# IPO Training video



## Tracey Hughes (Jul 13, 2007)

Helper is Jaime Guillen


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YScCIx-pLG0


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## James Kotary (Nov 14, 2012)

Nice video. Your dog looks great and really listens to the release command. Good work!


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## Tracey Hughes (Jul 13, 2007)

Not my dog unfortunately.I believe this training was taking place in Spain. It's not often I see a Doberman being worked in this way, so I wanted to share.


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## Steve Burger (Jan 2, 2009)

I was just happy to see a helper without the stick stuck up his ass. A lot of the video people post that must be where it is at because you never see it.


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## Lori Gallo (May 16, 2011)

Tracey thank you for posting that video. Makes me think twice about dobermans. 
In any event I was just going to ask if someone had a video of a helper working a dog in defense so I could watch and learn.


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## Tracey Hughes (Jul 13, 2007)

This style of training is slowly making a comeback in Schutzhund. The protection part of the sport was/is way too heavy into the play side of things so now the sport needs to swing back to where it was meant to be. 

You will see that the helper doesn’t do any running around, or hissing at the dog. 
Even as pups, little helper movement or verbal attraction is done with these types of trainers, the dogs are taught to be active vs re active right from the start.

Slow, deliberate movement along with use of the stick and little sleeve movement is what you want you want the dogs to see in training. It is the same in a trial where the dog needs to be able to bring the fight to the man and bark hard without any helper influence.

Nothing is more impressive to me then to watch a powerful dog in protection with top notch control. Hard to get but so worth the training put in.


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## Daniel Lybbert (Nov 23, 2010)

Why would he make the dog lie down in the blind?


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## Steve Burger (Jan 2, 2009)

Lori Gallo said:


> Tracey thank you for posting that video. Makes me think twice about dobermans.
> In any event I was just going to ask if someone had a video of a helper working a dog in defense so I could watch and learn.


 Why would you want to work a dog exclusively in defense? We start protection work in the very beginning, utilizing their defense drive. Ideally a dog should have balance between prey and defense in their work. I will try to post a video where the defense drive of the dog is utilized, but briefly, as an provocation to go into fight drive.


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## Joby Becker (Dec 13, 2009)

Steve Burger said:


> Why would you want to work a dog exclusively in defense? We start protection work in the very beginning, utilizing their defense drive. Ideally a dog should have balance between prey and defense in their work. I will try to post a video where the defense drive of the dog is utilized, but briefly, as an provocation to go into fight drive.


steve please share as much as you can 

I just read this and to be honest I did not see anything where Lori was stating that she wants to work a dog exclusively in defense. 

what is your opinion on the video of this doberman? 

defense? fight? balance? no balance?


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## Steve Burger (Jan 2, 2009)

Joby Becker said:


> steve please share as much as you can
> 
> I just read this and to be honest I did not see anything where Lori was stating that she wants to work a dog exclusively in defense.
> 
> ...


I am not an expert in protection work by any means but I liked the dog. It looked to me like it was pretty balanced, There is no prey stimulation in the work (The helper running around like a jack rabbit or popping the sleeve)which I like.The Dobermann shows the same good barking whether the sleeve is there or not. He is grounded in his stance in front of the helper. I don't know what stage the dog is at in his training but I like it.


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## Steve Burger (Jan 2, 2009)

Lori Gallo said:


> Tracey thank you for posting that video. Makes me think twice about dobermans.
> In any event I was just going to ask if someone had a video of a helper working a dog in defense so I could watch and learn.


 Please excuse the poor handling and leash management, but in this video you will see the helper going behind me and Cairo. We were working primarily on teaching blinds (me thinks my God we are still back to working on the f#$ng blinds almost a year later) .He pops her from behind and sends her into fight. This is kind of what I was referencing above, briefly stimulating their defense drive to provoke the dog into fight (at least that is the way i interpret the work). 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E7wQd-npSlA


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## Tracey Hughes (Jul 13, 2007)

Nice to see video from you Steve.

Daniel, I am guessing the down is there to cap the dogs drive, as you can really see the dog explode up afterwards, but we would have to ask the trainers themselves as to why the down vs a sit as a way to cap drive. Or what the objective was in that scenario.


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## Joby Becker (Dec 13, 2009)

looks good to me...

One of the last Dobes, I worked was supposed to be in SCH training.
Did a few line bites to feel the dog out some..
Dude said dog was clean in the B&H and had lots of blind work with a good trainer in our area....
I got in there, and the dog came into the blind went under the sleeve and immediately tried chewing my nuts off...:-o


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## Lori Gallo (May 16, 2011)

Steve, it's been my understanding that a dog is started in prey, worked into a confident guard, bite, etc and then the dog is pressured into defense and allowed to "win" thereby building up the dog to eventually be able to work in defense without losing any confidence. Pardon the run-on sentence! I think the word is balance? I'm not sure why a dog would not be worked in prey as a young dog. 

When I think of the long bite, doesn't it make sense for he helper to start in prey, allow the dog to learn the physical demands of the bite, strike etc and let him grow up? If a young dog gets pounded and put into defense every time wouldn't that cause a weak long bite? 

Regarding the doberman in the video I'd like to see him in a much longer field.


