# Playtime 2



## Don Turnipseed (Oct 8, 2006)

The first is the pups second trip to the valley after being introduced to the GF's house and the dog door. They come and go pretty freely but if they come in they go to their bed without being told.

http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v401/hicntry/High Country Airedales/?action=view&current=00077.mp4

http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v401/hicntry/High Country Airedales/?action=view&current=00082.mp4

http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v401/hicntry/High Country Airedales/?action=view&current=00084.mp4


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## Joby Becker (Dec 13, 2009)

Very cute...

thanks for sharing 

still get the feeling this is somehow slow motion or something, might just be my computer though...

since you are making the effort to do this kind of thing, my advice if you are interested would be to rip that toy around ON THE GROUND...more like a running small prey animal would look like, get them to CHASE, not sit and watch it like it a hummingbird flying around, waiting for you to drop it in his mouth...

whats up with that other one? good manners? waiting for his turn?


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## Lynda Myers (Jul 16, 2008)

Not trying to to be funny Don, but who broke your puppies? Because I have never had an AB pup with such a lackadaisical reaction to toys or rags. Hell my new AB pup (9 mos old female) is chasing the damn cursor on the computer screen. 
Seriously....are you contributing to the delinquency of puppies ie are those puppies drunk Don?


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## Terrasita Cuffie (Jun 8, 2008)

Lynda Myers said:


> Hell my new AB pup (9 mos old female) is chasing the damn cursor on the computer screen.


That's because you haven't managed to train yours to stay on a pillow whenever its in the house. 9 months??? What are Don's puppies--10 weeks? You'd better get to work. You're behind. As for the curser, at least pull up some cattle videos for her to watch when the batteries are dead in the laser light. 

T


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## Joby Becker (Dec 13, 2009)

Lynda Myers said:


> Not trying to to be funny Don, but who broke your puppies?


do they seem very subdued to you? or is it just me?


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## Lynda Myers (Jul 16, 2008)

Joby Becker said:


> do they seem very subdued to you? or is it just me?


No them seem subdued to you, me and that video camera lense! :grin::mrgreen::-D:mrgreen::-D:mrgreen:


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## Lynda Myers (Jul 16, 2008)

LOL thanks Terrasita ya could a told me my spelling was off ges what kind of friend are you?


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## Terrasita Cuffie (Jun 8, 2008)

What's the matter, can't type with Wasabi zoning out on the letters popping up on the screen? If you taught her to pillow, you might be able to have fewer errors.


T


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## Kristi Siggers (May 27, 2009)

Look like pups being pups to me. Very cute. But like someone else said drag it instead. that really gets them going. I don't do any sport work with my dogs, just flirt pole to get him in shape for the ring.


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## Joby Becker (Dec 13, 2009)

Kristi Siggers said:


> Look like pups being pups to me. Very cute. But like someone else said drag it instead. that really gets them going. I don't do any sport work with my dogs, just flirt pole to get him in shape for the ring.


yes they are puppies... they are baby dogs and are alive...they are cute, you are correct about that.


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## Chris McDonald (May 29, 2008)

Lynda Myers said:


> Hell my new AB pup (9 mos old female) is chasing the damn cursor on the computer screen.
> 
> 
> Why would anyone want a dog that would do anything like this ill never understand. But that’s just me, maybe im wrong. Id rather a calm, smart thinking dog any day.


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## rick smith (Dec 31, 2010)

FP work

- my experience ha been most pups lose interest if you continually pop the lure up in the air vice dragging it on the ground....maybe they are learning it is useless to try to catch a bird that can fly 
,,, but of course this is toy drive not simulating prey critters 

- and i also get better results when i give them a higher proportion of catches than misses

- i've also found very few pups who didn't like to latch on to trousers if i let em

...just my experience and i don't deal with too many pups


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## Don Turnipseed (Oct 8, 2006)

Hopefully Joby will be gracious enough to post the vid of his high speed pup biting the pillow he is holding in front of the dog in the house. That was pretty special....always like to see good dogwork from an easy chair. Then we can hear about how his dogs are too high drive to settle in the house. Just for you Joby. LOL

http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v...edales/?action=view&current=00086_Combine.mp4


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## Nancy Jocoy (Apr 19, 2006)

My goodness sounds like you AND the pups got into the whiskey. Wow are they alive?


