# Meet Hoss Vom Canuck



## Sarah Platts

Meet the newest ankle biter!

Hoss Vom Canuck out of Fina III von Neuarenberg x Lebeau KS vom Hege-Haus

















He was the smallest pup in the litter, one-third smaller than the rest of his littermates, and not the one I went there to get. But during the testing process showed me that he had the machismo to do the job so I picked him up and went down the road with him. I'm looking forward to see this pup grow up and develop into a first rate sar dog.


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## Sarah Platts

And yes, he really does bite ankles.....


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## Nicole Stark

Handsome pup you got there. I like the smallies. Congrats!


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## Misty Wegner

What a cutie! Bet he will be an asset and a great partner


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## Bob Scott

Outstanding!

I've never been big on bird dogs but if I were to get one it would be the GSP. Outstanding dogs!


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## leslie cassian

Squeeeeee!


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## susan tuck

Congratulations on your new pup! Looking forward to reading about his progression in training.


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## rick smith

like most all pups .... simply adorable 
i'd like to hear how your selection process went that made you choose him.
machismo gives me a mental image of a bullfighter


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## mel boschwitz

Such a cutie! Keep us updated on his training. I have enjoyed reading about Gus


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## Sarah Platts

rick smith said:


> like most all pups .... simply adorable
> i'd like to hear how your selection process went that made you choose him.
> machismo gives me a mental image of a bullfighter


I thought about straight answering but think this needs it's own home.


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## Meg O'Donovan

Sarah Platts said:


> He was the smallest pup in the litter, one-third smaller than the rest of his littermates, and not the one I went there to get. But during the testing process showed me that he had the machismo to do the job so I picked him up and went down the road with him. I'm looking forward to see this pup grow up and develop into a first rate sar dog.


Congrats! I like his name too. In the testing process, by macho do you mean how he responded to scent or how pushy he was with other dogs/people, or what? I wish you an excellent future ahead with this lovely pup.


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## Sarah Platts

Meg O'Donovan said:


> Congrats! I like his name too. In the testing process, by macho do you mean how he responded to scent or how pushy he was with other dogs/people, or what? I wish you an excellent future ahead with this lovely pup.


I'll tell you I didn't pick his name the breeder did but he readily answers to it so won't change it. I started another thread that I hope some of the non-sar folks would respond to on what they think would be traits or behaviors to test for. I will tell you that the breeder said no hunter would have selected this pup based on how he saw me make my decision. Evidently, a hunter would have used a different set of criteria. Interesting....


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## Catherine Gervin

VERY cute puppy and i like that name! very John Wayne...


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## Bob Scott

A puppy or even a grown dog can learn to respond to a new name in a matter of hours of days ant most. :wink:


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## Sarah Platts

Bob Scott said:


> A puppy or even a grown dog can learn to respond to a new name in a matter of hours of days ant most. :wink:


To true, I've renamed dogs but only when they told me to. I got a lab once as a rescue. Trained her for mantrailing and cadaver. Her name when I got her was Emily Lou. She never seemed attached to it but loved the name Sam (the lab). My GSP Ben was named 3 times. Diego by his first handler, renamed to Coda by his second. I used that name for about 6 months and he never responded well to it for me. Spent a couple of days trying out other names and he liked Ben. So Ben, he became. Ben loved "Ben".

I didn't really care for the name but the pup's made it clear that he likes it. So I'm starting to like it too. It's one syllable, doesn't sound similar to my other dogs' names, easy to get out even if your lips are frozen together and a respectable male name although many people are saying ".... like in Bonanza...?"


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## Bob Scott

I got a St. Bernard when she was 11 months old and her name was......8-[........ :-& Fluffy! :-&

She was responding to Sam by the next day.


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## Nicole Stark

Sarah Platts said:


> I started another thread that I hope some of the non-sar folks would respond to on what they think would be traits or behaviors to test for. I will tell you that the breeder said no hunter would have selected this pup based on how he saw me make my decision. Evidently, a hunter would have used a different set of criteria. Interesting....


