# Mange



## Lee H Sternberg (Jan 27, 2008)

Does anyone know if hydrocortisone salve will work for mange or do I need to take a trip to the vet?


----------



## Guest (Dec 1, 2008)

Lee H Sternberg said:


> Does anyone know if hydrocortisone salve will work for mange or do I need to take a trip to the vet?


 
DON'T!! It causes it to get worse very quickly. Any type of steroid solution, lotion, liquid, tablet, etc, will make it enflamed even worse and may cause other issues with your dog. 

Depending on the type of Mange you have as their are two types and two courses of action, home remedies sometimes work for one, but NOT the other. 

Hope this helps a bit....


----------



## Jim Domenico (Oct 2, 2009)

All that will do is relieve the itching, it wont "cure" the mange per se. Multiple dips in Lyme Sulfur or Paramite after clipping the affected areas is the best way to go. Dandruff shampoos can also help. Cortisone relieves the itching. Infected sores can be treated with topical antibiotics.


----------



## Guest (Dec 1, 2008)

Jim Domenico said:


> All that will do is relieve the itching, it wont "cure" the mange per se. Multiple dips in Lyme Sulfur or Paramite after clipping the affected areas is the best way to go. Dandruff shampoos can also help. Cortisone relieves the itching. Infected sores can be treated with topical antibiotics.


 
It won't releive the itching it will intensify it, in this case with mange. I agree with lyme sulfr and paramite, however antibiotics will be invloved if serious....


----------



## Anne Vaini (Mar 15, 2007)

Lee,

What is available for vet care down there? Are you pretty much on your own?


----------



## Lee H Sternberg (Jan 27, 2008)

Anne Vaini said:


> Lee,
> 
> What is available for vet care down there? Are you pretty much on your own?


Actually I found the vet care very good for normal run of the mill stuff. If you need any specialty vet care you are in big trouble. I lived in 4 different places where I needed a vet for various reasons. They were fine in all places. They were all concerned (scared) with protection breed dogs just like the typical Costa Rica person. She was running around looking for a muzzle that fit.

The vet that is closest to me here is about a half hour away. She even speaks fairly good English. That is a big plus. I have her card with home phone number for any emergency stuff like scorpion bites if they have a reaction. 

Last month I took my male in for all his annual booster shots except rabies. Rabies are good now for three years in the US. I have not had much experience with her but understand from the locals she is good. The charge with exam was 6,000 colones, less than $12 bucks US.

That brought a smile to my face! :razz:


----------



## Anne Vaini (Mar 15, 2007)

If you can, I'd go with the vet. From what I understand, mange mites are normally on dogs, but don't usually cause a problem - unless the immune system is weakened. So some will try to find why the dog is having the mange issue, while others treat the symptoms. Your dog have gone through a whole lot of changes in the last few months, so I'd go to the vet and get treatment for the symptoms first.


----------



## Lee H Sternberg (Jan 27, 2008)

Anne Vaini said:


> If you can, I'd go with the vet. From what I understand, mange mites are normally on dogs, but don't usually cause a problem - unless the immune system is weakened. So some will try to find why the dog is having the mange issue, while others treat the symptoms. Your dog have gone through a whole lot of changes in the last few months, so I'd go to the vet and get treatment for the symptoms first.


A whole lot of changes is putting mildly, Anne. The thing that has me a bit puzzled is here, they usually get mange in the dry season. The dry season is almost here but it has been raining for days and days. The other strange thing is it is on the very bottom (where the meat is) of one ear. It sure looks like mange but I've always seen it on the dog's body.


----------



## Lee H Sternberg (Jan 27, 2008)

Jody and Jim - Thanks for the help. No more cortisone.


----------



## Lee H Sternberg (Jan 27, 2008)

The only reason I was trying a home remedy was because this is my maniac evil female. She walks into the vet's office, or anywhere else for that matter, ready for a brawl. :evil:


----------



## Don Turnipseed (Oct 8, 2006)

Mange is pretty common in wirld animals such as foxes, coyotes and such. The houndsmen I have always known put used motor oil on the affected area. Works for them.


