# Crying Over K-9s



## Howard Gaines III (Dec 26, 2007)

Has anyone had an issue with their neighbors regarding your dogs or training; crying over the style of training, dogs barking, handlers hollering, and the illusion of K-9 beatings when stick hits are used? Understand, my neighbors love it; they get a free show, folks stop to watch and ask questions, and we never seem to have salesmen! :mrgreen:=D>


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## David Frost (Mar 29, 2006)

The only complaint I've ever had is; "locking the dog is a small space, for hours on end, without benefit of exercise." The small space is the back of Ford Crown Vic.

DFrost


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## Geoff Empey (Jan 8, 2008)

All depends .. on the show itself and the stomach of the audience.  Like any good showman Harold you gotta know the audience. 

I've seen people at demos totally mortified over the limp noodle padded stick and the illusion of the aggression on the sleeve call the cops. Then another time see dogs choked out and the crap kicked out of them, with nothing but a shrug of the shoulders.


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## Thomas Barriano (Mar 27, 2006)

I had a guy I train with, tell me Animal Control came to his house saying they had a report he was watching dogs fighting in his back yard. It actually was a male Malinois that had come over to breed to his female. JQP don't know the difference between fighting and 
fuking :=)


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## Bob Scott (Mar 30, 2006)

My back yard is small (corner lot) so I do all my training in the side or front yard. VERY rarely anything but ob but I've had a couple of them question my use of a tug as a reward. Usually from folks with red or blue neck scarves on their "cute" dogs ](*,). LOTS of dog walkers here.
"IF" they stop and watch a bit they more often then not change their minds. None of my neighbors are aware that my dogs have been "bite" trained.
When my brother trains with me over here with his Presa most don't even stop to watch. :roll:


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## Derek Milliken (Apr 19, 2009)

I had the police called on me once for "beating" the dogs, with the stick.
RCMP showed up, took one look, laughed, wished us a good night, and went to go tell the neighbour to mind his own business


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## Kadi Thingvall (Jan 22, 2007)

No issues from my neighbors, probably because I know most of them and they like the dogs. But I also don't do bitework at my house, partly for liability reasons and partly because of the barking it would generate. Probably one reason my neighbors like me 

However, when training at other locations (private fields, public parks, businesses, etc) we've had people stop and pull in to start going off about the abuse of the dogs (usually due to the FR stick work), other people call AC about us beating dogs, and my favorite people calling the police about us "fighting pitbulls". Umm, only 1 dog out there at a time, he's biting a decoy, how can anyone think that's dog fighting? Never had a problem with AC or the police though, if they even bothered to show up they just watched what we were doing then left. Once or twice we were asked to keep the dogs on leash, or get a permit to use that park. A few of the private citizens who stopped by left better educated about protection dogs, the clatter stick, etc. A few just left, once they realized were weren't interested in listening to their AR sermon, and since they were on private property if anyone called the cops it would be us, to have them removed.


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## Laura Bollschweiler (Apr 25, 2008)

Yes. We train at an obedience club's field and there is a dog park right next door, well within view. Sometimes the obedience club gets complaints from those people about the SchH clubs that train there on off nights, but very fortunately for us, the training director of the obed club is supportive of us and has a letter she's written explaining what we are doing. We really like it when the local cops stop by and hang out with their police cars. We feel like it gives us credibility or something. The dog park closes at 9:00 p.m., so certain dogs might go after 9:00. :-\"

A coiuple years ago, my sister, who sort of knows what I do, called me to let me know somebody was doing bitework down the street from her in a very public unofficial dog walking area. Lots of people in her very nice neighborhood take Fluffy for walks in the private land down the street. My sister said she was walking with another lady and their little dogs and they happened upon a training session. The woman with her was ready to call the police because they were hitting the dogs. Not only that but the cars all had barking dogs and that was upsetting people. My sister managed to talk the woman out of calling the police but still was pissed about the invasion into their neighborhood. She described the people to me and I knew exactly who they all were. Malinios people! 

