# impressive work



## Chris McDonald (May 29, 2008)

Some very impressive work 
http://www.youtube.com/user/WorkingDogsCentralv


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## vincent demaio (May 6, 2009)

Chris McDonald said:


> Some very impressive work
> http://www.youtube.com/user/WorkingDogsCentralv


 

the link doesnt work


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## Mike Scheiber (Feb 17, 2008)

Chris McDonald said:


> Some very impressive work
> http://www.youtube.com/user/WorkingDogsCentralv


ZIPPO
WTF cant even post the shit much less discuss it DAMN


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## Chris Michalek (Feb 13, 2008)

good thing you guys aren't into SAR. You'd fail miserably! 

http://www.youtube.com/user/WorkingDogsCentral


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## Chris McDonald (May 29, 2008)

thanks, Chris


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## Francis Metcalf (Oct 10, 2009)

Thanks for the link! I like how in the guys description of his channel he points out that none of the dogs on the channel are trained with food or do sport, yet the video on his player is from Andrea Vandergeten and he is a sport trainer who uses food!


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## Chris McDonald (May 29, 2008)

Francis Metcalf said:


> Thanks for the link! I like how in the guys description of his channel he points out that none of the dogs on the channel are trained with food or do sport, yet the video on his player is from Andrea Vandergeten and he is a sport trainer who uses food!


Well that’s what you get for reading… I just looked at Zippo, that’s why I never read :lol:


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## Sudhir Mathur (Sep 10, 2009)

Working dog central I guess just adds the clips from other channels....here is the right one...

http://www.youtube.com/Dovrefjeld#p/a/u/2/gQzcGDDnoII

Work certainly looks impressive...and I like the description .... they say for some circus work and for some life saving.....depends on what one needs...

And if I see the little discussion here this statement looks real...

IMO great work....very few can realise that kind of work....I think the other very similar clip was from chris...great


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## Chris McDonald (May 29, 2008)

Sudhir, as far as I know this type of work is called Phoenix. So far I only know of a few places that work like this. None in the US, from what I have seen I really like it the more I learn the more I am impressed, I think one of the coolest things my dog has done with this work is climb a fairly high cargo net. When it really comes down to it, it just about what you like to do. I dig the circus work


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## Sudhir Mathur (Sep 10, 2009)

Thanks chris...I did ponder on where all these kind of agility could come to use...and believe me it's almost everywhere apart from the sport field....

So I guess thats what these guys mean with their circus statement....

I did read about Andre too and he is not just a sports trainer....if u see his website u will realize he is more of a real life work trainer....sports is just a small part of the entire thing for him...

For me it's the end result that matters....there could be many ways to get there...that is left to individual handlers to decide....

BTW ....UR dog looks great Chris.... amazing work...keep it up...


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## Chris McDonald (May 29, 2008)

Too me Its everywhere even the sport field, not that I been on one. That Dutch Shepherd Zippo looks a lot like my dog , it amazing how they move in the same manner. I kind of think the Circus thing on their site is a bit of sarcasm but funny, but I guess it would work. Some of those circus dogs are pretty good. I tried to get Quinn to stand/ walk on one of those exercise balls before, it popped after about 5 minutes, and he just slowly sank to the floor with me holding him. Thanks for the comment on my dog but I hope you didn’t think he was one of the dogs in this video


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## Chris McDonald (May 29, 2008)

Mike Scheiber said:


> ZIPPO
> WTF cant even post the shit much less discuss it DAMN


Now that you can see it are you gona discuss it or are you looking for something else to bitch about? :lol:


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## Jennifer Coulter (Sep 18, 2007)

I am not sure I would ever spend the time to teach my dog to walk on wobbly boards tied in rafters like that, but it is neat to see that it can be done. I get the considerable amount of training to teach the dogs to do this kind of stuff "carefully" instead of always teaching agility "in drive". I do work some of this stuff, but have never taken to those levels, and much of the stuff I have done is in drive.

I would like to see more video of the "real" applications of this circus work.

I guess I should edit to add that my dog does get lots of opportunity to work on agility and control "not in drive" coming to work with me on the mountain...I just have never considered it training, but it likely is. Still..nothing like the rafter vid!


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## Andy Larrimore (Jan 8, 2008)

Very impressed with the work.


