# K9 Pro Sports East coast final



## Butch Cappel (Aug 12, 2007)

All breeds are welcome. The Federation of Working Dogs is hosting a K9 Pro Sport event on Sat. Sept. 26. all levels

Fri. Sept. 25 will be a work shop "Intro to Personal Protection" via Butch Cappel

Sun. Sept. 27 will be CGC, WDE (Working Dog Evaluations), Conformation fun match, Hardest Hitting contest, Obedience test, Drivest Pup contest, etc.

The event will be held indoors. 12,000 square feet with rubber flooring.

There will be food and fun for everyone. More info goto the site and look under Events http://workingk9s.org


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## Thomas Barriano (Mar 27, 2006)

Butch,

I always thought a Federation was a group of States or Clubs etc. not a group of individuals (dogs or humans)? It seems like "The Federation of
Working Dogs" is attempting to cash in on the reputation of the AWDF
by using Federation in its name? It also seems like FWD is nothing but a
K9 ProSports shadow club, using K9 ProSports rules, titles and even "borrowing" the catch phrases "K9 Martial Arts" and listen well/train well and bite hard? What does the FWD offer that is new and not available
elsewhere?


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## morris lindesey (May 2, 2009)

It offers nothing Thomas!!!!...... I know of the guy running this "Federation" and its a bunch of BS!


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## Al Curbow (Mar 27, 2006)

Butch,
I don't know you but every time you post the same people always attack you, what's that about? or is it just the same ole dog people crap? just curious,
AL


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## Chris McDonald (May 29, 2008)

Al Curbow said:


> Butch,
> I don't know you but every time you post the same people always attack you, what's that about? or is it just the same ole dog people crap? just curious,
> AL


I must be missing something as well, this guy Butch has not knocked on anyone that I have seen


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## Thomas Barriano (Mar 27, 2006)

Chris McDonald said:


> I must be missing something as well, this guy Butch has not knocked on anyone that I have seen


Chris and Al

Do a little research. Ask around about Butch Cappel and
K9 ProSports. Ask people that have been around for awhile.
What some people are speaks so loudly it is hard to hear anything else they say.


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## Jerry Lyda (Apr 4, 2006)

Chris as far as I know he hasn't on THIS forum.

Do your reseach. Ask from people that has been in the dog arena for awhile. Learn from others mistakes. You would ask questions to these people about dogs and training etc....wouldn't you? There's a lot of knowledge out there. It's up to the individual to ask about trainers, dogs, and orginizations.


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## Butch Cappel (Aug 12, 2007)

Hey Al, Chris, Good question!

I've been in the dog/pet industry for about forty years now and seems I have made about 8 enemies, four of whom have their computer on auto response whenever a post comes up with my name. They have never put anything in the posts except "look out! Don't talk to him You'll be sorry" etc. But that's why they can use the auto response they have nothing to say. 

It is up to the moderators as to what type of posts are put up here, I prefer the ones that have to do with education about dogs, but that is my preference and we all have our own. 

Chris asks good questions and Al you put up good stuff too, so while these three or four people are jumping on me it keeps you and others from being their target. 

I know, I know, these people know nothing about either of you but. No one that has said anything negative about me on this board, has ever met me, talked to me, done any business with me, had or seen a dog trained by me, or participated in any of the dog trials I have sponsored over the years. They just have a buddy that didn't do well in Pro Sports and is smart enough to get them to fight his battle for them. At least that is the way it seems as I have put up my ph# and asked them to call and tell me face to face what their gripe is and I never get any response. 

I think it is time to get back to dog talk and look for the auto response!


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## Anita Griffing (Aug 8, 2009)

Hey Butch,
You don't know me and I have never met you, but we have a mutual friend who was a flight attendant that speaks very highly of you. You have worked her dogs (gsds) for years. She has a home in Texas. I live in Florida and have/had working dobermans. I hate to say anything, because there are so many 'internet bullies' that gang together on the web that patrol for victims to discredit. Kind of scarey to me. (thought I would add that it is a small world)
Anita
[email protected]


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## Thomas Barriano (Mar 27, 2006)

Butch Cappel said:


> Hey Al, Chris, Good question!
> 
> I've been in the dog/pet industry for about forty years now and seems I have made about 8 enemies, four of whom have their computer on auto response whenever a post comes up with my name. They have never put anything in the posts except "look out! Don't talk to him You'll be sorry" etc. But that's why they can use the auto response they have nothing to say.
> 
> ...



Butch,

You're a smooth talker and can really spin a yarn, I got to give you that  Lets get specific. You post here about the
K9 ProSports "World Championship" trying to give noobs
the idea that this is a world class event. The FACT is, last
years event had no Danish team and a one person Australian
team consisting of one member who wasn't even living in
Australia. Here is the video of the "World Champion's performance
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2muism2NhQc

Notice the venue (Butch's backyard?) the skills and equipment of the decoys and the performance of the dog
(To be fair this is a 2 year old dog) This isn't my idea of a 
world event.

You post pictures of a wolf hybrid being worked in Protection.
I believe this is dangerous and I think most trainers agree.
You tried to elicit support by trying to make it about obedience training. You then further expose your weak training by suggesting you can train wolves to do protection
by using their pack instincts??

Here is a video of one of the dogs you trained and you think
you can train a wolf to do protection?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vSM-2XBhZXU&feature=related

Of course you claim you only trained this dog for a short time
and someone else ruined your training. Here is another video
of your own personal dog

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YQ-AlAXjscg

who ruined his training?

There are lots of bad trainers and bad training around and it is real easy to "talk" someone that isn't familiar with protection sports into thinking that you know more than you actually do. Look at the videos and read the comments.

"Poor me, I'm being picked on" Sure Butch. You edited and
modified MY posts on the K9ProSports list. You've done it
with others. When caught you try to make out like it was
just a joke? I don't find forgery that amusing.

