# Trailing Video



## Bryant Jackson (Oct 29, 2013)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CpzA2ywMwTg

The above link is for a Youtube video of our 6 month old GSD and my wife. This was his second to last trail of the day.

Comments or suggestions are more than welcome.


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## rick smith (Dec 31, 2010)

nice work; nice pup !

wish you could have shown a little more detail at the find

did the hide walk straight up the road without moving off at any time ?
had the dog worked this same path earlier ?
any wind condition worth noting ?


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## Bryant Jackson (Oct 29, 2013)

Rick, first time on the trail that day in that area. The hide was instructed to walk straight up. We have only been training for a couple of months and are trying to lay a good foundation. No real wind to note, it was almost non-existent. I do apologize about not getting the find videoed very well. It was the first trail we have taped, good lesson for next time.

We are very limited access to trainers and etc in the area. We travel out to West River SD to train with an outstanding trainer and work with a group about an hour and a half away once a month.


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## Brian Smith (May 26, 2013)

The dog looks good but there are two things I would change. First, I would try not to lay tracks along cleared paths or trails. In my opinion it is showing the dog the trail without him having to put forth much effort. You can see this with how the dog is working, his nose it down for a short time and then comes up and he continues to walk forward. I know there are dogs that can and do trail like this but at this stage he should be learning to follow his nose. Open fields or fields with mixed in trees are much better because it forces the dog to trail instead of follow the path of least resistance. 
Second, I would have the handler stop walking when the dog is no longer trailing. A few times the dog stopped to look around and the handler continued to move forward, at one point walking right up to the dog. This also applies to a dog that is walking forward but is clearly not trailing. It is also important to walk directly behind the dog, not off to one side or the other. Often handlers will walk the exact path of the trail while the dog is a few feet (if not more) off. Both of these things cue the dog and will eventually make him rely on you instead of his nose. The dog has to learn to lead you. As it was explained to me, the handler is the dumb end of the leash, our job is to follow and not lead.
Hope this doesn't come off as being too critical. You are definitely on the right path and have a good looking dog. I would also agree with needing to see the find a little better. I would like to see the handler and the decoy and whoever else is present down on the ground playing and giving all kinds of praise to the dog.....for several minutes. This should be fun for the dog and finding the decoy is the biggest reward ever.
Let me know if you have any other questions and good luck in training.


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## Guy Williams (Jun 26, 2012)

Brian Smith said:


> It is also important to walk directly behind the dog, not off to one side or the other. Often handlers will walk the exact path of the trail while the dog is a few feet (if not more) off. Both of these things cue the dog and will eventually make him rely on you instead of his nose. The dog has to learn to lead you. As it was explained to me, the handler is the dumb end of the leash, our job is to follow and not lead.


We had this discussion at training this morning. A very experienced handler is having a few issues on hard surface trails. In training when he knows where the trail is he walks where he believes the trail is whilst the dog is off at an angle. 

When he doesn't know where the trail is he obviously has no choice but to follow the dog. This feels very different to the dog (connect a line to your belt and pretend to be the dog). Confident line handling with a sideways pressure and uncertainty with the pressure straight down the middle is something which cannot help. Always follow the dog is my advice. If you know where the trail is and the dog is off and you want to work on accuracy you can just slow the dog up until he comes back on and then speed up when he is back on. This replicates what is likely to happen for real. When you are unsure you slow up. 

I'm fairly sure others will disagree?!!


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## Sarah Platts (Jan 12, 2010)

Nice trail. Here's my suggestions. 

If your starting command is "find it" then you should not be using those words after the dog starts. You can say something like 'get busy', 'back to work', etc. Because this is a young dog they will be very curious to see new things and get distracted. I would not be so quick to chastise a young dog for taking a moment out to see something new but give them that couple of seconds to watch and then see if they go back to task. You can correct if they take off after the squirrel but sometimes that head up and change of body change can signify a dangerous threat (such as a bear) or a wind shift that gives the dog a snot-full of fresh scent. You, as the handler, know the trail goes further but the dog is working off his nose. Give him a chance to learn.

Like Brian said, when the dog stops - you should too. Stop running up on the dog. As the trails become harder, more wandering, etc sometimes the dog will overshoot and must back up or reverse past you. Give them the opportunity to do that. If you keep running up on them, then all they learn is to keep moving even if they lose the trail. What I will do is if the dog stops, I will step a bit off to one side to remove the pressure and barrier my presence causes behind him and lets the dog have the opportunity to go back past me if they want to. 

O.k. walking pace but you could stand to increase your stride a bit. I would also change your footwear to boots or something more sturdy. This is because you do not get to pick the path your dog works. He's working odor and you have to go where he goes. At seminars, airscent handlers always came back looking clean and neat. The trailers came back sweaty, muddy, and looking like they went through the briar patch.

