# Advice on starting tracking with 18 month old? (IPO)



## Angel Leandres (Apr 23, 2012)

Hey everyone,

Looking for some advice for starting tracking (IPO style) with my 18 month old male. We did foundation work as a puppy, but nothing since. Been having a very difficult time locating a club to work with in my area, so had to put a hold on it. I do not want to delay any longer, would really like to get started again.

Anyone have any advice on foundation work I can start with? Resources for advice/guidance on foundation work? Advice on high value training food?

We are ready for his BH, started in protection, just need to get my butt in gear with tracking. I've had to do all the obedience work entirely on my own, finally have a club level helper for protection.

Thank you kindly.


----------



## Bob Scott (Mar 30, 2006)

The book 'Tracking From The Beginning" by Gary Patterson is pretty good. 

Joanne Flemming-Plumb has a couple of excellent DVS on tracking.


----------



## Christopher Smith (Jun 20, 2008)

Angel Leandres said:


> Hey everyone,
> 
> Looking for some advice for starting tracking (IPO style) with my 18 month old male. We did foundation work as a puppy, but nothing since. Been having a very difficult time locating a club to work with in my area, so had to put a hold on it. I do not want to delay any longer, would really like to get started again.
> 
> ...


Every dog is different and the foundations should be different for each dog. Have you ever laid a track and let the dog run it? If you do, you can put together a better program. IMO, doing it from a book or video is like painting by numbers. It makes a recognizable image, but you might not want to hang it up in your dinning room. 

Lay a 400-500 pace track in *very easy conditions*, mostly straight, with a couple of gentle turns, no food, and see what he does. Bring him to the start and let him off of the leash and let him work. Come back and describe it or show a video.


----------



## Robley Smith (Apr 20, 2012)

Christopher Smith said:


> Lay a 400-500 pace track in *very easy conditions*, mostly straight, with a couple of gentle turns, no food, and see what he does. Bring him to the start and let him off of the leash and let him work. Come back and describe it or show a video.


 
Wow! I am interested to hear what you can learn from that test of a basically untrained (in tracking) dog. Other than easy conditions, it sounds very hard. I assume a pup/dog that took off down the track would be a great response, how often does that happen? It would never have occurred to me to try something like that before training.


----------



## Thomas Barriano (Mar 27, 2006)

Robley Smith said:


> Wow! I am interested to hear what you can learn from that test of a basically untrained (in tracking) dog. Other than easy conditions, it sounds very hard. I assume a pup/dog that took off down the track would be a great response, how often does that happen? It would never have occurred to me to try something like that before training.


Robley

It sounds hard because you underestimate how sensitive a dogs nose is and how much they rely on their nose to explore the world around them. Take your dog to an empty field with no track and see how much he uses his nose. In Christophers example the track should be the freshest scent out there and will have the owners scent which should attract the dog. 
The only thing I'd be concerned about is limiting the other environmental distractions and the handler not interfering or influencing too much. I kind of think most tracking problems come from not trusting the dog to do what he does naturally.


----------



## Christopher Smith (Jun 20, 2008)

Robley Smith said:


> Wow! I am interested to hear what you can learn from that test of a basically untrained (in tracking) dog.


You learn what the dog does naturally. IMO, it's far easier to shape the behaviors the dog has naturally into what is need for the sport than it is to create everything from scratch. Often you try to create everything from scratch you end up covering up the dog's natural abilities. 





> Other than easy conditions, it sounds very hard. I assume a pup/dog that took off down the track would be a great response, how often does that happen?


It's not hard at all because this is not a test, it's just for observation. It's impossible for the dog to do anything wrong. So the dog taking off down the track is simply shows me that the dog has drive for the track. But that is just a small part of it. I want to see the other reactions the dog as on the track too. How does he take the corners? How does he deal with distractions? How much tenacity does the dog have to come back to the track when he gets lost?

BTW, most puppies will follow a track like this very easily before they are around 12 weeks old. And some will even retrieve the articles too. 






> It would never have occurred to me to try something like that before training.


