# Raw diets for puppies



## Kayla Barth (Apr 18, 2009)

I am willing to admit that I am new to the raw diet. My perivous dogs were all feed cheap kibble and table scraps and would scrounge around our burn pit. I know what you all are thinking but it wasnt my choice....was still in high school and it was my parents decision. 
I want to the best for my puppy that I will be getting in a few weeks. I have spent countless hours researching and have a pretty good idea on how to go about it. I would just like to hear others first hand accounts on feeding puppies the raw way and what your diets look like. BTW I read the prey model feeding thread..all 23 pages. lol quite interesting to say the least.
Thanks again

Kayla in hot ft. bragg:smile:


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## Connie Sutherland (Mar 27, 2006)

What book, if any, do you have about raw feeding? What web sites (specific to raw feeding) have you read?

I ask to get a point of reference for where you need to be started.

I agree with others here (not unanimous) that feeding raw to puppies takes care and some beforehand learning. The puppy cannot usually instinctively correct owner error in the woods or the barn, and growing bodies need what they need (calcium springs to mind).


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## Meena Moitra (Jul 11, 2008)

kayla,
I am raising 2nd pup (age 9 months) on raw food. began feeding raw in 2000. read Dr. Ian Billinghurst's books, Give Your Dog a Bone and his book on raising pups on B.A.R.F. it isn't that hard. everything you need is at the grocery store already. If you cook from scratch, half your battle is met. A lot of your throw away scraps go to the dog. Buy a whole chicken? The back, neck, gizzards are there, so is the wing tip... Buy eggs? throw a raw one in the food bowl. Make oatmeal for breakfast? Give the pup some extra. Have brown icky bananas? Smoosh them with a fork and give to pup. Buy beets? Chop the tops and blanch then for the pup. Tough asparagus stems? Same thing. Old sprouted potato, bake it, smash it with a chicken liver. Stinky hamburger you forgot about? Give it to the pup. Just do it!


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## Connie Sutherland (Mar 27, 2006)

Scraps are great, BUT.

_Read something_. If you want links, I'll provide them. I am seeing too many instances on three different websites of people giving growing puppies random diets with nowhere near enough calcium (digestible bones) -- two who were giving no calcium whatsoever to puppies with developing teeth and growing skeletons.

Meena is very wisely feeding backs and necks. 

But far too many people would take away from this the idea that any meat scraps would work. They will not.

The most critical ratio in a raw canid diet is the calcium-phosphorous ratio. This means (pretty much) bone-to-meat. There are some other important items as well, but a growing puppy getting an all-meat diet with no calcium has no chance at all to grow either his skeleton or his teeth properly. 

Calcium-phosphorous sounds all technical, but what it boils down to is feeding the dead small prey meat the way it came. The bones in a whole small prey animal like a rabbit or a chicken happen to be the bones that are needed by the dog to balance the meat that comes on that small prey animal. If you need or want to stray from giving the whole thing (over time) and feed, say, chicken backs along with some other muscle meat, then you have to devise a diet that replicates that appropriate ratio.

Luckily, others have done the work. You can see pictures of a good puppy diet, and you can read day-by-day suggestions.

I strongly urge that anyone wanting to feed a growing puppy a raw home-prepared diet learn how first.

I used to be a little more casual about it (having all adults myself) until the results of the idiotic all-meat diets some people were feeding puppies started to show up on nutrition sites.

And I want to add that I am a very strong proponent of fresh raw diets for dogs. VERY.


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## Carol Boche (May 13, 2007)

One thing that I do for puppies since I still get nervous about not getting everything in there (and I have been feeding raw for a few years now) is get a box of The Honest Kitchen dog food (grain free variety) and feed that as a meal a few times a week or make a gravy substance out of it and pour over their meals. 

I feel a lot more confident with pups and young dogs (til about 9 mos) doing it this way.


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## Connie Sutherland (Mar 27, 2006)

Carol Boche said:


> One thing that I do for puppies since I still get nervous about not getting everything in there (and I have been feeding raw for a few years now) is get a box of The Honest Kitchen dog food (grain free variety) and feed that as a meal a few times a week or make a gravy substance out of it and pour over their meals.
> 
> I feel a lot more confident with pups and young dogs (til about 9 mos) doing it this way.


I like THK too. I do what Carol mentioned: I make a thin version of it as a "gravy" to pour over RMBs sometimes as a form of variety for my adult dogs.


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## Kayla Barth (Apr 18, 2009)

I agree with you Connie. That’s why I came here to ask this question to ensure that I don’t leave anything out. Here are some of the websites that I have checked out. 

www.*barf*world.com www.*raw*learning.com www.*raw*fed*dogs*.net *lee*r*burg*.com/*feeding*a*raw*diet 

These are the ones that I have been to the most. I have heard different things about no plant matter yes to fruits and veggies, and was wondering if there was any type of consensus on that. Ok when working out the percentages for bone to meat does organ meat fall into the percentage of meat or is that a fraction of the diet that is separate? I have access to whole rabbits and small birds and in the fall I have access to deer parts as well. 

