# A question about dewclaws



## Sarah Best (Oct 3, 2010)

Im interested in maybe getting a Beauceron within the next couple years. I know that they are supposed to have the double dewclaws on their hind legs but I wondering if they cause any real problems. 
Ive heard of multiple people saying that if your not showing your dog you should have them removed because they are so easily ripped off. But Ive also heard if you keep them trim they wont cause any problems.


----------



## Thomas Barriano (Mar 27, 2006)

Sarah Best said:


> Im interested in maybe getting a Beauceron within the next couple years. I know that they are supposed to have the double dewclaws on their hind legs but I wondering if they cause any real problems.
> Ive heard of multiple people saying that if your not showing your dog you should have them removed because they are so easily ripped off. But Ive also heard if you keep them trim they wont cause any problems.


I don't remove the dew claws on my Dobermanns. I figure if
God didn't want them to have dew claws they wouldn't be born with em 
I've never had any problems with injuries and think they give extra gripping power ;-)


----------



## Jim Nash (Mar 30, 2006)

Thomas Barriano said:


> I don't remove the dew claws on my Dobermanns. I figure if
> God didn't want them to have dew claws they wouldn't be born with em
> I've never had any problems with injuries and think they give extra gripping power ;-)



Have you seen dewclaws on a Beauceron ? Nasty . I can see why , they have an extra one . We trained a couple as PSDs several years ago and had them removed . Don't know of anyone that actually had problems with them catching on something but we didn't take the chance .


----------



## Thomas Barriano (Mar 27, 2006)

Jim Nash said:


> Have you seen dewclaws on a Beauceron ? Nasty . I can see why , they have an extra one . We trained a couple as PSDs several years ago and had them removed . Don't know of anyone that actually had problems with them catching on something but we didn't take the chance .


Beaucerons are just long haired Dobermanns aren't they? 
I had a friend who had a Beauceron with dew claws and never had a problem. I just have a problem with removing stuff off of any dogs.


----------



## Jim Nash (Mar 30, 2006)

Thomas Barriano said:


> Beaucerons are just long haired Dobermanns aren't they?
> I had a friend who had a Beauceron with dew claws and never had a problem. I just have a problem with removing stuff off of any dogs.



Didn't know Dobes had two huge ugly ass dewclaws .  I hear you but those things give me the creeps anyways and something that ugly has got to go .


----------



## Kristen Roberts (Sep 28, 2010)

I had 3 Beaucerons and never had a problem. From talking to others injuries are rare. They are not typical extra dewclaws in that they are only connected by skin. On the Beauceron there is bone/joint in there and it would be major surgery to remove them. It's definitely not necessary. Briards and Great Pyrenees also have similar double dewclaws. And of course you do need to keep them trimmed just like the rest of their nails


----------



## Jim Nash (Mar 30, 2006)

Kristen Roberts said:


> I had 3 Beaucerons and never had a problem. From talking to others injuries are rare. They are not typical extra dewclaws in that they are only connected by skin. On the Beauceron there is bone/joint in there and it would be major surgery to remove them. It's definitely not necessary. Briards and Great Pyrenees also have similar double dewclaws. And of course you do need to keep them trimmed just like the rest of their nails


You are correct about that surgery . It's not something to be taken lightly .


----------



## Kellie Wolverton (Jan 16, 2009)

Both of my Beaucerons actually use those extra dews for gripping. My female even uses her front dews, mostly to grip while she is trying to shake hands with you.They are all very well developed and jointed. 

We do herding and they haven't caused any problems so far.

I do have to admit, the first time I saw them move while she was sleeping I got a little creeped out!

Kellie


----------



## Kadi Thingvall (Jan 22, 2007)

Kristen Roberts said:


> They are not typical extra dewclaws in that they are only connected by skin. On the Beauceron there is bone/joint in there and it would be major surgery to remove them.


I think it depends on the dog. I had a Beauceron who had very nice rear dewclaws, really did look like and extension of the dogs foot and had a connected joint in there. Laid flat and snug against the leg. However, I've seen many Beauceron with double rear dews that are clearly just connected by soft tissue, they are floppy and stick out. Those are the ones I'd be concerned about injury with, although I don't know how common it is. If an owner didn't want to remove them, and was worried about an injury, a quick wrapping with vet wrap would keep them from getting snagged on something when in a high risk situation.


