# Off Switch



## Jennifer Coulter (Sep 18, 2007)

What does this mean to you?

Why do you want one in a dog?

Why don't you want one in a dog?

Seems to be some varied opinions on what constitiutes an off switch from handlers and breeders alike. 

Can a dog that can settle in the house and doesn't eat your furniture (once mature, trained and WELL exercised) be a good working dog? 

Discuss....


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## Jeff Oehlsen (Apr 7, 2006)

I have never seen an off switch on a dog. I have one that it would be really nice to shut him down.........would it make him live longer, like a toy with batteries ? ? ? ?

Eating the furniture would be your fault and has nothing to do with the dog, or any switches.


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## David Frost (Mar 29, 2006)

In my business, I don't want an off switch. I just want control. Which, I firmly believe is a delicate balance and never guarenteed.

DFrost


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## Khoi Pham (Apr 17, 2006)

To me, it means a dog that acts like a pet that can take anywhere but can turn on instantly with a command or in my case, just a tone of voice, you do want this in a dog, it is control, it is training, a dog that can switch drive instantly and not lock, it all start in basic training, we use sleeve to start, dog bite, wins and run around with the sleeve, handler calms the dog down, teach him to hold still and not trying to shake a dead sleeve, teaching the dog to switch drive and enjoy the win, he won the sleeve, it is dead, no need to shake it or kill it anymore, enjoy it, (off switch),choke him out or whatever you do and start bite work again (on switch), this is how the dog learn to switch drive and learn to relax when it is over, if you don't teach a dog to switch drive, they always want to do something because they don't have enough, they don't know how to turn off, cuz you turn them into a prey driven monster, so now you have a dog that always pacing in the house wanting to do something or don't know how to relax (turn off)Just my opinion.


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## Gerry Grimwood (Apr 2, 2007)

Switches all fail at some point in time, ever notice how they always screw up in the off position ??


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## Chris Michalek (Feb 13, 2008)

I work on having a switch in my dog. For me, that supposed to be his collar. Collar means we are working and might get to be aggressive and bite people. My dog doesn't wear a collar in the house unless I'm stupid. Case in point is where I left it on him one morning after training and my wife in frisky moment thought it would cool to jump on my back sans clothing... well, she almost got chewed up for doing it. 

My dog is a much different dog without his collar even outside of the house he seems to be more mellow. But as Gerry says the switches fail at one time or another. Over the weekend MythBusters was on, and this episode they were testing theories to thwart guard dogs. In several clips there was a man in a bite suit or wearing a sleeve my dog in turn was going crazy and barking at the TV. Ever since that day my dog sits in front of the TV and it's off most of the time. He just sits there watching the blank screen. Idiot.


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## Khoi Pham (Apr 17, 2006)

You guys are missing the point, there is no problem with the dog reacting to a situation, if you don't want that then might as well get a robot, then you can turn it on whenever you want to.


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## Carol Boche (May 13, 2007)

David Frost said:


> In my business, I don't want an off switch. I just want control. Which, I firmly believe is a delicate balance and never guarenteed.
> 
> DFrost


After a long time of using the term "off-switch" and then hearing so many different opinions on what people perceive it as.....I agree with this description the most. 

Short, sweet, accurate and direct. If I were to try and explain that exact statement.....it would be a page long....:mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen:


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## Gerry Grimwood (Apr 2, 2007)

Khoi Pham said:


> You guys are missing the point, there is no problem with the dog reacting to a situation, if you don't want that then might as well get a robot, then you can turn it on whenever you want to.


I thought you were describing a robot in your last post, maybe I'm missing something that you were trying to convey.


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## Jennifer Coulter (Sep 18, 2007)

How about this....

A breeder tells you you have a choice between two breedings.

Both matings produce dogs that are good workers, giving %110 percent on the job, any time, any place.

Big difference is how the dogs are in the time between working. 

Breeding #1 produces dogs that are calmer when not working..they settle easier. Very focused workers. 

Breeding #2 produces dogs that are hard to settle, they want to engage everything/ anything all the time...

Remember...dogs are described as equal in drives, enthusiasm, longevity when working....only they differ in how they are when NOT working.

Which dog do you like and why?

Does it matter if you want this dog for sport, SAR or PSD?

A similar description (not word for word by any means) was described to me by a breeder that is a member here. Maybe they will respond as well


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## David Frost (Mar 29, 2006)

If it's for PSD, i'm only buying after they've reached 18 months. Then I'll determine which I want from that. If these dogs are a minimum of 18 months it would come down to what I saw in each dog. I like the always ready because you never know when you have to be. 

DFrost


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## Jennifer Coulter (Sep 18, 2007)

David Frost said:


> If it's for PSD, i'm only buying after they've reached 18 months. Then I'll determine which I want from that. If these dogs are a minimum of 18 months it would come down to what I saw in each dog. I like the always ready because you never know when you have to be.
> 
> DFrost


BOTH are ready to work any time, any place. 

Dog # 1 settles and watches you for the slightest indication it may be go time.

Dog # 2 makes his own fun with everything, lets say you have to crate him to get him to stop moving.


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## Konnie Hein (Jun 14, 2006)

All things being equal, I need the dog with the off-switch. USAR is a hurry-up-and wait job. We scramble to be there and then sit around for hours until we're told where to search. Also, I travel a lot with my dog. My dog simply can't be bouncing off the walls or up expecting to work when I'm in the airport, on a plane, in the car or waiting at a staging area to search. And, when you're involved in a multi-day search, the dog needs to rest during down time. Sometimes we have crates for them, sometimes we don't, so the dog must settle down even if it's not in a crate.


