# CGC and the bad boy



## Howard Gaines III (Dec 26, 2007)

Has anyone ever tried to get an *AKC CGC* title on their PPD and been told that it shouldn't be done because of the training? Getting ready to do it in the fall or winter and wanted to hear some war stories, need reply topics in case they get CRAZY. ](*,) =D>


----------



## Michelle Reusser (Mar 29, 2008)

Yes I have heard such comments. Someone I knew went anyway with her Sch 3, now training in PSA male and cleaned house at the AKC shows. Quite funny and shut them all up! She went home with the ribbons and her dog never bit anyone...SHOCKER!


----------



## Terry Fisk (Jul 26, 2007)

Howard Gaines III said:


> Has anyone ever tried to get an *AKC CGC* title on their PPD and been told that it shouldn't be done because of the training? Getting ready to do it in the fall or winter and wanted to hear some war stories, need reply topics in case they get CRAZY. ](*,) =D>


Our club hosted a CGC test last year with pet, show, schH and PPD dogs too. Everyone passed. I know the person on the crutches (sometimes they use walkers) took some getting used to as the awkward movement looks a bit suspicious to the dogs. Also, depending on what they use for the reaction to distraction may cause a dog to aleart. I have seen everything from ringing cowbells, to dropping a book on another (similar to gun shots) or dropping a lid on a heavy pot, etc. It's helpful to get to practice with a group ahead of time if you can.


----------



## Chris Michalek (Feb 13, 2008)

Terry Fisk said:


> Our club hosted a CGC test last year with pet, show, schH and PPD dogs too. Everyone passed. I know the person on the crutches (sometimes they use walkers) took some getting used to as the awkward movement looks a bit suspicious to the dogs. Also, depending on what they use for the reaction to distraction may cause a dog to aleart. I have seen everything from ringing cowbells, to dropping a book on another (similar to gun shots) or dropping a lid on a heavy pot, etc. It's helpful to get to practice with a group ahead of time if you can.



Hope nobody thinks to use a whip :grin:


----------



## Terry Fisk (Jul 26, 2007)

Chris Michalek said:


> Hope nobody thinks to use a whip :grin:


Hahaha, that would certainly get mixed reactions! Some run for cover, and the schutzund and PPD's looking for the bad guy  You should have seen the look on the evaluator's face when I had my big GSD tested a few years ago. You would have thought I was bringing a darn Grizzly bear in on the leash ](*,)


----------



## Dan Long (Jan 10, 2008)

Howard I wouldn't even mention it. It won't matter, the guy who did the CGC for Gunnar knew about my training and never said a thing. The only people who care about bitework seem to be therapy dog groups.

If you want his name I can give it to you, it's the obedience guy in Newark that I've talked about before. There's another person outside of Dover who is certified to test as well.


----------



## Bob Scott (Mar 30, 2006)

Can your dog be brushed, feet handled, and left with a stranger (separate exercises) for 3 mins while your out of sight? If so, no problems with the CGC. Most on our club have them. Aggression towards a person or another dog will get you flunked.
I have the TT from the ATTS on my dog also. The judge actually commented that he likes to test Schutzhund dogs because he knows what to expect from them.
PPDs seem to have a high % of dogs that are a bit over the top with nerve and/or aggression issues. JMHO! 
It would all depend on the dog and the handler. Course that's no different with the furbaby and it's handler.


----------



## Howard Gaines III (Dec 26, 2007)

Bob Scott said:


> Can your dog be brushed, feet handled, and left with a stranger (separate exercises) for 3 mins while your out of sight? If so, no problems with the CGC. Most on our club have them. Aggression towards a person or another dog will get you flunked.
> I have the TT from the ATTS on my dog also. The judge actually commented that he likes to test Schutzhund dogs because he knows what to expect from them.
> PPDs seem to have a high % of dogs that are a bit over the top with nerve and/or aggression issues. JMHO!
> It would all depend on the dog and the handler. Course that's no different with the furbaby and it's handler.


Bob Scott and his GREAT one liners! "Can your dog be brushed?" Sure, you'll never get the brush back...and maybe the hand too. Yep the blue hair, white knuckle old ladies had better strap on those Depends if I had Rock tested. I think I'll work with the female, Bear and plan for less Rx issues. Can the sit be a down/platz with the recall? It's been close to 10 years since I did one with two working dogs. Back then the folks all put said "no." After a little Scotch-Irish communications with them, all was well and the dogs passed!


