# Meloxicam for HD



## Chip Blasiole (Jun 7, 2006)

I have a six year old GSD with HD. X-rays look horrible, but the dog can still bolt an 80 yard fence line after a schoolbus and swims regularly. He is clearly in increasing pain as he ages and his hip clicks with each step. I just got a prescription for Meloxicam. 
Does anyone have any opinions on this med for pain related to HD, risks, etc. Any recommendations for a better med? If I get the Meloxicam online, any suggestions as to where to purchase it? Thanks.


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## Sally Crunkleton (Jan 13, 2012)

I tried the Monica once for my former GSD and I didn't see great results, and it upset his tummy- however, I know others who have great experiences using it with their dogs. I do know that it is pretty taxing on the liver, I think previcox is suppose to be a little easier on the liver. May want to check and be sure as he ages. 

Hopefully it will help in the meantime. I usually order my dog mess through www.fosterandsmith.com - much cheaper than the vet, but not sure if they fill that, as it was indicated for use in humans. If you have a Publix pharmacy that may even be free.


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## Lee H Sternberg (Jan 27, 2008)

Chip Blasiole said:


> I have a six year old GSD with HD. X-rays look horrible, but the dog can still bolt an 80 yard fence line after a schoolbus and swims regularly. He is clearly in increasing pain as he ages and his hip clicks with each step. I just got a prescription for Meloxicam 7.5mg a day or prn.
> Does anyone have any opinions on this med for pain related to HD, risks, etc. Any recommendations for a better med? If I get the Meloxicam online, any suggestions as to where to purchase it? Thanks.


It sure helps my "trick" knee and arthritis.


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## Connie Sutherland (Mar 27, 2006)

Chip Blasiole said:


> I have a six year old GSD with HD. X-rays look horrible, but the dog can still bolt an 80 yard fence line after a schoolbus and swims regularly. He is clearly in increasing pain as he ages and his hip clicks with each step. I just got a prescription for Meloxicam 7.5mg a day or prn.
> Does anyone have any opinions on this med for pain related to HD, risks, etc. Any recommendations for a better med? If I get the Meloxicam online, any suggestions as to where to purchase it? Thanks.


_
This is all JMO._

Some stuff about the risk/benefit trade-off of NSAIDs in general:

Metacam* has a somewhat better record than Deramaxx and Rimadyl insofar as liver and kidney deaths go (although it has a slightly worse record for GI problems, including serious ones like bleeding ulcers, or it did when I researched NSAIDs for dogs exhaustively four years ago).

But _all_ NSAIDs for dogs, aspirin included, have the potential for serious side effects.

OTOH, many dogs are alive and have quality of life because of an NSAID -- dogs whose debilitating pain would otherwise have caused a caring owner to PTS.

I have a dog like this. His HD and OA are bad enough that I would have had to put him down back when he was about age 8.

Now he's 12+, and the daily Deramaxx he is on is the reason he's relatively frisky and obviously happy. (I tried to withdraw the Deramaxx a few months ago for a week in order to switch him to Metacam because of the new shortage*** of Deramaxx, and learned by day three how much this drug means to his quality of life. Even with tramadol, he started spending most of the day on his heating pad, not even wanting to participate in the usual joy of his life, which is going somewhere, anywhere, in the car, and also pottying much closer to the door and then immediately returning to his heating pad. Instead of finishing the week, I started using a much bigger tablet than he needs, a size which is still available, and cutting it into doses with a razor blade.)

(Of course, he is also kept trim, and he gets daily fish oil and E and a daily GAG combo. Also, I learned range-of-motion passive exercises for him that I do every other day and he swims as often as possible [not very often, unfortunately] and gets walks on surfaces with some "give," like grass, sand, etc..)



Probably the most important thing you can do with NSAIDs is to be very aware of how to use them in the safest way possible. This includes pre-protocol bloodwork to establish baseline liver and kidney values and then regular testing to check those numbers. (My dog is re-tested three times a year.) It also means knowing and watching for the signs of GI distress. It means not giving two NSAIDs, or an NSAID and Pred, concurrently (even aspirin added to Metacam, for example), and withdrawing one NSAID for long enough for it to have completely left the system before giving a different one.

IME and IMHO, way too many owners leave the vet's office with a bottle of pills and no information sheet.