You appointed and supported a convicted child molester
as your NW Regional Director. You tried to blame it all
on Ron Ackerman (a former K9Prosports officer) but you
were the man in charge.

You talk a lot of trash on your list (APPDA?) but you don't want anyone to call you on your history and nonsense on any open forum where you can't modify, edit and delete
posts and whole topics.

I'm not asking anyone to believe me. I'm a sport dog trainer that barely manages to get titles 
Do you're own research before you believe everything someone tells you


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## morris lindesey (May 2, 2009)

Firstly, the me state that this no apology for my initial statement. I just want to clear the air. Mr. Cappell, I don't have any gripe with you or your organization, to each their own. I reside in VA and have been various dog sports and clubs here. In Va when comes to dog sports it's extremely flakey, as I imagine it is in other parts of the US. One of the problems here specifically is we have bogus individuals that prey upon newbies to protection sports. The leaders or "trainers" of these "organizations" have almost equivalent accolades of trainers who go to World Championships in mainstream dog sports. Meanwhile, the "trainer" demos a subpar working dog, the newbie is throughly impressed. They charge them for every little thing they do with these newbies, the newbie pays and comes to train for months for very simple protection events and fails miserably. The cycle is then repeated, newbie now has a bad taste in their mouth and puts the dog back on the couch. Ultimately, this one of the main reason why dog sports in VA, is so unstable. In short, the "trainers" need to stop burning people for the sake of a dollar (really pennies).


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## morris lindesey (May 2, 2009)

I don't know Thomas......but there is something I do know about him after that last post. He makes POWER to the BITE!:grin:


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## Jerry Lyda (Apr 4, 2006)

Morris, like Thomas said, butch really made fun of APPDA. He has changed my post too Thomas. And I thought I was the only one.


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## Butch Cappel (Aug 12, 2007)

Morris, No sweat on the first post I had an idea what you meant. That is not a new problem in the PP world or the dog world in general. it is one of the problems I hoped to minimize 17 years ago when we started K9 PRO SPORTS, cause I doubt it will ever be ended.

When we started K9PS we worked hard to figure a way to stop any sort of good ol boy system. Even back then (1990-92) people would put on their version of a "Protection" trial and after traveling to a few I was always amazed out how often the trainers biggest customer would do all the winning. 

If you don't mind I'll get off topic long enough to tell one story I just remembered.

At a trial in New Mexico the son of a very rich man had a Dobe that stayed sort of close in the heeling, wandered into the crowd on his recall and barked but didn't bite in the protection.

The trainer putting on the show told us we would take a break and everyone could come up with their own very best scenario for the last exercise, something to show our dogs best side.

One guy did a call off, a few did run-aways, all the standard stuff. The rich kid? He put his Dobe in a sit stay and then performed a Martial Arts kata around his dog. And the winner was? You got it Rich Kid!

When I started K9PS we did all we could to make sure we had street applicable scenarios and that each contestant was judged in a way that gave them a clear picture of exactly what the judges saw. 

To hold the Judges accountable we used a TWO judge system and each judge had a written score sheet with point values assigned to each and every move the team performs. Kinda risky to give points to your buddy when you don't know the judge on the other side, don't you think.

Any way when we get to Va. each contestant will have a written rule book with the judging standards clearly defined, a protest system that allows them to question any call on the spot, and they will have TWO written critiques, or score sheets from two different judges that have never met. 

I hope it will be the beginning of something good for PP enthusiasts in your part of the world. And thanks for taking your time to explain things to me.


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## Butch Cappel (Aug 12, 2007)

Well, Well, Well! Mr Barrriano in your never ending never sleeping quest to prove I wasn't born, I instead crawled out from a rock, you have typed a whooole bunch of stuff, so lets gets to it and see if you said anything.

You had three videos and three written accusations, so lets start with the videos. 

Video #1 Willa, the Rott, last years K9PS Champion from Australia. Little Rott is half again larger than most Mals and hits with as much speed, but about face high, not a hit designed to give an attacker much of a chance in a fight. 
Control, you ask? 
Without raising his voice the handler asks her to "out" and she spits out that bite like it was one of your nasty, nasty, socks! Now the handler,again in a conversational tone says "heel" and the dog without breaking her "guard" or taking her eyes off the bad guy, backs to a heel position next to her partner. And you had a problem with what? 

Oh yeah, forgot, you said I didn't cut the grass short enough?

Next we have the infamous video put up by your Ped pal (Whoops meant to say Pen pal) Ackerman. As you said it shows a dog I trained until it was a year old, in that video he is 5 or 6 and I have no idea where she has trained all these years. So I am guilty of WHAT? But since you started all this please reference my post to Morris above. As stated this lady was a customer of mine, but she still got a zero for this exercise in K9PS. It's called _ integrity _ you can look that word up later Barriano

Now the training video. I have no idea what you are talking about here. 
We are training the dog. That is something I do instead of typing. My dog has about an 85% reliability rate in his Call Offs, I am told he bites like a Banshee, and fights like a she-lion protecting her cub and he has one street apprehension, so I am pleased so far. He's not Willa, Yet, but we're getting there, that's why you'll see videos of us training, while you are at your computer typing.

Ok, that's the video section now lets get to those written accusations, this wont take long either.

A. You say I change or moderate posts on the K9 PRO SPORTS message board, but you got tell the whole story or it sounds funny (I'm sure you don't want it to sound funny, now do you?) It should read _"Butch you change posts of people that come on the K9PS board and break the board rules after you have warned them repeatedly"_

My response; Guilty

B. You said I appointed a child molester to a K9PS position, again true. But gosh darn it can you believe you left out the rest of the story AGAIN.
The complete accusation should read _"Butch you appointed TWO (yes two) pedophiles to positions in K9PS, BUT you kicked them out as soon as you found out what they were."_

My response: Guilty, and if I may add I would think you would be glad I kicked them out _mod delete_

C. You said I don't want to be questioned on my history and nonsense unless I can edit and modify the responses.

My response: Here I am! 