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## Gerry Grimwood (Apr 2, 2007)

Jennifer Coulter said:


> BOTH are ready to work any time, any place.
> 
> Dog # 1 settles and watches you for the slightest indication it may be go time.
> 
> Dog # 2 makes his own fun with everything, lets say you have to crate him to get him to stop moving.


Neither one, most dogs will settle down somewhat when nothing is happening, I don't like a dog that would always be watching me and don't like a total nutbar either.

" Lightly Flammable " is a term I've heard hear and like alot.


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## Chris Michalek (Feb 13, 2008)

Jennifer Coulter said:


> BOTH are ready to work any time, any place.
> 
> Dog # 1 settles and watches you for the slightest indication it may be go time.
> 
> Dog # 2 makes his own fun with everything, lets say you have to crate him to get him to stop moving.


I think the difference between #1 and #2 depends on the type of person you are. From the bits I read about you, you're awfully active and #2 might be best for you. Personally, a super hyper dog would that is go go go all the time would drive me nuts. I do my dog stuff every morning and most evenings, otherwise I am mostly in the house practicing, writing or recording music. I like a dog that mirrors me, meaning he's ready to go when I WANT to go.

My wife is much more active than me, she's a runner and could handle an obnoxious dog. Her dog is ready to go as soon as she puts on her running shoes.


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## Bob Scott (Mar 30, 2006)

I think a lot depends on what you want out of the dog. Even a high drive dog can learn to settle down when and where you want it to IF that's what you demand from it. 
Both my GSDs can chill out when in the car. Jangle a collar and they are reddy for anything. Maturity can add a lot to that. My 12 yr old JRT has been a lot calmer for a good.....year or so. :-o


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## Connie Sutherland (Mar 27, 2006)

Bob Scott said:


> My 12 yr old JRT has been a lot calmer for a good.....year or so. :-o



My 11-year-old Border Terrier granddog is calming down a little too.


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## Michelle Reusser (Mar 29, 2008)

I'd take dog #1 every time if he's capable of the same drives and work ethic. I can't stand a dog that paces day and night and is always looking for something to get into. Dog #2 would be dead before age 2, they usually bark all the damn time too.


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## Konnie Hein (Jun 14, 2006)

Michelle Kehoe said:


> Dog #2 would be dead before age 2, they usually bark all the damn time too.


And spin in their crates...I hate crate-spinning!


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## Konnie Hein (Jun 14, 2006)

Bob Scott said:


> I think a lot depends on what you want out of the dog. Even a high drive dog can learn to settle down when and where you want it to IF that's what you demand from it.
> Both my GSDs can chill out when in the car. Jangle a collar and they are reddy for anything. Maturity can add a lot to that. My 12 yr old JRT has been a lot calmer for a good.....year or so. :-o


I interpreted Jennifer's posts to mean that both dogs were high drive dogs and that no loss of working drive existed in Dog #1 - it just had an off switch vs. Dog #2 who didn't.

I've had both types of dogs. My lab has a lovely off-switch, but is a very high drive dog. Neither of my Malinios have off-switches, unless they are crated in the house and all is quiet. 

The Malinois are obedient for sure, but try taking an 11-hour road trip where the damn Malinois barks and spins in his crate for the entire trip (despite a bark collar or other attempts at correction) because he saw you pack the training gear into the car. He almost got dumped along the highway on that trip. As for maturity, he'll still pull that kind of crap even though he's around 8 or 9 years old. That's a high-drive dog with no off-switch for ya!


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## Dan Long (Jan 10, 2008)

To me the off switch is when the dog can lay around and be calm when it's not working. When it's time to work, they do it with the same zeal as any good dog would. At my last training session I took my dog off the field, put him up, and the group sat around and talked. One person has a young dog who we'd been working with, and we were trying to get him to be calm, sitting in our group, with sleeves and stuff around him. Teaching him it's ok to be calm even with a decoy and sleeve nearby. I brought my dog out to add an additional distraction. He laid right down in the middle of the same people he was biting a few minutes earlier, and was a nice calming influence to the young dog. His switch was in the off position. The kids and other adults were petting him, he was relaxed and calm and enjoying the company of people. 

My buddy who just retired his police Mal gave me a great example of an off switch. He was on his way to an elementary school to do a meet and greet. On the way, he got a call about a burglary in progress, and he was the closest one. He went to the crime scene, his dog found the suspect, and bit him up. He left the scene, went to the school, and in 5 minutes had 20 kids petting his dog. To me, that's a good off switch.


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## David Frost (Mar 29, 2006)

Jennifer Coulter said:


> BOTH are ready to work any time, any place.
> 
> Dog # 1 settles and watches you for the slightest indication it may be go time.
> 
> Dog # 2 makes his own fun with everything, lets say you have to crate him to get him to stop moving.


Number 2.


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## Konnie Hein (Jun 14, 2006)

David Frost said:


> Number 2.


 
Why? I can imagine a spinning, barking Malinois would be fun to have in a patrol car while driving around town, right? :grin:


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## David Frost (Mar 29, 2006)

Konnie Hein said:


> Why? I can imagine a spinning, barking Malinois would be fun to have in a patrol car while driving around town, right? :grin:


I like a dog that can engage himself, keep himself occupied, doesn't necessarily have to wait for me to do something. the description said, they can be crated to quiet them down. The back of the cruiser is like a crate.

DFrost


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## Maren Bell Jones (Jun 7, 2006)

I think of a working dog with a good off switch kind of like the Malinois in this anti drug public service video. Dog is resting quietly. Then all the sudden up and alert and eating pot smokers. :lol:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PTX2R6EYi_g


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