You gotta' go out and play around with dogs. We get so uptight about ruining our dogs sometimes that we forget that trying stuff and creativity is part of the process. It gives you different perspectives on how the dog thinks.


----------



## Peta Het (Feb 13, 2011)

Schutzhund Village has a great article about starting tracking. I found it very helpful, you might too.
http://www.schutzhundvillage.com/nose1.html


----------



## Louise Jollyman (Jun 2, 2009)

You could try running a similar type track to what he had at his foundation to see how much he remembers. This page describes some of the basics - http://www.schutzhund-training.com/tracking.html

I have seen some video recently of folks doing circle tracks with their young dogs, may try that with mine soon - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tVrzz3vOmG8


----------



## Terrasita Cuffie (Jun 8, 2008)

Christopher Smith said:


> Every dog is different and the foundations should be different for each dog. Have you ever laid a track and let the dog run it? If you do, you can put together a better program. IMO, doing it from a book or video is like painting by numbers. It makes a recognizable image, but you might not want to hang it up in your dinning room.
> 
> Lay a 400-500 pace track in *very easy conditions*, mostly straight, with a couple of gentle turns, no food, and see what he does. Bring him to the start and let him off of the leash and let him work. Come back and describe it or show a video.


I suggested this to a couple of tracking friends a couple of months ago and they thought I was crazy. Since the dog is trained, I figured it would be a good way for me to learn how to read her. I hadn't thought about the number of paces, but since I was laying the track, I could take her to the start, give her the command and watch how she did it. Their response was that I had to put a line on her and maintain line tension. Why? If it were just a sorta easy diagnostic track, does it matter how long I age it? This dog has a VST.

T


----------



## Alison Grubb (Nov 18, 2009)

Christopher Smith said:


> Every dog is different and the foundations should be different for each dog. Have you ever laid a track and let the dog run it? If you do, you can put together a better program. IMO, doing it from a book or video is like painting by numbers. It makes a recognizable image, but you might not want to hang it up in your dinning room.
> 
> Lay a 400-500 pace track in *very easy conditions*, mostly straight, with a couple of gentle turns, no food, and see what he does. Bring him to the start and let him off of the leash and let him work. Come back and describe it or show a video.


This is reminiscent of what I was told by a friend and trainer I was working with to develop my male's tracking last year. I went out thinking that I was gonna do all this step-by-step slow work for weeks on end. My buddy pretty much nixed that from the get-go. To date, it's the best experience I have had with tracking - due in no small part to my ability to just be excited by watching my dog do this kind of thing on his own.


----------



## Britney Pelletier (Mar 5, 2009)

Christopher Smith said:


> Every dog is different and the foundations should be different for each dog. Have you ever laid a track and let the dog run it? If you do, you can put together a better program. IMO, doing it from a book or video is like painting by numbers. It makes a recognizable image, but you might not want to hang it up in your dinning room.


Words to live by. Amen.


----------



## Gillian Schuler (Apr 12, 2008)

I let my 4-5 month old pup work out a fresh track. I just walked up to it with him and he stuck his nose down and sniffed out the 20 paces until he found his reward - minced meat at the end of it. I didn't say anything or motivate him.

Had he not paid any attention to the track, I would have walked past it - no harm done - wait until another day - the crows could have a feast!

I am not in favour of too long tracks, even for older starters. The mistake quota can be higher. A short track, obviously a bit longer than the above will give you the answer you need - can he track or not without my influence and that is a good guideline - you know he can track and it's up to you to let him!!!

It is definitely good to read about how a dog tracks, weather conditions (on the ground), heat, wind, etc. etc. but watching the dog track will help you to understand the a written advice afterwards.

I remember reading about square searching before I'd watched it or done it. It was hard to envisage.


----------



## Christopher Smith (Jun 20, 2008)

Terrasita Cuffie said:


> Their response was that I had to put a line on her and maintain line tension. Why? If it were just a sorta easy diagnostic track, does it matter how long I age it? This dog has a VST.
> 
> T


I have no idea why they insist on line tension . Ask them and let me know. Personally I use line tension to communicate with the dog during training.