----------



## Lee H Sternberg (Jan 27, 2008)

Don Turnipseed said:


> Mange is pretty common in wirld animals such as foxes, coyotes and such. The houndsmen I have always known put used motor oil on the affected area. Works for them.


Great tip although I don't know why someone would want to put that on a fox or coyote! \\/:razz:

Thanks!


----------



## Don Turnipseed (Oct 8, 2006)

LOL....I thought about clarifying that after I posted it Lee. Now I see I........ should have. LOL


----------



## Guest (Dec 1, 2008)

Hey Lee, I hate to ask, but are you sure 100% its Mange? Is so what type?


----------



## Maren Bell Jones (Jun 7, 2006)

There are two kinds of mange: demodectic and sarcoptic. Demodex mange is normal flora that for some reason has gotten a toehold into the animal and is usually seen at a fairly young age. Pit bulls and German shepherds are examples of two breeds predisposed to it. Steroids of any sort do NOT help! They are immune suppressive in nature and can actually make it worse since this is caused by an immune deficiency. This is picture of a demodex mite:












Sarcoptic mange (AKA: red mange or scabies) is caused by another species of mite and can be found at just about any age. It's also zoonotic (demodex is not), meaning you can catch it and be just as itchy as your dog. Sharing is caring. ;-) To determine which is which, your vet will need to do a series of skin scrapes. They take the edge of a scalpel blade and carefully scrape the skin and look at the sample under a microscope. This is what sarcoptes mites look like:











It's actually very difficult to catch these guys on skin scrapes. You can do 10 scrapes and only one might find a little critter, but it just takes one. Also, dermatophytosis (AKA: ringworm) can also look like mange and also be zoonotic (not a pretty sight on a child), so I'd get her to a vet for a work up to see what's going on (and hopefully so you don't get anything!). Your vet can help you with treatment depending on what they find out. Pass on the motor oil.


----------



## Lee H Sternberg (Jan 27, 2008)

Jody Butler said:


> Hey Lee, I hate to ask, but are you sure 100% its Mange? Is so what type?


I am not sure but it looks like mange. She is headed to the vet Monday.


----------



## Lee H Sternberg (Jan 27, 2008)

Okay Maren, I guess I will see if this vet is any good. I hope she owns a microscope. She never know here! Maybe she will break out a magnifying glass.


----------



## Don Turnipseed (Oct 8, 2006)

Looks like you need to get a microscope there Lee. Not a big investment. You can probably get everything like slids and such on line. I was looking into microscopes and you can get by with one for about $150. Do stool sample and everything right at home.


----------



## Lee H Sternberg (Jan 27, 2008)

I'm stumped. I decided today that it isn't mange or ringworm. It is expanding rapidly. It is on the inside edge of the lower ear a half inch before it meets the head. The original problem is now a bit swollen and pink. The new area are not and looks like mange. There is no puss in the swollen area.

The whole area is about three quarters of a inch long and three eights of a inch wide. She lost her hair in this area. That's the reason I originally noticed it.

If it wasn't expanding I would guess now on a insect bite. We have lots of critters here.

This whole issue has been going on for about 5 days.


----------



## Connie Sutherland (Mar 27, 2006)

Lee H Sternberg said:


> I'm stumped. I decided today that it isn't mange or ringworm. It is expanding rapidly. It is on the inside edge of the lower ear a half inch before it meets the head. The original problem is now a bit swollen and pink. The new area are not and looks like mange. There is no puss in the swollen area.
> 
> The whole area is about three quarters of a inch long and three eights of a inch wide. She lost her hair in this area. That's the reason I originally noticed it.
> 
> ...


So it's on the ear only?

Like ear mites?


http://www.marvistavet.com/html/body_ear_mites.html

PS
Sorry, I totally missed the ear part, skimming the thread yesterday.


