# Why THOROUGH is IMPORTANT!!!



## Carol Boche (May 13, 2007)

http://www.kndo.com/Global/story.asp?S=8694881&nav=menu484_2_7

A reason never to assume anything......bad day in the press...


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## Howard Knauf (May 10, 2008)

Embarrassing, yes. But things happen. Air support from the start would have been nice though.

I know a cadaver dog handler that was called to look for an alzheimers patient that went missing. They waited about a week before calling. He arrives at the command center, gets his dog out, and the dog has odor as soon as he exits the car. The victim is found in a clump of palmetto bushes about 30 yards from the car. Seems no one thought to look there. It happens.

Howard


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## David Frost (Mar 29, 2006)

I wonder too though, if he was that close and that easy to find, why family members didn't find him. 

DFrost


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## Howard Knauf (May 10, 2008)

He had actually wandered off and was last seen near a wooded area by a resident. The main focus was on a large retention pond and the CC just happen to be set up where the guy apparently laid down to rest. I think he was initially killed by fire ants while he slept so he never moved of course.

Howard


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## Carol Boche (May 13, 2007)

Howard Knauf said:


> Embarrassing, yes. But things happen. Air support from the start would have been nice though.
> 
> I know a cadaver dog handler that was called to look for an alzheimers patient that went missing. They waited about a week before calling. He arrives at the command center, gets his dog out, and the dog has odor as soon as he exits the car. The victim is found in a clump of palmetto bushes about 30 yards from the car. Seems no one thought to look there. It happens.
> 
> Howard


Totally agree that it happens. Sounds like SAR waited even after the first call-out which is bizarre to me. Unless they did not have enough info to constitute deploying. 

I too wondered why family did not find him if he was that close.


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## Howard Knauf (May 10, 2008)

He wasn't close to home. If I remember correctly he was about a half mile away.

Howard


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## Nancy Jocoy (Apr 19, 2006)

You know it is easy to figure out things if you were not there when something went wrong, but sometimes a lot of circumstances can add up to a *miss* - hopefully those experiences are few and far between and cause a lot of learning.


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## Kris Dow (Jun 15, 2008)

Nancy Jocoy said:


> You know it is easy to figure out things if you were not there when something went wrong, but sometimes a lot of circumstances can add up to a *miss* - hopefully those experiences are few and far between and cause a lot of learning.


When these type of problems occur, is there any part of the chain which tends to be the weak link? Reading the article, I wondered if it was a central-command error (or whomever determined the area to be searched, and coordinated who would search where), communication (which I'd kind of point back to central command, since I think they should check and double check to make sure people know where they're supposed to be), or handler and/or dog error (poor training? Misunderstanding of assignment?)

"It depends" is a perfectly valid response, btw. I know there's a lot of stuff going on in these situations.


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## Nancy Jocoy (Apr 19, 2006)

I think one thing I have seen at some searches is the lack of a good planning in the early part of the search [somewhere after the first rush and hasty searches] - after that, some strategic planning and tracking of coverage needs to occur. But it really is chaotic with the news folks showing up, the community wanting to "help", tracking and coordinating your resources, getting more info from the family [often info that is not readily forthcoming but vital - e.g., person has a mental problem, etc.]

Also, I think sometimes people come back and don't accurately report the area they have really covered [not lying just lack of ability to describe where they *have* been]

There is so much that *can* go wrong. Unfortunately sometimes it seems like experience is the best teacher.


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## Howard Knauf (May 10, 2008)

With the advent of GPS units that can track a person's movements, those would be good for every person involved in the search to have so a command center mapping person can know for sure whats beens covered.

Howard


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## Carol Boche (May 13, 2007)

Howard Knauf said:


> With the advent of GPS units that can track a person's movements, those would be good for every person involved in the search to have so a command center mapping person can know for sure whats beens covered.
> 
> Howard


Exactly...that is what we use and actually what is used on most searches.....


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## Nancy Jocoy (Apr 19, 2006)

Howard Knauf said:


> With the advent of GPS units that can track a person's movements, those would be good for every person involved in the search to have so a command center mapping person can know for sure whats beens covered.
> 
> Howard



We keep applying for grants to get standard GPS units that transmit to base. They are expensive. We are volunteers and spend a heck of a lot of money on our own already to train ourselves and our dogs and get to and from searches! I know I sure don't have an extra $600 laying around. Most folks have some kind of handheld but you cannot track in live time like you can with the better units. But folks always do come back to command and are asked to map their coverage.

LE does not typically have them - or if they do, they have one or two and very little training in their use.


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## David Frost (Mar 29, 2006)

"LE does not typically have them - or if they do, they have one or two and very little training in their use."

Every member of our team, 12, has one. We can also call in the lat/longs for the pilots, or they can direct us. 

DFrost


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## Nancy Jocoy (Apr 19, 2006)

I guess I should have said "always" not "typical" - I know the bigger forces do have them but there are a lot of small rural forces out there that do not.

There are also issues of software compatibility - most of the garmin units are compatible with maptech, but some of the others like lowrance may not be - when it comes to downloading tracks and waypoints. Of course there is a lot of other mapping SW out there. But it is hard to me to juggle x different number of brands of GPS units and download info. Waypoints no problem as you can call them in.


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