There's your answers now it's my turn. As Anita said in an earlier post internet bullies are every where, and keep a lot of people from posting. I will tell you what I tell any Internet Expert or Drama Queen that comes on the K9PS board. Boards are for dog info, you got a beef with ME call 817-483-2026 can't afford the phone call e-me your number, I'll call you. Got more to say than just a phone call, send me your address I'll be glad to fly up and discuss it in person. Let the people enjoy their message board.

Butch Cappel
Director
K9 PRO SPORTS
The only internationally practiced PP system in the world!!!
(excuse me moderators I just had to add that last part cause I know how it gets his goat)


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## Thomas Barriano (Mar 27, 2006)

Butch Cappel said:


> Well, Well, Well! Mr Barrriano in your never ending never sleeping quest to prove I wasn't born, I instead crawled out from a rock, you have typed a whooole bunch of stuff, so lets gets to it and see if you said anything.
> 
> You had three videos and three written accusations, so lets start with the videos.
> 
> ...


So Butch, The 08 K9 ProSports World Champion was the only member of the Australian team and actually lived in California or NOT? The dog was 2 years old. My complaint
was the venue, the poor decoy work and mish mash of equipment. The other videos everyone can look at all the
videos and read the comments and make up their own minds

Re Ron Ackerman

I've never met or talked to Ron Ackerman, so don't bother with your transparent attempt to smear me with your
ped pal nonsense. The only convicted pedophile in K9 ProSports was the one that YOU appointed as NW RD
If Ron Ackerman is a pedophile you only had a problem with it after he questioned your honesty. You defended Thad
Stacy for quite awhile before you finally cut him loose.
You sure as heck didn't get rid of him as soon as you found out. Quite the opposite you defended him with it was all in the past and it was a 15 year old druggie etc. 

Anyone that disagrees or questions you is a drama queen or Internet Expert. LMAO


As far as letting people enjoy their message board.
Letting people enjoy their message board doesn't mean letting you post your self serving promotion of K9 Pro Sports
event without pointing out the reality of what actually happens at them. It doesn't mean you get to promote and
encourage training wolf Hybrids to do bite work, without
saying it is a bad idea.


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## Gerry Grimwood (Apr 2, 2007)

These posts are just like a small turd in your soup.

Who ****ing cares what Butch or anyone else does really ? Are they real or what, who gives a shit ?
Will it change your day to day schedule and what you do with your own dogs ?


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## Chris McDonald (May 29, 2008)

Gerry Grimwood said:


> These posts are just like a small turd in your soup.
> 
> Who ****ing cares what Butch or anyone else does really ? Are they real or what, who gives a shit ?
> Will it change your day to day schedule and what you do with your own dogs ?


Gerry your wording is perfect. 
Is it just me or does there seem to be more know it all types in dogs then in most other sports/ hobbies/ jobs? Do you think it could have something to do with bossing dogs around or something? There is something really deep going on here. What’s up with some of these dog people pretending to care about new dog people? Some of you “experienced guys” carry on how certain breeders and trainers prey on the new and inexperienced. They carry on about a sucker born every minute etc. pretending to worry about how much people pay for dogs. My ass.. your just worried about trying to pretend you look like you know something. Over the past two years I’ve come to believe that many of you should spend more time worrying about yourselves and you can start by vacuuming your house and cars a bit more often. 
Outside of the dog work it’s called marketing and competition. The only thing here of public concern is this child molester thing. Feed the freaks to the dogs and put that on youtube. WTF anyone got any good dog videos for me to watch or something 

You had a turd in your soup once ? You got to do more than vacuum then !


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## Gerry Grimwood (Apr 2, 2007)

Chris McDonald said:


> Is it just me or does there seem to be more know it all types in dogs then in most other sports/ hobbies/ jobs?


Just like every other aspect of life, the empty barrel usually makes the most noise.


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## Chris McDonald (May 29, 2008)

Gerry Grimwood said:


> Just like every other aspect of life, the empty barrel usually makes the most noise.


“ the empty barrel usually makes the most noise” I read it a few times, are you talking in some secret code or something? :grin:


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## Butch Cappel (Aug 12, 2007)

Chris said; _They carry on about a sucker born every minute etc. pretending to worry about how much people pay for dogs. My ass.. your just worried about trying to pretend you look like you know something. Over the past two years I’ve come to believe that many of you should spend more time worrying about yourselves and you can start by vacuuming your house and cars a bit more often. _

I said; Go Chris Go!


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## Bob Scott (Mar 30, 2006)

To all concerned
This post was about posting info for a seminar!
Go or don't go!
If you have honest, real life reasons for all the comments (some may, some may not) then take it to pms.
Hearsay about my friend said/someone said/"they" say" BS gets boreing way to fast for the rest of us.
Thank you


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## Mike Jones (Jan 22, 2009)

I was just wondering how the event turned out? Is there any video or photos? What was the result? I met some guys at the Presa that said there were going to compete.


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## Bill Whatley (Aug 26, 2009)

Mike Jones said:


> I was just wondering how the event turned out? Is there any video or photos? What was the result? I met some guys at the Presa that said there were going to compete.


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## Bill Whatley (Aug 26, 2009)

=; Who lost???


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## Butch Cappel (Aug 12, 2007)

Mike thanks for your interest in the K9PS east coast trial. I thought ir might be a little more unbiased if I let someone else answer your question. One of the contestants, Maynard Pease, a twenty year veteran P.O. and a man with about two decades of dog training experience competed and then wrote up his account of what went on, so I’l let him tell it.

"I first want to thank Butch (Founder K9 Pro Sports), Ish (Dream Team Kennels), Teresa (Colonial K-9), and Chip (selected decoy for the competition) for putting together an awesome event. Congratulations to all the handler K9 teams that stepped up and competed, as it is a lot of work to just get to the point to be able to walk on the field. 

