# Difficulty taking a dump



## Eugene duplissis (Sep 23, 2009)

A budy of mine has a GSD that he just switched to grain free and is adding small amounts of raw to the dogs diet. The dog looks much better and has more energy, but takes a while to shit and is usually hunched and straining for too long. Any suggestions other than K9 readers digest. I advised to wait a while as the dog needs to get used to the new diet, but it has been three weeks. I got him to add raw so this is my problem to solve. 
 yes I did a search and no results.


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## Sue Calkins (Nov 5, 2009)

try a tablespoon of canned pumpkin with the food, or slippery elm. Also some veggie grind helps, make sure there's not too much bone in the diet.
Sue


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## Tammy St. Louis (Feb 17, 2010)

had a shep who boarded here and she was on raw , alot of chicken backs , legs , she had such a hard time pooping, and little tiny poops came out , she cried a couple times i saw when pooping, and one time there was blood also , he ended up switching her to the ultimate diet and taking all the bones away and she has been fine since then, 
maybe too many bones?


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## Lynn Cheffins (Jul 11, 2006)

Grain-free dog foods tend to use low fibre/bulk carbs like potato etc and the raw can be pretty low residue depending on what you are feeding. I would add psyllium (1/2 tsp to start) to the dogs meal. Psyllium is a good addition anyway for lower gut health


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## Carol Boche (May 13, 2007)

Eugene duplissis said:


> A budy of mine has a GSD that he just switched to grain free and is adding small amounts of raw to the dogs diet. The dog looks much better and has more energy, but takes a while to shit and is usually hunched and straining for too long. Any suggestions other than K9 readers digest. I advised to wait a while as the dog needs to get used to the new diet, but it has been three weeks. I got him to add raw so this is my problem to solve.
> yes I did a search and no results.


What grain free food? What kind of raw? and is your friend mixing it? How much water does the dog drink? And yes, I agree with the pumpkin (not pie filling but real canned pumpkin)


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## James Downey (Oct 27, 2008)

Sue Calkins said:


> try a tablespoon of canned pumpkin with the food, or slippery elm. Also some veggie grind helps, make sure there's not too much bone in the diet.
> Sue


I second this advice. The pumpkin has to be REAL though. Thier is canned pumpkin pie bs...Get real canned pumpkin. Works both ways, on hard stool and runny. It will make the poop the right consistency.

I feed grain free kibble and raw. I do not have these problems. After 3 weeks. I know this sounds dirty. But I have pulled foriegn objects out of my dogs colon before. mostly tennis balls they found somewhere are swallowed pieces of. 

Any blood? red, do not worry so much about. dark, almost black...is not always bad news but it could be.


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## Maureen A Osborn (Feb 12, 2010)

what kibble did he switch to? also, raw and kibble should not be fed at the same meal from what I have been told fromt he raw forums, it takes different enzymes to break each down. COuld also be too much bone. Bone should only consist of about 10% (approx. 80% meatymeat, 10% edible digestible bone & 10% organ - 3-5% liver, 5-7% 'other). I know of people that feed their dogs a lot more and their dogs poop "white balls of powder" which is TOO much bone in the diet. Here is an awesome flrum on Facebook on raw diet
http://www.facebook.com/group.php?g...373072738&ref=ts#!/group.php?gid=261761471359


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## Bob Scott (Mar 30, 2006)

Try a couple of prunes and a bran muffin in the mornings and........... :-k..........:-o 8-[...........nevermind!8-[


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## Anne Vaini (Mar 15, 2007)

Maureen A Osborn said:


> what kibble did he switch to? also, raw and kibble should not be fed at the same meal from what I have been told fromt he raw forums, it takes different enzymes to break each down. COuld also be too much bone. Bone should only consist of about 10% (approx. 80% meatymeat, 10% edible digestible bone & 10% organ - 3-5% liver, 5-7% 'other). I know of people that feed their dogs a lot more and their dogs poop "white balls of powder" which is TOO much bone in the diet. Here is an awesome flrum on Facebook on raw diet
> http://www.facebook.com/group.php?g...373072738&ref=ts#!/group.php?gid=261761471359


 
Not feeding raw and kibble together is a valid point, but "it takes different enzymes to break each down" is not.

I don't think your numbers are correct. I would have to put out some textbooks and do some math because I've lost my notes. I remember it was somewhere in the 20 - 30% bone in order to get the macrominerals balanced out. In addition - ALL bones fed should be "edible" non-weight-bearing bones.

I agree with previous posters to reevaluate the raw diet "recipe" and add fiber to the diet in the short term.


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## Maren Bell Jones (Jun 7, 2006)

James Downey said:


> I second this advice. The pumpkin has to be REAL though. Thier is canned pumpkin pie bs...Get real canned pumpkin. Works both ways, on hard stool and runny. It will make the poop the right consistency.
> 
> I feed grain free kibble and raw. I do not have these problems. After 3 weeks. I know this sounds dirty. But I have pulled foriegn objects out of my dogs colon before. mostly tennis balls they found somewhere are swallowed pieces of.
> 
> Any blood? red, do not worry so much about. dark, almost black...is not always bad news but it could be.


