# Mal mauls 3yr old



## Meng Xiong

http://www.krem.com/news/local/stories/krem2-092809-Girl-Mauled-Dog.1c6a80ca1.html


Poor girl.


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## Jason Lin

"The owners say the dog is highly trained and this is unusual behavior."

I wonder in what?


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## Kyle Sprag

Great, add another to the Dangerous Dog List! ](*,)


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## Mike Lauer

euthanize the owner not the dog


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## Jennifer Michelson

Off leash!!???!!! My son was bitten by someones dog because he didnt leash it as they passed children playing. Why anyone allows their dog off leash when around people is beyond me. Dogs are dogs.....


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## Thomas Barriano

Jennifer Michelson said:


> Off leash!!???!!! My son was bitten by someones dog because he didnt leash it as they passed children playing. Why anyone allows their dog off leash when around people is beyond me. Dogs are dogs.....



I totally agree. I hope the dog is taken away and given to someone who is smart enough to know how to put on a leash.
The "owners" should be sent to jail for a couple of months and sued for everything they own.


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## Gillian Schuler

When will this ever stop?

The dog I wrote about who savaged a small child in Schaffhausen in Switzerland was pts. He belonged to a 3xmurderer and was, on his request, given to his mother to look after. She, 55, in a 2-room flat.

Shortly after this happened, another Rottweiler, taken for a walk by the owner's father, bit a child in the arm badly, after she came up to stroke it. Venue? Children's playground in the SAME town. It's unbelievable but true.

I don't know whether there is anything to be gained in checking out if the Rottweiler was an officially bred Rottweiler or just one who looked like one. To gain would be the Rottweiler community but is this the solution?

Same with the Mali.

The main issue, kids are being bitten unnecessarily. Kids very often are fascinated by dogs and very small children cannot be "trained" not to touch strange dogs. Why do dog owners feel the need to stroll around kids' playgrounds for heaven's sake?

Since I've lived in this little village, whatever dog I've had, the kids / adults have never had to fear anything from my dogs. They were / are no angels but where kids especially are concerned, my first concern is for the "little folk". They are the ones that suffer and so I take the necessary precautions.


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## Meng Xiong

The resort city that this incedent occured is about 30miles from where I live. The working dog scene is surprisingly non-existent in this part of Washington and usually we all know whos-who. 

What I find disturbing, next to the little girl getting mauled by an offleash Mali, is that I suspect there is someone local who is breeding pet-type Mals, because Ive seen a few being walked around town. I'm no expert dog trainer, but its easy enough to tell if they are pet or working dog owners.

A guy I know recently found and adopted a 3month old mal from the local animal shelter. The little guy certainly looks like a Mal, but doesn't posses anything near working temperment.

Hopefully this isn't the start of a new trend in my neck of the woods. :-&


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## Matt Grosch

How can people not think the dog should be put down???


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## Kyle Sprag

Matt Grosch said:


> How can people not think the dog should be put down???


 
Why should the dog be put down, because it has STUPID owners?


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## Thomas Barriano

Matt Grosch said:


> How can people not think the dog should be put down???



The dog was being a dog. We (most of us at least) think a little three year old girl is adorable. A dog sees a small, quick little creature with a high pitched voice and sees prey object.
I know all the "family guardian" breeders are going to tell us their dogs would never bite a human, but toddlers and dogs don't belong together unsupervised and NO dog(s) should be left to run around loose


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## Matt Grosch

Of course, a dog that has mauled a three year old girl should be destroyed......why shouldnt it?


And.......not that it matters (dont give this criminal the death penalty because he had bad parents).....but how could anyone conclude anything about the the owners other than they had it off a leash?



Is it just a blind loyalty thing since its a breed people like that it should be put down for an unprovoked mauling of a child?


A responsible person might put down a dog for growling or snapping at a kid.


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## Matt Grosch

If it was my kid, or even if I happen to see it happen, I would kill the dog on the spot, and consider doing the same to the owner and anyone that tried to stop me.