Sarah, did the breeder tell you what traits the hunting folks would have selected for - or if not and you know, what are they?

I was going to respond to your question in the other post but it didn't come up in my recent posts so I will have to go look for it later.

Oh yes, maybe you already said but is there is specific reason you are drawn to this breed? From my perspective, something about them seem to make for a pretty balanced dog for the type of work you have them doing.


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## Sarah Platts

the biggest thing is the breeder told me was they didn't want the pup to come back to them. So they wanted a puppy that initally may say 'hi' first but then left the person(s) and spent the entire time off doing their own thing. So if the pup would come in to say 'hi' and then go back out, that was counted as a problem even though the pup left the person again. They didn't want a pup that 'checked-in' because it was felt that the puppy would later spend time running back and forth to the human and not getting out and staying out looking for birds. Unless the hunter calls the dog back, they are not to return to the hunter on their own.

They also would plant wings to see how far out the pup would catch the scent or who picked up on it the fastest


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## Sarah Platts

Nicole Stark said:


> I was going to respond to your question in the other post but it didn't come up in my recent posts so I will have to go look for it later.
> 
> Oh yes, maybe you already said but is there is specific reason you are drawn to this breed? From my perspective, something about them seem to make for a pretty balanced dog for the type of work you have them doing.


I was hoping Rick would respond but evidently he won't particpate in a discussion.

I fell into the breed but like the strong nose, the ability to turn off-lead, the heat tolerance, their work ethic and all the gas they have in their tank. Good structure and low health issues and general behavior things. Like low dog agression issues. These dogs are expected to get along with others, and work together.


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## Nicole Stark

Noted. Obviously, my response wouldn't make or break the thread you started so I'll leave it up for him to respond should he choose to.


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## Meg O'Donovan

Sarah Platts said:


> the biggest thing is the breeder told me was they didn't want the pup to come back to them. So they wanted a puppy that initally may say 'hi' first but then left the person(s) and spent the entire time off doing their own thing. So if the pup would come in to say 'hi' and then go back out, that was counted as a problem even though the pup left the person again. They didn't want a pup that 'checked-in' because it was felt that the puppy would later spend time running back and forth to the human and not getting out and staying out looking for birds. Unless the hunter calls the dog back, they are not to return to the hunter on their own.
> 
> They also would plant wings to see how far out the pup would catch the scent or who picked up on it the fastest


So independence means good hunting. As long as they are willing to retrieve? Or does this breed just indicate (no retrieve) when hunting? I met one guy who has pointers and he said they should hold the stance until they are released from it. This guy hunts on horseback, and said it was key for the dog to work way out in front and then just hold when it found until he could catch up. No wonder people put GPS on the hunting dogs.


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## Sarah Platts

I know my first GSP was out there. He was from AFC/DC stock. For him it was all about the next horizon. Many people likened him to watching a machine work. 

I like the independence or as one breed description put it "willful disobedience". Even though I've never hunted my dogs, they do hold and honor each other.

Long before there were GPS's, there were bells. I remember one guy saying he thought Bossy The Cow was running up on him. I still use them.


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## Bob Scott

The field trial dogs are bred to be big runners. That's the reason you'll see lots of horses at the big trials. You could never keep up with one on foot. 

The other side of the coin is a meat and potato dog meaning it works close enough to walk behind and get you limit.


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## Sarah Platts

Bob you're right. The NAVHDA/DKs are dogs that do work closer to the human and their staminas are different. Its a very distinct difference once you see the examples in real life. The endurance and distance of AFC-bred dog was literally the stuff of legends. The flankers used to rotate out every couple of miles because that dog worked and worked quickly. The longest trail I ran on the ground with him was 22 miles in about 8 hours. Then we turned around the next day and ran one that was 20+. The dog could be weaving on his feet with exhaustion but shake the harness at him and he would surge for the door. Not something I could easily duplicate with the dogs I'm working now.


