# Omg....help me please.....



## Carol Boche (May 13, 2007)

Have a 2yr old GSD/Mal mix (actually a working line as it was a military mistake, not the base but a handlers dog nailed a Czech GSD bitch by accident) and he is a NIGHTMARE. 

He is now in a $500 aluminum crate in the back of my car as that is where he does not wig out....owners are sailing the east coast for a few weeks......

Two commercial chainlink kennels and one black expensive kennel in two days.....bloodied face AND one of the aluminum mesh and sliders is GONE out of the crate.....will kill cats......used the e-collar to zap him when chewing on the chainlink, teeth are marked with silver from chewing the fence and crate.....

Now, he is easy to handle when out of the crate, will only eat if I stand next to him, drinking water......and will play fetch......cannot take him to work as he can be aggressive......and Doug would not be happy if he nailed someone there. 

I knew he had separation anxiety....but did not think it would be like this. I really don't want him living in my vehicle, but when I put the crate in the quiet part of the kennel and went to work....came home to a bloody mess and I am really hoping he did not swallow any aluminum pieces.....the slider part was crunched into a mess too......

Besides shooting him......any suggestions.....I gave him doggie valuim today and it did not make a dent in the anxiety at all.......


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## ann schnerre (Aug 24, 2006)

are you boarding him carol? or did you somehow end up owning him? would a running line be an option?


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## Carol Boche (May 13, 2007)

boarding him....a log chain and a BIG tree might work......something he can't tear apart or chew through. I have a feeling he would kill himself being tied out though....

Doug (and I) are not happy that my new rig is now starting to smell like a friggin dog kennel.....if you get my drift.....

I am trying to contact the owners, we are going to have to do something and I have a feeling he is going to have to go to a boarding facility that has staff 24/7. Not sure if they will have anything strong enough to handle his destructiveness though. 

I feel for the dog as it is not really his fault....classic case of being treated as a human from a puppy.....classic......


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## Bob Scott (Mar 30, 2006)

When Thunder had heartworm at 2 yrs old I had to keep him "mellowed out" for weeks. Can't remember what it was though. Not vallium.


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## Carol Boche (May 13, 2007)

Bob Scott said:


> When Thunder had heartworm at 2 yrs old I had to keep him "mellowed out" for weeks. Can't remember what it was though. Not vallium.


I am going to call my vet in the morning and see what he says. The v came from the vet here in town.......I am sure there is something I can get for him.


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## Anna Kasho (Jan 16, 2008)

What about running him to exaustion before you crate/kennel? Would that help at all?

Is he used to a muzzle at all, and could he be confined without hurting himself in muzzle? Or take him with you if he was muzzled?

I feel for you, I only deal with lapdogs who are this bad, and only in grooming for a few hours, not boarding longterm...


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## Jeff Oehlsen (Apr 7, 2006)

Like they are coming back for him. Sure they are.

Muzzle him, and keep him aced out of his mind. I would put him back in the kennel. The fact that what you are using to calm him down doesn't work looks like an indicator that he has built a tolerance from previous use.

No need to damage, or stink out your truck for a dog like this.


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## ann schnerre (Aug 24, 2006)

get the stuff sarah takes b/f going to the dentist. i hear it's good stuff, lol...

the reason i threw 'running line" out there was the thought that being less confined but still contained might take some of the stress out of the equation. what the line woudl be made of that he wouldn't chew thru was a problem that occurred to me. but not a solution unfortunately....perhaps a log chain w/smaller links that you could run a link of a larger chain over?..between 2 large trees? 

what a deal. hope the owners have a great time, and hope you charge them a LOT of $$. haha.


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## Carol Boche (May 13, 2007)

Anna Kasho said:


> What about running him to exaustion before you crate/kennel? Would that help at all?


Three half hour sessions of fetch today, walk to the highway and back in a controlled semi-heal position and two miles with the fourwheeler and he is out of shape.....he was severely overweight when I first met him....four months ago and he has lost weight....BUT.....here is what I saw him fed when we all went camping...

