# Size or Bite



## Howard Gaines III (Dec 26, 2007)

What do you like better for a working or sport dog training, size or bite drive?


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## Carol Boche (May 13, 2007)

In my field, which is SAR, I like both size and drive. 

Size for the fact that it is easier to travel, both in the vehicle with more than one dog which I do often, and also when I fly. Makes it easier for the dog to curl up. 

Drive, well it has to be there for the work that I do. 

I have some bigger dogs as well, the Bloodhound is pushing 95# and the new GSD is 78 at 9 months.....not really an issue since they have the drives to do the work.....


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## Anne Vaini (Mar 15, 2007)

I'll take a dog I can live with and then see what it has. I like 30 pounders.


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## liz shulman (Aug 28, 2008)

Size is a factor for me, mainly because I have a lot of physical limitations and I don't like the idea of a dog that's too heavy for me to pick up ~ I had a vet emergency with on that was bigger and if I hadn't had other people at the house, I don't think I could have gotten him into the car.

I see no reason why it needs to be an "or". Plenty of little guys out there with drive.


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## David Frost (Mar 29, 2006)

I'm still a believer in "size doesn't matter". Give me a dog with drive any day. It's like which would you rather be hit with, a .223 or a .45. I figure they are both going to leave a mark. Size is only relative, to me, when it gets below 55 pounds.

DFrost


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## Michelle Reusser (Mar 29, 2008)

I'm a woman and I'm not affraid to say it...size does matter boys. LOL Ohhh you meant dogs right? I'm with David anything over about 60lbs is fine, I hate small dogs, sorry I just do.I don't want too large to work healthy but too small just doesn't make that impact...


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## Alyssa Myracle (Aug 4, 2008)

I've been knocked on my ass by more small dogs (>60 lbs), than big.


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## leslie cassian (Jun 3, 2007)

Howard Gaines III said:


> What do you like better for a working or sport dog training, size or bite drive?


Many years ago, when I first started working as a security guard with a dog, I worked a big 90# GSD male. Loved working him, just his size was enough to make me most people steer clear. 

Worked one night with another guard. His dog was a little 60# shepherd mix. Tiny next to my boy, and cute, too. Didn't think much of her as a guard dog. We were waiting to get on the elevator in the apt. building we were working, the doors opened, and little dog hunkered down, fired off, and every single person on the elevator froze. Little dog, big presence. I was impressed.

Then I saw malinois doing ringsport on tv. Little scrawny dogs, taking down full sized guys. I wanted one.

These days, because I want a dog I can lift, (in case I ever have to carry a semi-conscious, just back from the vet after being de-quilled dog into the house again,) I'll take a smaller dog with a big bite.


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## jay lyda (Apr 10, 2006)

Its all about the drive. What does the size matter if there is no drive to train the darn thing.


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## Mike Scheiber (Feb 17, 2008)

I don't think my dog would last long if he were big or helpers for that matter 
www.youtube.com/watch?v=KXt8M3sissU


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## Chris McDonald (May 29, 2008)

My dutch is about 70 pounds, I got to admit I’m really impressed watching those 40 pound mal/dutch or whatever work. There little fire crackers. I like the “sleepers” the cute little dogs that nobody is intimidated by but can work or hit like hell. My dutch is too big, when he loses a few pounds his head looks too big, looks like he’s gona tip forward just standing there. I think I would rather have one 90 pound dog after me then two 45ers. I can think of very few situations where I would want the big dog. Maybe pulling a cart or something. But even then I think I would rather two 60 pounders than one 120 pounder. Ill chose the smaller dog with the drive over the big lazy guy any day.


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## David Scholes (Jul 12, 2008)

Drive is most important but do need some size to be effective. A jack russell does look fun though.


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## Laura Bollschweiler (Apr 25, 2008)

My GSD is 90 pounds. I'd prefer a dog around 75 pounds. I have a feeling my dog's career might be shorter than a medium sized dog's, especially since he really has no sense. I just don't know how else to put it! :smile: 

I like to watch dogs with substance. I don't like those little bitty mini Malinois. I don't care how "angry" they are or how flashy their obedience is, it's just not impressive to me. 

