# Whistle Commands



## Nancy Jocoy (Apr 19, 2006)

Thinking of getting into this because basically when Beau is scanning for scent he is nearly deaf to me. He is not in lala land but is working but sometimes I want to cast him somewhere else, stop him or call him back. And, yes, if he DOES get distracted on a search jolt him into reality. Had that issue in the lowcountry when he was hot, saw water, and dove in. Can't have that down there.

We do plan (myself and a teammate) on tackling some more precise directional commands this summer with our dogs using the VSARDA info as a training guide......Right now he has the general idea of going in a direction I sweep my hand, but not so specific as left, right, stop etc. I have always been a little cautious as we are not doing disaster and I don't want to control too much where he goes as he naturally covers his area pretty completely without me.

..but I am think of using verbal and hand controls for those--not so much coming up with complex whistle communication.

The main use I *think* I would have of a whistle is

--Stop, look at me for direction
--DOWN!
--Come

Any insights on if/how to make a whistle part of our repertoire? Because he is HR, he is not normally ranging far out of sight or bell distance.


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## Sarah Platts (Jan 12, 2010)

I would suggest this....

http://www.gundogsupply.com/dualtonwhis.html

It produces 2 tones and similar to what I use on my dogs. All of mine are whistled trained and for distance work, it's better than yelling at the dog. Very effective in windy conditions or heavy rain which can drown out voices. There are 2 tones (one sharp and the other more blurred because of the pea or bead) and both are very distinctive. The sharp tone for comes, attention to handler, etc. The blurred tone to halt the dog.
For my dogs on the sharp tone: one tweet means look to me for direction, 2 tweets means return to me. A long blast on the burred one means halt, stop and stay there. I then switch to the sharp tone to give further direction to either continue or return. But you can make the tones mean anything you want.

If working airscent and the dog is out of sight, I will give very short toot on the sharp end on a periodic basis so the dog can continue to sweep but use the tones to keep track of me and continue fanning out. I can change directions and the dog will move with me in the sweep using the tone to maintain his working width.


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## Nancy Jocoy (Apr 19, 2006)

Wonderful, I was actually looking at one similar on Amazon, an Acme 640 two toned whistle with a pea in one end, HF on the other very much like this. 

How did you train these. That is exactly what I am looking to do! (What you currently do) I figure we can do directional controls with verbal and hand signals if I get the dog to look at me.


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## Sarah Platts (Jan 12, 2010)

For the 2-tone come: I usually do this in a park and take the pup out to play with a ball or something that I can throw that will get the pup to leave me. If the pup already knows come, and is reliable, then you yell come and as the pup begins to respond then toot with the whistle. If they are not reliable then I go out with a 100 ft rope so I can reel them in if necessary giving double toots. But you will begin to tie the two acts (voice and whistle) into the result you want. Any time the dog heads into you give 2 toots. But like other OB commands it's not an endless string of "comes" or whistles. Both need the same weight and level of obedience. In the beginning with pups its the voice, whistle, lots of verbal praise as they head in. Over time you can drop the voice and just toot with the whistle. Do just the 2-tweet come first and leave the single tweet attention tone for later since you need the dog to know hand signals or coursing behavior first.

For the halt, if a puppy, then you will need a second person to handle the back lead so when you call and then signal for the halt, that person can stop the puppy. The first times will cause some confusion for the pup because you called and then you prevented them from obeying but they will soon get the idea down. It works better once they get 6-8 months old. I usually throw up both hands, palms facing the dog, and I command them to verbally 'wait'. The 'wait' is already pre-taught during trailing work. Once the dog knows the verbal and hand signal then I drop the voice and substitute the long burr tone. I can tuck the whistle into the corner of my mouth, yell wait, and then whistle while throwing up my hands. Once the dog halts then I give the 2 toots to get them to finish coming in. What I have found is that to much halting work in a session will leave the dog very reluctant to come but instead will just stay where you left them. So mix it up a bit and don't always have the dog return to you. Let them re-start by chasing after a ball or tug throw. Because if it's always a halt with return to handler the dog will just skip the middle step and head in to you on the burr tone.
I've also used an ecollar to reinforce the halt once they know what to do. Most of the time, I'm teaching this in my front yard and then later in the park or on free walks. Start with small distances and then gradually increase the range. Some want the dog to down to help break a chase or stalking response on the hunting dog but I have mine just stop and stand.