----------



## Lee H Sternberg (Jan 27, 2008)

Connie Sutherland said:


> So it's on the ear only?
> 
> Like ear mites?
> 
> ...


It isn't ear mites Connie. Any other ideas?


----------



## Guest (Dec 1, 2008)

Hey Lee can you post a good picture of it?


----------



## Connie Sutherland (Mar 27, 2006)

Jody Butler said:


> Hey Lee can you post a good picture of it?



That'd be great. Include the ear-edges.


----------



## Connie Sutherland (Mar 27, 2006)

Lee H Sternberg said:


> It isn't ear mites Connie. Any other ideas?




Folliculitis? Chiggers?


----------



## Lee H Sternberg (Jan 27, 2008)

Connie and Jody - I don't know how to post any photos but to the photo gallery so that's where I put them. There are three possibly okay shots.


----------



## Anna Kasho (Jan 16, 2008)

Below the image, where it says BB image code - select the code, copy it, and paste into the message. Should show up as a clickable thumbnail linking to full size pic in the gallery.

Hope that helps. This is one of the pics:



I don't think anyone asked, is it itchy or not? Is it possible for her to be in contact with some kind of chemical irritant, or rubbing it on something? (would explain hair loss?)


----------



## Maren Bell Jones (Jun 7, 2006)

PM sent, but for everyone's edification, here is some information on sarcoptic mange. Not that I can even remotely diagnose this from a picture (nor should I be), but just some general information that may be of help:



> The localization of lesions can be relatively suggestive. *At least at the beginning of the disease they appear on the ear pinnae, particularly on their margins*, the lateral aspects of the elbows and the ventral aspects of the thorax and abdomen. Generalization can occur but even in these cases the dorso-lumbar area seems to be spared....
> 
> DIAGNOSIS
> Diagnosis of scabies is based first on history and clinical aspects (a contagious pruritic ventral papulo-crustous dermatosis). Contagion is sometimes subtle and the source of infection is not clearly identifiable in 50% of cases. A good response to systemic glucorticoid therapy occurs in about 40% of the cases and consequently does not allow the exclusion of scabies. In addition to the lesions and topography described above, the *pinnal-pedal reflex should be looked for: when the ear margin (with or without visible lesions) is rubbed, particularly at the site where the pinna is folded, this triggers an attempt to scratch by the dog's hind leg.* This zone may give a "sandy" feeling when palpated. In the French literature it is called "Henry's zone" after the name of a parasitologist who noticed in the twenties both its oft-infestation of mites and its sensitivity to stimulation. *The pinnal-pedal reflex is only suggestive and not specific: it occurs in about 80% of scabies cases but also in about 20% of other pruritic dermatoses.*


From: http://www.vin.com/proceedings/Proceedings.plx?CID=WSAVA2004&PID=8625&O=Generic

Don, when fecals cost about $20, why on earth you'd mess with purchasing a decent microscope (good student ones at at least $500...don't mess with crappy scopes, trust me) and having all the training, solutions, supplies, parasitology guides, and a centrifuge needed to run fecal floation is beyond me.


----------



## Don Turnipseed (Oct 8, 2006)

Maren Bell Jones said:


> Don, when fecals cost about $20, why on earth you'd mess with purchasing a decent microscope (good student ones at at least $500...don't mess with crappy scopes, trust me) and having all the training, solutions, supplies, parasitology guides, and a centrifuge needed to run fecal floation is beyond me.


