# Question about the sleeve they are using...



## Toran Scott (Mar 27, 2009)

This vid may have been posted before. I happened to stumble across it today. I was curious if the half sleeves I see them using can be bought like that (does someone manufacture them that way) or are they just regular sleeves that they cut the shoulder guard out of? I like what they are able to do with the sleeve and my arm isn't quite long enough to bend a full sleeve like that. Just curious. 

Does anyone else use methods similar for working on fast "launching" type entries.While I am pretty confident that a good portion of this is genetics I know you can slow a banger down considerably if he/she is jammed or juked enough. I prefer to not do very many long attacks in training as it only takes one or two poor catches to begin slowing a dog up. There half sleeve and wedge seems to allow them to do more of the frontal attack while keeping the dogs from "planting" (hitting with front legs first) before the bite to absorb the impact. My Dutchie is a flyer but she like to be very center on frontal attacks which can make her very hard to catch, especially in a sleeve. 

Either way enjoy the video. I'm really curious what people's opinions will be (i'm sure they will be varied).
Thanks,
Toran
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4gilN-GWVKg&NR=1&feature=fvwp


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## Tanith Wheeler (Jun 5, 2009)

Using a wedge like that is the kind of thing I would do with a young dog before putting it on the sleeve - less impact, very fun.

The half-sleeve is again a confidence building thing, enables the helper to slip it off really quick and hence reward the dog. Maybe the video was a drive building session or something - the dogs seemed quite young.

Just my 2 pence


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## Toran Scott (Mar 27, 2009)

There looked to be a few younger dogs but there were a number of older dogs as well on the wedge and shorty sleeve (also a number of them on a regular sleeve as well). Even Master was caught near the end of the video. A number of those dogs were in the Czech WUSV nationals in 08. I assume these are Czech trainers... they are skilled decoys, nice, safe catches and good work (at least what little work after the bite you see).


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## Guest (Dec 1, 2008)

:34 mark oh oh was that an airdale.....


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## Toran Scott (Mar 27, 2009)

And I think a Groendale in their as well... hhhmmmmm 
I just watched their "best of #2" vid and they certainly have a number of nice dogs that they get to work. Looks like an Master son who is a banger and another Mali that comes in super fast and the ears never come up... and they have a ton of hard hitting shepherds as well. A pleasure to watch.


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## Joby Becker (Dec 13, 2009)

toran....thanks for finding that vid..I saw it before and looked in my youtube for a hour to post in the vid of the good long bites....

I don't care what anyone says, those entries are impressive to me...a fair amount of wedges...and that half sleeve can be any sleeve that has a separate shoulder guard that is strapped or buckled on...

and DON that IS an airedale, showing prey on a training device,,,


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## Mario Fernandez (Jun 21, 2008)

The sleeves in the video are just the bottom half of two pieces sleeve. Majority of the two piece sleeves are disposable meaning can not replace the cover. 

You can buy half sleeves with replaceable sleeve covers. Euro Joe, Sporthund and HST make a nice one. You can get a half sleeve here in the US at Allk-9.com, A good tool for you dogs and old dogs. The only knock I have about the half sleeves is no support for your elbow unlike a regular sleeve. .

Gappay has a new wedge that you can put on as a sleeve as well and you can buy a replaceable sleeve cover. 


As far as method we use at our club. Drag bites into the helper. We have a 100ft long line we use w/ welder gloves. All the dogs no matter what level will be worked on this at some point. A safe technique with the long line as we can control the resistance and the level the dog must work for the bite. Plus anybody can handle the line and not have to worry about distance per say with bungee. We can make a miss if need be, we can stop the dog on the courage test and use some frustration, also we can control the speed of the dog when working on new helper or doing some crazy sleeve presentations. Seen dogs improve overall with targeting and commitment.


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## Gerry Grimwood (Apr 2, 2007)

I was suprised that out of all those bite wedge scenes I could only see one guy at around the 5 minute mark that looked like he had to let go, and nobody even stumbled really.


