# Interesting video



## Jeff Oehlsen (Apr 7, 2006)

Not dog related, but you gotta take a break sometime.

http://www.hulu.com/watch/127572/fight-science-special-ops


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## Carol Boche (May 13, 2007)

I have this recorded, just haven't watched it yet.....looks like a good one though....


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## Bob Scott (Mar 30, 2006)

Cool program. I've been following it on the Nat Geo channel.


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## Amy Swaby (Jul 16, 2008)

Farking hulu and it's proxy detection


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## Harry Keely (Aug 26, 2009)

I only watched the ice one, pretty amazing what the human body can do. Good video Jeff thanks.


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## bao qu (Jan 23, 2010)

Very interesting.

There's a also a short one on dog
http://www.hulu.com/watch/127565/fight-science-k-9-super-cop


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## Daryl Ehret (Apr 4, 2006)

Carol Boche said:


> I have this recorded, just haven't watched it yet.....looks like a good one though....


I redorded those too, a couple years ago.

On the dog one it'd be kind of cool, standardly outfitting the dog with the vid cams, and attach a remote-triggered taser to them in the event the suspect attacks.


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## Daryl Ehret (Apr 4, 2006)

Harry Keely said:


> I only watched the ice one, pretty amazing what the human body can do. Good video Jeff thanks.


The martial arts one demonstrating the ninja's center of balance on the foot pedestals was cool, and the MMA fighter one demonstrated Randy Cotoure's off the chart ability to control his cortisol levels, by shifting muscle strain for even pressure on a hold without ever becoming fatigued.


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## Daniel Audet (Jun 8, 2009)

The reason he lasted so long because his core was out of the water. If he was up to his neck in real ice water he wouldn't last 4 minutes. 

At the 2 minute mark he wouldn't have even been able to complete a full sentence if the water was indeed in the 30s. 

They also added ice to warm water. If they had chilled the water and then added ice it would have been a lot different too.

I used to be a white water kayaker and have ended up in water that was in the mid to high 30's. In a wet suit( as opposed to dry suit) you can last 15 minutes or more. Without it not even 4 minutes. 

The Nazis killed a few people with similar experiments during the second World War.

Fight Science is a cool show but there is a lot of nonsense mixed in.


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## Robert E Lee (Dec 16, 2009)

Daniel, I know being a kayaker and being a Navy Seal is pretty close to the same thing, but couple of things I think you missed .They had a thermometer in the water so the temperature would be the same whether they started with warm water or cold water. They said if Im not mistaken the water was 55 degrees and they added ice to get it down to 50. he had 80 % of his body submerged. They had scientists there measuring all the data.I think your just one of those people who doesnt ever do anything themselves yet picks apart and downplays what others with more ability and passion do on a daily basis.Sorry to be harsh but this reminds me of an old saying we had in my unit. 
" People who say something is impossible should get out of the way of the people who are doing it"


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## Jeff Oehlsen (Apr 7, 2006)

I don't want to sit in water like that at all. They also had readings from the probe they put through his nose.


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## mike suttle (Feb 19, 2008)

robert e lee said:


> " people who say something is impossible should get out of the way of the people who are doing it"


this is the quote of the day...........this is great!=d>=d>=d>


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## Harry Keely (Aug 26, 2009)

Daryl Ehret said:


> The martial arts one demonstrating the ninja's center of balance on the foot pedestals was cool, and the MMA fighter one demonstrated Randy Cotoure's off the chart ability to control his cortisol levels, by shifting muscle strain for even pressure on a hold without ever becoming fatigued.


Thanks Daryl will probally watch it here shortly, need a break from the BS and drama.