----------



## marta wade (Apr 17, 2008)

What Bob said. 

I actually do CGC tests and did some for our club dogs most passed with ease but the key ones are definately if you taught your dog to accept strangers touching them and holding their leash. Our handlers usually did a down stay and I just held the leash for the three minute out of sight. There is no rule that the evaluator must be petting and cooing over the dog during that time the owner is not present so I did not( I dont with Pet dogs either)In the reaction test to sound/movement the dogs are allowed to alert(bark) but if they agress they fail. Thing is you can talk to them tell them leave it/stay...for a well trained dog most is very easy depending on the training you chose and of course the dog. 

I will admit my own dogs would most likely not pass the test :-$ 

Depending on the evaluator I might not tell them the work the dog does. Also there is a statement in the book for evaluators that says if they see agression before or after the test at the test location that day they can fail the dog. So no bite work to reward your dog's passsing the test :wink: 

Marta


----------



## Jerry Lyda (Apr 4, 2006)

I too am an AKC CGC evaluator. I had rather test PPD dogs. They have better training. It's the little booger that'll act up. I have only one dog that didn't pass and it was because it didn't like being away from mama. I use a fast opening umbrella for the reaction to a distraction. It scares most dogs and would me too if I wasn't expecting it. It's the recovery that I look for. Most all the dogs in our club has their CGC. It's done by me and that's not good because I tell them that from them I expect more.


----------



## Dan Long (Jan 10, 2008)

Howard, This is stolen directly from the AKC site, http://www.akc.org/events/cgc/training_testing.cfm, so you can see exactly what is required. 

AKC's Canine Good Citizen® (CGC) Program
Training/Testing: CGC Test Items

Before taking the Canine Good Citizen test, owners will sign the *Responsible Dog Owners Pledge*. We believe that responsible dog ownership is a key part of the CGC concept and by signing the pledge, owners agree to take care of their dog's health needs, safety, exercise, training and quality of life. Owners also agree to show responsibility by doing things such as cleaning up after their dogs in public places and never letting dogs infringe on the rights of others.

After signing the Responsible Dog Owners Pledge, owners and their dogs are ready to take the CGC Test. Items on the Canine Good Citizen Test include:

*Test 1: Accepting a friendly stranger *
This test demonstrates that the dog will allow a friendly stranger to approach it and speak to the handler in a natural, everyday situation. The evaluator walks up to the dog and handler and greets the handler in a friendly manner, ignoring the dog. The evaluator and handler shake hands and exchange pleasantries. The dog must show no sign of resentment or shyness, and must not break position or try to go to the evaluator.

*Test 2: Sitting politely for petting* 
This test demonstrates that the dog will allow a friendly stranger to touch it while it is out with its handler. With the dog sitting at the handler's side, to begin the exercise, the evaluator pets the dog on the head and body. The handler may talk to his or her dog throughout the exercise. The dog may stand in place as it is petted. The dog must not show shyness or resentment.

*Test 3: Appearance and grooming* 
This practical test demonstrates that the dog will welcome being groomed and examined and will permit someone, such as a veterinarian, groomer or friend of the owner, to do so. It also demonstrates the owner's care, concern and sense of responsibility. The evaluator inspects the dog to determine if it is clean and groomed. The dog must appear to be in healthy condition (i.e., proper weight, clean, healthy and alert). The handler should supply the comb or brush commonly used on the dog. The evaluator then softly combs or brushes the dog, and in a natural manner, lightly examines the ears and gently picks up each front foot. It is not necessary for the dog to hold a specific position during the examination, and the handler may talk to the dog, praise it and give encouragement throughout.

*Test 4: Out for a walk (walking on a loose lead)* 
This test demonstrates that the handler is in control of the dog. The dog may be on either side of the handler. The dog's position should leave no doubt that the dog is attentive to the handler and is responding to the handler's movements and changes of direction. The dog need not be perfectly aligned with the handler and need not sit when the handler stops. The evaluator may use a pre-plotted course or may direct the handler/dog team by issuing instructions or commands. In either case, there should be a right turn, left turn, and an about turn with at least one stop in between and another at the end. The handler may talk to the dog along the way, praise the dog, or give commands in a normal tone of voice. The handler may sit the dog at the halts if desired.