Cooked chicken leg bones (I know, I said something)
2 pints of outdated chocolate milk (I know I said something)
Leftover baked pasta and tomato/basil sauce that was two weeks old 

and he had gotten into the coolers while we were all out on the boat and ate all the hot dogs......

then.....kibble. 

At some point I realized it was useless to say anything since "she" feeds him whatever and says things like "he knew I was going to give this to him all day" 

"He" is more realistic, but I think kind of gives up. 

Had I known the anxiety was this bad.....I would have probably said no. 
However, most of their friends are nervous around the dog (fear/pressure issues we figured out when Bernhard was here) so they had no one really to care for him. 

He is pretty drivey actually (LOVES the frisbee and any kind of ball), but his issues interfere with his want to do something far away from people.

Ann, you were here when they were here with that big dark dog Jack weren't you? When Nick was in the suit? That is the dog.

Will ace affect him after two weeks of use? And, doubt I have a muzzle here he would not be able to get out of.....and the basket muzzle w/ head strap I have will not fit this dog....he is a big dog...(100lbs maybe)


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## Nicole Stark (Jul 22, 2009)

That sucks. What do they do with/for him when they need to leave? Are they looking to correct the behavior or are you in a position where your just dealing with it until their return? Ace might do the trick. How's he do with a companion other than you, like another dog?


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## Bob Scott (Mar 30, 2006)

Keep the dog, shoot the owner!


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## Carol Boche (May 13, 2007)

Nicole Stark said:


> That sucks. What do they do with/for him when they need to leave? Are they looking to correct the behavior or are you in a position where your just dealing with it until their return? Ace might do the trick. How's he do with a companion other than you, like another dog?


Dog aggressive....killed a small dog or severely injured it if I remember and he tried to go after the hound through the fence. 

I will do my best with him.....but I doubt they will keep up with any of my methods. 

and, they just clean up the mess and say "guess what Jack did?"


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## Anna Kasho (Jan 16, 2008)

Carol Boche said:


> Ann, you were here when they were here with that big dark dog Jack weren't you? When Nick was in the suit? That is the dog.


If that was for me, I am not the Ann youre thinking of... :lol:

I like Bob's idea, keep the dog, shoot the owners. Dog could use some structure and new owners who actually have a clue...


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## Kadi Thingvall (Jan 22, 2007)

Carol Boche said:


> Will ace affect him after two weeks of use? And, doubt I have a muzzle here he would not be able to get out of.....and the basket muzzle w/ head strap I have will not fit this dog....he is a big dog...(100lbs maybe)


The Ace will only work for a few days and then he'll build up a tolerance to it. That is assuming it can work in the first place, each dog is different and in extreme anxiety cases sometimes it works, other times it doesn't. You might talk to the vet about multiple drugs, a few days on one, then a few days on the other, then back to the first, etc

You may be able to find a wire basket muzzle at a mom and pop pet store, the one in my town sells them for around 25.00 Don't know if he could destroy it or not, but I'd give it a try and bill the owners for it LOL


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## Carol Boche (May 13, 2007)

Alrighty then......$236.78 later we now have cattle panels up around the inside of my already reinforced "bitch in heat" kennel. Hog Panel floor to discourage digging, the chainlink panels are heavy duty construction site chainlink that are 10' high.....log chain and carribeeners for the close of the gate in 3 places since he rams the gate.....or well he did before the Ace. 

Now he is sitting there, a little stoned.....howling quietly. 

Wish me luck......at least the fly attracting, smelly, damaged crate is out of my car now.