I don't think age matters too much. The track just needs to be within the dog's abilities.


----------



## Gillian Schuler (Apr 12, 2008)

Why would you want line tension? 

OK, if it is kept constant, it is paramount to loose line. 

Nowadays over here we use loose line as it is less likely to influence the dog.

I have an open mind, as ever!!


----------



## Christopher Smith (Jun 20, 2008)

Gillian Schuler said:


> Why would you want line tension?


Leash tension gives dogs reassurance and support and this equates to confidence on the track. I train my dog that if the leash is tight he's doing a good job. If the leash is slack he is screwing up. This way all of my interaction comes from the leash and I am removed from the picture. This is a way of avoiding the classic dog coming back to the handler and other stuff like that. In the end the only time I want my dog to pay any attention to me on the track is when I allow him to search.




> Nowadays over here we use loose line as it is less likely to influence the dog.


Where is "over here"? Who is "we"?


----------



## Christopher Smith (Jun 20, 2008)

Gillian Schuler said:


> I am not in favour of too long tracks, even for older starters. The mistake quota can be higher.


My experience is the opposite. When most dogs start a track they are more hectic and distracted. But as the track goes on they settle in and start thinking and concentrating.

A track without mistakes is a masturbation track. It makes you feel good, but it's not productive. Dogs learn from their mistakes. NO MISTAKES = NO LEARNING


----------



## Terrasita Cuffie (Jun 8, 2008)

Gillian Schuler said:


> Why would you want line tension?
> 
> OK, if it is kept constant, it is paramount to loose line.
> 
> ...


That's what I thought--loose line, don't screw up and miscommunicate to the dog. Maybe they need drive building of some sort. I was saying I'd opt for loose or no line and they thought I was mad as a hatter. I need to sit down with the rules regarding the line. I vaguely remember something about the distance behind the dog.

T


----------



## Terrasita Cuffie (Jun 8, 2008)

Christopher Smith said:


> Leash tension gives dogs reassurance and support and this equates to confidence on the track. I train my dog that if the leash is tight he's doing a good job. If the leash is slack he is screwing up. This way all of my interaction comes from the leash and I am removed from the picture. This is a way of avoiding the classic dog coming back to the handler and other stuff like that. In the end the only time I want my dog to pay any attention to me on the track is when I allow him to search.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I would think it would be the exact opposite. What else do you do to train him that a loose line means a mistake? After you've indicated the mistake, how do you get the dog back on track?

T


----------



## Christopher Smith (Jun 20, 2008)

Terrasita Cuffie said:


> What else do you do to train him that a loose line means a mistake?


 Nothing. It's just information to the dog. I'm telling the dog to be careful. Pay attention cause there is a article, puzzle or corner ahead. 




> After you've indicated the mistake, how do you get the dog back on track?


 I don't. It's the dog's job to get back on the track. If the dog won't go back to the track on his own I have to go back and retrain some stuff.


----------



## Dave Colborn (Mar 25, 2009)

Christopher Smith said:


> Lay a 400-500 pace track in *very easy conditions*, mostly straight, with a couple of gentle turns, no food, and see what he does. Bring him to the start and let him off of the leash and let him work. Come back and describe it or show a video.


Have you ever laid the track similar to this with a young dog and had someone else start your dog? I'd done this with trailing dogs (hiding for your own beginner dog) and it's amazing to see what a lot of dogs have naturally in finding their own handler. Not nose to the ground footstep tracking, but trailing fast to find mom or dad, good negatives on corners (showing that they've lost the track) and then natural ability to work it out.


----------



## Gillian Schuler (Apr 12, 2008)

Christopher Smith said:


> Leash tension gives dogs reassurance and support and this equates to confidence on the track. I train my dog that if the leash is tight he's doing a good job. If the leash is slack he is screwing up. This way all of my interaction comes from the leash and I am removed from the picture. This is a way of avoiding the classic dog coming back to the handler and other stuff like that. In the end the only time I want my dog to pay any attention to me on the track is when I allow him to search.
> 
> At the beginning, taut line tension can be good for "unwilling to "don't care" seekers.
> 
> Why should your dog pay attention to you on the track, unless he is straying too far from it? He has a far better nose than you do - although the thought of you on hands and knees sniffing out the track would be something to behold.


