# So...where did you all get your dogs?



## Kirstyn Kerbo (Apr 3, 2010)

I figure most people in dog sports get their dogs from breeders as puppies, or they buy them as young adults. I would really love to get a GSD or a Dutchie puppy someday(college and instability being pretty solid reasons not to for now, sadly), but then again I have heard that getting a puppy can be a crapshoot. So I just wanted to know where everybody got their working dogs.

Do all sport dogs cost over 1-2k? Even for a puppy? Hey, I have no problem coughing up the dough...for a dog that I really want. It isn't bad considering people pay just as much or more for pomchipoowtf's at petstores from puppy mills...but I would hate to get a puppy and it turn out to have bad nerves, no drive, etc. 
What do you all look for when you go to a breeder? 
What do you want to see as far as paperwork, health certs, xrays, etc. of the canine family of the puppy? 
How do you pick a good puppy for bitework/PP/ScH/ring/etc? I have heard about some temperment tests, but how do you get a breeder to accomodate for this?
Is getting an older dog far more worth it that a puppy?

Getting another dog isn't going to happen for awhile for me(much to my dismay), but sometimes I cannot resist thinking about it. There are some breeders I already like, but when it rolls around...how would any of you pick? :-k

I don't mean to sound like a noob...but I would like to share in the experience of others on this one. 
Thanks.


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## Don Turnipseed (Oct 8, 2006)

Mine had show tiles up the wazoo. Takem out in the mountains for a 1/2 a day and they limped around for the next week or so.


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## Chris Michalek (Feb 13, 2008)

get with a club, watch and learn about what you want in a dog. What you think you want now may be different after you see what certain dogs are really like. 

God clubs will have contacts with working dog breeders or at least know who you should be looking into depending on the breed.


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## Ashley Campbell (Jun 21, 2009)

One I got from a breeder but she's not panning out to do much other than obedience. My second one came for one of the military handlers here, as his personal dog but he was getting stationed in Korea and couldn't take him. He's young so no clue if he'll be good for anything yet.


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## Kirstyn Kerbo (Apr 3, 2010)

Don Turnipseed said:


> Mine had show tiles up the wazoo. Takem out in the mountains for a 1/2 a day and they limped around for the next week or so.


That sounds like my younger GSD. He is the "fancy" one with the papers and all that(he was given to us last Oct, though)...but he is the one who is totally sore and beat after hiking around in the mountains with us. He can barely keep up with my older GSD and my friends cattle dog...which is funny, because most people would say he is the best looking of my two GSDs.


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## Kirstyn Kerbo (Apr 3, 2010)

Chris Michalek said:


> get with a club, watch and learn about what you want in a dog. What you think you want now may be different after you see what certain dogs are really like.
> 
> God clubs will have contacts with working dog breeders or at least know who you should be looking into depending on the breed.


I'm working on the club thing. 
I need to firgure out how to reliably get down there(my cars engine took a dump), and also figure out if I need to pay just to watch every week. 

But your suggestion is what I want to stick with.


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## Chris Michalek (Feb 13, 2008)

Kirstyn Kerbo said:


> I'm working on the club thing.
> I need to firgure out how to reliably get down there(my cars engine took a dump), and also figure out if I need to pay just to watch every week.
> 
> But your suggestion is what I want to stick with.


Every club is different and a really good one might be worth paying a few dollars to learn. 

We don't charge visitors but we watch to see how dedicated and helpful the visitors are. If you're just coming to get your dog worked, that's not going to last very long. If you're coming to learn and you don't have a dog then it's expected that you help however you can and learn while you're there. 

There is a noob in our group (Jeremy) that has shown tremendous dedication. He doesn't have a dog and yet he comes out to every session. He helps with equipment and in return, we're prepping him to be a good handler for when his puppy comes in a couple of months. We let him handle some of the puppies in group and I let him handle my rottweiler so he understand what it's like and what needs to be done. This will help decrease potential mistake he will inevitably make with his new dog.

Not every group has a dog that others will let you handle but they might. My Rottie has been the perfect dog for noobs and people wanting to learn helper work. He's trained, he's clean and all around a very fun dog that is far enough along that he can't be screwed up by people who don't know what they are doing.


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## Diana Abel (Aug 31, 2009)

I got my Dutchie Import male from Logan Haus Kennels. I bought from Mike for several reasons. 1. being that I knew him and knew he had nice dogs because I had trained with him and seen them first hand. 2. because of his health guarantees and so on. 3. His Rep & the Rep of the dogs he has sold. It all boils down to this, I went with someone who was well known & who was known to sell good dogs.