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## Debbie Skinner (Sep 11, 2008)

Carol Boche said:


> Alrighty then......$236.78 later we now have cattle panels up around the inside of my already reinforced "bitch in heat" kennel. Hog Panel floor to discourage digging, the chainlink panels are heavy duty construction site chainlink that are 10' high.....log chain and carribeeners for the close of the gate in 3 places since he rams the gate.....or well he did before the Ace.
> 
> Now he is sitting there, a little stoned.....howling quietly.
> 
> Wish me luck......at least the fly attracting, smelly, damaged crate is out of my car now.


Can you borrow a stock horse trailer? Just have him live in a well built stock trailer that has no padding inside. He wouldn't be able to get out of it and it would have ventilation. Just put shavings down and park it under a tree. Take all collars off as a precaution. Maybe that would work. The nicer horse trailers have padding and screened drop down windows so I wouldn't borrow one of those ad he would probably tear out the screens and padding. A friend of mine boarded a GSD like that for a friend and the dog ended up killing itself somehow in a chainlink run.


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## ann schnerre (Aug 24, 2006)

carol, 

when i read your original post i wondered if it was Jack....yeah, i saw all that and my thoughts at the time were "that dog's gonna come to a bad end"; both owners just make excuses for him/his behavior. not a good situation, esp w/that dog.

i wish you luck--you KNOW what's gonna happen next time they want to go on vacation, right? keep him stoned 

oh--and BTW, please don't keep Esta in the same kennel Jack's been in when she comes in heat: the vibes fr him may affect her puppies adversely.


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## Carol Boche (May 13, 2007)

Debbie Skinner said:


> Can you borrow a stock horse trailer? Just have him live in a well built stock trailer that has no padding inside. He wouldn't be able to get out of it and it would have ventilation. Just put shavings down and park it under a tree. Take all collars off as a precaution. Maybe that would work. The nicer horse trailers have padding and screened drop down windows so I wouldn't borrow one of those ad he would probably tear out the screens and padding. A friend of mine boarded a GSD like that for a friend and the dog ended up killing itself somehow in a chainlink run.


GREAT...GREAT....GREAT.....idea....we will see what happens tonight with this kennel....since all is quiet and he is sleeping......but..I will call Merle in the morning and see if he will park his stock trailer here.....it is an older one so I don't think he could damage it any....


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## ann schnerre (Aug 24, 2006)

just make double-sure there's no rust/weakness esp at the bottom:side joints. but i agree-a great alternative.

but Jack's already been in the "bitch-in-heat" run and ruined it for propitious breeding results, soooo...


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## Debbie Skinner (Sep 11, 2008)

Carol Boche said:


> GREAT...GREAT....GREAT.....idea....we will see what happens tonight with this kennel....since all is quiet and he is sleeping......but..I will call Merle in the morning and see if he will park his stock trailer here.....it is an older one so I don't think he could damage it any....


Good Luck! Wish you were close then you could just toss the dog in one of my kennels as they are the European style (no chainlink) and strong enough for a lion I think. If anyone decides to build additional kennels, I would strongly encourage looking at the bar panels and also what I love is that our feeder is built into the door and you can feed from the outside like a giant stainless rabbit feeder in design. No bowls to spill or for them to play with.


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## Konnie Hein (Jun 14, 2006)

What brand are those kennels?


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## Debbie Skinner (Sep 11, 2008)

Konnie Hein said:


> What brand are those kennels?


We hired a friend that had a metal fabrication business made the front panels (bar panels) using a set of European ones that I bought from Dave Reever (Alderhorst) as a guide. I had the guy make them about double the strength as the European one was. I bought the doors and panels which are aluminum used from a Lab breeder that bought a kennel and then tore out those kennels and put in chainlink as she wanted her dogs to "see each other". Everyone has their own ideas. I think those are from a science lab supplier and probably would cost thousands today as they are solid aluminum. I can take close up photos and you can ask a metal fabricator do make some. 

My husband Ron had this kind of business for a few years, but has since gone back to project super due to the economy. We had too many developers go bankrupt here in CA and then the contractors lose that have done the work. He still builds gates and kennels here for us and friends. However, I would ask someone that makes Estate gates, railings, entries..do a google search for this type of work. Unless someone knows of a manufacturer?