The seminar on Friday Butch explained that the main objective of K9 Pro Sports was to test your dog to see if he will protected in a real life situation. The civil agitation by Butch was awesome and all the Handlers had a chance to see how there K9`s would do to deter and if needed protect the team if needed in the most real life situation that can be created in a trial setting. 


K9 Pro Sports Trial on Saturday started with some impressive teams completing the training division. Yes Patsy I was watching that BIG-BIG fire breathing wolf dog.. You have done a great job with him and thanks for making the long twenty two hour drive to have some fun with us in Virginia. Chip the handler attack decoy work was great and mimicked a real fight from a suspect trying to do harm to the handler. All teams where prepared for the challenge and passed. 
Next ---- the Person Protection Division. I wish I could have seen all the teams but I was preparing my old man Roy for the challenge we where facing. I know the civil agitation scenario is a tough one and Butch showed on Friday that he was not afraid to get in on you if your K9 was not 100 percent focused on the task of protecting the team at all cost. I did see the team of Sandi Burlarley and Marvel. Very impressive and great handler skills. I missed the team of Teresa Mathern and Abby. But I did see them working Friday and I could tell that have been doing there homework. Now from the eyes of Roy and I….. First up the obedience… Very practical and needed to show control. I was very nervous about the distraction when you left your dog before the recall. I was walking away form Roy hoping he would still be on his down when I looked back and my old man was.. oooo yesssss…..Ok now for the protection phase….First up civil agitation with distraction. The training on Friday prepared us and we did it Roy passed… ooooooo yessssss…. Now I just had to worry about the out as Roy has a little problem with that ..hahah .. Handler attack: Chip came out and brought it to us and Roy came to my defense… Here we go Butch said out your dog : I commanded to Roy---- Done and he let go wow ok now Roy might just pass…Mark and I have been working with Roy this out very hard--- now it all comes together for us. Now one more to go the courage test with the recall back to the handler (For Handler Safety)….Well we did not practice this like we should have…. Roy ran down the field and Chip worked the old man so good Roy said nooo wayyy am I coming back to my handler he does not play with me like Chip does… So no matter what I did Roy would not leave Chip… Roy even got a few cheap bites in on Chip because he heard Chip joking him about all his grey muzzle hair. 

Wow as you can tell I had a great time last weekend… 
I want to thank Butch and Ish for a perfect and unbiased job of judging… 

I better get back to work… 

The east coast is coming on strong in K9 Pro Sports… watch out for 2010 at the world championships we may be taken the championship buckle back to the east coast…"

Winners in the Training division; 3rd place Luger, Wolf-dog, handler Patsy Waldrop
2cd place, Champ, Dobe, Handler Jeremy Connathy
The winner, Roy, Mal, Handler, Maynard Pease.

Personal Protection; 3rd Roy, Mal, Handler Maynard Pease, Md. 2cd. Abba, GSD, handler Theresa Mathern. Va. 
The Winner; Marvel American Bulldog, Handler Sandra Burlarly

Mike ther are a few trophy photos on the K9PS message board but we are not so computer savvy as some groups yet. Hopefully some one will have some photos up soon.

Butch Cappel
http://www.workingdogforum.com/vBul...ro-sports-east-coast-final-12231/www.k9ps.com


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## Patsy Waldrop (Sep 20, 2009)

Hi! I can finally speak for myself, technology kicks my behind. 

I had a great time in VA. Very proud of both of my boys. Luger took 3rd in training and Scout came in 4th in the PP division, not bad at all for us, was glad to have made the trip, I learned allot.

Luger at first was very sensitive to the buildings acoustics. A ball that he loves more than anything else just nearly shut him down and he kept wanting to leave out of the building. That took some time and patience to overcome, he did great, but not completely. He didn't fire up like he does out doors. I trained his ob by treats a first and then we went to balls since he's addicted to tennis balls and that bit us in the behind during the trial, they used a tennis ball as a distraction, and of course he went for it, took a little doing to get him over that, but we made it, I was still proud of him, that he just did it, after showing such reluctance to being in the building and having traveled some 21 hours in a crate in the back of my truck so I can't complain any. About every 4 hours he let me know he wanted out to stretch his long legs so we did. Did well on attack on decoy, too.

Scout, however was better about the ball distraction this time as to the last trial. He didn't go for the ball, which he did last time, but he did watch the ball and the 1 judge caught that, so we lost a few points, I was just glad he didn't fall for it like the last time. He didn't heel as crisp as I would have liked, but he did OK. He too, was not happy with the building. I also found out I need to trust my Scout more, and quit worrying so much about the what ifs. I've heard so much about him being unpredictable and psycho that I'm not trusting him to make the right decisions.I'll be working on that. On the send , well let me say it was a little touchy. I sent , he went, I outed, he slowly outed, I recalled, he came about a 1/3 of the way spun around and dropped, I called him again, and again he came to about 1/2 way spun and dropped, I called again, he then got about 8 feet from me, spun & dropped. I didn't want to take anymore chances with him, so I looked at everyone and said sorry folks, but I'm not taking anymore chances. I went and got his lead and led him back to a starting point and everyone clapped, I guess they were as relieved as I was. Even though he did not come all the way back to me I was still tickled pink, cause this was he first recall with out a long line, so I was happy for him.

I did enter both of them in the hardest hitting. I was told by others that Scout should do well, but I think he was still a little Leary of the building, but we will work on that. Luger, well after reading all these treads about wolf/hybrids, one story caught my eye about having totally no control off lead, so I wanted to see how he would do, and was pleased. I sent, he went, engaged the decoy, I called, he outed and came about 3 to 4 steps in my direction and returned to the decoy. I believe with proper training we will succeed in that, he was not completely out of control. Oh and afterwards, Maynard was sitting near the exit door after one of the drills, I don't remember which one, and Luger went right up to him face to face for a little pet me time, nothing more, just see me pet me, no big deal. I'm not sure how Maynard felt about that, but he didn't have much of a choice, if Luger wants your attention he's practically in your lap, non aggressive of cousrse.
.
In all had a great time and hope to go back, only next time I will include a young dobie\\/.