He knew what I was looking for and I knew he would'nt sell me something that was too much for me, as Im a Noob myself. He has always been available for any questions I have had which is another thing to look for in a good breeder. He got my pup from Gerben K. His Sire is Irtho.He is an awesome dog @ 9 months. I have no complaints with the dog or anything else. 

When you are looking, read up, ask around, like your doing now. Ck out their dogs working first hand and if possible, bring someone with you who knows their stuff so you can get an unbiased opinion. Im surely no expert. Just telling you how I did it and so far, perfecto! Revo, my pup just keep getting better and Im very proud of him! Sounds like you have plenty of time, you should never impulse buy anyway.
Good luck with your search.


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## Christopher Smith (Jun 20, 2008)

Don Turnipseed said:


> Mine had show tiles up the wazoo. Takem out in the mountains for a 1/2 a day and they limped around for the next week or so.


They might stop limping if you if you take the tiles out of their ass.


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## Christopher Smith (Jun 20, 2008)

All of the sportdogs that I have owned I have gotten becaused I have like their parents and/or siblings. And my sole critera for choosing a pup from a litter is how I "feel" about the puppy. Sort of a vibe thing. I don't think I have ever heard of a better system for choosing a puppy. When breeeders stop telling me that the best dogs they have ever bred were sold as pets or last picks I'll be open to changing my belief.


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## Anne Vaini (Mar 15, 2007)

You can find a good dog (or a bad dog) in any price range. You need to get involved and know what you are looking at. Work with someone you can trust. I second Mike Suttle. 

High-drive dogs do end up in rescues, but you don't have support and have to rely on your own ability to evaluate the dog. If you know what you want, and know what it looks like, it can work. 

Best dog I've EVER had I got off of Craiglist for $40. Purebred, beautiful conformation, drivey, rock solid nerves. Perfect for his job.


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## Ben Colbert (Mar 9, 2010)

I have two dogs. I have a ASPCA rescue mix that will title but just barely. I love him to death and he has taught me more about problem solving than any perfect GSD could have. That said we're at the point in training where its more work than anything else and its just not as much fun as having a dog with all the right drives.

I just picked up a 7wk Bulldog puppy. I have high hopes for this dog but only time will tell.



Kirstyn Kerbo said:


> What do you all look for when you go to a breeder?


I want someone that works their dogs. That knows the breed well and has passion for the breed and sport. There's a million SchH3 dogs out there, you are best looking for proven breeders (breeding dogs that are doing big things) and breeders referred by club members.



Kirstyn Kerbo said:


> What do you want to see as far as paperwork, health certs, xrays, etc. of the canine family of the puppy?


All of it. I want the dogs health tested (hips, elbows etc). I want to see the pedigree but you really need to do a lot of research and have help from someone you trust to understand exactly what the ped tells you. For titled parents I'd like to see their scores.



Kirstyn Kerbo said:


> How do you pick a good puppy for bitework/PP/ScH/ring/etc? I have heard about some temperment tests, but how do you get a breeder to accomodate for this?


Get help from someone you trust. If it's a reputable breeder then they should be able to point out a puppy that matches your needs.



Kirstyn Kerbo said:


> Is getting an older dog far more worth it that a puppy?


Getting an older dog allows you to begin training immediately. It allows you get used to handling an adult dog and gets you trialing much quicker. Its not a crap shoot because you know exactly what you are getting. It doesn't help you learn how to raise a puppy or develop drives etc. I also don't think it's as rewarding. [/quote]

Did you see a theme? Hint: "someone you trust". Find a club. Hang out, bring coffee, listen and ask questions. This will help you establish a relationship that will help when you go to get a dog.


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## Don Turnipseed (Oct 8, 2006)

Anne Vaini said:


> You can find a good dog (or a bad dog) in any price range. You need to get involved and know what you are looking at. Work with someone you can trust. I second Mike Suttle.
> 
> High-drive dogs do end up in rescues, but you don't have support and have to rely on your own ability to evaluate the dog. If you know what you want, and know what it looks like, it can work.
> 
> Best dog I've EVER had I got off of Craiglist for $40. Purebred, beautiful conformation, drivey, rock solid nerves. Perfect for his job.


Anne, your telling everyone that you bought a dog off of Craigslist???? Good for you. Good dogs are where you find them....even the newspaper and Craigslist.