When I got the original kennel from Alderhorst he had purchased a cargo container of panels years ago when he built his new kennel. He had some extras that he sold to k9 handlers and others. If/When the US$ gets strong to the Euro$, you could go in with some others and bring a container over. Most of these galvanized panels are made in Belgium and not France due to the manufacturing restrictions regarding galvanizing (hazard to environment). I know this because a friend in France used to purchase them wholesale in Belgium and sell them in France. When I was looking for dogs we would pick up panels on the way back from dog searching (multi-tasking). I bet the panels are manufactured in Germany and Holland as well as there is a lot of manufacturing in these countries as well.


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## Jason Hammel (Aug 13, 2009)

If your going to have a metal fabricator TIG or MIG weld Tubular steel then I would actually talk to a 4wheel drive shop. I have several buddies who build roll cages and tube buggies winch bumpers etc.

The economy is hurting everyone so I would talk to one of them 1st. If a guy makes clean welds and has a tube bender then building big rectangular 'monkey' cages would not be a problem IMHO. The welds should look like they came off Lance Armstrongs Tour de France bike. 

Sorry to go a lil off topic.


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## Carol Boche (May 13, 2007)

Jason Hammel said:


> Sorry to go a lil off topic.


Not off topic at all.....good suggestion actually. 

He tore back the stall mats that were the flooring, bent the hog wire back and dug a friggin hole and was out this morning trying to nail my cats. 

(my mats are 6'L x 4'W x 1"thick so they weigh a TON....looks like he peeled them back like they were paper. 

SO, the crew is out there installing a floor in the kennel with 2' x 4" on a frame. They are digging down so that the floor sticks out past the kennel walls. 

Right now he is doped and in the aluminum crate again.


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## Kristen Cabe (Mar 27, 2006)

Wow. 

I sure hope you get your money's worth out of his owners.


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## Carol Boche (May 13, 2007)

Yeah, about the time I figure out how to keep him in, the owners will be back...LOL

Merle is bringing the stock trailier today......trying to figure out where to place it for shade, since trees are scarce here....ugh

The rotten thing about the whole deal is that when I get him out he is very obedient, sits, downs, heels, stays, comes when called everytime (even with the cats present) and plays like crazy.....

If there were no fear based issues with strangers, he would be fine at work with me. SO, I feel for the dog. As much as I want to throttle him, I feel for him as he is a nice dog (other than the fear) to be around. 

He is actually fine with people if they just ignore him.....if they put pressure on him to pet him, then it gets a little dicey....


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## Julie Ann Alvarez (Aug 4, 2007)

Can you put him in a snug harness and then use a chain attached to some thing very heavy that he would have to drag slowly around so the other animals are safe? I picture large used tires heavily weighted and a 5 foot chain.

I like the stock trailer idea. Does he like meaty bones? Just wandering if you can get him a butchered beef carcas and throw it in the pen to keep his mind occupied. It does sound like he likes to eat.

What a nightmare.


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## Jeff Oehlsen (Apr 7, 2006)

Does he act desparate, or is this something that he does because it has worked so many times in the past ??

If he does not look desparate, I would put the E-collar on him, and watch him from the window, and other devious places and then yell no, and let him have it.

I hate dogs with this shit.


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## Heather Boche (Aug 29, 2009)

Wow. I never thought that it was going to be that bad.. 
I thought maybe like Rock just a little bit worse...
But it sounds like it is WAY WAY worse then Rock. 
Poor mommy... And no Heather to stay with him LOL


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## Carol Boche (May 13, 2007)

Jeff Oehlsen said:


> Does he act desparate, or is this something that he does because it has worked so many times in the past ??
> 
> If he does not look desparate, I would put the E-collar on him, and watch him from the window, and other devious places and then yell no, and let him have it.
> 
> I hate dogs with this shit.