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## Rick Cadez Jr. (Dec 1, 2009)

Robert E Lee said:


> Daniel, I know being a kayaker and being a Navy Seal is pretty close to the same thing, but couple of things I think you missed .They had a thermometer in the water so the temperature would be the same whether they started with warm water or cold water. They said if Im not mistaken the water was 55 degrees and they added ice to get it down to 50. he had 80 % of his body submerged. They had scientists there measuring all the data.I think your just one of those people who doesnt ever do anything themselves yet picks apart and downplays what others with more ability and passion do on a daily basis.Sorry to be harsh but this reminds me of an old saying we had in my unit.
> " People who say something is impossible should get out of the way of the people who are doing it"


 
Wait Kayaker's dont have to complete B.U.D.S training before they go out on the water ? Stupid me I also thought kayaking was what Seals chose to do on their down time. lol


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## Chris McDonald (May 29, 2008)

Daniel Audet said:


> The reason he lasted so long because his core was out of the water. If he was up to his neck in real ice water he wouldn't last 4 minutes.
> 
> At the 2 minute mark he wouldn't have even been able to complete a full sentence if the water was indeed in the 30s.
> 
> ...


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## Chris McDonald (May 29, 2008)

offa that did not cut and past like a chart

http://www.seagrant.umn.edu/coastal_communities/hypothermia#time


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## Daniel Audet (Jun 8, 2009)

I missed the part that water was only 55 degrees. My mistake, I am sorry. I was under the impression that they were suggesting the water was ICE cold. In other words in the 30s. I have been submerged in water 30-40F. Your teeth chatter uncontrollably during the first 2 minutes. 

I certainly believe it is possible if the water was in the 50's. I have voluntarily gone swimming in water in the high 50's. (57-58F)

I am critical of that show because I have seen a lot of nonsense. For instance in the one show they demonstrate how civilians can defend themselves. A lot of these tactics would assume that the attacker is going to freeze or do something a person with no experience would. 

For instance, they demonstrate the front joke. Yes, we are all familiar with all those escape tactics. If I was going to choke from the front, I would keep driving forward and head butt to the nose and slip my right leg behind theirs to throw them to the ground. 

If the person was going to do the spin move, I would release and put the sang. strangulation on from the rear which would render them out in 4 seconds. 

They give another demonstration where the person is kicking to the knee. Again that assumes your attacker is going to remain perfectly still. I personally have kicked to the shin in order to step on the person's foot to push them backwards. That works. The thing is to pinpoint a concentrated blow, it's going to take years of practice. 

I believe the attempt was to demonstrate techniques that could be used in a do or die situation. The problem is, with shows like the Dog Whisperer (I am a Cesar fan) or Fight Science, there are too many fools that believe they can do things without proper training and practice. The people that do these sort of bad things (attack others) most likely have many years of practice.

--Dan


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## Daniel Audet (Jun 8, 2009)

I am assuming that where I head that most people die in 4 minutes is because they no longer can swim so they drown. My own experience in the 30-something degree water was that you could feel limbs being shut off like a light switch after a minute or so. My own experience was that after getting out of the water, everything was spinning also. This may have been from exhaustion from swimming in white water. 

I also used to teach people when they were in that situation, to grab onto someone's boat or anything else they can find to pull part of their upper body out of the water. (as the Seal did ...not in water up to neck) If you get your heart / lung area partially out of the water you are going to be able to survive a lot longer. 

A wet suit improves things exponentially. It isn't the same experience at all. I had the same experience with a wet suit on and never hit the point of the extreme teeth chattering. That experience involved swimming out of a hydraulic in Canada, in December. There was several inches of snow on the ground. 

"_ people who say something is impossible should get out of the way of the people who are doing it_"

I do have experience with what I am talking about. 

--Dan


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## Chris McDonald (May 29, 2008)

Anyone else ever get the feeling that people are on here because they can’t get anyone to listen to them in person?


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## Daniel Audet (Jun 8, 2009)

Tell you what; if you have some military friends in the Charlotte NC area. I will be more than happy to do a test / experiment. 

I will get in Lake Norman as the control subject with one of your military buddies. (very cold this time of year) We can see if Human Physiology changes much due to training. 