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## Gerry Grimwood (Apr 2, 2007)

Don Turnipseed said:


> Anne, your telling everyone that you bought a dog off of Craigslist???? Good for you. Good dogs are where you find them....even the newspaper and Craigslist.


I use Petsmart, those people are awsomer than most.


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## Carol Boche (May 13, 2007)

Gerry Grimwood said:


> I use Petsmart, those people are awsomer than most.


=D>:mrgreen::-\"](*,):mrgreen: LOL Gerry, I did not know awesomer was a word!!!

Let's see...

Current Dogs

Bloodhound, $5k, from a LEO whose wife hated the dog (best trailing dog I have ever had and he is a cantakerous ole SOB to boot....:mrgreen: )

First Mal, $600, Tarheel Canine

GSD, Mathenhaus Kennels....not sure she wants me to disclose price....will get her permission first

Fourth Mal, $500, Jeff Oehlsen, resident controversial member....LOL

Other dogs that have been here ranged from, free (handlers needed placement and I found homes) to $2500.....learned a wide range of things from, even if you pay a lot of money, some breeders think the dog is still theirs and throw hissy fits if you do anything without permission, don't enter into a co-ownership and watch out for the trainers and instructors that treat you like you are their only friend....it usually only means they like you til they have no use for you or that you go against them and they don't like someone who cannot be controlled......and a lot of stuff in between. 

Also learned that more money does not necassarily mean more or better dogs.

Do your research, talk with people you trust and have someone help you if you think even for a second that you might need it.


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## Matt Grosch (Jul 4, 2009)

Diana Abel said:


> I got my Dutchie Import male from Logan Haus Kennels. I bought from Mike for several reasons. 1. being that I knew him and knew he had nice dogs because I had trained with him and seen them first hand. 2. because of his health guarantees and so on. 3. His Rep & the Rep of the dogs he has sold. It all boils down to this, I went with someone who was well known & who was known to sell good dogs.
> 
> He knew what I was looking for and I knew he would'nt sell me something that was too much for me, as Im a Noob myself. He has always been available for any questions I have had which is another thing to look for in a good breeder. He got my pup from Gerben K. His Sire is Irtho.He is an awesome dog @ 9 months. I have no complaints with the dog or anything else.
> 
> ...




ditto (except I didnt go out)


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## Matt Grosch (Jul 4, 2009)

also


1) I thought the reputation of the person you're going to is #1, mike suttle seems pretty rare in that he might be too honest, and it sounds like he might go too far with his guarantee (I have heard this from multiple people). I talked to other breeders that werent helpful at all with a potential customer, which means they will be no help at all if a problem were to come up


2) find out what you want to do and then get a dog to do that, if you are in california and want to do ring, check out kadie and the skinners, if you want the best police type dog, mike suttle. Do not get a dog because you like them (rottie, AB, etc) and then try to get them to do something like protection because they "should have it in them" or the idiot breeders said they were working dogs

You couldnt pay me to take a dog from a lot of the big names out there


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## Gerry Grimwood (Apr 2, 2007)

I have to agree with the Mike Suttle thing, even with the ENS I would put him on the top of the list in the USA.

Even though he mainly sells females to the general public


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## Ashley Campbell (Jun 21, 2009)

Anne Vaini said:


> You can find a good dog (or a bad dog) in any price range. You need to get involved and know what you are looking at. Work with someone you can trust. I second Mike Suttle.
> 
> High-drive dogs do end up in rescues, but you don't have support and have to rely on your own ability to evaluate the dog. If you know what you want, and know what it looks like, it can work.
> 
> Best dog I've EVER had I got off of Craiglist for $40. Purebred, beautiful conformation, drivey, rock solid nerves. Perfect for his job.


So it's not just me, lol. My newest was a Craigslist "omg I have to rehome this dog I'm PCS'ing and can't take it" - which should have read "OMG this dog is a ****ing landshark and has eaten me out of house and home, now that I'm moving I have an excuse" -


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## Mike Scheiber (Feb 17, 2008)

Chris Michalek said:


> get with a club, watch and learn about what you want in a dog. What you think you want now may be different after you see what certain dogs are really like.
> 
> God clubs will have contacts with working dog breeders or at least know who you should be looking into depending on the breed.


What Chris said, another thought is find someone that's been around your breed of choice and has allot of knowledge about blood lines have them teach you about breeding and help you find a pup/litter or young dog
The US produces allot of litters out of convenience, lack of knowledge, just plain lazy and don't give a shit. Pups are a crap shoot but if you do your homework or better yet find someone who is unbiased to help, you can stack the deck for success.