----------



## Gillian Schuler (Apr 12, 2008)

Christopher Smith said:


> Leash tension gives dogs reassurance and support and this equates to confidence on the track. I train my dog that if the leash is tight he's doing a good job. If the leash is slack he is screwing up. This way all of my interaction comes from the leash and I am removed from the picture. This is a way of avoiding the classic dog coming back to the handler and other stuff like that. In the end the only time I want my dog to pay any attention to me on the track is when I allow him to search.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


"Where" is Switzerland.

"We" is not important. Erwin Patzen many time Europe and World Champion in tracking with Aly vom Hause Patzen, Ajax Haus Hartmann. etc.

Erwin gives extremely good seminars which are followed by the numerous clubs. 

Switzerland has a very good reputation for excelling tracking results.


----------



## Gillian Schuler (Apr 12, 2008)

Christopher Smith said:


> My experience is the opposite. When most dogs start a track they are more hectic and distracted. But as the track goes on they settle in and start thinking and concentrating.
> 
> A track without mistakes is a masturbation track. It makes you feel good, but it's not productive. Dogs learn from their mistakes. NO MISTAKES = NO LEARNING


What's masturbation got to do with it?? It may make you feel good but speak for yourself..........

I thought the idea was how to *start *tracking with an 18 month old dog? It doesn't need a long track to see whether the dog has a natural aptitude for tracking. A long track will not bring any more information than a shorter one. You just need to see how the dog takes to the track to help you devise the tracking programme.


----------



## Britney Pelletier (Mar 5, 2009)

Christopher Smith said:


> My experience is the opposite. When most dogs start a track they are more hectic and distracted. But as the track goes on they settle in and start thinking and concentrating.


This has been my experience as well.. I have even laid plenty of "starter" tracks to let my dogs blow off some steam before executing a longer track that might involve more problem solving. 

My 14 month old is a complete and utter, hectic mental case while tracking.. he is very driven for the track, but he does not yet settle in and REALLY start concentrating until after at least the first 100 paces. The best thing I found that I could do, short of just putting him up and not tracking him until he was older, was to just start laying him very long tracks. This really seems to have helped and has allowed us to start making some progress in the overall consistency of his tracking behavior.


----------



## Christopher Smith (Jun 20, 2008)

Dave Colborn said:


> Have you ever laid the track similar to this with a young dog and had someone else start your dog? I'd done this with trailing dogs (hiding for your own beginner dog) and it's amazing to see what a lot of dogs have naturally in finding their own handler. Not nose to the ground footstep tracking, but trailing fast to find mom or dad, good negatives on corners (showing that they've lost the track) and then natural ability to work it out.


Hell yeah I've done it! Big fun. But it will F up an IPO dog in a hurry. :lol:


----------



## Dave Colborn (Mar 25, 2009)

Christopher Smith said:


> Hell yeah I've done it! Big fun. But it will F up an IPO dog in a hurry. :lol:


 
I was just speaking in terms of the test. I hear ya. It's fun untraining an IPO footstep tracking dog making it a police dog.


----------



## Christopher Smith (Jun 20, 2008)

Gillian Schuler said:


> "Where" is Switzerland.
> 
> "We" is not important. Erwin Patzen many time Europe and World Champion in tracking with Aly vom Hause Patzen, Ajax Haus Hartmann. etc.
> 
> ...


I'm sure he's very good and I would love to train with him. But what he does is not the gospel. Other people have other ideas and they are very successful too. In fact many are more successful. Including the guy who taught me about using leash pressure. 

Also there is no "what we do" in Switzerland. The Swiss are diverse in thought and I find it impossible that everyone in the country tracks with a slack line.