A little of both...desperate and the fact that it has worked before. 

I tried the e-collar thing....brand new dogtra.....fully loaded....he just stops, sits and then goes right back to it. 

Tried knuckle bones and what not.....won't touch them unless I am standing there....seriously.....


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## Kadi Thingvall (Jan 22, 2007)

You might look at the rigs pitbull people use and try putting something like that together. I would be a lot cheaper then repairing all the damage he's done so far. And he might even do better on it, if he doesn't feel like he's "caged" maybe he won't wig out quite so much. Diane Jessup has a page on her website about how to set up a rig. http://www.workingpitbull.com/tethering.html I've also seen some rigs that had the cable running between two posts or trees and then a chain trolley setup.


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## Lynn Cheffins (Jul 11, 2006)

I'm with Kadi and would recommend a secure tie-out. Make sure you have a heavy-enough slip-proof collar with good hardware. (like this one http://www.reshaequip.com/images/circlecollar.jpg I like cold shuts like this http://www.fdsons.com/cold-shuts-n240341-p-1896.html?osCsid=3d9c99bc42898737538af063f295e157 to fasten the bull snaps to the chain rather than the screw down quick links shown though. If you don't have the aircraft tie downs you can always pound in a heavy pipe (or heavy t-post) and use a large ring over the post to attach the chain to - put a tire on top of the post so he can't flip the chain off when he is jumping around.
He really sounds like a bit of trial - hope you are charging the owners LARGE for boarding him!


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## Carol Boche (May 13, 2007)

I like the look and idea of this stuff.....but.....I really think he would kill himself trying to get out of it. I really do.....I tied him to the walnut tree so that I could fill the hole before the crew got here, and he dang near choked himself out, digging at his neck and twisting when I was visible....I can just imagine what he would do if I were to leave him.

Not sure a harness would work as he could chew it off......

It is actually becoming a Civil War type thing....he vollies and then I vollie.....and I am actually able to shake my head a laugh about it today. 

Maybe a steel hamster ball would work.....LOL


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## Jason Hammel (Aug 13, 2009)

Lynn Cheffins said:


> If you don't have the aircraft tie downs you can always pound in a heavy pipe (or heavy t-post) and use a large ring over the post to attach the chain to - put a tire on top of the post so he can't flip the chain off when he is jumping around.


 
The old school guys I grew up around would use a 3/4 ton Truck Axel pounded into the ground. About 6" off the ground and it will have the axel end (where it bolts to the brakes wheel etc) stop the chain from coming off. All this other stuff is great just kinda fancy IMO.

The Owner should repay you for the damages. If you have never had any issue before with your other boarding dogs then just to the tether thing and rbuild how it was. AND CHARGE them. IMO


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## Nicole Stark (Jul 22, 2009)

I'd leave the gate open.

Ok, so that wasn't exactly helpful... I supposed he'd have interest in RMBs if he got hungry enough.

Got a 4 wheeler? If so put a weighted vest on him and run his ass in to the ground. That's really not helpful either, nor would I expect it to work.

I would really like to know what these people do with him when they have to go to work or the store, etc. I think you mentioned that they laughed it off and cleaned up the mess. He sounds so destructive I cannot imagine that they'd have much of a house left nor really continue to find it funny after all this time.

I've heard of dogs like this but have never actually had to deal with one. Sounds like a miserable existence for him. One he'd probably be better off not in if his owners aren't willing to do the right thing and deal with it properly.


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## Carol Boche (May 13, 2007)

Nicole Stark said:


> I'd leave the gate open.
> 
> Ok, so that wasn't exactly helpful... I supposed he'd have interest in RMBs if he got hungry enough.
> 
> ...


LOL....we thought about leaving the gate open, but that was quashed when he dug out and just ran around whining and looking for people......

I have been running him with the four wheeler.....when he is not too stoned.  

