled and not in floofy moronic conformation. For sure titled in protection sport. I'd like to put a herding and some other obedience titles on her. As well as being TT tested at 3 years as well. 

My wife understands why I'd want it that way now. As to me if it doesn't improve the breed's ability to work and add those positive genes into the pool. Why bother???

Conformation people are already neutering many breeds ability to do meaningful work just for the sake of someone's idea of making a purdy dog. Remember that post I put up with the Malinois at Westminster in Feb? Those are 2nd and 3rd generation of floofyness and already they don't look like working Mals. Supposedly these are people that know how to breed .. Imagine Mommy and the kids picking a stud for your female a year or 2 down the line. They'd probably end up with a Chovier or a Boudoodle ... #-o 

Good call Howard for saying "bye bye" and hanging up!


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## Mike Scheiber (Feb 17, 2008)

Never stops amazing me how stupid people are. She said she had kids how the hell did that happen.
That's a shame to.


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## Gerry Grimwood (Apr 2, 2007)

Howard, are Bouv's usually that price for a pup ?


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## Russ Spencer (Jun 2, 2008)

A few years ago...

Hollywood Type: Hi, this ************** (pregnant pause)
Me: How can I help you?
HT: I want one of the puppies you're selling?
Me: What are your plans for the dog?
HT: Huh? I don't know, why, does it matter?
Me: Believe me, it does. Who is going to take care of the dog when you are away?
HT: I don't know yet. Why all the questions? I'm paying good money for the damn puppy.
Me: No you're not. Thank you for your interest, but I'm not interested in placing one of my puppies with you.
HT: FU!!! Click

Guess what...no autograph. Damn!


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## Connie Sutherland (Mar 27, 2006)

Howard Gaines III said:


> " Oh, I want to have one litter of puppies. I think it is very important for kids to see that type of thing. This is why I want a female."


Yes. The miracle of birth. I too want to tell every single one of them to make sure to complete this with their kids seeing the miracle of death as it comes to pass every day in every shelter.


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## ann schnerre (Aug 24, 2006)

heck, i used to have to explaiin to my baby girl that every pet animal we had was to be spayed/nuetered, regardless that SHE wanted to see the "miracle of birth". fortunately, after participating in a few cow's calving, she's over it. lol


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## Mike Schoonbrood (Mar 27, 2006)

Last year:

"I want to breed one litter so it will make her more protective. Females get more protective after having a litter right?"

and

"I can sell black and red show line puppies all day long, everybody wants a black and red show line." (said while watching the worlds biggest piece of shit nervebag fearbiter showline trying to figure out what to do with the worlds softest pansy of a female showline, belonging to the person who made the first statement above.) Neither dog had x-rays far as I knew, not that it should matter. When a dog craps all over the floor because I try to grab him to get him into the kennel, or sits at the back of the kennel cowering and growling, I would say that rules him out as a stud.

I told someone that Lyka was in heat, he asked me if I was gonna breed her. I told him no, he told me that I should spay her then...

A guy here in Belgium told me he was expecting a litter from his JRT bitch, because she's in the back yard, in heat, and lots of dogs walk by the house n he's at work (the dog wasn't pregnant at the time of this statement far as anyone knew). Sure 'nuff a while later he had a litter of pups to an unknown sire. They just thought it was cute......


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## Howard Gaines III (Dec 26, 2007)

Gerry Grimwood said:


> Howard, are Bouv's usually that price for a pup ?


Gerry my Breeder's pick is $1,500, but the litter was so balanced that nothing was over the top in uniqueness of drive. Full ownership on this litter is $1,300 m/f. Next time it might go to $1,500. Spay/neuter is $1,000 but I try and stay away from that as the lines are too good to not reproduce in a SOUND manner. :mrgreen:


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## Howard Gaines III (Dec 26, 2007)

*And in ******* Land it only gets better..*.

" I'm on a fixed income and sell puppies for $xx. to help pay my bills." Oh, so "Fluffy" is bringing home the bacon while your big a$$ is watching TV and the kids are doing porn in the basement. Nice! I can tell you of loads of folks who breed mis-matched lines and breeds, "designer breeds", and those "GREAT guard dogs" and ones that are "big bone beauties." Since when was big boned beauties an AKC or other standard for the GSD or GSN? 

When your price is high then the village fools come out and look at possible dollar signs for their junk. I love to call and ask, "So, tell me about your lines?" Typical Breeder: "Oh they are tough shepherds and are *full blooded*." Like they will sell a dog with half the amount of blood at a discounted rate! :-$ 

"The father is a police dog and the mother is nasty..." OK, so where are they from? "You have to breed them mean." Oh, there is a "special" way to put mean into them..."You don't understand how tough my dogs are, nobdy comes around!" [-X 

Makes me want to look at some folks and go aaaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!  [-X


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## Ashley Hiebing (Apr 6, 2008)

I'm not a breeder but I have one funny/sad story from a high school kid who had pit bulls. Apparently they were "real mean," which is a great reason to breed them, right? Duh, everyone knows pit bulls make the best guard dogs.

