# Puppy Videos



## Megan Bays (Oct 10, 2008)

Here are a few videos of my black mali pup, Jux.

The stalking malinois:
http://i567.photobucket.com/player....com/albums/ss120/MegMcCalli/Jux/052609003.flv

First times on the teeter totter and pupply walk:
http://i567.photobucket.com/player....com/albums/ss120/MegMcCalli/Jux/052609010.flv
http://i567.photobucket.com/player....com/albums/ss120/MegMcCalli/Jux/052609009.flv


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## Vivianne Herrero (May 20, 2009)

Cute pup! I like his confidence already.


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## Chad Byerly (Jun 24, 2008)

Looks good.
And I like your obstacles!


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## Anna Kasho (Jan 16, 2008)

Very Nice! Gotta love that tail-up confidence.


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## Nathen Danforth (Feb 12, 2009)

What a cute confident pup. How old is he?


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## mike suttle (Feb 19, 2008)

Nathen Danforth said:


> What a cute confident pup. How old is he?


He was born on March 22nd at Logan Haus Kennels. Megan has really done a geat job with every puppy she has gotten from me.


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## Nathen Danforth (Feb 12, 2009)

mike suttle said:


> He was born on March 22nd at Logan Haus Kennels. Megan has really done a geat job with every puppy she has gotten from me.


It figures that pup came from you


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## mike suttle (Feb 19, 2008)

Nathen Danforth said:


> It figures that pup came from you


What is that supposed to mean?


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## Nathen Danforth (Feb 12, 2009)

Obviously it was meant well. I had complimented the pup. You said it was from you. So of course it's a badass pup. Don't worry Mike. I love what you're doing. If I don't screw up my current pup I'm coming to you in 6-12 months for an Arko pup...Since Endor is gone....


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## mike suttle (Feb 19, 2008)

Nathen Danforth said:


> Obviously it was meant well. I had complimented the pup. You said it was from you. So of course it's a badass pup. Don't worry Mike. I love what you're doing. If I don't screw up my current pup I'm coming to you in 6-12 months for an Arko pup...Since Endor is gone....


Thanks for the compliment, Megan will do a great job with this little puppy I am sure.
Dont worry about Endor being gone, believe me the best of the best stay in my kennel, the other ones go down the road. Endor is a great dog and a good producer, but to be very honest with you I have never had a dog who produces like Arko does, so that is a better option for you for sure.
I have 4 Endor daughters for future breedings with Arko and Carlos.
Let me know when you are ready for a puppy, we have several super breedings planned for this fall.


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## Gerry Grimwood (Apr 2, 2007)

mike suttle said:


> Dont worry about Endor being gone, believe me the best of the best stay in my kennel, the other ones go down the road. Endor is a great dog and a good producer, but to be very honest with you I have never had a dog who produces like Arko does, so that is a better option for you for sure.
> I have 4 Endor daughters for future breedings with Arko and Carlos.


I don't understand this, if Endor wasn't among the best of the best, why would you keep back his daughters for breeding ?


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## mike suttle (Feb 19, 2008)

Gerry Grimwood said:


> I don't understand this, if Endor wasn't among the best of the best, why would you keep back his daughters for breeding ?


Endor himself was among the best of the best, but he did not produce the high % of excellent puppies in his litters as Arko does. I have a few of the best Endor puppies that he ever produced and they are excellent so I will keep them and possibly breed with them down the road. Endor produces perfect health, great full calm grips, solid nerves, and good size.
However many Endor puppies did not have the drive that I like to see. Some of his puppies are truely EXCELLENT, and I have picked a few of those great females to keep for future breedings.
I am trying to find the magic cross that will help me produces what Endor himself is. I think Arko may help achieve that because the real bloodlines of Endor match very well with Arko's lines.


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## Megan Bays (Oct 10, 2008)

Thanks everyone for the compliments! We're having a lot of fun with this little guy.

He's extremely confident, and had a major test of nerves this past weekend in which he passed with flying colors. We took him to a local race track where he was around the biggest group of people he's ever seen, and also very loud race cars that were right in front of us. 

Nothing phased him a bit. He did have to have a water bottle to chew on the entire time (I left his bone in the truck) to keep him from eating me alive with boredom. 

I only wanted to bring him out for the first few laps to see how he reacted to everything. He did great, and I only took him back to the truck because I was afraid the noise over an extended time would hurt his ears. When we went back to the truck, we had to walk right beside of the race track while the cars were on it. Jux of course had his usual tail and head straight up in the air attitude  !


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## Jason Sidener (Nov 8, 2006)

mike suttle said:


> Endor produces perfect health


Isn't the puppy this thread is about a replacement for a pup out of Endor that died from health issues?


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## mike suttle (Feb 19, 2008)

Jason Sidener said:


> Isn't the puppy this thread is about a replacement for a pup out of Endor that died from health issues?


