# can the dutch shepherd breed be saved



## Peter Cavallaro

*Intro:* Hi folks I am doing some research on the dutch shepherd breed and am looking for some expert opinion. I plan to publish the article in both leading vet and breed journals.
*Preamble:* Anecdotal evidence suggests that the GSD breed has now been discredited as a working dog due to genetic afflictions in both health and temperament related issues. Increasingly the mal and more recently the dutch shepherd is seen as the replacement breed for the gsd in the field. This article endeavours to investigate the substantial claims made by breeders of DS dogs as the _new breed_ for field police, military and sport work, with particular focus on the bite sports.
The breed has gained a new and increasing following outside of traditional markets in Holland and particularly listings for new breeders are proliferating at an alarming rate in North America, Australia and the UK. 
A key finding of this remarkable uptake of the breed is that it appeals to the dog owner looking for that “something different” to stand out from the crowd, seemingly regardless of the breeds proven working potential. The dog as _fashion accessory_ syndrome we have all seen in countless trendy breeds as they have come and gone in the past. The downside to this syndrome is it encourages breeders to select for extreme phenotype eg fluffy coats, blue eyes, big chest and heads etc.
*Research Question:* *Is it such, that if it ain’t Dutch, it ain’t much??* 
*Literature Review:* after an extensive review and analysis of the literature the only verifiable data on the DS is as follows;

Eating their own faeces is a genetic trait
Propensity for sullen/guardy possessive behaviour, seemingly genetic
Don’t like to retrieve stuff, seemingly genetic
I am trying to compile verifiable data on the following;

How many Dutch shepherds (percentage wise) actually claim podium spots at major performance trials at the national and international level.
How many of the top contemporary trainers currently own or train a DS for high level sport work of the calibre of Mich. E, Ivan B, Gotf D, Bart B, Nick V, Bern. F………etc.
If not why not???????
This article is only in the earliest conceptual phase, hoping members here particularly expert breeders/trainers eg Chris Jones, Mike Suttle…etc can help focus the direction of the research.
Note; I make no bias or assumption about the breed, in fact I have considered purchasing one. Just trying to put the hype and bs on a rational basis.

Any advice appreciated.


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## Thomas Barriano

What are your qualifications to write such an article?


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## Peter Cavallaro

just a dude whose into hendrix


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## Thomas Barriano

Peter Cavallaro said:


> just a dude whose into hendrix



Based on that answer and your lack of scientific credentials.
I'd suggest that any Dutch Shepherd owner or breeder think long and hard about contributing to your "study".


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## Marta Wajngarten

What??? So you're saying that that Dutchies eat their own poop, hate to retrieve, tend to guard, and are not much of a sport dog because Michael Ellis (a Mal breeder) doesn't own one?? And exactly what physical appearance are the Dutchies being bred for by the band wagon pet people?


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## Peter Cavallaro

guys just trying to get the facts, not trying to meet counterclaim with counterclaim.


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## Jackie Lockard

You realize that any "high caliber" (really, what I mean by this is people who intend to compete at a world level in IPO), cannot use a Dutch Shepherd since there is no national championship?

And why is your opinion that they need saving?


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## Jackie Lockard

Oh, and I've met an overwhelmingly larger percentage of GSDs that ate their own shit, compared to ANY other breed. Where that even factors in is beyond me...


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## Geoff Empey

My Mom's Corgi cross eats the cat food and the horror of it all even licks its own nuts, sad to say that he has no nuts though but he still licks where they used to be. I think it could be genetically related to these gawd awful Dutchies you talk about. He doesn't retrieve either but does chase sheep and tries to organize them but the kicker is Micheal Ellis I don't think owns one either. I dare say it could be the end of this breed as we know it too. The horror of it all.


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## Peter Cavallaro

Jackie Lockard;308690
And why is your opinion that they need saving?[/QUOTE said:


> just figure given history they will follow the same trajectory as every other working breed has done.
> 
> why not stop the destruction before it starts? seems like a noble goal, why the angst?
> 
> can you answer any of the questions or you just going to make up your own.


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## Peter Cavallaro

instead of smoke screens answer the questions, start a save the corgi thread if that's a concern for you, my thread, my questions.

does all the 'tude say something about ds affecionados??




Geoff Empey said:


> My Mom's Corgi cross eats the cat food and the horror of it all even licks its own nuts, sad to say that he has no nuts though but he still licks where they used to be. I think it could be genetically related to these gawd awful Dutchies you talk about. He doesn't retrieve either but does chase sheep and tries to organize them but the kicker is Micheal Ellis I don't think owns one either. I dare say it could be the end of this breed as we know it too. The horror of it all.


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## leslie cassian

_ Eating their own faeces is a genetic trait
Propensity for sullen/guardy possessive behaviour, seemingly genetic
Don’t like to retrieve stuff, seemingly genetic
_

It's genetic if you breed for it.

It would appear that I have a mutant Dutchie, as she does not eat her feces, though she is fond of the cat's.

I can take stuff from her, but I will admit we need more work on the out. She can be a bit pouty at times, but that's not the same as sullen, is it? I just thought it was a girl thing.

I throw a ball and she brings it back to me repeatedly and incessantly. She is picky about her toys and has special favourites. I haven't worked on a formal retrieve yet, and I suspect she will be less fond of that than the chuck-it game I play with her. 

You would have to ask Mike if any of that is genetic.


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## Don Turnipseed

Peter said,


> why not stop the destruction before it starts? seems like a noble goal, why the angst?


The destruction starts when special interest groups start breeding. The GSD is pretty much used up. Another favorite breed was singlded out. Won't be long before it is used up and discarded. Then the dutchies will go down the same path. No different than when the show breeders take a working breed under their wing. Anything bred for peoples amusement rather than bonafide work is the kiss of death for a breed. Why? Because, in real work it goes back to the dog having the tools to actually getting get the job done. No one has the time for a dog that doesn't have the tools. Games and amusement become the trainers world of building drives and confidence that doesn't really exist. Has nothing to do with getting any real job done Peter.....Dogs with no real job are no different than people that don't ever have a real job.


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## Peter Cavallaro

thanks for the data


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## Josh Smith

Don't feed the troll people!


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## Peter Cavallaro

anti-science DS owner???


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## Marta Wajngarten

Peter, for starters GSD has a massive presence in the show ring and as a breed is very highly popular as a pet because the pet GSDs can be very easy going dogs. 

None of that applies to the Dutchies. They are not recognized by either AKC or CKC so the show people have not yet sank their fangs into them. And most Dutchies I know would drive the average pet person mental as they destroyed their home and all possessions. Not exactly a good calling card for other pet owners.


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## Geoff Empey

Peter Cavallaro said:


> instead of smoke screens answer the questions, start a save the corgi thread if that's a concern for you, my thread, my questions.
> 
> does all the 'tude say something about ds affecionados??



From one troll to another ... BOOOOOO! From under my bridge! 

Your asine thread my asine answers so put that in your pipe and keep smoking that electric lettuce Mr Scientist. 

Here is another asine answer for you. 

I have done serious internet research for you and I think I have found why the breed you call Dutchie may not be reproducing well any more. It seems that it is another genetic defect with the breed to go along with poop eating and not retrieving is that they are self neutering. OMG OMG OMG!!! 

I hope this helps your in your noble quest for more research. This is real scientific internet evidence I found it on google it took 0.000036354 seconds so it has to be true! 











God bless you Pete for doing this important work, one day you may get the nobel prize and be known as a trailblazer in your field! You might be able to follow Don Turnipseed to greatness!