Laura


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## Bob Scott (Mar 30, 2006)

Hard to beat a driven 10-12 lb terrier (Mini-Mals) to send down a hole with a fox/raccoon/grooundhog/possum. 
I like a GSDs about 75-80 lb with lots of drive. 
I've seen a lot of small GSDs that didn't know they were!


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## Howard Gaines III (Dec 26, 2007)

Michelle Kehoe said:


> I'm a woman and I'm not affraid to say it...size does matter boys. LOL.


Michelle I'm VERY upset! Size over drive...umn! If there isn't any drive in the size, bigger is a waste. We have a few bigger GSDs working with our group that hit like a ton of bricks. We also have some smaller dogs that hit with the same power. If given a choice, I would take smaller over bite because it's easier to transport and use. Skin to bone bites hurt and a smaller dog chewing with the buffet desire of a bigger dog is okay in my book!


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## Aamer Sachedina (May 6, 2008)

I take drive.

My Belgian is a 52# female with lots of drive. She is a blast to work. Sch is a 'sport' to me and I have no need for her to look intimidating. 

Her size allows for her to be very agile - over jumps and so on.

One place where it is a bit of a disadvantage - the SCH 3 dumbell is about as big as her! She does retrive it just fine though - just looks funny to see a little dog with a big dumbell in its mouth.


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## Gillian Schuler (Apr 12, 2008)

David Frost said:


> I'm still a believer in "size doesn't matter". Give me a dog with drive any day. It's like which would you rather be hit with, a .223 or a .45. I figure they are both going to leave a mark. Size is only relative, to me, when it gets below 55 pounds.
> 
> DFrost


A word of sense. 

My GSD is around 94 pounds, lean and very muscly and hits the decoy like a freight train and the grips "sit". He, too, is "big-headed", especially when he's been starved.

My Briard was about 10?? pounds lighter and decoys used to laugh when I entered the ring, until he hit them - one he pulled over because he hadn't been expecting it. He was often described as "home knitted" with his long hair.


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## Michelle Reusser (Mar 29, 2008)

Gillian Schuler said:


> A word of sense.
> 
> My GSD is around 94 pounds, lean and very muscly and hits the decoy like a freight train and the grips "sit". He, too, is "big-headed", especially when he's been starved.quote]
> 
> ...


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## Laura Bollschweiler (Apr 25, 2008)

Big dogs are fun!!


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## Maren Bell Jones (Jun 7, 2006)

Very simple...force equals mass times acceleration. A 90 lbs GSD likely cannot run 35 mph, but a 50 lbs Malinois could. The acceleration can make up for the mass.


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## Gillian Schuler (Apr 12, 2008)

David Scholes said:


> Drive is most important but do need some size to be effective. A jack russell does look fun though.


Especially when it's going for your neck and believe me if its got the will its got the way \\/ \\/ \\/


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## andrew boh (Oct 13, 2008)

i reckon them mals are bloody awesome and the dutches are crazy ! but ive a a bit of bias and need to say size does matter and anything around 70-75 pounds is going to hurt!


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## Gillian Schuler (Apr 12, 2008)

I was once bitten by a mouse - prettxy painful.

I don't think you can generalise but I would rate dirve "willingness to attack" over size - although size could have the advantage of knocking the assailtant down making it easier to bite??


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## David Scholes (Jul 12, 2008)

Maren Bell Jones said:


> Very simple...force equals mass times acceleration. A 90 lbs GSD likely cannot run 35 mph, but a 50 lbs Malinois could. The acceleration can make up for the mass.


and the energy dissipated is one half the mass times the velocity squared. I'm not an expert but momentum probably counts for more which is mass times velocity. Either way, speed is worth as much or more than the size as far as the physical impact. Emotionally, size might mean more than speed but that's dependent on the viewer.


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## Howard Gaines III (Dec 26, 2007)

Gillian Schuler said:


> I was once bitten by a mouse - prettxy painful.


Gillian was the mouse protection trained? :-o That will teach you to steal cheese you rat! 8-[


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## Gillian Schuler (Apr 12, 2008)

Yeah and as luck would have it the cheese had holes in it :-&


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