# Pedigree question . . .



## Jim Just (Mar 23, 2010)

In looking at a GSD pedigree, what should I be looking for aside from HD? This will be the first time I've gotten a dog when I've not known at least the parents (and often 3+ generations back).


----------



## Tim Leonard (Apr 23, 2010)

What are your plans for the dog?


----------



## Joby Becker (Dec 13, 2009)

Jim Just said:


> In looking at a GSD pedigree, what should I be looking for aside from HD? This will be the first time I've gotten a dog when I've not known at least the parents (and often 3+ generations back).


you should be looking at *everything* on the pedigree as far back as you can go.

if is for working, you want to see a lot of info in addition to the dog's name, his registration number, and ofa number...and you shouldn't see Champion in there, unless its champion in sport...

the gsd is one of the more easily researched breeds, but also there are a shit ton of crappy dogs with titles....to ignore...

Since you are posting this here, seems most likely you haven't much experience and if you are serious about it...start learning..and then .find someone to help you....


----------



## Don Turnipseed (Oct 8, 2006)

You want to see the same names on the pedigree repeatedly. The last thing you want is a bunch of odd dogs bred together.


----------



## JOHN WINTERS (Mar 5, 2010)

What is the dog's name, or Sire's/Dam's? Have you researched it on Pedigreedatabase?


----------



## Mike Scheiber (Feb 17, 2008)

Don Turnipseed said:


> You want to see the same names on the pedigree repeatedly. The last thing you want is a bunch of odddogs bred together.


it's a german shepherd he's asking about not exactly the way it's done


----------



## JOHN WINTERS (Mar 5, 2010)

Here's mine to give you an idea of what PDB has if the dogs are listed on it. Mine does not have the same dog represented numerous times however you can see certain kennels that have heavy influences.

http://www.pedigreedatabase.com/gsd/pedigree/649314.html


----------



## Shane Woodlief (Sep 9, 2009)

Why would you get a dog from lines that you know nothing about?

The issues with reasearching any dogs pedigree from a data base is that it may look good on paper but the reality is something all together different.

My suggestion would be to find several strong avid GSD people ask them what lines/breeders they would suggest. What lines they have owned and worked and make an educated decision. It is hard enough to find really good pups and it just compounds when you are not familiar with the lines. If you have already done all of this then I apologize for saying it again.


----------



## Don Turnipseed (Oct 8, 2006)

Mike Scheiber said:


> it's a german shepherd he's asking about not exactly the way it's done


That's why the mals took over.


----------



## Tim Leonard (Apr 23, 2010)

Yes, that's why the maps took over. Good working gsds to look for in a pedigree would be Nick v heiligenbosch, olex de valsory, grim z pohranicni straze, zidane v haus sevens, just to name a few. These dogs are excellent producers also.


----------



## Tim Leonard (Apr 23, 2010)

*Mals* took over.


----------



## Jeff Oehlsen (Apr 7, 2006)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike Scheiber 
it's a german shepherd he's asking about not exactly the way it's done

That's why the mals took over.

Oh MAN that has to sting. That and helpers that come to a complete stop on a courage test. (you HAD to have known that was coming)


----------



## David Feliciano (Oct 31, 2008)

Jeff Oehlsen said:


> Oh MAN that has to sting. That and helpers that come to a complete stop on a courage test. (you HAD to have known that was coming)


This is incorrect


----------



## Jeff Oehlsen (Apr 7, 2006)

Prove it..


----------



## Ashley Campbell (Jun 21, 2009)

Don Turnipseed said:


> You want to see the same names on the pedigree repeatedly. The last thing you want is a bunch of odd dogs bred together.


LOL, and then there are some people that see a little linebreeding and god "ahhhh it's inbred!" - A local yokel here liked Lacey, wanted to breed his male to her, I sent him her pedigree. Two of her g-grandparents were half brother and sister. He said "oh she's inbred nevermind"...

Sorry, that was O/T


----------



## David Feliciano (Oct 31, 2008)

Jeff Oehlsen said:


> Prove it..