When the bitch got pregnant, this high school kid and her friend were discussing how much they should sell the pups for:
"What color is the nose?"
"Red nose."
"Aw damn, that's good! Sell 'em for $500!"

Like "red nose pit" means anything anymore. They were probably fighting the dogs but I could never prove it.


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## Gillian Schuler (Apr 12, 2008)

Huh?? I haven't "got that"


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## Bob Scott (Mar 30, 2006)

When I wa a kid my dad bred my GSD/Collie to my uncle's Collie. He took me along for the breeding and also told me to watch the birth of the pups when the time came. No explinations. No comments from him at all. 
I thought "WTF"! He's crazier then I thought he was. Found out yrs later that this was my sex education. 
I thought I got that watching dogs "push" one another across the school yard. At least that got lots of comments and explinations. Watching the nuns freaking out was even more interesting. :grin:


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## Lynsey Fuegner (Apr 11, 2007)

I had an interesting email, out of the blue, of someone requesting to breed her SAR GSD to my young dog...first, he's just now 6 months old :-s (no OFA yet, no titles, nothing), second the bitch is a half sister out of the same father...needless to say we politely declined.


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## Jennifer Marshall (Dec 13, 2007)

I find it excruciating when people think that the color of the dog makes it a different breed. Such as brindle, for example. Spelled "brendal" of course. "100% pure brendal pits, 2 black and whites, 1 brown, 1 all white" ....

"Amstaff puppies for sale, mom is Razors Edge, dad is American Bulldog..."

People breed and sell all sorts of nonsense around here. About the only useful worth looking into dogs in the Valley are Anatolian/Pyr and Anatolian/Maremma crosses from actual livestock guarding dogs used for the goats and sheep to protect from cougars, bear, coyotes, stray dogs, wolves, and stupid people. The dogs are very good at their jobs and they only breed to create more livestock guardians, all the pups are imprinted on goats or sheep. Ah and the dogs that are not advertised are often the best, working ranch dogs (BCs and ACDs) Most everything else is just plain sad. 

"YorBichoMaltChiPoo puppies for sale!" or "Gorgeous PuglePooChiZsuApso Terrier for stud"

The word "Rare" is also very popular.

When I had Cajun (AB) a lady at a pet store carrying this sad little mop of a dog approached me and asked if my dog was neutered. I said no... she said "Good! Would you be interested in breeding him to my female, here?" the little thing was about 20 pounds, looked ancient, smelled bad. I said no and walked away. Cajun was only 6 months old at the time.


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## Maren Bell Jones (Jun 7, 2006)

Just cause I'm a masochist, I looked at the pets classified in the newspaper. Here's a random sampling:
_
ACA registered Shih Tzu puppies, first shots and home raised. Call 573-682-1471

_ACA? Oh good, a real reputable registry there.

_ American Pitbull Terrier male. 1 yr old. ADBA Registered, breedable. $250/offer 573-289-9108

_Breedable? Hmmm, pretty sure a 1 year old male is not eligible for OFA, not to mention they're too young at that age to be competing in dog sports that would prove its worth. Did I mention every pit bull that comes into the local shelter is automatically killed? Because there's definitely a shortage of pit bulls in this country that need good homes.  

_Beautiful white woolly Siberian husky Puppies with Ice Blue Eyes. Nurtured loving pups sold to good homes only. 217-440-6126. $550.00

_Oh yes, let's breed a husky with a coat that is not desired by the standard due to problems with ice and snow accumulating on it.

_ Black Lab Puppies. Black, 9wks old-- Beautiful. 660-882-3976 www.whisperinghillskennels.net

Schnoodles, Chiffons, Dachshunds 660-882-3976. See their pics at www.whisperinghillskennels.net

_Hmmm...big "variety" of breeds and designer mutts? I smell puppy mill! Well, it is Missouri after all.

_ Pit Bull puppies. Alligator Eyes w/Razors Edge bloodline. Gorilla Head. All different colors! $200, 875-8586 234-3391

_Alligator eyes? WTH is that? Gorilla head? Why don't they just stick with English bulldogs? Those are already ruined sufficiently.

_ Yorkie mix, adorable, will be small, male & female, all shots. HURRY! WONT LAST! $250-$275. 823-9163

_Yeah, and neither will all the other trendy little mixes down at the shelter.


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## Greg Williams (Aug 5, 2007)

Wow! I'm fortunate enough to NOT get those crazy calls! Yet, anyway! The worst I've gotten was internet scam artists.
They start by sending an email something to the effect of, "I am interested in your puppys". To which I reply, "How many did you want?"
Following email goes something like, "I would like one puppies. I will send you a check for $2500 hundred dollars to cover the price of puppies ($600-$800). The rest you will give to my shipping agent when he arrives." To which I reply, send the check." Once the check arrives I take it to the ost office, they tell me it's bogus and start an investigation for mail fraud. 
I get atleast one of these scam artists with every litter I advertise.