----------



## Maren Bell Jones (Jun 7, 2006)

My old GSD/Mal cross had double dew claws and never had a problem with them. He did tear a front dew claw once. His new owner hasn't reported any problems. You just had to trim them every so often.


----------



## rick smith (Dec 31, 2010)

Jim Nash said:


> Didn't know Dobes had two huge ugly ass dewclaws .  I hear you but those things give me the creeps anyways and something that ugly has got to go .


guess that would mean you would decapitate a bull terrier if you got one as a present  

imnsho, amputating dew claws falls into the same category as clipping ears and chopping off tails to make a dog look "better" or cooler..... everyone knows a real protection dog should never have their claws trimmed

actually, just building up my post count to get beyond the "ankle biter" label and maybe become a landshark someday


----------



## Debbie Skinner (Sep 11, 2008)

I've had the breed for more than 20 years and haven't had a problem with the dew-claws getting torn on my dogs. We have a lot of brush in the areas that I hike and horseback ride with the dogs and never had a problem. We never had a problem or heard of a problem doing ring sport (palisade, etc.) either. 

I've heard of very few situations of torn or bleeding hind-dews, and it's usually the nail bed and not serious. However, just yesterday, the co-owner of one of my females mentioned that the dog broke the toe of one of the hind-dews she thinks. It's swollen. She figured it was injured in the yard playing with the other dogs that morning, but doesn't know. Not bothering her much though as she showed her yesterday to a Best in Show win at a local UKC show so didn't affect her movement or attitude.

The removal isn't as simple as snipping the flimsy hind-dew that occasionally is found on a GSD, Rottie, or Mal pup. It is bone connected to bone so removal would have to be done by a vet imo. 

The double-dews are part of the breeds history and I don't see the standard changing to allow for dogs misising dews or their removal. They are a breed characteristic that is considered a sign of the race and purity. 

That said, if I could wave a magic wand, the dews would not be held in such regard and I'd love it also if all my Beaucerons were born with upright ears like a Malinois and didn't have to undergo ear cropping for the look that I and many others prefer. 

When considering getting a Beauceron for work, the possibility of the dew-claws getting torn would not be a concern for me. You will get a lot of remarks from the public regarding the dews. Quite the conversation piece as people ask about them.


----------



## Debbie Skinner (Sep 11, 2008)

Thomas Barriano said:


> Beaucerons are just long haired Dobermanns aren't they?
> I had a friend who had a Beauceron with dew claws and never had a problem. I just have a problem with removing stuff off of any dogs.


beauces are dobes on roids


----------



## Thomas Barriano (Mar 27, 2006)

Debbie Skinner said:


> beauces are dobes on roids



I thought Rotties were Dobies on steroids?


----------



## Debbie Skinner (Sep 11, 2008)

Thomas Barriano said:


> I thought Rotties were Dobies on steroids?


I always heard pigs in dog suits or was it dogs in pig suits.. Here we go race bashing!  and the gsds are swamp collies.. the malinois? european coyotes..


----------



## Debbie Skinner (Sep 11, 2008)

Here you can see all of Avatar's back toes including dews in contact with the Palisade wall (French Ring trial - National D'Elevage in France). This was a few years back when Tim Welch was competing at level 2 with Avatar O.V. 










Below you can see him pushing with rear toes:










another palisade at FRIII:


----------



## Jenny Thorp (Nov 8, 2008)

I've not had any problems with my Beaucerons dewclaws. 
Never had them snag on anything dispite all the crazy stuff she does.

Them being able to move them took some getting use to.
Maybe that's part of why they don't get snagged/torn as so many people seem to think will happen.


----------



## Jenny Thorp (Nov 8, 2008)

Debbie Skinner said:


> Here you can see all of Avatar's back toes including dews in contact with the Palisade wall (French Ring trial - National D'Elevage in France). This was a few years back when Tim Welch was competing at level 2 with Avatar O.V.


 
NICE photos of toes in action :-D
Thanks for sharing.


----------



## Debbie Skinner (Sep 11, 2008)

Jenny Thorp said:


> NICE photos of toes in action :-D
> Thanks for sharing.


Welcome. On the vids, you can see better. Tim has a bunch of videos of Avatar if you go to the page I made for Avatar and scroll part way down there's a bunch of youtube links: http://www.pawsnclaws.us/avatar_ped.htm

I think Tim may have more too so once you are at youtube you can search through tim's vids as well.