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## Joby Becker (Dec 13, 2009)

Don Turnipseed said:


> Hopefully Joby will be gracious enough to post the vid of his high speed pup biting the pillow he is holding in front of the dog in the house. That was pretty special....always like to see good dogwork from an easy chair. Then we can hear about how his dogs are too high drive to settle in the house. Just for you Joby. LOL
> 
> http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v...edales/?action=view&current=00086_Combine.mp4


Don, I am serious about the speed thing, the video is kinds herky jerky and cant tell if it is playing at full speed, all of them are like that, that was not a dig on the pups...

I realize you are probably thinking that the toy on the string is not real game, its just a game that the dogs are not that interested in.. do you really think if someone, anyone on here, was to tie a baby rabbit or dead squirrel onto a string, that our pups would not chase it and grab it with the same or even more intensity than a stuffed toy? 

I do have some respect for the way you raise your pups, concerning the house training. That is why I have been asking to see the pups interacting with you in certain ways, and asking you HOW you actually do it, because in my mind I cannot see a way to do that, in the manner you have eluded to (but not described), without breaking the pups down and knocking the confidence out of them. I am not talking about confidence with animals, confidence with you and with people in general, 2 well respected trainers have said that some of your dogs were lacking substantially in the confidence department where people were concerned, outside of the testing that occured...and I was wondering if that was something in the genetics, or something you caused in them.

I watched this vid, it is a great video of dogs relaxing...If you want I can shoot a video of the dog laying on its pillow, and another of a dog laying on the floor...can do that from the comfort of the easy chair too..

I could for certainly get a pup to stay on a pillow, if I wanted to, but I don't have a reason to do that, I wait until the dog is a little older that is all. If I did want to do it, I would use toys and treats and marker training, that would not affect the pups confidence around me, or people, or his confidence to move freely and powerfully indoors..the pups drive appears to be about 100 times what your pups are showing, I just dont need for him to control that drive at this time, and act subdued. I am not raising the dog to be a well mannered house pet Don..the goal is to have the pup grow into a dog that will drag his handler into any structure, plow through whatever is there, climb over whatever it needs to, to do its job, not go in and lay down on a pillow. To put that amount of restriction and control on a small pup being raised for what I am raising him for would be one of the dumbest things I could do at this point.

you have never stated WHAT you do with the pup in the early stages, to get compliance. That is the part that interests me. It does not appear that the pups you are showing are the most confident puppies on 4 legs, as you stated your dogs are. The word that keep coming to mind is subdued...: (lacking in vitality, intensity, or strength).

I found this video hiding in a private folder on photobucket...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ze6UIbYr8io


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## Joby Becker (Dec 13, 2009)

Don Turnipseed said:


> Hopefully Joby will be gracious enough to post the vid of his high speed pup biting the pillow he is holding in front of the dog in the house. That was pretty special....always like to see good dogwork from an easy chair. Then we can hear about how his dogs are too high drive to settle in the house. Just for you Joby. LOL
> 
> http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v...edales/?action=view&current=00086_Combine.mp4


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xgFcOXaRdcw


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## maggie fraser (May 30, 2008)

Joby Becker said:


> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xgFcOXaRdcw


You forgot to clap your hands and stamp your feet !!!!!


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## Lee H Sternberg (Jan 27, 2008)

maggie fraser said:


> You forgot to clap your hands and stamp your feet !!!!!


He can't do both at the same time!


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## maggie fraser (May 30, 2008)

Lee H Sternberg said:


> He can't do both at the same time!


Maybe he can ask Don for a demo on that too :-D.