----------



## Bob Scott (Mar 30, 2006)

In Schutzhund competition a tight line will cost points. It's supposed to be about the dog doing the tracking. If it still needs direction with a tight lead at trial time it just may not be ready. If I don't know where the track is the last thing I want to do is direct the dog. Trust your dog!
If there are no intentions for trialing then is all what the handler wants and expects. ;-)


----------



## Christopher Smith (Jun 20, 2008)

Bob Scott said:


> In Schutzhund competition a tight line will cost points.


No true.


----------



## susan tuck (Mar 28, 2006)

Bob Scott said:


> In Schutzhund competition a tight line will cost points. It's supposed to be about the dog doing the tracking. If it still needs direction with a tight lead at trial time it just may not be ready. If I don't know where the track is the last thing I want to do is direct the dog. Trust your dog!
> If there are no intentions for trialing then is all what the handler wants and expects. ;-)


I always track with a taunt line, as do all of my mentors, we prefer a dog who is tracking in drive, almost pulling us down the track, we sort of lean back as the dog pulls forward, is the best way I can think to describe it, but it's not hectic at all, and I have never heard anyone criticized or losing points for tracking with a tight line.


----------



## Terrasita Cuffie (Jun 8, 2008)

Object reflex or drive? Whose the guy that did the FH off lead--Wallace Payne? Is that dog in any less drive? It woud be easier if I didn't have to worry about leash mechanics.

T


----------



## Terrasita Cuffie (Jun 8, 2008)

So for the new IPO, from the DVG page it says that its the handler's choice to track with or without a line. It also states you can have the line slack as long as you continue to hold it.

T


----------



## susan tuck (Mar 28, 2006)

Terrasita Cuffie said:


> Object reflex or drive? Whose the guy that did the FH off lead--Wallace Payne? Is that dog in any less drive? It woud be easier if I didn't have to worry about leash mechanics.
> 
> T


Wallace Payne and his dog Pedro scored 99 off lead and I believe it was an FH championship. I haven't seen the video in years but as I recall the dog looked to be working evenly and he looked intense, and in drive.

I prefer to track with a taunt line and I like a dog who tracks in drive. Taunt leash, to no leash, both have always been allowed, neither is considered superior to the other, or worth more points than the other. It's a matter of personal choice, and taking into account what's best for that particular dog. I'm not talking about using oppositional reflex, if that's what you're asking, it's contact and feel, similar to a riders hands on the reins.


----------



## Terrasita Cuffie (Jun 8, 2008)

susan tuck said:


> Wallace Payne and his dog Pedro scored 99 off lead and I believe it was an FH championship. I haven't seen the video in years but as I recall the dog looked to be working evenly and he looked intense, and in drive.
> 
> I prefer to track with a taunt line and I like a dog who tracks in drive. Taunt leash, to no leash, both have always been allowed, neither is considered superior to the other, or worth more points than the other. It's a matter of personal choice, and taking into account what's best for that particular dog. I'm not talking about using oppositional reflex, if that's what you're asking, it's contact and feel, similar to a riders hands on the reins.


The leash thing is just me not wanting to fool with it. Pulling out ahead is this dog's default which drove me crazy in other walks of life. But she damn near began life with tracking. This breeder puts a TD on her dogs usually at about a year old and she had the VST around Age 2. Looks like I have to maintain a 20 foot distance behind her. Looking at the rules, Sch would be easer to deal with. The dog can pass without indicating whereas in AKC she has to get all of the articles. 



T


----------



## Christopher Smith (Jun 20, 2008)

Terrasita Cuffie said:


> Looking at the rules, Sch would be easer to deal with. The dog can pass without indicating whereas in AKC she has to get all of the articles.


That's not true either. In IPO the dog MUST indicate at least one article.


----------



## Thomas Barriano (Mar 27, 2006)

Christopher Smith said:


> That's not true either. In IPO the dog MUST indicate at least one article.


Where do you get that from? I know they changed the points so you can only get a satisfactory rating if you miss the articles, but I'm pretty sure you can still pass.