*Test 5: Walking through a crowd* 
This test demonstrates that the dog can move about politely in pedestrian traffic and is under control in public places. The dog and handler walk around and pass close to several people (at least three). The dog may show some interest in the strangers but should continue to walk with the handler, without evidence of over-exuberance, shyness or resentment. The handler may talk to the dog and encourage or praise the dog throughout the test. The dog should not jump on people in the crowd or strain on the leash.

*Test 6: Sit and down on command and Staying in place* 
This test demonstrates that the dog has training, will respond to the handler's commands to sit and down and will remain in the place commanded by the handler (sit or down position, whichever the handler prefers). The dog must do sit AND down on command, then the owner chooses the position for leaving the dog in the stay. Prior to this test, the dog's leash is replaced with a line 20 feet long. The handler may take a reasonable amount of time and use more than one command to get the dog to sit and then down. The evaluator must determine if the dog has responded to the handler's commands. The handler may not force the dog into position but may touch the dog to offer gentle guidance. When instructed by the evaluator, the handler tells the dog to stay and walks forward the length of the line, turns and returns to the dog at a natural pace. The dog must remain in the place in which it was left (it may change position) until the evaluator instructs the handler to release the dog. The dog may be released from the front or the side.

*Test 7: Coming when called* 
This test demonstrates that the dog will come when called by the handler. The handler will walk 10 feet from the dog, turn to face the dog, and call the dog. The handler may use encouragement to get the dog to come. Handlers may choose to tell dogs to "stay" or "wait" or they may simply walk away, giving no instructions to the dog.

*Test 8: Reaction to another dog* 
This test demonstrates that the dog can behave politely around other dogs. Two handlers and their dogs approach each other from a distance of about 20 feet, stop, shake hands and exchange pleasantries, and continue on for about 10 feet. The dogs should show no more than casual interest in each other. Neither dog should go to the other dog or its handler.

*Test 9: Reaction to distraction* 
This test demonstrates that the dog is confident at all times when faced with common distracting situations. The evaluator will select and present two distractions. Examples of distractions include dropping a chair, rolling a crate dolly past the dog, having a jogger run in front of the dog, or dropping a crutch or cane. The dog may express natural interest and curiosity and/or may appear slightly startled but should not panic, try to run away, show aggressiveness, or bark. The handler may talk to the dog and encourage or praise it throughout the exercise.

*Test 10: Supervised separation* 
This test demonstrates that a dog can be left with a trusted person, if necessary, and will maintain training and good manners. Evaluators are encouraged to say something like, "Would you like me to watch your dog?" and then take hold of the dog's leash. The owner will go out of sight for three minutes. The dog does not have to stay in position but should not continually bark, whine, or pace unnecessarily, or show anything stronger than mild agitation or nervousness. Evaluators may talk to the dog but should not engage in excessive talking, petting, or management attempts (e.g, "there, there, it's alright").

*Equipment*

All tests must be performed on leash. Dogs should wear well-fitting buckle or slip collars made of leather, fabric, or chain. Special training collars such as pinch collars, head halters, etc. are not permitted in the CGC test. We recognize that special training collars may be very useful tools for beginning dog trainers, however, we feel that dogs are ready to take the CGC test at the point at which they are transitioned to regular collars.

The evaluator supplies a 20-foot lead for the test. The owner/handler should bring the dog's brush or comb to the test.

*Encouragement*

Owners/handlers may use praise and encouragement throughout the test. The owner may pet the dog between exercises. Food and treats are not permitted during testing, nor is the use of toys, squeaky toys, etc. to get the dog to do something. We recognize that food and toys may provide valuable reinforcement or encouragement during the training process but these items should not be used during the test.

*Failures - Dismissals*

Any dog that eliminates during testing must be marked failed. The only exception to this rule is that elimination is allowable in test Item 10, but only when test Item 10 is held outdoors.

Any dog that growls, snaps, bites, attacks, or attempts to attack a person or another dog is not a good citizen and must be dismissed from the test.