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## Maren Bell Jones (Jun 7, 2006)

Two out of my three working dogs are from either a shelter or rescue. The Rottweiler who does therapy work and herding came from the local shelter and the Malinois who does PSA, herding, and is retired from therapy work is from American Belgian Malinois Rescue. My male Malinois who does PSA, herding, and dock diving is a 3 year old from Kadi Thingvall (Dantero Kennels). A good dog is a good dog.


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## Kirstyn Kerbo (Apr 3, 2010)

Diana Abel said:


> I got my Dutchie Import male from Logan Haus Kennels. I bought from Mike for several reasons. 1. being that I knew him and knew he had nice dogs because I had trained with him and seen them first hand. 2. because of his health guarantees and so on. 3. His Rep & the Rep of the dogs he has sold. It all boils down to this, I went with someone who was well known & who was known to sell good dogs.
> 
> He knew what I was looking for and I knew he would'nt sell me something that was too much for me, as Im a Noob myself. He has always been available for any questions I have had which is another thing to look for in a good breeder. He got my pup from Gerben K. His Sire is Irtho.He is an awesome dog @ 9 months. I have no complaints with the dog or anything else.
> 
> ...


Logan Haus is on my "favorite breeders" list(which is short,btw)...but I probably will not get my first sport dog from him. It doesn't seem fair to his dogs to practice on them :mrgreen:
I gotta work on getting myself to my local SchH club. 
There is supposed to be a Mondio club somewhere in the same area or ???
I wrote it down when I met a lady from the club(we chatted for awhile, and she spoke with great excitement of trying to get me to put the suit on  it must be hilarious to do with the noobs)

Anyone reading this thread from Southern California?
I will redirect this question elsewhere when I can actually get my ride up and going again...](*,)


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## Austin Matthews (Apr 19, 2010)

I'm from Orange County. You? I want to get into Schutzhund as well, good luck with your search.


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## Anne Vaini (Mar 15, 2007)

Kirstyn Kerbo said:


> Logan Haus is on my "favorite breeders" list(which is short,btw)...but I probably will not get my first sport dog from him. It doesn't seem fair to his dogs to practice on them :mrgreen:
> I gotta work on getting myself to my local SchH club.
> There is supposed to be a Mondio club somewhere in the same area or ???
> I wrote it down when I met a lady from the club(we chatted for awhile, and she spoke with great excitement of trying to get me to put the suit on  it must be hilarious to do with the noobs)
> ...


If your goal is to learn how to train, a "practice dog" is nice. A h*ll of a lot of work with little/no success, but a great way to learn to train.

If you want to actually participate in a sport and be reasonably successful, then spring for a good dog the first time. Give Mike a call and tell him you are looking for a dog for a first-time handler. I worked with a washed-out puppy from Mike that did better than "good" pups the same age I've seen training at local clubs. 

For a first-time handler, I would go for a dog that is a little bit on the "hard" side. If you mess up a correction, your dog won't fold. Also go for a dog that doesn't show handler aggression - probably not something you want to deal with on your first dog.


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## Ben Colbert (Mar 9, 2010)

Anne Vaini said:


> For a first-time handler, I would go for a dog that is a little bit on the "hard" side. If you mess up a correction, your dog won't fold.


On the other hand a soft dog that you have to think twice before physically correcting will teach you problem solving like nothing else will.


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## sam wilks (May 3, 2009)

I got my last dog from wade morrell. He answered any question I had about his dogs. I told him what I was looking for and when I looked at all the puppies I picked the same one he had in mind for me. Wade had nothing to hide. When I got there he let me catch a bunch of his dogs of all different ages and I also watched him do some training. Wade is always willing to answer any question I have had for him. He is never too busy to talk. I am very happy with my dog. I also got a cool t shirt=D>

PS You owe me a new kennel. the little devil ripped the entire panel off the bar yesterday.:-D


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## Sue DiCero (Sep 2, 2006)

Any of the dogs we got as puppies/young dogs, Gabor imported himself, working directly with the person in Europe, since we were there.

The others are from our own breedings: a Rosso son, a Vito daughter (last breeding or so), an Olek Main. duaghter and a 4-4 yoschy girl )


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## Kara Fitzpatrick (Dec 2, 2009)

my lab is from a breeder in Mass... showlines. 

Elsa is from the working kennel Landgraf (Wendy Schmitt).