Laura


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## georgia estes (Nov 3, 2009)

We got the 'fighting dogs' thing a lot. I haven't a clue why. We had the cops called at least 5 times. It was never over 'beating' a dog though, it was always 'dog fighting'. I guess they were half right, the dog was fighting someone, just not another dog. :roll:


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## Adam Swilling (Feb 12, 2009)

No issues here, so far. The older man and woman behind me are great; he's 70 and still keeps pit bulls around. He did 3 tours in Vietnam so he doesn't sweat the small stuff; worked around (not with) dogs for one of those tours. He even knew what a malinois was by sight which is odd in my neck of the woods. The neighbors on one side love the dogs; they told me the other day that they know when they hear the dogs bark to take a look, plus the dogs are great with their kids. The neighbors on the other side are scared shitless of them, which is how I want it. Fortunately, they don't complain.


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## Daniel Lybbert (Nov 23, 2010)

Nothing here. Most of the town comes and watches the trial we hold. I have seen shit at other fields I have been pretty offended at. But not really my problem. Had the cops come once for shooting pistols in town.(just a starter pistol) they didn't care.


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## Jim Nash (Mar 30, 2006)

I've had similar experiances as David . If folks only knew how much our dogs love being in a squad car . I think mine probably does about 10 miles a night pacing in the back of the squad also . 

This is related to the soccer ball thread . Our head trainer likes to bring the new patrol classes around the local soccer fields for OB and bitework . 

One day a soccer Dad came over quite irrate yelling at Mark to get the dogs out of there because there are little kids present . Mark was trying to calm this guy down when one of the volunteers from the nearby Humane Society came by while out walking one of the pound dogs . 

This guy came over and from what I was told yelled at Mr Soccer Dad : " The officer here is a professional so he can't tell you to get f***ed but I will because those dog are probably more well behaved then your kids ; So get f***ed ! " and walked off .

We have a similar issue with the local mall cop who works the downtown skyways . Mark just comes back time after time and listens to him yell as they walk the dogs .


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## Pete Stevens (Dec 16, 2010)

I have both good and bad experiences. The good is when we as K9 handlers get to explain that these dogs have to train for the real world. We have to throw everything at them because someone could get hurt or even worse, killed. But most of our training doesn't take place out in public. Now I have seen some really dumb stuff most of it from my sport people, but some cops too. Doing bitework in a public park, near a play ground with a ton of kids is just asking for problems. I just think its in bad taste. Especially of they are using a loud whip popper. I give a call to whatever jurisdiction I might be in if we are doing gunfire exercises. They still have to come check it out but are usually much more relaxed. Its no big deal when your with a bunch of black and whites, but for my civilain friends it solves a lot of un-needed drama.

My neighbors are great, the ones I like anyway. I can't hear the other ones cuz my dogs bark too much.


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## Jim Nash (Mar 30, 2006)

Pete Stevens said:


> I have both good and bad experiences. The good is when we as K9 handlers get to explain that these dogs have to train for the real world. We have to throw everything at them because someone could get hurt or even worse, killed. But most of our training doesn't take place out in public. Now I have seen some really dumb stuff most of it from my sport people, but some cops too. Doing bitework in a public park, near a play ground with a ton of kids is just asking for problems. I just think its in bad taste. Especially of they are using a loud whip popper. I give a call to whatever jurisdiction I might be in if we are doing gunfire exercises. They still have to come check it out but are usually much more relaxed. Its no big deal when your with a bunch of black and whites, but for my civilain friends it solves a lot of un-needed drama.
> 
> My neighbors are great, the ones I like anyway. I can't hear the other ones cuz my dogs bark too much.


Been doing that for over 20 some years no problems except for some overly anal cry babies at times . Usually it's a chance to educate the public . They can come up and ask questions and learn something . They get to see theses aren't just out of control "attack dogs" . We've had far more positive experiances by training in the public then negative ones .

We have a very good relationship with our citizens and a big part of it is because of our openness to them .


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## Geoff Empey (Jan 8, 2008)

Jim Nash said:


> We've had far more positive experiances by training in the public then negative ones .


I have my jumps set up in my front yard in the summer. We live on a busy busy street that is a city bus route as well. It is pretty funny watching the faces of the people on the bus as my little female clambers up the palisade at 2.1m or flies over the hurdle at my chest level. 

We get recognized at the local restaurant now and mall, people come up to me. " Hey you are the guy that has that real well trained dog." 

Haven't done bitework yet out front but tried once at the college and the rent a cop put a squash on that quick, I should have known better to try it on private property. 

