# The search for new decoys......



## Jeff Oehlsen (Apr 7, 2006)

..............may be 1 closer!!!!

Today, our own WDF's Steve Herrera showed up and put on a suit. 

I think he liked it, and he has some talent folks :-$ :-$ :-$ Don't tell anyone, as I am gonna keep him for our little group. LOL

We have Federico Melo coming into town today, and hopefully he can give Steve some good pointers on catching dogs this Wed.


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## Howard Gaines III (Dec 26, 2007)

Jeff Oehlsen;122628... hopefully he can give Steve [B said:


> some good pointers on catching dogs [/B]this Wed.


Two pointers from here:
1. CASH in lieu of beer, lots of it.
2. Stay on your feet!


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## Jeff Oehlsen (Apr 7, 2006)

Here is a video in french subtitles for all those that want to see the techniques.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d_54kJ3EeNA&feature=related


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## Stephanie O'Brien (Sep 11, 2007)

That's a great video Jeff, thanks for posting it. It gives people a peek into the importance of technique in French ringsport and just how much these ring dogs understand and have been through trainingwise. 
This video is good for new decoys to watch so that they understand there is much more to it than just safely catching a dog. 
Below is a link to another video showing a recent NARA level 1 decoy selection. Its gives an idea of how hard these guys work to get certified.....with a little humor thrown in of course  We appreciate our decoys! 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s8GIHiRpp2I


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## Ron Skinner (May 28, 2009)

Hey Jeff,

That's a great video! I think it is a good one for young decoys and "old timers" like me as well. I have seen just about every one of the techniques shown in the "interdite" section in trials here in southern California by decoys from here and from France.

As far as attracting more young decoys, I don't have the answer to that. I go to France and Belgium a couple times a year and I hear the same complaints/comments there...no young people are interested in becoming decoys, not enough young people in the dog sports in general, etc.

Just some food for thought...How much money do most club members spend on their dogs?, their trials? And then how much money do they spend on a decoy? We have to remember that young decoys, because they are young, don't have much money and everything about becoming a good decoy costs a LOT of money. I think it's up to the clubs to try to bring in people that can teach a good prospective decoy as often as possible.


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## Andy Larrimore (Jan 8, 2008)

Very good video :smile:


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## Jerry Lyda (Apr 4, 2006)

I agree, Very Nice.


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## Jennifer Coulter (Sep 18, 2007)

Thought I was going to get to see someone puke in the last vid:twisted: 

The good decoys make it look so simple, it is easy to take the work they do for granted as a spectator.


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## Ted Efthymiadis (Apr 3, 2009)

Jeff Oehlsen said:


> ..............may be 1 closer!!!!
> 
> Today, our own WDF's Steve Herrera showed up and put on a suit.
> 
> ...


I really wish I had someone to learn from every here on the eastcoast of Canada.... I'm the only one willing to decoy, send some guys over Jeff.
We have kick ass lobster, I'll make sure they are fed.


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## charles Turner (Mar 2, 2009)

*Carlos Rojas*

A special thanks to Carlos Rojas for being extremley patient with me on selecting my female puppy, you were a true professional, and I appreciate it, I brought home a super nice pup with tons of drive and rock solid nerves.


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## Mike Scheiber (Feb 17, 2008)

Ron Skinner said:


> . I think it's up to the clubs to try to bring in people that can teach a good prospective decoy as often as possible.


Our club has been doing this for years sending them off to helper camps seminars what ever it takes mentoring only for them to lose interest, family issues, run off chasing poon quitting and starting there own clubs and charging money and a dozen other reasions I have dug into my own pocket a couple of times for helpers attend a teaching seminars. Iin a couple of weeks Marina and my self are bringing back Greg Doud this is going to cost us some dough one of our newer club helper is unemployed and broke and I need him to see what we are working on and how to apply it. 
I or we will have to cover his fee so he can learn I need him to see and participate in these sessions so he can help train my dog. 
F&%K now wile I'm typing I'm thinking is this fair to the other newer helper that I cover the other guys fee and not his F$$K I might as well F$$King pay his to.
It's insane the amount of time and money thought I spend on Schutzhund. Shit I bet if I put this much effort into becoming a millionaire I would be a millionaire:-s


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## Jeff Oehlsen (Apr 7, 2006)

The going off and charging money thing is getting really popular. ****ers. LOL


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## Mike Scheiber (Feb 17, 2008)

Jeff Oehlsen said:


> The going off and charging money thing is getting really popular. ****ers. LOL


I really get a kick out of some of these arm boys that still smell like piss that have some athletic skills but have no clue. Never titled a dog maybe worked some with a big name trainer as a arm boy or did some work on a big name dog and now think they should get 20 bucks a round for there work and fuked up advice.
I really wouldn't/don't have a problem paying a outside the club guy if that is all he is doing is working dogs and has skill and will take direction. 
However we have several national and international level members that a outside the club guy could benefit from if he wanted some coaching or even just sitting and watching them train.That in itself is worth working a handful of dogs for if he wanted some of what they have. 
Money is starting to screw things up. 
When I joined our club we had 5 helpers all were members none ever got payed or eaven expected to get payed thank you was enough.