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## Anne Vaini (Mar 15, 2007)

I fostered an extremely stunted, nearly dead chi mix that had been severely neglected. The day I (finally) got the dog out, she had not been out of her crate, had food or water in 2.5 - almost 3 days.

The dog should have been 10 - 15 pounds, but had never had enough food or water and weighed under 2 pounds. In the first couple days, I had her everywhere with me to be able to give her the special diet every hour or so.

*People practically flocked to want to breed to this "teacup" dog that was stunted, starved and nearly dead.* Facts were completely lost on these morons.

Happy ending: Dog was an emotional support dog for a woman dying of cancer and got an awesome home with a relative of the woman, is spayed and weighs a healthy (for her) 2 pounds.

People are stupid.


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## Greg Leavitt (Aug 31, 2006)

The reason to breed Duh Thats an easy one to make money. LOL

had a call last week 
Guy: I am intereted in the female Chloe on your website can you tell me about her
Me; yes she is inster info here
Him: I have been looking at sch clubs i am in san diego I talked to a guy in ramona he was nice
Me; yes I know who that is 
Him: so I want the female
We discuss price and
Him: well I want to pay for her and for you to board her till she comes into heat and for a stud fee to one of your males
Me: well that would be alot in boarding since she i repeat again is only 6 mons
Him: ya I want her sent here pregnant
Me: she is too young
Him: she cants get pregnant at 7 months?
Me: she wont be getting pregnant and she wont be going to you thanks
him: your an a$$Hold you have to sell her to me I have the money
Me: no thanks I appreciate your interest Goodbye
Him screaming FU FU FU
me CLICK


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## Terry Fisk (Jul 26, 2007)

On the flip side (notes from some of my customers):

So, he's officially, MACH3 ADCH NATCH ATCH Firecreek's Blue Flame CD (along with some Performance USDAA titles that I don't know how to abbreviate!). Pretty darn cool for my little old man! Thanks again for entrusting me with this little guy all those years ago. He has FAR exceeded all my expectations and continues to amaze me at 9 1/2 years young! (Note: he now has a MACH4 and still competing at 11 years of age.)

We in our family are celebrating the 9th birthday of our favorite son Firecreek's Jake Orion, C-ATCH !!! Thank you for bringing him into our lives 

Thought you could use a bit of good news. Rhi & I finished her ADCH! Firecreek's Outta My Dreams, ADCH, LAA Bronze, MX, MXJ, NF. Thanks for letting us share our lives with this wonderful girl.

Thought you would like some updates on Maverick for your website: 
ATCH - March 2007
2006 USDAA Championships - Veterans 22" All Around winner
2005 USDAA Championships - 3rd Place Veteran's Grand Prix 22"
Firecreek's Outta This World, ADCH, Gold Medal PIII Std, ATCH, MX, MXJ.2005 USDAA Grand Prix 3rd place 22" Veterans, 2006 USDAA Championships - Veterans 22" All Around winner


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## Howard Gaines III (Dec 26, 2007)

Greg Williams said:


> Wow! I'm fortunate enough to NOT get those crazy calls! Yet, anyway! The worst I've gotten was internet scam artists.
> They start by sending an email something to the effect of, "I am interested in your puppys". To which I reply, "How many did you want?"
> Following email goes something like, "I would like one puppies. I will send you a check for $2500 hundred dollars to cover the price of puppies ($600-$800). The rest you will give to my shipping agent when he arrives." To which I reply, send the check." Once the check arrives I take it to the ost office, they tell me it's bogus and start an investigation for mail fraud.
> I get atleast one of these scam artists with every litter I advertise.


Greg I got one of these from a "lady" in Baltimore, Maryland. Same deal, I sent her an e-mail back wishing her much success some place else. Small Bouvs, Big Bouvs, but no Bouvs for her! :mrgreen: =D>


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## Greg Leavitt (Aug 31, 2006)

A quick way I have found to spot those nigerian check scams is they like t call the pup and item as in I would like very much tobuy for item and I am an englishman living in nepal, I want item for birthday pressnt my shipper will take care


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## Trish Campbell (Nov 28, 2006)

I just had someone ask me at work how much of a stud fee they should charge for their 5 month old Great Pyraneas...grrrr!

Unfortunately, as a breeder, we all get those lovely types of calls. Problem is that person will find someone to get a dog from. Just won't be me


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## Trish Campbell (Nov 28, 2006)

Terry Fisk said:


> On the flip side (notes from some of my customers):
> 
> So, he's officially, MACH3 ADCH NATCH ATCH Firecreek's Blue Flame CD (along with some Performance USDAA titles that I don't know how to abbreviate!). Pretty darn cool for my little old man! Thanks again for entrusting me with this little guy all those years ago. He has FAR exceeded all my expectations and continues to amaze me at 9 1/2 years young! (Note: he now has a MACH4 and still competing at 11 years of age.)
> 
> Now those emails do make it worth all the work


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