# Training with Jeff O



## Sarah Mandler (Jul 5, 2008)

Here are a few videos of what we worked on at the seminar last weekend. 

Hurdle, food refusal, send away (the dog was crashing the hurdle at the last seminar, so much improvement there):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BWo5KLKpGMo

Heeling:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PgSw9-z-knY

Somewhat formal obedience exercises:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RnKlgdkbjXM


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## Carol Boche (May 13, 2007)

I think I will up the bet on what we discussed to a slip lead there darlin!!! LOL


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## Mo Earle (Mar 1, 2008)

are you training for French Ring? if so...only watched the first two exercises and hope this doesn't offend, it is not meant to, as we all have our own techniques of training...so with that said...
I don't like training with food....and teach the food refusal completely different, but 
didn't understand the food refusal training being done here...it appeared the dog was going to get real full taking all those treats- I saw he was being rewarded for everytime he looked at the handler- but during food refusal the handler will be out of sight...and he even seem to get rewarded when he took something from the "strangers" hand and then looked up at the handler........???

also couple of things I noticed- on the return jump...handler- Watch the very slight movement of your left hand on the return jump- as minor as it might be now, it is a bad habit and when you are nervous, that can get more accentuated and you could be accused of giving an "extra command"....also at the end of that, once your dog is placed on the return jump, handler should NEVER return to the dog...have the dog return to your side always, while you are still at the jump, so it becomes habit....sit to start, stay...command dog jump, dog takes placement, dog command to jump, dog returns over jump, goes back out to original spot, turns and comes back to handler...

finally have fun, if you are enjoying it , your dog will too!


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## Gillian Schuler (Apr 12, 2008)

All I watched was the heeling. Handler walked away with the dog before the dog had even looked up at her.

Heeling was, as a result, not satifactory.


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## Steve Strom (May 25, 2008)

Good job Sarah. Its pretty cool, all the stuff you guys are doing up there.


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## Steve Strom (May 25, 2008)

And you and Carol make sure you get as much training in with Jeff as you can. He won't have as much free time once he has that baby.


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## Sarah Mandler (Jul 5, 2008)

Mo, thank you for the reply, we are training with Mondio in mind. I should have stated that in the OP, oops. The handler will be in view for the food refusal, our goal is for the dog to look at me when food is presented. For now he is allowed to try to get the food, but he will never actually be rewarded from the stranger. This was the 5th time we had worked on this exercise. 

I too noticed that hand gesture on the jump. That's why I love video, I never would have known I did it otherwise. I am having him jump straight to the targets and picking him up to try to avoid his anticipation of being called to heel and jumping sideways. He's not great at jumping, so he needs all the help he can get.

Gillian: yes, the heeling was terrible.  I thought I'd post it anyway, what the hell.


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## Sarah Mandler (Jul 5, 2008)

Thanks Steve! :mrgreen:


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## Carol Boche (May 13, 2007)

Steve Strom said:


> And you and Carol make sure you get as much training in with Jeff as you can. He won't have as much free time once he has that baby.


YOU are so naughty....and just FYI...it is the mashed potatoes!!! :mrgreen::mrgreen::mrgreen::mrgreen:

These are training videos, we use them so we can see the mistakes we are making. It helps tremendously and, as people can see, we are not afraid to post it. It not only helps us learn, but hopefully helps someone else as well. 
Wish more people would do it.


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## Steve Strom (May 25, 2008)

Lol, my first post was legit. I just couldnt help myself on the second one.


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## Sarah Mandler (Jul 5, 2008)

Really Steve, it's not our fault- you should see the food that Carol's Mom cooks up for the seminars!


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## Steve Strom (May 25, 2008)

Yeah, but mashed potatos??? That looks like he ate Idaho.


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## Connie Sutherland (Mar 27, 2006)

That wasn't Jeff. Who was it really? Didn't you guys catch in this one http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BWo5KLKpGMo the phrase _"whatever the heck your word is"_?

"HECK"?

"HECK"?


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## Jeff Oehlsen (Apr 7, 2006)

Quote: I don't like training with food....and teach the food refusal completely different, but 
didn't understand the food refusal training being done here.

