# From Food To Prey



## brad robert (Nov 26, 2008)

So when do you guys make the decision or no the time is right to change from training your pups from food to prey.

My GSD pup has good food drive but mental play/prey drive for any toy but trying to train her in prey drive is a little hard as she can get a bit hectic.Although training her with food she is a lot calmer and since putting her through the basics with food she is a lot better in prey now then she was.She has worked out that work equals rewards and its fun.

So i no a lot of people here say they train this way food then prey its a better(calmer) way to go ,but when do you change over? Also is it normal for a dog to get more mentally tired from prey training then food through a higher attention level etc?


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## Bob Scott (Mar 30, 2006)

Change when the dog really starts understanding the particular behaviour!


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## brad robert (Nov 26, 2008)

Thanks bob, but say my girl has her heeling going nicely for food but when i add prey she start to crowd forge etc is it the foundation is not solid enough or by adding prey i uped the ante so training sort of starts again? I usually try to talk to her to get her in line then reward if she will listen as i dont want to add a correction as she is to young at the moment.


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## Bob Scott (Mar 30, 2006)

Are you using marker training? Just mark and reward when she is in correct position only. 
Correcting a puppy is as simple as a "nope" and loss of reward. 
Is the prey (toy, etc) in view? 
Wean off of that soon or all your doing then is bribing a young dog. Keep it in your pocket, mark when correct, THEN bring out the reward.
You may very well have to take a step back when the reward is raised.


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## brad robert (Nov 26, 2008)

Yeah im using marker training in the form of voice and clicker.Wow it may seem a bit silly but i never thought of using say the clicker for prey work with the toy/prey item is that what you mean?I usually train prey with the flinks method and there isnt really any talk of marking etc only giving the reward.

Sometimes the prey is in view some times i hide it under my arm definately something to improve on.


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## Bob Scott (Mar 30, 2006)

In the Flinks method you are teaching the dog to focus on the toy or where he thinks the toy is (as in trial vest numbers) 
I prefer to teach the dog to make eye contact no matter wher the toy is at. Meaning I can hold it out to my side but don't mark and reward unless the dog is looking in my eyes not the toy. 
Both work. It's just a preference.


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## todd pavlus (Apr 30, 2008)

I started on the flinks method also. Then I got Balabanov's dvd, and it is almost the complete opposite. But works better IMO


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## Willaim Somers (Jan 17, 2009)

Ivan teaches the watch command, as in eye contact first two way then one way. Very gradually adding distraction, specifically using the toy as a distraction,which I like, the key is in the timing of the release( or clicker I guess), it always comes before the reward,with no movement of cues from the handler to the reward prior to that release. Your dog will be less hectic using the marker before the prey reward.


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## James Downey (Oct 27, 2008)

I would not change to prey if the dog is hectic in it's play. If you teach the dog in a hectic frame of mind during foundation training...good luch with changing that later. It wil be forever stamped in the dogs mind that's how OB is done. I would focus on trying to see what's causing the dog to be hectic.

How old is the dog?


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## brad robert (Nov 26, 2008)

She is only young still about 6 mnths im just trying to install a solid foundation and like i said as her training progresses she is becoming less hectic in her work and more focused.But so far i have to make sure i work on a reward system and not an exchange and put the toy in my pocket etc.

She has a strong play ethic and really wants to get after it trying to channel that is a fun challenge and could make for a good dog.James i guess in play she can get pretty wound up and i take it as a genetic thing as her mother was an extreme play/ball type of dog.Both mum and daughter are good with people and kids but get that ball out and watch out.


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