----------



## Kadi Thingvall (Jan 22, 2007)

IMO any well trained PPD should be able to pass a CGC. It's a very basic test, and the handler can talk to the dog as much as they want throughout. If they can't control the dog well enough to get through the test without some non-threatening person getting nailed, they probably shouldn't have the dog out in public anyway. In some cases, depending on why the dog failed, I'd question why the dog was trained to bite. 

I would not tell them ahead of time about the dogs training. It's one thing for someone to casually/innocently walk up to your to interact with it. You tell them the dog is bite trained, and you may have an evaluator walking up hesitantly, acting nervous, etc which may put the dog on edge. Can't really blame the dog for reading the person's body language.


----------



## Mo Earle (Mar 1, 2008)

I am also an AKC CGC Evaluator, and encourage those teaching personal protection or working dogs to get their CGC...besides the fact if your teaching your dog bite work, you should be able to demonstrate control of them to a point. I don't use a whip, but have used a clatter stick, an opening umbrella, a penny jug...a two wheel cart...etc for distractions.... Understand some dogs are definately more intense than others...as long as they don't display aggression to anyone or other dogs...you will do ok, and later should you ever have an issue with someone being concerned about you teaching and developing their biting capabilities, you can also show...they are also a "good citizen". The majority of the dogs in our club have earned it, and it is also a good first test for the new inexperienced handlers...before they get their intro to the big league trials...Mo


----------



## Bob Scott (Mar 30, 2006)

I'm ALSO an AKC CGC evaluator as is Lynsey F from our club and also on this forum. 
One thing to remember. The CGC is NOT a title. It's a certificate. It's also suggested the the dog be recertifyed every couple of years. 
The TT from the ATTS IS an actual title that is recognized by the AKC and put on the dog's papers. That's a one time test and the dog keeps the title of TT after his name. 
http://www.atts.org


----------



## Maren Bell Jones (Jun 7, 2006)

I'm not an evaluator (heard some not so great things from them about various hoopsto jump through lately from the AKC), but I've run numerous mock CGCs for our therapy dog club and I almost always help out at the real test. 

All my dogs have the CGC and all are rescues/shelter dogs except Fawkes. No one has ever failed it. With BSL and the litigious society that it is, I can't recommend it highly enough that people get it. Especially for big "scary" breeds or PPDs. Just comes down to training.

Off topic about PPDs, but our therapy dog club wanted to remove the CGC requirement that is one of the required things before a dog is allowed to start visits because too many people weren't passing the separation part because the dog would whine. :-({|= They thought there wouldn't be a situation like that in a hospital or nursing home. I strongly voiced my opinion that once they graduate from vet school, most therapy dog clubs require the TDI, which is more stringent than the CGC, so buck up and train harder. =; Fawkes usually hollers like a banshee if I turn him over to someone else to hold while I walk away. So we just trained it as a 3 minute out of sight down stay, no problem with some work. What frustrates me is I've offered many many times to do private lessons with people if their dog is having trouble. Does anyone ever take me up on it? NO. Do we still hear a lot of complaining that part is "unfair?" YES. :roll:


----------



## Mo Earle (Mar 1, 2008)

> What frustrates me is I've offered many many times to do private lessons with people if their dog is having trouble. Does anyone ever take me up on it? NO. Do we still hear a lot of complaining that part is "unfair?" YES. :roll:



should be sad about it...BUT I am 
:lol::lol: glad to see someone else has experienced this- ....Mo


----------



## Terry Fisk (Jul 26, 2007)

Maren Bell Jones said:


> With BSL and the litigious society that it is, I can't recommend it highly enough that people get it. Especially for big "scary" breeds or PPDs. Just comes down to training.


That's exactly why we did the test and opened it up to all the clubs in our region. Sad to say we had mostly club members other than some AKC obedience dogs that took us up. Funny how that little piece of paper from the AKC holds it's weight in this society.


----------



## Howard Gaines III (Dec 26, 2007)

My only issue with the CGC is that it gives a false measure of security. If the AKC says it's safe, it's safe. Not always true with some dogs and dog training styles. I would rather have a dog that is more defensive, know it and modify safety measures, than to have one that passes a test and fails in other protecton areas. 