We will measure water temperature and record a video of myself and a person of your choosing to see if there is any difference. 

So are you going to get out of the way?

--Daniel Audet
704 948 7204


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## Daniel Audet (Jun 8, 2009)

Your comment about getting people to listen to them in person.

I noticed that you have: Posts: 1,324 

Some have a greater need than others.


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## Chris McDonald (May 29, 2008)

Daniel Audet said:


> Your comment about getting people to listen to them in person.
> 
> I noticed that you have: Posts: 1,324
> 
> Some have a greater need than others.


Exactly, what I’m getting at. I already asked if I could start over from 0 again


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## Daniel Audet (Jun 8, 2009)

There is hope; you at least have a sense of humor. ;-)

--Dan


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## Chris McDonald (May 29, 2008)

Daniel Audet said:


> There is hope; you at least have a sense of humor. ;-)
> 
> --Dan


 
Even that depends who you ask !


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## Daniel Audet (Jun 8, 2009)

This would have been a much better test. 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oCtcD2F4C2k


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## Dennis Jones (Oct 21, 2009)

I've seen BUDS/UDT teams in action and was passively involved in one of thier exercises, if one of them told me they could choke out a polar bear under an ice flow I would believe them


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## Robert E Lee (Dec 16, 2009)

:---)They documented that test pretty well Daniel, just set up your own test and tape it and put it on youtube to prove there is no difference in a kayaker and a SEAL. Set up a tank submerge yourself up to your mid chest as he did for45 minutes then climb a wall run a z pattern balance beam crawl under a cargo net then shoot one of three opponents after determining which has the weapon in low light. If you film it at less than 23 seconds as the SEAl did. I will issue a public apology for my comments and will forever know that KAYAKERS rule and SEALs drool. But after going through training with those guys i also agree if they tell me they can do it I would bet the farm.


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## Daniel Audet (Jun 8, 2009)

Robert E Lee said:


> :---)They documented that test pretty well Daniel, just set up your own test and tape it and put it on youtube to prove there is no difference in a kayaker and a SEAL. Set up a tank submerge yourself up to your mid chest as he did for45 minutes then climb a wall run a z pattern balance beam crawl under a cargo net then shoot one of three opponents after determining which has the weapon in low light. If you film it at less than 23 seconds as the SEAl did. I will issue a public apology for my comments and will forever know that KAYAKERS rule and SEALs drool. But after going through training with those guys i also agree if they tell me they can do it I would bet the farm.


"no difference in a kayaker"

Please show me where I made this claim.

I never made this claim. I made initial claims that he could not be in water that was ICE cold, meaning water in the 30s. I didn't hear the part about the 50F water. Fight Science is notorious for their exaggeration.

I never doubted that the gentlemen in question was in 50 something degree water. As I said previously I voluntarily went swimming in water in the high 50's as a teenager. 

"They documented that test pretty well Daniel"

If you believe everything you see on TV, maybe you should order the book on "Killer Chi". You could send a pulse down the internet and knock me out of my chair. 

My challenge is still open. I have provided my phone number. Put up or shut up.


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## Robert E Lee (Dec 16, 2009)

I believe the " put up or shut up " would be in your court there sport. The show is documented and now all you have to do is recreate it so you can put up or shut up.Your initial post cast doubts on whether this was accurate or not and one of your other posts cast doubts about if his training would alter his physical abilities. As far as my kayak comments you may be right you never said you were the same as a SEAL. But so Im clear what have you ever done to make you an expert on Spec ops personell and their abilities. I stand by one of my original posts I doubt you have ever done much and just take pot shots at others that have skills and abilities far superior to anything you will ever do. I believe the 
SEAL on that show did everything they said and could do other things almost super human. i have seen them in action and have the utmost respect for them. I dont have to believe everything I see on T.V. I have gotten out and done them. BTW the show was not about how long you can survive in cold water it was about can training and sheer will push you to complete a mission even when subjected to adverse cold or heat.I would dare say that if you forget the cold water you couldnt come close to his time. This isnt personal to you Daniel I just disagree with you and your opinions.


