# Question about Breeder/buyer contract



## Molly Graf (Jul 20, 2006)

not sure if this is the right place for this - 

Need some advice, different points of view about this matter.

I sold two puppies to one owner, one is now spayed, highly accomplished/titled (schh titled, UDX, tracking), older female with health problems. The other a young adult with BH and <was> in training toward her Schh titles and other various tracking and obedience titles, not spayed.

The owner recently passed away, unexpectedly. She had gone into the hospital for a major surgery, left her dogs in the care of friends - my two were left in her home with a housesitter/friend, the other two (not my dogs) were in someone else's home being cared for. Of course she expected to come home and resume care of her dogs.

The owner signed my contracts, for both dogs, which includes a first right of refusal clause in the case of the owner needing to place the dogs for any reason. 

Since the owner's death I had attempted communication with the friend I was told either had the dogs, or knew where the dogs were. That didn't go so well... these friends are "akc folks" - anti-breeder, anti-schutzhund, anti-working dogs, anti-intact dogs, anti-kenneling dogs - in other words, "typical animal rights" sort of folks. I caught all of that when I spoke to this lady who was obviously not interested in speaking to me about getting the dogs back.

So instead I spoke to the solicitor of the owner's estate (she did not have family interested in the dogs at all, no close family members at all). In fact the solicitor contacted me first, asking if I wanted the dogs (yes!) and asking me to fax him the signed contracts, which I did immediately.

I later heard (through my attorney who I asked to contact the solicitor on my behalf when I didn't hear back from him and they wouldn't return my phone messages) that my contracts were not legally binding, and that they would make the decisions on where the dogs went.

I then sent a letter through my attorney asking for the return of the dogs and explaining why I would be the best choice for rehoming these two working-bred GSDs.

I heard later that the "friends" planned on having the younger dog spayed.

No response, so my attorney advised me to simply give up on getting these dogs back, and he will be rewriting my contract to make it legally binding in the case of something such as this happening in the future.

Any advice/opinions or ideas? I'd like to get the dogs back - if anyone knows how I might go about doing that? and if I can take my contract to court to get the dogs back, or just give up?

my current contract (the one the owner signed for both dogs) is on my website, link to "guarantee" http://workinggermanshepherd.com


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## Melissa Thom (Jun 21, 2011)

A contract is only as good as your willingness to fight for it but in this case I think they're right. You don't have but a wobbly leg to stand on. I would leave your number with them and try to let them know that if things don't work out the dogs have a home to go to. 

Reality is most dog contracts do not stand up in court since dogs are a transfer of property.


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## Ariel Peldunas (Oct 18, 2008)

Molly ...would you be able to say what about your contract was found not to be legally binding and what your attorney did/will do to make it so? I'm curious and it might be a concern for me down the road.


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## rick smith (Dec 31, 2010)

unfortunate situation to be in and i feel for you

i do know from past experience that unless you spend considerable time and money under the guidance of a lawyer who specializes in contract law that you stand a good chance that another such lawyer on the opposite side will find a way to nullify your contract.....that's what they are "bred to do", it's "genetic" and some are very good at it :-(

my suggestion if you are very concerned with being able to enforce a contract regarding a K9 sale is to pay a professional to do a thorough legal search and find litigation that ruled in favor of the contract and supported it. then i would pattern mine in a VERY similar manner to the one that was enforced in court.

when you can show a legal precedent that "your" (theirs) contract held up, you are in a MUCH stronger legal position to have the courts rule in your favor, regardless of how confident some legal beagle is when you pay them to do one for you 

this may sound like going backwards and a pita, which it is, but i hope you understand my approach; which boils down to : go with a proven winner


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## Brian Anderson (Dec 2, 2010)

That is a heck of a tangle to be in and I certainly sympathize with your plight. The way I would go about getting the dogs back I would not suggest to anyone else. I assure you the dogs WOULD come back to me and there would not be a lawyer in the mix.


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## James Downey (Oct 27, 2008)

Molly, Just because you do not have a "good contract". Does not mean the judge will not err in your favor. If they are just being A-holes out of righteousness, The judge may help you. I bought a home and the people who sold it to me. We had them fix 3 three things...well long story short they were shady and tried to go the cheap route. They asked us for estimates to fix and yada yada yada. but we did not watch are words very well in the contract and even to me, they had done what we wrote down. But it was not our intent. We went to court and the judge awarded me the decision based on they were being pompus and basically calling me a fool. 

So, even though your lawyer says the contract is not the greatest...even just taking them to court may scare them enough. Be professional, let them wig out and the judge may help. 

And in the end Molly if this does not work out to your favor. The dogs going to people concerned about animal rights are going to most likely give the dogs a good life.


