# Intestinal Spirochetes?



## Tammy McDowell

Might anyone have information on Spirochetes? I am having a hard time finding anything online other than the fact that they are corkscrew parasites...anyone?

Being the absolute sucker that I am, I was back at the animal shelter yesterday and arrived home with a sick pup. I wouldn't have pulled her BUT if you all remember the pup I pulled 2 weeks ago w/ the big ears...apparently this little one is from the same litter. Not sure where she was 2 weeks ago but there is no mistaking that they are siblings. Again, I'm a sucker and couldn't leave her there. I figure she has a better chance at recovery here than at the shelter living in filth. 

The shelter started her on Clavamox a few days ago. I took her into the vet and she has Coccidia, Giardia, Spirochetes and suspected Ringworm topped off with the nasty shelter funk. My vet said the Coccidia is not contagious to humans, I know Giardia and Ringworm ARE both contagious but have no idea about Spirochetes.

She is extremely thin and sickly looking BUT on the plus side when I take her out she is spunky and playful and is also eating and drinking very well.

She is isolated from everyone and is going potty in an area that our dogs do not venture. 

Pup is on Albon, Metronidazole and Clavamox and also received Drontal as well as medication for ringworm.


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## ann schnerre

tammy,

i looke in mymerck manual, and the only thing i could find that MAY be even related is "spirocerca lupi", an esophageal worm..and that manual is the 6th edition, published 22 yrs ago, so it's def not up to date.

from what i read, i hope the pup doesn't have them, &/or there's an effective treatment nowadays...i can tell you more if you want, but again--it's old info.

ps--she's as cute as her brother  and no--i don't want her. sorry...


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## Debbie Skinner

What I found on "spirocerca lupi" on the net: _eggs are irregularly found and released through pathways other than only feces, like vomit, and depend on whether or not granulomas open into the oesophagus at that point in time._

Sounds hard to diagnose so how was it diagnosed?

Also, in my Veterinary Clinical Parasitology book it says next to a photo of the eggs: _A sedimentation test is the best technique for recovery of these small, larvated eggs...The egg of Physaloptera, a stomach worm of dogs and cats, is similar to Spirocerca but is more oval in shape..._

Maybe it's not Spirocera? I read up on Spirocera also and it seems to be a really nasty parasite.

Good luck.
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## Tammy McDowell

Debbie Skinner said:


> What I found on "spirocerca lupi" on the net: _eggs are irregularly found and released through pathways other than only feces, like vomit, and depend on whether or not granulomas open into the oesophagus at that point in time._
> 
> Sounds hard to diagnose so how was it diagnosed?
> 
> Also, in my Veterinary Clinical Parasitology book it says next to a photo of the eggs: _A sedimentation test is the best technique for recovery of these small, larvated eggs...The egg of Physaloptera, a stomach worm of dogs and cats, is similar to Spirocerca but is more oval in shape..._
> 
> Maybe it's not Spirocera? I read up on Spirocera also and it seems to be a really nasty parasite.
> 
> Good luck.


 
It could be Spirocera, let me look that up. It is very highly possible that I spelled it wrong, I had never heard of whatever it was...vet found it in a fecal exam.

Pup is on the way to recovery and doing great! It's amazing what happens when you get the bugs out of their systems! :mrgreen:


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## Diane Seaman

Spirochetes are spiral shaped bacteria. Familiar spirochetes would include the bacteria that cause Lyme's disease and Leptospirosis ("Lepto"), plus syphilis in humans. Spirochetes are commonly found in the intestinal tract of both healthy dogs and those with diarrhea. It's not too unusual to find an overgrowth of spirochetes in dogs with GI disease, but whether the spirochetes are actually causing the problem or are just overgrown due to some other problem (giardia, coccidia) is sometimes unclear. There are some species that seem to cause diarrhea especially in pups under a year old and others that are found as normal, non-pathogenic residents of the intestine. It could be that normally harmless spirochetes become a problem when underlying disease (worms, giarda, coccidia etc.) damages the mucosal lining, but the bottom line is that it's not too unsual to find an abundance of spirochetes in a pup with diarrhea.


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## ann schnerre

thank you diane!


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## Tammy McDowell

Diane Seaman said:


> Spirochetes are spiral shaped bacteria. Familiar spirochetes would include the bacteria that cause Lyme's disease and Leptospirosis ("Lepto"), plus syphilis in humans. Spirochetes are commonly found in the intestinal tract of both healthy dogs and those with diarrhea. It's not too unusual to find an overgrowth of spirochetes in dogs with GI disease, but whether the spirochetes are actually causing the problem or are just overgrown due to some other problem (giardia, coccidia) is sometimes unclear. There are some species that seem to cause diarrhea especially in pups under a year old and others that are found as normal, non-pathogenic residents of the intestine. It could be that normally harmless spirochetes become a problem when underlying disease (worms, giarda, coccidia etc.) damages the mucosal lining, but the bottom line is that it's not too unsual to find an abundance of spirochetes in a pup with diarrhea.


 
Thanks Diane!


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## Diane Seaman

You're welcome! Most likely when the Giardia is eliminated and the coccidia are under control the spirochetes will be as well (metronidazole is good against many spirochetes, too). 

I forgot to mention earlier that they aren't likely to be a problem for humans because most of the intestinal type are species specific, but there are exceptions (as with everything). The same precautions you will employ to keep yourself and family from picking up Giardia will take care of the spirochetes as well (hand washing, bathing the dog frequently, disinfecting).


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## Tammy McDowell

As hard as she fought and seemed to recover, I had to put this little one down today.  She bounced back and had about 4 days as a normal, fun and healthy puppy before starting to go back down hill. I am normally skeptical when vets mention distemper because nasty URI's are so common here and are often mistaken for Distemper. With this one, I knew from the look in her eyes this afternoon...there was nothing there anymore.  RIP Penelope.


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## Diane Seaman

So sorry to hear this, Tammy. Thank you for giving Penelope the best chance possible and letting her know human kindness before she left. RIP little Penelope


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## Anna Kasho

I am so sorry. At least she had a few good days spent with you...:-(


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