# Hip X-ray questions



## Stacia Porter (Apr 8, 2006)

Achilles will be 14 months on the 29th nad the vet has suggested I have his hips xrayed now instead of later. We aren't sure we'll ever breed him, but he's only SV papered so he has to have the registered x rays blah blah blah (again, slim chance we'll breed him).

The vet suggested doing the x rays now just in case there is a problem b/c treatment options are available. So I made an appt for June 6th.

They want to try to do the x rays withotu putting him under if possible, but I don't see this happening. He isn't going to lay still on his back for anyone...suggestions? He also needs his nails trimmed BADLY so I've asked for htat, and he's having his shots.

Do I need to do the x rays now? Should I try to get the PennHip certified vet to do them instead? Any info is appreciated!


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## Sarah Hall (Apr 12, 2006)

In my tech experience, we never had a dog that would allow his rear legs to be tied up and stretched back for the OFA-style hip shots. I like PennHip better for breeding stock. If you cannot (or can, but with great difficulty) make him lay flat on his back while his legs are tied and stretched back at your house with the people he knows and trusts, you won't be able to do it without sedation at the vet's. It's stressful, and many dogs are very sore for the next few days because of how the legs are stretched. Get his shots, but I'd hold off on hip x-rays until breeding age at 2 years old, IMO.


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## Stacia Porter (Apr 8, 2006)

Sarah Hall said:


> In my tech experience, we never had a dog that would allow his rear legs to be tied up and stretched back for the OFA-style hip shots. I like PennHip better for breeding stock. If you cannot (or can, but with great difficulty) make him lay flat on his back while his legs are tied and stretched back at your house with the people he knows and trusts, you won't be able to do it without sedation at the vet's. It's stressful, and many dogs are very sore for the next few days because of how the legs are stretched. Get his shots, but I'd hold off on hip x-rays until breeding age at 2 years old, IMO.


At what age does Pennhip do the x rays, Sarah? I do know we have one Pennhip certified vet in town...


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## Sarah Hall (Apr 12, 2006)

PennHip can be done as early as 16 weeks old.


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## Nancy Jocoy (Apr 19, 2006)

From the perspective of someone who has a dog diagnosed with dysplasia AFTER the growth plates had closed, I will never again have a puppy that does not get OFA prelims at 4-6 months. 

Our treatment options are severely limited at this stage of the game to keeping the dog lean,fit , and flexible and hoping that it does not progress to the point of deciding whether or not to do a hip replacement.

The stats on their page indicate a pretty good predictive value of dysplasia at 2 (though I know even good at 2 may not mean much if there is laxity) and as I understand they typically get better as the dog matures as opposed to worse.


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## Connie Sutherland (Mar 27, 2006)

Stacia Porter said:


> ........The vet suggested doing the x rays now just in case there is a problem b/c treatment options are available. So I made an appt for June 6th.......


A couple of good discussions:

http://www.workingdogs.com/ofa_penn.htm
http://www.pennhip.org/PennHIPFAQ.html


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## Connie Sutherland (Mar 27, 2006)

Sarah Hall said:


> PennHip can be done as early as 16 weeks old.


Is there an "ideal" age, do you know?


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## Sarah Hall (Apr 12, 2006)

I suggest the dog getting prelimed at 4-7 months of age, and I usually wait until a male is 18-24 months (20-26 months for females) old to get the actual cert. done. Mainly because I won't breed a male until he's 24 months old (won't breed a female until 26months).


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## Kristen Cabe (Mar 27, 2006)

I've heard that PennHip is not as good a rating as OFA because with PennHip, your dog's x-rays are compared to other dogs' x-rays to determine how good or bad they are. If they compare your dog's, say, good hips, to a bunch of excellent hips, your dog might get a lower rating. If your dog's good hips are compared to a bunch of fair or worse hips, your dog could be rated excellent when he's really not. Seems to me like with PennHip, the results could be off.


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## Sarah Hall (Apr 12, 2006)

I don't know how they do PennHip, but I know it measures the laxity in the joint. There, as always, are people that favor PennHip and those that favor OFA. Kind of like German vs American Shepherds. I never liked OFA just because any dog I had done (at different clinics too) were sore the next few days because of the way they stretch their legs out, plus I saw a few very dysplastic dogs (practically HAD no joint) get a "Fair" rating while I was teching, which some people WILL breed.
It's all personal taste. I've done both PennHip AND OFA on two males. Some breeders like to see OFA, and some like PennHIp. Like I said, it's all personal preference.


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## Kristen Cabe (Mar 27, 2006)

Here's some info that I found to be kind of interesting:

http://www.pennhip.org/what_is_ph.html
http://www.pennhip.org/ph_method.html

http://www.canismajor.com/dog/pennhip1.html

http://www.thepetcenter.com/xra/ph.html

http://www.offa.org/hipproc.html
http://www.offa.org/hipgrade.html


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## Kristen Cabe (Mar 27, 2006)

Since both PennHIP and OFA _do_ use the x-ray that OFA uses to rate the dog, could you not do both using that same radiograph? I mean, could you not have that same x-ray evaluated by both PennHIP _and_ OFA and have both ratings?


Nevermind, I just found the answer #-o 



> Since both PennHIP and OFA use the ventrodorsal, hip-extended view, PennHIP certified veterinarian can make a copy of the hip-extended radiograph for submission to the OFA at the time your dog has the PennHIP procedure. You do not have to abandon OFA opinion nor schedule a separate appointment for an additional radiograph.


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## susan tuck (Mar 28, 2006)

Dr White in So Calif does ofa xrays without anesthesia. (I found him Connie!). Does anyone have an opinion on which program is better - OFA or USA/SV "a" stamp program?


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## Trish Campbell (Nov 28, 2006)

OFA will only give the actual certification of a dog at 2 yrs of age, they will do a preliminary report anytime prior. 
The A stamp can be done at 1 year. 
As far as which one is better, think you will get quite a few different opinions on that one


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