# This is just Odd



## David Frost (Mar 29, 2006)

Someone sent me these videos. At first I thought it was funny and a bit odd. On second thought, I'm not so sure it isn't a seizure of some sort.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h-0dzKH1Rfs&NR=1 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z2BgjH_CtIA 

DFrost


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## Gillian Schuler (Apr 12, 2008)

Looks like an epileptic fit but I'm not a vet.

I had / have a dog who does this for a few seconds but not for so long and he carries on sleeping afterwards.


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## Carol Boche (May 13, 2007)

Yikes, I could not even watch it the whole way through. Does not look like anything normal, that is for sure. 

Sad that they choose to video it, and hopefully they get the dog checked out. (probably wishful thinking on my part for that)


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## Michelle Reusser (Mar 29, 2008)

Wow, I don't know what to think of that???? It's not normal or like anything I have ever seen. The first 5 seconds maybe but that went on a long time and the dog stood up? Weird.


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## todd pavlus (Apr 30, 2008)

He's on drugs!!! Bad blotter trip


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## David Frost (Mar 29, 2006)

Carol Boche said:


> Sad that they choose to video it, and hopefully they get the dog checked out. (probably wishful thinking on my part for that)


I agree. Problem is, in one of those videos it seemed like the dog's owner was laughing, like it was a joke or something. She speaks to the dog at one point; something to the effect of, did you finally wake up. Sure seems like a problem to me. I've seen dogs have the old, chase the rabbit ( at least that's what I call it) dreams, but nothing that intense. The video where the dog runs into the wall was bad. The one where the dog stands and by the looks of it, has no idea where it is, is really bad. Notice the hackles as well. Something sure isn't right.

DFrost


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## Julie Ann Alvarez (Aug 4, 2007)

That poor dog and idiot owner. It is obviously some kind of seizure/neurological disease. Did you notice the end of the first video after the dog stops barking- that was a seizure for sure.

Disgusting that they think it is funny enough to post it.


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## Carol Boche (May 13, 2007)

David Frost said:


> I agree. Problem is, in one of those videos it seemed like the dog's owner was laughing, like it was a joke or something. She speaks to the dog at one point; something to the effect of, did you finally wake up. Sure seems like a problem to me. I've seen dogs have the old, chase the rabbit ( at least that's what I call it) dreams, but nothing that intense. The video where the dog runs into the wall was bad. The one where the dog stands and by the looks of it, has no idea where it is, is really bad. Notice the hackles as well. Something sure isn't right.
> 
> DFrost


Ugh....I saw none of that (except the hackles up) and it makes me want to cry. 
My dogs have "dreams" but nothing like that.....not even remotely close. 

Is there a way to leave comments on that video, maybe if there were enough comments the owner would get the dog some help????


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## David Frost (Mar 29, 2006)

I dont know if there is a place for comments or not. A friend sent it to me in an email.

DFrost


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## Jared Martin (Jan 22, 2009)

On the youtube comments some guy says it's just fungus on the brain that causes a mild reaction, and that it's still funny.

WTF is wrong with people these days?


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## Tiffany Geisen (Nov 4, 2008)

I agree its definitely some sort of neurological thing. My dogs also do the chase the rabbit dreams and it is nothing like that. I work over nights in an emergency vet clinic and see some pretty nasty seizures (looking pretty similar to what the dog is doing while laying laterally) but the slam into the wall and the ataxic stance is very awkward. I have seen some dogs with meningitis do some funky stuff.


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## Connie Sutherland (Mar 27, 2006)

David Frost said:


> I dont know if there is a place for comments or not. A friend sent it to me in an email.
> 
> DFrost


Yes, you can post, and I did. :-x

Hasn't showed up yet.


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## Kristen Cabe (Mar 27, 2006)

Do dogs run like that with their legs when they have a seizure? I mean, they were moving in exactly the same motion that they would move in if the dog were actually running. All the siezures I've ever seen are quite a bit more jerky and the movements are very uncoordinated. The legs seem to always be stiff, too, in the seizures I've seen.


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## Julie Ann Alvarez (Aug 4, 2007)

Kristen,

Did you watch the entire video? I was thinking the same thing in the first part but then things changed.