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## Edward Egan (Mar 4, 2009)

Joby Becker said:


> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xgFcOXaRdcw


I'd send that dog to Don for training!


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## maggie fraser (May 30, 2008)

Edward Egan said:


> I'd send that dog to Don for training!


You'd wanna ensure it had a good bottle of moonshine in it's backpack though!


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## Don Turnipseed (Oct 8, 2006)

Joby was that pup asleep? Just woke it up or what? Take em outside Joby! At least I can see what you think is fast!!! LMAO.


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## Chris McDonald (May 29, 2008)

Joby Becker said:


> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xgFcOXaRdcw


Joby are you out of breath and breathing heavy from filming this, or did you just get back from running or something?


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## maggie fraser (May 30, 2008)

Chris McDonald said:


> Joby are you out of breath and breathing heavy from filming this, or did you just get back from running or something?


Reckon he had been typing at the same time !!


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## Joby Becker (Dec 13, 2009)

Chris McDonald said:


> Joby are you out of breath and breathing heavy from filming this, or did you just get back from running or something?


got out of the chair too fast.


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## Joby Becker (Dec 13, 2009)

Don Turnipseed said:


> Joby was that pup asleep? Just woke it up or what? Take em outside Joby! At least I can see what you think is fast!!! LMAO.


It is not about speed Don, it is about intensity.. the speed reference was about the video appearing to look slowed down on the computer I have...and that the pups look *subdued* period..

*SUBDUED*

1. lacking in vitality, intensity, or strength

If you are implying that the pup I have will not show more drive, engagement, focus, intensity, and speed than your pups (or should I say PUP, since the one is totally showing NO engagement) on the flirt pole, you are literally insane, and I have used one probably about as much as you have, a couple times...

I dont need to shoot video, I have some of my pups at 7 weeks, second time out of my yard, first time even doing anything like this. first exposure to pretty much everything..

*MY pup*
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S3r-ievqmaE&list=UU5Teu-yr3ggIqso1oVYTE2A&index=9&feature=plcp


female pup
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z0VOQIVrEJ0&list=UU5Teu-yr3ggIqso1oVYTE2A&index=14&feature=plcp

3 pups
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=js2MuqcZYUY&list=UU5Teu-yr3ggIqso1oVYTE2A&index=17&feature=plcp


Here are videos of a female pup out of our litter, she was the one that was the most easily distracted, and had the least amount of intensity and focus for the "toys", the least impressive of the bunch at that age. Compare that to your video.

Here are 2 males at 8 weeks of age.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dqef8WYX5wY&feature=mfu_in_order&list=UL

Nothing impressive, but far from *subdued* like the ones in your videos.


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## Doug Zaga (Mar 28, 2010)

JOBY...ROFLMAO! Yeah, dude what is up with being out of breath?


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## Joby Becker (Dec 13, 2009)

Doug Zaga said:


> JOBY...ROFLMAO! Yeah, dude what is up with being out of breath?


compressed lungs... 
lets keep the focus here, it is about puppies playing...


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## maggie fraser (May 30, 2008)

Joby Becker said:


> compressed lungs...
> lets keep the focus here, it is about puppies playing...


It is about playtime....and you are flogging a dead horse!


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## Joby Becker (Dec 13, 2009)

maggie fraser said:


> It is about playtime....and you are flogging a dead horse!


dead horses stay dead, except zombie horses I suppose...


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## maggie fraser (May 30, 2008)

Joby Becker said:


> dead horses stay dead, except zombie horses I suppose...


You are trying to resurrect one! But crack on....Don did a runner a long time ago....we can keep the seat warm in hopeful and optimistic anticipation !


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## Doug Zaga (Mar 28, 2010)

Joby Becker said:


> compressed lungs...
> lets keep the focus here, it is about puppies playing...


 
Old msn Don is in better shape...and his puppies were more gently with the pillows...!