If you can afford it, I also believe that looking into Adequan is well worth the effort. Even though it's anecdotal, I've read and heard many owners enthusiastically recommending it, and explaining ways to cut the cost.

http://www.caberfeidh.com/Adequan.htm

Another thing to keep in mind is that there's an element of individual response to the different NSAIDs. One may work better than another for your dog.** (Again, there has to be a withdrawal period in between so two NSAIDs are not in the dog's system at once.)

I'm not a health professional. I did spend over a month reading stats, vet journals, and everything else I could get my hands on before starting my dog on his NSAID, and I still keep up with NSAID updates and news.



* meloxicam

** This is why my dog in on Deramaxx rather than Metacam, which would otherwise have been my first choice.

*** http://www.petcarerx.com/content/?contentid=1250




ETA: http://www.fda.gov/AnimalVeterinary/SafetyHealth/ProductSafetyInformation/ucm055434.htm_
"A Client Information Sheet should always be given to the client with each NSAID prescription. Pet owners should read this information carefully. "_


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## leslie cassian (Jun 3, 2007)

I've had two dogs on daily metacam, so this is just my personal limited experience with it. 

I started the first dog, a Rottix on it when she was about 10. She was a crazy unstoppable go all the time dog when she was young and I think that caught up to her as she aged. She looked stiffer and an old shoulder lameness came back. So I started her on Metacam. Didn't seem to do a whole lot - she still limped, so I stopped it. It took about a week for her to get grumpy and start showing signs of being uncomfortable. She would lie down and then get up and then stomp off to lie down somewhere else. Started the drugs and she just seemed happier. So I kept her on them until she died. I figured there was no fixing what was wrong with her, so keeping her comfortable, even at the expense of her liver seemed to be my best option.

The second dog was a severely dysplastic, but active labx who suddenly one day at about 8 years old seemed to be really uncomfortable. (Did not want to go for walks - would get to the park and go back to the car) So the vet recommended Tramadol and Metacam and when my dog seemed to be feeling better, I started to taper off the Tramadol and just gave him the Metacam every day. He did well for about a year, and then seemed to be in a lot of pain again. 

I know for myself, daily NSAIDs make me feel better. Doesn't fix my arthritic knee and achey hip, but makes it a lot more bearable.


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## Maren Bell Jones (Jun 7, 2006)

Meloxicam is my first go to NSAID purely because of price. There is no need to order it through shady internet pharmacies as your vet can prescribe it from their office or give you a prescription to get it at about any human pharmacy. I script it out and for a 65 lbs dog, a $4 supply will last about 4 months. If the dog does not respond, I will usually try generic carprofen and then on up to either firocoxib (Previcox) or deracoxib (Deramaxx). 

I am very, very aggressive with pain management. I will typically start a dog that presents to me with these kinds of signs with full bloodwork and urinalysis and referral for radiographs. Then we usually do some combination of medication (NSAID, tramadol, AND gabapentin, +/- amantidine), medical massage, Adequan injections, Dasuquin for the joint supplement, and concentrated fish oil. I would like to be able to do therapeutic laser and possibly acupuncture in the future. I can also do joint injections, which are pretty awesome too. Many pet dogs will need to lose a significant amount of weight as well. Until you get the inflammation and pain (and weight) under control, it is not fair to ask the dog to start rehabilitation. I want them feeling as good as possible before we start strengthening again.


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## Sally Crunkleton (Jan 13, 2012)

Sally Crunkleton said:


> I tried the Monica once for my former GSD and I didn't see great results, and it upset his tummy- however, I know others who have great experiences using it with their dogs. I do know that it is pretty taxing on the liver, I think previcox is suppose to be a little easier on the liver. May want to check and be sure as he ages.
> 
> Hopefully it will help in the meantime. I usually order my dog mess through www.fosterandsmith.com - much cheaper than the vet, but not sure if they fill that, as it was indicated for use in humans. If you have a Publix pharmacy that may even be free.


Just saw my autocorrect struck again- Monica is suppose to be Mobic and dog mess should be dog meds!


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## Bob Scott (Mar 30, 2006)

I've had good luck with Dasuquin from Maren for my older GSD. Moderate HD. At 8 yrs old he just started showing a slow down and reluctance to jump up on his dog house when it was cold and damp out. Now he's back to always being ready to play fetch till *I *get tired.


