# Mali Teeth???



## FRANK PORT (Jul 29, 2011)

Hey Guys

I adopted a beautiful female 3 yr old mali at the beginning of the summer from a wonderful lady that just had too many dogs. I was wondering if anybody has seen these type of teeth (issues) before. She is a total pleasure, total light switch. She started training in protection when she was 6 mo. and bites hard/serious on the field and flys through the air unbelievable, but gentle as can be in the house with the kids. *All* of her teeth look straight almost like they were broken off or wore down, but they are symmetrical (right side incissors & left side incissors are exactly the same height and the other teeth on the sides are same height as each other and perfectly even), how can that be?. I know some malis lines have straight teeth and not your typical scissor like inscisors (and other teeth), but from one of the pictures you can see what looks like a root showing (typical for teeth on both sides). The previous owner said that she spent a lot of time in an outside kennel playing/chewing with a tennis ball and maybe that did it, but how can left and right be exactly the same. I know when she plays with my male GSD she snaps her teeth hard together and makes a serious snapping noise, all play (she never hurts my male), could that snapping from when she was young have did it? I always had GSDs, but did have a female mali in the past, but her teeth were like my GSDs (*sharp). I must stress, both sides, left & right are exactly the same. Looks almost like her teeth should be this way, but I see the root down the middle of them from a top view. What do you think? Anybody see this before?


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## Karen M Wood (Jun 23, 2012)

They don't appear to be broken, so i'm going with sanded down by plaing with tennis balls that got covered in sand. I've seen this in a friend's GSD that was ball obsessive. Ground his teeth right down to the gums by the time he was 6. So she's half way there.


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## Brittany silveira (Jun 20, 2012)

Like Karen said, ground down. My husbands GSD had nubs by the time she passed from simply playing with tennis balls her entire life.


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## Guest (Dec 1, 2008)

Karen M Wood said:


> They don't appear to be broken, so i'm going with sanded down by plaing with tennis balls that got covered in sand. I've seen this in a friend's GSD that was ball obsessive. Ground his teeth right down to the gums by the time he was 6. So she's half way there.


 
Thats it! Toys with sand. I had a dog that played with a Horse Jolly Ball all day long and within months her teeth were exactly like that!


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## FRANK PORT (Jul 29, 2011)

Thanks for the input. 
Since we got her she plays constantly with us and my male GSD, so she has no interest with any balls or chew toys. She now eats orijen in the morning and raw in the evenings with an occasional chicken back now and then as a treat, so I am hoping the damage to the teeth stays as is.
Even with the teeth worn down, she puts a hurting on the decoys when training.
She looks like a 60lb female bodybuilder.


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## Connie Sutherland (Mar 27, 2006)

Brittany silveira said:


> Like Karen said, ground down. My husbands GSD had nubs by the time she passed from simply playing with tennis balls her entire life.



Yes, even with no sand.

I know not everyone agrees (or maybe not everyone is aware), but I'm convinced that the coating on the tennis ball is extremely wearing on many dogs' teeth as is, and sand just exponentially increases that abrasive effect.


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## Gerald Dunn (Sep 24, 2011)

Connie Sutherland said:


> Yes, even with no sand.
> 
> I know not everyone agrees (or maybe not everyone is aware), but I'm convinced that the coating on the tennis ball is extremely wearing on many dogs' teeth as is, and sand just exponentially increases that abrasive effect.



so what is it about the tennis ball that causes wear?????


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## Guest (Dec 1, 2008)

Gerald Dunn said:


> so what is it about the tennis ball that causes wear?????


I hear alot of people say its the glue that they use, however I don't beleive that at all, I think its the contant compression of the teeth going into the rubber or any material over and over again, its almost like a nail file or sander. Sand obvioulsy just speeds things up, but with other rubber toys that compress you see the same effect over time if the dog is allowed toys constantly. Of course thats only what I experienced and seen.


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## Connie Sutherland (Mar 27, 2006)

I don't know for sure. I've read opinions about the chemicals in the glue, and about the glue combined with the dog's saliva, and about the fuzz itself. I don't know what it is.

Long ago, I used to think it was an old wives' tale. But now I've seen quite a few dogs with that kind of wear, and the constant tennis ball playing being the only thing in common .... I'm pretty much convinced. 

http://www.avds-online.org/info/wornteeth.html_
"Dogs that chew on tennis balls or other abrasive toys (think of tennis ball as a scoring pad), will often wear their smaller front cheek teeth (premolars), and the back aspect of the canines. ... "_

But I've known dogs who had the same obsession with tennis balls and did not experience this kind of wear, too, so I don't know exactly what the mechanism or culprit is. (If you Google it, you'll find many opinions about it.)

Maybe the difference is the thickness and hardness of the enamel, which can vary greatly.


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## Dana McMahan (Apr 5, 2006)

I saw a rescue Dutchie with the same issue. Was allowed to mouth a tennis ball obsessively and it just wore the teeth down. I'm guessing some dogs get it and some don't based on how long they are allowed to play with a tennis ball and how strong their teeth are to begin with.


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## Ben Thompson (May 2, 2009)

I was told by my trainer to stop using tennis balls once the adult teeth came in. So when that happened I threw them in the garbage. I use those rubber balls and squeaky balls. So far no problems. I should mention I'm working with a GSD not a mal. Another thing you need to watch out for is rocks and gravel. Don't let them play with it.


