# Where did all these "trainers" come from?



## chris haynie (Sep 15, 2009)

i have a CGC, a Novice agility and a CD title on my dog. i am not a great trainer. mediocre at best, thats why i am here and going to get a working dog to train in schutzhund or french ring. it will make me a better trainer. i would not call my self "great" trainer and will not take from money from people to help with thier dogs. i have several friends and associates who have asked me to help them on really basic shit with thier pet dogs and have done so, primarily to stop them from pestering me all the time.

recently i have noticed a very large increase in the number of totally unqualified "pet dog trainers" in my area.

seems like everytime i make a delivery to a store that stocks my products theres some "trainer" there hanging out passing out business cards and pamplets promopting thier business. most of these poeple have never titled a dog in anything and have just gone to some month long "trainers academy" somewhere. i have a feeling alot of these place grant certifications to anyone whose tuition check clears the bank. 

just tonight i was working with my dog at the park down the street. we go there several times a week to do stupid agility shit on the playground equipment. i have fun with it and it beats paying to run the agility gear at the local training club. tonight and last night we worked on position changes on top of playground equipment, and broad and high jumps over and through various kid play stuff. 

some lady came around with a puffy curly coated dog wearing an ecollar. she was shocking the shit out of him from the moment they came up our way. no rewards around, just compulsion from the e-collar and very poor timing with it from what i saw. she insisted on giving me her card and pamphlet and gave me a "hard sale" speech about her methods and training. 

i asked her what titles she had put on what dogs. how long had she been training? what kind of dog she have with her tonight.

her answers were as follows: none, 6 months since she finished her 3 week "trainer in a can" course at some dog training school in kansas, and a goldendoodle she bought after she finished her training school.

she then tried to convince me i should pa her 75$ an hour to "teach my dog things she learned in trainers school"

has anyone else noticed an increase in unqualified and probably really bad "trainers" since the economy went south? is it just my area or have these types popped up elsewhere? any ideas on why? did all these animal planet and cesar milan shows make pet dog training the cool new job? 

i did drink several beers with my neighboor after we trained tonight so if this is all a half drunken cluster**** that makes no sense to ya'll please disregard and lock thread.


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## Chris McDonald (May 29, 2008)

I guess if they are better than a dogs owner they are qualified, that three week course probably does it. 99% of the owners out there don’t want much from their dogs and that’s what these people deliver. The owners just want a dog to Sit when they mean Sit. It works out well.


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## Maren Bell Jones (Jun 7, 2006)

Well, they show Cesar Millan and Victoria "Has to Have a Hissy Fit Every Episode" Stillwell driving around in these cool cars looking like movie stars, so they probably figure they can supplement their income. Which is their right, I suppose, since you don't have to have any sort of education or qualification to be a trainer. Pet dog behavior counseling type training is where the money is after all, just because there's such a broader market for it.


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## Anne Pridemore (Mar 20, 2010)

Uneducated "trainers" abound. ](*,) Some of the worst will have "professional certification" from a corprate pet store monster. I have seen the BINDER that teaches these people to train your dog, you would be better off with the '60s Kohler book. The sad fact is that anyone can say "I'm a dog trainer". Even worse is people who blindly give up their cash to "trainers" that rob them blind, can't fix/train the dog, and tell the owner some stupid crap like the dog is "highly aggressive and a danger to own". Worse case the dog dies because some great pretender has steped up to ruin people's lives and distroy their dogs.

As a dog owner all you can do is sift through the lies and BS and protect you own dog. Also being a dog person, one would hope, that you would pass these lessons on finding a good trainer on to others. If everyone was educated not one pretender would make a dime.

As for finding that good trainer, look at the trainer's dog. That dog will tell you everything you need to know about the limits of its trainers methods. A dog refects it's master, absolutely.


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## Jonathan Katz (Jan 11, 2010)

I really don't mind these know nothing dog trainers. They only make me look better to clients when they meet me. I also hate the hard sell! Only when the dog tries to kill me on the eval, do I hard sell (for everyones safety). Being a trainer in the NY\NJ area, I can only sell these people myself and my experience. Many trainers try to do business here, but most can not!