In the end it is quite apparent to me. I have had 2 dogs with seizure disorders. A cocker spaniel when I was a kid and an AB about 7 years ago.

I reported the videos as animal abuse to youtube and I sent the person a note. She replied that I am being silly......


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## Terry Fisk (Jul 26, 2007)

Sure looks like a seizure to me. Coccidioidomycosis (aka valley fever) is one fungal infection and can cause seizures.. poor dog to have an owner that make light of his condition :-(


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## Connie Sutherland (Mar 27, 2006)

Kristen Cabe said:


> Do dogs run like that with their legs when they have a seizure? I mean, they were moving in exactly the same motion that they would move in if the dog were actually running. All the siezures I've ever seen are quite a bit more jerky and the movements are very uncoordinated. The legs seem to always be stiff, too, in the seizures I've seen.


Did you see the extended period where the dog was standing, swaying, dazed and disoriented, and the video of crashing into a wall? Not stumbling or walking slowly -- crashing.

I received the same "silly" reply from the person posting it. :sad:


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## Connie Sutherland (Mar 27, 2006)

Terry Fisk said:


> Sure looks like a seizure to me. Coccidioidomycosis (aka valley fever) is one fungal infection and can cause seizures.. poor dog to have an owner that make light of his condition :-(


I'm afraid that many people have one mind-picture of seizures (like a classic grand mal seizure) and do not understand the huge range.


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## Michelle Reusser (Mar 29, 2008)

That's all she can say is your silly? No response like" he has been to the vet, checked out and is OK"? That is really sad. The blank look in that dogs eyes freaked me out when it stood up. She laughed and called the dog a "nerd". I think the owner has issues and doesn't deserve to own and animal or raise kids for that matter.


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## Connie Sutherland (Mar 27, 2006)

Michelle Kehoe said:


> That's all she can say is your silly? No response like" he has been to the vet, checked out and is OK"? That is really sad. The blank look in that dogs eyes freaked me out when it stood up. She laughed and called the dog a "nerd". I think the owner has issues and doesn't deserve to own and animal or raise kids for that matter.


Just "It's just a video. Don't be silly."

And yes, the blank disorientation is what I have seen in dogs suffering from cluster and other seizures.


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## Carol Boche (May 13, 2007)

UGH
I made a public comment and am now getting bombarded with f*****g emails telling me shit like this

help center | e-mail options | report spam 
wuwm has replied to your comment on Bizkit the sleep walking Barking Dog: 

Relax, the dog appears to be having a seizure. It's quite common. 
You can reply back by visiting the comments page. 

AND THIS

help center | e-mail options | report spam 
joshuaslong has replied to your comment on Bizkit the sleep walking Barking Dog: 

Yeah, it would only cost about 50,000 dollars to find a neurological surgeon for dogs. Or maybe she should just have it put to sleep. 
You can reply back by visiting the comments page.


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## Connie Sutherland (Mar 27, 2006)

I made public comments too. I really don't much care what the amused lowlifes have to say back to me. I just hope that enough comments might make a dent (and there are several similar to mine).


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## Kristen Cabe (Mar 27, 2006)

Yes, I watched both videos in their entirety. I was just unsure if the leg movement was part of the seizure, since alll the ones I've ever seen have stiff limbs. I've found several other videos that do show dogs running with their legs during seizures. Maybe we should post video responses of these other dogs so that the person who owns the dog in the video that is the topic of this post can see that it's not just 'sleep walking' or whatever she thinks it is.

This dog shows the same stiff-legged stance w/the swaying head that the dog in the first original posted video does:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rGJiqGldAds



I also couldn't believe the number of 'dog-wallering-on-back' videos that people had posted were seizures. :roll:


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## kristin tresidder (Oct 23, 2008)

Connie Sutherland said:


> Did you see the extended period where the dog was standing, swaying, dazed and disoriented, and the video of crashing into a wall? Not stumbling or walking slowly -- crashing.


unfortunately, cerebellar ataxia is a problem we see in stafs. watching that video reminded me of some of the videos i've watched of ataxic dogs. very sad....
*
*


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## ann schnerre (Aug 24, 2006)

that is absolutely a frickin seizure. to tape it, post it, and act like it's "normal" or "funny" is the height of ignorance, and personally, makes me weep for all the animals that are subjected to this.

i'm glad some days that i'll be dead before "too" much longer if this is how our kids deal with the animals that depend upon them.

i have to add that i was brought up that animals were cared for first-before i had breakfast/supper, the livestock/dogs/etc were fed/milked/etc. i love knowing that the animals in my care are fed/comfortable before i go in to take care of me--they have no-one else to depend upon! and there's really nothng like going in the house AFTER caring for those who depend upon you...

sorry for the rant, but hey--it's how i feel.