My vets understand the training that we do and they agree to let me handle the dog for all exams. The measure of safety is for their protection and good relations! When broken K-9 teeth were shown, I head the mouth open and the vet did the exam. The created pressure for an exam came off without K-9 threats, or false issues for an attack. Even a "nice" Border Collie can get a case of the a$$ and bite, if the professional groomer is yanking the hair out of the dog's hide, and Jess did just that...


----------



## Maren Bell Jones (Jun 7, 2006)

Howard Gaines III said:


> My only issue with the CGC is that it gives a false measure of security. If the AKC says it's safe, it's safe. Not always true with some dogs and dog training styles. I would rather have a dog that is more defensive, know it and modify safety measures, than to have one that passes a test and fails in other protecton areas.


Since we deal with animals, this is definitely true. We can raise them from puppies, put them through the CGC, the TT, the BH, the TDI, etc and they can still act on instincts and surprise us, sometimes with unpleasant or even tragic results. So I agree with that.

However, I still advocate them because it shows the public that our dogs (PPDs or not) are not mindless rabid killing machines, which is especially necessary for BSL at risk dogs. I LOVE how the ATTS reports how high the passing rates of the American pit bull terrier is on their website, for instance. That sort of reporting is very very helpful when combating BSL and I wish the AKC did it for the CGC by breed.

The CGC is also a really good intro into dog sport for many people. For example, many average pet owners get discouraged with seeing agility dogs flying through jumps and obstacles with precision at a trial or on TV, take their first agility class, and are blown away with how much theory and practice goes into it. They take one class and give up because the idea of a trial, even at novice level, is so far away. The CGC is a nice first goal for average pet owners to get more interested in other kinds of sport and activities.


----------



## Howard Gaines III (Dec 26, 2007)

Tough to make a post from the Jones' on that one...well said. BSL will be the end of all real dog training and responsible ownership in America if folks don't step up. This is an election year and CHANGE is needed on all fronts. I don't care what party you belong to, most go in with youthful eyes and come out whores! And the paying Johns are the American public.

I want to know where my people stand on the issue of BSL and how they plan on changing some of the wrongs that have been created by a "feel good" few. Most of the people who I've contacted within the last year don't own working or herding breeds. Few understand the drives and the genetic makings of these active animals. When some child is bit or a senior has a chasing issue on the record, you know the dog and the owner pay! Accidents happen. CGC awards, PSA titled, or working police dogs all can have off days. The point is the CGC is that it is a good start to the road of working dog training or other K-9 venue.

If we, the responsible few, are happy sitting about with hands folded and mouths shut, don't go crying when YOUR interest is kicked in the butt by the far off few, the anti-dog training folks want to shut us down. Some can tell stories all day long about the evil dogs that run the streets, but remember that with ownership comes some level of educational responsibility on our part!


----------



## Howard Gaines III (Dec 26, 2007)

CGC Evaluators have you ever had a test go real wrong and in a hurry. I'm getting ready to do it with one of my dogs and I hate to say that I thinking RED, but...All I can think about is some old, white knuckled, blue hair woman getting eaten by one of my "squirrels." :roll:


----------



## Dan Long (Jan 10, 2008)

Howard you just need to relax, your dog will get ancy if you are nervous. When Gunnar was about 9 months I tried it and it was me who screwed him up, I let my frustration show and he picked up on it. As far as the blue haired woman, that is just who you might get, so if you are not confident that your dog is ready for that, you might want to keep training. I'm assuming this is Bear? Have you been socializing her with strangers and strange dogs? How about the 3 minute out of sight with a stranger holding her lead?


----------



## Anna Kasho (Jan 16, 2008)

Another simple thing that can help, and I'm not sure if anyone's mentioned it or not... Prior to doig the CGC, tire the dog out. Take them for a run, a swim, 4 hour hike, play ball, whatever you usually do. Anything that will get them good & tired and take the edge off. A tired dog will inevitably be nicer and calmer than the dog who's been sitting around all day and eager to get out for some action... Just a thought


----------



## Nancy Jocoy (Apr 19, 2006)

I got a CGC on a dog aggressive female.
She is not bad dog aggressive but is a snarky little shit.
I sweated the meet and greet but I had hammered into her little head what was and was not ok.