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## Jeff Oehlsen (Apr 7, 2006)

How much is the "dog training in a can" ?? I could use a couple cans after the ass ****ing my dog just gave me. :lol::lol::lol:

I have no certifications at all. I went to a lot of seminars, and paid a lot of money a long time ago when I was a much better trainer. Most of the time it was the same old tired shit, just delivered by someone new. Every once in a while, I would find some cool new shit to try.

I do not like training pet dogs. I hate their little quitter owners. I also have to face God at the end of this life, so there lies my conundrum. 

In the nightclubs, I had no problem relieving drunky the clown of his money. But I also did not have to argue with him about the method that I made his/her drink. For many of these pets, I will be one of the last chances they get to not get put down. Hopefully, I won't get a lot of those again. Mostly, I just hate taking money for something I like to do, as long as the owner is not a pain in the ass.

The last time that I did pet training, I had several clients that were just pure gold. They worked their dogs everyday, and I couldn't have been happier. However several, out of a few hundred make for a long long day. The no shows were a lot of fun as well. No need to call, better to show up two weeks later, and then bitch because the dog is not learning fast enough, and still pulls on the leash. Good times.

Now, ME (mr no certificate, no patience for idiocy) is going back to pet training to see about making some money. Hope you don't hate me to much for it.


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## Dana McMahan (Apr 5, 2006)

For the most part it doesn't bother me because most of them charge 1/3 of what I charge and the owners eventually come find someone with qualifications after having a few bad lessons. I use to be part of the "graduation" process for the ABC school. Their trainers would have to come attend a group class without a dog, one time with a dog, and one time teach. I'd give their student's D's and F's because they were late, unprepared, missed classes, or couldn't explain simple behaviors. I eventually read the text book and understood. There was only one way in their mind of how to teach things. These trainers couldn't speak in public much less properly explain something as simple as a sit. I'd fail them, they'd graduate. Not sure how that worked. 

The thing that makes me mad is not only is everyone a trainer, the ethics of the trainers in the area is so subpar. I was just complaining on facebook because I did an evaluation on a Cavalier King Charles Spanial. The dog grows a little bit at strangers, no forward aggression, never bit anyone. The owner had just gotten the dog because she was older and her husband passed away. She was quoted $2400 and $1800 and one trainer told her to put the dog to sleep if she wasn't going to go through with his training program. I evaluated the dog, suggested one to two lessons and she'll have a handle on the dog. Its not a super aggressive dog and I don't see a reasn to prey on someone when its clear they love their dog and don't have an extra $2000 sitting around to do 4 weeks of training. 

Trainers preying on owners just pisses me off more than the fact that most of the trainers don't even have the qualifications to demand these prices. I put everything out there on my website. The name of every dog titled. A biography of who I worked with and where. Photos that date back to when I started. I do this because too many people have "50 years COMBINED experience". WTF is combined experience?? Or "3rd generation dog trainer" because their dad had a dog, their grandpa had a dog, etc. That doesn't make you a dog trainer. People embelishing their resumes without proof to back it up or blatently lie about what they've accomplished....just another way to prey on dog owners who don't know any better. The best I can do is prove what I've done and hope owners see the difference and don't get scammed by other trainers.


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## Anna Kasho (Jan 16, 2008)

I can't tell you how many times people have asked me after seeing my dogs "do you train dogs professionaly?" I now reply, "Yes, but only my own". Figure that one out, LOL! I don't think my dogs are all that well trained, but I guess they are better than 90% of all the "he's friendly" fluffies straining at the end of the leash? I don't want to get involved, I don't want the responsibility, or the liability, or the guilt trip I'd be laying on myself if things don't work out. No thanks!

I'd like training the dogs, it's the people I can't stand. Cesar Milan has this neat quote that dog training is not about teaching dogs, it's about training their owners. That's very true...


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## Chris Michalek (Feb 13, 2008)

times are hard for some people and I think they are trying to be resourceful by offering dog training services. These same people would probably mow your lawn instead if you asked them. 