Aren't you the training director of a supposed schutzhund club? I'd think you would know better.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FTqk1Q31ack&feature=related

BTW, how many helpers do you think their are in the world that can work dogs like that?


----------



## Jim Just (Mar 23, 2010)

Thanks for the replies. The pup is going to be an "experiment" to see how I like the breed; in the past I've worked with a couple of rescues for a few months but no other GSD experience. Aside from general obedience stuff, she'll get trained in whatever sounds like fun. If the temperament works out when she's older, she'll probably get trained as a service/therapy dog (I work with special ed kids). No plans for schutzhund, etc, though we may give tracking a try. 

The pup was selected by a friend with some extensive GSD/schutzhund experience. I basically told her I was wanting a dog with good intelligence, trainable (and re-trainable when I make dumb newbie mistakes). She talked with some friends, and now I have this nifty little pup chewing on my shoelace. I'm curious about pedigrees to get an idea of the pup's background, and so that when I do get interested in schutzhund I have some idea of what I'm looking at. 

My last two Chessies were bred by breeders with an approach much like Don's, and they were fantastic hunting dogs. I learned to hunt over their great-grandparents, hunted over their grandparents and parents, so when it was time to select a pup there was no question about what I wanted. I think I've still got the pedigrees on both, but I don't recall ever actually looking at them.

My pup isn't listed on PDB, though both parents are: http://www.pedigreedatabase.com/gsd/pedigree/546419.html and http://www.pedigreedatabase.com/gsd/pedigree/659540.html 

I guess maybe I should be asking how to research individual dogs?


----------



## Jeff Oehlsen (Apr 7, 2006)

So now I am doing Sch ??

What does that video prove again ??


----------



## David Feliciano (Oct 31, 2008)

Jeff Oehlsen said:


> So now I am doing Sch ??
> 
> What does that video prove again ??


That video proves that not all helpers stop on the courage test for schutzhund/IPO trials

The following website says you are the training director of a mondio/schutzhund club.

http://www.facebook.com/#!/pages/Crazy-Hound-Kennels/133040886720971?ref=ts


----------



## Jeff Oehlsen (Apr 7, 2006)

To the OP, you'll see a lot of this. Felatio is off his meds again and is more than likely in his mothers basement leaping about in his underoos occasionally taking breaks to look up whatever he can about everyone.

I have had a bunch of conversations with people about how creepy in that perve sort of way he is. I just prefer to use the term backstabbing buddy ****er.


----------



## Mike Scheiber (Feb 17, 2008)

Don Turnipseed said:


> That's why the mals took over.


Not in my world not my flavor


----------



## Mike Scheiber (Feb 17, 2008)

Jeff Oehlsen said:


> Quote:
> Originally Posted by Mike Scheiber
> it's a german shepherd he's asking about not exactly the way it's done
> 
> ...


What the **** are you talking about "helpers that come to compete" Its Schutzhund its the helper job to show the dog I don't care how the helper dose it as long as my dog stays safe I know for damn sure my dog has no regard or concern I want to keep it that way. And this coming from a guy that dont know his ass from a hole in the ground that cant pass a helper cert or train his own damn dog much less some one else's crawl back in your hole ring boy you got a long way to go my guess is if nothing has happened by now it ain't gonna :lol:


----------



## JOHN WINTERS (Mar 5, 2010)

Although the Sire is a bit stocky for my taste I like his colorization. I would be a little concerned that some of the recent lineage on the Sire side don't have OFA ratings, but alot of times people dont update the records. I prefer the Dam's background and look. That being said, IMO, it doesn't matter, pedigrees and titles are just paperwork. I haven't met a dog yet who cared if he had one or the other. What matters is that you and your dog have a great relationship, train him to be the best he can be and at the end of the day you will have an excellent companion. :wink:


----------



## Jeff Oehlsen (Apr 7, 2006)

Of course you are afraid for your dog. He might actually get tested and figure the car is a better way to go.

You talk about ol school man up Sch, and you put a helper on the field that cannot catch a dog at a run.