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## Adi Ibrahimbegovic

The owners are at fault, no questions, ifs or buts.

A high prey dog, like a Malinois should be on the leash in populated areas, period.

This kind of strikes close to home, as I have a 3 year old boy.

I went to great pains to desentitize the GSD puppy to him when he was brought over, all day, every day until the dog lost all interest in the little guy and now at 18 months sees him as a piece of furniture with 2 legs that occasionaly tosses him a biscuit in the crate.

Of course, the kid had to be taught too that "puppy" (lol, puppy, 82 lbs now) is not a toy and cannot be kicked, hair puled, poked, probed etc...

Then, when still a small puppy, I would stand infront of the grocery store for hours with him on the leash. Whoever wanted to pet him - could, heavily supervised and directed by me. That lasted about 3 weeks and I deemed it sufficient. When small children are concerned, well, any children, the dog has to tolerate them for a few seconds, then it's free to ignore them if he chooses so.

After he turned 5 months, stranger petting and adults coming over to pet and "talk about him" stopped and it's on a case to case basis.

I suck at many things, but one of the things I am good at is judging a person and assessing a situation, so if I deem somebody not to be bothered with, my body language and the dog's tells them to stay away without being rude or saying a word to them.

Throughout his 18 months life the dog has been extensively socialized with small children, even going to a school playground on a recess and the kids actualy formed a line to pet him - a quick stroke between the ears and get the hell out of here... NEXT! kinda petting.

NOw, that the dog is maturing, not so much, that all happened before he turned 1, now he is gettign into his "aloof GSD" schtick more and more and is starting to lift his leg when peeing.

Either way, as this dog is my best friend, I would shoot my best friend on the spot with my Glock if he were to snap, lunge or growl at a kid nearby.

A month ago, I was stupid enough to check if I locked the house before puttign the leash on and the damn dog bolted and went after the neighbor's chihuahua, scared the poor woman to death before I even turned my head with the key and leash still in my hand.

It's just not worth it.


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## Kyle Sprag

Matt Grosch said:


> Of course, a dog that has mauled a three year old girl should be destroyed......why shouldnt it?
> 
> 
> And.......not that it matters (dont give this criminal the death penalty because he had bad parents).....but how could anyone conclude anything about the the owners other than they had it off a leash?
> 
> 
> 
> Is it just a blind loyalty thing since its a breed people like that it should be put down for an unprovoked mauling of a child?
> 
> 
> A responsible person might put down a dog for growling or snapping at a kid.


Again, why should the dog be put down, just because it has stupid owners?

People are not the same as dogs, you have used the parallel to try and explain more than one behavior, stop now and it will save you some trouble.

Some dogs are good with kids and some are not, NO dog should be left off leash around a bunch of people and/or small children.

A "respinsible" person should not leave a kid around a dog that is not supervised and 110% safe around children.


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## Matt Grosch

None of the police K9's I have seen would do it, and it should not be tolerated at all.



Edit to add, it shouldnt be put down because it has stupid owners, it should be put down because any dog that would maul a child is dangerous and unstable.


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## Kyle Sprag

Matt Grosch said:


> None of the police K9's I have seen would do it, and it should not be tolerated at all.
> 
> 
> 
> Edit to add, it shouldnt be put down because it has stupid owners, it should be put down because any dog that would maul a child is dangerous and unstable.


Well that shows your Inexperience, ANY DOG no matter the breed is capable of mauling a child under the right conditions!


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## Mike Lauer

so if the owner let the 3 year old play with a loaded gun we should kill the gun?

would that solve the problem?


a dog mauling a child _might _mean an unstable dog
but it does not automatically mean an unstable dog
shesh how can u say that?
you train your dog to bite people!
but not little people, only people i say so
but i'll let you run free around children

...no the owners are at fault....100%


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## Drew Peirce

Matt Grosch said:


> If it was my kid, or even if I happen to see it happen, I would kill the dog on the spot, and consider doing the same to the owner and anyone that tried to stop me.