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## Peter Cavallaro

man you guys are so mean, smoke screen, character assassination, sarcasm......everything cept the facts.

whys do even bother, yr all just mean.


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## Marta Wajngarten

Geoff Empey said:


> You might be able to follow Don Turnipseed to greatness!


:0 oh no you didn't


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## Shane Woodlief

Wow Pete way to stir it up hahahhahaha.

I will contribute since I own both. There are things I like about both and things I don't like about both. Yes it is hard to find a good GSD but it is only a matter of time before the Mali and Dutchie go the same way. I think the one thing that works in favor of the Dutchie is that it is not registrable and that keeps the stupid - idiotic show dog people away from it.

I do believe that if we are not careful and breeders are not careful the Dutchie will not go the way of the GSD IMO but rather the way of the pit bull. Every thug will have them and breed them.

What I am concerned with right now is that there are people breeding dutchies that should not be breed - I also believe that there are breeders who are breeding that have no concept of what they are breeding for they are just putting brindles together. Look at the number of people breeding them that are advertising everywhere look at facebook. Harry Kelley made a comment a while back that he caught crap for but he was right - They will go down hill it is only a matter of time.

Also I think "strong dog" needs more conversation. There are some who believe that a dog that comes up the leash (with fair correction) to eat your face off is a strong dog. I actually disagree. I actually think it is the oposite. There are some great people out there breeding quality Dutchies do the research and buy form them and tell the others to keep their over hyped crap in their backyard where the breedings took place.

As far as crap eating a GSD will win that contest every time ahhahaha.


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## Peter Cavallaro

Too late man my feelings are hurt, Geoff needs to apologise.


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## Thomas Barriano

Peter C writing "I plan to publish the article in both leading vet and breed journals." is almost as funny as "the Seed" saying
"I know my dales will protect with no training" ;-)


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## Geoff Empey

Peter Cavallaro said:


> man you guys are so mean, smoke screen, character assassination, sarcasm......everything cept the facts.
> 
> whys do even bother, yr all just mean.



It's the truth .. the gawd hernest truth I tell ya! All hail science! :grin: 

I found some more info on the imminent demise for you here. http://lol.escoflip.com/


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## Don Turnipseed

Thomas Barriano said:


> Peter C writing "I plan to publish the article in both leading vet and breed journals." is almost as funny as "the Seed" saying
> "I know my dales will protect with no training" ;-)


Like I am worried about what you folks think Thomas. I know the dogs will protect in a "real" situation. That hokey stuff you guys do is laughable as far as being real. What is really laughable is that most of you think your dogs will protect off the training field in a "real" situation. The reality is you better have a gun with you because those trained sport dogs are leaving. I have seen the dobes, like you have, be the bad dogs. I have seen the rotties and GSD's run the same gamut, now the Mal's. You guys seem to think a "good" dog has to be bouncing off the walls. Not at all true. That bouncing off the walls just impresses those that think they know dogs. Keep breeding for hyper dogs with BS like ball drive and chasing towels and all your breeds will all go downhill Thomas. Y'all been drinking the koolaid to long.


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## Jackie Lockard

Don Turnipseed said:


> Like I am worried about what you folks think Thomas. I know the dogs will protect in a "real" situation. That hokey stuff you guys do is laughable as far as being real. What is really laughable is that most of you think your dogs will protect off the training field in a "real" situation. The reality is you better have a gun with you because those trained sport dogs are leaving. I have seen the dobes, like you have, be the bad dogs. I have seen the rotties and GSD's run the same gamut, now the Mal's. You guys seem to think a "good" dog has to be bouncing off the walls. Not at all true. That bouncing off the walls just impresses those that think they know dogs. Keep breeding for hyper dogs with BS like ball drive and chasing towels and all your breeds will all go downhill Thomas. Y'all been drinking the koolaid to long.


I'm glad this thread has a point now.

Apparently I'm out of the loop for drama around here (and I hope to stay that way.........), but who the hell thinks a GOOD dog, ANY GOOD DOG, wouldn't protect in a real situation? My LAB looks weak as hell on the sport field (at least at the trial)...come break into the house like a creeper at night and let's see what happens. I want to set up video this time so I have proof.  I certainly haven't trained him in any sort of real life scenario.

I do sport because it's fun. The fact that people think it actually means anything when it comes to a real protection dog is just a cherry.


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## Peter Cavallaro

Thomas Barriano said:


> Peter C writing "I plan to publish the article in both leading vet and breed journals." is almost as funny as "the Seed" saying
> "I know my dales will protect with no training" ;-)


 
when my thesis question referred to a list of contemporary world class trainers i forgot to mention the most obvious one, it was just assumed you all knew THE best trainer and representative of the DS breed, hardly needed mentioning, the one so far ahead of the rest of the pack we only ever get to see his butt stain, so tough he makes chuck Norris look like a little beach, the alpha-est male and a devil with the ladies;

Thomas Barriano






my bad


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## Peter Cavallaro

Geoff E, if'n you don't apologyise, i'm gonna tell the mods on you.

talk about crushin a man's dreams into the dirt and spit on them.


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## Peter Cavallaro

Jackie, so you own a DS??


stay on topic


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## Jackie Lockard

Peter Cavallaro said:


> Jackie, so you own a DS??
> 
> 
> stay on topic


Do you?


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## Bob Scott

Fact is, until it becomes a popular "REGISTRABLE" breed with the show/pet organizations no one outside the working community is going to have any great interest in the "breed". The working community has no interest in makeing it a "registerable" breed for the simple reason that the sports/activities they are involved in don't require it.


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## Josh Smith

This thread is gay.


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## Peter Cavallaro

Josh Smith said:


> This thread is gay.


 
don't feed the troll people


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## Peter Cavallaro

Jackie Lockard said:


> Do you?


whats with you people, answer every question with a question??

answer, no i don't, considering it actually so thought i would do some research first.


actually i lied - got enough dogs at the moment but i admire what i seen/heard about them and came close to purchasing one once but don't own one and am not currenlty looking, actually i am so happy with my GSD i would consider buying a breedingd female one day in the long tearm future.


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## Jason Davis

Titan (DS) FRIII. 2009 NARA Eastern Zone Champion and National Champion. 

Sniper (My DS) 2009 FRII Eastern and Central NARA Champion and 2009 National Champion. 
2010 NARA FRIII Eastern Zone champion 
Vice National Champion
Cup Winner
2011 NARA FRIII Cup Winner.


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## Thomas Barriano

Peter Cavallaro said:


> when my thesis question referred to a list of contemporary world class trainers i forgot to mention the most obvious one, it was just assumed you all knew THE best trainer and representative of the DS breed, hardly needed mentioning, the one so far ahead of the rest of the pack we only ever get to see his butt stain, so tough he makes chuck Norris look like a little beach, the alpha-est male and a devil with the ladies;


Peter 

Have you noticed that neither of the trainers you mentioned has responded to your thesis? A thesis suggests a scientific 
study not nonsense from a troll. Go find a biker gang and see if they'll let you provide security. Or better yet, go listen to some Andreas Segovia


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## Peter Cavallaro

why all the DS owners allowed to be so rude and not get stomped by mods? - modstomped lol.


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## Peter Cavallaro

Thomas Barriano said:


> Peter
> 
> *Have you noticed that neither of the trainers you mentioned has responded to your thesis?*
> 
> man i used to respect the way you could cut people down - that sh!t there is the stupidist thing you ever said. its a sign, it is the beginning of the end for the DS......and Thomas - yr losing it pal, lost yr edge and now just rambling, shame to see it.
> 
> how many of them trainers have responded to anything ever on the WDF fool, what did i run them off? man thats funny, i guess one of the top trainers has responded evidently - *you*
> 
> changing my thesis to - "Can Thomas B be saved"
> 
> i doubt it.