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## Don Turnipseed (Oct 8, 2006)

Joby Becker said:


> Don, I am serious about the speed thing, the video is kinds herky jerky and cant tell if it is playing at full speed, all of them are like that, that was not a dig on the pups...
> 
> I realize you are probably thinking that the toy on the string is not real game, its just a game that the dogs are not that interested in.. do you really think if someone, anyone on here, was to tie a baby rabbit or dead squirrel onto a string, that our pups would not chase it and grab it with the same or even more intensity than a stuffed toy?
> 
> ...


Joby, your computer can't handle the full screen mode maybe. Take it off fullscreen. First I want to apologise for your pup on the pillow. If that is what you like, you got it. Someone else wants her dog to chase cursors on the computer screen. That's great. I am going to be frank with you for a moment, at least I am going to try...

I am not going to explain anything that may be of value to anyone. I got this cam corder for a reason. So far, the dogs on a rag was wrong, the use of the flirt was wrong, yadda, yadda, yadda. I am not a trainer, but, I can train a dog that is not trained just in very special training scenarios or if I am standing there. They are actually trained. There is no point in my explaing the hows and whys to you because the first piece of advice I gave you was....don't work the pups in the house....everyhing I have seen is in the house. You are far from the only one that does it, but, there is no point in going farther. 

You said I if I am at least attempting to work the dogs with the flirt, I should do it right and drag it. It was said the pup needs to catch it to remain wound up. The pup needs to get a reward. That was the first time I used the thing. I don't care to create obsessive behaviors in the dogs. I want the dog working for me, not the reward. I can tell when a pup is losing interest and know how to make the "game" interesting.....with praise. Constant reward etc is great for fast "training", but, the dogs are not trained, in my book, and are working solely for reward. I will continue to put vids of the pup up as he gains co-ordination. If the pup loses interest, it simply tells me it is the wrong pup for the job and I cannot see putting in the time training the dog for something he isn't suited for. That little female in the vid is a fine example. I left her in the valley also. I will give her a chance because she has been recuperating from a bad mauling from a littermate sister, twice her size, for the last couple of weeks. Sold the sister because of that and up till then I really favored the larger sister. How much do I plan to use rags and flirts? Suffice it to say, I didn't even bring them home with me. They are still in the valley and I will do it for a few minutes when I go down there twice a week. It is pretty pointless to me, but, I will make a point by doing it. Maybe the pup will lose interest. I will hold off on the squirrel because he will lose interest in chasing inanimate objects. I simply have no need to create compulsive behaviors for inanimate objects. Yes, I can see where it makes it much easier for novice trainers to train a dog for sport but it reminds me of teaching an attentive heel that is useless. Popular only because it is easier for novice trainers to get by the distraction phase(Distactions like squirrels running by, cats, other dogs and other things that cannot be done "effectively" with rewards).


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## Guest (Dec 1, 2008)

Don Turnipseed said:


> Joby, your computer can't handle the full screen mode maybe. Take it off fullscreen. First I want to apologise for your pup on the pillow. If that is what you like, you got it. Someone else wants her dog to chase cursors on the computer screen. That's great. I am going to be frank with you for a moment, at least I am going to try...
> 
> I am not going to explain anything that may be of value to anyone. I got this cam corder for a reason. So far, the dogs on a rag was wrong, the use of the flirt was wrong, yadda, yadda, yadda. I am not a trainer, but, I can train a dog that is not trained just in very special training scenarios or if I am standing there. They are actually trained. There is no point in my explaing the hows and whys to you because the first piece of advice I gave you was....don't work the pups in the house....everyhing I have seen is in the house. You are far from the only one that does it, but, there is no point in going farther.
> 
> You said I if I am at least attempting to work the dogs with the flirt, I should do it right and drag it. It was said the pup needs to catch it to remain wound up. The pup needs to get a reward. That was the first time I used the thing. I don't care to create obsessive behaviors in the dogs. I want the dog working for me, not the reward. I can tell when a pup is losing interest and know how to make the "game" interesting.....with praise. Constant reward etc is great for fast "training", but, the dogs are not trained, in my book, and are working solely for reward. I will continue to put vids of the pup up as he gains co-ordination. If the pup loses interest, it simply tells me it is the wrong pup for the job and I cannot see putting in the time training the dog for something he isn't suited for. That little female in the vid is a fine example. I left her in the valley also. I will give her a chance because she has been recuperating from a bad mauling from a littermate sister, twice her size, for the last couple of weeks. Sold the sister because of that and up till then I really favored the larger sister. How much do I plan to use rags and flirts? Suffice it to say, I didn't even bring them home with me. They are still in the valley and I will do it for a few minutes when I go down there twice a week. It is pretty pointless to me, but, I will make a point by doing it. Maybe the pup will lose interest. I will hold off on the squirrel because he will lose interest in chasing inanimate objects. I simply have no need to create compulsive behaviors for inanimate objects. Yes, I can see where it makes it much easier for novice trainers to train a dog for sport but it reminds me of teaching an attentive heel that is useless. Popular only because it is easier for novice trainers to get by the distraction phase(Distactions like squirrels running by, cats, other dogs and other things that cannot be done "effectively" with rewards).


 
Good response. Everyone has a technique on the how and why, and I do see some needing a nice heel and others not. Its all application. Work is work, regardless if it is sport or PD, herding, etc. The work is the work and that will never change. I think some things are useless to me, but appreciate the dog and handler/trainer for doing and getting that far with the dog. House manners, crate training, pillow training, etc. Thats on whoever, I know what works for me, thats all I care about. 

The whole high drive thing and compulsive behaviors.....well I can see how they can be of the same at times, and then sometimes I think you may not have seen many cases and are only seeing it here based of the comments and reading into them.

Although your comment about training in the house reminds me of why some people don't yard train. You want it calm and quiet at the house, then train away from the house. You want them calm and relaxed inside the house without putting them in a down/stay, then don't train or get them jacked inside. 

Rewards, yes it can be done both ways and has by trainers. What works for one dog may not work as well for another. For every correction you give you have to have an equal and meaningful 180 degree reward. Sometimes a dog needs more than a pat on the head. Just Saying.


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## leslie cassian (Jun 3, 2007)

I'm not supposed to train in the house?

Oh crap, I've been doing it wrong all this time. Better go wake my dogs up and tell them I'm sorry for messing with their heads.


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## Ariel Peldunas (Oct 18, 2008)

Don Turnipseed said:


> Joby, your computer can't handle the full screen mode maybe. Take it off fullscreen. First I want to apologise for your pup on the pillow. If that is what you like, you got it. Someone else wants her dog to chase cursors on the computer screen. That's great. I am going to be frank with you for a moment, at least I am going to try...
> 
> I am not going to explain anything that may be of value to anyone. I got this cam corder for a reason. So far, the dogs on a rag was wrong, the use of the flirt was wrong, yadda, yadda, yadda. I am not a trainer, but, I can train a dog that is not trained just in very special training scenarios or if I am standing there. They are actually trained. There is no point in my explaing the hows and whys to you because the first piece of advice I gave you was....don't work the pups in the house....everyhing I have seen is in the house. You are far from the only one that does it, but, there is no point in going farther.
> 
> You said I if I am at least attempting to work the dogs with the flirt, I should do it right and drag it. It was said the pup needs to catch it to remain wound up. The pup needs to get a reward. That was the first time I used the thing. I don't care to create obsessive behaviors in the dogs. I want the dog working for me, not the reward. I can tell when a pup is losing interest and know how to make the "game" interesting.....with praise. Constant reward etc is great for fast "training", but, the dogs are not trained, in my book, and are working solely for reward. I will continue to put vids of the pup up as he gains co-ordination. If the pup loses interest, it simply tells me it is the wrong pup for the job and I cannot see putting in the time training the dog for something he isn't suited for. That little female in the vid is a fine example. I left her in the valley also. I will give her a chance because she has been recuperating from a bad mauling from a littermate sister, twice her size, for the last couple of weeks. Sold the sister because of that and up till then I really favored the larger sister. How much do I plan to use rags and flirts? Suffice it to say, I didn't even bring them home with me. They are still in the valley and I will do it for a few minutes when I go down there twice a week. It is pretty pointless to me, but, I will make a point by doing it. Maybe the pup will lose interest. I will hold off on the squirrel because he will lose interest in chasing inanimate objects. I simply have no need to create compulsive behaviors for inanimate objects. Yes, I can see where it makes it much easier for novice trainers to train a dog for sport but it reminds me of teaching an attentive heel that is useless. Popular only because it is easier for novice trainers to get by the distraction phase(Distactions like squirrels running by, cats, other dogs and other things that cannot be done "effectively" with rewards).