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## Nancy Jocoy (Apr 19, 2006)

For Cyra, I liked the Meloxicam, the vet talked me into it and I was surprised at the changes (she did have severe HD)

What I liked about it (and I bought the more expensive liquid) was that I could really meter the dose down and her little 50lb body wound up getting a 20lb dose. ........... she is gone now from hemangiosarcoma but her short time did improve things I thought were not that bad.


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## Chip Blasiole (Jun 7, 2006)

Thanks for all your replies. So Maren, are you saying I can take my vet's prescription to my pharmacy and they will fill it and likely at a cheaper price than online? This dog has a history of intermittent, significant red (as opposed to black,tarry) blood in his stool on about five different occasions over the past few years, without being on any meds for pain. These episodes are usually accompanied by a brief loss of appetite and intestinal "gurgling" sounds. I took a bloody stool sample in, nothing was found, and it has never been diagnosed. I suppose I should get the bloodwork done before starting it. I was using Deramaxx intermittently, until I ran out and have just started enteric coated aspirin, which I know can irritate the stomach. I have also heard the enteric coated aspirin might be passed before it can dissolve enough to provide any results.


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## Nancy Jocoy (Apr 19, 2006)

My own vet was opposed to the generic form and felt the liquid dose for pets was easier to carefully meter. That said - you have to figure out where to put your trust on that one. 

His opposition was due to the inabilty to adjust dose easily with the pills (they wanted the lowest effective dose which you slowly meter down) and that the issues that have occurred have been with the generic formulation designed for dissoulution in a human.


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## Thomas Barriano (Mar 27, 2006)

I need to get my eyes checked.

I thought the topic was
Mexican for Hip Dysplasia? ;-)


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## Maren Bell Jones (Jun 7, 2006)

Nancy Jocoy said:


> My own vet was opposed to the generic form and felt the liquid dose for pets was easier to carefully meter. That said - you have to figure out where to put your trust on that one.
> 
> His opposition was due to the inabilty to adjust dose easily with the pills (they wanted the lowest effective dose which you slowly meter down) and that the issues that have occurred have been with the generic formulation designed for dissoulution in a human.


I don't use it in dogs smaller than 40-50 lbs. For small dogs, I start with generic carprofen and go from there. But large breed dogs, I am fairly comfortable using it as long as people split the tablets appropriately.


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## Connie Sutherland (Mar 27, 2006)

_"I suppose I should get the bloodwork done before starting it. "_



IMHO, yes.


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## Kat Hunsecker (Oct 23, 2009)

Hello,

I never gave any harsh meds to a dog i had with HD. The risk of other troubls is so high. I did have very good results with feeding daily a bag of regular Gelatin, vitamin C and Glucosamin chondroiden tablets in the beginning, after a couple of years i switched to Traumeel and later added Zeel and VermiCalite cu.
wonderfull results, she had increased mobility and less inflamation. which allowed her to be more active. We called her spider dog, she was able to climb 6 ft fences and occationally hang upside down on the chainlink fence we had on top to keep her in. Later a friend agve me a couple of jars of Phycox, that worked well,too.

I would wait to start that harsh medication, or even avoid it alltogether if you can.


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## Connie Sutherland (Mar 27, 2006)

Kat Hunsecker said:


> Hello,
> 
> I never gave any harsh meds to a dog i had with HD. The risk of other troubls is so high. I did have very good results with feeding daily a bag of regular Gelatin, vitamin C and Glucosamin chondroiden tablets in the beginning, after a couple of years i switched to Traumeel and later added Zeel and VermiCalite cu.
> wonderfull results, she had increased mobility and less inflamation. which allowed her to be more active. We called her spider dog, she was able to climb 6 ft fences and occationally hang upside down on the chainlink fence we had on top to keep her in. Later a friend agve me a couple of jars of Phycox, that worked well,too.
> ...


Kat, I am no rah-rah NSAID person, which I hope was clear. But when you have an OA dog who needs it, who would have no quality of life without it, who (like mine) would have had to be put down without it, then it can be a magic bullet (and yes, with potential side effects that are not only serious, but possibly deadly).

Glucosamine chondroitin is the GAG combo I mentioned. I'm talking about OA that the GAGs and long-chain 3s and other supplements are no longer sufficient for.

I am _not_ talking about a dog who is climbing 6-foot fences. I wouldn't be looking at NSAIDs for that dog, either.