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## Geoff Empey

Peter Cavallaro said:


> Geoff E, if'n you don't apologyise, i'm gonna tell the mods on you.
> 
> talk about crushin a man's dreams into the dirt and spit on them.



Awww Pete! This should cheer you up. I've been known to write crappy poetry for the WDF I have a special one for ya. 

Pete reached out to the breed as it became transparent to him. He grabbed for its paw, to only make a fist. Pete stared into those oh so familiar brown eyes, only to see, untiedly, the violet dawn behind the dog... Pete's all white garments, blowing with the gentle breeze of tomorrows. Tears, drift down his face and stain the sediment beneath them. The stars in the dying night time sky, still﻿ hid the twinkle of the dog's brown eyes so perfectly. Pete leans in, for the final kiss.. final embrace with his eyes closed. Once opened, the breed was gone.

Awww Pete .. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NHtwYFq_2lU&feature=related


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## Peter Cavallaro

Doesn't rhyme man, not a poem.

poems gotta rhyme or its just a string of pretty words.

no more poems though man too ****.


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## Selena van Leeuwen

Do better research....


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## Dave Colborn

Pete.

I think you are trying to help the breed in your own funny way. 

I am an advocate of dutchies and pooh/bucket eating, I have also worn one as a hand accessory after one unloaded on me instead of a dog. Not a lot of love for them, but I can reason past my emotions and opinions.

I think they are as good as any other breed, period. You just find the good ones without the traits that you don't want, just like any other breed. Find breeders that are responsible, have a good guarantee and breed for traits you want. 

Think about where the breeds were years ago compared to where they are now. I don't have revisionist history going on. I wonder what a GSD REALLY was like a 100 yrs ago. I think most breeds have lines within them that are WAY stronger now compared to then. 

Just like getting a dog for anything, all this talk does nothing until you see the dog and select for what you want.

Thanks to all the reputable breeders, breeding to make dogs better!!


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## Jackie Lockard

Peter Cavallaro said:


> answer, no i don't


Clearly you're an expert in your field. I apologize. Good luck with your publications.


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## Chuck Zang

Is TB the only one that can detect the bait? PC is obviously just trying to yank the chains of the DS owners- likely because of the article on the GSD. Stop feeding the troll. 

Sent from my MB860 using Tapatalk


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## Jackie Lockard

Chuck Zang said:


> Is TB the only one that can detect the bait? PC is obviously just trying to yank the chains of the DS owners- likely because of the article on the GSD. Stop feeding the troll.
> 
> Sent from my MB860 using Tapatalk


Not at all. The question remains why it hasn't been locked.


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## Christina Kennedy

LOL, I have not read this entire thread but seeing as it is coming from Peter- I am not sure why everyone is in a tizzy. It is obvious he likes to stir the bucket, yank the chain, etc etc. It made me chuckle actually.

With that said, I will mention Sniper if he was not mentioned already. An INCREDIBLE Dutchie who has done some great things in the Ring sport, beating some very nice Malinois.


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## Peter Cavallaro

The question remains why do you keep trying to derail the thread??? anyone forcing you to keep reading it and to keep posting on it. 

if someone is (forcing you to post) and you cant say anything for fears of reprisal just blink your eyes 3 times and hold yr nose funny, we will know what you mean.






Jackie Lockard said:


> Not at all. The question remains why it hasn't been locked.


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## Peter Cavallaro

Thanks to all the reputable breeders........



+ 1, the money you make is nowhere near the time, care and dedication you put in but still you do it, to repeat to make sure you dont miss it;



Thanks to all the reputable breeders.


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## susan tuck

Jackie Lockard said:


> You realize that any "high caliber" (really, what I mean by this is people who intend to compete at a world level in IPO), cannot use a Dutch Shepherd since there is no national championship?
> 
> And why is your opinion that they need saving?


Since WDSA (Working Dutch Shepherd Association) is recognized by AWDF, I believe that makes them eligible to compete individually at the AWDF National Championship, and also makes them eligible to compete on the American team at the FCI IPO World Championship. 

Anyway I agree with the person who said something about Peter prolly starting this thread more to yank a few chains, and I think maybe one or two people misplaced their senses of humor. Serious or not, it's certainly his perogative to pose the question, people can respond or not, but I really don't understand why you would think this thread should be shut down. 

There is a troll on this thread, but it's not Peter.
:lol:


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## Timothy Stacy

Any data on how much poop one can consume at one time?


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## Connie Sutherland

Timothy Stacy said:


> Any data on how much poop one can consume at one time?



If anyone can supply this data, do they get free copies of the forthcoming leading vet and breed journals?


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## Bob Scott

Timothy Stacy said:


> Any data on how much poop one can consume at one time?


The poop eaters I've had in the past (any breed) have pretty much been just nibblers.


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## Timothy Stacy

Bob Scott said:


> The poop eaters I've had in the past (any breed) have pretty much been just nibblers.


True for most breeds but these DS have insatiable appetite for large quantities of dung


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## kelsey cooke

and i thought i was the baby dutchie person here:-\"
i've met tons of dogs that ate their own ship, and my cousin's new dutchie pup ONLY retrieves ...


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## Peter Cavallaro

Thanks for helping with the research, i think we got the poop topic covered which is definately better than the other way around lol.


so what's up with the relative lack of brindle on the podium, disregarding KNPV.


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## Connie Sutherland

I want to know about the free copies for research contributors.


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## Peter Cavallaro

first 50 will be autographed and bonus poster of me included.


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## Connie Sutherland

Peter Cavallaro said:


> first 50 will be autographed and bonus poster of me included.


Can I pay for no bonus poster?


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## Marta Wajngarten

Peter Cavallaro said:


> Thanks for helping with the research, i think we got the poop topic covered which is definately better than the other way around lol.
> 
> 
> so what's up with the relative lack of brindle on the podium, disregarding KNPV.


Which podium?


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## Peter Cavallaro

But you would be the envy of all gf's up there in mass.


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## Peter Cavallaro

Whoops, just checked yr 20, why did i think you were an east coast girl??


my bad


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## Peter Cavallaro

Marta any podium would do for a discussion starter.


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## Marta Wajngarten

Sniper and Titan were mentioned earlier, they would be on the FR podium. Name another podium where Dutchies can compete.


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## Peter Cavallaro

Thats 2 dogs, what's that work out % wise?

dont know the venues, doing the 'research' here, not the marketing.


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## Jackie Lockard

susan tuck said:


> Since WDSA (Working Dutch Shepherd Association) is recognized by AWDF, I believe that makes them eligible to compete individually at the AWDF National Championship, and also makes them eligible to compete on the American team at the FCI IPO World Championship.
> 
> Anyway I agree with the person who said something about Peter prolly starting this thread more to yank a few chains, and I think maybe one or two people misplaced their senses of humor. Serious or not, it's certainly his perogative to pose the question, people can respond or not, but I really don't understand why you would think this thread should be shut down.



That's new. I'm always out of the loop! Definitely a change for the better...maybe I can get a Dutchie again after all.

Taking a new antibs outlook on life in light of a few personal things. \\/


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## Peter Cavallaro

Jackie cant enforce it but i request you please stay the F off my thread, yr not contributing.


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## Jackie Lockard

Peter Cavallaro said:


> Jackie cant enforce it but i request you please stay the F off my thread, yr not contributing.


Would another poop statistic put you at ease? I could go back and count up all the dogs I've met that qualify and make a list of their general pedigree. Or has the research moved onto sullen behavior? Tell me what you seek, so that I may contribute better.