Don, you do realize you're really just wasting your time with the rag/flirt pole trying to prove a point that you've completely missed the mark on? You're doing something meant to be a means to an end in training protection dogs pretty incorrectly and yet you snuff the people who try to educate you about how to do it better and then try to explain to them why your way is better. It's ridiculous, really. You're proving nothing and the only purpose your videos serve is to show people that your dogs really aren't cut out for any work except maybe that which they are driven to do naturally. What would really be impressive would be either for you to take a step back and admit you're trying to be relevant in a field in which you have no experience ...that, or you could really shock us all and produce/train a "real" protection dog, considering you know better than anyone else how to identify one. Until then, you're providing lively debate and cutesy puppy videos with not much else to offer ...heck, you won't even share your methods when asked nicely. 

I can only hope the people who are seriously interested in training/owning protection dogs can see through your charade and will consult those you call "pseudo experts" who have at least some experience training and employing these dogs.


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## Joby Becker (Dec 13, 2009)

Don Turnipseed said:


> JI simply have no need to create compulsive behaviors for inanimate objects. Yes, I can see where it makes it much easier for novice trainers to train a dog for sport but it reminds me of teaching an attentive heel that is useless. Popular only because it is easier for novice trainers to get by the distraction phase(Distactions like squirrels running by, cats, other dogs and other things that cannot be done "effectively" with rewards).


Don. you are looking at this the entirely wrong way...it is not about novice trainers, or only sports.

the use of toys, rags and tugs serve many more functions than you might think....as well as food/treats. 

Hopefully you can continue this discussion because you really are dead wrong.

I think you are stuck looking at the house-training, training a truck dog, hunting, or simple Obedience, these things can be easily accomplished without the use of these types of training aids.

What is a novice to you? 
Novice means beginner, or someone new or unproven by definition.

Your dogs will lose interest in inanimate objects, if you do not animate them.

As far as creating or breeding for compulsion of said "objects" it is not much different than breeding a dog such as you like to breed, that has a compulsive interest in live game. The difference is you cannot use live game to train a dog to do anything other than hunt or kill live game, it does not transfer into training dogs for other tasks, it is useless except for hunting... It is the same type of drive/compulsion but a different focus.

What types of dog training do NON-Novices use methods in WITHOUT these types of things? the toys, tugs, treats, rewards, etc..aside from Hunting? or sledding...can you name any? Because in almost every function I can think of for training a working dog, these things are used by the experts...

About the only place where these things are not beneficial is for teaching house manners, basic pet-type obedience, average companion training type stuff, guard dogs, fighting dogs, and dogs that kill game.

even bird dog trainers use bumpers Don. Assistance and guide dog trainers use these items, police dog trainers use these items, military dog trainers use these items.

The reason for using these things is mainly to facilitate the teaching of behaviors if used as a reward, for tracking/scent detection, for taking a dog through a progression of skills used for biting and confronting people, and even just for fostering a working relationship with the handler, or interacting with others in the type of work that they do. 

The chasing of the rag or toy, is NOT the goal. Nor are treats, toys, tugs, and rewards the sole methods used by most trainers, they are only part of the equation...