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## Thomas Barriano (Mar 27, 2006)

*Trial Video*

There is a lot of spin and hype and embellishment about K9 Pro Sports trial results. However here is a pointer to some actual video from the trial.
http://www.youtube.com/cycburke#p/a
IMHO it is weak and unimpressive. I've seen 10 x better control and drive from almost every Schutzhund club level
dog I've ever seen :-( 
I also wonder if there is any dog that K9 Pro Sports wouldn't do bite training with? We've already discussed the dangers of working with Wolf Hybrids and now I see they also are training an ALBINO (not white) Dobermann. Albino Dobermanns are the worse examples of the breed due to 
health and temperament issues from incestuous inbreeding
for the albino trait. Every legit dog sport I know of has a temperament test requirement BH Brevet etc. before they start training bite work. All I see on any K9 Prosport is a lot of civil agitation and defense :-(


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## Tamara McIntosh (Jul 14, 2009)

*Re: Trial Video*



Every legit dog sport I know of has a temperament test requirement BH Brevet etc. before they start training bite work. All I see on any K9 Prosport is a lot of civil agitation and defense :-([/quote said:


> Mondio doesn't require an entry into brevet to compete at level 1.
> 
> Tamara McIntosh


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## Christopher Jones (Feb 17, 2009)

*Re: Trial Video*



Thomas Barriano said:


> There is a lot of spin and hype and embellishment about K9 Pro Sports trial results. However here is a pointer to some actual video from the trial.
> http://www.youtube.com/cycburke#p/a
> IMHO it is weak and unimpressive. I've seen 10 x better control and drive from almost every Schutzhund club level
> dog I've ever seen :-(
> ...


Thomas, I dont know anyone who takes K9PS seriously compared to the other dog sports. I watch the videos and I dont see anything that interests me. But thats cool. The people who are doing it are taking their dogs out and trialing. Sure the levels not world class, but hey, who here is world class? 
We have K9PS here in Australia and I dont have an interest in doing it. I would much prefer to do NVBK or KNPV (if it were available). But there are people here who do it, and seem to enjoy it. I also find there are people who do it because they have breeds of dogs that IPO clubs here wont allow on the fields such as AB's, Amstaffs, Bandogs etc. So in the end of the day I think it could have its positives. Maybe some future good working dog folks will get their taste of dogsports through K9PS and then migrate to the higher level sports.
Just see it for what it is Thomas.


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## Mike Jones (Jan 22, 2009)

It looks like an interesting sport for people who just want to have fun doing something with their dogs that does not require a lot of intense training. I believe the title was called a training title. I would like to see video of more advance work where perfection and execution is judged more strictly.

It did look like basic civil agitation but the dogs looked like they were having fun and not take the work to seriously. I know some guys who train police dogs and personal protection and they have more fight and drive to do the work but their dogs are more advanced in there training. 

I still would like to see video of some of the top competitors in the sport before I make a real judgment. I just don't know enough about it. I have read the rules and they do not seem stringent. I would think that the top competitors have some high flying intense working dogs that also perform obedience with finely executed precision. 

Butch gets a lot of criticism but I don't think he cares. He's one confident dude. I would love to see video of some of his personal dogs working...they must be beasts with the training knowledge he professes.


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## Thomas Barriano (Mar 27, 2006)

Mike Jones said:


> I still would like to see video of some of the top competitors in the sport before I make a real judgment. I just don't know enough about it. I have read the rules and they do not seem stringent. I would think that the top competitors have some high flying intense working dogs that also perform obedience with finely executed precision.
> 
> >Mike
> 
> ...


>I'm afraid you're mistaking brazen BS with confidence?
>Here is a video of Butch's personal dog.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YQ-AlAXjscg


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## Mike Scheiber (Feb 17, 2008)

Thomas Barriano said:


> >I'm afraid you're mistaking brazen BS with confidence?
> >Here is a video of Butch's personal dog.
> 
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YQ-AlAXjscg


I haven't bothered with many of the PPD posts after seeing this little cartoon I have to ask what the **** was that supposed to be glad it was short caus I had to watch it twice. The helper should have grabbed that dog thrown it back at the handler
Blind leading the blind and this Butch guy has some sort of doggie protection rodeo sort of thang. hmmm


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## Patsy Waldrop (Sep 20, 2009)

Thomas Bariano, besides a Butch C. critic, what the ---- are you. Is the only way you can feel good about yourself is to put someone else down[-X. As for the white dobie, he's no albino, as a matter of fact he's actually a cream. One of the best temperaments for a dog I've seen. If you watch the video, you can see that, right after the agitation, the agitator was standing right near both the dog and handler,and I don't see you putting up any videos up for anyone to see, that is if indeed you are a trainer, are you afraid to put your stuff up for the world to see and judge your every move. My daughter had a school teacher just like you, dogging her every move, maybe you should look around to see if you've got any friends, cause I doubt you do, then ask why, your not :grin: and it shows dude, so get happy. Oh, and as for as my wolf/hybrid goes he's great and loves everyone so long as they leave his feet alone, and I think I've figured out why he doesn't want them handled. He's in the back yard with a gyp herder mix, that keeps all the boys, which I now have 4 , in line by nipping and biting their feet.I just love these smiley faces, don't you:-\"!