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## Christopher Smith (Jun 20, 2008)

Anne Vaini said:


> If your goal is to learn how to train, a "practice dog" is nice. A h*ll of a lot of work with little/no success, but a great way to learn to train.


This advise is often given, and I'm not out to start an argument, but I find this advise akin to a 16 year-old learning to drive a car in the snow with sloppy steering, a tricky clutch and running on only half it's cylinders. I think that the best thing for a new trainer to do is to have fun and have success. I can't tell you how many potentially good trainers that I have seen crash and burn with a less than talented dog. They come out to the club and see every other dog dog making progress and driving off to reach their goals, meanwhile they languish on the side of the road waiting for AAA. Most of these people only stay in the dog game for a few months.

My advise is the polar opposite. Get the best dog you can afford. Preferably from someone that is close enough to train with on a regular basis. Most breeders are very motivated to help people that have their puppies and you should use that to your advantage.


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## Joby Becker (Dec 13, 2009)

Christopher Smith said:


> This advise is often given, and I'm not out to start an argument, but I find this advise akin to a 16 year-old learning to drive a car in the snow with sloppy steering, a tricky clutch and running on only half it's cylinders. I think that the best thing for a new trainer to do is to have fun and have success. I can't tell you how many potentially good trainers that I have seen crash and burn with a less than talented dog. They come out to the club and see every other dog dog making progress and driving off to reach their goals, meanwhile they languish on the side of the road waiting for AAA. Most of these people only stay in the dog game for a few months.
> 
> My advise is the polar opposite. Get the best dog you can afford. Preferably from someone that is close enough to train with on a regular basis. Most breeders are very motivated to help people that have their puppies and you should use that to your advantage.


Great advice when you look at it that way...


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## Martine Loots (Dec 28, 2009)

Almost all my dogs are pick pups from my own stud dogs. 
In almost all of the cases they didn't disappoint me, because I know our lines very well.
Some dogs I bought for a lot of money and strange but true, mostly these were the ones that didn't stay.


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## Maren Bell Jones (Jun 7, 2006)

Christopher Smith said:


> This advise is often given, and I'm not out to start an argument, but I find this advise akin to a 16 year-old learning to drive a car in the snow with sloppy steering, a tricky clutch and running on only half it's cylinders. I think that the best thing for a new trainer to do is to have fun and have success. I can't tell you how many potentially good trainers that I have seen crash and burn with a less than talented dog. They come out to the club and see every other dog dog making progress and driving off to reach their goals, meanwhile they languish on the side of the road waiting for AAA. Most of these people only stay in the dog game for a few months.
> 
> My advise is the polar opposite. Get the best dog you can afford. Preferably from someone that is close enough to train with on a regular basis. Most breeders are very motivated to help people that have their puppies and you should use that to your advantage.


LOL, I know many folks who learned to drive under such conditions. One of my first cars was an 1988 Ford Crown Victoria. :lol: Guess it kind of depends if you've had or trained dogs before in just pretty basic stuff. Selling a really high powered Malinois to a newbie owner who has never had a dog before is a bad, bad idea. Ideally, going out to the club before getting a dog and just observing, asking questions, helping out, etc is going to be ideal since people have it in their minds they want a really BAMF dog, but if they don't know even the basics of how to control it, it's going to be a disaster. A pet dog is going to be good for just the very basics of dog training and behavior. A nice club level dog will get you going to where you feel you're making progress and then you can really get a high powered dog once you decide you want to be competitive. I do agree with getting the best dog you can afford when you do feel more comfortable learning the ropes. Some people seem to pick up a new dog every few years from somebody locally, which is okay, but an extra couple hundred on a pup from a really nice breeding will pay for itself long term.


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## Laura Bollschweiler (Apr 25, 2008)

Christopher Smith said:


> This advise is often given, and I'm not out to start an argument, but I find this advise akin to a 16 year-old learning to drive a car in the snow with sloppy steering, a tricky clutch and running on only half it's cylinders..


This is exactly what Christopher said to me when I had a "learner" dog (he probably doesn't remember). It was my dog, though, and all I could have at the time.

But this is what I kept in mind to keep me from getting discouraged. I was out and about and soaking in the sport. For me, a learner dog was the right thing to do. A few years later, I'm still in the sport and still learning a ton with an upgraded model  and about to get a puppy so I can learn all over again. 

Laura


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## Jackie Lockard (Oct 20, 2009)

If you're going to give up training dogs because your dog isn't perfect and you're having a hard time then training dogs isn't for you.