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## Chris McDonald (May 29, 2008)

Jennifer Coulter said:


> I am not sure I would ever spend the time to teach my dog to walk on wobbly boards tied in rafters like that, but it is neat to see that it can be done. I get the considerable amount of training to teach the dogs to do this kind of stuff "carefully" instead of always teaching agility "in drive". I do work some of this stuff, but have never taken to those levels, and much of the stuff I have done is in drive.
> 
> I would like to see more video of the "real" applications of this circus work.
> 
> I guess I should edit to add that my dog does get lots of opportunity to work on agility and control "not in drive" coming to work with me on the mountain...I just have never considered it training, but it likely is. Still..nothing like the rafter vid!


Come on you guys have to have circuses in Canada, the last good dog show I saw was in Sea World on FL a few years back. 
No really though, maybe one of the reasons for this work is not the agility itself only. Maybe it goes deeper? I got my thoughts and beliefs but unfortunately not true knowledge or experience to back them up on this type of work or any other. I have come to like this as the foundation on my dog and would be hard pressed to go with another foundation type on my next dog. 
These dogs don’t look very stressed to me for the things they are doing, do you think that because of this it might allow for a dog to perform work better in a situation that may be stressful? Maybe there used to dealing with stress? For example in your situation you were searching and for whatever the reason there were two low flying helicopters over you, maybe with infrared cameras or something. I know you guys train with this kind of stuff but could it be possible that your dog may be able to ignore the distraction a bit better? I don’t know I’m just asking. Do you see a down side to this kind of foundation?


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## Mike Scheiber (Feb 17, 2008)

Chris McDonald said:


> Now that you can see it are you gona discuss it or are you looking for something else to bitch about? :lol:


Meh it's impressive was the music the instrumental/Muzak version of Fire Starter www.youtube.com/watch?v=wmin5WkOuPw


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## Chris McDonald (May 29, 2008)

Mike Scheiber said:


> Meh it's impressive was the music the instrumental/Muzak version of Fire Starter www.youtube.com/watch?v=wmin5WkOuPw


 
All right you left me speechless


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## Mike Scheiber (Feb 17, 2008)

Chris McDonald said:


> All right you left me speechless


Cool I'll take that as a compliment :mrgreen:


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## Gerry Grimwood (Apr 2, 2007)

Chris McDonald said:


> Come on you guys have to have circuses in Canada,


I'm training for the circus, but you have to watch this boring video to the end to see proof :lol:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zA3FnaEJr-c


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## Chris McDonald (May 29, 2008)

Gerry Grimwood said:


> I'm training for the circus, but you have to watch this boring video to the end to see proof :lol:
> 
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zA3FnaEJr-c


 
Dog has some go go juice… you really F us with the ½ second of circus work though. You can be in charge of advertising for the circus if we ever start one


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## Mike Scheiber (Feb 17, 2008)

Gerry Grimwood said:


> I'm training for the circus, but you have to watch this boring video to the end to see proof :lol:
> 
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zA3FnaEJr-c


2 things that impressed your dog didn't go to your camera bag and shake off and of cores the speedy circus performance.


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## Carlos Machado (Dec 28, 2008)

They have a website some great work and yes it can be used for real this video shows it all jumping out of a helicopter before it lands, going through fire and up a ladder to get a guy or on the catwalk to find drugs and the video showing it all http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HSq_3WBS89k&feature=player_embedded this is the site http://www.stealth-paws.com/content/videos


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## Jennifer Coulter (Sep 18, 2007)

Chris McDonald said:


> Come on you guys have to have circuses in Canada, the last good dog show I saw was in Sea World on FL a few years back.
> No really though, maybe one of the reasons for this work is not the agility itself only. Maybe it goes deeper? I got my thoughts and beliefs but unfortunately not true knowledge or experience to back them up on this type of work or any other. I have come to like this as the foundation on my dog and would be hard pressed to go with another foundation type on my next dog.
> These dogs don’t look very stressed to me for the things they are doing, do you think that because of this it might allow for a dog to perform work better in a situation that may be stressful? Maybe there used to dealing with stress? For example in your situation you were searching and for whatever the reason there were two low flying helicopters over you, maybe with infrared cameras or something. I know you guys train with this kind of stuff but could it be possible that your dog may be able to ignore the distraction a bit better? I don’t know I’m just asking. Do you see a down side to this kind of foundation?


I understand it goes deeper. I think that it builds trust in the handler and confidence too.

As far as the question about helicopters flying around while the dog is searching, you are correct I get to work on that stuff. Especially since I work at an operation that uses helicopters frequently, so I can set up searches or do obedience when they are flying around...droping explosives too.