Try to forget about deflecting questions or changing the subject, or getting personal and just answer this question...

In what area of dog training, sport or not, real or not, do expert people, that are NOT novices, forgoe using these types of things?


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## Ariel Peldunas (Oct 18, 2008)

Joby Becker said:


> Don. you are looking at this the entirely wrong way...it is not about novice trainers, or only sports.
> 
> the use of toys, rags and tugs serve many more functions than you might think....as well as food/treats.
> 
> ...


Great post Joby! You have way more patience than I do at the moment. I can only hope that maybe Don will consider what you've written that plenty of people have tried to tell him many times over. If you're asking the dog to do something unnatural and non-instinctive, you have to use an external motivator. Sometimes, the task itself can become motivation enough, but the dog has to learn to enjoy the work first.


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## Edward Egan (Mar 4, 2009)

leslie cassian said:


> I'm not supposed to train in the house?
> 
> Oh crap, I've been doing it wrong all this time. Better go wake my dogs up and tell them I'm sorry for messing with their heads.


I hear ya, when it's 110 in the shade for 2 months (during his puppy hood, las vegas) I wasn't suppose to have any fun with the dog in the house! LMAO! Since moving to NC he still played in the house, usually once a day for like 15 minutes, it was still fun and didn't damage anything. Just some fun interaction between dog and handler. He should try it some time, LOL!


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## Don Turnipseed (Oct 8, 2006)

Joby said:


> I am not talking about confidence with animals, confidence with you and with people in general, 2 well respected trainers have said that some of your dogs were lacking substantially in the confidence department where people were concerned, outside of the testing that occured...and I was wondering if that was something in the genetics, or something you caused in them.


Joby, look up any description of the Airedale Terrier' temperament in regards to strangers. Something any "professional, well respected trainer" would do BEFORE traveling cross country to evaluate that breed. You might post it just for fun when you find it. Very common and available knowledge to any professional evaluating a breed they are totally unfamiliar with. Night all.


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## Thomas Barriano (Mar 27, 2006)

Don Turnipseed said:


> Joby said:
> 
> 
> Joby, look up any description of the Airedale Terrier' temperament in regards to strangers. Something any "professional, well respected trainer" would do BEFORE traveling cross country to evaluate that breed. You might post it just for fun when you find it. Very common and available knowledge to any professional evaluating a breed they are totally unfamiliar with. Night all.


Don

What a crock of SHIT. Dave and Ariel are a whole lot more professional and well respected as trainers then you'll ever be.
They did NOT come to evaluate any breed. They came to see if your untrained Airedale would protect you naturally. They did NOT in any way shape or form. You don't agree with anyone, not even yourself. What you posted in the two weeks after the test is 180 degrees from the nonsense your coming up with now.


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## Ariel Peldunas (Oct 18, 2008)

Don Turnipseed said:


> Joby said:
> 
> 
> Joby, look up any description of the Airedale Terrier' temperament in regards to strangers. Something any "professional, well respected trainer" would do BEFORE traveling cross country to evaluate that breed. You might post it just for fun when you find it. Very common and available knowledge to any professional evaluating a breed they are totally unfamiliar with. Night all.


Come on now, Don. Dave and I went to your place to evaluate whether or not your dogs would live up to your outrageous claims, not to evaluate your dogs against some standard or description you'll probably say you don't believe in anyway. Your dogs didn't live up to your expectations, so you had no choice but to backpedal and make excuses.

And, because you asked ...