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## Thomas Barriano (Mar 27, 2006)

Patsy Waldrop said:


> Thomas Bariano, besides a Butch C. critic, what the ---- are you. Is the only way you can feel good about yourself is to put someone else down[-X. As for the white dobie, he's no albino, as a matter of fact he's actually a cream. One of the best temperaments for a dog I've seen. If you watch the video, you can see that, right after the agitation, the agitator was standing right near both the dog and handler,and I don't see you putting up any videos up for anyone to see, that is if indeed you are a trainer, are you afraid to put your stuff up for the world to see and judge your every move. My daughter had a school teacher just like you, dogging her every move, maybe you should look around to see if you've got any friends, cause I doubt you do, then ask why, your not :grin: and it shows dude, so get happy. Oh, and as for as my wolf/hybrid goes he's great and loves everyone so long as they leave his feet alone, and I think I've figured out why he doesn't want them handled. He's in the back yard with a gyp herder mix, that keeps all the boys, which I now have 4 , in line by nipping and biting their feet.I just love these smiley faces, don't you:-\"!


Patsy,

I'm a critic of all liars, cheats and con men. I don't like people who blow smoke up some noob's butt to stroke their own egos and/or make a buck. Instead of believing every thing Butch tells you. Try checking things out for yourself.
Ask why none of the other founders of K9 ProSport are still involved. Ask why so many of the K9 PS judges and decoys have moved on. Ask why one of his NW Regions RD is in jail and the other left to start Protection Dog International. Ask why Thomas Ravn is now involved with PDI.

There are NO White Dobermanns no matter what color they are. There are only four allowable Dobermann colors and "white" isn't one of them. The "white" Dobermanns are Tyrosinase Positive ALBINO. Look it up on the DPCA or UDC websites.

Luger may be the most stable family pet you've ever had, BUT he is part wild animal and you should NOT be training him to do bite work. You can listen to Butch Cappel or to the vast majority of trainers and behaviorists who DON'T have their hands in your pocket?

I've posted several video of my dogs training, sorry you missed them. I don't have anything to prove. I don't want or need your money. I"m not trying to sell you training or any
puppies and I don't have my own organization that I want you to join. LOL

It is interesting that when ever anyone criticizes someone like
Butch, people like you wonder about how many friends I have? LMAO


Thomas Barriano
Dubheasa Germania (11/05/99-08/11/08) SchH III M R Brevet AKC WD III AWD 1 STP 1 CD WAC TT
Ascomannis Jago (06/20/03) SchH III AKC WD III AWD I TT WAC
Belatucadrus (08/14/05) Dutch Boy BH TT
Flannchadh von der Bavarianburg (5/21/08) CGC


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## Mo Earle (Mar 1, 2008)

I am glad all of you that went to the K9 Pro Sports East Coast final had fun...most on this forum, don't work in the police/security world and look to the "sport/protection venues" to do something more with their dog... I take time to applaud those who are interersted enough in their dogs to get up off the couch and to put the time in and expense to train, and drive to the sport venues-which ever one it may be!!

I have participated in a lot of the different venues with my dogs...ASR,NVBK,FR,APPDA as well as K9 pro sports in the past, and I had fun- Tango did great and in the higher levels of K9pro sports ....and as in other venues....the higher the level the more distractions, and pressure applied. .....the videos that were shown- and are getting the criticism- are for the most part the beginning level dogs- people can sit here and criticize the decoy work, the handling skills, the temperment of the dogs....but everyone has to start somewhere..everyone has to utilize what is available to them.....maybe not every dog, decoy or handler is going to be the awesome super star that some of these other people are or have- but these dogs/decoys and handlers are giving what they have at this level and appear to be having a good time. 

others have to realize some of the criticism is a result of personality clashes...if only we could keep egos/and personality differences out of dog training...anyway...

I enjoyed watching all of you, and applaud you all for getting involved- :-\"


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## Patsy Waldrop (Sep 20, 2009)

Thank you so much, Mo. I don't see it so much as a sport as I do a learning tool, to see where my dogs are at in there development.

"Re Ron Ackerman

I've never met or talked to Ron Ackerman, so don't bother with your transparent attempt to smear me with yourped pal nonsense"

As to TB, (isn't that a disease ), you must criticize your self allot since you seem to be a :---). I beg to differ with you on having never talked with RA, since I have seen you numerous times chatting with him on a board he created just to bash Butch, you and Ron talked frequently until the board was finally stopped and removed, you must be







with envy man, just be .


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## Patsy Waldrop (Sep 20, 2009)

It seems like you are trying to make every board a Bash Butch Board, since they ended Rons BS board.


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## Patsy Waldrop (Sep 20, 2009)

And hey, why not post those videos of yours up and lets all have look and see how well you are doing, since you seem to always have something bad to say about others, man. Let's seem them, we all know you know how to search past videos and bring them back.


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## John Watcher (Jun 22, 2009)

Thomas,

It sounds like you sure do hate Butch. I see you on so many message boards attacking him because of all the things you have _heard_ from other people. Yet, I would venture to guess you've never met him, nor have you probably ever competed in a K9PS event. So, that would mean everything you are spouting off about is "information" (I say that loosely) you have acquired from someone else. Which means, you don't have any actual experience with Butch to talk about yet you continue to bash him.

Yes, it is a fact that there was a pedophile in his program. Is he anymore? No. Were you on the phone or in the room with Butch when he made the decision to remove this person. No. All your information is based on someone else's story. If *you* actually knew all of this, why didn't you report this person as a pedophile since you are so omniscient. It's all hearsay from other people and you are personally choosing to attack someone based on what other people tell you. It sounds to me like you are the sheep with nothing more to do.

Which brings me to my next point, Butch is having a championship event at his place in November. Since you spend more time on forum's than you do anything else, why don't you take some time off and drive down to compete with your dog. I'm sure he would welcome you to compete. In fact, it would be an opportunity for you to gain first hand knowledge of his program and the proof you need to complain based on FACT instead of hearsay.

I'm sure Butch would extend this offer to anyone that thinks K9PS is for beginners or non-serious dogs. My opinion is this: don't talk trash unless you have the experience. It just makes you look stupid.