It is not something I would wish on my worst enemy I don't think. I have a semi soft spot for him now, but not enough to give in and treat him like a human. NO WAY!!!!


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## Nicole Stark (Jul 22, 2009)

Well, then maybe there's your answer. Leave the gate open and tell them he ran off. That will satisfy their ego I'm sure. Not that I am suggesting there's anything wrong with his owners.

Sounds like he won't leave anyway. Then do the right thing for him. Keep him and help him find a way into a good life then put him where he'll thrive. I cannot imagine having to carry that bizarre burden.

I'm not shifty but I do have a genuine concern for animals that I think are in a situation that isn't good for them. There's really no legitimate reason these people have allowed this to occur.


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## Carol Boche (May 13, 2007)

They asked me if I wanted him....I have 5 of my own dogs to care for right now and we will be having a litter from Esta as well. So, as much as I feel for the dog....I cannot keep him....but I can try to find a home for him.....he is just so big and destructive......I doubt I can find a home fast enough. 

I understand what you are saying though. Want me to ship him to you? LOL


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## Kristen Cabe (Mar 27, 2006)

Good luck finding someone that will take that on, Carol.


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## Nicole Stark (Jul 22, 2009)

He'd probably never make the flight to AK. Seriously, believe it or not if the timing were right I'd take you up on the offer. 

I don't have the time (long term) that it would take to get him right - if it's even possible. I'm planning for a new arrival (puppy) myself, which is something I've waited a long time for (the right dog to work). Needless to say it's important enough to me that I don't want to get myself committed to something and side tracked in the process.


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## Carol Boche (May 13, 2007)

Here are a couple pics of the monster.....he is a trim 97.6lbs now.....

Puppy

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v666/bumper01/image103.jpg

And now......(well a few months ago)
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v666/bumper01/image101.jpg

Posted links instead....don't feel like resizing....LOL I am tired.


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## Carol Boche (May 13, 2007)

Kristen Cabe said:


> Good luck finding someone that will take that on, Carol.


I know....I think he can go home.....I am just swamped with everything else.....and as much as it kills me......but if I can get her to STOP feeding all that shit....it is a step in the right direction.


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## Carol Boche (May 13, 2007)

Thought I would update you guys on Jack.....he has spent three nights outside in the kennel run now, and aside from a bit of whining and howling, he has not done any damage. 

2.5 to 4 miles a day with the four wheeler and just a small dose of calming meds and he is doing okay. I mainly give him meds before bedtime.....if I am home, he seems happy to just voice his opinion on being in a kennel without destroying stuff. 

He still would like to eat the cats, so I am actually debating on using the e-collar with him on that issue. BUT, he comes when called even of focused on them so I am not sure that doing that would benefit him. Since he will recall away....I am happy with that. 

I do put him in a cool area in the crate during the day while I am gone. I do not trust him to stay in the kennel after my vehicle leaves. 

He is now eating by himself and drinking as well. 

What kills me is that he is coming along and actually learning to cope with alone time in a reasonable way....and when he goes home.....it will all be undone I fear.


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## Jeff Oehlsen (Apr 7, 2006)

Quote: .and when he goes home.....it will all be undone I fear.


Who gives a shit ?? LOL You planning on boarding this guy again and losing a bunch of money ?? :razz:


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## Carol Boche (May 13, 2007)

Jeff Oehlsen said:


> Quote: .and when he goes home.....it will all be undone I fear.
> 
> 
> Who gives a shit ?? LOL You planning on boarding this guy again and losing a bunch of money ?? :razz:


Well.....ummmmm let me think about that............NO

But he has made progress.....and that I am proud of and hate to see it undone. 8-[
(remind me to throw something at you when I get there!!!!!) :razz:


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## Jeff Oehlsen (Apr 7, 2006)

Just chalk it up to a learning experience. Have you at least used him to practice the tug on a line ??