Priceless...........


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## mike suttle

I hate to say it, but a lot of the dogs that I have here would likely bite a small child if left unattended. I can assure you that it will never happen while they are at my kennel because I NEVER allow my adult dogs around small kids. Most of the dogs in my kennel are imported as young adults and have not been exposed to small children, by the time I get them they are too large and too powerful for me to risk the introduction to small kids. I have a few who I know are 100% safe with kids and I still dont have them off leash with my own two small kids around. My boys are 1 1/2 and 2 1/2 years old and they LOVE dogs, but they are only allowed to play with the baby puppies here.
These dogs are very high prey drive dogs who have been trained to bite very well, so if they should decide to bite a small child, they know how to do it right and it would be very bad. For me it is just not worth the risk.
Ask Drew if he would trust Rex or Lanzo around a strange child, Ask Dick if he would trust Wibo, ask Chris if he would trust Boy. I can tell you for 1000% I would not trust Arko or Carlos with strange children.


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## Timothy Stacy

Matt Grosch said:


> None of the police K9's I have seen would do it, and it should not be tolerated at all.
> 
> 
> 
> Edit to add, it shouldnt be put down because it has stupid owners, it should be put down because any dog that would maul a child is dangerous and unstable.


LOL Most Police dogs suck and wouldn't bite anybody!!! I'll go out on a limb and say 75% of them!!!!


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## Timothy Stacy

mike suttle said:


> I hate to say it, but a lot of the dogs that I have here would likely bite a small child if left unattended. I can assure you that it will never happen while they are at my kennel because I NEVER allow my adult dogs around small kids. Most of the dogs in my kennel are imported as young adults and have not been exposed to small children, by the time I get them they are too large and too powerful for me to risk the introduction to small kids. I have a few who I know are 100% safe with kids and I still dont have them off leash with my own two small kids around. My boys are 1 1/2 and 2 1/2 years old and they LOVE dogs, but they are only allowed to play with the baby puppies here.
> These dogs are very high prey drive dogs who have been trained to bite very well, so if they should decide to bite a small child, they know how to do it right and it would be very bad. For me it is just not worth the risk.
> Ask Drew if he would trust Rex or Lanzo around a strange child, Ask Dick if he would trust Wibo, ask Chris if he would trust Boy. I can tell you for 1000% I would not trust Arko or Carlos with strange children.


Amen for intelligence.


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## Jeff Oehlsen

If it were one of mine it would be dead right then and there. No questions asked. Unexcusable. 

I don't give a **** what the situation was, I don't care if the child stepped on it, I don't care period. I will kill the worthless piece of shit right there.


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## Milton Burton

Mike as I was reading this topic I was thinking I know all these people can't really believe their dogs wont bite a child. Had me thinking are my dogs that unstable. My dogs will bite children given the opportunity and they all grew up with them. *I know we have heard it before but you have to treat these dogs like loaded guns.*

I also agree with you jeff if mine did I would kill him/her myself.


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## Mike Lauer

i love the people who say my dog wont bite

bullshit, all dogs bite

My wife and I did Greyhound rescue for many years and they are the gentlest dog you have ever seen
like a 75# cat. We had one dislocate a toe and i tried setting it, must have been a ton of pain, obviously caused by me and he yelped cried but all i got was avoidance, not even a motion toward me

the same dog snapped at a strange child that woke him up

people see their dogs around them and think they will be tht way with everyone

strangers are much different than "pack members"


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## Jennifer Michelson

I lean more towards putting down than not. I do not tolerate biting either. 
That said, I wouldnt put the dog down who bit my son. It was an older bitch that seemed to be disciplining an annoyance. She was moving towards playing kids (off leash) and mine happened to run across a path near her. She ran up tagged him on the leg and moved on. Granted if I had been closer she would have been at least kicked. But she had no intention of rebiting, holding on, shaking etc.