Maybe that is what you should ask first. LOL

I trained my dog this way and it works very well. I did it every day for 6 months, and after than never trained it again. It lasted for 6 years. Imagine if you actually trained it here and there ! ! !

Remember, this is NOT the finished program, this is still very early with the food refusal.

We were running through the ring one routine at whatever level the dog was capable according to training. I want the girls to know what it looks and feels like. I did a lot of pieces, and not the whole thing very often, and I think, and have been told that I should train that way more, and the people telling me this have more experience than I do trialing.

I am very proud of them, they are posting videos and DAMN what anyone else says. They are going to be a good group when they trial, I cannot wait !


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## Jeff Oehlsen (Apr 7, 2006)

Oh yes, I am getting that fat. Running is not doing shit, but then again, I do eat WAY to much when Carols Mom shows up. Something to consider if you are thinking of coming to one of our seminars. REALLY good hospitality, and we train like possessed fools. : )


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## Jim Nash (Mar 30, 2006)

Steve Strom said:


> Yeah, but mashed potatos??? That looks like he ate Idaho.


That made me laugh out loud !


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## Chris Michalek (Feb 13, 2008)

@sarah

Keep it up. If you want focus then work on focus alone from all of the other stuff. Jeff has you going too far too fast. If you can sit with the dog in heel position and have people come up, shuffle around, clap their hand and stomp their feet without the dog breaking focus then you are read to try it while heeling. 

All that endless heeling around people along with the little jerk corrections is something your dog isn't ready for. You can also cue your dog with body lean when you're going around people and such but train it away from people first. 

@jeff

too bad you're on the outs with David F. He could show you how to work and train a few dogs. Nice that you like to work in prey only but I've never seen prey move so slowly and then jump into the predators mouth. 

I liked how you had to sit down in the middle of a session, classic fat guy move. With you in that yellow shirt, I thought I was in that vid but then I realized that I move quicker than you and know what I'm doing when it comes to training OB. tracking not so much but then again we haven't seen you track a dog have we?


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## Sarah Mandler (Jul 5, 2008)

Thank you Chris. The problem with the heeling is that my dog is a little weird in a close group of people, and I only have the opportunity to train with the group once or twice a month, the rest of the time I train by myself. Heeling in a group is something we struggle with every time we get together. Heeling is fine otherwise.

I respectfully ask that you keep your little war with Jeff off of this thread. That comment has nothing to do with the training in the videos posted here.


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## Chris Michalek (Feb 13, 2008)

Sarah Mandler said:


> Thank you Chris. The problem with the heeling is that my dog is a little weird in a close group of people, and I only have the opportunity to train with the group once or twice a month, the rest of the time I train by myself. Heeling in a group is something we struggle with every time we get together. Heeling is fine otherwise.
> 
> I respectfully ask that you keep your little war with Jeff off of this thread. That comment has nothing to do with the training in the videos posted here.



actually it does have everything to do with it. I'm not at war with Jeff anyway.

Bring your dog out to places like home depot and other places where there are lots of people.


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## Gerry Grimwood (Apr 2, 2007)

Chris Michalek said:


> @jeff
> 
> I liked how you had to sit down in the middle of a session, classic fat guy move. With you in that yellow shirt, I thought I was in that vid but then I realized that I move quicker than you and know what I'm doing when it comes to training OB. tracking not so much but then again we haven't seen you track a dog have we?


I find it funny that like in the working world at our jobs, we all think we're the shizzle/bees knees or whatever...then some fukwad tells you all you're doing it all wrong and you listen patiently while in the back of your mind you are playing out that scene where Anthony Hopkins is frying Ray Liotta brains and eating them :lol:

Or, you just ignore them :razz:


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## Carol Boche (May 13, 2007)

Every time, every thread. It is annoying as hell. 

Chris, you have told me that David F is a good guy, a little odd, but that he can train dogs, is cool to work with ect.....

Might as well say it out in public too....Kinda like what I have told you about Jeff in our phone conversations huh? 