I got my first Schutzhund dog from The Seeing Eye as a guide dog drop out. Wanted to get into Schutzhund but didn't have the money or room for another dog at the time so I trained what I had. He's my 'learner' dog by default and I'm very glad I have him. He's taught me how to motivate and build drive. Anyone can train a dog with ball drive out the ears. It takes skill to figure out what a dog's thinking and use that to train instead of just dangling a ball in their face. I worked very hard at building drive to get where I am today with him and I'm glad I did it. Of course I enjoy training my ball-drive dogs as well, but it's helped me a LOT to work with an 'off' dog. Of course I never again want to build drive as it IS difficult and requires a TON of work, but I think you learn a lot from it and you get closer to your dog in the end.

I've gotten great working dogs from free to $900. Just have to look in the right places and know what you're looking for in a dog. Going to a club and watching is the best way to start.


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## Christopher Smith (Jun 20, 2008)

Maren Bell Jones said:


> Selling a really high powered Malinois to a newbie owner who has never had a dog before is a bad, bad idea.



It depends on the person. Here is a video of a handler and their first schutzhund dog. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nAr1Lo2b7cw

And I'm not talking about a Ferrari I'm talking about a reliable Toyota Celica. Something that fun to drive, looks cool enough that the girls like it and starts up every morning. 

BTW, '88 Crown Vics don't come with manual trans.:razz:


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## Christopher Smith (Jun 20, 2008)

Laura Bollschweiler said:


> This is exactly what Christopher said to me when I had a "learner" dog (he probably doesn't remember). It was my dog, though, and all I could have at the time.
> 
> But this is what I kept in mind to keep me from getting discouraged. I was out and about and soaking in the sport. For me, a learner dog was the right thing to do. A few years later, I'm still in the sport and still learning a ton with an upgraded model  and about to get a puppy so I can learn all over again.
> 
> Laura


I remember that!:smile: I'm glad to see you still around. And I like your upgrade! 

I fully understand and respect the sentiment of "that's my dog" I'm the same way....once I get the dog. But I'm not going to suggest that anyone go out and buy a marginal dog just because they are a beginner. 

BTW, When you get ready to up grade on your upgrade...GET A MALINOIS!!!:mrgreen:


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## Christopher Smith (Jun 20, 2008)

Jackie Lockard said:


> Anyone can train a dog with ball drive out the ears. It takes skill to figure out what a dog's thinking and use that to train....


So you clearly understand why I suggest beginners to get a good dog. :wink:


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## Don Turnipseed (Oct 8, 2006)

I do. :wink:


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## jeremy anderson (Mar 19, 2010)

Chris Michalek said:


> Every club is different and a really good one might be worth paying a few dollars to learn.
> 
> We don't charge visitors but we watch to see how dedicated and helpful the visitors are. If you're just coming to get your dog worked, that's not going to last very long. If you're coming to learn and you don't have a dog then it's expected that you help however you can and learn while you're there.
> 
> ...


:mrgreen:\\/
I HAVE learned from watching & helping.
I DO show tremendous dedication 8-[
You guys ARE lucky to have me. [-o<
when my liger gets here he/she WILL be a schIII







good advise though. 8)


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## Hoyt Yang (Dec 26, 2007)

Didn't read through this entire thread, but Mike Suttle from Logan Haus has my highest recommendations.


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## Chris Michalek (Feb 13, 2008)

jeremy anderson said:


> :mrgreen:\\/
> I HAVE learned from watching & helping.
> I DO show tremendous dedication 8-[
> You guys ARE lucky to have me. [-o<
> ...



You're right, we are lucky to have you so nobody else has to pick up the equipment and dog shit.

BBQ after training so bring something good. That goes with shish kabobs.


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## Don Turnipseed (Oct 8, 2006)

Good show Chris. Sounds like you guys are teaching Jeremy dogs from the bottom up.LOL


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## Laura Bollschweiler (Apr 25, 2008)

Christopher Smith said:


> BTW, When you get ready to up grade on your upgrade...GET A MALINOIS!!!:mrgreen:


D'oh! That was low, man.  Too late, I've got a puppy coming from the upgrade. He is only two weeks old right now. whichever one he is, but he's all GSD! A good breeding, but still a crapshoot so we'll see. If he makes me laugh like Bernie does, it's all good.