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## Terrasita Cuffie (Jun 8, 2008)

Joby Becker said:


> looks good to me...
> 
> One of the last Dobes, I worked was supposed to be in SCH training.
> Did a few line bites to feel the dog out some..
> ...


Then what happened???? Who won?

T


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## Joby Becker (Dec 13, 2009)

Terrasita Cuffie said:


> Then what happened???? Who won?
> 
> T


lol..

I still got my nuts so I guess I did...


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## Steve Burger (Jan 2, 2009)

Lori Gallo said:


> Steve, it's been my understanding that a dog is started in prey, worked into a confident guard, bite, etc and then the dog is pressured into defense and allowed to "win" thereby building up the dog to eventually be able to work in defense without losing any confidence. Pardon the run-on sentence! I think the word is balance? I'm not sure why a dog would not be worked in prey as a young dog.
> 
> When I think of the long bite, doesn't it make sense for he helper to start in prey, allow the dog to learn the physical demands of the bite, strike etc and let him grow up? If a young dog gets pounded and put into defense every time wouldn't that cause a weak long bite?
> 
> Regarding the doberman in the video I'd like to see him in a much longer field.


 We start all of our puppies and young dog in prey with a tug only, with the handler doing all of the work. The transition to protection does not involve hammering on the dog whatsoever. It does not occur until the dog is 12-14 months of age. It means having a helper in the bushes and the handler carefully approaching. The helper rustles the bushes and hopefully the dog reacts in defense. The helper runs away. This graduates to the helper giving the dog a prey bite with a tug rewarding the alert. From there on it goes to sleeve.So the dog learns that the initial defense and alert ends up allowing him to go into prey to get a bite. This process is a work of art, and with our dogs only Lance does the work with the young dogs. It is only some time later that the helper will tag the dog from behind. In addition all of the foundation work is done long before that with a tug, including the hold, carry, out, bark and hold for the play reward in the foundation work as wel, with the puppy being active to get the tug.


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## Steve Burger (Jan 2, 2009)

Joby Becker said:


> lol..
> 
> I still got my nuts so I guess I did...


 My bitch has started to do the same. We have to keep on top of her because she reverts to being a nasty, dirty little bitch.


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## Joby Becker (Dec 13, 2009)

Steve Burger said:


> My bitch has started to do the same. We have to keep on top of her because she reverts to being a nasty, dirty little bitch.


its a fine line keeping it "almost" real 

I also worked a far better dobie in my opinion. I kinda figured he was gonna be shitty, but he was not...
Sport PP (pp event) dog...they were looking for a sort of test on him..

ran into the woods. they sent him to find me..I came out from behind the tree in the pouring rain, and charged him...he did hesitate some, was pretty surprised...but did recover quick and came in..

the dogs supposedly had great outs..from what I was told.... he never outed that day (did 5-6 bites) when I worked him..but hell..I was still impressed..he never popped off either...


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## Joby Becker (Dec 13, 2009)

Steve Burger said:


> We start all of our puppies and young dog in prey with a tug only, with the handler doing all of the work. The transition to protection does not involve hammering on the dog whatsoever. It does not occur until the dog is 12-14 months of age. It means having a helper in the bushes and the handler carefully approaching. The helper rustles the bushes and hopefully the dog reacts in defense. The helper runs away. This graduates to the helper giving the dog a prey bite with a tug rewarding the alert. From there on it goes to sleeve.So the dog learns that the initial defense and alert ends up allowing him to go into prey to get a bite. This process is a work of art, and with our dogs only Lance does the work with the young dogs. It is only some time later that the helper will tag the dog from behind. In addition all of the foundation work is done long before that with a tug, including the hold, carry, out, bark and hold for the play reward in the foundation work as wel, with the puppy being active to get the tug.


show some video of this.. 

This is very similar to how we do PP training.


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## Steve Burger (Jan 2, 2009)

Joby Becker said:


> show some video of this..
> 
> This is very similar to how we do PP training.


 Sorry don't have any. Not only that but it if we did it would have to be from a long distance away because everyone is kept at the far end of the field.


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## Joby Becker (Dec 13, 2009)

Steve Burger said:


> Sorry don't have any. Not only that but it if we did it would have to be from a long distance away because everyone is kept at the far end of the field.


understandable.. I guess tripods are a foreign object 

anyhow I know video is not a priority or even desirable in some cases..

I dont have any video either..

was hopeful though..cant blame a guy for askin...


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## Steve Burger (Jan 2, 2009)

Joby Becker said:


> understandable.. I guess tripods are a foreign object
> 
> anyhow I know video is not a priority or even desirable in some cases..
> 
> ...


 Hello camera's and video camera's are pretty much a foreign object at West Coast.


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## Joby Becker (Dec 13, 2009)

Steve Burger said:


> Hello camera's and video camera's are pretty much a foreign object at West Coast.


Yep...can video the trial...if desired..makes perfect sense..


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## Thomas Barriano (Mar 27, 2006)

Steve Burger said:


> My bitch has started to do the same. We have to keep on top of her because she reverts to being a nasty, dirty little bitch.


Steve,

You say that like it's a bad thing? ;-)


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## Steve Burger (Jan 2, 2009)

Thomas Barriano said:


> Steve,
> 
> You say that like it's a bad thing? ;-)


I know, right? Worked on it today. After about 10 good zaps she finally settled back..for now anyway.


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