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## Bob Scott

Not to mention the equipment and expense of trialing the AFC dogs. :grin:

I'm not sure if doing scent work on the ground with a dog like that would be worth all the trouble. 

You would need marathon runners to go with you as ground pounders. :grin:


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## Sarah Platts

Bob Scott said:


> You would need marathon runners to go with you as ground pounders.


Let's see ...... but one guy in the hospital for a heart attack. Had 2 cops blow out their knees. Two more injure their backs. Had one pleading over the radio for someone to come shoot this dog. Had another issue him a speeding citation. Told one guy to lose all the extra gear on his belt only to have him say that it wouldn't be a problem. When I stopped to change out flankers, he grabbed the new guy and pulled him behind the police car telling him to drop all the extra gear off his belt.
I had people putting in for leave when they heard we were coming to town just so they wouldn't have to flank. It was the initiation for one department, sticking the newest guy on the force with me. When we got ready to start the 'old' guys would all line up just to watch the start. Dog would take off and I would hear a string of "Run faster..... they're getting away from you...." Big Joke for those in the know. Which is why I always told them to flank me in a car. When I cut between building or into brush, one guy would bail out to follow and then get picked back up by the car when next we got to a road. If no car, then I always asked for the most physically fit person for flanker duty. The only guy I truly had keep up with Jack and I ran marathons on the side. Ah, the memories....


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## Bob Scott

:lol: Sounds like Forrest Gump didn't have a thing on you. :grin: :wink:


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## Sarah Platts

So the little guy has been loose since I picked him up. I thought it was probably due to all the traveling and food changes but it was not resolving. So I ended up putting him on a course of metronidazole and that sure made a difference. Energy up, eating up, sleeping through the night, etc. Now that he's feeling better, a better name for him should be trouble. Definitely making his feelings known on a variety of subject.


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## Sarah Platts

In addition to the giardia he had cystitis as well. Almost done with that course of antibiotics. His weight at 8 weeks is what the rest of his littermates were at 6weeks. At 18.8lbs, he's a little bruiser.


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## Bob Scott

Hopefully he's on the mend for good now!


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## Sarah Platts

Hoss has made up for lost time. He's now up to the same size and weight as his littermates. 

Started doing HR kitchen drills last night. I'm using teeth but he absolutely adores the smell. Will grab the jar and make off with it at any opportunity. I kept having to rescue it from his clutches.


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## Bob Scott

"Working HR kitchen drills"

Cleaned out your fridge huh Sarah?! :twisted: :grin: :wink:


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## Sarah Platts

Bob Scott said:


> "Working HR kitchen drills"
> 
> Cleaned out your fridge huh Sarah?! :twisted: :grin: :wink:


Wellll, a gal has to do what a gal has to do.....lol

Just don't go looking in the freezers...


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## Sarah Platts

Did drills again to day. Kitchen drills are nothing more than taking a jar of stuff and sliding it around the floor. I slide the jar while I'm saying the word as the pup will take off after the jar. Once they get there, the pup will either nose the jar or, more desirable, hit the jar with his paw. Then I click and reward. Rinse and repeat. This way the pup learns the search command coupled with the material coupled with reward. Ultimately, I want the paw slap. Once I have him slapping the jar then I will add a sit and fade out the paw slap for an initial indication. The paw slap come back into play when I ask for a "show me". That way I have a passive alert but can ratchet it up to an active alert if necessary.


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## Misty Wegner

That's a cool way of teaching your alerts.. Glad Hoss is doing so well  You going to do trail with him as well or just HRD?


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## Sarah Platts

Misty Wegner said:


> That's a cool way of teaching your alerts.. Glad Hoss is doing so well  You going to do trail with him as well or just HRD?


I'm doing both. I just rolled back in from training and did a couple of sets of puppy runaways while waiting for the tracks to age for the older dogs. He's a pistol.


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## Misty Wegner

So much fun to work with a dog with so much potential! Can't wait to hear how he progresses


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## Bob Scott

Another method I've used is similar. 