But it sounded like the mal had to be beaten off the little girl, that is a little extreme. What else do you do with a dog like that--it still has irresponsible owners and will probably be given a chance to bite again?


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## Timothy Stacy

I agree with Kyle and Mike S. and Mike L for never never putting your dog in the situation and never trusting them like that, never.
I also agree with Matt G. once the dog did it, the end...


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## Meng Xiong

Milton Burton said:


> *I know we have heard it before but you have to treat these dogs like loaded guns.*
> 
> I also agree with you jeff if mine did I would kill him/her myself.


 
Yeah, I agree, about the only dog of ours I trust around the kids is my Father's 8year old Choc Lab.


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## Nicole Stark

Better yet, treat them like what they are - animals. No amount of training or socialization is going to win over when it comes right down to it. See to it that you don't put yourself or your dog in these situations and you will always be better off for it. I once read that an accident is a single unwatched moment in time. Whether or not that's what this was it's difficult to say. But it's a real pity for everyone involved if it was.


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## Colin Chin

Can a dog differentiate a child from an adult who is shorter let say like a 12 year old child's height ? 

Colin


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## Adi Ibrahimbegovic

Interesting question. I do admit I don't have a clue about the answer, but I'd say - a clear headed dog - yes. But, then again, a clear headed dog likely wouldn't have mauled the kid in the first place.

Either way, everybody is saying - responsible woner this, responsible owner that.

If those owners were "responsible", a responsible dog owner whose dog mauled a 3 year old child who ran to greet her mommy out of her own house would do this:

Run up to the melee and physically stop it imemdiately, by all means necessary. I know what I'd do.

Get the child to safety and see what needs to be done to stop bleeding.

Call 911 and request an EMT sent asap.

While waiting... To avoid further traumatizing the child, take the dog away from the scene and shot him on the spot.

If EMT is not coming, get your own car and drive the kid to ER.

Pay all the necessary medical bills.

Give the statement to the police or the Animal control with no subtitles, add-ons, "interpretations", lies, cover butts or whatnot, just exactly what happened.

When it comes to court of law, plead guilty immediately, show remorse and pay all associated costs, no questions asked.

Accept the judge's ruling without any objections and lay in the bed that you made.

Pay all medical, counseling, phychological trauma recovery and whatever other costs incured to the injured child for as long as it's needed.

That's what a responsible dog owner would do, likely even more. A ****ing Malinois... Not even a stupid bull breeds we are accustomed to hearing bitting kids.



Colin Chin said:


> Can a dog differentiate a child from an adult who is shorter let say like a 12 year old child's height ?
> 
> Colin


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## Colin Chin

Hi Adi,
This question was brought up by a showline friend of mine asking me in a rather crude manner. Dogs that trained to bite, can they differentiate a midget from a child. So, I thought of asking everyone here in this forum. BTW, I was also made to know that Bull breeds are way safer around kids. Seen some of them including APBT and Staffies with no issue of biting a stranger kid. 

Colin


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## chris haynie

that sucks. hope the kids ok... I would never trust either of my dogs unleashed or unsupervised around any kids. just to much that could go wrong. even if I could say "i trust my dog with kids 100%" (which i never would with my current dogs or any future ones) theres just no way you can trust the kids with your dogs. little kids are stupid and do stupid things. 

I know my big dog chases things that are loud, and things that run fast. he's a border collie mix, that what he's gonna do. how any one who owns any kind of herding dog or mix would think its ok to have them off leash around kids is beyond me. 

a kid with scars and trauma and a dog that will be killed. all becuase of some stupid people. just goddamn foolish. i do agree with those who would put the dog down. if either of my dogs attacked a kid i'd shoot them myself, but i'd never put them in a situation for that to happen.


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## Mike Lauer

i dont think dogs differentiate between adult, children or other dogs
It is the body language and posture that dogs read
and children unwittingly give false cues

first thing most children do to a dog is:
run toward it
place their head over the dogs
then hug the dog restricting its movement

what does that say in dog language?