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## Peter Cavallaro

I seek u not to be on my thread.


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## Doug Zaga

Peter Cavallaro said:


> Jackie cant enforce it but i request you please stay the F off my thread, yr not contributing.


Pete you need to take up a hobby...maybe stamp and/or coin collecting or maybe gardening. Just sayn'


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## maggie fraser

Doug Zaga said:


> Pete you need to take up a hobby...maybe stamp and/or coin collecting or maybe gardening. Just sayn'


Leave him alone...he needs the stimulation!


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## Doug Zaga

maggie fraser said:


> Leave him alone...he needs the stimulation!


I think he has had too much stimulation in the bush or maybe no bush ...:razz: He needs a hobby!


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## maggie fraser

Jackie, get off Peter's thread will you.


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## maggie fraser

Doug Zaga said:


> I think he has had too much stimulation in the bush or maybe no bush ...:razz: He needs a hobby!


At least he converses and has humour, and he raises interesting topics and questions. And....he has a hobby,,,obvious enuff to me lol


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## Connie Sutherland

maggie fraser said:


> And....he has a hobby,,,obvious enuff to me lol



Yeah, me too. :lol:


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## Doug Zaga

maggie fraser said:


> At least he converses and has humour, and he raises interesting topics and questions. And....he has a hobby,,,obvious enuff to me lol


Maggie May... how are you ?


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## maggie fraser

Doug Zaga said:


> Maggie May... how are you ?


I am good thanks, thought i'd just offer a wee bit support for Peter and his thread lol


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## susan tuck

Jackie Lockard said:


> That's new. I'm always out of the loop! Definitely a change for the better...maybe I can get a Dutchie again after all.
> 
> Taking a new antibs outlook on life in light of a few personal things. \\/


Yes, it is new, as of mid 2010 I believe, I agree it's a good move, this pointy eared herder definitely should be able to play at the same tables as the others!!

Maggie: How the HELL have you been girrrrrrrrrrrrl ??????!!!! Now don't you go and try and chase Jackie, she may be new, but I'm getting the impression she's pretty tough and can hold her own AND hang with the big dogs......even if she accidently left her sense of humor behind on this thread!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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## Jackie Lockard

Now my feelings are hurt Maggie.


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## Kathy Barker

Back to podiums. Could it be that since DS are listed as 'mixed breed' in some of the other sports, you wouldn't necessarily realize that they actually are the more superior breed?

Just sayin.


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## Lee H Sternberg

maggie fraser said:


> At least he converses and has humour, and he raises interesting topics and questions. And....he has a hobby,,,obvious enuff to me lol


What hand do you think he uses for that HOBBY you speak of?


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## kelsey cooke

Lee H Sternberg said:


> What hand do you think he uses for that HOBBY you speak of?


Omg, love this .


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## Timothy Stacy

Not sure about the DS but I'm working on getting this French Brittany on the podium. Over the top aggression for fingers and forearms, loves metal, and great ball drive. Should have him on the hard sleeve in a few weeks and then right to the table training!

This is no joke! I got home tonight and he took a shit and proceeded to try and sniff it and nibble it! 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sBTI-o_J7aU&feature=youtube_gdata_player


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## Peter Cavallaro

Be sure and get back to me when you can look at all the worlds armies and all the worlds police forces and no see sable because all you see there and draping the podium is stripe.

until then keep jerking each other off, my hands are full already lol.


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## Doug Zaga

Peter Cavallaro said:


> until then keep jerking each other off, my hands are full already lol.


Dude you have the bikers over...again? 

Here is something to bring you back to the time of side burns....

http://www.youtube.com/​watch?v=Pm3zUQjG5no&feature=rel​ated


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## leslie cassian

So we didn't actually make it on to the podium, me and my little stripey dog, but we were close and would have been closer if the chick with the Dobe didn't clean our clocks with her awesome obedience in the BH. You won't see our impressive showing listed anywhere in the DS news though, because the results page just shows my Pure Bread Kay En Pee Vee Ducth Sheppard listed as a mix. Oh the humiliation.


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## Harry Keely

Doug Zaga said:


> Dude you have the bikers over...again?
> 
> Here is something to bring you back to the time of side burns....
> 
> http://www.youtube.com/​watch?v=Pm3zUQjG5no&feature=rel​ated


Holy crappola, Im laughing my ass off and made me think of this bar scene:-o

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jo3m2ATiomY


----------



## Christopher Smith

susan tuck said:


> Yes, it is new, as of mid 2010 I believe, I agree it's a good move, this pointy eared herder definitely should be able to play at the same tables as the others!!



What happened in mid 2010?


----------



## Harry Keely

as far as this thread gos, some statements might stand true for a breed in generalization, but each dog needs a individual basis test perform to evaluate the dog for any and all habits, what works for one might not work for all, its like reading a book and or video and saying here ya go heres my dog or its entire breed, negative - big negative ghost rider that pattern is way over filled .now what I think of this thread in one simple pic](*,)


----------



## Doug Zaga

Doug Zaga said:


> Dude you have the bikers over...again?
> 
> Here is something to bring you back to the time of side burns....
> 
> http://www.youtube.com/​watch?v=Pm3zUQjG5no&feature=rel​ated





Harry Keely said:


> Holy crappola, Im laughing my ass off and made me think of this bar scene:-o
> 
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jo3m2ATiomY


LOL!


----------



## Christopher Smith

Don Turnipseed said:


> What is really laughable is that most of you think your dogs will protect off the training field in a "real" situation. The reality is you better have a gun with you because those trained sport dogs are leaving.


I know that ain't a call out is it The Seed? Anytime you want to discover the reality of a sport dog I'm your huckleberry.


----------



## Peter Cavallaro

and this thread started out so serious


----------



## Timothy Stacy

Christopher Smith said:


> I know that ain't a call out is it The Seed? Anytime you want to discover the reality of a sport dog I'm your huckleberry.


I have a feeling there might be a hospital visit!


----------



## Geoff Empey

Peter Cavallaro said:


> and this thread started out so serious


No it didn't .. Nice try though Pete .. 



Connie Sutherland said:


> If you are talking about your DS thread, please don't try to say that you posted that thread with the goals of
> (1) receiving all serious replies, and (2) not stirring sh*t.





Pete Cavallaro said:


> I won't argue either point (1) or point (2).


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y55wvdcCJfk  I like Rock and Roll and sullen Dutchies!


----------



## Peter Cavallaro

So what's everyone up to this evening??

I know Doug n Harry are hookin up at the back end of the oyster bar, back end get it, one of them will lol.

Geoff you can set the romance rolling with some poetry.


----------



## Christopher Smith

Timothy Stacy said:


> I have a feeling there might be a hospital visit!


For what??? Any damage a *sport dog* would do to The Seed could easily be healed with a slather'n o hog or bear grease. And I'm sure he's got plenty from all the "big game" epic battles his dog's have won. I just hope they don't run into the most nasty and dreaded beast known as the Colborn again.


----------



## Drew Peirce

Man, for a human spam-bot this clown sure does get people to dance.


----------



## Harry Keely

Peter Cavallaro said:


> So what's everyone up to this evening??
> 
> I know Doug n Harry are hookin up at the back end of the oyster bar, back end get it, one of them will lol.
> 
> Geoff you can set the romance rolling with some poetry.


Come on is that your best you got Peter :lol:, heres one I thought up just for you pal:-s
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EHmefyksm_I


----------



## Peter Cavallaro

I'm not clicking on it if its something disgusting involving the type of bars u hang out at??


----------



## Harry Keely

Peter Cavallaro said:


> I'm not clicking on it if its something disgusting involving the type of bars u hang out at??