Not to mention the fact that you don't like people making fun of you, but yet you seem fine making fun of others, or telling them they shouldn't own a dog......

Advice and opinions are one thing, and in general, I like you and respect you....but the antics are getting old.


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## Jeff Oehlsen (Apr 7, 2006)

Sarah, we will do a lot more with Dutch and groups next time. I think Sunday we are going to go to train with that new Sch club. 

I am looking forward to meeting them. In October, Midwest will have a trial, and we can all go up there and have some fun. Remember, the ring one is as hard as silly Sch3. I am thinking you could get a leg or two on your one there.


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## Sarah Mandler (Jul 5, 2008)

I'm thinking we're not ready for bitework  (we being I) 

3 months is an eternity to prepare though, so maybe...


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## Carol Boche (May 13, 2007)

Sarah Mandler said:


> I'm thinking we're not ready for bitework  (we being I)
> 
> 3 months is an eternity to prepare though, so maybe...


Remember the motto...."YOU CAN DO IT".... 

I have all the faith in the world in you and my team mates....and I have half faith in myself, being new to all of it. Comp OB is not my strong suit, but I am making progress. 

I need to ask Elizabeth if it is okay that I put the Mint stuff here. Kind of nervous about that as I don't want her to get bashed....but then, she only had him for what.....20hrs? LOL


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## Jeff Oehlsen (Apr 7, 2006)

Post it. Minty can stand on his own two feet.


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## Chris Michalek (Feb 13, 2008)

Minty looked good when watched it this morning.


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## Elizabeth Digmann (Jan 28, 2009)

No worries carol! I am having a blast with mint and there's nothing anyone can say to change that


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## Jeff Oehlsen (Apr 7, 2006)

Ponk ponk ponk ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! !


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## Carol Boche (May 13, 2007)

Elizabeth Digmann said:


> No worries carol! I am having a blast with mint and there's nothing anyone can say to change that


Annndddd.....I think that sums it up!!!!! 

We have FUN when we train. Are we serious?....of course. But the four of us also have fun with our dogs. I think a lot of people forget that when training and competing. 

This is why we don't have an issue posting training stuff......we screw up.....so what? Doesn't everyone? 

I have four dogs....ALL have tested my patience, and still do......but the BIG thing is we are PROGRESSING in training....I LOVE that.


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## Bob Scott (Mar 30, 2006)

I liked the food refusal training!
The comment was made that the handler wont be on the field for the dog to look for a reward. That's no different then the handler not being on the field for a correction.
I know, I know! E-collars, but this is still very obviously foundation training which I see no reason to start application of correction. 
I also like seeing, and admire the lack of fear for showing mistakes on the video. Absolutely one of the very best learning tools. JMHO of course! :wink:


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## Jeff Oehlsen (Apr 7, 2006)

I did the food refusal without correction. I had some ass wipe at a FR trial throwing the food into his mouth at the ring 1 level, and so I corrected him there, but it was years later.


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## Bob Scott (Mar 30, 2006)

Sometimes a little compulsion can be a wonderful tool.....although the timing was off just a bit with that "years later". :grin::grin::grin::grin:


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## Sarah Mandler (Jul 5, 2008)

Bob Scott said:


> I liked the food refusal training!
> The comment was made that the handler wont be on the field for the dog to look for a reward. That's no different then the handler not being on the field for a correction.
> I know, I know! E-collars, but this is still very obviously foundation training which I see no reason to start application of correction.
> I also like seeing, and admire the lack of fear for showing mistakes on the video. Absolutely one of the very best learning tools. JMHO of course! :wink:


Thanks Bob. I have no problem showing mistakes and admitting my lack of knowledge. I certainly didn't post these videos to show what a great dog trainer I am. :lol:

I absolutely trust my trainer and my team 100%, and as Elizabeth said, nothing posted here can change that.


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## Bob Scott (Mar 30, 2006)

Sarah said;
"nothing posted here can change that".

For only nine posts your showing great intelligence! :lol::lol:;-)


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## Mo Earle (Mar 1, 2008)

*"Quote: I don't like training with food....and teach the food refusal completely different, but 
didn't understand the food refusal training being done here.

