# Bravo Food?



## Chris McDonald (May 29, 2008)

My dog was raised on raw, full chicken mostly feathers and al, then I got him and decided it was to much of a pain to do the whole total raw thing. So I had a freezer full of turkey necks, chicken quarters and whatever red meat was cheap. Other than an occasional rabbits or whatever was being sold at the skankest butcher around that was all he got raw. It consisted of about half of his intake. After taking him to Costa Rica where he was feed a raw diet for two weeks (lots of red meat, must be cheap in Costa) I and everyone else notched a big difference in everything in coat, eyes etc. But it says the following on the package. What is this stuff supposed to be mixed with? 
should it be mixed with other stuff on there site? 
 http://bravosnaturalrearing.com/Main/products.htm 

*Directions for use:* for the further manufacture of animal feed – Do not feed as is or free choice. To be added to blended animal feed under the supervision of a veterinary nutritionist. This supplement contains selenium – selenium from all sources should not exceed 0.3 ppm in the complete animal feed.








*Ingredients: Beef, Tripe, Trachea, Finely Ground Bone, Salt, Egg & Trace Minerals* 

*Meeting AAFCO Specifications for Maintenance & Reproduction*
*Guaranteed Analysis • No Preservatives*​Protein14%Ash1.30%Fat10%Calcium.13%Fiber.85%Phosphorus.14%Net Wt. 5lbs.
Keep Frozen until ready to use.








For Animal Consumption Only​ 5lb. Tubes
2lb. Tubes​ 2.50¢
2.55¢ <BLOCKQUOTE><DIV class=Section1>
<SPAN class=subHead><B style="mso-bidi-font-weight: normal"><FONT face=Tahoma><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold; mso-bidi-font-weight: normal">CUSTOM VITAMIN – TRACE MINERAL PREMIX


----------



## Skip Morgart (Dec 19, 2008)

When you said "Bravo Food", I thought you were talking about the same Bravo Raw stuff I buy, but I checked and they are 2 different companies. Check this one out:

http://www.bravorawdiet.com/bravoproducts.html

Very good stuff, but I don't feed it by itself. I just mix it in (about 1/3 Bravo) with a good kibble.


----------



## Connie Sutherland (Mar 27, 2006)

Skip Morgart said:


> When you said "Bravo Food", I thought you were talking about the same Bravo Raw stuff I buy, but I checked and they are 2 different companies. Check this one out:
> 
> http://www.bravorawdiet.com/bravoproducts.html
> 
> Very good stuff, but I don't feed it by itself. I just mix it in (about 1/3 Bravo) with a good kibble.


Thanks, Skip. I followed the first link too and thought that I had crossed into some alternate cyberspace.


----------



## Chris McDonald (May 29, 2008)

Skip Morgart said:


> When you said "Bravo Food", I thought you were talking about the same Bravo Raw stuff I buy, but I checked and they are 2 different companies. Check this one out:
> 
> http://www.bravorawdiet.com/bravoproducts.html
> 
> Very good stuff, but I don't feed it by itself. I just mix it in (about 1/3 Bravo) with a good kibble.


 
Your right not the same stuff, I always been told not to feed raw mixed with kibble. Heard several reasons for this don’t know if any are true. But anyway I rarely, if ever mix kibble with raw. Is there a reason you don’t feed it by itself?


----------



## Connie Sutherland (Mar 27, 2006)

Chris McDonald said:


> Your right not the same stuff, I always been told not to feed raw mixed with kibble. Heard several reasons for this don’t know if any are true. But anyway I rarely, if ever mix kibble with raw. Is there a reason you don’t feed it by itself?


Many people do feed raw with kibble.

But if I wanted to feed kibble and raw, it would be at separate meals.


----------



## Skip Morgart (Dec 19, 2008)

Chris McDonald said:


> Your right not the same stuff, I always been told not to feed raw mixed with kibble. Heard several reasons for this don’t know if any are true. But anyway I rarely, if ever mix kibble with raw. Is there a reason you don’t feed it by itself?