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## Derek Milliken (Apr 19, 2009)

I've seen a few of the manufacturers are now making 1/2 sleeves like that.
dogsportgear.com sells something like that, although I've never used one.
I know I've seen them other places as well, but I'm not at my personal computer to be able to find them for you.


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## Toran Scott (Mar 27, 2009)

Thanks guys... I figured the resident sleeve expert (Mario) could help me out  . I was pretty sure that I had seen a manufacturer or two make a shorty sleeve but the ones in the vid looked to be chopped but I really couldn't tell. Thanks for sharing that technique as well Mario, makes sense and allows for a bit more control, especially depending on the skill level of the decoy. Glad you like the vid Joby... there is another one that is just as fun without the music, I'll try to find it...


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## Thomas Barriano (Mar 27, 2006)

Derek Milliken said:


> I've seen a few of the manufacturers are now making 1/2 sleeves like that.
> dogsportgear.com sells something like that, although I've never used one.
> I know I've seen them other places as well, but I'm not at my personal computer to be able to find them for you.


Dog Sport Gear sells the red line half sleeve for $125 
All K9 sells the same sleeve for $149 ?


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## Joby Becker (Dec 13, 2009)

ray allen sells sleeves of a few different models that have separate upper and lower halfs..


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## Mario Fernandez (Jun 21, 2008)

The difference in price is due to one website DSG sells with w/o the $25 sleeve covered require for the half sleeve and allk-9 sells it with the Sleeve cover included.

The half sleeve is nice, easy for the dog to carry but really no support for your elbow.


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## andreas broqvist (Jun 2, 2009)

Gappays.

I like the first one. 
http://www.gappay.cz/index.php?id=c...-a-navleky/zkracene-univerzalni/rukav-trainer

http://www.gappay.cz/index.php?id=c...vy-a-navleky/zkracene-univerzalni/rukav-jumbo


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## Thomas Barriano (Mar 27, 2006)

Mario Fernandez said:


> The difference in price is due to one website DSG sells with w/o the $25 sleeve covered require for the half sleeve and allk-9 sells it with the Sleeve cover included.
> 
> The half sleeve is nice, easy for the dog to carry but really no support for your elbow.


WWW.ALLK-9.COM,
is running a 15% off sale this weekend (Friday-Sunday) so if you're thinking of getting one, this might be a good time 
Use coupon code 283011 at check out


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## Mario Fernandez (Jun 21, 2008)

Bende make a similar version. 

http://www.bendeitalia.com/catalogo_bendeitalia/cat044.htm

and a half sleeve. 

http://www.bendeitalia.com/catalogo_bendeitalia/cat042.htm


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## Pete Stevens (Dec 16, 2010)

Believe Mario...the guy knows his stuff.


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## Derek Milliken (Apr 19, 2009)

DSG is also running the same sale, 15% off, on the same sleeve. Thinking it's everyone linked in to redline.
Like I said, I've never used one of these 1/2 sleeves. But I think it's more a question of catching some really fast dogs, over and over. Learning to use what you have, properly.
Love my old Gappay, pretty sure I can catch most any dog on it. Wouldn't make that brag with my newer Schweikert.
Maybe these 1/2 sleeves are more of a gimmick than anything else?


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## Toran Scott (Mar 27, 2009)

Mario is definitely the go to guy for questions with sleeves  
I don't know that anyone "needs" a half sleeve but I can see them having some value beyond simply being a gimmick, easy on, easy slip, probably easy to re-insert your arm for more fight when dog's on the bite. The reason I am personally interested has to do with angling my arm like they are in the video to set up the appropriate target off to the side of the body. My arm just doesn't want to do that in a full sleeve. I think it's due to the length of my arm and the shoulder guard but I may not have the most flexible arms either . I'd like to see if it helps. 
Thanks for all the input. Hope you guys enjoyed the video at least 
Toran


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