LOL, nice try Jason.:razz: 
The Endor puppy died at 5 months old after a couple days of swollen and painful front legs. My guess is a snake bite to the chest which I had happen a few years ago to a young dog with devistating effects. There was no necropsy done, but I replaced the puppy as a favor because I really like Megan and she does a great job with her dogs and I wanted her to have a puppy to work.
I dont know of any deadly genetic health problem that causes swollen and painful front legs, followed by lathargic behavior, then death. Do you? The puppy was 100% normal up until the day the painful swollen legs were noticed, the next day he was dead. Megan could better explain it to you than me because I did not see the puppy and as I said no necropsy was done. 
I will say that in 2006 I had a GSD puppy that showed similar trouble and was later determined that is was caused by a poisonous snake bite.
There are hundreds of reasons that a dog can die, only a post death exam can reveal it, and since this was not done we will never know.
How many other breeders would have given a puppy to somone with no proof of the cause of death? Like I said I really like Megan and Scott and even though I am nearly 100% sure this puppy died from something other than a genetic health related problem, I was happy to give her another puppy just to keeep her working and having fun with a young dog.
Jason, unless you know something that I dont know about the cause of death of this puppy, there is absolutley no way to say it was from a genetic health problem.


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## Megan Bays (Oct 10, 2008)

I very tragically lost my puppy Ike due to unknown causes. I was/am still terribly upset about this, as the puppy was absoloutely awesome, even with his constant barking.

When Scott had went to feed him one morning he wouldn't come out of his dog house. The night before he was completely normal, barking ass of a mali puppy. This was around 9, and he was taken to the vet around 11. By 11 he had went completly lame in his left front leg, and had a temp of 106. We had xrays ran, almost every test available at the vets except for a urinalysis. All with results that showed us basically nothing. The vets told me that recommended path would be to treat his symptoms and I opted to do that at home. This included giving him fluids, keeping his temp down (soaking his pads in alcohol, keeping ice packs around him, etc etc), making sure he was hydrated, trying to get him to eat, and keeping him comfortable. 

This was on a Thursday, on Friday morning his other front leg was swollen, and then that evening one of his back legs was in the same condition as the front. The next morning we woke up to a dead puppy in his crate.

I was giving him around the clock care, I didn't work Thursday afternoon or Friday. The vet had said to call if we needed anything at all. The pup was drinking and the temp was down, but the cause had spread. I attempted calling the vet all day to only get the she was in surgery or could not talk with me. By the time I had really got pissed and realized the vet was not going to speak with me, it was too late to go to another regular hours vet that day. Since the pup was drinking and his fever was down, I decided to not go to the EVet and take him in for a second opinion the following morning. Sadly, we didn't have that oppurtunity.

I didn't realize I could have the body sent off to reveal cause of death, and certainly wasn't in the frame of mind to think about things rationally and realize that. Had I known, the body would have been sent off to reveal exact cause of death. But he was buried that morning, and I wasn't about to dig the body back up.

Mike very graciously offered us another puppy. I don't think he'll ever realize how much I appreciate that.


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## Jason Sidener (Nov 8, 2006)

mike suttle said:


> LOL, nice try Jason


Not sure what you think I am "trying" but it was just a question.

Perfect health is impressive Mike. How many pups has Endor produce with this perfect health?

I have never had to deal with a snake bite. Is it common for a dog with life threating symtoms to be taken to a vet and have almost every test available done and the vet not think of maybe a snake bite and to check for that?


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## Megan Bays (Oct 10, 2008)

The vet at first thought the pup had panostetis (sp?). I'd never heard of pano in it's formal term and I asked her if it was referred to as pano. She said she'd never heard of it being referred that way, but it was possible. So there's that for what it's worth. For the leg examination, on the table she picked it up, looked at it, tried moving it around and bending and was met by a POed mal pup in pain in which she put the leg back down. Immediately following this, there was an xray done. I didn't see them examine it any further than that, while it's completely possible. They could have examined it more in detail when they took the xray.

When Scott first called me, my thoughts were TBD as we'd pulled a couple off of him (we give our dogs topical flea and tick prevention, and also check them reguraly, we hadn't put it on the pup at that time but were doing daily checks). The in house tick and parasite test was ran on him with negative results. That didn't cover everything, but covered the most common to my knowledge.

Looking back now there are so many things IMO that I did wrong. I was worried about my pup and wasn't thinking rationally which probably caused his death. I should have went for a second opinion sooner, I should have had an autotopsy, I should have made sure the vet examined him properly to check for every possible cause, I should have had a better vet to begin with, I should have done lots more. The vet told me the next thing would be to send him to research vet hospitals, which were definitely out of the question. But I did the best I could at that time, and while I'd love to have done better I have to live with the decisions I made.


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## mike suttle (Feb 19, 2008)

Jason Sidener said:


> Not sure what you think I am "trying" but it was just a question.
> 
> Perfect health is impressive Mike. How many pups has Endor produce with this perfect health?
> 
> I have never had to deal with a snake bite. Is it common for a dog with life threating symtoms to be taken to a vet and have almost every test available done and the vet not think of maybe a snake bite and to check for that?


