# DDR Dogs



## Dave Clarkson (Sep 16, 2006)

I have read many articles saying that DDR dogs take longer to mature and do not have as much prey drive as the West German lines. 

So the question is what is the differences of the training methods for doing bite work? If the DDR dog does not have as much "prey" how are they worked and at what age is this type of work introduced compared to a W German line? Do they still do the Rag work as a pup? 

I realize a dog does not have to be hyped up on prey to work and DDR dogs do have prey but maybe not as much. I was just interested in the training differences and time line of training. 

Do the DDR lines have something that other lines may not have that enables them to do the work without the high prey drive?


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## ann schnerre (Aug 24, 2006)

i'll try this one on as a person that has a 60% DDR pup, so keep in mind i'm still just learning.

definitely do puppy rag-work: you want to build drive, right? so why not?

with that said, what are your goals w/pup? i think that determines everything else---and i'll let the really smart ppl here go from there....


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## Dave Clarkson (Sep 16, 2006)

Thanks for the reply Anne.

I dont have any goals for a DDR dog. I am interested in anything gsd and have seen the generalization about ddr dogs many times on fourms and web sites. I have even been told in person by a few people but they did not own full ddr dogs.

I have a little 3 1/2 month old pup out of West German lines. 

Just curious thats all.


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## Greg Long (Mar 27, 2006)

I do think they mature later than some.

I wouldnt do rag work on any dog of mine.I dont think I would do anything differently because all dogs are individuals.You start with a picture in your mind of what you want to end up with and then adjust your training to the dog or pup.I want the pup to use everything he has and use all his natural ability when working.The word "drives" really gets in my way and isnt something I consider when actually training.
Its all about building confidence particularly in a more calm and serious type of dog.Many great dogs are passed over because either the pup doesnt show much "prey drive" or they wont wait for the dog to mature a little.There are DDR dogs however that have tremendous "prey drive".


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## Dave Clarkson (Sep 16, 2006)

Thanks for the input Greg.

I find the different opinions on drive very interesting. Some say that if a 3 month old pup isnt chomping away madly at anything you should get rid of it and start over. And then you have the ones on the other side of the argument.

It is very interesting that the W GER, DDR, and Czech developed their own characteristics during the communist era in Europe. 

Now they are all being thrown in the mix. 

Even thogh I am a novice I have to agree, it seems some people may get a little to carried away about "drives". This is assuming we are dealing with well bred dogs.


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## David Frost (Mar 29, 2006)

Just as a point of discussion, how much longer can there be DDR dogs. DDR hasn't existed for several years now, so eventually they kind of have to fade away, don't ya think? It's kind of like puppies born in the US from imported dogs; they are no longer imports, but American bred. 

DFrost


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## Andres Martin (May 19, 2006)

> DDR hasn't existed for several years now


 Whaaat? Really? What will DDR dogs be called then? East German Shepherds? Berlinerhunden?


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## Greg Long (Mar 27, 2006)

You are correct!There are no "DDR" dogs anymore.They dont exist.However there are certain dogs whose bloodlines are traceable to DDR dogs and there seems to be a few characteristics that are identifiable common to these same bloodlines.Stubborn,PIA,dominant,and aloof are a few that come to mind.

Of course noone would ever lie about a dog pedigree right??? :lol:


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## Bob Scott (Mar 30, 2006)

There was a time when the "German" GSD was the breeding to have. Then it was DDR, then Czech. 
Popularity will eventually bring them all down.


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## Woody Taylor (Mar 28, 2006)

You can spot a good DDR bitch still, though. Look for a mustache, big muscles, and lots of body hair. Killer swimmers. You have to feed them a lot of supplements to keep up the appearance, though.


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## David Frost (Mar 29, 2006)

<<<You can spot a good DDR bitch still, though. Look for a mustache, big muscles, and lots of body hair.>>>


That was funny right there, don't care who ya are.

DFrost


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## Dan Reiter (May 12, 2006)

All right enough (_I am realy offended_  ) I am married to a DDR/West German VA Pedigree female human however I made my selection on both temperment and (the hair free arm pitts). 

I should be fine as long as nobody passes this on. 

Dan


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## Woody Taylor (Mar 28, 2006)

Dan Reiter said:


> All right enough (_I am realy offended_  ) I am married to a DDR/West German VA Pedigree female human however I made my selection on both temperment and (the hair free arm pitts).
> 
> I should be fine as long as nobody passes this on.
> 
> Dan


HAH! Sorry about that, no offense intended, I was referring to working DDR lines, not show.


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## Jerry Lyda (Apr 4, 2006)

Woody, you ARE the man. :lol: :wink:


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## ann schnerre (Aug 24, 2006)

he's "something" all right :lol: i think he maybe needs to have more to do. get back to work woody!!!!


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## Woody Taylor (Mar 28, 2006)

ann freier said:


> he's "something" all right :lol: i think he maybe needs to have more to do. get back to work woody!!!!