On the flip side, if I were to go with a kibble for the first couple of years or so what type would yall suggest? I am getting a GSD from T. Floyd. Thanks again 

Kayla


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## Jason Sidener (Nov 8, 2006)

> I want to the best for my puppy that I will be getting in a few weeks



I have a question. 

Do you believe the raw diet is what is best?


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## Kayla Barth (Apr 18, 2009)

I feel that if I feed my dog the same quality food that I would eat than it would be presumably be better then all the crazy things that are put in to kibble. I will admit that all the pet food recalls have me a little skeptical of the process that the food goes through. JMO

kayla


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## kristin tresidder (Oct 23, 2008)

if you're in ft bragg, you can contact these people: http://blueridgebeef.com/ to find a distributor near you. they offer a pre-made "puppy mix" that i have used in the past and been pleased with. i also use them for my organ meat. (natural mix) 

by 8 weeks, (which is when i'd assume you're getting your pup) my pups were getting through meaty chicken 1/4s with no problem, so the ground up food, which is more expensive, may not be necessary, although some are more comfortable with it for pups. when they first got 1/4s, i would smash the "knuckles" to make them a bit easier to get through - but that quickly went out the window. so, at 8 weeks, my pups ate mostly meaty chicken 1/4s supplemented with that natural mix each meal for organs, and then sometimes i fed them the premade rolls of beef & bone or even the puppy mix for a while. i also supplemented the pups (and my adults) with this: http://www.thewholisticpet.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=product.display&Product_ID=542&ParentCat=40 salmon oil, vitamin e. they somtimes got yougurt, and sometimes bananas, apples, carrots etc occasionally for variety - the apples and carrots mostly because they all like them - not because it's a food they need.

oh yeah - and i halved the 1/4s and made 1 into two separate meals because my young pups eat 2x per day....


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## Carol Boche (May 13, 2007)

IF you are going to try kibble....and since you asked as well....here are a few I like:

Innova
Innova Evo
Chicken Soup
Orijen
Solid Gold
Wellness Core
Canidae
Califonia Natural

I use a few of these for the dogs that are not on raw, when I travel really long distances and when I forget to take meat out or am running low. 

There are a few others that I am sure will get mentioned. 

The one thing I stay away from is the "puppy" formulas. I might feed it until they are 5 mos, but then go to the adult formulas. I think that the puppy formulas are kind of a gimmick and you really don't need to feed it for long.


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## Connie Sutherland (Mar 27, 2006)

Kayla Barth said:


> Ok when working out the percentages for bone to meat does organ meat fall into the percentage of meat or is that a fraction of the diet that is separate?


Organ meat is a separately-figured 5 to 10% of the diet.

I think that both of those sites are good. I think that the NJ Boxer site is good, too.

If I were you, I would read the "Natural Feeding" forum on the Leerburg board, because of the amount of detail that you will find, and I would get a (at least one) book.

There are a couple of books that are under $20, on LB as well as Amazon. 

This board has addressed the produce question in enormous detail, and so has the LB forum. 

You're really doing yourself a disservice to just rely on the answers to one produce question here when a search will yield pages of produce discussion (green tripe, low-cellulose produce, low-sugar fruits, and so on).


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## Connie Sutherland (Mar 27, 2006)

PS

My own answer to the produce question is an absolute yes, despite the fact that it's a small part of the diet. Organ meat is a small part, too, but I would never leave it out.


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## Kayla Barth (Apr 18, 2009)

I picked up the book "Grow your pups with bones" by Dr. Billinghurst. Thanks for all your help.

Connie- I took ur suggestion and checked out the Leerburg forum as well.  

Kayla


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## Nick Bolton (May 1, 2009)

Raw Diet. If I could guarantee the quality of the slaughter house meat (not for human consumption) in the Ukraine my BRT would be fed a raw diet of 

Breakfast; Milupa, SMA GOLD or equivalent 

Main Meals broken down throughout the day for pups 

Raw Beef mince 
Brown whole-meal Bread 
Cooked puree vegetables (mixed assortment) 

BIG Raw knuckle bone once a week to clean teeth etc 

I also think its a good idea to add the Holistic additive which kristin recommended. 

I fed all my Grey hounds and Lurchers a raw diet and I never had any health issues as I did on ready mixes, However this was 10 years ago and now ready mixes seem more advanced. I now feed my BRT Eagle pack Holistic Giant Puppy www.eaglepack.com/ and he seems to enjoy it and is developing very well. 

I too was very cautious of the recalls of certain Dried foods. I checked for Eagle recalls of which NONE where listed. 

Hope this helps, 

Nick


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## Nick Bolton (May 1, 2009)

this may be of help;

www.black-russian-terrier.ca/israel-terrier-club/ste12.htm

regards, 

nick


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