# SchH or IPO?



## Chris Michalek (Feb 13, 2008)

I just entered another trial and was told that I should trial as IPO1 instead of SchH1. I know there really isn't any difference other than the call out of the blind which isn't an issue for me. 

However,I can't seem to find a reasonable explanation for why I should trial as IPO instead of SchH, can somebody please explain this for me?


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## Thomas Barriano (Mar 27, 2006)

Chris Michalek said:


> I just entered another trial and was told that I should trial as IPO1 instead of SchH1. I know there really isn't any difference other than the call out of the blind which isn't an issue for me.
> 
> However,I can't seem to find a reasonable explanation for why I should trial as IPO instead of SchH, can somebody please explain this for me?


Either you want to be Politically correct and IPO is less objectionable then PROTECTION Dog or you're a title whore


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## Chris Michalek (Feb 13, 2008)

Thomas,

you can call me a title whore after I beat your ass with my MR3! ;-)


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## Thomas Barriano (Mar 27, 2006)

Chris Michalek said:


> Thomas,
> 
> you can call me a title whore after I beat your ass with my MR3! ;-)


Hey Chris

There's nothing wrong with being a title whore


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## tracey schneider (May 7, 2008)

chris michalek said:


> i just entered another trial and was told that i should trial as ipo1 instead of schh1. I know there really isn't any difference other than the call out of the blind which isn't an issue for me.
> 
> However,i can't seem to find a reasonable explanation for why i should trial as ipo instead of schh, can somebody please explain this for me?


why didnt you ask the person who told you that? 

T


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## Chris Michalek (Feb 13, 2008)

tracey delin said:


> why didnt you ask the person who told you that?
> 
> T



I did. 

"You have a malinois. That's what most malinois people do." 
"what does that mean"
"they are the same thing so don't worry about it"


that's not a reasonable explanation.


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## Joby Becker (Dec 13, 2009)

Chris Michalek said:


> I did.
> 
> "You have a malinois. That's what most malinois people do."
> "what does that mean"
> ...


Did the woman compete in SCH and did she have GSD?
that might be one reason for the suggestion...:-k:-k


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## tracey schneider (May 7, 2008)

LOL. sounds like she maybe heard it somewhere and is just regurgitating it but doenst know why so I wouldnt worry about it. I have heard some folks say it because its the "international" title and others because they say its all gonna be IPO someday.. but really for today, it doesnt matter... not for any reason I can think of anyway.

t


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## Christopher Smith (Jun 20, 2008)

Schutzhund is German and IPO is international. Some people feel that we should not be supporting a German sport in the US, we should be doing IPO or AWD. Also the AWMA and AWDF nationals are IPO trials as are the FMBB and FCI world championships. So if you are in the US and want to go to the most important Malinois trials you might want to trial IPO.


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## Chris Michalek (Feb 13, 2008)

yeah screw the Germans. IPO it is! Now that makes sense.

Thanks Chris


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## susan tuck (Mar 28, 2006)

Everyone i know seems to end up doing both anyway, no big deal.


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## tracey schneider (May 7, 2008)

Can see how it matters much, we are talking about a level ONE title here... you can go to nationals do IPO with your SCH title as a qualifier(maybe an exception somewhere?). In this instance I cant see how it matters unless you just hate the Germans lol... but wouldnt Sch be USA and VPG be German?

t


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## Christopher Smith (Jun 20, 2008)

tracey delin said:


> Can see how it matters much, we are talking about a level ONE title here... you can go to nationals do IPO with your SCH title as a qualifier(maybe an exception somewhere?). In this instance I cant see how it matters unless you just hate the Germans lol... but wouldnt Sch be USA and VPG be German?
> 
> t


It's not about hating the Germans. It's about having pride in Americans.


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## Chris Michalek (Feb 13, 2008)

Christopher Smith said:


> It's not about hating the Germans. It's about having pride in Americans.



Awwwwww.....you Californians make me smile, so full of love! 

Let's do this. Go IPO! America, **** yeah!


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## Thomas Barriano (Mar 27, 2006)

tracey delin said:


> Can see how it matters much, we are talking about a level ONE title here... you can go to nationals do IPO with your SCH title as a qualifier(maybe an exception somewhere?). In this instance I cant see how it matters unless you just hate the Germans lol... but wouldnt Sch be USA and VPG be German?
> 
> t


Tracey

Schutzhund is German (SV, DV etc.)
VPG is German too (DVG version of Schutzhund)
IPO is the International version of Schutzhund/IPO
K9 Pro Sports is the American protection dog sport. You can tell cause the judges wear American Flag shirts, drink Budweiser and
tell tall tales. BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA


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## Christopher Smith (Jun 20, 2008)

Chris Michalek said:


> Awwwwww.....you Californians make me smile, so full of love!
> 
> Let's do this. Go IPO! America, **** yeah!