Come on man dont knock it, till you try it HAHAHA:lol::lol::lol:

Hey question for ya, if you went camping and you woke up in the morning and you felt a little wierd, would you tell anybody?


----------



## Peter Cavallaro

OK, thats a funny enough pic. i was a bit concerned lol.

dont really want to chat with you though, there's no internet chat room at the oyster bar where you can meet guys?

not that yr not potentially cute, just that the mods are on my case about off topic banter......that and i'm just not down with the lady boys so there's really nothing for us to chat about, nothing personal, see ya.


----------



## Maren Bell Jones

Marta Wajngarten said:


> Sniper and Titan were mentioned earlier, they would be on the FR podium. Name another podium where Dutchies can compete.


Hill S.'s Dutch dog Rex did pretty good at the PSA 3 nationals (I think they got first overall and a leg towards the PSA 3 title, IIRC?). You can have a Chihuahua/Irish wolfhound mutt compete at PSA and it doesn't matter, which I love. May the best dog win...


----------



## Doug Zaga

Harry Keely said:


> if you went camping and you woke up in the morning and you felt a little wierd, would you tell anybody?


He FEELS that every day and just now is starting to come out :mrgreen:


----------



## David Ruby

Don Turnipseed said:


> Like I am worried about what you folks think Thomas. I know the dogs will protect in a "real" situation. That hokey stuff you guys do is laughable as far as being real. What is really laughable is that most of you think your dogs will protect off the training field in a "real" situation.


I think Thomas was just yanking your chain a bit (which you kind of asked for, no?). That said . . .

How could you possibly know your dogs would protect in a real situation?** They were ran off by a sport decoy. Based on that, why should the sport folk care what you think? I would not care except you seem pretty authoritative for a guy whose only bitework footage we've seen is of your dogs getting run off. Maybe they can be built up to be more than that, maybe not. Dave seemed to see some potential, which is nice. Still, until you actually show otherwise that is what we have to base our collective decision on.



> The reality is you better have a gun with you because those trained sport dogs are leaving.


Maybe. Based on the video of your dogs, that's somehow better?



> You guys seem to think a "good" dog has to be bouncing off the walls.


Well, that's not entirely true.



> Keep breeding for hyper dogs with BS like ball drive and chasing towels and all your breeds will all go downhill Thomas. Y'all been drinking the koolaid to long.


Probably because their dogs actually bite when told to. That tends to reinforce their belief they're doing the right thing. I have to wonder, what would you expect them to do? Even if you have a different perspective, their dogs are generally speaking doing what they want them to do in the venue they are working their dogs. What's the motivation to change?

Seriously Don, go check out Debbie Skinner's dogs. I've only seen a couple, but they seemed pretty self-composed, they've been used "for real" as Police dogs (and sport dogs), and she offered to show you some training. I would take her up on that offer.

-Cheers

** O.k., that was a rhetorical question


----------



## kelsey cooke

Timothy Stacy said:


> Not sure about the DS but I'm working on getting this French Brittany on the podium. Over the top aggression for fingers and forearms, loves metal, and great ball drive. Should have him on the hard sleeve in a few weeks and then right to the table training!
> 
> This is no joke! I got home tonight and he took a shit and proceeded to try and sniff it and nibble it!
> 
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sBTI-o_J7aU&feature=youtube_gdata_player


French Brittany? New best friend!  haha .
My girl's working on arm sleeves as well, she seems to only like it if my cousin's in the arm sleeve. =D>


I would also think that the poop eating/nibbling could have to do with the quality of food the dog is on as well (in general) as I've heard dogs eat their shit to get nutrients?


----------



## Drew Peirce

Turnip you really are a funny old codger, but your way out of touch with reality if you think those curs your breedin will protect anything but their own asses in any situation, real or imagined, we all witnessed the debacle man, just leave it alone......


----------



## maggie fraser

susan tuck said:


> Maggie: How the HELL have you been girrrrrrrrrrrrl ??????!!!! Now don't you go and try and chase Jackie, she may be new, but I'm getting the impression she's pretty tough and can hold her own AND hang with the big dogs


Hey Susan, I;m grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrreat lol! 

Just doing my bit for the odd underdog that's all !!!!


----------



## Doug Zaga

maggie fraser said:


> Hey Susan, I;m grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrreat lol!
> 
> Just doing my bit for the odd underdog that's all !!!!


 
Maggie... who is the ODD UNDERDOG????


----------



## maggie fraser

Doug Zaga said:


> Maggie... who is the ODD UNDERDOG????


Hey, how should I know ?

It sounded good though didn't it ?


----------



## maggie fraser

Lee H Sternberg said:


> What hand do you think he uses for that HOBBY you speak of?


His backhand Lol :razz:


----------



## Geoff Empey

Peter Cavallaro said:


> Geoff you can set the romance rolling with some poetry.


Nah Pete, I've done enough damage already. I sometimes forget that there are internetally "challenged" persons in this world who find these type of things to be difficult. If I had known that this was true like in your case then I would have never have exposed myself to your thread. It just doesn't feel "right." Sort of like illegally parking in a handicap space or beating up a guy with no arms. I feel so dirty now.


----------



## maggie fraser

Geoff Empey said:


> Nah Pete, I've done enough damage already. I sometimes forget that there are internetally "challenged" persons in this world who find these type of things to be difficult. If I had known that this was true like in your case then I would have never have exposed myself to your thread. It just doesn't feel "right." Sort of like illegally parking in a handicap space or beating up a guy with no arms. I feel so dirty now.


I wouldn't be going and feeling dirty and exposed now Geoff, you are not the only poet on here, only trouble was, yours just didn't rhyme.

So to make things easier for Peter
Making it rhyme will make things better
Fly him high and far, upon a star
So he can see, all there is to be
Not just greys and hues of blue
But, the truth of poetry and the internet too!


----------



## Doug Zaga

maggie fraser said:


> I wouldn't be going and feeling dirty and exposed now Geoff, you are not the only poet on here, only trouble was, yours just didn't rhyme.
> 
> So to make things easier for Peter
> Making it rhyme will make things better
> Fly him high and far, upon a star
> So he can see, all there is to be
> Not just greys and hues of blue
> But, the truth of poetry and the internet too!


Oh Maggie!


----------



## maggie fraser

Doug Zaga said:


> Oh Maggie!


WTF does that mean ?? I thought it was pretty good !


----------



## Doug Zaga

maggie fraser said:


> WTF does that mean ?? I thought it was pretty good !


 
Hey watch your mouth...I should have put a big heart after my post...leaving it open for intepretation made you go angry on me....geez! LOL


----------



## maggie fraser

Doug Zaga said:


> Hey watch your mouth...I should have put a big heart after my post...leaving it open for intepretation made you go angry on me....geez! LOL


That's ok then #-o.


----------



## Doug Zaga

Glad your ok don't need two woman being mad at me tonight LOL!


----------



## Geoff Empey

Doug Zaga said:


> Oh Maggie!


Sounds dirty to me .. :-\"


----------



## Lee H Sternberg

Oh you're in the dog house too, Doug? I'm getting the old "evil eye" again. I grabbed some eggnog at the store this afternoon and cracked open a bottle of Jim Beam to give it a bit of added flavor.

I'm having a little solo party. 

She is aggravated because my kid has a sleep over and I'm babysitting while she goes to church.

I told her I wouldn't spike the kids' eggnog but she didn't see the humor in that comment.