I hold the salt shaker or whatever has the scent in it then mark and reward for even looking in the direction then nose contact. 

From there it goes on the ground next to me and eventually further away, etc. 

One reason I would use this is to keep the dog from retrieving the object. 

ANYTHING rolled across the floor was an invite to retrieve because it was a natural thing for him from the get go. 

Lots easier for me if they learn that I'm wanting only nose contact. From there whatever alert I build in comes later as you do.


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## Sarah Platts

Puppies are great. However, there reaches a point where you hope he survives past the point where you want to just strangle him. He's a definite handful. Reminds me horribly of my first gsp, Jack. People say they want a "high drive" dog until they actually get one......


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## Meg O'Donovan

If you have time, please make video of the "baby bad boy" doing his kitchen drills. Could use some puppy moments in my life, even if just video. Hope he grows into a great one like your Jack too!



Sarah Platts said:


> Puppies are great. However, there reaches a point where you hope he survives past the point where you want to just strangle him. He's a definite handful. Reminds me horribly of my first gsp, Jack. People say they want a "high drive" dog until they actually get one......


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## Sarah Platts

Hoss is coming along with his HR. No indication yet but he knows the search word and the connection between that and hunting for odor. 

I met with a woman who is doing a research study on cadaver dogs. Spent about 4 hours talking with her about HR and the basics of how you train an HR dog. Then I set up a few little problems where the hide was placed so that she could see the dog work odor (like along a wall). Started with Hoss doing little puppy problems and then sent out my other dogs on those hides to let her see what a finished dog looks like. 

She told me later that she though it would be hard to tell when the dogs detect odor but she was very happy that it was so obvious. That someone with no dog experience was able to *see* when they hit odor. She's got some kinks to iron out with her project but I'm really curious to see how it all pans out.


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## Bob Scott

Sounds great!

Nothing like watching a good indication from a dog.


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## Sarah Platts

Haven't done a post in a while. Hoss is 4 months old (where does the time go?) and the switch finally threw in his brain that, gee, you actually can follow that human odor stuff and it DOES take you somewhere and you get fun stuff at the end. I've never done tracking circles or train track style work with him but strictly human odor scent article and a walking subject. Now that he's got the *idea* he should take off with his trailing work.

He loves the odor of dead human and the biggest issue now is that he wants to pick it up and carry it around like a great stinky prize. Working on that issue but can be tricky as it's sporadic when he does it. Have started working on his trained indication and his animal proofing.

I was drifting around the youtube world and found the videos by a horse harness driving trainer by a guy called Barry Hook. He lives in England but posts videos about all the work he does and how he deals with the problems: horses that won't stand quiet, shying from vehicles, manners in harness. He makes it a point to simplify the task down to the horse, puts them back into soft bits and makes the horses enjoy the work. Some of the dog trainers I've known could sure stand to take a few lessons from this guy. Has basic expectations and wants the horse to do them. Not because they are forced to but because it's the logical things to do. I like the mannerisms of the guy and the way he deals with stuff. I've exported some of his philosophy over to how I train my dogs. 

I was having an issue with Gus hitting the end of the lead. I don't like using e-collars to fix simple OB things. Prong collars only worked when he was wearing them, and the same with quick turns or using food rewards. I threw some Barry Hook on him yesterday and in the space of 3 short walks, the dog is walking on a loose lead with no more pulling. Took him to the woods today and was waking the pack of 6 dogs out and other dogs are yanking but he's still on a slack lead. Its something I needed to help refine myself with.


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## Bob Scott

Seems horse trainers have traditionally been "firm" trainers till the Horse wisper guy came along. 

My youngest brother hung out at a horse barn that was pretty much old retired rodeo folks.

Seems a lot of them felt anything could be cured with a crack in the head or a good kick in the ribs. :roll:

As a kid I recall my other brother was grabbed on the shoulder by a horse and shook like a rat. Dad hit it across the head with a coal shovel. :-o

Luckily bro had a heavy coat on.