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## Connie Sutherland (Mar 27, 2006)

Ann, your post belongs on that video site.


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## todd pavlus (Apr 30, 2008)

ann freier said:


> that is absolutely a frickin seizure. to tape it, post it, and act like it's "normal" or "funny" is the height of ignorance, and personally, makes me weep for all the animals that are subjected to this.
> 
> i'm glad some days that i'll be dead before "too" much longer if this is how our kids deal with the animals that depend upon them.
> 
> ...


Wasn't it Ghandi that said " you can tell the greatness of a nation by the way they treat their animals", the same can probably be said for individual people as well.


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## susan tuck (Mar 28, 2006)

Jared Martin said:


> WTF is wrong with people these days?


My sentiments exactly. How ****ing sad. I posted comments too, but the idiots probably think we are PETA types.


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## Tammy Cohen (Dec 21, 2008)

I hate youtube people. I was reading the comments under the video, it seems like every other post said it looks like a seizure and the following person saying the previous person is an idiot or moron, it's obviously sleepwalking....read the title of the video????
If that was my dog I would definitely have it checked out. If it was actually diagnosed as sleepwalking then it may be amusing. 
Aren't there laws about providing medical care for your pets? Does this fall under that category? I want to save that video, find out where this person lives and send it to their local dog officer! :x 
That is sad.


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## Lou Castle (Apr 4, 2006)

Sure looks like a seizure to me. I've seen the "running ones" and the ones with stiff legs as well. The real clincher for me was the postictal state afterwards. 

Look here


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## Carol Boche (May 13, 2007)

Yeah, not only did I get told to STFU on you tube, I also got private emails telling me how stupid I was through my website as well.....

People are stupid. I feel so sorry for that dog...doesn't even occur to the owner for the dog's entire life to have it checked out and verify if it is an issue or not. 

I'd like to turn her in too......


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## Michelle Reusser (Mar 29, 2008)

Anyone else find their posted comments gone? Bitch, I'd love to choke the shit out of her, till her legs twitched. MAybe I could post it on youtube and we could all have a good laugh...


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## susan tuck (Mar 28, 2006)

Michelle Kehoe said:


> Anyone else find their posted comments gone? Bitch, I'd love to choke the shit out of her, till her legs twitched. MAybe I could post it on youtube and we could all have a good laugh...


Yes mine are gone too and I was very careful not to be my normal bitchy self about it. Guess I shouldn't have bothered to rein myself in after all. Maybe YouTube just thinks we are all a bunch of wet blankets and can't just laugh like everyone else.


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## Michelle Reusser (Mar 29, 2008)

Well it was funny for about 5 seconds until you can see, that ain't normal dog dream stuff. I really hate people, and this is why. Ignorance is bliss I guess for 90% of the general pop.


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## Carol Boche (May 13, 2007)

I added a comment page and these links to my site....if you want to leave a comment that will not be deleted....please feel free. 

I am tired of receiveing curse word filled emails....and have sent messages to you tube and yahoo now. 

I will be going in and canceling both my accounts....which SUCKS

Thanks

Carol


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## susan tuck (Mar 28, 2006)

The other thing you can do on YouTube is "flag" the videos, which I believe gets them reviewed. Probably won't do much good except if enough people flag them, maybe they will take them down.


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## Michelle Reusser (Mar 29, 2008)

Not a single email or PM back to me and I was very harsh. Not many people probably saw my comments though, because bitchface took them right down.


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## Connie Sutherland (Mar 27, 2006)

susan tuck said:


> The other thing you can do on YouTube is "flag" the videos, which I believe gets them reviewed. Probably won't do much good except if enough people flag them, maybe they will take them down.