Oh yeah, don't worry if your dog has a foreign body that could be perforating its bowel causing the frank blood in the stool. And don't worry about black tarry stools where the body is digesting blood in the GI tract. Nothing to worry about surely. :roll: ](*,)


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## James Downey (Oct 27, 2008)

Maren Bell Jones said:


> Oh yeah, don't worry if your dog has a foreign body that could be perforating its bowel causing the frank blood in the stool. And don't worry about black tarry stools where the body is digesting blood in the GI tract. Nothing to worry about surely. :roll: ](*,)


 
Yep, do not worry. Because Maren bell has the worst comprehension skills ever.


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## James Downey (Oct 27, 2008)

Also as a Veternarian she obviously do not go through any classes that talked about catching more flys with honey than you do with vinegar, but she did go to the ones that teach you how to be self important and condesending and I am willing to bet a pay check she got an A in that one.

So to the OP, Yep a small amount of red blood is probably just from a chapped asshole. If she had major perforations that were life threatening, I believe your probably a smart enough person to know that a lot of blood is bad. And I think you may have read that dark blood, maybe of some concern. Because that's what I wrote. Maren Bell missed that.....And she's going to be a really important vet on day. And if she missed it, a laymen dipshit like me or you may not even know how to read. 

I also think that if she'd taken time read that this problem has been going on for three weeks. And if it was caused by some sort of blockage and the dog had peforations...We would be telling you how sorry we are for your loss. 

Maren Bell. Your a vet student....we all know this. Your mother must be very proud. But your lack of experience shows when you hit the panic button all the time. I have been working in Emergency response and emergency medicine for over 10 years....when you get there you will learn that Grey's Anatomy is just a T.V. show....and Animal Cops has been dramatized. So stop acting like every dog with constipation is melting from the inside out. And when others try to help out and do not set code red for a simple constipation problem.... Especially when I asked if there was blood....up until that point there was not blood...actually there still is no blood. I was just deducting the possibilities. But if you think we need the paddles in case of sudden cardiac arrest....Go stand in the corner with them.


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## Maren Bell Jones (Jun 7, 2006)

:lol::lol::lol: So you're saying if you had severe constipation, pain from straining, and frank blood or black tarry stool coming from YOUR rectum, wouldn't you call your doctor and you'd rely on internet advice instead? #-oFrank blood can be a perforation in the large or small bowel, black tarry stool can be digested blood from a perforation or a bleeding ulcer from the stomach. Both of which that can be from bones (either raw or cooked if they splinter) AND are emergency situations that need prompt attention. So yes, it does relate and giving advice like, "eh, if you see it, no biggie" is just stupid.


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## Eugene duplissis (Sep 23, 2009)

The kibble is California natural venison meal formula and the raw is a patty I make with venison, fish, chicken, potatoes, brocolli, chicken and fish bones are all ground through a grinder with livers heart etc. etc


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## Eugene duplissis (Sep 23, 2009)

Oh and no blood yes that is a trip to the vet.


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## Connie Sutherland (Mar 27, 2006)

Eugene duplissis said:


> The kibble is California natural venison meal formula and the raw is a patty I make with venison, fish, chicken, potatoes, brocolli, chicken and fish bones are all ground through a grinder with livers heart etc. etc





I don't recommend mixing kibble and raw, despite the fact that many do, but we've had that discussion a hundred times.

Why potato?

Constipation makes me look at the amount of bone.


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## Eugene duplissis (Sep 23, 2009)

Potatoes
 I just read the ingredients to a few dog foods I liked and tried to mirror them and combine what I liked. I don't know much about the nutrition requirements for dogs, but judging by most of the dog foods out there neither does anyone else. I have heard starch is not the best for dogs, but it is the 4th ingredient in Orijen which is the favorite dog food of this forum. But a little expensive so I switched salmon and herring for bass and perch and the rest just looks like berries, weeds, and hippie tea leftovers.
 I usually will use whatever extra veggies we have around that I have seen as an ingredient. Although I did use asparagus stalks once and that went through well. The food I make is mostly meat (meat, bone, organ meat, spam type substances) and maybe 15 to 20% veggies I also add dandelion leaves, chamomile,parsley and whatever else seems non toxic. 
 I would love to see a study that said "Completed by the reputable university of______ or after a two year study by Dr _____ this is a good menu for your working dogs" Until then its road kill, spare chicken parts, hunting season leftovers, and misc veggies that hopefully don't kill em. 
 I have noticed a huge difference in the dogs as many of us have gone from cheap food to the Evo's, California's,etc and are slowly adding raw.


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## Connie Sutherland (Mar 27, 2006)

Kibble can't be made (the kibbling, or extrusion, process can't be done) without something like grain added. If grain is left out, potato or sweet potato or tapioca or some other starch is used instead.

This doesn't mean that a home-prepared diet has any need for potato, though; its inclusion in kibble is process-based rather than nutrition-based.

Greens like celery tops and parsley, both lacking stiff cell walls that dogs can't digest, are great.


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## Carol Boche (May 13, 2007)

I feed sweet potatoes once a week....because they LOVE them....I do use them as training treats too...after boiling to almost soft I refridgerate them and then cube. 

I don't feed white potatoes at all.


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## Connie Sutherland (Mar 27, 2006)

Carol Boche said:


> I feed sweet potatoes once a week....because they LOVE them....I do use them as training treats too...after boiling to almost soft I refridgerate them and then cube.
> 
> I don't feed white potatoes at all.




I occasionally give the orange winter squashes, cooked and cubed for a treat, for the same reasons. They LOVE them. :lol:

I don't give any white potato, either.


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## Eugene duplissis (Sep 23, 2009)

That makes sense Connie. :-k Thank you.


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