# correction threshhold



## Peter Cho (Apr 21, 2010)

The longer I am training with very seasoned trainers who have multiple WUSV under their belts, the more I am becoming keenly aware of threshhold. It is such an important concept that probably will fill a book.

I used to be hesitant in going too far beyond the dog's threshhold when it needed a correction to block the behavior. But now, I am MUCH MORE hesitant NOT going over its threshhold. 
As my training director, L Collins, would say, "That is why we buy quality dogs."

CLEARLY understand, I am not talking about teaching using stim, which are done with very very low levels and with tug (food for pups). I am talking about a behavior the dog ABSOLUTELY KNOWS and absolutely knows how to turn off the stim. I did not want newbies to start blasting their dogs. LOL.

I just found this mindset change interesting. To be frank, this way, the communication is so much cleaner, corrections are very few, and most importantly, the dogs look much happier.


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## Joby Becker (Dec 13, 2009)

I agree..if the training is clear, and the dog is strong, it can be amazing, but those are not what causes problems...clear training and strong dogs....


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## brad robert (Nov 26, 2008)

interesting topic surprised more people havent chimed in??

Peter how do you find or know your dogs threshhold without ruining a behaviour your trying to enforce?? Is it just a matter of knowing your dog for you?? What do you do if you go over the threshhold how do you deal with that?? Im familiar with how you guys train having seen a few work week vids etc or use to train  i know its an individual dog thing but about what age do you guys start adding physical stress to your dogs on average?


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## Tracey Hughes (Jul 13, 2007)

Good topic Peter. 

This is probably one of the biggest errors I see in training, people correcting way under the dogs thresholds. I think many trainers are afraid or uncomfortable in doing what needs to be done. Doesn’t matter if the dog is hard or soft. What matters is giving a correction hard enough to get the point across at any given time. 

A correction in tracking vs obedience vs protection will all be different. 

The only way you can know where the threshold is at with each dog is through experience. That is where handling skill comes into play. In dog training you can’t be afraid to try..a lot of knowledge is gained by getting out there and doing.


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## Joby Becker (Dec 13, 2009)

brad robert said:


> interesting topic surprised more people havent chimed in??
> 
> Peter how do you find or know your dogs threshhold without ruining a behaviour your trying to enforce?? Is it just a matter of knowing your dog for you?? What do you do if you go over the threshhold how do you deal with that?? Im familiar with how you guys train having seen a few work week vids etc or use to train  i know its an individual dog thing but about what age do you guys start adding physical stress to your dogs on average?


Brad, I know this question is not for me but it is confusing me.

I dont know any people at all that use a correction to try enforce a behavior, unless they dont know how to train dogs at all, that is just my opinion, and how I look at it though. 

Correction is used as a punishment for not complying to a command, the behavior that is trying to be punished or extiquished is the behavior of not complying, again just my opinion here. That is why the training must be clear to the dog.

do you have an example of using corrections to enforce a behavior? I can think of using corrections for automatic sits and things like that, but those are not going to be over threshold type corrections.


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## Gillian Schuler (Apr 12, 2008)

_I used to be hesitant in going too far beyond the dog's threshhold when it needed a correction to block the behavior_

Peter, can you explain this for me - the dog can have a low or high threshhold. Pain threshhold can be different from aggression threshhold etc. etc.

I am not so quick on the uptake!


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## brad robert (Nov 26, 2008)

Joby Becker said:


> Brad, I know this question is not for me but it is confusing me.
> 
> I dont know any people at all that use a correction to try enforce a behavior, unless they dont know how to train dogs at all, that is just my opinion, and how I look at it though.
> 
> ...


I think it was in the way you read it or i worded it? as i was talking about training and re-enforcing behaviours then adding stress to a dog who doesnt comply to an already known behaviour and what happens if you go beyond his threshold going to far with the stress. and the use of stress Ok well probably correction was the wrong word i used Joby.Im not an expert in these matters but stress is applied to a dog to make him comply he turns of the stress which ever method u choose

So doesnt the use of stress actually enforce the behaviour in a dog that already knows it


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## Joby Becker (Dec 13, 2009)

brad robert said:


> I think it was in the way you read it or i worded it? as i was talking about training and re-enforcing behaviours then adding stress to a dog who doesnt comply to an already known behaviour and what happens if you go beyond his threshold going to far with the stress. and the use of stress Ok well probably correction was the wrong word i used Joby.Im not an expert in these matters but stress is applied to a dog to make him comply he turns of the stress which ever method u choose
> 
> So doesnt the use of stress actually enforce the behaviour in a dog that already knows it


I am confused now even more after re-reading it...and reading peters post again...seems you were right in what he was saying...

Peter when you are using the above threshold stim to get performance for a command that the dog knows, and he knows how to turn the stim off...now that I read it correctly, and the dog is well versed at how to turn it off...when are you utring it off? at the beginning of compliance? or further into the process of command completion...I was confused..I thought you were talking about corrections...


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