----------



## susan tuck (Mar 28, 2006)

Question about the grooming/ feet picking up part of the test:

If the examiner was a confident person who was matter-of-fact, my dog would be OK with this, but if the person were to act nervous or dart around or act frightened, my dog would react, sort of like "oh hey there, wtf is your problem?". Not to the point of aggression, but would for sure jerk his feet back and not like this person to touch him. For instance, here at home we have an office. If any of the employees walk into the house to tell me I have a phone call, no problem. My dog likes them and is fine with them. BUT if any of these people come running into the house and are yelling to find me, he will not let them past the hall, so he is a little reactive. 

Do the examiners ever act sketchy to check too see if dogs will react or are they pretty confident and straight forward? 

Anna, I just read your suggestion about tiring a dog out and I think that would maybe make my dog mellow enough even if the guy acted suspicious or dodgy.


----------



## Maren Bell Jones (Jun 7, 2006)

In my experience, they are usually pretty straight forward and don't try to "trick" the dog. When I run mock tests, I do it similar to how horse people usually get the horse to pick up a hoof. I run my hand down gently the whole leg from the point of the shoulder and go top to bottom and grasp the carpus (the "wrist") and lift instead of straight grabbing for the paw, but that's just me. I don't man handle their actual paw much, usually just the carpus, since even tolerant dogs aren't usually fond of it.


----------



## Bob Scott (Mar 30, 2006)

I don't think any will try and fool the dogs during a CGC test but not all the evaluators are truely qualified dog people. Some are way to much furbaby, fluffy dog folks. 
All it takes to become an evaluator is to pass a written test over the net. It doesn't necessarilly mean the person is qualified to handle/work/train dogs. 
I do it with my dogs for the simple reason that it looks good on paper in the event of a dog bite.
As Maren said though, it can be a nice beginning for a newby dog owner interested in getting started out in dog activities.


----------



## Howard Gaines III (Dec 26, 2007)

Anna Kasho said:


> Another simple thing that can help, and I'm not sure if anyone's mentioned it or not... Prior to doig the CGC, tire the dog out. Take them for a run, a swim, 4 hour hike, play ball, whatever you usually do. Anything that will get them good & tired and take the edge off. A tired dog will inevitably be nicer and calmer than the dog who's been sitting around all day and eager to get out for some action... Just a thought


What size TIRES?


----------



## Mo Earle (Mar 1, 2008)

_"Do the examiners ever act sketchy to check too see if dogs will react or are they pretty confident and straight forward?"


_I can only speak for myself, but when I am running an evaluation course-for item #3 I look to see that the dog appears to be healthy,-proper weight,alert,coat clean-good condition-not shaking his head due to an ear infection-etc. If the Handler does not have a brush they usually use, I do supply my own-but encourage the handlers at the beginning of the session to have theirs ready. 
If on "accepting the stranger"- I see a dog,that appears unsure, when we come to "Appearance and Grooming" I will have the Handler raise the dog's paw and then I will take the paw, and then proceed to gently pick up the other foot. I will then comb or brush the dog and gently examine the ears.

I encourage the Handlers to do what they feel most comfortable with during the test- they can talk to their dog,they can give encouragement-or some handlers that have competed in different venues actually prefer to be stoic and quiet,as if they were trialing. The dog is NOT required to stay in one position during this part of the exam.I also encourage the Handlers before the start of the test-try to have fun-have positive and assertive energy and your dog will do great!

If I have a dog that has done well on everything except one- I will allow them to retest that item- unless the dog displayed definate aggression toward a helper,myself or another dog...

Bob is right, you are required to take a test, and then fill out an application outlining your experiences to become an evaluator- so the evaluators may have a variety of dog training backgrounds-but most CGC evaluators I know,no matter what their own history of dog involvement I believe they have the dogs best interest as their motivator.

Good Luck to anyone wanting to try-and I think it is something really good to have,especially when we are teaching our dogs to do these other activities...like bite, or find people..etc...
Mo:smile:


----------



## Howard Gaines III (Dec 26, 2007)

Well, we did it, went and tried our hand at the AKC-CGC. A small group of folks, many who I think had taken a CGC class in how to get ready for the test, were there ready to go. My oh my...mostly small, FuFu dogs with my female Bouvier des Flandres being the *Big Bubba* of the lot.