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## Sarah Platts

Yeah, I think this guy is more like a Monty Roberts. He talks to them in sentences and generally the aids, when given are light. The guy isn't a yanker or cranker which is different then a lot of horse trainers I know. It's not about domination. It's about here's my expectations and this is my part and this is your part. Think about it. The guy is sitting up on a carriage and only have the reins, the whip, and his voice and he uses his voice well. Most of the stuff is just standard speaking tones unless the horse isn't listening and then he just growls more. He's got vids showing the horses going right and correctly until the owner or driver gets ahold of them and you can see the problems just starting. And just the slight correction at the right time fixes things before they get to bad. 

I like the one where he was going on about how he got this team straightened up but the owner (who's been driving for years) ain't doing his job and in in a fortnight this guy's going to screw up these horses and they will be right back where they were wasting what he (Barry) spent weeks fixing. I don't know but it struck a chord with me between people who know what they are doing and the ones who think they do.


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## Misty Wegner

Good analogy.. I have been a natural horsemanship trainer and clinician for 20+ yrs and the principal behind it is this: make the wrong thing hard and the right thing simple ; teach rather than force ; you get out what you put in ; relationship is everything, obedience, trust, consistency follows good leadership (which includes a relationship)... Many of the methods work on dogs, certainly the principles but being a horse is prey and a dog predator, there are a few different transitions... You can force a horse (although you won't get consistency and probably a bunch of other problems (dangerous ones)) to do things because they are prey, you may be able to force a dog but he is apt to bite back faster due to his predator instincts... 

Anyhow, I would love to see a video of your boy working a puppy trail! Enjoy watching young talent learn and flourish..


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## Sarah Platts

You will get your wish. I filmed night trails Sunday night and then did one on my method of animal proofing and I show all my current dogs from 7 yo Sam to 4 mo Hoss. Spent the last several hours getting everything chopped and blended and will upload to youtube tomorrow. Its a method, I've done for years and I think it works as none of my dogs (knock on wood) when exposed this way has ever falsed on animal remains. This method grew out of my second dog (who was cadaver only) that kept irregularly indicating on animal. The only way to cure it was to desensitize them to the odor(s) and the attraction element was to make it part of their everyday lives.

Night trails are fun but hard to see anything on the film. I probably won't do another for that reason.


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## Sarah Platts

Misty Wegner said:


> but being a horse is prey and a dog predator, there are a few different transitions...


Different but not. Both like to work in groups and have a hierarchy. Prey or Predator, there are some similar fundamentals that I think apply to both.


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## Misty Wegner

Hence the few differences  Concepts can be the same but application is tweaked for type of animal. It is definitely the training method I would choose (and use) for my animals, prey or predator... It works


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## Sarah Platts

The first clip is Hoss doing small night trails. To bad I don't have an infrared camera but I tweaked the contrast and such when I uploaded so no promises there.

https://www.youtube.com/edit?o=U&feature=vm&video_id=j5OZi42qM3w

The other is my method of animal proofing for HR work. As I indicated, I started doing this years ago when dog #2 which was cadaver only but still, on occasion, indicated on animal. I figured the way to remove the attraction was to make it part of their everyday lives so it was no big thing and they could smell decomposing animal in their full odor range just as you do for human. My results have upheld this belief but judge for yourselves.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rMURkxyb64c


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## Misty Wegner

The first video doesn't pull up...


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## shelle fenton

I hope you do share your selection process, as i would love to read about how this is done from others points of view.
Gorgeous pup.


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## Sarah Platts

Misty Wegner said:


> The first video doesn't pull up...


Sorry, try this one

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j5OZi42qM3w


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## Sarah Platts

hopefully the link works. 

https://vimeo.com/146596018

Worth a couple of laughs and its stuff I know we have all told others.