From www.dogbreedinfo.com:

*"Courageous and protective. Fairly friendly with strangers. Intelligent, pleasant and loyal. Sensitive and responsive"*

From www.airedale.org:

*"He has a jolly, friendly personality and although he will not back down if challenged, he is not generally a troublemaker and should get along nicely with other dogs. When he barks, there is usually a reason."*

From airedaleterriers.org:

*"An Airedale's attitude toward strangers varies from enthusiastically friendly to sensibly polite, but even the friendly ones tend to be vigilant watchdogs. Some individuals are more protective than others."*

Maybe there's something else you were eluding to, Don. So far, in the few years I've been around dogs and studied various breeds, I've not seen Airedales referred to as skittish, standoffish, suspicious or aloof. "Sensibly polite" is the closest I've seen to any of those descriptive terms. My experience and understanding is that, as a large terrier, they are terriers by nature ...tenacious, rambunctious, bold, stubborn, comical, intelligent ...but perhaps I'm referring to some standard that you believe shouldn't apply.


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## Joby Becker (Dec 13, 2009)

Don Turnipseed said:


> Joby, look up any description of the Airedale Terrier' temperament in regards to strangers. Something any "professional, well respected trainer" would do BEFORE traveling cross country to evaluate that breed. You might post it just for fun when you find it. Very common and available knowledge to any professional evaluating a breed they are totally unfamiliar with. Night all.


Don that was a fair question.. I want to know what your idea of confidence is...that is why I asked...I am not the one that said your dogs are the most confident dogs on 4 legs...YOU ARE...

Nice way to deflect, dodge and ditch, by chosing to address that post, instead of answering the one simple question I asked you: *What working dog training areas do the experts NOT use food, treats, toys, tugs, or rags in....* YOU are the one that said these things are used by novices.

Don. I'll play your game....

here is one famous quote about the Airdale:

"He is swift, formidable, graceful, big of brain, an ideal chum and guard. ....To his master he is an adoring pal. *To marauders he is a destructive lightning bolt*."

History:

*Before the adoption of the German Shepherd as the dog of choice for law enforcement and search and rescue work, the Airedale terrier often filled this role.*

here is the FCI (Worldwide) standard in regards to the temperament of the Airedale Terrier...how do you know they did not read it?

*FCI (International Worldwide) Standard for Airedale*..


*Temperament: *_*outgoing and confident, friendly, courageous and intelligent. Alert at all times, not aggressive but fearless.*_

If you were a dog trainer that read this standard, that has trained all sorts of dogs, including dogs that bite people, police, protection, and military dogs and you were going to test some dogs , after the EXPERT breeder, of 12 generations of a superior inbred line pretty much told you and the world, that he was gonna have to pry his dogs off of you, clearly thought (and apparently still thinks) his dogs are the most confident dogs on the planet, would not hesitate to bite, is all over a working dog board talking about his dogs....What would you expect to see, when you went there? They were not evaluating your breed, they were TESTING YOUR DOGS...

I would expect the breeder to be breeding to the FCI standard as stated above, I would expect to see *confident, fearless* dogs, and would expect that a breeder that has produced 1000's of puppies to know what the hell he was talking about if he was making such claims about his dogs all over a working dog message board...


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## Terrasita Cuffie (Jun 8, 2008)

AKC doesn't have much to say but the FCI standard is interesting: 

_Characteristics_: keen of expression, quick of movement, on the tip-toe of expectation at any moment. Character denoted and shown by expression of eyes, and by carriage of ears and erect tail.

_Temperament_: outgoing and confident, friendly, courageous and intelligent. Alert at all times, not aggressive but fearless.

T


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## Edward Egan (Mar 4, 2009)

Joby, maybe that expert breeder should outcross with this dog?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rTN5kTkdvME

LOL!!!


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## Lynda Myers (Jul 16, 2008)

Chris McDonald said:


> Lynda Myers said:
> 
> 
> > Hell my new AB pup (9 mos old female) is chasing the damn cursor on the computer screen.
> ...


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## Lynda Myers (Jul 16, 2008)

Joby Becker said:


> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xgFcOXaRdcw


I love it Joby!


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## Christopher Smith (Jun 20, 2008)

The Seed, loved the videos! They say so much. But why were the puppies being put out of the house for the night? Poor little guys. According to you they know to stay on the pillow and won't soil the house or destroy anything. They also have a pet door to go outside if need be. So why put them outside for the night?


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