Thomas, it would also give you a chance to work Lee's dogs since I know that's another feud I would like to see over. I'm sick of you two going back and forth like children and nobody having the intelligence to shut up or balls to show up. You litter message boards all over the place. Do I have to click on your threads, no I don't. But, what happens is you end up taking over a decent message board with your nonsense and then the people that want to post get caught up in some BS between you and Lee and end up leaving. 

Get over yourself and show up. If not, you should shut up. You are only hurting your name. Butch is way better at being good than you are at being bad. And please don't use any lame excuse about how you would be cheated. There will be plenty of people there and an official appeals process. If you do anything other than show up, you are a coward.

And another thing I've been wanting to tell you all this time, karma sucks my friend. Maybe if you spent less time on forums talking bad about other people, you could have spent more time looking for Jago. I never want to see anything bad happen to any dog and I hope he is o.k., but maybe he's in a better home now with someone who has a better soul.


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## Patsy Waldrop (Sep 20, 2009)

NM. and a BIG AMEN.


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## Thomas Barriano (Mar 27, 2006)

Thanks for the concern with me and my dogs and the "challenge" to compete in November. I think I'll pass. I'm just a little skeptical of first time posts from someone who calls themselves "John Watcher" who spew the same old tired Butch line of BS. I don't give a rodents posterior if "you" or Patsy don't believe anything I'm telling you. What goes around comes around and the truth always comes out. Nice to hear from you 
LEEtle man. I didn't think you'd stay away long.


Thomas Barriano
Dubheasa Germania (11/05/99-08/11/08) SchH III M R Brevet AKC WD III AWD 1 STP 1 CD WAC TT
Ascomannis Jago (06/20/03) SchH III AKC WD III AWD I TT WAC
Belatucadrus (08/14/05) Dutch Boy BH TT
Flannchadh von der Bavarianburg (5/21/08) CGC


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## John Watcher (Jun 22, 2009)

Thomas,

Nothing to be skeptical of here. Obviously you didn't read my post clearly enough. I am also calling Lee out by saying neither of you had the intelligence or balls to shut up or show up. I can assure you I am not Lee, nor is this Butch. 

I didn't spew any lines of anybody. I stated the facts as they are. You have never competed in K9PS nor have met Butch. It's time to put up or shut up.

I will state again, if you do anything other than show up to compete, you are a coward. Talking trash without backing it up (in this case you are bashing K9PS without trying it first) is cowardly. Once you compete you then have something to stand on. Until then, you are making yourself look stupid.

Again, (you even stated this yourself by saying what goes around comes around) karma is tough sometimes. You should remember that next time you see a flyer for a lost Dobie. Fix your life instead of trying to destroy others.


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## Thomas Barriano (Mar 27, 2006)

John Watcher said:


> Thomas,
> 
> Nothing to be skeptical of here. Obviously you didn't read my post clearly enough. I am also calling Lee out by saying neither of you had the intelligence or balls to shut up or show up. I can assure you I am not Lee, nor is this Butch.
> 
> ...


Why in the world would I have any interest in competing in a "sport" I have ZERO respect for, run by someone I have little respect for? Just cause someone I don't know (YOU) issues a "challenge"? LOL

Lee said he is going to show up at the Nationals. You can see him there. 
Okye showed up at a K9PS trial with his APBT and Butch disrespected him on his list. I'm not playing that game.
I compete in real sports with impartial judges and competent
decoys, NOT in some Bubba PP "sport" run by a BS artist.

It is interesting that you would try to equate my missing dog with my criticism of a con man? 
Have you ever competed/titled in any sport, including K9PS?




Thomas Barriano
Dubheasa Germania (11/05/99-08/11/08) SchH III M R Brevet AKC WD III AWD 1 STP 1 CD WAC TT
Ascomannis Jago (06/20/03) SchH III AKC WD III AWD I TT WAC
Belatucadrus (08/14/05) Dutch Boy BH TT
Flannchadh von der Bavarianburg (5/21/08) CGC


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## Butch Cappel (Aug 12, 2007)

Swami Barriano has taken a break from the Psychic Network to jump in and call me a liar, though he's never spoken to me. A con, though he's never had any dealings with me and a cheat although he has never seen any event or affair I have ever hosted or participated in. 

Once again he is having those visions and calling me out "To Save The NEWBIES!" And once again his turban is wrapped WAaaaay to tight. But it's always nice to talk about K9 PRO SPORTS so since he asked, here goes.

TB (those initials can't be a coincidence, hack, hack) asked; _"What happened to the founders of K9 PRO SPORTS why aren't they still around?"_ WEll? Actually.... I am! Thank you, thank you, very much.

K9PS was not really founded. It was a job I was hired to do. In 1992 a man named Abel Cordoba in Mexico imported a SchH3 Rott from Germany. he wanted the dog retrained as a street or PP dog. I was working with the Attorney General of the state of Chihuahua, Mexico at the time to set up standards for their police dogs, and Abel who was high in Government hired me to retrain his dog. Once it was done he thought it would be cool to have a place to compete and show off his dog. He again hired me to come up with what is today K9PS, and I'm still here (sorry TB).

TB (hack, hack) then asked; _ "What happened to all the original or early judges or decoys in K9 PS" _ I actually don't know. We started seventeen years ago, Krike! Did you think they signed a life time contract?
Actually all judges and decoys are hired by the hosting club. They meet K9PS standards and we list them as qualified, but K9PS has nothing to do with who works the trials that is up to each host club, ask them.

Let's see if I remember the next question had to do with a director leaving K9PS and attempting to start some kind of dog thing. I really don't know anything about that person or their other activities today. I do know that one hundred percent of the very few disgruntled ex K9PS people have one thing in common, they have ALL failed at achieving whatever their K9PS goals were, and I don't need to elaborate on that they are not here to defend themselves. But that's why they leave and the Players, the dog folks, in the game like Mo Earle, and Patsy and a few hundred others have fond memories of their K9PS experience (which you seem intent on ruining for them).