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## Sarah Platts

So Hoss has met his first cows. He's bark, bark, barking with his hair standing up from the end of his tail all the way to the back of his head. I just kept working around the cattle letting Gus and Sam migrate among them. Finally Hoss starts watching those dogs' lack of reaction and he begins to do the same thing. Hey, its cows..... no big deal. Same thing with the big sheep but the freeze and stare comes out with the lambs. And the cats. Working on getting him neutral to those. Out of curiosity does anyone have any tricks up their sleeves to deal with prey sharp puppies that call for something other than nuking with an e-collar?


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## Sarah Platts

Hoping the pictures load (I'm out of practice)

This is Hoss' first day on his USAR journey. Doing a rubble walk with my two older dogs but he took to the surface like a duck to water. Very fast on the pile.


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## Misty Wegner

What a big beautiful /handsome boy he has become!


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## Bob Scott

Thanks Sarah. Great shots!


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## rick smith

is that rubble pile a big training area or a left over natural disaster zone ?
realize it's probably both but a helluva nice space to do a lot of agility work...i'm jealous 

__ just noticed this : 
....re : "And the cats. Working on getting him neutral to those. Out of curiosity does anyone have any tricks up their sleeves to deal with prey sharp puppies that call for something other than nuking with an e-collar?"

- how's it going with the cat conditioning ?
- i've done a lot of that kind of work, so if you still need to work on it, i've got a system you might try if you're willing to spend some time on it. not a quick fix but has worked with a few dogs i've done it with. can be done with you and the one dog. it will learn from you only; not other pack members so it would be an entirely different approach from what you described.
- but won't work if you dislike cats 
- and you need access to an urban/neighborhood area...won't work well in the country around totally feral cats


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## Sarah Platts

Rick, 
It's an 'engineered' pile. The site has 3. This one I consider the full access one as it's easy to walk around on (yes, easy is a relative term). the other two are very much less 'friendly' with more angles and scrambles to get around.

They also have lots of smaller elements scattered all over the place. Like a pancaked bridge system, confined spaces areas (con-ex boxes stacked 3 high packed with rubble material). Burn buildings, smoke house, etc. It really is a very nice site. Periodically, they go in and rearrange the piles adding new elements and adding/changing places you can hide people.

And, no, the cat thing failed miserably. If it had just been one dog, I think I could have made it work but once you start adding dogs, ..... it went downhill. To many sneak attacks. Finally gave the cat away as it was just a matter of time before they got him. If the other dogs had been neutral, I probably stood a chance but not once I started adding dogs. They just fed off each other and there was just not enough of me to ride herd and do the corrections. If I had more people to do it would have helped but I couldn't trust the dogs and I don't have a place to kennel if I'm not there. Last time I tried this the dogs broke down a door to get the cat. I'm open to other ideas as mine aren't going anywhere fast. I think the major problem is that the dogs have taken out feral cats so they lump all cats into the same bucket.


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## Gina Mezin

Congrats! Wish I could pet him. He looks so soft.


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## Sarah Platts

Been a while but here's some vids of Hoss doing his thing. Sorry for the out-of-focus and jumpiness. for some reason the stabilizer isn't working to fix on U-tube.

https://youtu.be/wjR3_2N4lW4

This video was shot first. The culvert he goes to was where we had just moved Elf from before putting her behind the tarp. My mistake was putting her someplace where Hoss could just crawl in with her. When he goes past her position you can see a nice head snap as he comes back to focus on the tarp.

https://youtu.be/lNCQxFWv03w

Second usar alley set-up. nice ranging, covering the area and good bark alert

https://youtu.be/d6OYsOZO5_k

Hoss on the limited access pile. Lots of angles to cross. He doesn't go above her to alert but rather finds a place he can shove his face into. Good example of the dog not always doing the alert where "we" think they will.

https://youtu.be/1hEeW1V8ptI

Hoss on the full access pile. There is a big chuck of frozen human remains out as a distraction. You can see him acknowledge the odor when he makes the trip back from right to left. He sniffs and then moves on to make the find. he's getting very comfortable working on the piles.

