# mad as retrieve drive - what to do with



## Peter Cavallaro (Dec 1, 2010)

looking for suggestions on how to take training advanatge of a pup with an insatialble drive to go fetch things, have not put it on command, just pure motivational at this stage untill i get to a real trainer to help with foundation work.

already put older vids up - pup has got more obsessed since then.

tried to "cure" him by chucking a stick untill he was forced to give up from exhaustion - i walked away exhausted, pup had butt and tongue dragging on ground but was still up for more.

guess i could use it to get shot ducks lol, but was just looking for suggestions. 

would like to do more than just retrieving a object over a 1m high hurdle and sitting really straight. seems to easy and pointless, sorry sch. guys.

pup has a problem with retreiving to hand but has figured out it is the only way i will keep playing so gives it up sort of - trembles though when i go to pick it up and snaps at hand. if he re-bites retreive toy i just walk away disinterested until he basically gives it to me for free.

don't know why but the OG seems like a totally cool thing IMO, i would like a dog good at that even though there is no venue here for it. maybe go in that direction with this drive??


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## mike suttle (Feb 19, 2008)

in your opening sentence you said your looking for suggestions......here's one.
Keep working his retrieve and hunt for the next year and sell him to me when he is old enough.


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## Marta Wajngarten (Jul 30, 2006)

BUT DOES HE RETRIEVE METAL??? (tan dan daaaa)

sorry.. had to 

One useful thing I can think of is to teach him to find and retrieve specific objects on command, i.e. car keys or what ever you can think of. Could be very handy or just a stupid party trick.


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## Peter Cavallaro (Dec 1, 2010)

mike suttle said:


> *looking for suggestions......here's one. Keep working his retrieve and hunt for the next year and sell him to me when he is old enough*.


 
there ya go folks, thats why Mike is ridng the wave while the rest of ya are still paddling yr canoes in the backwaters, Mike can see whats up before the rest of y'all have even woken up. :-D

Mike don't want yr money but if yr thinking of sending me a proven brood female in trade we can talk lol


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## Peter Cavallaro (Dec 1, 2010)

Marta Wajngarten said:


> *BUT DOES HE RETRIEVE METAL???* .....
> 
> *....... Could be very handy or just a stupid party trick*.


yeah will retreive metal no problemo - i don't know why the metal thing is good but it is a big deal here, why is that???


party trick is about all i got to train for unfortunately - think i will focus on the OG, pointless but looks cool and less gay than retreiveing a *dumb*-bell.


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## Kelly Godwin (Jul 25, 2011)

Peter Cavallaro said:


> yeah will retreive metal no problemo - i don't know why the metal thing is good but it is a big deal here, why is that???


I think it has to do with the fact that a dog who will go crazy over something that is uncomfortable in their mouth has a huge amount of drive. 

It really is a sight to see a dog hunt for metal in a large field and stay in the hunt until the metal is found - no matter how long. We got to see some of this at Logan Haus with Ivo. He methodically worked the field until he found the pipe and this was a big field. He was in the work for a while but not once did he get distracted. 

Really cool stuff!


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## Peter Cavallaro (Dec 1, 2010)

Whatever floats folks boats i guess, if everyone says it's good then it's good.


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## Shane Woodlief (Sep 9, 2009)

Hey Pete one the things that you can do is if you have an object small enough to keep on your person like a ball (Metal Pipes for Mike ) that the dog just goes nuts to retrieve you can harness that drive for obedience and use the short retrieve for the reward if that makes any since. 

Like Kelley said early it is about drive so harness it to help in obedience.

If it is a metal pipe you can also use that to hit him over the head with if he gets out of line - Hard to hit him with a ball. - Now I know that there are some people out there that I will have to explain this too so here goes I AM ONLY JOKING YOU MORONS!


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## Peter Cavallaro (Dec 1, 2010)

So Shane, yr saying i should beat my pup over the head every time it retrieves something???


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## Shane Woodlief (Sep 9, 2009)

dude you killing me fo coarse lol!


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## Peter Cavallaro (Dec 1, 2010)

Man don't mess with me u knew i hang on yr every word




lol


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## Shane Woodlief (Sep 9, 2009)

No way dude I get hung up on yours!


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## Maren Bell Jones (Jun 7, 2006)

Has dock diving made it over to Oz yet? I should know, but I don't. :wink: Anyways, do some water retrieve. Swimming is great low impact for the joints.


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## Peter Cavallaro (Dec 1, 2010)

Will look into it......in the next life maybe.


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## Nicole Stark (Jul 22, 2009)

I gather you've gone this route already but if not, start hiding the object he is retrieving. An example of what I have done with my pup is below.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LU5uCg4gfa0


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## Peter Cavallaro (Dec 1, 2010)

Thanks, seems like a good idea.


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## will fernandez (May 17, 2006)

I will second the retrieve as a reward for obedience and searching. For ob give a command, mark it and toss the object for reward.

For searching I would throw out gradually decreasing sized objects when he retrieves them throw his toy for the reward.


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## Bob Scott (Mar 30, 2006)

See if he will retrieve a stick you throw into a pile of similar sticks. That will help you see if he's just retrieving or using his nose to find your scent.


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## rick smith (Dec 31, 2010)

the dog is self satisfying and all you are becoming is a ball/stick/whatever "launcher"

you haven't used this behavior and drive interactively and it's not "working for you"

the more you allow it to continue this way, the more obsessed with it the dog will become

it's why i don't play "fetch" with dogs ... recommend you start training it to work for you and with you


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## brad robert (Nov 26, 2008)

rick smith said:


> the dog is self satisfying and all you are becoming is a ball/stick/whatever "launcher"
> 
> you haven't used this behavior and drive interactively and it's not "working for you"
> 
> ...