Let's see what else was it? Oh Yeah, Thomas Ravn. You say he is involved in some thing? Your the psychic, so who am I to argue? Being limited to dealing with people I actually know and things I have really experienced ain't near as much fun as being you, so all I can say is what I actually know from first hand experience That is that Thomas Ravn just got off the phone with me and I'll be picking him up at the airport again as part of an International team of judges and decoys at the K9 PRO SPORTS championship, Nov, 7, and he is still THU Man in Denmark for K9PS.

So if you don't mind a little free advice there Swami TB, you might loosen that turban a little, seems your losing some valuable blood flow. Oh and it might not hurt to get a little Windex and elbow grease after that crystal ball, it must be fogging up on you cause you aint got Nothing right yet. 

Butch Cappel
http://www.workingdogforum.com/vBul...ro-sports-east-coast-final-12231/www.k9ps.com


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## John Watcher (Jun 22, 2009)

Thomas Barriano said:


> Why in the world would I have any interest in competing in a "sport" I have ZERO respect for, run by someone I have little respect for? Just cause someone I don't know (YOU) issues a "challenge"? LOL
> 
> Lee said he is going to show up at the Nationals. You can see him there.
> Okye showed up at a K9PS trial with his APBT and Butch disrespected him on his list. I'm not playing that game.
> ...


Ahhh, trying to bait me with the"my titled dog means I know more" trick. I'm smarter than the average bear Mr. Barriano. Not the smartest, just smarter than you.[-X I will control this conversation, not you. I'm not a K9PS'er, Butch has never taken my money (although I have met him several times and he has yet to break my trust), and I also don't compete in any other dog sports arena. 

I know coward when I smell it and you sure do stink the place up. I've seen you bash Butch and plenty of other people for no reason other than trying to be an internet bully. That's where I equate your missing dog with your character and karma. What goes around comes around and it sounds like you got yours (with more to come probably) by Jago going missing. I'm sure if Butch does bad things, his karma will let him know.

Again, put up or shut up. That's not a "challenge" by me. That's something I would like to see you do so you could then warn "the newbies" based on your experience and fact instead of hearsay. Thomas will be there from Denmark as well as Tony from Australia. I would say those are impartial judges based on the respect you give Thomas yourself. I have never seen a harsh word mentioned about Tony, so I would guess he is impartial as well. Not to mention plenty of people competing as well as a printed out version of the rules with a fair appeals process.

If you're not going to compete in or even attend a K9PS event and you continue bashing, I would make sure you have your dog pretty secure. He might just start looking for another owner.:-({|=


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## Thomas Barriano (Mar 27, 2006)

Butch Cappel said:


> Swami Barriano has taken a break from the Psychic Network to jump in and call me a liar, though he's never spoken to me. A con, though he's never had any dealings with me and a cheat although he has never seen any event or affair I have ever hosted or participated in.
> 
> Once again he is having those visions and calling me out "To Save The NEWBIES!" And once again his turban is wrapped WAaaaay to tight. But it's always nice to talk about K9 PRO SPORTS so since he asked, here goes.
> 
> ...


Butch,

You're posts are always entertaining, but seldom enlightening. Here is the PDI website where your last
NW RD went and where Thomas Ravn is listed as Judge, Decoy etc. You still never answered the question about whether there is going to be any "teams" from either Denmark or Australia? You also never disputed the fact that last years K9 ProSports "World Champion" was the ONLY rep from "Australia" and actually lived in the USA.
Spin and embellish all you want Butch. All anyone has to do is look at the videos of you working your dog or of Willa at last years World Championship and compare that to your version of events. Videos don't lie.
http://www.protectiondogsinternational.com/officials.html


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## Jerry Lyda (Apr 4, 2006)

To make myself clear. I do not have any problem with the sport. That's all well and good. Some like it and some don't. Isn't that the same as most any sport. I could care less about basketball but love baseball. The only problem I have is posts that were changed on K9PS forum. You tell me how they got re-worded? Mine, my son, and Matt's were changed, although I don't associate with Matt any longer, the point is it was done. Now would I give K9PS a shot, yea I think it may be fun to watch someone else do it, but not with my dog.


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## Al Curbow (Mar 27, 2006)

I don't know either guy, but TB sure seems like a stalker, LOL. Strange stuff in the dog world.........


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## Butch Cappel (Aug 12, 2007)

Mr. Lyda,
I'm sure you'd like to show your solidarity with Ol Swami B, but this is not the place to discuss issues you think you have with me concerning my message board. 

I find it hard to believe you have forgotten even one sentence that passed in that little affair, but if that is the case all you have to do is go to My board and ASK. I will be glad to bring all the posts you, your son and Matt posted as well as my answers to the top. 

You can also call me 817-483-2026 and I will be glad to discuss any problems you think you have. I just feel a little creepy taking space on THIS board to discuss YOUR problem with MY board, But if you insist I will put the posts up here for all to judge.

But let's respect the folks interested in dog things and keep it where it belongs, deal?.

Butch Cappel


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## Mike Scheiber (Feb 17, 2008)

Al Curbow said:


> I don't know either guy, but TB sure seems like a stalker, LOL. Strange stuff in the dog world.........


Some strange mofos and some real goofy bastards.


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## Thomas Barriano (Mar 27, 2006)

Al Curbow said:


> I don't know either guy, but TB sure seems like a stalker, LOL. Strange stuff in the dog world.........


Think what ever you want Al. Look at the video of the "WORLD Championship, look at the video of Butch's own dogs. Look at the video of this "EAST COAST FINAL" if you think this is a legitimate "International Protection Dog Sport", then have another sip of the kool aid and chalk up everything I've
posted as stalking. LMAO


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## Bob Scott (Mar 30, 2006)

The bullshit stops NOW!


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