A couple reasons:
First, it says on the package that "This product is intended for intermittent or supplemental feeding only". Second, it would be a little pricey just feeding that. There is no valid reason for not feeding both (kibble and raw) together. I know quite a few people that have been doing it much longer that I have, and I've been doing it for about 6 years with very good results. I've heard a couple old wive's tales...stuff about raw is digested so much different and it confuses the system if both are fed at the same time...etc..etc.., all of it bull. Feeding both at the same time is fine.


----------



## Chris McDonald (May 29, 2008)

Skip Morgart said:


> A couple reasons:
> First, it says on the package that "This product is intended for intermittent or supplemental feeding only". Second, it would be a little pricey just feeding that. There is no valid reason for not feeding both (kibble and raw) together. I know quite a few people that have been doing it much longer that I have, and I've been doing it for about 6 years with very good results. I've heard a couple old wive's tales...stuff about raw is digested so much different and it confuses the system if both are fed at the same time...etc..etc.., all of it bull. Feeding both at the same time is fine.


If it’s a true full raw diet why intermittent or supplemental only to me that kind of falling into the dog biscuit category


----------



## Chris McDonald (May 29, 2008)

So Connie says it’s OK to feed raw and kibble but not at the same time. This is what I typically hear for whatever the reason. I don’t mix it, its just as easer to go into the freezer and grab a few turkey necks and chicken quarters one day and a scoop or two of kibble the next day. Although I see Skips side and don’t “think” it would harm. I just don’t because it is easier not to. My question is does anyone see a reason why I can’t feed the food I posted exclusively? The same manufacture has a product called a meat eaters diet that I was told was not as good, but maybe that was the food that meant to be feed exclusively. Anyway we look at it I got a few hundred pounds in my freezer that someone is eating one way or another


----------



## Connie Sutherland (Mar 27, 2006)

Chris McDonald said:


> So Connie says it’s OK to feed raw and kibble but not at the same time.





Kinda. 

I said IF I wanted to feed both, it would be at separate meals.


----------



## Connie Sutherland (Mar 27, 2006)

Chris McDonald said:


> My question is does anyone see a reason why I can’t feed the food I posted exclusively?


I didn't see the ingredients. I believe it was boneless and organless. That would be a nutritional disaster.

Do you mean you have that in the freezer, or what? The first post mentioned turkey necks, etc.

What is it that you already have and want to use?


----------



## Connie Sutherland (Mar 27, 2006)

Many owners mix kibble and raw with nary a problem.

Here is my biggest problem with it (nothing to do with "confusing the system" :lol: ):

Dogs have a couple of great defenses against pathogen colonization making them sick.

One is their stomach acid, which is far more caustic than our own.

Another is their short fast digestive system. (Ours is looooooong and slooooooow.) That short journey from one end to the other is great for limiting the opportunity for food pathogens to colonize (and that's what causes the illness: their proliferation). 

(In fact, there are several classes of meds that contribute to human susceptibility to food pathogen illness, such as antacids, etc., and one of them is any med that slows the passage of food through the gastrointestinal tract.)

Fresh food takes about 3 to 6 hours for dogs to digest. Kibble takes two to three times as long. IOW, the kibble slows the process by a lot, thereby affecting one of the two biggest defenses dogs have against foodborne pathogens.

I would not give antacids to a dog on raw and I would not cause the digestion time to be two or three times the natural raw-processing rate.

Again, many people do it. Many dogs are fine with it, and nothing ever happens.

But I think it's not a good idea. So if I wanted to feed both, they would be in different meals, at the other end of the day from each other.


----------



## Chris McDonald (May 29, 2008)

Connie Sutherland said:


> I didn't see the ingredients. I believe it was boneless and organless. That would be a nutritional disaster.
> 
> Do you ean you have that in the freezer, or what? The first post mentioned turkey necks, etc.
> 
> What is it that you already have and want to use?