----------



## Doug Zaga

Lee H Sternberg said:


> Oh you're in the dog house too, Doug? I'm getting the old "evil eye" again. I grabbed some eggnog at the store this afternoon and cracked open a bottle of Jim Beam to give it a bit of added flavor.
> 
> I'm having a little solo party.
> 
> She is aggravated because my kid has a sleep over and I'm babysitting while she goes to church.
> 
> I told her I wouldn't spike the kids' eggnog but she didn't see the humor in that comment.


 
LMAO...Yeah don't spike it! Yep, I love my dog more than her etc etc etc...I just gave up the remote for a couple of hours to minmize the noise


----------



## Peter Cavallaro

Geoff sheesh man dont bleed out all over us and die of a broken heart, expose yrself all you want on the internet, Harry n Doug will know the best sites, i'm flattered u writed me a poem, just said it would be more poem like if it rhymed, what are you all the sensitive artist like, I never rejected you man, buck the **** up girlfriend.

Maggie, seriously, you have outdone yrself. that is some sweet ass sh!t. you copy that off someone???


----------



## maggie fraser

Peter Cavallaro said:


> Maggie, seriously, you have outdone yrself. that is some sweet ass sh!t. you copy that off someone???


Who else would be writing a poem about you Peter ?


----------



## Lee H Sternberg

Hey Maggie! Do they have eggnog in Scotland??


----------



## Peter Cavallaro

'I'm having a little solo party.....'

Holy crap Lee, at least i got the decency to be in denial about my 'hobby'.

You freakin brag about it on the internet WTF.

be sure and wash yr hand when yr done, i would keep that from the board in future, lol.


----------



## Peter Cavallaro

maggie fraser said:


> Who else would be writing a poem about you Peter ?


Geoff


----------



## Peter Cavallaro

Seriously mags, i liked it, funny thing is all this time i just thought you were some foul mouthed scottish tramp.


was that a compliment?????


----------



## Lee H Sternberg

Peter Cavallaro said:


> 'I'm having a little solo party.....'
> 
> Holy crap Lee, at least i got the decency to be in denial about my 'hobby'.
> 
> You freakin brag about it on the internet WTF.
> 
> be sure and wash yr hand when yr done, i would keep that from the board in future, lol.



Peter - You would be very surprised about how many "hobbies" I've had in 65 years. 

Been there, done that on more things than I care to remember! 

I am willing to bet, most on this forum have led sheltered lives compared to some of the shit I've done.


----------



## Peter Cavallaro

Yeah Lee no argument here, was just going along with the whole hand hobby sub topic which i believe you started.

So as a ds owner can you shed some light on the actual thread, or as someone (miss barker, no shit) stated earlier the ds is 'the superior breed' hype, fact or what


----------



## Lee H Sternberg

Peter Cavallaro said:


> Yeah Lee no argument here, was just going along with the whole hand hobby sub topic which i believe you started.
> 
> So as a ds owner can you shed some light on the actual thread, or as someone (miss barker, no shit) stated earlier the ds is 'the superior breed' hype, fact or what


I prefer to discuss eggnog! Done too many of these Dutchie threads. Do you have eggnog in Australia?


----------



## Peter Cavallaro

People make it, i cant say i tried it. is it just a drink or is there some cultural significance to it?

non alcoholic drink right? that explains why its not on my radar.

for some reason when someone says them word eggnog, i burst out laughing??


----------



## Lee H Sternberg

Peter Cavallaro said:


> People make it, i cant say i tried it. is it just a drink or is there some cultural significance to it?
> 
> non alcoholic drink right? that explains why its not on my radar.
> 
> for some reason when someone says them word eggnog, i burst out laughing??


No booze unless you add some. It is a mixture, milk and egg based, popular from Thanksgiving through New Years.


----------



## Doug Zaga

maggie fraser said:


> Who else would be writing a poem about you Peter ?


 
I bet his Biker Bang friends have some poems about him...


----------



## Doug Zaga

Peter Cavallaro said:


> 'I'm having a little Biker Bang party.....'
> 
> Holy crap Lee, at least i got the decency NOT to be in denial about my 'hobby'.
> 
> I freakin brag about it on the internet WTF.
> 
> be sure and wash yr hand when yr done, i keep it all in even after all 50 had their turn, lol.


 
Damn Petey...!


----------



## Peter Cavallaro

Doug you are an idiot, the hard edit is gay you need to stop living your fantasies out through other people, embrace and be proud of yr gayness.


----------



## Doug Zaga

Peter Cavallaro said:


> Doug you are an idiot, the hard edit is gay you need to stop living your fantasies out through other people, embrace and be proud of yr gayness.


:razz:


----------



## Peter Cavallaro

Doug it just hurts me to see a good guy beating himself up inside for sumthin that in the end is no big thing, yr gf is trying to tell you, is she angry and unsatisfied a lot with you.

when you gonna see what is obvious to everyone cept you man.



note: i said beating up..........not off.


----------



## Doug Zaga

Peter Cavallaro said:


> Doug it just hurts me to see a good guy beating himself up inside for sumthin that in the end is no big thing, yr gf is trying to tell you, is she angry and unsatisfied a lot with you.
> 
> when you gonna see what is obvious to everyone cept you man.
> 
> 
> 
> note: i said beating up..........not off.


 
Dude your always talking about BEATING...maybe you need a GF instead of the Biker Bangs.  



BTW "She"...is my wife not gf! It is a game of give and take...she was whining about wantign attention...I gave up control of remote....now she is happy ..


----------



## Peter Cavallaro

remote.........scary


----------



## Doug Zaga

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZL9fnVtz_lc


Peter Cavallaro said:


> remote.........scary


 
The simple things in life...but I think you have said you do not own a TV so you would not understand. 

Nothing like watching something like this on big screen HDTV with the Bose System...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XX8Y5-BZLaM

or this
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZL9fnVtz_lc


----------



## maggie fraser

Peter Cavallaro said:


> Seriously mags, i liked it, funny thing is all this time i just thought you were some foul mouthed scottish tramp.
> 
> 
> was that a compliment?????


the tramp with a stamp
can a compliment do?
sure it can peter
sure it can from you!
my ass !
you farce !
with your great rollin spoof
kicking up shit and raising the roof,
tread carefully peter
you ought to thank her
or you know what she'll say
ya stirring wee w***** !!




F** me, i'm on a roll :smile:


----------



## maggie fraser

Lee H Sternberg said:


> Hey Maggie! Do they have eggnog in Scotland??


Lee, don't have anything non alcoholic in Scotland.


----------



## Peter Cavallaro

I was trying to give you a compliment but looking back i see how it may appear different, i'm not the poet right.


----------



## Peter Cavallaro

we dont have thanksgiving, and i believe eggnog is served warm???

where i live mostly alkyhol is served either cold or at room temp.

a traditional old soldiers drink we spaz out on ANZAC day is rum and milk, thats about as close as i can imagine it.

around here most drink is rum and lager beer, girls drink vodka mixes.

i got a taste for bourbon while living in the states, only beer i could drink there was corona, yours beer is sooooo bad, no offence.


I will google eggnog and try make it, still laugh at the sound of the word. 

eggnog sounds like a good name for a molosser lol.



Lee H Sternberg said:


> No booze unless you add some. It is a mixture, milk and egg based, popular from Thanksgiving through New Years.


----------



## Connie Sutherland

Peter Cavallaro said:


> .... and i believe eggnog is served warm???



