# 5 m/o pup only weighs 35 lbs.



## Matthew Criner (Apr 19, 2006)

I took my 5 month old pup to the vet the other day, and he weighed 35 lbs. The Vet said that since he was sick for so long and wouldn't eat on his own, he will be very small when he is full grown. Is this true? I was looking at this GSD chart, and it sais that he should weigh 50 lbs by now. http://www.nwk9.com/weight_height.htm

Should I be concerned?


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## Kristen Cabe (Mar 27, 2006)

Jak was about that weight at 5 months. Don't worry about it. As long as his bones aren't sticking out, he's fine.


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## Connie Sutherland (Mar 27, 2006)

Matthew Criner said:


> I took my 5 month old pup to the vet the other day, and he weighed 35 lbs. The Vet said that since he was sick for so long and wouldn't eat on his own, he will be very small when he is full grown. Is this true? I was looking at this GSD chart, and it sais that he should weigh 50 lbs by now. http://www.nwk9.com/weight_height.htm
> 
> Should I be concerned?


I agree with Kristen.

As long as you can't easily see his ribs ...... and don't
forget that the vet isn't concerned!

IMO, small and lean is way better than oversized, for 
many health reasons.


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## Matthew Criner (Apr 19, 2006)

So what do you guys think he will weigh when he is full grown?


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## Connie Sutherland (Mar 27, 2006)

Matthew Criner said:


> So what do you guys think he will weigh when he is full grown?


Who knows? 

A guess? 55 to 60?

Mine is only 64-66.


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## Connie Sutherland (Mar 27, 2006)

Connie Sutherland said:


> Matthew Criner said:
> 
> 
> > So what do you guys think he will weigh when he is full grown?
> ...


BTW, Matthew, how is he doing? Does he have his
appetite now? That little guy went through a lot; it's
great that he's coming along!


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## Matthew Criner (Apr 19, 2006)

Yea, he eats a lot now. 55-60....that's rather small for a import male from sieger rated parents. Do you think I should complain to my breeder? He has a 5 year guarantee for all genetic problems, and I specifically told him I wanted to participate in shutzhund and possibly show him.


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## Connie Sutherland (Mar 27, 2006)

Matthew Criner said:


> Yea, he eats a lot now. 55-60....that's rather small for a import male from sieger rated parents. Do you think I should complain to my breeder? He has a 5 year guarantee for all genetic problems, and I specifically told him I wanted to participate in shutzhund and possibly show him.


I actually have no idea what size he will be, Matthew.

But it makes sense to me that after all he has been through,
he would probably be a small guy.

Since I'm pretty much a second-hand dog-owner, I know
very little about size as a function of conformation or SchH.

I'll bet others here will have better answers.


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## Mike Schoonbrood (Mar 27, 2006)

My showline GSD is 24" at the shoulders and 65lbs.... my female dutch shepherd pup is 25lbs at 5 months old, 35lbs sounds about right for a GSD... maybe a teeny bit small, but I think that's what Cujo was, he's a smaller GSD but not small small, his appearance looks more than 65lbs but when you touch him then touch a heavier set GSD you feel the difference.


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## Connie Sutherland (Mar 27, 2006)

Mike Schoonbrood said:


> My showline GSD is 24" at the shoulders and 65lbs.... my female dutch shepherd pup is 25lbs at 5 months old, 35lbs sounds about right for a GSD... maybe a teeny bit small, but I think that's what Cujo was, he's a smaller GSD but not small small, his appearance looks more than 65lbs but when you touch him then touch a heavier set GSD you feel the difference.


And Mike, you have no problems with a relatively
small GSD, right? I know I sure don't, since I see
it as a hedge against joint problems.


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## Matthew Criner (Apr 19, 2006)

Mike, did he have eating problems when he was younger?