Thanks. I flagged it.


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## Tom Cawood (Feb 3, 2008)

This is crazy . . . that is definitely a seizure. Feel sorry for the poor dog.


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## Emilio Rodriguez (Jan 16, 2009)

David Frost said:


> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h-0dzKH1Rfs&NR=1
> 
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z2BgjH_CtIA


Interesting vids. I think that dog has a strong propensity for dreaming. The second vid is an indication of that, the impact woke him up. The test would be simple. If in the first video the dog could be snapped out of it by a different stimulus, such as the owner walking over and calling it loudly, then it's just a dream albeit unusually intense. If the dog is having a dream where it's showing aggression as that dog did it may not be wise to touch it, you could get bit. I've seen dogs run and whimper and growl in a dream. I think about whether I should wake them up but decided against it and let it run it's course.

As for standing up while asleep. I saw that today on the street. Some bum was passed out sitting on a bicycle leaning against a post. I didn't stick around to see how long it will take him to fall.


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## Gerry Grimwood (Apr 2, 2007)

Emilio Rodriguez said:


> As for standing up while asleep. I saw that today on the street. Some bum was passed out sitting on a bicycle leaning against a post. I didn't stick around to see how long it will take him to fall.


Maybe he was just baiting you.


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## Alyssa Myracle (Aug 4, 2008)

I had a Boxer that suffered the exact same seizures.

That's NOT a dreaming dog.

Anyone know a good Veterinary Neurologist that they can forward the video to?

Perhaps if a legitimate vet was to tell the owner that NO, your dog is clearly suffering a seizure, they'd realize what's going on.


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## Konnie Hein (Jun 14, 2006)

Maybe you missed this in another thread. Maren did seek the advice of such a person:
http://www.workingdogforum.com/vBulletin/f30/sleep-walking-seizure-dog-10184/index3.html


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## Alyssa Myracle (Aug 4, 2008)

I did miss that. Thanks Konnie.


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## Emilio Rodriguez (Jan 16, 2009)

Haha I knew it and didn't need to be a professor either









> Maren
> Thanks for sending that link. This looks like the disorder called REM without atonia in the veterinary and experimental literature and REM sleep behavioral disorder in human medicine. REM sleep is the phase when we dream and in both animals and humans, brain activity during REM looks just like wakefulness. Motor commands that come from the cortex during that phase of sleep are blocked in the brainstems so that they don't get translated into movements. Animals with the disorder don't have that block so their "dreams" (assuming dogs have the same subjective experiences we do) get translated into movements. Sometimes those movements can be pretty violent and confused with seizures. Notice though that this dog just appears to wake up when he slams into the wall. A dog with a seizure would keep going until the seizure ended. I have some videos of examples of both if you would like to see them sometime.
> {{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}
> Dennis O'Brien DVM PhD
> ...


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## todd pavlus (Apr 30, 2008)

Emilio Rodriguez said:


> Haha I knew it and didn't need to be a professor either


Great, now this dude is a genius when it comes to veterinary medicine. Jack of all trades:-({|=


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## Bob Scott (Mar 30, 2006)

todd pavlus said:


> Great, now this dude is a genius when it comes to veterinary medicine. Jack of all trades:-({|=


Let's not start this crap again! :evil:


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## Connie Sutherland (Mar 27, 2006)

Emilio Rodriguez said:


> Haha I knew it and didn't need to be a professor either


Really? You diagnosed REM without atonia?

That's a disorder where neural mechanisms governing the sleep paralysis of REM are damaged.

I'm pretty sure that the vet responding would say what I (and many, many others) posted on that You Tube "comments" area said: "This dog needs a neuro workup."

The posts were deleted and emails were sent (to me anyway) calling us silly.

A vet tech and a DVM who posted were both deleted too.

Maren, did he see both videos? The one where the end was a looooong period of the dog standing and swaying slightly, dazed and disoriented, looked exactly like the end of some seizures I've seen. But maybe the confusion of waking to find himself in a standing position when he had been asleep is almost as disorienting as the loss of consciousness of a seizure.


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## Emilio Rodriguez (Jan 16, 2009)

I didn't diagnose anything. I said the dog was dreaming and not having seizures. That's all.


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