We were third to test and the pre-game nerves were at its finest! Bear was too big to fit on the typewriter table stand. For those who grew up later, the typerwriter is an old fashion computer! Ask Jay about the History Channel, it might be on there! :mrgreen: 

Bear was the social retard, the Chunky Cheese kid from the farm, "Oh look at the little chew dogs..." Focus was NOT the game plan today! While she handled somewhat well and passed, it was a PPD handler's grind of the teeth, a wearing of a LOW brimmed hat to get me through the day. She broke her "down-stay" after three steps away and needed REMINDING. Her recall was quick, but only to get a better look at the FuFu's on the side of the field. If it were the Schutzhund BH, my a$$ would have been busted that day big time.

All in all, glad I did it and would tell others without "hard" dogs, like my male, to do the same. The TDI or TD, whatever the next thing is, we'll try it. They were shocked when they found out she was a PPD and a member of our working dog group. And to my shocked face, I was asked to speak at upcoming club events regarding working dogs, PPD training, to be a member of the host club, and to help teach some of the classes. All that from one busted CGC test. ](*,) 

Yep, somedays a blind squirrel finds a nut, some scrub pony gets some scrub brush, and in my hour (10 minutes) of pain and humbleness, get to showcase the issues of responsible working dog use and handling. Shucks, who would ever think $10.00 could go so far? :-k


----------



## Mo Earle (Mar 1, 2008)

\\/ good job!


----------



## Howard Gaines III (Dec 26, 2007)

Mo what's the next thing to do that is easy and productive? I understand that the AKC is restructuring the dog classes and changing some groups.


----------



## Maren Bell Jones (Jun 7, 2006)

Yay, good job Howard! Back when I did the CGC with Lily, it was at Purina Farms south of St. Louis and outdoors. For the down stay, the evaluator wanted us walk away to a certain spot on the grass for the recall. I looked over at the judge (who was standing right next to my dog) and said, "right here?" Lily ran right to me. Hier being her recall cue word. :lol: Fortunately the evaluator believed me. ;-) 

I'd keep an eye on the American Temperament Test Society's page for upcoming tests:

http://www.atts.org/index.html

I'll be doing that with Fawkes next month hopefully, but those are a lot less commonly held than the CGC (once a year around here if we're lucky). He's 6 days short of the 18 month old age cut off, so hopefully they'll let him slide. 

The TDI is pretty tricky for a dog with a lot of ball/prey drive because they usually have a part where kids or whatever play ball right near your dog with you out of sight during the 3 minute separation. Train a solid down stay and it should be fine, but that part had me the most worried. They also tend to have people wearing hats, sunglasses, breathing masks, limping, walking funny, with wheelchairs, etc. When I've helped with a TDI test, I've seen the canes or walkers be waved around a little bit like crazy old folks (think Bob, haha! ;-) ) 5-10 feet from the dog , so careful with that one if they're real reactive. Something to be aware of. Just remember, it's not about your dog being a hardass, it's about control.


----------



## Dan Long (Jan 10, 2008)

Congrats Howard and Bear!


----------



## Bob Scott (Mar 30, 2006)

Big congrats!
Here's another to check out. I just got Thunder's TT this spring. I even has a very minor protection routine in it to see if the different breeds have the correct/incorrect temperments for guarding. 
http://www.atts.org/


----------



## Mo Earle (Mar 1, 2008)

Howard, in addition to att's-and AKC obedience-utility dog etc....they are all fine... what about going the direction of PSA- starting with the TC, and the PDC of PSA-good place to start and it is geared toward working dogs... http://www.psak9.org/psapdc.htm  Mo


----------



## jay lyda (Apr 10, 2006)

Howard Gaines III said:


> For those who grew up later, the typerwriter is an old fashion computer! Ask Jay about the History Channel, it might be on there! :mrgreen:


I can't recall a show on that one, but I do believe that I've seen one at a yard sale one time. Oh wait are yard sales nation wide or do we just have them around here? And before you get excited Howard its not the kind of thing that you need to bring a shovel to. :-D


----------



## Howard Gaines III (Dec 26, 2007)

I hear ya Jay but we call the stuff "sod." It's dirt with grass growing on it, a real popular thing in the hood! During NASCAR, you can roll out a few feet of it and it feels like home...even throw the beer cans on it when you're done.:mrgreen:


----------