He's turning into a versatile working dog. He certed this spring with NAPWDA in mantrailing, tracking, area search, and OB. When dealing strictly with scent work, so much carries over from discipline to discipline. He's turning into a nice live-find only dog.


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## Misty Wegner

Great videos! Love watching hi work, he is so enthusiastic.. Good bark alerts. Loved hearing the laughter when he found his subject


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## Bob Scott

Very nice work and Hoss looks like an easy read.


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## Nicole Stark

Nice to see him again!! I was wondering how he's turned out for you.

1st video. Forgive my possible lack of correct terminology in my questions but do you know what route the person took to hide? I have some idea by what I saw but I wanted to ask. 

2nd video. I don't know what a USAR alley set up is supposed to look like. Is the description basically self explanatory? Also, do you start the dog basically where the person starts from? As in I assume this alley search is a basically straight line or mostly narrow outward search and the hidden person is somewhere within that range. If that's the case I was wondering if the person starts at the north end and goes and hides is the dog started basically from that same place or do you start them from an entirely random point? Is the bark alert standard or can there be other alerts?

3rd video. Cool set up. I couldn't tell where she was exactly though, I had an idea but wasn't sure. On this one how long from the time the person hides until you send him out to search? Actually, that applies to video 1 and 2 as well.

4th video. Same as above on the question and also when you add in HR who generally puts it there and how long does it set out? Or rather how long did it set out in this case?

Overall have you had any challenges or unexpected surprises with him?

THANKS! For sharing the videos, I've missed people sharing stuff like this and you made my day! Two last questions, I probably asked you this before but have you ever done any work with identical twins? If so what were the results or your experiences/observations?


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## Sarah Platts

Nicole,

USAR alley is just how the fire training center has it named. It's all a mock-up but we pretend it's like walking down a street and the dog ranging out after a tornado or such. So you don't have a single point (like a specific spot) but more of an area search type problem. Well, it's all area search really but easier to work on issues. One thing I was told is that you fix the problems on the ground before you take them in the air. So this is a chance to get the basics and behaviors down before you move the searching to the actual rubble pile where the dog is having to deal with negotiating the terrain and footing issues.

In Vid one: Elf walked across an open space coming in from the right, going past the multi-colored painted chuck of concrete to go into the culvert and then the pallet was placed across the entrance blocking the dogs out. When we moved her from there she went down the road and right behind the tarp. I started the dog at the top of the roadway. Hoss would, indeed, cross her trail but I don't see him reverting to trailing behaviors. He sticks with airscenting. Elf had been in the culvert for approx. 20 minutes as we worked the problem with a couple of dogs and then behind the tarp for about 2 minutes before Hoss worked it.

In VId 2: I had her come in the opening right by the bridging sections, up the stairs, to the barrel. I started him at the top of the road so he's not started on a trail. But in this vid, this was the first problem of the day so no residual scent pools unlike in Vid 1.

in vids 3-4, Elf had been in position about 15-20 minutes before I started. Both of her entries to the hiding positions were opposite from where I started the dog. With the cadaver, I had put it out for my other dog and that was the second spot we have moved it too. The first spot was at the far end of the pile. It had been in this second position for about 30 minutes. The wind in vids 2 and 4 is very slight, almost stagnant (the build-up before a t'storm) and was drifting from behind me to ahead of me. So the dog is working with the wind at his back from the starting position. In vid 3, he's working into a very, very slight headwind.

I've worked twins during a seminar. None of the dogs have an issue. Once they get past infant, the kids develop their own unique odors based on their metabolism and habits. Identical twins may look the same but they don't smell the same.


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## Sarah Platts

Nicole Stark said:


> Overall have you had any challenges or unexpected surprises with him?


I think the challenge is that he is ALWAYS busy. Lots of drive to do something, all the frigging time. I remember the FEMA gal telling me to just kennel him up (he was 9 months old) and don't do any training with him until he was old enough for USAR work. All I could think of was..... I won't have a house left if I do that...... so I didn't. That's how he got all his NAPWDA stuff. Had to find something to turn that energy into or he would have driven me crazy.