I knew all that talk was fake. Sad thing is that it is too bad that is what got on video. I would have loved to seen that dog smash a helper..... not one that was standing still waiting for him. 

How many exercises are in your little sport before you take the dog off the field ?? LOL How hard is that ? I think a defense of handler is harder than your whole "c".


----------



## ann schnerre (Aug 24, 2006)

i like both sire's and dam's breeding--some powerful dogs there. i'd try a pup out of them!


----------



## Mike Scheiber (Feb 17, 2008)

Mike Scheiber said:


> And this coming from a guy that dont know his ass from a hole in the ground that cant pass a helper cert or train his own damn dog much less some one else's crawl back in your hole ring boy you got a long way to go my guess is if nothing has happened by now it ain't gonna :lol:





Jeff Oehlsen said:


> Of course you are afraid for your dog. He might actually get tested and figure the car is a better way to go.
> 
> You talk about ol school man up Sch, and you put a helper on the field that cannot catch a dog at a run.
> 
> ...


 Like you have done ether :lol:


----------



## Jeff Oehlsen (Apr 7, 2006)

Hey, I am only 46. I will get up there some time and give me a few to warm up, and I will catch that dog of yours just fine.

I know you think he is all that, but I catch my dog all the time coming back off of face attacks. I am not the one that jams him. : )

I guess that never occurred to you.

You can warm up and put on the suit and try and esquive him. After all, points are the only way to judge a dog according to your way of thinking. 

That would be a fun day.


----------



## Mike Scheiber (Feb 17, 2008)

Jeff Oehlsen said:


> Hey, I am only 46. I will get up there some time and give me a few to warm up, and I will catch that dog of yours just fine.
> 
> I know you think he is all that, but I catch my dog all the time coming back off of face attacks. I am not the one that jams him. : )
> 
> ...


I know what I got and thats a nice dog nothing more. What matters more to me is what helpers and judges think of him. When helpers like James Laney come up to me after a training session and thanks me for allowing him to work my dog Dean Calderon gets done working him and says **** yeah!!!! Or any of the helpers that have worked him and helped me tell me nice dog.
I haven't had a club training helper for this dog Ive had to go to different training helpers and cobble him together opportunities were missed lucky very few mistakes were made a couple are obvious.


----------



## Jeff Oehlsen (Apr 7, 2006)

That is a sight better than what I have had to do. I guess that is easy to forget. I have had to train my own decoys with a green dog. As an added bonus, after a couple of months, they start doing things their own way, **** the fact that they are going from A to F, and damn what I have asked. Then I get another 6 months or more of no training.

Try doing that and see how it works out. 

I thought your dog did well. It is not your fault the helper had no business being on the field. Sadly, at 46, I can catch your dog at a run safely, but that kid didn't have the guts to.


----------



## Jim Just (Mar 23, 2010)

John and Ann, what characteristics were you looking at (aside from OFA ratings)? John, you mentioned the sire being stocky--is that good or bad for sports like schutzhund? 

Ann, you might get to at least meet this pup this fall. If I can't find anyplace closer, I'll try to head up to Omaha to observe some training.


----------



## ann schnerre (Aug 24, 2006)

jim, where are you located? i'd love to meet your girl (and you, of course!) if you come to OM! 

anyway, what i see in your pups' ped are some (IMO) fine dogs and fine kennels. granted, some of the sire's info is a bit sketchy, but the PDB isn't necessarily up-to-date, either. so i wouldn't make a decision based on that.

the dogs she has behind her, like Lord, Dargo, Don, Cliff, Alf, Brain and Gabi are all very good dogs, IMO (though there are definitely people who might disagree on at least some of them, but hey opinions are like....). i like east german breeding for the most part, and your girl's dam has some of my favorites.

both sides have very well-known kennels, and if i recognize them, they have to be, lol. i'm not a breeding expert by any means--but at least you're starting off with some good genetics. no really close linebreeding, but i think there's enough stacked up behind her that, like i said, i'd try a pup if i saw sire/dam work and liked them.


----------