Also unlike a tracking dog, most trailing dogs develop a head-bob as they work. They start out nose to the ground but as they gain experience and knowledge working with human scent will normally raise up their head until it's level with their back and just bob it down as they go. Normally once every couple of strides. When they are in that posture, and suddenly throw that head up high, the handler better be taking note of it. 

Didn't see much reward for the dog. Nice high praising voice but didn't see alot of enjoyment on the part of the dog. While it's true that some dogs find the act of the work to be self-rewarding, most don't . So consider making your reward system stronger.


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## Bryant Jackson (Oct 29, 2013)

Brian, that is great advice. It makes a lot of sense. I will be sure to relay the message. Not too critical at all. Much better to correct these types of things at the beginning before they become too habitual.

Guy, same deal. It makes perfect sense. Often times it is hard to not try and correct the dog when the handler knows or thinks they know better.

Thanks for the advice and suggestions everyone.


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## Bryant Jackson (Oct 29, 2013)

Sarah, great advice. Thanks so much. I will be sure to go over it all with my wife. What I love about these types for forums is being able to draw from everyone's experiences. No matter positive or negative, we can all stand to learn something.


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## Howard Knauf (May 10, 2008)

I would like to echo Brian Smith's advice ref staying off of established trails. You have such a nice place to train it would be a shame to waste the resource. Going off the beaten path will surely confirm that the dog is trailing for real.


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## Bryant Jackson (Oct 29, 2013)

Noted! Thanks for the great advice everyone.


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## mel boschwitz (Apr 23, 2010)

Dont be afraid to use paths like that as a test tho. I like to put a subj down a path for a little bit, then have them leave the path and trek out into the woods. Is the dog steamrolling and just taking the easy way? Or is the dog really working. I do the same with cow paths, etc. In real life people will go on established paths, so you have to know what your dog does. 

I have one dog that steamrolls on established paths and I have to line check him a lot to keep him focused. My female and my new dog stay focused without my help. 

Is this your first trailing dog? Is that typically how the dog works? Would this be a typical trail for you?


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## Chris McDonald (May 29, 2008)

I really think posting training videos like this is an under used could be benefit of this site. In all fairness there really was not all too much in the video to review in the video you posted. 
I found it a bit funny that even with the little there was of the video how different some of the comments are from what I was thinking. The more I read on the internet the more I see the benefit of not reading it on the internet. One thing I think most would agree on that was covered was not to ride up the dogs ass as much. That can just lead to a lot of not good things like simply rushing the dog. And before you know it your just on a long walk in the woods. I used to hate those long walks in the woods, ha… still go on them 
For some reason someone needed to tell you what shoes to put on? At first I found telling you this funny than I found me disagreeing with it funny. I don’t know what’s wrong with good sneakers? Like anything else whatever works for you. For me maybe if I was walking on nothing but rocks maybe boots or if I was exhausted and getting lazy maybe boots? Some people like boots if they have a pack on? I got some lard ass friends that like boots because their ankles can’t handle there lard asses. The handler doesn’t look like a lard ass? There was also a comment regarding a bigger stride? Does a larger stride increase find rate? Maybe I am really missing something? 
Some interesting comments about using the trail. I don’t know exactly what the dog and handler has been working on. But I like having inexperienced dogs work the hard packed dirt with the brush on the sides. Seems to work for me? I don’t really see enough of a problem with it in one video? But like they are saying you got to switch it up. I would imagine you are. Again maybe I’m missing something? 
I don’t know if anyone mentioned the line work? I think most people would just rather let the line drag behind them rather than trying to hold all the line. Some people like to cut the end hand loop off there tracking leads so they don’t get em caught up on anything. Some don’t like to cut them. 
I don’t understand the use of squeaky high pitched talk during a reward but some like to squeak? I thought there was plenty of praise at the end of the track? I think you used some food treats too. I never seen the need to use food for tracking for any reason? Some people stop and get hot dogs to track with? Ill really never understand this one? 
But whatever works for you guys


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## Sarah Platts (Jan 12, 2010)

Bryant,

Please don't let the snarky few discourage you from asking questions. To date, you have received some very good advice. If you have any future questions please don't hesitate to PM me or any of the other trailing handlers if you dislike having your thread being hijacked. The mantra we all work under is to train like you expect to work. The advice posted is to instill good training habits from the beginning rather than trying to correct bad habits later or to keep a novice handler from making stupid mistakes or get injured. We all have made mistakes and we would rather someone make a new one rather than repeat another's.

Your wife is correct to keep the lead off the ground and her skills on the long line are good. While many tracking folks let all their business drag out behind them, trailers keep it up and looped. 

I'm sending you a PM.


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