----------



## Gillian Schuler (Apr 12, 2008)

Christopher Smith said:


> Hell yeah I've done it! Big fun. But it will F up an IPO dog in a hurry. :lol:


Wherever do these narrow-minded out-dated ideas come from :roll:

Our earlier National Schuthund trials consisted of a search where the handler walked out about 100 paces and then 50 odd paces to the right or the left and deposited a dumbbedl. Returned next to the track and gave the dog commando to search. The dogs raced out but then had to use their noses and returned with the dumbell.

In training we also used to let the dog watch his handler disaappear for a few seconds. Then when the handler was hidden, the dog was let loose to seek it's handler out. It's still a valid exercise for some.

None, but none of these exercises hindered the dogs to go on training for Schutzhund and also IPO.

Nothing will F up a dog who has the "nose" to "nose" apart from a "stick-in-the-mud-handler".


----------



## Gillian Schuler (Apr 12, 2008)

Christopher Smith said:


> I'm sure he's very good and I would love to train with him. But what he does is not the gospel. Other people have other ideas and they are very successful too. In fact many are more successful. Including the guy who taught me about using leash pressure.
> 
> Also there is no "what we do" in Switzerland. The Swiss are diverse in thought and I find it impossible that everyone in the country tracks with a slack line.


 
Jesus, you are bigotted!! Erwin Patzen has been more than once World and European Champion with more than one of his dogs and you say you are sure he is "good" and you would love to train with him but what he does is not gospel.

What do you do that is "gospel"??? When you get to his standard, we can discuss it again.

I am about to retire from this forum. I am not used to defending World Champions to assuage the "would be" handlers.

I really love this forum - I find the warmth and chitchat amongst the forum members excellent.

In Europe people don't spend so much time of the Net - ever wondered why??

Live on and do your own thing.


----------



## Christopher Smith (Jun 20, 2008)

Yeah...whatever.


----------



## Gillian Schuler (Apr 12, 2008)

Terrifc answer - shows someone who cannot defend his tracking prowess and therefore knows when he is defeated.

I'm sorry, we used to have good conversations but in tracking you are lacking!!


----------



## Gillian Schuler (Apr 12, 2008)

Terrasita Cuffie said:


> So for the new IPO, from the DVG page it says that its the handler's choice to track with or without a line. It also states you can have the line slack as long as you continue to hold it.
> 
> T


It was *always* possible to track without a line. However, I do know that some handlers resorted to this as they had put too much pressure on their dogs, making them unsure, hence the switch over to "no line".

The off-line would only pose for me a problem when teaching the pup / young dog to track, i.e. how would I regulate his speed? How would corrections take place? Or maybe handlers start off like this and later change to "no line".


----------



## Britney Pelletier (Mar 5, 2009)

susan tuck said:


> I always track with a taunt line, as do all of my mentors, we prefer a dog who is tracking in drive, almost pulling us down the track, we sort of lean back as the dog pulls forward, is the best way I can think to describe it, but it's not hectic at all, and I have never heard anyone criticized or losing points for tracking with a tight line.


Ditto! 

also, I just trialed my dog last weekend and the judge never mentioned my taught line once.. what he DID mention was my dog's drive and intensity for the track


----------



## Steve Burger (Jan 2, 2009)

oops double post after edit..


----------



## Steve Burger (Jan 2, 2009)

Gillian Schuler said:


> It was *always* possible to track without a line. However, I do know that some handlers resorted to this as they had put too much pressure on their dogs, making them unsure, hence the switch over to "no line".
> 
> The off-line would only pose for me a problem when teaching the pup / young dog to track, i.e. how would I regulate his speed? How would corrections take place? Or maybe handlers start off like this and later change to "no line".


In the beginning we teach tracking by using circles and dropping the leash. We then graduate to serpentine tracks but with light tension on the lead. The dog then will tend to self regulate the speed. When it is not straight line tracking the dog tends to search with intensity but not speed. We don't really do much in the way of corrections until after articles are introduced.