Laura


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## Maren Bell Jones (Jun 7, 2006)

Christopher Smith said:


> It depends on the person. Here is a video of a handler and their first schutzhund dog. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nAr1Lo2b7cw
> 
> And I'm not talking about a Ferrari I'm talking about a reliable Toyota Celica. Something that fun to drive, looks cool enough that the girls like it and starts up every morning.
> 
> BTW, '88 Crown Vics don't come with manual trans.:razz:


No, no, I'm not talking not getting a Malinois for their first Schutzhund dog. I'm talking about their first dog. Like, ever. That's like giving a Ferrari to a 16 year old! A nice GSD would be your reliable Toyota Celica. :wink: I know the old Crown Vics don't have a shift. But it was horrible in about every other way possible. :lol:


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## Kirstyn Kerbo (Apr 3, 2010)

Austin Matthews said:


> I'm from Orange County. You? I want to get into Schutzhund as well, good luck with your search.


I live in orange county as well. I am familiar with parts of la county though. 

The nearest club I could find has meetings in long beach.


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## Kirstyn Kerbo (Apr 3, 2010)

Anne Vaini said:


> For a first-time handler, I would go for a dog that is a little bit on the "hard" side. If you mess up a correction, your dog won't fold. Also go for a dog that doesn't show handler aggression - probably not something you want to deal with on your first dog.


Luckily I have both with my two GSDs. My older one (Rudy, hes about 7 or8...my first GSD) is very soft to my corrections, but everyone else can screw themselves. I can give him a dirty look and its takes him down a notch. It can be very difficult to balance all of this. Oh yeah, and he is handler aggressive. Usually he snaps or bites other objects, but I have been on the receiving end...and lets say I have a good respect for helpers :-D
But I do like that I know what to do if I correct a dog and he tries to take it out on me...I've only slipped up twice(got bit) in quite a few instances. Or is that bad?

On the other hand, the younger GSD(His name is Beau, he's 4) is a pretty hard dog. The only corrections that GET HIS ATTENTION back on me when he wants to go after something are those that would have my older dog on the ground in a complete mess. It is an odd contrast. #-o


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## ann schnerre (Aug 24, 2006)

Chris Michalek said:


> get with a club, watch and learn about what you want in a dog. What you think you want now may be different after you see what certain dogs are really like.
> 
> God clubs will have contacts with working dog breeders or at least know who you should be looking into depending on the breed.


i'm with chris on this for a couple of reasons: first, see above.

second, you may actually pay less for a better pup/dog than you would buying one from a breeder 2K miles away. there does tend to be an "accountability" factor, that decreases with distance, IME. 

granted, i got burned pretty good on the first GSD i ever spent real money on--not the dog himself (he was a great dog), but i HAD to learn the hard way that a "contract" is worth the paper it's written on--which is why getting with a (good) club is a great first step in finding a good prospect.

also, i have to say i have found a great breeder, they work/title their dogs, they know me, and they DO stand by their committment to the dogs they breed: if for any reason a buyer needs to rehome a dog they purchased from this breeder, believe me (as i have seen it)--these ppl will drive thousands of miles to collect the dog if need be, bring it home, and keep/train it until another suitable home is found.


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## Margaret Wheeler (May 29, 2010)

Christopher Smith said:


> ... Get the best dog you can afford. Preferably from someone that is close enough to train with on a regular basis. Most breeders are very motivated to help people that have their puppies and you should use that to your advantage.


 
I've followed this advice for twenty plus years and through a few different working breeds and I'll say that it has worked like a charm! To me if you find a well-bred pup from a reputable breeder you are free to find a club that you (and the breeder) like without you being a potential puppy buyer confusing the issue. I also wrote to cool people who are way out of my league in dog sports and asked their opinion and so I got very kind and generous help from Michael Ellis and Cindy Rhodes and Deanna Thompson.

Being a novice and with my busy family, Michael advised me to look at GSDs. Cindy kindly allowed me to post my puppy search on Leerburg forums and Deanna kindly directed me to this kennel. As a result I have a wonderful family companion that I am hoping will also carry me through some ringsport competition. Oh and look, it appears that there are some pups available this spring too!


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## Austin Matthews (Apr 19, 2010)

Kirstyn Kerbo said:


> I live in orange county as well. I am familiar with parts of la county though.
> 
> The nearest club I could find has meetings in long beach.


Cool. There is a French Ring club in Riverside, and Schutzhund clubs in Corona as well. What type of club is operating out of LBC?