----------



## Sarah Best (Oct 3, 2010)

Debbie Skinner said:


> Welcome. On the vids, you can see better. Tim has a bunch of videos of Avatar if you go to the page I made for Avatar and scroll part way down there's a bunch of youtube links: http://www.pawsnclaws.us/avatar_ped.htm
> 
> I think Tim may have more too so once you are at youtube you can search through tim's vids as well.


Aw yes, ive been kinda stalking your web site and videos for a while now  and Avatar is defiantly one of my favorite dogs. Ive already watch all his videos, he is just an amazing worker and I hope that my Beauceron will be as great as him


----------



## Debbie Skinner (Sep 11, 2008)

Sarah Best said:


> Aw yes, ive been kinda stalking your web site and videos for a while now  and Avatar is defiantly one of my favorite dogs. Ive already watch all his videos, he is just an amazing worker and I hope that my Beauceron will be as great as him


Thanks. Webpage stalkers are great. Got to watch out for the wdf stalkers though :wink: 

You might want to talk with Tim Welch (owner/trainer of Avatar) as well about working and living with Beaucerons. He's a nice guy and is training a Dexter son now (malinois) so can easily compare the two. 

There's a litter planned for later this year in France with Enji DGV, a Avatar daughter from DGV/Julian's breeding to a FRI dog. The owner of the female is a facebook friend and just mentioned his plans to me today.

Of course then I went into "research mode" and searched out the peds:

Breeding to Chok, FRI: http://www.aboutbeaucerons.com/cgi-bin/geneal.pl?op=tree&index=24096&gens=4&db=beauceron.dbw

Enji is daughter of Avatar x Tara (Julian's female that is the dam of Artizan).

http://www.aboutbeaucerons.com/cgi-...nce&gens=4&db=beauceron.dbw&submit=Create+Now

Breeding info on Tara: 

http://www.aboutbeaucerons.com/cgi-bin/breeding.pl?op=breeding&index=16785&gens=4&db=beauceron.dbw


----------



## Sarah Best (Oct 3, 2010)

Debbie Skinner said:


> Thanks. Webpage stalkers are great. Got to watch out for the wdf stalkers though :wink:
> 
> You might want to talk with Tim Welch (owner/trainer of Avatar) as well about working and living with Beaucerons. He's a nice guy and is training a Dexter son now (malinois) so can easily compare the two.
> 
> ...



I dont plan on bring home a new pup for another year or 2. My current dog (a rottie/GSD mix) still acts like a giant puppy and he needs some more training before I bring the new pup home.

In a few months I will be starting agility classes with him and then some time next year I hope to get him into a little bit of herding. So hopefully maybe i can meet some people who have owned Beaucerons. I also found this ranch like an hour or two away from me and they own 2 or 3 Beaucerons. Im hoping to visit them also to getting a better feel for owning Beaucerons


----------



## pj star (Nov 15, 2021)

Thomas Barriano said:


> I don't remove the dew claws on my Dobermanns. I figure if
> God didn't want them to have dew claws they wouldn't be born with em
> I've never had any problems with injuries and think they give extra gripping power ;-)


I’m interested that ppl who do not want to remove the dew claws for the reason that “God put them there “ so readily cut their ears. Didn’t God make their ears that way too?Just wondering the difference.


----------



## VWJen (8 mo ago)

Thomas Barriano said:


> Beaucerons are just long haired Dobermanns aren't they?
> I had a friend who had a Beauceron with dew claws and never had a problem. I just have a problem with removing stuff off of any dogs.


Nope  Dobermans were bred from German Shepherds, Rottweilers, and some other terriers. However, some people have theorized regarding Beaucerons were involved. But, a Beauceron is an "original" breed, it wasn't intentionally bred from other breeds.
I have an 8 month old Beauceron who was found abandoned in the plains of Montana. He ended up in our local shelter all the way in SW MT, and he's AMAZING. His double dew claws were removed when he was a puppy, and he seems to do pretty well without the second one. He's absurdly agile and his sense of smell is very well honed. He's excellent with children, and isn't as shy about strangers as his breed would suggest. But, that's probably because we have heavily socialized him and he knows strangers have treats (we frequent ranch supply stores and Home Depot where the employees always have dog treats on them) 




Jim Nash said:


> Have you seen dewclaws on a Beauceron ? Nasty . I can see why , they have an extra one . We trained a couple as PSDs several years ago and had them removed . Don't know of anyone that actually had problems with them catching on something but we didn't take the chance .


----------