Assuming you have already taught the coursing behavior using hand signals (or beginning to teach) then you start doing the single sharp tone. When the dog gets to the point I want them to turn, I give a single tone (which the dog will start to turn because he thinks the second tone is coming) and I will wave them off to sweep past me (or I will throw out a ball). Then they get to the other end, its a toot, dog starts to turn, and then I wave on. You can also have the dog walking or running around, playing, give a toot - and then I will cast them out to go over a toy of theirs. This way they learn that following your directions may lead to a prize. 
Never give a single attention tone and then try and change that single tone into a return tone by slapping a second toot onto the first. If you want the return then it's 2 quick toots. Not a single toot, pause, then the second toot. Some people make the attention tone one longer blast. And a return 2 short quick ones. 
Carry the whistle with you every time you take the dog out and work on it when on free walks or during play. 

This is probably as clear as mud, so if you have any questions let me know.


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## Sarah Platts (Jan 12, 2010)

Over time, as the dog learns good coursing behavior I can use the whistle to define my borders and the dog will stay to that distance. So he moves off to the right, whistle tone at the distance I want, return to the left, whistle tone at the distance desired, then on the right the dog will stop and turn at the previous distance you have already tonally marked off to him. So I can walk a pattern and the dog will course out the distance I've indicated to the left and right. It works for send-outs too.


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## Sarah Platts (Jan 12, 2010)

I just have my dogs stop and stand because I don't want to run the risk of cueing what some could take to be an indication on a search. If you make the dog down or sit and that's their cadaver indication, and you do it on a search, then it could be argued that your dog false alerts. Just something to think about....


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## Nancy Jocoy (Apr 19, 2006)

Useful information. Will have to re read a few times. Come to think of it I typically control his range by me giving a tweet whistle from my mouth where he automatically changes direction and casts across me. Not really trained, it just happened naturally. Not as precise as I like but something to build on.

What you have on the wait is similar to what I did with drop on recall with not calling the dog to me for reward. Actually I got faster drops by throwing the ball behind him after he dropped. 

Interesting insight on the DROP command. Had not thought about that though we do have an emergency down.......have to for certification. Our team also requires but it is so different than an indication.


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## Bob Scott (Mar 30, 2006)

The duck hunters use the whistle in send outs for just a "turn and look at me." When that happens then the dog responds to hand signals.


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## Nancy Jocoy (Apr 19, 2006)

That is really what I am looking for and even with the boundary whistle I can start to build in a hand signal...I think...


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## Sarah Platts (Jan 12, 2010)

Your question got me to thinking about this. Whistles were probably common for the bird dog folks from early on but when I was getting started in SAR, no one used them. I had just a regular whistle to use because Jack would range out hundreds of yards and I got tired of yelling over that distance. I figured if I could whistle the cows and horses up out of the fields it would work for this application too. 

I remember folks looking sideways at me when I whistled to him and asking why I didn’t just use my voice. They would kinda nod their heads but no one was burning any bridges to try it. I remember a very short time after that a USAR handler asking me about them and wondering if it would work for her dog. Her thought was that when they gave the tones to emergency clear the pile, the dog gets left behind and she wanted something she could use to signal the dog to her as she was scrambling to clear. Years later, FEMA handlers are now openly talking about their use. I’m not saying anyone got the idea off of me but to see more people using them, it sure makes up for all the snide comments from the early years.

And along with the whistle was the E-collar. I remember an early airscent seminar I took in Louisiana. When we got to this huge field I put Jack into his ecollar because he had this thing about hunting and coursing birds at the same time he hunted and coursed for humans. I had several folks make it a point to tell me that if my dog needed THAT then I needed to just go home because he wasn’t fit to be brought out into public yet. E-collars were whispered of behind closed doors, no one admitted to using one, and certainly you didn’t let anyone see you using one or where others could see you using it. There was one gal from Texas who was also running a GSP who said basically said I needed to take my dog out behind the barn and do all my teaching back there, but don’t come to a seminar with one on the dog. I got a bit of my own back later as my dog at least came when I called. Her dog was so conditioned to the ecollar that it would stage escapes and vanish into the swamps when it got the chance because the handler over used it and without the ecollar the handler couldn’t enforce her demand. Dog showed back up when it wanted to, not because it had to. I felt a bit sorry for the dog because her dog was so OB’d with the collar that it was pretty useless without it.