Can you expand on this rick?

Is this similiar to the ME approach of playing tug?


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## Peter Cavallaro (Dec 1, 2010)

Rick did u, miss the bit where i said it was untrained n i was looking for some place to direct it prior to contacting an experienced trainer??


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## brad robert (Nov 26, 2008)

I here what your saying peter but i think rick raises a good point i use to do things like what you have done with your pup and i ended up with a dog who is posessive of its toy not to the point of aggression but the dog gets its toy ball whatever and wont bring it back and says screw you its mine its a total PITA for training i have to make the dog bring the ball back it wont come and harrass me to play because of the way i trained her which when she was a pup i use to train more along the flinks style ME says this is a problem with this method and from what i have seen i would agree.

I love the methodology of the dog gets rewarded for bringing me the toy and initiating play then you have a foundation


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## brad robert (Nov 26, 2008)

Meant to add that you may have a foundation but you also get another type of PITA the type thats always hounding you to play but that i could live with.

I know you just want things to do to channel his drive peter but starting all this properly will make your life much easier when you find that trainer.


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## Peter Cavallaro (Dec 1, 2010)

No argument here, pup is entering the era that there are rules on when you can and can't act like an A-hole.


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## Nancy Jocoy (Apr 19, 2006)

The only comment here (all mine are ball fools but I encouraged that from day 1) is that I would be careful with the sticks. 

I personally know (not *internet know* but training together know) 5 different dogs who have had sticks penetrate the soft palate by either running with them and having the end of the stick hit the ground and push in or having some strange accident when they got the stick. I also have two metal retrievers (all three will retrieve a thrown metal object but Cyra and Beau will go out of way to locate and carry metal objects.)..I am not really sure that means a darned thing but that is neither here nor there.

I only throw balls large enough the dog can't swallow or other objects like sections of heater hose etc.


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## rick smith (Dec 31, 2010)

not jumpin on you at all Peter, but i look at just about everything you do in the dog's presence, with it watching you, as a type of training of one sort or another...it is learning stuff from you all the time, sometimes good sometimes not so good 
it's getting reinforced to repeat stuff or not repeat stuff; developing good or bad "habits", etc
formal or informal, it's kinda all the same to me
with or without a pro present to guide you along, and in some cases the pro "on the field" could care less what you do elsewhere, but what happens "elsewhere", can screw up your field training too :-( ...and vice versa

especially with a pup - they are "learning" behaviors from you during every waking moment whether you consider it a "training session" or not

dogs read us a lot more often than we read them


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## Geoff Empey (Jan 8, 2008)

Nicole Stark said:


> I gather you've gone this route already but if not, start hiding the object he is retrieving. An example of what I have done with my pup is below.
> 
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LU5uCg4gfa0


This is a great way to work the pup Peter. If you get some searching into it, it is a surefire way to take it to the next level. Turn the retrieve drive into Hunt drive and get the dog more into using his nose. Just keep doing it in a playful way and prepare to be amazed.


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## Peter Cavallaro (Dec 1, 2010)

Thanks for the comments guys all very helpful.

Kind of got the impression the metal object retrieve has taken on a mythical importance and many don't really know why it deserves such high status but do it anyway.

Cheers


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## Marta Wajngarten (Jul 30, 2006)

Peter Cavallaro said:


> yeah will retreive metal no problemo - i don't know why the metal thing is good but it is a big deal here, why is that???
> 
> 
> party trick is about all i got to train for unfortunately - think i will focus on the OG, pointless but looks cool and less gay than retreiveing a *dumb*-bell.



HUH?? so you only read the first 4 and the last 5 words in my post? I said to teach him to find and retrieve specific objects on command.


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## Gillian Schuler (Apr 12, 2008)

Nancy Jocoy said:


> The only comment here (all mine are ball fools but I encouraged that from day 1) is that I would be careful with the sticks.
> 
> I personally know (not *internet know* but training together know) 5 different dogs who have had sticks penetrate the soft palate by either running with them and having the end of the stick hit the ground and push in or having some strange accident when they got the stick. I also have two metal retrievers (all three will retrieve a thrown metal object but Cyra and Beau will go out of way to locate and carry metal objects.)..I am not really sure that means a darned thing but that is neither here nor there.
> 
> I only throw balls large enough the dog can't swallow or other objects like sections of heater hose etc.


Agreed Nancy. Any balls around the size of a tennis ball that my dogs occasionally play with have a long string / ribbon on them (even this is probably not foolproof) but I know of a dog that picked up a ball whiilst running free and swallowed it. The owner tried - over an hour - to save the dog - was bitten as she tried to pull it out of him.

This is not a dramatic incident - it happened to a Mohnwiese GSD.

What about footballs or basket balls, my dogs love them, even if they sometimes get theiir teeth plugged into them.

A big, hard rubber kong on al long rope is my choice.


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## Nancy Jocoy (Apr 19, 2006)

LOL ok now there are metal retrievers. The puppy will retrieve glass mason jars (well actually, they have training materials in them but he does not want to retrieve them, he wants to possess them....balls he will retrive but I think he wants to have the HR to himself)

-----

No, I thought it was anchored down better than it was. Little bugger was fast and got it before I could get to him.
I need major work to anchor down his hides until he learns not to pick them up.


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