 
Yes I typically had a freezer full of turkey necks, chicken quarters and some other parts. I would buy them by the case and then throw one of each in a zip lock. But I was not really getting much guts with anything so I was also giving kibble, plus kibble is so convenient. They got the kibble or a chunk of frozen on different days, my Dutch Sheppard only eats once a day, and he skips a day here and there especially if he is looking like he is gaining a few. What I am trying to do is feed a total raw diet without having to mess around at the butchers and was wondering if this would do it. I will still be throwing them turkey necks and other parts once in a while but is this frozen stuff in the wrapper better than a high quality kibble (if there is such a thing)


----------



## todd pavlus (Apr 30, 2008)

Definately need some organ meat in there. Usually prepacked raw diet is extremely expensive.


----------



## Chris McDonald (May 29, 2008)

Can you make a full raw diet out of the list below.... I dont know what is in the "Meat eaters diet" what about the beef hearts, Steer liver? 
Some how I got the performance diet thinking I was doing good. Maybe I will get some of the other stuff to mix in 





*Product**Description**How Supplied**Price per pound*Beef​
Coarsely Ground

** _Protein Not Less Than 18%_
_Crude Fat 2.00%_
_Crude Fiber Not Less 0.50%_ 5lb. Tubes
2lb. Tubes$2.50

$2.60Green Tripe​
Coarsely Ground
** _Click Photo for More Info_ 5lb. Tubes
2lb. Tubes $2.35

$2.50Performance Dog

Beef, Tripe, Trachea, Finely Ground Bone, Salt, Egg & Trace Minerals
** _Click Photo for More Info_​5lb. Tubes
2lb. Tubes $2.50

$2.55Meat Eaters Diet​
Fully Nutritionally Balanced Formula

** _Click Photo for More Info_5lb. Tubes$2.40Beef Hearts​
Diced
Whole 10lb. Bags
Per pound $1.65

$1.50Steer Liver​
Diced
Whole 10lb. Bags
Per pound $2.00
$1.85Trachea 2lb packages$2.55Beef Tongue SplitPer pound $2.35Ox Tails Per pound


----------



## Connie Sutherland (Mar 27, 2006)

So do you now own any of this stuff?

I will read up and find out what is in what you have, and what you would need to provide in addition, but I don't want to research the whole site if you have certain items to use. 

Do you have the Performance Dog product? What else?


----------



## Chris McDonald (May 29, 2008)

Connie Sutherland said:


> So do you now own any of this stuff?
> 
> I will read up and find out what is in what you have, and what you would need to provide in addition, but I don't want to research the whole site if you have certain items to use.
> 
> Do you have the Performance Dog product? What else?


 
I have a freezer full of the Performance Dog Product. I was expecting to add to it. I was hoping chicken and turkey parts. Although I appreciate all your input please don’t spend too much time on things. I have seen your post before and Im not worthy. I’ll just F it up. I need to keep it very simple. If I need to have a few of their other products that is no problem, but for the most part my dogs will have to get a total diet over time, it won’t be very likely that I will be spending 10 minutes a night mixing things up. I’m just starting to think that even the best kibble is poison compared to a half decent raw diet. I guess I am looking for a pre-manufactured raw food that I could use in place of kibble in-between feeding chicken, turkey and other raw parts. 
They have pretty limited info on their site 
Thanks


----------



## Connie Sutherland (Mar 27, 2006)

Okey-doke.

I will see what the Performance Dog might be short on and what food you'd need to add to it to make up. Tomorrow.