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## Maren Bell Jones (Jun 7, 2006)

So the goal of using a non-steroidal anti-inflammatory is to bring down the level of inflammation in a clinically lame dog. Once a dog is to a certain point, you will not get that under control with some of the other more ancillary stuff. For dogs that are moderately to severely affected, I use a moderate dose of the NSAID along with the medications to bring the inflammation and pain down and then see if we can taper it a bit with improvement along with all the other stuff (medications, supplements, diet, weight loss, rehab, etc). I always like to leave a little room for a ceiling to go higher if necessary.

I do find it interesting that pet owners tend to fixate on the liver side effects that they hear about on the internet, which are actually not as common as the possible GI and kidney side effects. At any rate, I have clients do bloodwork and a urinalysis before starting it and every 6 months.


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## Nancy Jocoy (Apr 19, 2006)

Our vet also said 6 months though Cyra died of hemangiosarcoma before that time was up.


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## Connie Sutherland (Mar 27, 2006)

_"I have clients do bloodwork and a urinalysis before starting it and every 6 months."_



Yes, every six months was what my vet recommended too.

And of course full awareness of what to watch for in GI symptoms.


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## Terrasita Cuffie (Jun 8, 2008)

Well, having had a dog I bred die after initiaing Rimadyl for pain after the first two weeks, I don't think the concern is misguided. I'd start with Adequan and look in to something like Boswellia, Devils Claw, Springtimes Fresh Factor, Mega Ester C, etc. I'd tap into the holistic approach especially given what the OP has already written regarding gastrointestinal issues which in a GSD you don't need. I have used tri-buffered aspirin with my bouv but long term White Willow Bark and Boswellia was a good combination with one dog. 

Terrasita


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## Kat Hunsecker (Oct 23, 2009)

I am not totally aginst the harsh meds, don't get me wrong...

The HD with my girl was severe. Once, she dislocated the hip cause it was very much gone, it went back in. so it was not a light HD case. Her drive to work was very high and she still did things she wasn't suppsoed to do....;o) like climbing a 6ft fence. severe bunny hop etc etc...

I was in the same boat with wanting to ease the pain and increae mobility and reduce the inflamation. I wanted the harsh meds to be the last resort. I tried the above mentioned treatments and within a few weeks we had improvement, that allowerd her to work for quite a while longer and then when I switched to the other homeopathic stuff we could extend it even more. 
I was surprised about the results myself.
Just wanted to throw it out there and to be considered to try before one goes to the meds with the higher risk potential. Since everything in that departement will be a long term therapy - why not give it a whirl you still can take the other meds...


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## Joby Becker (Dec 13, 2009)

Kat Hunsecker said:


> I am not totally aginst the harsh meds, don't get me wrong...
> 
> The HD with my girl was severe. Once, she dislocated the hip cause it was very much gone, it went back in. so it was not a light HD case. Her drive to work was very high and she still did things she wasn't suppsoed to do....;o) like climbing a 6ft fence. severe bunny hop etc etc...
> 
> ...


Does this read right? you were trying to maximize the length of time you could "work" a dog with severe dysplasia?


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## Thomas Barriano (Mar 27, 2006)

Joby Becker said:


> Does this read right? you were trying to maximize the length of time you could "work" a dog with severe dysplasia?


I read it as easing the pain of a dog who really wanted to work.
It's either let them work or keep them in a crate all day


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## Kat Hunsecker (Oct 23, 2009)

Thomas Barriano said:


> I read it as easing the pain of a dog who really wanted to work.
> It's either let them work or keep them in a crate all day


 You got it, beeing a kenneled dog was a torture for her mind.... to keep her happy, she had to work...


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## Joby Becker (Dec 13, 2009)

Kat Hunsecker said:


> You got it, beeing a kenneled dog was a torture for her mind.... to keep her happy, she had to work...


gotcha...


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## Maren Bell Jones (Jun 7, 2006)

Just remember this little pearl, especially regarding homeopathy...if it doesn't have any side effects, it might not have any real effects either. :wink:


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## Nancy Jocoy (Apr 19, 2006)

You know I am open minded to homeopathy when I saw some anomalies in some studies in grad school (chemistry) that seemed to support a homeopathic effect and when I mentioned it, it was written off as an artifact. Scientists are just as likely to filter information through the paradigms that are built into their own brains and things that don't fit the model are often missed.