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## Calvin Ledford (Apr 15, 2009)

Anyone have a suggestion for a good decoy (suit) training DVD? I'm a schutzhund helper with a good foundation on starting and green dogs and am fairly fluent in the trial work. I would like to look into suitwork and don't know where to get started. 

-Calvin


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## Jeff Oehlsen (Apr 7, 2006)

Is there a ring club near you ??? I do not know of any DVD's, and the video I posted I saw years ago. THere was "Dancing with dogs" which was not a horrible attempt, but missing many many things.

Logistically, it is a nightmare. LOL To "tell" people how to keep a dog from ripping big holes in their flesh is a nightmare. I can show it in 25 seconds, but writing it ?? I have to delete, and delete, and it still does not convey what I want to say very well. 

Experience, and hands on training is the best way to go. Even if I COULD tell you in a fashion that makes sense to me, new people tend to freeze up a bit the first X amount of times, either out of fear, or like Steve, he did not move at first, but the look on his face was, "HOW COOL IS THAT ???"

I still have these moments when the dog does exactly the right thing, and I get a little stuck, just thinking dumb shit like "HOW COOL IS THAT" LOL

So that is a long version of try and find a club that you can go and watch and see if they will work with you. : )


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## Calvin Ledford (Apr 15, 2009)

How about the video that Canine Training Systems sells? It is more LE related - but at this point I just want to understand the basics of suitwork. 

-Calvin


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## Jeff Oehlsen (Apr 7, 2006)

I have not seen that video. The one I posted, if you could get someone to drag a dog in is very good in showing FR technique. If you watch the trials you can see where they are showing the dog that they are going to do one of those basics, and then they switch it at the last moment to try and get the esquive.


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## Howard Gaines III (Dec 26, 2007)

Calvin Ledford said:


> How about the video that Canine Training Systems sells? It is more LE related - but at this point I just want to understand the basics of suitwork.
> 
> -Calvin


I've seen some of their stuff and IMO it is all just junk. Same stuff different package!!!!!!!!


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## Guest (Jun 1, 2009)

I'm a newb in NY that has a solid dog training background and is willing to take instruction! I'm gonna look for the dancing with dogs dvd and see what i can learn from it.


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## Geoff Empey (Jan 8, 2008)

Calvin Ledford said:


> Anyone have a suggestion for a good decoy (suit) training DVD? I'm a schutzhund helper with a good foundation on starting and green dogs and am fairly fluent in the trial work. I would like to look into suitwork and don't know where to get started.
> 
> -Calvin


Hey Calvin, 

As Jeff said there is no real video that shows what you need to do. The Video with Marc Villain is awesome to show some more advanced techniques, but it doesn't really show work with a green dog.

Basically if you have a good foundation for starting green dogs in SchH it is really not that different in principle. You play with the big tug and get the dog working in prey at first. Keep it fun and with no pressure at first.

The big difference is the way you introduce the Jambiere or leg sleeve. A lot of SchH guys square up with the dogs and will put pressure on the dog with the eyes and then raise the stick to call the dog to the arm sleeve. Ring you use the stick to call the dog to the jambiere there is no squaring up to the dog and using the eyes as you would do in SchH and that is the biggest mistake a SchH decoy does when they try to crossover to Ringsport as well as using to much stick or using a whip to put a dog into defense. 

The best video I've seen with this type of technique was done by a fellow WDF member Michele Kutelis and her young Malinois Zh'Akm. The decoy is Adrian Centeno in the vid and in my opinion one of the most talented training decoys in North America today .. his work is top notch. Check it out. 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cr8loSQWES0&feature=channel_page

In the vid you see Adrian call the dog to the jambiere with the stick. No squaring up with the dog with the eyes until he slips the sleeve and then it is to release the jambiere as the reward. In the 2nd attack you see them using a static line or a bungee and Adrian using the space to let the dog get the bite and win. 

Beautiful work I must say by Adrian for a green dog. That's the way it should be done.

Oh yeah and here is my own dog working with the tug and we transitioned to the suit during this session for the first time. Hope this helps ...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GbnKmALV_o4


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