As far as my dog...I would say it is his drive and desire to search makes him ignore the distractions, coupled with the fact that he has been desensitised a fair bit and exposed to those noises since very young. 

I have become more interested in how dogs react to things "outside of drive". For example we hear all the time about mals being not so stable. They have very high drive, and they can overcome all kinds of things when they are in drive. However when not in drive, it is easier to see the true colours of a dog that is a little on the skittish side.

I would say that a positive to the kind of training you have described is that you desensitize the dog to certain stresses. Do I think that the walking on high tippy platforms makes a dog handle the stress of thunderstorms better lets say???? No, I don't. I don't think that dogs are that good of generalizers. I think that if you desensitize and train dogs in MANY different types of stressful situations and build trust in the handler, you will see that the dog performs better in stressful situations. You know...tippy platforms...gun shots....RINGS OF FIRE;-)8) 

Of course I think it would be great to have a dog that can just naturally handle stress without a lot of desensitization and exposure...but then we get into the whole Mike S vs. Don and Jeff debate about exposing young dogs to all sorts of crap from birth on to help them deal with the stesses they will face in the future.

I don't think there is a downside to this kind of foundation as long as it does not end up that the dog is too relient on the handler to think independently. This is important to me in the type of work we do. As long as dog isn't constantly looking at the handler for direction when it is not required, I am okay with any early training.

JMHO.


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## Jennifer Coulter (Sep 18, 2007)

Gerry Grimwood said:


> I'm training for the circus, but you have to watch this boring video to the end to see proof :lol:
> 
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zA3FnaEJr-c


A little on the anti climactic side Gerry:mrgreen: That dog sure does have you well trained to throw stuff;-)


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## Jennifer Coulter (Sep 18, 2007)

Carlos Machado said:


> They have a website some great work and yes it can be used for real this video shows it all jumping out of a helicopter before it lands, going through fire and up a ladder to get a guy or on the catwalk to find drugs and the video showing it all http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HSq_3WBS89k&feature=player_embedded this is the site http://www.stealth-paws.com/content/videos


I am pretty sure that most high drive dogs would jump out of a hovering heli for a bite...in or out of a bus window and so on. I am not sure that your average PSD or sport dog would climb up the obsticle course shown without previous training/exposure for a drug search though. Just what I think...I could be wrong.


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## Jason Hammel (Aug 13, 2009)

Dang Gerry had me laughing. "and some circus stuff for chris" lol I don't know how you were able to get out and throw stuff for your dog today though. I was too full to even look at my dog.

BTW chris saw the new vids on your channel looking good! your dog not you I mean.


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## Chris McDonald (May 29, 2008)

Jennifer Coulter said:


> I understand it goes deeper. I think that it builds trust in the handler and confidence too.
> 
> As far as the question about helicopters flying around while the dog is searching, you are correct I get to work on that stuff. Especially since I work at an operation that uses helicopters frequently, so I can set up searches or do obedience when they are flying around...droping explosives too.
> 
> ...


I’ll go with that you say too, as soon as I get 20-years experience with several hundred dogs and training methods I will get back to you with my answer. At my current rate it should take me about 100 years to get those 20-years of experience. So we will continue this on Thanks Given Day 2109. 

Has anyone posted a video of fetch ever before?


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## Sudhir Mathur (Sep 10, 2009)

Hey Chris thx for ur response and I wasn't confusing your dog with this one...

I am not as experienced as you guys but when I see the clip in discussion I can imagine a whole lot of scenarios that happen in our day to day life....e.g when we see a high rise on fire with fire tenders all around having huge ladders...and lets say we need to send in a dog ...the dog takes the ladder easily rather than having the need to carry it....same will hold good in an earthquake situation when searching and also in a building collapse scene....here the rumbles will make the search delicate since one will not know what gives in when..so for dogs to work they need to be sure footed and also be stress resistant to such surroundings....I have been and seen such scenes...it's a big big mess.....

In airport cargo complex and other such places the dogs should be able to reach right to the top for any searches....and not just go around the ground sniffing....we should understand that in this big bad world criminals and others are getting very smart....

IMO maybe these dogs will never cross the barriers that they work on in the clip...but that work will help these dogs be very very comfortable and sure footed in similar or lesser situation...

I also think it is wise that the dog looks for handler direction...or else in such situation one wrong foot may spell doom.....


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## Sudhir Mathur (Sep 10, 2009)

Strange ....since I see no response...can I request some experts to please respond to my opinion...whether my thought is right or wrong...

Thanks....


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