I had my one and only kidney stone...a LARGE insoluble type simply disappear overnight with a homeopathic product. They had scheduled me for lithotripsy. The traditional doctors said I must have passed it and just missed it even though I was filtering every drop of my pee and even though there was no pain with its "passing" ....wish I remember what it was as it was about 30 years ago. A homeopathic product recently seemed to have a positive impact on Grim who is still struggling along with his problems.

It was not that long ago acupuncture was treated as voodoo medicine and it now has some acceptance at least enough that it can be practiced by licensed veterinarians. 

I think as long as you are not taking foolish risks, why not give alternative medicine a chance?


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## Connie Sutherland (Mar 27, 2006)

I'm a huge proponent of what we often call alternative or holistic medicine. 

For me, homeopathy is not included. 

Homeopathy is the practice of treating disease with minute doses of natural substances that would produce symptoms of the disease in an individual who didn't have the disease ..... and by "minute," I mean diluted and then diluted again to the point where there is sometimes no molecule of the substance left.

The word "homeopathy" is often used to mean "holistic medicine." But they aren't interchangeable. 

JMO!

But I would like very much to learn more about this:

_"I had my one and only kidney stone...a LARGE insoluble type simply disappear overnight with a homeopathic product. They had scheduled me for lithotripsy. The traditional doctors said I must have passed it and just missed it even though I was filtering every drop of my pee and even though there was no pain with its "passing" ....wish I remember what it was as it was about 30 years ago. A homeopathic product recently seemed to have a positive impact on Grim who is still struggling along with his problems."
_
I'm wondering if this was a homeopathic preparation in the traditional sense (a substance that would produce symptoms of the disease in someone who didn't have the disease ..... but hugely diluted), or more like an herbal tincture. You don't remember what it was, do you?


ETA:
_
"Scientists are just as likely to filter information through the paradigms that are built into their own brains and things that don't fit the model are often missed."
_
You're right, of course. It's amazing how much we learn we don't know as we get older. I think back fondly on my younger days when not only did I know everything, but I was invincible too! :lol:


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## Nancy Jocoy (Apr 19, 2006)

That is a valid question. It was a product called "stone dissolve" and I was told it was homeopathic but it very well could have been herbal.


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## Terrasita Cuffie (Jun 8, 2008)

I tend to fall on the herbalist side of things and have friends who are more homeopathic, but I certainly wouldn't rule out homeopathic. 

T


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## Maren Bell Jones (Jun 7, 2006)

Nancy Jocoy said:


> You know I am open minded to homeopathy when I saw some anomalies in some studies in grad school (chemistry) that seemed to support a homeopathic effect and when I mentioned it, it was written off as an artifact. Scientists are just as likely to filter information through the paradigms that are built into their own brains and things that don't fit the model are often missed.
> 
> I had my one and only kidney stone...a LARGE insoluble type simply disappear overnight with a homeopathic product. They had scheduled me for lithotripsy. The traditional doctors said I must have passed it and just missed it even though I was filtering every drop of my pee and even though there was no pain with its "passing" ....wish I remember what it was as it was about 30 years ago. A homeopathic product recently seemed to have a positive impact on Grim who is still struggling along with his problems.
> 
> ...


I'm a card carrying member of the American Holistic Veterinary Medical Association. The only one in my city, in fact. But there is a *very* broad spectrum of what is considered holistic or alternative. I am from the show me state and as you know, was trained as a scientist before I was trained as a vet, so I need to see good controlled studies before I generally recommend things to clients. I don't sell unproven potions, powders, and pills just to run up the bill like many others do. In fact, always beware if a practitioner or website attacks "Western" medicine as driven only by the pharmaceutical industry, but their main solution is to sell their favorite supplement...which is typically completely unregulated!

If clients want to try modalities I am not familiar with or comfortable with, that's fine, but I will generally try to find someone to refer them to unless there is a contraindication for that particular treatment. For example, if someone only wanted to do homeopathy on a cancer patient, that would not be something I'd be comfortable with, but if they wanted to try it as adjunctive along with more proven methods, that's fine.


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## Nancy Jocoy (Apr 19, 2006)

The approach in your last paragraph is what I would do. If I have an infection that is beyond my immune system, I am taking antibiotics, etc.

I do understand science with degrees in both biochemistry and analytical chemistry and it was some of the graduate level classes I took in quantum mechanics that left me wondering what else is out there.