Not too long ago, I got approached by a dude outside of the park where I sometimes train. Keep in mind, I have a dedicated dog vehicle, two aluminum crates a shit load of equipment, Malinois and a Rottie that is in shape. That scene should read as "This dude is a dog trainer" So this guy approached me and asked if maybe I need help training. I'm thinking, he's skinny and athletic so maybe he wants to play decoy or something. But then he starts asking about OB on my dogs and I tell him that I don't need him. "Oh c'mon everybody can learn something from somebody" So I tell him that my dogs are better trained than his demo dog and I'll prove it to him.

I bet this bloke $20 bucks that my dog have better OB than this person who claims to be an OB expert. I tell him to put his dog in a down stay. I roll a ball and the dog breaks. The "trainer" tells me that's not fair. [puke] So I tell him again, and then walked up to his dog and attempted to step over him and the dog bolted. He tells me that's not fair because "NOBODY WOULD NEED THAT" Hmmm..... he did... idiot. Anyway, the dog heeled but not for shit and the only really good thing his dog did was recall. 

I told him my dog wouldn't move under any circumstance. Then I demo'd my dog to him, I made him Platz and went out of sight and watched. He tried yelling at my dog, tossing a ball at him and even kinda kicked him with his foot (I thought he might break but didn't) Then I returned and did the Ceasar Millan bit SHHHHHHHHHHHHHT I poked him and said "You owe me $20." Of course the ****er didn't have it. I invited him out to the club and he declined. Dummy.

I often get asked by people if I am a professional trainer and I say no, I'm not a trainer, I'm a musician that knows how to train a dog. I always get these baffled looks like I'm full of shit just because I have highly trained dogs.

I have requested payment from some of the people I help. I'll help anybody who asked but when people get stupid and start talking about how my training is better that the people that they were working with before "...and you're free!" that's about when I feel insulted for being taken advantage of and put the lid on them or they can pay me $50 a session. Only a couple of people have paid but never came back more than twice at that price and I don't care. I do it for fun and don't find enjoyment in training other people's dogs especially when they do nothing to enforce what they learned from me. 

So now with quite a few of the neighbors, I'm that asshole that has dog that bite and won't help train other people's dog for free. That's fine by me.


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## Amy Swaby (Jul 16, 2008)

What I love is when they see you already training your dog by yourself and somehow think you need their oh so experienced help. I'm was at the dog show and this guy from down the road from me gives me his card.

I'm like... I just... won everything exactly which of these other dogs that I beat did you train that you think I should pay you?


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## chris haynie (Sep 15, 2009)

i got nothing against these folks, and i certainly dont hate them. i am sure they do help alot of people with thier pets, i just think its odd that two years ago i didnt see any folks like this in my area and hadnt ever been approached by one, and now i probably get the sales pitch from at least two or three a month. i also get really annoyed at pushy sales people, especialy when its obvious i got no use for thier product/services


chris i love you dog OB bet. =D> im totally gonna do that next time i get approached by one of these folks.


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## Chris Michalek (Feb 13, 2008)

chris haynie said:


> i got nothing against these folks, and i certainly dont hate them. i am sure they do help alot of people with thier pets, i just think its odd that two years ago i didnt see any folks like this in my area and hadnt ever been approached by one, and now i probably get the sales pitch from at least two or three a month. i also get really annoyed at pushy sales people, especialy when its obvious i got no use for thier product/services
> 
> 
> chris i love you dog OB bet. =D> im totally gonna do that next time i get approached by one of these folks.



whatever you don't forget the Ceasar Millan SHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHTT and poke. It's awesome!


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## Lee H Sternberg (Jan 27, 2008)

There are more trainers now because of the economy is in the toilet. Saw a story on a ex realtor turned dog trainer. There are also more dog "barbers" or whatever you call them.

I saw it on my favorite FOX NEWS channel down here.