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## Carol Boche (May 13, 2007)

Jeff Oehlsen said:


> Just chalk it up to a learning experience. Have you at least used him to practice the tug on a line ??


Yep, I did last night.....not really drivey for that at first, but gave me good opportunity to work the line and wedge to get him to want to go after it. 

Ball on a string work was better as well.....


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## Nicole Stark (Jul 22, 2009)

That made my day. I've been wondering how he's doing.

Who knows maybe he'll leave enough of an impression on you to keep him around - even if for the eventual someone else.


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## ann schnerre (Aug 24, 2006)

i was wondering today as well what was going on. good to hear he's settling a bit.


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## Drew Peirce (Nov 16, 2006)

damn he looks cool, any pics that show his physique?


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## Carol Boche (May 13, 2007)

Drew....I will catch a few pics tomorrow....he is a well built dog....large....but solid.....


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## Jeff Oehlsen (Apr 7, 2006)

Quote: damn he looks cool, any pics that show his physique?

Really ?? His physique ?? Good God.


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## Drew Peirce (Nov 16, 2006)

my bad, conformation........


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## Gillian Schuler (Apr 12, 2008)

Carole, congrats on getting this dog so far. You'll just have to keep it. How can anyone take over from here????

Jeff, some people are interested how dogs look, not how they tick. Face it and cym.


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## Ashley Campbell (Jun 21, 2009)

Wow, not what I expected a GSD/Mal cross to look like, he's actually rather handsome looking. Though that doesn't make up for his asshattery of destroying stuff.

It's probably a good thing you didn't use a horse trailer. Most of them have wooden plank floors (at least mine does) and they are escapable, when I go home to AZ my dogs have to stay in a large steel stock trailer (it's not a paneled kind, it's solid on the sides) and they have managed to damage floorboards. But they have to stay there because my mom has like 10 dogs, and I don't know how well they'd get along, etc. Actually the one that destroyed the floor boards was put down this last winter, he dug at them until he escaped. Not that you can't just replace them with wood from the hardware store, but still, sounds like he's destroyed enough shit.

Glad you figured out how to contain him, I'm sorry if sending him back is going to mean a major regression in behavior. I hope that their comment of "do you want him" doesn't mean they're going to try to look for another home for a dog that's that weird.


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## Carol Boche (May 13, 2007)

LOL...we did try the trailer and he either bashed into the sides or dug at the flooring....

Today was a bad day....I did not give him meds as he has been doing okay...went home to find the aluminum crate vents that he did not rip out before, gone....so now there are 4 to replace. 

More drugs again. Somehow I am going to have to listen to Doug and the "I told you it was too good to be true" LOL...hate it when he is right. 

He is a really nice looking dog.....when I first started working with them, he was severely overwieght....topping 130# seriously....now he is 97.6 and looks SO much better....probably could drop another 7 and be trim at 90#

Not sure how he got SO big with the Mal in there.....from what I saw of the Mals at the AFB, they were fairly medium sized....not sure what the GSD's size is. 

Anyhow....teaching a CGC class to some 5th graders tonight and will get some pics then.....Jack will not participate in the class...he is getting a bath after class.....LOL


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## Jeff Oehlsen (Apr 7, 2006)

It takes how long to condition proper behavior ??

How much longer does it take when it has been conditioned to do the wrong thing ???

HA HA. LOL


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## Carol Boche (May 13, 2007)

Jeff Oehlsen said:


> It takes how long to condition proper behavior ??
> 
> How much longer does it take when it has been conditioned to do the wrong thing ???
> 
> HA HA. LOL


PPLLLBBBTTTTTTT....to you.....

He is sleeping like a baby right now....LOL 

Maybe I will just take the Ace and then I won't care......:-\":-\":lol::lol::lol::lol::lol:


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## Jeff Oehlsen (Apr 7, 2006)

Always plan "B" right there. My first Rott had seperation anxiety, but no where near that nutty shit. I do not want to be in your shoes at all.


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