We have a new mailman too and we weren't getting mail for a few weeks as the dogs go to the door all bent out of shape every time, and it was freaking this young guy out. He showed up while I was doing the jumps outside one day again he was all apprehensive about the dog. So I showed him how obedient she was and then pulled out one of the Belgian arms I have and did a quick bite, and outted her. He was pretty amazed then I passed him the sleeve and he took a few bites it was pretty funny seeing the mailman in his uniform with a Malinois hanging off of him! :lol: A Kodak moment!


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## Jim Nash (Mar 30, 2006)

Geoff Empey said:


> I have my jumps set up in my front yard in the summer. We live on a busy busy street that is a city bus route as well. It is pretty funny watching the faces of the people on the bus as my little female clambers up the palisade at 2.1m or flies over the hurdle at my chest level.
> 
> We get recognized at the local restaurant now and mall, people come up to me. " Hey you are the guy that has that real well trained dog."
> 
> ...


It's always good to keep the postal carrier happy when you're a dog owner . 

I found these videos awhile back while looking for other videos about our K9 unit . The first video is at one of our more popular parks along the river . Nothing special with they training . Looks like something easy the were ending on . 

The decoy is about 6'3" and he's got a bad knee that's been operated on twice after my first K9 blew that knee out in training , so he's pretty limited on some of the things he does nowadays . The female handler is a former member of Mike Scheiber's Schtz. club . Notice the person's comments about the video . Pretty positive . 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WJt8zBTAkAw

Somewhere in the city our K9 teams do training like this for anyone to see . We also use our neighborhoods to track and do area searches in too . Most of the time the residents are happy to allow use the use of their yards . I remember 1 complaint in my 14 years and that was from a guy who didn't want to see squad cars in his neighborhood because it made it look like a bad neighborhood . We do get some barking complaints from time to time but not very often .

Here are some videos I found of demos we do for about 2 weeks every year at out state fair . We've been doing this for about 20 some years also . The last time I can remember an accidental bite on a spectator here was about 12 years ago . It was on of our single purpose Drug dogs (Lab) as it was walking through the crowd . Go figure . There was a bad bite last year in the same training area . It wasn't from us but a Therapy dog that was allowing her dog to be pet . Bad facebite . 


This one the guy talking is doing his Buffalo Bill imitation .

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=94L3oWRik_U&feature=related

This one is a show of our awesome police decoys skills . 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JFrApzazCWo&feature=related


They are dogs and you have to be careful . But doing bitework in public is not something a police department should be ashamed of . It shows the public these dog have control and are not just bitting machines . 

So far the only negative video I found on youtube was of my dog crapping on somebody's lawn while doing a real article search after a carchase . Luckily the lady removed that video . It was pretty funny though .


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## sam wilks (May 3, 2009)

Had the cops, SPCA, and even fish and game out over 40 times in one year.
All from one set of neighbors behind me who dont like the dogs barking, even though I keep bark collars on them 99 percent of the time, not because I have to but out of courtesy. Had fish and game come out on reports that I was hanging ***** from a tree to train my **** hounds. Told him to tell the neighbors that I had a hundred dollar bill waiting for them if they came over and slipped a noose around the ***** neck.[-o< My neighbor is a town cop and I work with her husband so I haven't had too many problems with the cops. I think the k9 guy likes coming out and checking the dogs out anyway. The only time animal control raised an eyebrow was when my wifes uncle talked to them about the dogs. They're all crazy, you should see the ones in the van too they're nuts. haha. I just make sure that I know all the laws and I inform the officers, I'm doing everything I'm legally obligated to and then some trying to keep these people happy. The other neighbors are happy to have dogs around that will actually do something when needed. Even had one neighbor catch the dogs a few times.


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## Howard Gaines III (Dec 26, 2007)

I just got done with the SPCA kennel warden. She saw my kennels, buckets/feed pans, dogs (Border Collie, Bouviers and German Shepherd), food and the container it's in, and got a short tour of the farm. Her only remark, "Where's you're sheep?" :mrgreen: :-k

The nice thing about dealing with folks who know, you can pick their brain for better ideas for down the road! My kennel passed again and this is another thing off the "to do" list for this week. \\/


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## sam wilks (May 3, 2009)

yeah its kinda like what can they say when your dogs are in good shape with clean kennels and food and fresh water when you see dogs living in their own feces but as long as they have a shitty excuse for a dog box and a muddy bucket of water.