To date Endor has produced 23 litters in total, 184 offspring. 
I can not comment on what the vet did in this case as I was not there. It sounds like the vet did not really take it too seriously and just passed it off as Pano from what I gather, which was obviously not the case.
When my GSD got bitten by a snake, I actually was the one who ask the vet to check for that, so they did and I was correct, it was a snake bite.


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## Betty Mathena (Apr 19, 2006)

I've never had a dog bit by a snake. <knock on wood>.

Woudn't the puncture wounds be readily visible with a cursory exam? At minimal localized swelling at the bite site?

Not trying to jerk anyone's chain here, just really want to know.


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## mike suttle (Feb 19, 2008)

Betty Mathena said:


> I've never had a dog bit by a snake. <knock on wood>.
> 
> Woudn't the puncture wounds be readily visible with a cursory exam? At minimal localized swelling at the bite site?
> 
> Not trying to jerk anyone's chain here, just really want to know.


My GSD puppy was bitten in the chest and his entire front end was swollen really badly, both legs included, but his chest had to be shaved to see the puntuce holes from the bite location.
I have no idea if Megan's puppy was bitten by a snake....that is my point, none of us knows what the problem was and at this point it does not matter, the puppy is gone and to try to figure it out now means we can only guess. 
I just got a little upset when someone with absolutley no idea what happend to the puppy implied that it must have died from a genetic health related issue. Me being the breeder of this puppy I am a little offended when people with no clue imply things like that. Like I said in an earlier post, I am nearly 100% sure that this puppy died from something other than a genetic defect, but regardless the puppy is gone, it has been replaced, and we will never know what the casue of death was.

I believe this thread was started to show videos of a nice puppy that Megan has and is proud of I think.


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## Konnie Hein (Jun 14, 2006)

Nice puppy, Megan! Thanks for sharing the videos!


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## Jason Sidener (Nov 8, 2006)

mike suttle said:


> I just got a little upset when someone with absolutley no idea what happend to the puppy implied that it must have died from a genetic health related issue


Sorry mike didn't mean to upset you. I was unaware of the "perfect health" that your dogs produce when I implied that.


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## mike suttle (Feb 19, 2008)

Jason Sidener said:


> Sorry mike didn't mean to upset you. I was unaware of the "perfect health" that your dogs produce when I implied that.


No worries Jason, I am sure at some point a genetic health issue will arise with one of our Malis and Dutchie breedings as it has before with one of our GSD breedings, and if it does we will replace it with no questions ask just like we did with one of our GSD puppies who had a bad hip last year.
But until now we have been blessed with no health problems in our Mali and Dutchie breedings.


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## Chris Keister (Jun 28, 2008)

I had a Boxer bitten by a rattlesnake. I was fortunate to have seen it happen. You were able to see the puncture marks but this was a Boxer. There was not alot of localized swelling. He was bitten in the rib cage area, just under the armpit. 

What happend was there was a gradual overall swelling of the entire rib cage area which caused a sagging of of the skin over a period of a few days.


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## Guest (Dec 1, 2008)

I have seen a snake bite numerous times on working dogs and I can assure you once it swells you cannot see the bite marks unless the dog is shaved and even still it is hard to see. This is something unless you actually seen the snake bite the pup/dog, you will never know and not something that is normally tested nor asked a vet unless you live in a region that has high snake bites. 

Nice videos Megan, I like what you are you doing with your youngin, and I understand your loss, the only thing you can do is learn from it, educate and make sure it doesn't happen again, which I am sure it won't.

Mike is the most honest person I know and beleive what he says, especially when it comes to dogs. He lives by his word and his kennel or product. He wants the customer to be happy, but rest assured he doesn't put out garbage at all. If you read most of his post or know this guy, he gives away his washouts and others that don't meet his selection criteria and in most cases these dogs can work at some department somewhere. They have more drive and work than some dogs I have seen currently working today. 

Mike see you in July!


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## Gerry Grimwood (Apr 2, 2007)

mike suttle said:


> How many other breeders would have given a puppy to somone with no proof of the cause of death?


In my experience none, even when it's proven to be genetic it can be a huge tit pull with some breeders, I wont mention the breed but it sounds like Herman peppered :razz:


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## Megan Bays (Oct 10, 2008)

When I called and told Mike that Ike had died, I didn't expect to be replaced with a puppy or anything like that. I didn't know what the cause of death was, and figured I'd just have to wait until we had money saved back up to get another pup. After I told Mike the pup had passed, he said (more or less) that he couldn't believe it, he was very sorry, and if I wanted he had a pup there he would give me. I was surprised that he didn't think twice about it, and I am very grateful about this. 

Needless to say, we'll be going to a different vet after this.

Thanks for the compliments on the vidoes and the puppy. We're really happy with him, and having lots of fun.


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