EWWWWW! Warm eggnog ..... :-&


----------



## Lee H Sternberg

Peter Cavallaro said:


> we dont have thanksgiving, and i believe eggnog is served warm???
> 
> where i live mostly alkyhol is served either cold or at room temp.
> 
> a traditional old soldiers drink we spaz out on ANZAC day is rum and milk, thats about as close as i can imagine it.
> 
> around here most drink is rum and lager beer, girls drink vodka mixes.
> 
> i got a taste for bourbon while living in the states, only beer i could drink there was corona, yours beer is sooooo bad, no offence.
> 
> 
> I will google eggnog and try make it, still laugh at the sound of the word.
> 
> eggnog sounds like a good name for a molosser lol.


I don't know when you were here but the beer here has gotten much better. There are literally hundreds of small micro breweries all over the country now.

Eggnog is served cold and often spiked with hard liquor.


----------



## Joby Becker

Peter Cavallaro said:


> *Intro:* Hi folks I am doing some research on the dutch shepherd breed and am looking for some expert opinion. I plan to publish the article in both leading vet and breed journals.
> *Preamble:* Anecdotal evidence suggests that the GSD breed has now been discredited as a working dog due to genetic afflictions in both health and temperament related issues. Increasingly the mal and more recently the dutch shepherd is seen as the replacement breed for the gsd in the field. This article endeavours to investigate the substantial claims made by breeders of DS dogs as the _new breed_ for field police, military and sport work, with particular focus on the bite sports.
> The breed has gained a new and increasing following outside of traditional markets in Holland and particularly listings for new breeders are proliferating at an alarming rate in North America, Australia and the UK.
> A key finding of this remarkable uptake of the breed is that it appeals to the dog owner looking for that “something different” to stand out from the crowd, seemingly regardless of the breeds proven working potential. The dog as _fashion accessory_ syndrome we have all seen in countless trendy breeds as they have come and gone in the past. The downside to this syndrome is it encourages breeders to select for extreme phenotype eg fluffy coats, blue eyes, big chest and heads etc.
> *Research Question:* *Is it such, that if it ain’t Dutch, it ain’t much??*
> *Literature Review:* after an extensive review and analysis of the literature the only verifiable data on the DS is as follows;
> 
> Eating their own faeces is a genetic trait
> Propensity for sullen/guardy possessive behaviour, seemingly genetic
> Don’t like to retrieve stuff, seemingly genetic
> I am trying to compile verifiable data on the following;
> 
> How many Dutch shepherds (percentage wise) actually claim podium spots at major performance trials at the national and international level.
> How many of the top contemporary trainers currently own or train a DS for high level sport work of the calibre of Mich. E, Ivan B, Gotf D, Bart B, Nick V, Bern. F………etc.
> If not why not???????
> This article is only in the earliest conceptual phase, hoping members here particularly expert breeders/trainers eg Chris Jones, Mike Suttle…etc can help focus the direction of the research.
> Note; I make no bias or assumption about the breed, in fact I have considered purchasing one. Just trying to put the hype and bs on a rational basis.
> 
> Any advice appreciated.


Not gonna get into this subject but those traits are also evident in almost all other working breeds, depending on the families of dogs, and not highly prevalent in the DS as a "breed" no more so than any other working breeds...


----------



## Lee H Sternberg

Joby Becker said:


> Not gonna get into this subject but those traits are also evident in almost all other working breeds, depending on the families of dogs, and not highly prevalent in the DS as a "breed" no more so than any other working breeds...


WTF does that got to do with eggnog, Joby?:razz::razz::razz::razz::razz:


----------



## Jackie Lockard

Lee H Sternberg said:


> WTF does that got to do with eggnog, Joby?:razz::razz::razz::razz::razz:


Maybe his dogs like something to dunk their nuggets in. [-X


----------



## maggie fraser

Joby Becker said:


> Not gonna get into this subject but those traits are also evident in almost all other working breeds, depending on the families of dogs, and not highly prevalent in the DS as a "breed" no more so than any other working breeds...


:lol::lol::lol:


----------



## Peter Cavallaro

haha, that was funny.


answer the question Joby





Lee H Sternberg said:


> WTF does that got to do with eggnog, Joby?:razz::razz::razz::razz::razz:


----------



## Peter Cavallaro

Oh sorry dont know why i thought it was served warm, live and lea





Lee H Sternberg said:


> I don't know when you were here but the beer here has gotten much better. There are literally hundreds of small micro breweries all over the country now.
> 
> Eggnog is served cold and often spiked with hard liquor.


----------



## Joby Becker

Peter Cavallaro said:


> haha, that was funny.
> 
> 
> answer the question Joby


I dont even know WTF Eggnog is...never tried it...sounds gross to me..never even ate eggs until I was like 30 or something.


----------



## Peter Cavallaro

I thought it was some american tradition like rocky downing that glass full of raw eggs, so Joby yr NOT rocky then?


----------



## Joby Becker

Peter Cavallaro said:


> I thought it was some american tradition like rocky downing that glass full of raw eggs, so Joby yr NOT rocky then?


lol....not even close..Pete...although I will ammend my earlier answer I did drink raw eggs in my early 20's...(when I was obsessively working out) just never ate cooked eggs, or tried eggnog...


----------



## Peter Cavallaro

Well chris claims to be manny p's cuz, how cool would that be, if it is true, me fanboy.


----------



## Doug Zaga

Pete...Wassup Fannyboy!

Maggie May that poetry is orgasmic :mrgreen:


----------



## Peter Cavallaro

While on the topic of eggnog, ......._ political post deleted_


----------



## Lee H Sternberg

Joby Becker said:


> I dont even know WTF Eggnog is...never tried it...sounds gross to me..never even ate eggs until I was like 30 or something.


You must lead a sheltered life, Joby!:-D


----------



## Lee H Sternberg

I hope you are out of the dog house today, Doug. My "old lady" came home from church in a better mood. 

I think she prayed for me not to be such a HEATHEN!!:-D


----------



## Peter Cavallaro

Lee H Sternberg said:


> You must lead a sheltered life, Joby!:-D



explains his attempt at derailment


----------



## Nicole Stark

Lee H Sternberg said:


> You must lead a sheltered life, Joby!:-D


I am sure he must. If it's not illegal or just plain weird, Joby probably wouldn't know about it. Egg nog doesn't seem to fit either category.


----------



## David Frost

I personally, don't like eggnog. Where I'm from however it's usually associated with copious amounts of rum and nutmeg.

DFrost


----------



## Peter Cavallaro

seems 50: 50, good bad.


----------



## Doug Zaga

Lee H Sternberg said:


> I hope you are out of the dog house today, Doug. My "old lady" came home from church in a better mood.
> 
> I think she prayed for me not to be such a HEATHEN!!:-D


Well came home from training she texted me she was going to the Providence Place Mall... I am now getting to watch the third game today.... SNF game....I would say that is out of the dog house


----------



## Joby Becker

Doug Zaga said:


> Well came home from training she texted me she was going to the Providence Place Mall... I am now getting to watch the third game today.... SNF game....I would say that is out of the dog house


go Mike V...


----------



## Doug Zaga

Joby Becker said:


> go Mike V...


 
Vick is warming the bench...ribs. Young is starting tonight. G-Men should win this one easily.


----------



## Joby Becker

Doug Zaga said:


> Vick is warming the bench...ribs. Young is starting tonight. G-Men should win this one easily.


ah....lol...I tried...(to stir the pot...)...did you see my man boobs on the puppy vids? just curious...


----------



## Doug Zaga

Joby Becker said:


> ah....lol...I tried...(to stir the pot...)...did you see my man boobs on the puppy vids? just curious...


I did but I was more interested in AC's legs :-$


----------



## Joby Becker

Doug Zaga said:


> I did but I was more interested in AC's legs :-$


legs? or what is above them?


----------



## Doug Zaga

Joby Becker said:


> legs? or what is above them?