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## Junior Johnson (Mar 19, 2010)

I had local LE show up at a training location because someone called them to report that we were using cattle whips on the dogs. The decoy was using a whip, but it was from 30 yards away to get the attention of the dogs. The local PD does not have a canine and still after lengthy explanation didnt understand why a whip was being used. Thankfully, the officer realized that the dogs were not being abused and went on his way.


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## Michelle Reusser (Mar 29, 2008)

I live in Redneckville, no one gives a shit! My dogs have OB, therefore they are doggy royalty. "Them there dogs, is smart as all hell." All but 1 neighbor, love my dogs. We don't like her either.


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## Howard Gaines III (Dec 26, 2007)

Junior Johnson said:


> ... The local PD does not have a canine and still after lengthy explanation didnt understand why a whip was being used. Thankfully, the officer realized that the dogs were not being abused and went on his way.


This is...I think, the main reason some folks get all "bunched up" and issues take place. If you have never seen it done or have knowledge, the average person may think it is bad. I would hate to hear about blank guns..."They're shooting the dawgs at training. I saw it for real! Git somebody over here right NOW!" Seconds later, the SWAT unit is falling out from all directions and "Officer Barnie" walks up shaking his ticket book, laptop now days!!! #-o


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## Terry Devine (Mar 11, 2008)

Got fussed at yesterday by a neighbor who said I was being unduly "harsh". She does not even own a dog and wants to tell me that I am being too hard on the dog. I was teaching a clients dog to do an automatic "sit". She would probably pass out if she ever saw the stuff we do at training when we do bite work LOLOLOLOL

Terry


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## Lisa Brazeau (May 6, 2010)

THAT is Awesome! LOL


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## Kristina Senter (Apr 4, 2006)

I've had the police come once when I lived in Richmond, VA....because I called them after finding my neighbor in MY backyard, removing a prong collar from one of my dogs. Thankfully/unfortunately (?), it was a very social dog. The dog had been running happily in the fenced yard and she jumped the fence, claiming that the collar looked uncomfortable. I didn't push the issue, but made it exceedingly clear that any future incidents would not go well for her. 

There was one other incident..it didn't go well for her..but had nothing to do with training.


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## Theresa MacDonald (Nov 2, 2009)

Kristina Senter said:


> I've had the police come once when I lived in Richmond, VA....because I called them after finding my neighbor in MY backyard, removing a prong collar from one of my dogs. Thankfully/unfortunately (?), it was a very social dog. The dog had been running happily in the fenced yard and she jumped the fence, claiming that the collar looked uncomfortable. I didn't push the issue, but made it exceedingly clear that any future incidents would not go well for her.
> 
> There was one other incident..it didn't go well for her..but had nothing to do with training.


I would Not leave a prong collar on a dog, unless I was there, training!!

Had a VERY unfortunate accident with a prong on my dog, unattended for a few minutes!!
Would have had a Dead dog had I not been There!!


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## Gillian Schuler (Apr 12, 2008)

Kristina Senter said:


> I've had the police come once when I lived in Richmond, VA....because I called them after finding my neighbor in MY backyard, removing a prong collar from one of my dogs. Thankfully/unfortunately (?), it was a very social dog. The dog had been running happily in the fenced yard and she jumped the fence, claiming that the collar looked uncomfortable. I didn't push the issue, but made it exceedingly clear that any future incidents would not go well for her.
> 
> There was one other incident..it didn't go well for her..but had nothing to do with training.


I've got stomach ache from laughing :lol:

On the other hand, you could say "it takes one to know one!" *or* how did she know what it was? Most of our blue rinse brigaders over here wouldn't know one at all or would think it was a Sex Shop article!!!


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## Bob Scott (Mar 30, 2006)

"Most of our blue rinse brigaders over here wouldn't know one at all or would think it was a Sex Shop article!!!"

:-k :-k :-k ........................... What's yer point??? :lol::lol:;-)O


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## Joby Becker (Dec 13, 2009)

look up leather gauntlet or leather muzzle on ebay, most of the items are "sex shop" type...


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## Anna Kasho (Jan 16, 2008)

I had a really funny phone conversation with a guy who phoned my grooming shop once asking advice about spike collars and e-collars. In the course of the discussion it became clear he was shopping for himself/wife, and did not actually own a dog... LMAO


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