----------



## Chris McDonald (May 29, 2008)

Sorry, I had to speak the truth about myself. I didn’t want you to think I was going to be breaking out the blender or cutting up carrots 
Thanks for your help


----------



## Steve Strom (May 25, 2008)

Chris McDonald said:


> I have a freezer full of the Performance Dog Product. I was expecting to add to it. I was hoping chicken and turkey parts. Although I appreciate all your input please don’t spend too much time on things. I have seen your post before and Im not worthy. I’ll just F it up. I need to keep it very simple. If I need to have a few of their other products that is no problem, but for the most part my dogs will have to get a total diet over time, it won’t be very likely that I will be spending 10 minutes a night mixing things up. I’m just starting to think that even the best kibble is poison compared to a half decent raw diet. I guess I am looking for a pre-manufactured raw food that I could use in place of kibble in-between feeding chicken, turkey and other raw parts.
> They have pretty limited info on their site
> Thanks


For commercial raw diets that are reasonably available, there's the bravo Skip linked, there's Nature's Variety, and you could also consider Honest Kitchen(Not frozen, it's dehydrated) And H-K also has a meat free base that you can add your own meat and RMBs to.


----------



## Chris McDonald (May 29, 2008)

Steve Strom said:


> For commercial raw diets that are reasonably available, there's the bravo Skip linked, there's Nature's Variety, and you could also consider Honest Kitchen(Not frozen, it's dehydrated) And H-K also has a meat free base that you can add your own meat and RMBs to.


 
Thanks Steve, it just happens that this place is convenient for me to get bulk at a realistic price. those little frozen dog hamburgers from the local feed store just isn’t realistic to do for a full diet. I am really wondering if a partial raw diet has much of an advantage over full kibble. It seems to me it might be all or none to get the results.


----------



## Connie Sutherland (Mar 27, 2006)

Chris McDonald said:


> ... I didn’t want you to think I was going to be breaking out the blender or cutting up carrots
> Thanks for your help



Neither do I. Blender OR carrots. :lol: :lol:


----------



## Connie Sutherland (Mar 27, 2006)

Connie Sutherland said:


> Okey-doke.
> 
> I will see what the Performance Dog might be short on and what food you'd need to add to it to make up. Tomorrow.


The calcium on that product is so unexpectedly low that I almost think it's a mis-print. 

I would expect to see 1.3%, 1.1%, 1.6%, numbers like that, but it has 0.13%. That's 10% (ballpark) of what you'd expect to be in a blend of meat and bone for dogs.

Anyway, I'm just gonna given them a quick call tomorrow and ask if it's a typo or if that item is supposed to be used as part of a diet that gets calcium elsewhere.

So more later.


----------



## Connie Sutherland (Mar 27, 2006)

Well, this was quite an adventure.

OK, this is a family-run business, and I mean family only. Three people.

The one covering for the brother who would have this kind of info (but is ill) honestly did not know how to answer me. He shared with me the fact that someone else had called him today and wanted to know how many calories were in one of the products, but he "didn't know if it had calories at all, so I couldn't help him." I assured him that all food has calories, and he was interested to learn that.

Anyway, nice guy, and he gave me a name and number to call. This person, he says, is someone who buys tons of their products and at the least would be able to advise you about which products should be added to the one you have.

Obviously, this guy (Mark, and the company is pronounced like Brave-oh, not like the other Bravo company) had no idea about whether the calcium content was a typo.

So .... I don't know. I'm not super-comfortable here, because (please note) that food you bought, if the numbers are not typos, is NOT a stand-alone food, IMO.

So I will PM you with the name and phone number that Mark at Bravo gave me.


----------



## Connie Sutherland (Mar 27, 2006)

I forgot to say, "Jerry's brother Mark" is who you say told you to call.

I feel like I am arranging something so much more interesting than calcium info on frozen beef for dogs.


----------



## Chris McDonald (May 29, 2008)

Connie Sutherland said:


> I forgot to say, "Jerry's brother Mark" is who you say told you to call.
> 
> I feel like I am arranging something so much more interesting than calcium info on frozen beef for dogs.


 
Your , sisters, aunts, brothers, cousin? 
Thanks you very much, I will let you know how I make out 
So if you took a narcotic k9 into a warehouse full of 1000s of pounds of raw meat and bones could it find the dope? 
Thanks again


----------



## Michael Wise (Sep 14, 2008)

Connie Sutherland said:


> I feel like I am arranging something so much more interesting than calcium info on frozen beef for dogs.


Are they suppose to meet at midnight down by the loading dock at the harbor?


----------