Well..I was starting at the legs LOL! Your video work suks big ones!!!


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## Peter Cavallaro

MV, i thought that guy was in jail for matching dogs?????


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## Jackie Lockard

Peter Cavallaro said:


> MV, i thought that guy was in jail for matching dogs?????


More out of the loop than I am. Not that the Eagles suck any less with him.


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## Doug Zaga

Peter Cavallaro said:


> MV, i thought that guy was in jail for matching dogs?????


 
Released over a year ago..got a 6 year/100 million dollar contract with the Eagles


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## Peter Cavallaro

I dont get it, not trying to be funny just the name??


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## Doug Zaga

Peter Cavallaro said:


> I dont get it, not trying to be funny just the name??


Not sure what you mean?


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## Joby Becker

Doug Zaga said:


> Well..I was starting at the legs LOL! Your video work suks big ones!!!


I'll try harder...


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## Peter Cavallaro

That name came up with some sport dude convicted of matching, wrong?? just askin if its same dude, i guess not, my bad.


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## Jackie Lockard

Peter Cavallaro said:


> That name came up with some sport dude convicted of matching, wrong?? just askin if its same dude, i guess not, my bad.


same dude...I think I'm following you.


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## Doug Zaga

Joby Becker said:


> I'll try harder...


At least you have AC in your vids she saved you from the beer belly and man boob fiasco! LOL...


Pete.. yes Vick is the guy that got sentenced for dog fighting anf animal cruelty.


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## Doug Zaga

Jackie Lockard said:


> More out of the loop than I am. Not that the Eagles suck any less with him.


 
Weren't they supposed to be the DREAM team ?


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## Peter Cavallaro

Just read post 176, all good, people do wrong sometimes, they pay their debt to society and get a clean start, the way it should be. everyone gets treated exactly the same regardless of fame, money, sport ability.

thanx


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## Joby Becker

David Frost said:


> I personally, don't like eggnog. Where I'm from however it's usually associated with copious amounts of rum and nutmeg.
> 
> DFrost


waaait a minute...people put RUM into eggnog??? I do like rum...


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## Jackie Lockard

Doug Zaga said:


> Weren't they supposed to be the DREAM team ?


Maybe when they learn to play football.


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## Joby Becker

looks like they know a little about the foosball to me ..and looks like the Gmen might have forgot a little...


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## Jackie Lockard

Oh yea, 3-0 in the second quarter I's shakin'. More of a hockey person though...


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## Joby Becker

Jackie Lockard said:


> Oh yea, 3-0 in the second quarter I's shakin'. More of a hockey person though...


Go Hawks!!!!


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## Maren Bell Jones

I'm hearing from this weekend that Hill and his dog Rex are the first Dutchie to get PSA 3. Big congrats!!!


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## Doug Zaga

Joby Becker said:


> Go Hawks!!!!


Chicken?


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## Joby Becker

Doug Zaga said:


> Chicken?


Huh??lol


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## Joby Becker

Maren Bell Jones said:


> I'm hearing from this weekend that Hill and his dog Rex are the first Dutchie to get PSA 3. Big congrats!!!


That is why I am glad *my* pick is going to someone who trains in that club...


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## Peter Cavallaro

There goes my thesis, that makes it 3 now!!!





Maren Bell Jones said:


> I'm hearing from this weekend that Hill and his dog Rex are the first Dutchie to get PSA 3. Big congrats!!!


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## Jackie Lockard

Peter Cavallaro said:


> There goes my thesis, that makes it 3 now!!!


He won PSA nats both 2011 and 2010 didn't he?


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## Joby Becker

Here Pete...for research...
http://www.youtube.com/user/Smackk9#p/u/11/n--9JMVMB-w


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## Peter Cavallaro

Jackie Lockard said:


> He won PSA nats both 2011 and 2010 didn't he?


3.5


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## Joby Becker

legit or hype? you tell me....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pTUwVWO8qO0

http://www.youtube.com/user/jasonfarrish#p/u/28/Sfp0ZmMuWFs


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## Maren Bell Jones

I met Baz in May and saw him work a bit in French ring. Super dog...


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## mike finn

Peter Cavallaro said:


> Just read post 176, all good, people do wrong sometimes, they pay their debt to society and get a clean start, the way it should be. everyone gets treated exactly the same regardless of fame, money, sport ability.
> 
> thanx


Are you joking? Are you not the one who was a complete asshole to some teen ager who worked a wolf hybrid rescue, because of how cruel it was? You may be retarded.


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## Peter Cavallaro

so is 100 mill. like the top pay scale, do any players earn more, are clubs given a cap on total player expenditure or is up to the clubs own finances?? just curious.

Mike do put rum in yr eggnog, i would.




mike finn said:


> Are you joking? Are you not the one who was a complete asshole to some teen ager who worked a wolf hybrid rescue, because of how cruel it was? You may be retarded.


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## Peter Cavallaro

Lee i tried that eggnog, the smell of raw eggs man in a drink, i couldn't do it. had to make it like 99% rum.

I want to have a drink with you on yr next birthday, can it not be eggnog.


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## Jason Davis

Maren Bell Jones said:


> I met Baz in May and saw him work a bit in French ring. Super dog...



Bas is a very nice dog


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## Thomas Barriano

I just wanted to say how amazing it is that this topic has 200 replies and that it has really gone downhill....................but then I remembered where it started


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## Maren Bell Jones

Jason Davis said:


> Bas is a very nice dog


Oops, misspelled his name. Sorry Jason F.! :mrgreen:


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## Chris McDonald

Holly cow does anyone have cliff notes for this thread? You know just a few lines telling me whats going on?


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## Steve Groen

Don Turnipseed said:


> Like I am worried about what you folks think Thomas. I know the dogs will protect in a "real" situation. That hokey stuff you guys do is laughable as far as being real. What is really laughable is that most of you think your dogs will protect off the training field in a "real" situation. The reality is you better have a gun with you because those trained sport dogs are leaving. I have seen the dobes, like you have, be the bad dogs. I have seen the rotties and GSD's run the same gamut, now the Mal's. You guys seem to think a "good" dog has to be bouncing off the walls. Not at all true. That bouncing off the walls just impresses those that think they know dogs. Keep breeding for hyper dogs with BS like ball drive and chasing towels and all your breeds will all go downhill Thomas. Y'all been drinking the koolaid to long.


With all due respect to everyone on this list, if any of you is expecting a dog, any dog, to protect you in real life on a city street, as opposed to your own home or the farm, you better hope there's only one perp, he's unarmed, and he has an IQ level of about 85.:-({|=


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## Steve Groen

Chris McDonald said:


> Holly cow does anyone have cliff notes for this thread? You know just a few lines telling me whats going on?


Ego.](*,)


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## hillel schwartzman

if it ain’t Dutch, it ain’t much
Didn't know it had to be saved...It is just trying to be bred better...
BTW you can and MY dog to your list of Dutch Shepherd National Champion PSA 3 and Titiled PSA 3 @ only 3yr 2mnth.


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## Aaron Myracle

Oddly, the Dutch in my club displays none of these traits.

Loves to retrieve, not possessive at all, I can't speak to the poop-eating.

Then again, that's only one dog.

Genetics are only so much of a dog. You can't put something into a dog that isn't there genetically, but you can enhance what is there, and you can absolutely destroy or pervert it.


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## maggie fraser

I love it when folks don't read the thread ! :grin:


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## Aaron Myracle

maggie fraser said:


> I love it when folks don't read the thread ! :grin:


I know. That's why I do it.


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## hillel schwartzman

maggie fraser said:


> i love it when folks don't read the thread ! :grin:



ooops my bad

3.1


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