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## Daniel Audet (Jun 8, 2009)

I wasn't questioning what was done could be accomplished in 50 degree water. One hour in 35 degree water, I would question it. (definitely)(regardless of who you are)

One of the big reasons I question every thing that fight science claims, is that if you listened to them about the force of their martial artists; it is highly exaggerated also. If what they said were true one would constantly see broken bones and even death in MMA. I have watched a lot of MMA. I have seen a broken bone once. Cung Lee broke Frank Shamrocks arm with a kick. That is one instance after seeing serveral dozen matches. Cung Lee is a superman when you consider his speed and power; yet he has not killed anyone.

Yes humans can improve anything that can be done with training. However no amount of training will change physics. One can't really fly or bend steel with their mind regardless of how many hours of practice.

My experience with seeing people in water in the 30s resembles this. 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MUwwRpuCLgI

Ok with proper training, say you could double the amount of time. It is still a far cry from an hour. 

So how did I make the assumption that the water was in the 30's. 

They made DRAMATIC comments several times that the water was ice cold. I fast forwarded through a lot of it after hearing the opening drama. I knew the water wasn't 30F. The experience also would have been different if he was in water up to his neck. (1/2 core was out of water) Again not discrediting Seals, just speaking of physics which applies to all humans.

Ice Cold means cold as ice. 

The temperature of ice is typically 32F. Please tell me if I am wrong on that.

Again intent was not to discredit Navy Seals but comment on yet another show trying to bend the truth with drama. You have to admit they oooh and ahhhh, a hell of lot for scientists. 

I watch this show as I do Dog Whisperer too. I just draw the line between TV fantasy and reality.(key word is..entertainment) Again I pity any woman that thinks she can defend herself after watching Fight Science's self defense show. The show wasn't almost implying, hey the average person can do this. Yes...after how many years of practice.

Again I will stick by my word, I offer myself as the average Joe, "has been, "never was" control subject so there can be some comparison done against military personnel. They might last longer than I do but guess what they will shiver and shake just the same. (physics / human anatomy) 

I would have not been as critical of the show if they had grabbed some college athlete as a control subject to do a comparison, for this test or any other.

--Dan


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## Bob Scott (Mar 30, 2006)

Cmon guys! Isn't this a silly argurment?! 
Everyone know what happens when a guy sits in cold water to long.
Doesn't that go totally against most guy arguments?
It CAN'T be bigger when your sitting in cold water! ;-):-$


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## Jim Nash (Mar 30, 2006)

I'm not saying the guys on the shows aren't badasses and can't do things most people can't . They've proven that over and over again . 

But having been on a reality show I can tell you they(producers/editors) have a way of doing things that exaggerates things on many of those shows . 

Watching my show if I didn't actually live in St Paul and work there I would have thought crime was running rampant there when reality was when they were filming we were enjoying one of the lowest crimerates in decades . 

Look at any of the shows on cable . They have shows on ghosts , monsters , Steven Seagal , Dog the Bounty Hunter (a show about chasing deadends up until the very end of the show where they usually tackle the guy for no reason then give him a cigarette and makeup) . If you broke that show down without the music , arguements and preaching there's not much to it . 

If they didn't exaggerate stuff they wouldn't have a show . Ghosts , monster ?! 

Also double check the "facts" put out on most shows . They aren't required to have their facts correct . There's alot of flawed information being put out on TV for the sake of entertainment . 

It's just my guess but I would bet if you talked to some of the guys featured in the show that is the subject of this discussion they would say some of the stuff was exaggerated . It was still a cool show and those guys were impressive .


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## Robert E Lee (Dec 16, 2009)

OK, Im gonna* zip up * now and leave this one alone.We now return you to your regularly scheduled program.Everyone have good evening.:wink:


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