Yeah were a prideful bunch!:razz:


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## tracey schneider (May 7, 2008)

Christopher Smith said:


> It's not about hating the Germans. It's about having pride in Americans.



You're right my bad the word was screw not hate....
Lol.


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## Thomas Barriano (Mar 27, 2006)

Christopher Smith said:


> It's not about hating the Germans. It's about having pride in Americans.


Chris

Is that why the 2011 AMERICAN Working Dog Federation trial has all three judges (Tracking, Obedience and Protection) from Europe and not ONE American Judge (UScA or DVG)?


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## tracey schneider (May 7, 2008)

Chris Michalek said:


> Awwwwww.....you Californians make me smile, so full of love!
> 
> Let's do this. Go IPO! America, **** yeah!


That's funny....


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## tracey schneider (May 7, 2008)

Thomas Barriano said:


> Tracey
> 
> Schutzhund is German (SV, DV etc.)
> VPG is German too (DVG version of Schutzhund)
> ...


Ah see now I thought somebody said the term schutzhund was banned in Germany... rumors ;-)... so its only "some" of the Germans that dont/can't refer to it as schutzhund..got it.


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## Christopher Smith (Jun 20, 2008)

tracey delin said:


> You're right my bad the word was screw not hate....
> Lol.


How does it "screw" the Germans Tracy?


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## Christopher Smith (Jun 20, 2008)

Thomas Barriano said:


> Chris
> 
> Is that why the 2011 AMERICAN Working Dog Federation trial has all three judges (Tracking, Obedience and Protection) from Europe and not ONE American Judge (UScA or DVG)?


You need to ask the host club about the judges, I don't have anything to do with that.


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## tracey schneider (May 7, 2008)

I honestly have no idea.... maybe ask the one that said it? Probably a good place to start....


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## susan tuck (Mar 28, 2006)

Thomas Barriano said:


> Tracey
> 
> Schutzhund is German (SV, DV etc.)
> VPG is German too (DVG version of Schutzhund)
> ...


The SV, WUSV and DVG all now use VPG (VPGI, II, III). We all just abreviate SchH because that's how we have always done it and frankly many of us don't give a shit about being politically correct, especially since the general public hasn't the first clue and couldn't give a rats ass what it means regardless of which initials are used!!!)


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## Christopher Smith (Jun 20, 2008)

tracey delin said:


> Ah see now I thought somebody said the term schutzhund was banned in Germany... rumors ;-)... so its only "some" of the Germans that dont/can't refer to it as schutzhund..got it.


The problem is not just the rumors, it's the people foolish enough to believe the rumors.


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## tracey schneider (May 7, 2008)

susan tuck said:


> The SV, WUSV and DVG all now use VPG (VPGI, II, III). We all just abreviate SchH because that's how we have always done it and frankly many of us don't give a shit about being politically correct, especially since the general public hasn't the first clue and couldn't give a rats ass what it means regardless of which initials are used!!!)


EXCELLENT thank you.... pretty much the same over here..... i dont even know how to pronounce vpg ....


Oops I just realizedyour location...


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## tracey schneider (May 7, 2008)

Christopher Smith said:


> The problem is not just the rumors, it's the people foolish enough to believe the rumors.


Yeah I guess if it was not true .... but it is...


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## Chris Michalek (Feb 13, 2008)

tracey delin said:


> EXCELLENT thank you.... pretty much the same over here..... i dont even know how to pronounce vpg ....



its short for Vigorous Pissing Game.


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## susan tuck (Mar 28, 2006)

Thomas Barriano said:


> Chris
> 
> Is that why the 2011 AMERICAN Working Dog Federation trial has all three judges (Tracking, Obedience and Protection) from Europe and not ONE American Judge (UScA or DVG)?


I could have sworn I saw you ask this same question on another forum. Wasn't it Govednik who responded to you? Didn't you like the answer?

I found it, Michelle Testa answered you. She mentioned they used USA and DVG judges in various other years along with foreign judges. Something about being very fortunate to have such a talented pool of qualifired judges from around the world to choose from? I think that's a good thing, personally.