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## Kathy Marcom (Mar 7, 2010)

Has anyone ever consider Costco for people/dog related medications? It's alot cheaper.


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## Maren Bell Jones (Jun 7, 2006)

The caveat is many human pharmacists (let alone the pharmacy techs) get zero training in veterinary pharmacology. My understanding is that it's typically an elective in pharmacy school. 

I stopped by Walmart a few weeks ago to ask the pharmacist a couple questions about their version of Heartgard Plus and they literally had no idea about it. I asked them if the company that makes it if they guarantee to treat the affected dog if they come down with heartworms while on the medication or if they have a reaction to it. They had no idea and just tossed me a four page print out as the only information the pharmacists had on it. The print out said nothing about either issue, so I turned to take it with me (I assumed it was mine to keep) and they told me to leave it because it was their only copy. Hmmm...I don't mind scripting stuff out especially if I don't carry it in stock (I don't carry a ton of meds as a house call vet purely for logistics), but that didn't really inspire a lot of confidence. :-k

The other thing to keep in mind is that while it may be cheaper, the reason they price those so low is because they know the average customer spends nearly $50 in the store shopping while waiting for their script to be filled. And there is no way me as a single very low volume buyer as a local small business can get drugs for as cheap as the behemoths do. For example, a tube of neo-poly-dex eye ointment (often used for superficial scratches and inflammation of the eyes) is a $4 script at Walmart. I can't even buy the stuff myself for less than about four times that from my supplier. So that kind of thing, I don't mind scripting out...if people don't mind dealing with Walmart. There's always a cost to everything...so I'd say always try to support local small businesses and ask your vet if they would match prices on what you find elsewhere.


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## Maureen A Osborn (Feb 12, 2010)

I have great success with 3 dogs, 2 with cancer, one with severe ITP/AIHA, that I did natural remedies with that cured all 3. So don't rule out natural stuff either. Acupuncture is great for pain relief in dogs. Glucosamine/Chondroiten/MSM supplements as well as Vit C is great too for arthritis. There is stuff by Amber Technology called Pet's Pain Formula that you might want to try, all herbal.


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## rick smith (Dec 31, 2010)

i'd love to learn more about holistic and natural remedies for dog problems.
i learned a tremendous amount (by necessity) when my wife was "diagnosed" with fibromyalgia and we found supps that worked very well for her. 

but researching the same for canines has gotten me more confused than when i first researched raw feeding. too many web sites based on one primary product that is being promoted, or filled with nothing but "cure stories", purely anti-traditional medicine, or mixed up with a lot of spiritual remedies and philosophies ..... got very frustrating....

finding a vet who supports anything besides traditional chemical drug treatments is impossible here and worse than trying to find human doctors with an open mind :-(


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## Maureen A Osborn (Feb 12, 2010)

Unfortunately, a lot of it I have found out by trial and error by doing a lot of reading and research. I did go to a holistic vet, but after meeting with him, he recommended the same stuff that I had already been using that I had found out on my own(it also helps that I have been in the human medical field for many years). I got ahold of a manual called," Veterinary Herbal Medicine," which is a really good read, but close to $200 for the book. You need to get a hold of real veterinary literature to back up some of the stuff you find on the internet.


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## Kat Hunsecker (Oct 23, 2009)

It is very confusing when you try to find things in the web, homeopathic, natural remedies etc... it is herbal and or mineral based. 

Best bet would be starting with books about herbal remedies/ home remedies . there are also Bach herbs ( Rescue Remedie) is one of the most popular ones, and or Schuessler Salts.
Find out what could help and which combo might be most beneficial. 
Unfortunatly i do not own very many english language books, with this information so I am not much help there. Germany is a bit further along in that departement. same with raw feeding. I get most of my info from there...

For the homepthic side, be sure to learn about the potence of the stuff, also i found out that some are classified different with letters, then with the D3( for example) that I am used to.

Two books in english I have in the shelve, but not totally worked through are:
The Doctors Book of Herbal Home Renedies 
The Encyclopedia of Natural Pet Care

might be a place to start.....


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## Maureen A Osborn (Feb 12, 2010)

Yea I know Europe is bigger on natural stuff....I know MRSA is big overthere and they are using more natural stuff to combat it...like Allicin and Tree Tea Oil. MRSI in dogs is big too, especially after that Bella dog that dies over there from it.


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