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## Brett Bowen (May 2, 2011)

That;s unfortunate. I may be reading between the lines but it sounds like the solicitor of the estate may end up giving them to you anyway. I think you've done what you could do by letting them know why you would be the better choice. 

As far as rewriting the contract, I'm no attorney, but I would think that unless the contract is written in such a way that it basically says: "Me the breeder is still owner of the dog, I'm just allowing you to lease this dog from me therefore I can get the dog back under the following circumstances blah blah blah" I don't think you'll have much of a chance anyway. Not to mention, I wouldn't sign that contract. 

But like has been mentioned, go to court they may not show and you get summary judgement. Or you get a sympathetic judge or an idiot attorney on the other side.


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## ann schnerre (Aug 24, 2006)

molly, from the buyers side, i have learned the hard way that a puppy contract is worth less than the paper it's written on. the sellers commitment is what matters when things go south, as they did here (thank you for being a breeder that is really concerned, btw).

when you get a legally binding contract, would you put it up here? i mean, really a contract to buy that's signed by both parties seems binding to me, but evidently it's not?


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## Paul R. Konschak (Jun 10, 2010)

What comes around seems to always go around


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## Molly Graf (Jul 20, 2006)

Paul, can you explain what you mean by that?


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## Bob Scott (Mar 30, 2006)

My guess is that if nothing was in a legal will as to the dogs (property) the issue will go into probate. 
Who takes car of the dogs in the meantime is anyone's guess. 
I have nothing to do with legal "stuff'. This is just a guess on my part.


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## Molly Graf (Jul 20, 2006)

thanks Bob - what does "going into probate" mean?


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## Bob Scott (Mar 30, 2006)

Molly Graf said:


> thanks Bob - what does "going into probate" mean?



As per Missouri
Any personel property that isn't listed as POD (Pay on Death) or TOD (Transfer on Death) will go to probate court. It's "listed" in the court daily records for 9 months were people have the right to make a claim towards the property. 
At the end of that time IF there are no claims against it, the court will ask the executor of the will how they want this property distributed. Then that has to be approved by the court. 
Not gospel on this but my wife is going through it with her dad's estsate because not everything had a POD or TOD on it. 
Anything of value that isn't in a will must have a POD or TOD on it in order for it to transfer directly to the person named as receiver of the property. 
Again, a lawyer could explain this way better then me. Probably more accurately also. :wink:


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## Thomas Jones (Feb 4, 2011)

Molly Graf said:


> Paul, can you explain what you mean by that?


I think he means that the people who are acting like a-holes will get what's coming to them. You have a lawyer tell his to get to work if you want them.


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## Paul R. Konschak (Jun 10, 2010)

*Cäsch vom Salztalblick*


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## Steve Groen (Aug 22, 2010)

James Downey said:


> Molly, Just because you do not have a "good contract". Does not mean the judge will not err in your favor.
> 
> James, I do not mean to pick on you, but this is a common misconception.
> 
> ...


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## Molly Graf (Jul 20, 2006)

Paul, LOL you are clueless. ok, whatever.

molly


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## Molly Graf (Jul 20, 2006)

steve, thanks very much for your informative post. Yes, I am told that my contract as worded is not legally enforceable in this case. Probably not in any case where the buyer decides not to honor the signed/written agreement that I get first right of refusal to get dog(s) back if the buyer decides to place or sell it for any reason. My contract certainly does not cover the possibility of death of the buyer, or what might happen to the guarantee if I were to die. 

anyway I'm not happy about it, but of course the main thing is the dogs' welfare and I hear (through the grapevine as noone has honored me enough with any direct information about the dogs' welfare or who has them) - that the dogs are in good hands and are receiving good care. That's good enough for me to not worry about them, and so that has to be good enough as I will not be attempting to enforce an unenforceable contract against the estate of a deceased dog buyer.

I will however have a new contract ready to go before the next litter is ready to go, that will be as legally enforceable as possible.

thanks for the advice and information, very interesting thread.

molly


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## Steve Groen (Aug 22, 2010)

Molly Graf said:


> I will however have a new contract ready to go before the next litter is ready to go, that will be as legally enforceable as possible.
> 
> molly


Molly, 

It's always good to hear when breeders are this concerned over the welfare of their pups. It's too bad that transactions can't be like in days past when a handshake was a good as gold and one's word was his or her bond.

Apart from a detailed hold harmless clause (even for puppy contracts), you probably want to make sure your contract has a choice of law (your state's) and choice of forum (your county) clauses, too, so that the other party in potential litigation doesn't drag you to some remote place at your expense when problems arise. 