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## Thomas Barriano (Mar 27, 2006)

susan tuck said:


> I could have sworn I saw you ask this same question on another forum. Wasn't it Govednik who responded to you? Didn't you like the answer?
> 
> I found it, Michelle Testa answered you. She mentioned they used USA and DVG judges in various other years along with foreign judges. Something about being very fortunate to have such a talented pool of qualifired judges from around the world to choose from? I think that's a good thing, personally.


Swear all you want. My post was to Chris not you.
No matter who I ask or how many times I ask. The answer is the same. The AMERICAN Working Dog Federation is so in awe of Euro judges that they see no problem in hiring all foreign
judges for the AMERICAN Working Dog Federation trial.


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## susan tuck (Mar 28, 2006)

I don't give a damn WHO you asked - if you only want the opinion of one person, ask it in a PM. But then again I forgot who I was talking to, you aren't happy unless you can find something to stir the shit about anyway - no matter how insignificant. Nobody is "in awe" of anything Thomas, people just want to see good judges from around the world, well apparently every one except you. Here is the thread: http://pets.groups.yahoo.com/group/GrassrootsUSA/message/6284


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## Kevin Walsh (Sep 8, 2009)

I could be mistaken, but during the process of setting up our DVG club in September, I thought I had read that DVG was changing to use IPO titles instead of VPG.


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## Thomas Barriano (Mar 27, 2006)

Kevin Walsh said:


> I could be mistaken, but during the process of setting up our DVG club in September, I thought I had read that DVG was changing to use IPO titles instead of VPG.



Everybody was supposed to switch to IPO in January 2011 along with a bunch of other changes, but the changes have been pushed back till 2012 or ?


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## Chris Michalek (Feb 13, 2008)

Thomas Barriano said:


> Everybody was supposed to switch to IPO in January 2011 along with a bunch of other changes, but the changes have been pushed back till 2012 or ?



I recall Doug Deacon saying new rules were supposed to come in Jan but they've been pushed back for at least a year.


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## Thomas Barriano (Mar 27, 2006)

susan tuck said:


> I don't give a damn WHO you asked - if you only want the opinion of one person, ask it in a PM. But then again I forgot who I was talking to, you aren't happy unless you can find something to stir the shit about anyway - no matter how insignificant. Nobody is "in awe" of anything Thomas, people just want to see good judges from around the world, well apparently every one except you. Here is the thread: http://pets.groups.yahoo.com/group/GrassrootsUSA/message/6284



You're the one making all the noise Suzy, cross posting and ranting on with personal insults


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## Christopher Smith (Jun 20, 2008)

Ok Tommy, so either you are shopping for the answer you want to hear or your "question" was just a way to complain. Stop being a tween, man up and make your complaint. 

I think that your complaint is perfectly legit and I too wish to see more American judges at American championships. But you sure ain't going to sway very many people with this bullshit. Why don't you get a position on the AWDF board?


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## susan tuck (Mar 28, 2006)

Thomas Barriano said:


> You're the one making all the noise Suzy, cross posting and ranting on with personal insults


hahah you just defined yourself! 

"Crossposting is the act of posting the same message to multiple forums, mailing lists, or newsgroups. This is distinct from multiposting, which involves posting multiple identical messages, each to a single forum, newsgroup, or topic area."


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## Laura Bollschweiler (Apr 25, 2008)

I admit I don't know all the details of AWDF, but in looking at it, isn't the AWDF nationals where they pick the FCI world team, so why not have a foreign judge or two or three?

A question was asked in our region about why our regional championships *should* be held in a stadium. The excellent answer was given: For the competitors' sakes. Either this is the goal and highest achievement for some, why not make it special. Or this is a stepping stone to a national event, so let's give them the same environment they'd be competing in.

So if this is a stepping stone for the FCI world competition, then why not have a foreign judge? Might take out some of the politics. And if it's the highest level for some, then why not have a judge you're not going to see at any ole club trial.

Laura
P.S. I love my country.


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## Christopher Smith (Jun 20, 2008)

One reason we need to use more US judges in our own championships is because a judge must have judged at national events to get the chance to do international events. So if we use a lot of foreign judges in our national events they get more experience than US judges and are picked to do the international trials over our own judges. We are shooting ourselves in the foot. 

Also I believe that if we don't use native judges for our championships it gives the impression that the foreign are better. 

Now let me paraphrase many of our popular politicians "If you don't agree with me you're anti-American":razz:


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