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## Mike Schoonbrood (Mar 27, 2006)

The first almost 2 years of his life were a struggle to get him to eat anything, he was so underfed, but he was always visually healthy... he wouldn't eat kibbles unless I mixed it with other crap, he's tried every kinda food there is, even The Honest Kitchen (which he LOVES now) was a slight struggle once the novelty of a new food wore off.... but for some reason having Lÿka around, he's turned into the cookie monster, he goes crazy when I bring his meal in, his food drive is thru the roof... I mean, he's the kinda dog that people told me "take away his food after 10 minutes n starve him till he eats right" n he would rather not eat for a week than give in to hunger... but now, if I walk into the room with his food bowl n make him do OB before he gets his food, he sits in heel position making whining noises begging for his food. I don't know if it's an age thing, or because he's watched a high food drive dog do backflips for her food n something clicked in his head or what.... but the thing I learnt thru all of this the most is "if he looks healthy, don't worry about how much he eats".

As for a smaller GSD... I will never go back to a larger GSD... I was a little disappointed at first when I realized Cujo would never be a big 85+lb GSD monster, but since then my attitude has changed alot, smaller GSD's have less structural problems, less bone problems, less health problems overall, longer lifespan on average, more agile etc.

If you really specifically wanted a 90lb dog n your breeder led you to believe that you would get a big 90lb dog, and by 12 months old the dog doesn't look like he's gonna fill out to that size (by 12 months the dog is about adult size minus the bulking up), then sure complain if you like --- I have 100 complaints to my breeder, but I never voiced any of them, because at the end of the day, I love the dog I have, he turned out to be a good dog regardless of my total ignorance to selection testing or lineage at the time, n if I were to get another GSD, I would look for the smaller sleeker breeding in hopes for another 65lb 24" tall male.


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## Bob Scott (Mar 30, 2006)

Mathew, we have a couple of small (50-55lb) GSDs on our club. We call them sable Mals because their small size makes them extreamly fast. Both hit like a sledge hammer. Fun to watch! Don't worry, be happy! :wink:


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## Matthew Criner (Apr 19, 2006)

Thanks for your kind words Mike and Bob. It just dissapointed me, because I was promise a large dog. His father is Flipp Von Arlett who is sieger rated and weighs 82 lbs. His mother is sieger rated as well and a larger female.


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## Mike Schoonbrood (Mar 27, 2006)

Matthew Criner said:


> Thanks for your kind words Mike and Bob. It just dissapointed me, because I was promise a large dog. His father is Flipp Von Arlett who is sieger rated and weighs 82 lbs. His mother is sieger rated as well and a larger female.


My dogs dad is Remus Zorro (look it up on Pedigree Database if you like) and he too is a large dog, his mother is Hemi von Kaykohl Land (Pedigree dB also) n both are larger dogs, n my boy was the big boy outta the litter, the breeder kept emphasizing "he might be the biggest now but they grow at different rates, you don't know if he's gonna be the biggest as an adult", I dunno if he was trying to tell me something with this, I doubt it, but just something to bare in mind, nobody knows how big their pup is gonna get, even if the parents are huge, there's always gonna be a few smaller pups here n there.


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## Sarah Hall (Apr 12, 2006)

I bought Carbon KNOWING he wasn't going to be a 98lb monster like his dad. I saw my first small, sleek GSD about 3 years ago doing bitework, and loved it. It's just all dog, no fluff that was built up from years of show and egotistical breeders. Plus, they look to be a real throwback to the first GSDs that looked more like Mals than today's GSDs. Just remember that old saying:
_"It's not the size of the dog in the fight, it's the size of the fight in the dog."_


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## Kristen Cabe (Mar 27, 2006)

Jak will be 13 months old on the 4th, he's still lean, and around 60-65 pounds (haven't weighed him in about a month). As I said, he was about the size of your dog at 5 months, and he still has some filling out to do. He'll probably be around 70 pounds once he's filled out, but I'm in no hurry to bulk him up. 



> As for a smaller GSD... I will never go back to a larger GSD... I was a little disappointed at first when I realized Cujo would never be a big 85+lb GSD monster, but since then my attitude has changed alot, smaller GSD's have less structural problems, less bone problems, less health problems overall, longer lifespan on average, more agile etc.