The price I mentioned was just an average on the net Maren. There are companies with fully guaranteed scopes for about half price etc etc, that were display models and such. You have to keep in mind, this is not for an actual vet lab...it is for my personal dogs. While I want good quality, I don't require a Rolls Royce. Here is a typical place with prices
http://www.microscopes.com/eppendorf-lab-equipment-centrifuges.html

Bear in mind also, with the "maybe" $20 charge, there is a $35 vet visit per dog. plus a 60 mile trip to the vet. Now multiply that times about 30 to include the puppies. Doesn't seem so out of line to me and look at the driving time and gas I would save. The centifuge is another thing, but $55 per dog has things covered without even considering the milage and time since I can't get more than about 4 dogs to the vets at a time. Another consideration is having my dogs in the waiting room with who know what all the dogs are suffering from that are in there. Seems to me that steralizing the table is a bit after the fact since there is usually a good wait with all the sick dogs in the waiting room.
Besides, I like this kind of stuff. I was thinking about refitting my reloading bench, which is 10' long to doing this instead of reloading. If I decide on this, I can reload everything I will ever need and sell the reloading equipment for considerably more than this equip costs. Let's face it. I have met a ton of vet techs and if the ones I have met can do this, I figure I can do it. So, to go along with your question as to why I would want to, I have to ask, why you decided to become a vet and incurring all the student loans to keep you in hock for years, since you knew there wasn't that much money in being a vet?


----------



## Don Turnipseed (Oct 8, 2006)

PS...Besides, it would give me less time in the winter to be on the net. LOL


----------



## Lee H Sternberg (Jan 27, 2008)

I don't know why but I never asked what the problem might be at the pulperia (convenience store, hangout and bar.They all know a lot about animals here. 

After I got control of her (tight fist over the muzzle) a couple of brave soles immediately said it was (as near as I can determine in Spanish) chiggers. 

They had a spray can of some blue stuff (called "Larvicid" in Spanish) that they went and got and spayed her ear. These people own many horses and cows. 

She lost it and was trying to bite them but got a good dose.

They seemed after one look to know exactly what her problem was.

We will see. They said to give her a second spray tomorro9w.


----------



## Connie Sutherland (Mar 27, 2006)

Don Turnipseed said:


> .... Besides, I like this kind of stuff.



Me too. I don't have any kind of innate talent with scientific equipment like microscopes and stuff, but I do lust after some books I run across, like this great one I saw on dogs' skin diseases that costs about $400. LOL Makes me know that the textbooks alone for vet school would have been beyond my means. 

I do have some of the big vet manuals, but seems like as soon as I save up and get one, there's a new edition! :lol:


----------



## Don Turnipseed (Oct 8, 2006)

Whoa, $500 for a microscope is one thing.....$400 for one book is another whole kettle of fish. I will have to look into that first if I ever decide to go down this road. Can't handle a book that cost that much just for a few items out of it. LOL


----------



## Connie Sutherland (Mar 27, 2006)

Don Turnipseed said:


> Whoa, $500 for a microscope is one thing.....$400 for one book is another whole kettle of fish. I will have to look into that first if I ever decide to go down this road. Can't handle a book that cost that much just for a few items out of it. LOL



I know, huh? Check out this USED book for a chuckle: http://www.workingdogs.com/store/ve...rgamon_Veterinary_Handbook_Series_Vol_11.html


----------



## Gerry Grimwood (Apr 2, 2007)

Lee H Sternberg said:


> They had a spray can of some blue stuff (called "Larvicid" in Spanish) that they went and got and spayed her ear. These people own many horses and cows.


I looked it up and Larvicides are for mosquito control, maybe chiggers are the same family or something.

Lee, I would rather have to deal with large mammals than bugs and shit :lol: Gimme winter any day over that kinda thing.


----------



## Lee H Sternberg (Jan 27, 2008)

Gerry Grimwood said:


> I looked it up and Larvicides are for mosquito control, maybe chiggers are the same family or something.
> 
> Lee, I would rather have to deal with large mammals than bugs and shit :lol: Gimme winter any day over that kinda thing.


Mucho insectos aqui. I really hate scorpions. I gotta look in my shoes and clothes before I put them on. Oddly enough there are no mosquitoes but something they call zancudos. 

Can't have everthing! I have no heating or A/ c bills.


----------