Maybe that is what you should ask first. LOL * I did ask if this was for French Ring- and Sarah stated it was for Mondio.....for French Ring, I would not train it this way.
*
I trained my dog this way and it works very well. I did it every day for 6 months, and after than never trained it again. It lasted for 6 years. Imagine if you actually trained it here and there ! ! !* Seems I hit a nerve here, Jeff- and I am not sure why...I like using videosduring training myself, it helps a lot with training, I also like constructive criticism....
*
Remember, this is NOT the finished program, this is still very early with the food refusal.* it was mentioned this was the sixth lesson of food refusal...and I believe taking at a dogs individual pace, and I train it differently that is why I ask....and have never seen it trained like that in the past...*

We were running through the ring one routine at whatever level the dog was capable according to training. I want the girls to know what it looks and feels like. I did a lot of pieces, and not the whole thing very often, and I think, and have been told that I should train that way more, and the people telling me this have more experience than I do trialing.* everyone I have trained with also trained for the next level that were serious competitors in French Ring
_* I am very proud of them, they are posting videos and DAMN what anyone else says. They are going to be a good group when they trial, I cannot wait !?*

_Why such the offensive attitude, *DAMN what everyone else says*...constructive criticism is and can be good, different opinions are good, I am open to learning new training techniques if the work for what I am doing...with other suggestions, ideas etc. you can accept them or forget them,AND you should be proud of them, no one said anything bad and I don't think Sarah took my comments as an attack...rather it was an observation...if I were going to attack, I would have directed ALL the comments to you directly..and I have a few...but that is not what is important...the handler and dog is most important and helping them reach their goals....so relax Jeff....going down different roads, sometimes lead you to the same destination...=;


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## Sarah Mandler (Jul 5, 2008)

Mo, I didn't take your post as anything other than thoughtful and helpful. I realize you don't know me, my dog, or our training at all, and it's nice to get objective opinions of the work from people who don't know the background. 

My video camera took a spill off the tripod at the first seminar we had, but I wish I had video of that train wreck to show how much improvement there's been. :lol:


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## Jeff Oehlsen (Apr 7, 2006)

What was I thinking Mo. You said French ring. Of course. It has to be different for French ring because......................................

The exercises are exactly the same.


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## Mo Earle (Mar 1, 2008)

_"Mo, I didn't take your post as anything other than thoughtful and helpful. I realize you don't know me, my dog, or our training at all, and it's nice to get objective opinions of the work from people who don't know the background. _"

Sarah I am glad you took my post the way they were intended...I have learned a LOT over the years from a LOT of different people, some ok, some good, some great, and hopefully I will continue to learn a lot more, and if I can share some of what I learned to help others do better ...that is good!


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## Mo Earle (Mar 1, 2008)

_ Jeff said..." What was I thinking Mo. You said French ring. Of course. It has to be different for French ring because......................................

The exercises are exactly the same. _________"


_ I asked, because it could have been for Mondio Ring, which so far, I have not been interested in...and I am not aware if they have a food refusal exercise....in a previous post, someone mentioned during the food refusal the handler stays with the dog??...in French Ring as you know....the handler is OUT of sight, and if you are teaching these people the food refusal for French Ring, I wouldn't want you to train my dog that way...thankfully I had the opportunity to learn French ring and a lot of training secrets and techniques from some very GOOD and Reputable French Ringers...now I just have to get the perfect dog for me...

finally Jeff, you can continue to be nasty, sarcastic and a smart a$$ in your responses, that is fine with me, I hope your students will do well with their dogs....but I don't take the responses as a personal attack, but rather it is a defense mechanism you over use to hide your insecurities... the trainer that "knows it all" will be a trainer I would want to stay away from....because there is always more to learn- remember that and maybe we will see less sarcasm from you. :-k


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## Jeff Oehlsen (Apr 7, 2006)

Probably not Mo. Probably not. However, feel free to come to one of the seminars. You can observe first hand all my massive insecurities. LOL

You can probably learn a lot more than you would expect, including my sense of humor.


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