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## Jennifer Michelson

This kid was not interacting with the dog--she was running to her mother on her property. Dog was on sidewalk passing by......To me, unjustifiable.


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## Kadi Thingvall

Colin Chin said:


> Can a dog differentiate a child from an adult who is shorter let say like a 12 year old child's height ?


I think dogs differentiate more between "intent" then actual size or age, although a dog with a lot of experience with different ages of humans does seem to realize that small generally equals young (lack of intent) and large equals older (more aware of their actions). I've seen dogs tolerate stuff from a young child who didn't have any malicious intent, but wasn't being nice, then seen the same behavior earn an older child a growl. Things like a baby crawling over and pulling the dogs tail, ears, etc earns it a lick on the face, but a teenage boy does the same thing and gets a growl. Or a child falls on the dog or steps on it while walking past and an adult gets growled at for the same thing. It may also have something to do with the level of pain caused, a 3 year old can't cause the pain a 16 year old can, but I've seen it enough times, and on occasion even heard the dog yelp from the child, to think they look at the intent. Especially when you see a dog growl at a 6 year old brat who you can tell meant to hurt them, while not growling at a 6 year old who accidentally hurts them. 

It's similar to how some dogs interact with puppies vs "teens" vs other adult dogs. My dogs will tolerate a LOT more from a pup then they will from a teen or another adult. 

I should probably add these aren't my dogs, I wouldn't allow a child to abuse my dogs, malicious intent or not.


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## Meng Xiong

I think the main thing is we don't know anything about the dog, like its age, temperment, type of training, ect...

Ive been waiting to hear more about whats going to happen to the dog, but no new info.


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## Kadi Thingvall

I forgot to add to my post I have also seen dogs react differently to an adult with a mental disorder vs another adult. Accepting way to rough of petting, grabbing, etc from the first while giving the second a warning.


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## Julie Argo

I agree that the dog should be put down, but I also think the owners should be held responsible for what their dog did. I have a bloodhound and two kids (6 and 4) and I trust Lulu around my kids but not "stranger" kids. My dog wasn't socialized very much when she was a puppy ( my fault totally) and now she doesn't deal well with other people. Unless she has to find you on a track. 
I also agree with the fact that this is a dog that has teeth so of course it can bite someone. You never fully know what that dog could do. I know I said that I trust my dog with my kids, but I wouldn't hesitate to put a bullet in her head if she ever took a snap at one of my kids. 
You need to punish the owners of the dog and also protect the public from an unstable dog.


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## Meng Xiong

Kadi Thingvall said:


> I forgot to add to my post I have also seen dogs react differently to an adult with a mental disorder vs another adult. Accepting way to rough of petting, grabbing, etc from the first while giving the second a warning.


Yes, my AB acts up around people who have physical disabilities such as jerky movement.


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## Julie Blanding

Jeff Oehlsen said:


> If it were one of mine it would be dead right then and there. No questions asked. Unexcusable.
> 
> I don't give a **** what the situation was, I don't care if the child stepped on it, I don't care period. I will kill the worthless piece of shit right there.


Holy crap! Jeff and I agree on something


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## Gerry Grimwood

On the next episode of Opra, we will be discussing nose hair and how it applies to road rage and mouth breathers


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## Bob Scott

Gerry Grimwood said:


> On the next episode of Opra, we will be discussing nose hair and how it applies to road rage and mouth breathers


When I'm driving......and I wanna get really, REALLY mad.......I reach up ang yank a lock of nose hair.....then I roll down my window and yell........"KILL THAT ********DOG"! 
Then shoot the dumbass owner!!


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## Robert Rosenau

Jason Lin said:


> "The owners say the dog is highly trained and this is unusual behavior."
> 
> I wonder in what?


Always check the sire and dam


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## Robert Rosenau

Robert Rosenau said:


> Always check the sire and dam


Mals can be crazy, and if you have a super hard dog with high prey drive you have a leg breaker (Falko)


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