There is a direct relationship to the number of posts I make in this forum and the levels of boredom and (in today's case) general irritation I have about the work I'm supposed to be doing. Trust me--joking around in threads is way more productive than me blowing up at my boss. If you cats think I'm confrontational in here... :evil: :wink:


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## ann schnerre (Aug 24, 2006)

oh, i understand COMPLETELY, woody--got my bi-annual *devaluation* today, got dinged for being too *unprofessional* w/the VP. oh well, no biggie. besides, i thought your DDR bitch was REALLY funny (but i'm kinda twisted :wink: ).

anyway, back to DDR dogs. can we say "DDR bloodlines"? i mean, i get that there aren't any "real" DDR dogs b/c there isn't a "DDR" anymore. or "DDR-bred"? and my pup certainly isn't "pure" or "100%" DDR. i'm thinking perhaps it would actually be more accurate to simply say working or showline GSD due to the fact that "100% DDR" isn't entirely accurate from what i understand, no matter what--too much switching, WG/Chezch/DDR dogs bred even if it was "illegal" or whatever while the Wall was up.

i could be completely wrong--still too new to the bloodlines for any kind of "informed" opinion, that's for sure :? 

with ALL that said, my brix has awesome prey drive (must be from his WG side), he's sharp--alerts/barks at out-of-ordinary stuff at home. he's a hard boy--a correction has to be immediate and absolute. i can't be wishy-washy with this dog, and even then the correction doesn't necessarily "take" the first time. i have to be absolutely consistent, and stay after it (my great failing as a "trainer" of course, and one i constantly have to work on).

enough rambling, gotta go socialize him at the highschool...


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## Liz Monty (Oct 22, 2006)

I cannot say at all if West German Lines have more prey drive than East or Czech Lines. I am only getting my first West German soon. But I have worked with the DDR dogs over many years and find their prey drives to be extreme, very extreme. Not each pup in a litter but the ones that I was lucky enough to have chosen. If it's true about the West German prey drive possibly being higher as a standard, then Oh my god, I don't know what I'm in for. LOL. This time around I'm looking for the little bit less prey drive than in my past dogs, LOL


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## Dave Clarkson (Sep 16, 2006)

So it sounds like the people who say the old DDR lines did not have as much prey in general and take longer to mature are full of it. 

Just going by the serious posts on this thread. But there were only a couple.


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## Woody Taylor (Mar 28, 2006)

Dave Clarkson said:


> So it sounds like the people who say the old DDR lines did not have as much prey in general and take longer to mature are full of it.


Don't know about prey drive, but I thought it was pretty accepted that DDR and Czech lines do take longer to mature, and that seems to have been validated by a lot of the people here and elsewhere that have had them as well as other GSDs. Thought Czech in particular were a bit like Labradors in that respect. Maybe Al Reanto and others that breed them can comment on this.



> Just going by the serious posts on this thread. But there were only a couple.


Yeah, these guys, I'm sorry Dave, they tend to screw around way too much. I try to keep things in line but there's always somebody tanking serious threads. Best to ignore the Lydas and Dave Frost and guys like that...pure trouble...always trying to make the funnies. Typical newbs.


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## Daryl Ehret (Apr 4, 2006)

I've only experience with two one year olds, but both of the same litter. One has immense drive for the toy or tug, but good around the cat. The other didn't develop any desire for the retrieve until about 8 months, but was always intrested in the cat. Both were always crazy for squirrel watching, and maniacs for the spray hose or sprinkler. Confidence was strong in one, but not so high in the other although improved immensely in the last few months, to surpass that of other dogs in the pack. So, even with littermates, it can vary or have inverse qualities. I'm no expert on DDR lines, but these are linebred on some quality "old blood". I'd be careful to make any generalizations, but if your aim is for sport purpose, I'd select only from titled parents, and there aren't too many. Wouldn't put too much emphasis on early training either, if the "focus" isn't there. Not sure I'd want to pass final judgement on their development til around 14 to 18 months either. That's too long for some people, understandably, and others say it's really worth the wait.


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## Daryl Ehret (Apr 4, 2006)

BTW, most of my breeding is Czech lines, founded from DDR blood. I have experienced no issues whatsoever with late development. Very impressive trainability, early onset.


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## ann schnerre (Aug 24, 2006)

just from talking w/ppl that have ddr-bred dogs, i think they do tend to mature a little more slowly. if you want my own personal opinion, ask me again in a year or two!


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## Dave Clarkson (Sep 16, 2006)

Thanks for the input!

So it seems it does depend on the individual dog regarless of lines . Assuming we are talking about good working lines.


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## Erik Berg (Apr 11, 2006)

DDR seems to be a sales pitch nowadays, for people wanting "old" type GSDs, what that now is :? With all the dogs they had in DDR some of them must have been good, but a lot of crap too, and I guess thats goes for every line/country of working GSD.


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## ann schnerre (Aug 24, 2006)

i think you said a mouthful there, erik. well said!!


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## Molly Graf (Jul 20, 2006)

Yes I'll go there Erik and agree with you - good post!!!

molly


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