----------



## Terrasita Cuffie (Jun 8, 2008)

Steve Burger said:


> In the beginning we teach tracking by using circles and dropping the leash. We then graduate to serpentine tracks but with light tension on the lead. The dog then will tend to self regulate the speed. When it is not straight line tracking the dog tends to search with intensity but not speed. We don't really do much in the way of corrections until after articles are introduced.


 
So do you start with scent boxes and then go to circles or is there something in between?

T


----------



## Thomas Barriano (Mar 27, 2006)

Terrasita Cuffie said:


> So do you start with scent boxes and then go to circles or is there something in between?
> 
> T


In the Ivan Balabanov version he starts with baited circles and the puppy/dog is run off leash. It's on his "train per view" website

http://www.trainperview.com/dog-training-videos/detail.aspx?id=25

I haven't used the site for awhile. Had trouble last time and got NO response from any of the contacts. Caveat Emptor but it is an interesting theory


----------



## Terrasita Cuffie (Jun 8, 2008)

Thomas Barriano said:


> In the Ivan Balabanov version he starts with baited circles and the puppy/dog is run off leash. It's on his "train per view" website
> 
> http://www.trainperview.com/dog-training-videos/detail.aspx?id=25
> 
> I haven't used the site for awhile. Had trouble last time and got NO response from any of the contacts. Caveat Emptor but it is an interesting theory


Is this part of the train in "something" assistance? And does it cost me? Advice here is free.

T


----------



## Terrasita Cuffie (Jun 8, 2008)

Interesting concept and appeals to me wanting to stay out of it and have the dog work independently and claims to not have to deal wit wind.

T


----------



## Thomas Barriano (Mar 27, 2006)

Terrasita Cuffie said:


> Is this part of the train in "something" assistance? And does it cost me? Advice here is free.
> 
> T


Follow the link. Ivan doesn't do much for free ;-)
I think that video is $20.99 and you can view it for a limited time.
Ivan's a great trainer but a lousy business man and website master IMO
There is an occasional piece of useful advise on the WDF but most of it is worth what you pay for it.


----------



## Terrasita Cuffie (Jun 8, 2008)

Thomas Barriano;363743There is an occasional piece of useful advise on the WDF but most of it is worth what you pay for it. :-)[/QUOTE said:


> Nahhhhhh, have to disagree with that one. I can sort through BS and there is gold here. Keeps me on my toes with what I want to do with my over-the-top drive herding dogs. That PSA obedience routine is really my winter project with my trial dog. I thought I had my scenario all worked out but seeing that, I'm going to add some more to up the ante. Besides, I've since added obedience, agility and now friggin tracking competitions. Have an upcoming obedience trial in January. Gotta continue brushing up on my gay heeling.
> 
> T


----------



## Joshua McGrotty (Apr 15, 2013)

I've just started my 14 week old puppy on tracking and the method I was told by my club seems to be working well - he's starting to distinguish the difference between the trampled and non trampled ground now after only 4 or 5 tracks.

I basically started just laying a track thats roughly 3ft x 3ft and dropping food within the tracking square. I take the pup to the start of the square, softly tell him to 'Seek' and point at the track (introducing the command this way) and let him do his thing. I didnt give any corrections and just watched and seen how he got on. The first few times he would wander a foot or two away from the track and then come back and realise he didnt have the scent of the trampled ground which he began to associate with food. When he finds all the food I give him praise and play a game and make it fun.

Now he's started distinguishing the trampled and untrampled ground a lot better. Where the first few times he would go a foot or two outside my square, he is now straying far less and is learning where the trampled ground is. I've now started to drop less food in the track so he's focussing harder.

My next step is now to make the square track more like a rectangle, maybe about 1ft wide by 4 or 5ft long, increase the food then when he gets used to it put less food in. Then start making the track still 1ft wide but 6 or 7ft long and doing the same with the food, until I can make it narrower and longer and more into an actual 'track'.

What I've done seems to be working and its building the scent association up slowly. I'd suggest trying it and seeing if it works for you


----------