Not to mention they eat less so you don't spend as much on food! :lol:


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## Al Curbow (Mar 27, 2006)

Matthew, Anne Jones has a small female gsd (pocket rocket) and it will kick your ass in a heart beat, she's a lot of dog in a small package. If the dog is good (temperament etc.) who cares how big he is? I have a big male gsd and he couldn't do a sport if his life depended on it, the ONLY thing he can do good is chase a ball, LOL. So, enjoy your pup, 
AL


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## Elly Elsenaar (Mar 27, 2006)

Our GSD wasn't that big at all, but I tell you to do Schutzhund you better off with a size that you can handle, not so much injury's.

Here a picture of Valdo when he was 5 months. I don't know his weight in usa, but in dutch kilo's he was about 20kg.











and this is what he now almost 2 years.




















So don't worry, he still can grow! We did a lot of swimming with him.


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## Woody Taylor (Mar 28, 2006)

Well said, everybody! 

Matt, you can look back in the threads...I posted that link myself a few months back. It is an FCI chart from 1991 or something. My mutt was undersized as well until six months or so and she ended following that chart within a pound or so...not that that should be your expectation...just saying that there is a lot more variability ( in my newb opinion) at that stage of puppyhood.

But yeah, don't sweat the fact that your dog might have a few less pounds of gut!


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## Kristen Cabe (Mar 27, 2006)

> I don't know his weight in usa, but in dutch kilo's he was about 20kg.


20 kilogram = 44.092 452 437 pound (http://www.onlineconversion.com/ I love this page!!)


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## Woody Taylor (Mar 28, 2006)

Matthew Criner said:


> I specifically told him I wanted to participate in shutzhund and possibly show him.


To whom were you gonna show him? ;-). You need to get his pelvis removed if you are in a US show, right?

Are there show competitions for euro GSDs in the US? I have no idea, would be interested to know...not that I am interested in doing it...


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## Bob Scott (Mar 30, 2006)

The SV shows have the Euro type dogs. The GSDCA-WDA North American Seiger show will be in the St. Louis area (Purina Farms) in October.


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## Stacia Porter (Apr 8, 2006)

Matthew Criner said:


> Yea, he eats a lot now. 55-60....that's rather small for a import male from sieger rated parents. Do you think I should complain to my breeder? He has a 5 year guarantee for all genetic problems, and I specifically told him I wanted to participate in shutzhund and possibly show him.


Did you buy him from Germany? If so, they have a "buyer beware" policy and you aren't very likely to get anything out of them. My contract for Achilles specifically states that once I take the dog off their property, he's MY problem :wink: . He's also out of VA rated lines...

The standard says your male can be on the smaller side, specifically he can be anywhere from 60 to 65 cm at the withers and between 30 and 40 kg (or between 23.5 and 25.5 inches tall and between 66 and 88 lbs). http://www.vomtauglichkeit.com/ImportGermanShepherdsBreedStanrdardsSV.html

Achilles is at the other end of the standard standing at exactly 65 cm at the withers but only weighing 63.5 lbs (he's 16 months old). For one thing, a dog is not full grown until about 2 1/2 or 3 years -- my vet told me that Achilles probably will top out at around 80, but it'll take another 18 months at least to do it.

So if your dog tops out at 60 cm and 66 lbs, he's within showing standard.


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## Stacia Porter (Apr 8, 2006)

Oh, and I was going to add, too, that smaller = agile IMO. My AmBred rescue bitch is 60 cm at the withers and weighs about 59 lbs (she's on teh thin side, we're trying to put a little weight on her). She's about 2 years old and has severe hip dysplasia -- but she's a lot quicker than Achilles! She gets underneath him in a flash when they're wrestling. He runs faster (obviously), but you can't count her out!

And I've been told that at a showt he height, gait, and overall apperance are going to be more important to the judge than weight. They are more concerned with the dog being at a healthy weight than they are about it being at a certain weight, if that makes sense. I dont' concern myself with how much either of my dogs weigh -- I go by what they look like. Achilles is perfectly fine wtih his last rib showing and a defined waist; Andi is underweight with all of her rips showing and part of her backbone, but we're going easy due to her HD.

BTW, Achilles's father is massive at 65 cm at 88 lbs on the dot (VA7 Marko della Valcuvia) but his mother was on teh smaller side of the bitch standard. Mike's breeder was right: there is no telling how large a dog will be full grown. Too many factors affect that to be the least bit certain.


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