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## Jennifer Coulter (Sep 18, 2007)

My mal likes to squish toys obsessively in her mouth, but only when I am around. (Won't squish a ball ALL day in her kennel, I also don't leave her any to do that with) She has NEVER played with a tennis ball, only rubber toys you would think would be easy on teeth.

She NEVER chews on her kennel. She is only 2 years old and her teeth are flat just like that. My yard does have dirt in it, and I sometimes let her carry a toy on walks in the dirty woods lol. So, I have to go with "the rubber toys with some dirt on them can do that" theory. I think even snow on the toys is abrasive over time.

I also think that some dog's teeth are softer than others...genetically?



Jody Butler said:


> I hear alot of people say its the glue that they use, however I don't beleive that at all, I think its the contant compression of the teeth going into the rubber or any material over and over again, its almost like a nail file or sander. Sand obvioulsy just speeds things up, but with other rubber toys that compress you see the same effect over time if the dog is allowed toys constantly. Of course thats only what I experienced and seen.


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## Nicole Stark (Jul 22, 2009)

Jennifer Coulter said:


> I also think that some dog's teeth are softer than others...genetically?


That'd be my final answer on this barring the obvious (excessive mouthing on sandy/dirty toys). Who knows though. I certainly don't.


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## Guest (Dec 1, 2008)

Jennifer Coulter said:


> My mal likes to squish toys obsessively in her mouth, but only when I am around. (Won't squish a ball ALL day in her kennel, I also don't leave her any to do that with) She has NEVER played with a tennis ball, only rubber toys you would think would be easy on teeth.
> 
> She NEVER chews on her kennel. She is only 2 years old and her teeth are flat just like that. My yard does have dirt in it, and I sometimes let her carry a toy on walks in the dirty woods lol. So, I have to go with "the rubber toys with some dirt on them can do that" theory. I think even snow on the toys is abrasive over time.
> 
> I also think that some dog's teeth are softer than others...genetically?


 
I had one at 12-16 months that was like that over a rubber toy, genetics, possibly, but I've known several dogs of various lineages, so if it is genetics, its flooded the gene pool.

I know hundreds and hundreds of PSD and MWD that use a tennis ball for their reward and no problems, and if their is, its less than 2%, go figure....??


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## leslie cassian (Jun 3, 2007)

Jennifer Coulter said:


> My mal likes to squish toys obsessively in her mouth, but only when I am around. (Won't squish a ball ALL day in her kennel, I also don't leave her any to do that with) She has NEVER played with a tennis ball, only rubber toys you would think would be easy on teeth.
> 
> She NEVER chews on her kennel. She is only 2 years old and her teeth are flat just like that. My yard does have dirt in it, and I sometimes let her carry a toy on walks in the dirty woods lol. So, I have to go with "the rubber toys with some dirt on them can do that" theory. I think even snow on the toys is abrasive over time.
> 
> I also think that some dog's teeth are softer than others...genetically?



My Mal does the squishy thing with toys. He almost seems to zone out when he does it. Even better for him is if there's a squeeky in there. Tennis balls are a non-issue, they last about 30 seconds before he pops them and starts shredding. The ball of choice for both dogs is the orange chuckit ball. 

At 7, my mali's teeth are less worn than my 3 yr old Dutchie's, so I think there may be a genetic influence on wear, too.


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## jim stevens (Jan 30, 2012)

I don't use tennis balls other than maybe 15-20 minutes a week for play, if the pup wants to chew something, I use a deer antler or bone. This is my first mali, but have had numerous shepherds, dobes, and never had teeth worn like this. I'm thinking there is a genetic thing, or chewing on a metal kennel, possibly. There are a lot here with more experience than me, but I haven't seen it.


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## Guest (Dec 1, 2008)

jim stevens said:


> I don't use tennis balls other than maybe 15-20 minutes a week for play, if the pup wants to chew something, I use a deer antler or bone. This is my first mali, but have had numerous shepherds, dobes, and never had teeth worn like this. I'm thinking there is a genetic thing, or chewing on a metal kennel, possibly. There are a lot here with more experience than me, but I haven't seen it.


 
If the dog was chewing on the kennel or cage, the teeth wouldn't be flat like that, they look alot different if you seen dogs that have that behavioral issue

genetics, behavior, toys, diet?? Maybe a little of everything?


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## Jennifer Coulter (Sep 18, 2007)

Jody Butler said:


> If the dog was chewing on the kennel or cage, the teeth wouldn't be flat like that, they look alot different if you seen dogs that have that behavioral issue
> 
> genetics, behavior, toys, diet?? Maybe a little of everything?


Yes, my female that has flattened teeth NEVER chews on her kennel or crate, and NEVER has.


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## Daniel Lybbert (Nov 23, 2010)

chewing a crate usually wears the inside or back of the teeth and makes them thin. I think lots of flat teeth are genetic. Thin teeth are going to wear fast. If mals had teeth like a GSD that would be great. Lots of bite work on synthetic material could cause undue wear also.


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## Joby Becker (Dec 13, 2009)

Daniel Lybbert said:


> chewing a crate usually wears the inside or back of the teeth and makes them thin. I think lots of flat teeth are genetic. Thin teeth are going to wear fast. If mals had teeth like a GSD that would be great. Lots of bite work on synthetic material could cause undue wear also.


and natural materials as well...if it abrasive to teeth, it does not matter if it synthetic or natural..


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