# New puppy...maybe?



## Hillary Hamilton (Jan 6, 2009)

Ok, I've been offered a really nice female pup to have with an excellent pedigree for free...but there is a catch. If I get her, they will have breeding rights on her once she has titles, but I will get my pick of the litter pup. Do you think this is a good deal (I don't really have the money to buy a puppy as our horses haven't sold yet and I'm looking into buying a car)? She will be mine and I will train her just that they will get to sell the pups as they bought her. Thanks!!!


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## Jeff Oehlsen (Apr 7, 2006)

**** that. Get a male, and pay for the thing. OR, renegotiate, and say they can have half of the first litter and get ****ed. You are doing all the work, and THEY will be making money if you get your 3.

The hours you will put in training basically "their" bitch is more than payment enough.


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## Courtney Guthrie (Oct 30, 2007)

I agree with Jeff! 

Courtney


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## Chris Michalek (Feb 13, 2008)

what happens if you get her spayed and say OOOPS

I agree with Jeff too.

What's the pedigree on the pup... I might not be breed worthy anyway


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## Anne Vaini (Mar 15, 2007)

Hillary Hamilton said:


> Ok, I've been offered a really nice female pup to have with an excellent pedigree for free...but there is a catch. If I get her, they will have breeding rights on her once she has titles, but I will get my pick of the litter pup. Do you think this is a good deal (I don't really have the money to buy a puppy as our horses haven't sold yet and I'm looking into buying a car)? She will be mine and I will train her just that they will get to sell the pups as they bought her. Thanks!!!


Don't do it! People get SCREWED OVER by agreeing to terms like this.

You've got plenty of time! There's no reason to rush to get a pup only to end up having to lose her because of a shoddy agreement. 

Besides - you aren't 18 yet (right?) so you can't sign a contract for co-ownership anyway.


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## Hillary Hamilton (Jan 6, 2009)

Well, they are my mom's friends and just want me to have a dog to train. I'm not 18 but they won't be coming to get her ever. And I'll have a chance to buy her if I want her later on.


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## Anne Vaini (Mar 15, 2007)

Hillary Hamilton said:


> Well, they are my mom's friends and just want me to have a dog to train. I'm not 18 but they won't be coming to get her ever. And I'll have a chance to buy her if I want her later on.



Don't do it. Find other people that have made similar arrangments and fidn out what happens!

The fact that they are family friend's only makes it all more messy!

If they come to get her, you are out thousands of dollars in time, training fees, vet bills, food... and don't think they won't! Wait about 3 years until you have a titled breeding-worthy dog that THEY own because there is no legal contract. Why wouldn't they take the dog back?

Or another scenario being that they won't sign her over to you because they want to claim the titles YOU put on their dog and their titles.

... ask Kristen Cabe about that ...


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## Kadi Thingvall (Jan 22, 2007)

The only person who can decide if an agreement is fair is you and the person who is offering you a co-own  

Are the terms that you gave the only terms they have discussed with you? If so, you need to ask a lot more questions.

If she turns out to be breeding quality who is responsible for paying the stud fee, any travel costs to/from the stud, breeding related costs (if an AI is needed), etc. Who whelps/raises the litter? Who pays for the vet care for the female and the litter? Who is responsible for marketing the pups and the follow up for the rest of their lives? What if there is a disagreement regarding the stud, the vet care for the female or any litter, where she's going to whelp, when she's going to be bred (you want to trial, they want to breed her, who gets priority) the homes for the pups, etc? What happens if she doesn't get titled? What if she doesn't pass her health checks? How many breedings do they get? Is there some sort of time limit on the co-own, ie they have to do their breedings by X age? 

There are risks on both sides in a co-own, it's not just some huge money maker for the breeder. What if the OP does as someone else suggested, agrees to the co-own, takes their free pup, then spays it? Or just disappears and doesn't honor the contract. What if they get bored with the sport and never title the dog? What if the dog turns out OK, but not breed worthy? There are lots of ways the OP ends up with a free pup, and the Breeder ends up out the $ they could have gotten if they had sold the pup outright. Or the breeder pays all the costs of a breeding, has a couple grand into the litter before they are born, there are only 2 pups and the OP takes their pick pup?

As a breeder I co-own some dogs, but you have to be very careful who you co-own with as it can get ugly fast. And the more you put in writing the better.


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## kristin tresidder (Oct 23, 2008)

Jeff Oehlsen said:


> OR, renegotiate, and say they can have half of the first litter and get ****ed.



i love the way you put things sometimes... LOL


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## Kristina Senter (Apr 4, 2006)

Do they want to do only one litter as "theirs" or is she THEIR brood bitch for all future litters? 

I was given some great opportunities by working other peoples dogs when I started off and could not afford a good dog for myself. They were beneficial to the breeder(s) and to myself and it was overall a great deal. 100% of the expenses (minus time) belonged to the breeder and I had dogs I enjoyed working and learned a lot from. I would have been accountable for major mistakes (dog runs away, accidentally gets bred, etc) but I was trusted to be responsible and appreciated (and still do) the trust that was put into me. 

The biggest factor however was that it was never an issue about whose dogs they were (not mine). I did not feel like I was being "used" because I was there completely by choice. The point is that it may be a good learning situation for you to work with and train the dog, but unless it is completely your dog, approach it as being completely their dog. 

Would I do something like that now? Hell no


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## Michelle Reusser (Mar 29, 2008)

That is not a free dog, you will be paying MUCH more later on than if you just lay the puppy price down up front. Just ask Kristin. How much interest is that anyway 1 puppy price = a whole litter of puppies they will sell at that same price? Crazy. It might sound good now but what happens if she can't title, isn't breed worthy or you lose interest? It's a good way to lose friends.


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## Maren Bell Jones (Jun 7, 2006)

I'm also curious...what are your plans after high school? If you're heading to college, there's a high likelihood you won't be able to take your dog with you until you find a dog friendly apartment (and good luck with that with a Rottie!). Many won't allow any dogs at all and the majority that do have weight limits of 25 or 40 lbs or whatever. Plus unless you're a trust fund baby, the costs of everything get really tight during school when you can only work a limited amount. Quality food, training equipment, housing, vet costs, excercising the dog, etc all add up to both time and money, especially when you've got active dogs that have higher energy requirements and are more likely to injure themselves than a more low key dog. 

I'm not necessarily trying to talk you out of it because God knows we need more young people in dog sport (I was the youngest in our old Schutzhund club by about 10-15 years at least and I'm 26 now), but I had to wait until I was 22 before I could get my "first" dog (other than my parent's dogs). Before I could get one, I had to spend lots of time getting my fix at the local shelter volunteering and learning to deal with dogs with behavior issues. But just so you know when you graduate high school, your priorities may have to change and a working dog in particular might not fit into that situation and it may not be real fair to the dog to be stuck at your parent's place while you're off at school or doing whatever you'd like to do. Just a heads up, I was in your shoes not too awful long ago myself. Best of luck! :mrgreen:


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