# Aggresion triggered BY Aggression ?



## Rose DeLuca (Oct 24, 2008)

I have working GSDs for years of all types- and 2 of them i have now (3 yrs old one male one female ) from same blood lines are very "triggered" by other aggression. Here are some examples that set them off- 

2 of my other dogs fight
OTHER peoples dogs fight
or if I take a dog to work with in my obedience class that objects or shows any conflicting behavior- 
I have also seen it to a lesser degree if a dog gets injured and shrieks 
I have also seen it when I am correcting one of my other dogs- and these dogs what to join in to help me. 

i guess to sum it up- ANY fight turns into THEIR fight, and they go postal... I have tried setting them up for situations like this when possible and they have become more tolerant... Interestingly they are not triggered by any "play fighting" behavior in the other dogs even if it gets very rough............

I get that the dog doesnt think I am in charge enough and wants to "get in" and take over etc... they remind me of dogs that would join in a bar fight- 

i KNOW everyone will say they do not let their working dogs together- but this works for me 99% of the time... I find this aggression on aggression behavior different than anything i've had over the years. I'm wondering if anyone else who has dogs like this manages them etc. These dogs are NOT dog aggressive, they are fine and interact VERY will with other dogs of all types- as long as no one fights.... 

Just thought I would try to get some discussion going on this.... Thanks ! ​


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## Marta Wajngarten (Jul 30, 2006)

I used to take care of a couple pits that were simillar, perfect around other dogs in every sense until some one got into a fight. They'd come barreling from across the field to join in if they saw or heard dogs fighting. I also know a NSDTR that's the same way. 

If you're looking for solutions, I would just treat it as obedience under distraction. Work your recalls and down/stays, or downs out of motion that you can use in case you catch them on their way to trouble (might be easier then a recall at first).


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## Detlef Berensmann (Jun 21, 2011)

Rose DeLuca said:


> I get that the dog doesnt think I am in charge enough and wants to "get in" and take over etc... they remind me of dogs that would join in a bar fight.


Hello Rose,
You are right a dog doesn't think this way. Even they are smart and intelligent they are not logical. I think that somehow they got conditioned to a stimulus in order to show up aggression. This can happen by exident or without you being aware of it. I saw one video of your youtube channel, wow, these two dogs barking at you to make you throw the stick scares me off. I wonder if they ever got in fight because of that?


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## Melody Greba (Oct 4, 2007)

Hi Rose!
My belief is that dogs are stimulated by sights and sounds, and react by instinct. I think it takes a very conscience effort with deep boundaries to not react. And one of the very common things that a dog will do is to join in against the subordinate (if in the same family) and there are 3, or an outsider. The weak one gets the brunt. Dogs can also be opportunists and just jump in and that is a primal response. 

Results after a fight can create boundaries in a dog's head and it may be less likely to do it again(some only get more turned on). Or we create boundaries for the dog.


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## Don Turnipseed (Oct 8, 2006)

This is normal behavior in terriers......right down to the correcting. I have to be careful even putting a leash on one while in a yard with the other dogs. While it can be a real PITA, it is what they are as far as I am concerned. If I have to leash a dog I keep a cattle prod handy. I also use it for breaking up free for alls when they come into the truck after a hunt. I separated all the males to one male per yard and that ended the yard fights.


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## Rose DeLuca (Oct 24, 2008)

great ! thanks for the thoughts, you are right i would describe it as very "primal" instinctual type of behavior that kicks in. 

I'm glad for the thoughts on others that have had similar dogs... when they are in "obedience mode" they are much better at controlling themselves - when i realized i had a "problem" i set it up in watching protection work, dog has to hold stay while other dog does bite work, and ive even done the helper work.... so its "proofed" in that environment. 

I had a situation once in ob class when a pushy lab went to take a frisbee off a "possessive" mini Aussie, the mini Aussie snarked once, lab backed off then pushed in again- and on the second snark-y-ism, my dog broke her stay from across the arena to "settle" it. I was able to down her in motion (which totally amazed me quite honestly!!) and it wasnt till the 2nd "snap" that she decided to react at least so i was immediately prepared (again I think its because I wasn't taking care of the situation and she felt she needed to ?) 

Luckily i have no aggression with them with toys or in "working mode" when they are fetching sticks or chuck it balls they will barrel past each other, and neither will go after the others throw. I think thats more of a learned behavior through 2 toy game and them learning to be totally focused on me for more game. I'm sure that barking behavior would normally trigger fights with lots of dogs, but it seems fine with all of my pack. if for some reason two dogs run for the same toy, the sub always backs down- so in general their pack is pretty stable for right now (though my dominant male is getting older and starting to show his age) 

i like that idea of a cattle prod ... I'm not familiar with them...how do they work ? would it possibly stimulate them more ? I normally use a small air horn- course have to make a conscious effort to have it with me


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## maggie fraser (May 30, 2008)

I would have had a pretty instant death if I threw a toy for my last two gsds at the same time, ok with the terriers (maybe 'cos they're quicker), but what's the big deal ? All of my terriers who got so much of a whiff of a fight were straight in there, I expected no less from them. It's just stimulus, that's a pretty basic response I suppose but why the need to analyse it so, I don't think it unusual dog behaviour at all ?


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## Christina Kennedy (Aug 25, 2010)

I was just coming in here to say what Maggie did. Sounds like a pack of Jack Russells to me! I have several friends who own a few or more each. If one gets in a scuffle with another, the rest come from left field to jump on in. One yelps from something and they have the potential of all jumping on him. 

Years ago I was visiting my friend who had all 4 of hers in the back yard. They knew my border collie well. One got a little nasty when he picked up a ball in the yard- nothing serious. But the rest of them went into pack mentality and jumped my poor dog. 

One of our GSD- a bitch- has a slightly similar mentality so we keep a close eye on things. Unlike the Jacks- she calls off


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## Matthew Grubb (Nov 16, 2007)

Any dog with some rank drive will look for that opertunity to "jump in" on an a$$ whooping. I always find it interesting when it happens as a result of a good handler issued correction.


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## Michelle Reusser (Mar 29, 2008)

I get the same thing in various degrees in most of my dogs. Now I'm down to one dog so it's easier but I still have to watchout. Tonight I was calling my cat because the idiot was laying in the road, he didn't come and I kept calling. My dog got up to see if he needed to handle the cat for me. I know which dogs are the worse and stay one step ahead of them trying to make corrections on eachother. My daughters bitch was the worst offender in our pack. I work on control to keep it from happening, teaching a downstay before I throw a ball and make dogs take turns if they can't behave running after it together.


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