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## Chris Michalek (Feb 13, 2008)

Lee H Sternberg said:


> There are more trainers now because of the economy is in the toilet. Saw a story on a ex realtor turned dog trainer. There are also more dog "barbers" or whatever you call them.
> 
> I saw it on my favorite FOX NEWS channel down here.


Even Steven Segal is training dogs now...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oPUScI7mfz8


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## Lee H Sternberg (Jan 27, 2008)

I'd be a trainer and work for rum and cokes here if anyone gave a shit about a trained dog!


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## shawn murace (Feb 20, 2007)

We had a small company come out of the box with all kind of p.r. and was fairly successful.....was... fairly successful. Even though they were "master" trainers they still sucked and tanked. I've met them a couple times at a few events. I'm still curious about the certified "master" trainers out there.

I don't mind doing pet dogs, btw. It's where the money is at for the most part.


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## Candy Eggert (Oct 28, 2008)

shawn murace said:


> We had a small company come out of the box with all kind of p.r. and was fairly successful.....was... fairly successful. Even though they were "master" trainers they still sucked and tanked. I've met them a couple times at a few events. I'm still curious about the certified "master" trainers out there.
> 
> I don't mind doing pet dogs, btw. It's where the money is at for the most part.


Here's a Master trainer....and he's working the tough economic times too!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xxIQUdgIHnw


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## Chris McDonald (May 29, 2008)

The word trainer covers a lot of stuff. Most of you know what its like to visit a house with that has a pain in the ass dog. Most people just want their dog to be less of an ass. The reality is if a pet owner spent 10 or less hours just learning a few basics they would enjoy every dog they ever own much more for the rest of their lives. For these people its really not about any serious training of the dog its kind of about letting the owners know how easy it is to set up boundary’s. Even my looser ass has helped a few house wives that spent the past few years being towed around the hood by their lab, ridge back or weimaraner. They all had pinch collars on the dogs and the dogs were always at the end of the lead just pulling along. They had no idea that a little wiggle of the lead is all it takes for these dogs. I literally spent 10 minutes with them and now they can walk by with a loose lead. Its much nicer to walk a dog without fighting him the whole time. What I am getting at is these trainers aren’t trainers you think they are. These trainers don’t even know that those trainers even exist. I think there month long course gives them enough to help out a lot of the people out there. most of these dogs aren’t bad dogs the owners just don’t understand how unclear they are being


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## Connie Sutherland (Mar 27, 2006)

Jeff Oehlsen said:


> ... I do not like training pet dogs. I hate their little quitter owners. .... For many of these pets, I will be one of the last chances they get to not get put down. Hopefully, I won't get a lot of those again. ... The last time that I did pet training, I had several clients that were just pure gold. They worked their dogs everyday, and I couldn't have been happier. However* several, out of a few hundred make for a long long day. * .... Now, ME (mr no certificate, no patience for idiocy) is going back to pet training to see about making some money. Hope you don't hate me to much for it.


The owners who expect the hour with me to "fix" the dog with no effort on their part are, no question, the worst of the whole pet-training thing.

I have found that when the dog is a real problem, facing "one of the last chances they get to not get put down," the owner's cooperation is ratcheted up a whole bunch. 

I think that a good pet trainer who charges a worthwhile fee is worth every penny, by the way. The owners are often so hard to work with that there should probably be a surcharge.


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## Amy Swaby (Jul 16, 2008)

Connie Sutherland said:


> The owners who expect the hour with me to "fix" the dog with no effort on their part are, no question, the worst of the whole pet-training thing.
> 
> I have found that when the dog is a real problem, facing "one of the last chances they get to not get put down," the owner's cooperation is ratcheted up a whole bunch.
> 
> I think that a good pet trainer who charges a worthwhile fee is worth every penny, by the way. The owners are often so hard to work with that there should probably be a surcharge.


Jesus christ yes, working with my friend Dwight. He would show them what to do, work with the dog a little and then come back next week to them asking why won't my dog sit yet? But when i asked them if they had done any work while we were gone... No. Not just no, NOT AT ALL.

It's not MAGIC you HAVE to do the WORK if you're only going to pay for one 30 minute class a week.


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