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## Rachel Kilburn (May 12, 2010)

I have seemed to have gotten all my dogs by "you touched him last" rule
My first working dog was/is Belgian Malinois and at first all we worked on was my handling skills and drive building and this year we have been trialing and he was 2 points shy of his PSA 1 last weekend in the OB portion ](*,)

My second dog was a wash out from a PD he was fun but we butted headed ALL the time and my trainer and I ended up selling him to a girl as a PP dog and they get along GREAT! 

As a result of selling one dog I got two dogs in trade...

Sully was a French import Malinois who was handler aggressive among other things but he taught me a lot about what a fair correction is unfortunatly he had a severe injury last year and had to be put down

Crack is my current Dutchie and I <3 this dog for some reason lol we butt heads all the time but he generally makes me laugh so it is good  

I also have a 1 year old GSD female puppy out of Andy Vah Maly and she is just a fun project 

but in all I have been lucky enough to have dogs given to me either because people don't want them or hard times fall on them their loss my gain I guess lol My suggestion would be to look around and know what you want before you go out and look, do your research!!


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## Kirstyn Kerbo (Apr 3, 2010)

Austin Matthews said:


> Cool. There is a French Ring club in Riverside, and Schutzhund clubs in Corona as well. What type of club is operating out of LBC?


 
Schutzhund. There is supposed to be a mondio club somewhere...I was talking to a lady at a pet expo. She may have said mission viejo?


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## Austin Matthews (Apr 19, 2010)

Kirstyn Kerbo said:


> Schutzhund. There is supposed to be a mondio club somewhere...I was talking to a lady at a pet expo. She may have said mission viejo?


Oh cool, I was at the Pet Expo too. That police officer had an impressive Dutchie!

Well I want to do Schutzhund with my DS as well, so maybe I'll see you around. From what I've heard there are good and bad clubs around the area, so I'm going to do my research before getting involved in one.


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## Sarah Atlas (Dec 15, 2008)

i work german shepherds but will have a mali in the future. Have 3 shepherds, oldest now retired is 10 came from Tarheel k-9. awesum Urban sar dog. the next two are from Eurosport...4 year old cadaver female and 11 months old pup for live find urban sar. Both outstanding!!!!

My future mali will come from Mike Sutte. Had the pleasure of visiting with him last year and he took lots of time to show me dogs and answer my questions. Thanks Mike


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## Kirstyn Kerbo (Apr 3, 2010)

Austin Matthews said:


> Oh cool, I was at the Pet Expo too. That police officer had an impressive Dutchie!
> 
> Well I want to do Schutzhund with my DS as well, so maybe I'll see you around. From what I've heard there are good and bad clubs around the area, so I'm going to do my research before getting involved in one.


Send me a message when you find a good one. I have heard the same...for sure drop me a line if you find a Mondio club.

There is a club based out of Westminster(where I am from) that trains in Stanton. They do French Ring...and I don't know anything about French Ring but baskets. I'll probably end up checking it out though...


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## Mike Scheiber (Feb 17, 2008)

Austin Matthews said:


> Oh cool, I was at the Pet Expo too. That police officer had an impressive Dutchie!
> 
> Well I want to do Schutzhund with my DS as well, so maybe I'll see you around. From what I've heard there are good and bad clubs around the area, so I'm going to do my research before getting involved in one.


Yes do a little research on the Dutch dog and the sport you chose, Schutzhund would not be the sport of choice for this breed of dog also some Schutzhund clubs are somewhat breed specific go watch and talk to the club


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## Kadi Thingvall (Jan 22, 2007)

Kirstyn Kerbo said:


> Schutzhund. There is supposed to be a mondio club somewhere...I was talking to a lady at a pet expo. She may have said mission viejo?


There is a Mondio club out in the Ventura/Oxnard area.


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## Courtney Guthrie (Oct 30, 2007)

My first sport dog was/is an APBT/AST that came from a semi-BYB. She is soft to a point and was definetely a PROJECT dog. BUT I learned SO much with her! Red is a great dog and now I'm pulling her out of retirement to do AKC stuff with. lol Red was free cause 1/2 the litter was stolen and he wanted them to go to good homes! She is papered UKC, AKC, ADBA. 

Judge-GSD was bought from a local breeder that knows what she is doing. She has phenomenal lines and I love his dad Kinte Von Den Wannaer Hohen. She gave me a good deal cause I stuck it out with Red and never quit just cause it got hard. She is still around and is still training dogs at 67 years old. She porduces some very phenomenal dogs and I'm lcuky to know her!! I paid $600 for Judge. I show him in Conformation classes as well as do Schutzhund(our main love) and also Rally-O.


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