I didn’t mean to hijack your thread, Nancy, but its sure weird how the wheel turns and the circle closes. It makes me wonder how much shit other handlers had to put up with when they tried new things before they became something that “everybody” does?


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## Nancy Jocoy (Apr 19, 2006)

Ecollars are well accepted here and some in our group use them. A heart to heart with the MT who re-certified us was that he did not think he needed one and he would suggest I not use it. I am still open minded but for now we are holding back.

What got me thinking about the whistle is during that cert my commands got tightened up (I learned that no, heel, etc. are a one-syllable words, for instance.......)  I think if he had an ecollar it would have gone on me.

What is more crisp and carries better than a blast on a whistle? So that is where I am coming from.


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## Sarah Platts (Jan 12, 2010)

Interesting because I do tend to converse with my dogs. My biggest issue is calling one dog by another's name and then wondering why "Ben" isn't coming back when it's Sam that's running away. Or saying "Jack, no... Sam, no.,... Gus ..... oh, whoever you are - get over here...."


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## Jim Delbridge (Jan 27, 2010)

Ok, I think you're overthinking this. First, watch some herding trials and you'll notice the handler uses almost only whistles because of distance.
Second, while I have seen handlers use a hand whistle successfully, it was right there around their neck with their clicker and their e-collar transmitter....while maybe a nice fashion accessory, for me it's just something else to catch on when I'm searching through heavy woods with the dog.
Third,the more we complicate how to do this, the more complicated it gets.....i.e. simplify, this is not rocket science and has been used by handlers for millenia....but, like our other tools it takes practice, timing, and consistency.

So, the best way would have been to incorporate whistles when the dog's learning curve was exponential at puppydom, but each current dog is the "mistake dog" for the next one we work.

I'd suggest you first working out what whistle system you want to use. The search dog handler should really be the area manager for the scent expert, so commands should detail "that's far enough, turn back", "I'd like you to work in this other direction", "Come here as fast as you can". 
Again, look for herding dog trials and you'll see how whistles are an art form.

So, you have the whistle cadences you want to use (mechanical whistle is limited to a morse code like system as in the cadence you create per command). Get out the long line and teach what the whistles mean such that the dog learns to anticipate what the whistle means and the long line is no longer necessary. yup, old school, but none of this is new, just more expensive toys to do it with.

A lot of times a whistle with travel a lot farther than voice, so I keep it in my tool belt as it's common for my dogs to search out of my sight.

Hope that helps,

jim


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## Nancy Jocoy (Apr 19, 2006)

I can pretty easy keep a whistle where it will be available and wont get hung up. Pup would have been prime time but I am keeping it simple. Strange I never used it before. It is about clarity and distance is why I want to do it.


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## Sarah Platts (Jan 12, 2010)

Nancy, I whipped this up today. Its not anything spectacular. Just something I threw together. I introduced Gus to the whistle come command yesterday for the first time. Did it about 3 times. The first clip is a come. Just the whistle and then verbal to keep him coming in. The second is the start of quartering. He's never done this before. I have been working with "this way" and a hand gesture when I change directions but the whistle cue is new. The last is him doing a long distance recall using only the whistle to begin the return. With the jets flying, it makes good sense to me.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Cd3JVdZXVk


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## Nancy Jocoy (Apr 19, 2006)

Thanks, looks good!. Right now I am getting a solid recall on two chirps and am going to try it with training where I already have him quartering across me with verbal or whistle with my mouth then waving my arm.


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## Sarah Platts (Jan 12, 2010)

Good deal. When I did the long distance recall, I wasn't even sure if Gus would hear the tones. I didn't blow it any louder than I normally do but that pitch level of the whistle must cut through alot of other noise.


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## Edward Weiss (Sep 19, 2011)

I use a whistle as routine in retrieving birds in trials or field. 
Very useful in directing a dog at a distance in water. 
One toot is sit looking at me,followed by a hand signal for left right or straight back. You can direct them in a blind retrieve such that they pick up a bird hundreds of yards away that they did NOT see fall.
In water one toot is tread water and look at me waiting for hand signal.
In dense woods the two whistles stops the intense hunting dog from getting lost.


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