I can't do any project around the house that he doesn't want to be part of. And if there are power tools involved, I have to watch him all the time. I think I finally got him broke off of chasing the circular saw as I'm sawing wood but its been a near thing several times.

The surprise (or maybe is shouldn't be) is that he is a deep reservoir of potential. Show him what you want, give him a chance to learn it, and he just takes it on with barely a hiccup. The challenge with that is he tries to amp up the speed and if you try that while climbing ladder (horizontal or vertical) it really raps the groin/balls when you hit that cross member.


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## leslie cassian

Maybe a really basic question, but how do you let him know he's searching for a live person, not cadaver? Or vice versa, how do you get him to indicate on the cadaver scent, rather than pass it by, if you know there's only a body to find?


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## Sarah Platts

All my dogs have separate commands. Trailing/tracking is one, articles is another, and cadaver is a third. Then I proof the various commands. So will have live and dead in the same area, but I asked you to look for live and won't reward if they indicate to dead and vis-a-versa. On live, I see them acknowledge the odor but they won't indicate. But I see the behavior, mark it, and then will recheck on cadaver command. It's really a question of flexibility and handler dedication to training it. Some dogs think sideways better than others. Some can only do one thing, some not.

With Hoss, I had initially started him on cadaver but stopped it when he was only a couple of months old when he started showing that he was usar capable and, really, what did I need with 3 HR-trained dogs? So in Hoss' case, he is live-find only. But he does have separate commands for trailing/tracking vs area search. Plus there is the scent article to help cue the type of search. Now, if I have a scent article, and doing an area search, specifically for one person (out of others in the area) then I give him the trailing command because *that* command is for a particular person matching the scent pad.

I've tried to interest some airscent folks in scent specific airscent work and you would think I was asking to sacrifice their firstborn. Anything with a scent pad is trailing, end of discussion and THEY are not going there. General wilderness is so much easier and less thinking on their part. <sigh>


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## leslie cassian

I am so impressed with what you are able to teach and accomplish with your dogs. I know so many people who can barely get their dogs to sit on command and I thought I was doing well with a reliable sit and down. :-D


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## Misty Wegner

That is sad Sarah... I always find it hard to understand why people resist the betterment of their dogs... And then take it personally if you do it (especially if you have success!).. Very sad.. But cool to see Hoss work.. Will you certify him as a disaster dog as well?


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## Sarah Platts

leslie cassian said:


> I am so impressed with what you are able to teach and accomplish with your dogs. I know so many people who can barely get their dogs to sit on command and I thought I was doing well with a reliable sit and down.


I hate doing OB work. It's boring to me and so that feeling is right down the lead....

So people who can teach that are up above me. But give me a complicated trailing problem and me and the dog will be all over that and loving every minute.


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## Sarah Platts

Misty Wegner said:


> Will you certify him as a disaster dog as well?


that is the goal. I see the potential, just have to battle the bureaucracy and such to make it happen.


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## Misty Wegner

Understand that... Good luck.. You have my support, for what it is worth...


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## Sarah Platts

Another challenge with Hoss. Guy likes his tongue sucked.

https://youtu.be/6N8E_0Et5UY


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## Misty Wegner

That is a weird dog! Lol!! Too funny


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## Bob Scott

Sarah Platts said:


> Another challenge with Hoss. Guy likes his tongue sucked.
> 
> https://youtu.be/6N8E_0Et5UY



Now that's just WRONG! :lol::lol::lol::lol:


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## Nicole Stark

Misty Wegner said:


> That is a weird dog! Lol!! Too funny


LOL. Look how nice he is to play with.

Hey Sarah, if that's as weird or challenging as he gets count yourself blessed. At least you don't live with the spy vs spy creeper who attempts to possess all I see and may ever think about.

Obviously, that's just a semi humorous attempt on my part to describe behaviors I'd like to knock her head off for sometimes. With nothing but love of course.


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## Bob Scott

:lol: :lol: :lol:


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