Steve


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## Molly Graf (Jul 20, 2006)

yes my current contract already has this (state, county) in case of any court hearings... I am told it is the wording of the "right of first refusal" or lack of wording as the case may be, that is the problem.

thanks again.

molly


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## Molly Graf (Jul 20, 2006)

so this is somewhat off-topic, but any advice on a contract for the sale of an adult, trained and/or titled dog? I would want a hold harmless clause, something about health/hips/etc for the buyer, and also a right of first refusal or buy-back first clause to protect the dog from going to the shelter, or being placed into an inappropriate home or... whatever, I just want to know where my dog is and that he is being cared for properly even if he changes hands.

are there any such contracts online (puppy or adult dog) that are legally enforceable (worded in such a way that they would hold up in court) for the seller, where I could take a look at it?

molly


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## rick smith (Dec 31, 2010)

Molly, since you have heard from a real world attorney, i suggest anyone, especially dog breeders, who makes "contracts" regarding dog transactions, go back and read my advice if you want to use one that will actually WORK as a "contract" 

and if the attorney (mark?), who is also a dog enthusiast, would like to provide a valuable service to the many members on this forum, why not take some time when the case loads allows some "dog time", and search for some enforceable legal precedents that upheld a K9 sales contract that was litigated

i'm not so naive as to think there is ONE contract that will cover all, and i don't care what state he practices in because contract law is basic to any state, but there are obvious statements that need to be in writing to guarantee ANY success that the contract IS a contract and will be recognized as an enforceable contract in a courtroom overseen by an uncorrupted judge or determined by an attorney influenced jury 

fwiw, i think we all know that dogs are property, not personal friends or relatives of their owners and that the days of handshake deals and contracts are OVER 
- breeding and training dogs should be a passion - buying and selling them should be an ethical business transaction


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## Howard Gaines III (Dec 26, 2007)

Contracts are only as good as the parties who sign.
If you want to keep your stuff under your control...continue to OWN IT.
Otherwise like most folks, you end up picking the battles you hope to win and in the end, was the cost worth it?!


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## rick smith (Dec 31, 2010)

Howard.... very true
that's why i would never go in to a battle without knowing i have a winning hand b4 i start ....

and since it's probably hard to buy a decent dog these days without some form of paperwork involved why not get something that might be worth more than TP if it ever comes to a battle
...so why not have a genuine lawyer who likes dogs help us all 
... pro- "bone oh" 
i get paid for doing a lot of the same things i've taken my time to do on this forum for free and i would hope others feel the same way
- if i was a breeder living in the states i sure as heck would make sure any "contract" i use was worth a bit more than the paper i wrote it on

if not important; move to Japan  contracts over here are viewed a lot differently than in the states  ((never intended to be "ironclad"))


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## James Downey (Oct 27, 2008)

Steve Groen said:


> James Downey said:
> 
> 
> > Molly, Just because you do not have a "good contract". Does not mean the judge will not err in your favor.
> ...


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## Molly Graf (Jul 20, 2006)

When my new contract is finished (will be before my next litter of puppies is ready to leave) it will be posted on my website, and I am happy to share that with all interested enough to click on a couple links. Whether or not it will stand up in court in a situation like this one, or not will be a question of "when that situation tests it" but I know it will be better than the one I have now, anyway.

thanks for all of the great advice!

molly


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## Howard Gaines III (Dec 26, 2007)

rick smith said:


> Howard.... very true
> that's why i would never go in to a battle without knowing i have a winning hand b4 i start ....
> 
> and since it's probably hard to buy a decent dog these days without some form of paperwork involved why not get something that might be worth more than TP if it ever comes to a battle
> ...


Everything is different over there. A closed culture is screwed up with the degree of social issues we have here. I understand your point and thanks!


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## Thomas Barriano (Mar 27, 2006)

It would be cheaper and easier to just hire someone to go over and steal the dog back. Of course that isn't something I would suggest on a public forum with lots of law enforcement officers on it


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## Molly Graf (Jul 20, 2006)

thanks Thomas, but no, that's not an option I will consider, unless of course the dogs were in an abusive situation, which I'm confident they are not.

molly


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## David Frost (Mar 29, 2006)

We purchase dogs. I can't enter a contract on behalf of the state. I test it, have it evaluated medically, all on my dime. I pay the price the vendor is asking and take his guarentee, whatever that might be. There are no contracts. But then, I don't generally buy from breeders.

DFrost


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## sam wilks (May 3, 2009)

maybe, and this sucks I know, you could offer them some money for the dogs. If you really want them back, and they are just being jerks, that could change things around possibly. maybe if they are animal rights people and they really care about the dogs, they will see that you care about the dogs enough to offer up your own money to make sure they are taken care of! It would still be cheaper than legal fees Id imagine.


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## Molly Graf (Jul 20, 2006)

there will be no legal fees as my attorney advised me that indeed my contract won't hold up in court. And I have already presented a written offer to the solicitor which was not accepted. Of course my "first right of refusal" clause in my contract does not say anything about getting dogs back for free - I am prepared to pay for them if necessary - that option has not been given to me in this case.

molly


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