# Dog paradox/personality



## georgia estes (Nov 3, 2009)

Just wondering if anyone elses dog is like this. I have a dog who is not social, he does not want to be touched and he acts weird and scared around people. I'm talking wide-eyed and the I want to get far far away from you look. When I first got him I wanted to get rid of him because he would piss himself and run away from people. (never in bite work, just in social situations) If you saw him around people and didn't see him work you'd think he was a total shitter.

I have tried and tried to make him more social but he's just not. He has a hair trigger and will bite anyone, any time the word is given. However he is not a fear bite, has never nipped or anything and he is very VERY strong in the work. He is not phased by any distraction, decoy etc no matter how much pressure etc he just bites harder. Mind you this dog is not 2 yet. Anyone have a dog that acts downright spooky and like a nerve bag around strange people but is still a very strong dog and confident in the work? It seems like such a paradox.


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## Alison Grubb (Nov 18, 2009)

I am interested to see the feedback on this.

I had a dog who was not super social and would light up on people for no reason - he never bit, but put on a heck of a display. He also displayed some slight environmental issues when he was out and about. In the work, he seemed fine. But then as the pressure increased, both from the decoy and from the expectations of the handler he started to crumble. I got rid of him after he ran off of the field twice.


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## georgia estes (Nov 3, 2009)

Alison Grubb said:


> I am interested to see the feedback on this.
> 
> I had a dog who was not super social and would light up on people for no reason - he never bit, but put on a heck of a display. He also displayed some slight environmental issues when he was out and about. In the work, he seemed fine. But then as the pressure increased, both from the decoy and from the expectations of the handler he started to crumble. I got rid of him after he ran off of the field twice.


Yeah he has no environmental issues except with people. No loud noises, surfaces, stairs, explosions, weed eaters, etc scare him at all. He has never been ran, and never released a grip even as an 11 week old pup. I went straight from ringsport with him to PSA without ever showing him distractions (can curtains, yelling, etc) and he never even blinked. I just competed with him in PSA 1 and got a 209 in protection, when the highest you can get is a 220. He's a nice dog but he's just really weird with people. I guess the paradox in my mind is that to have this beast dog who is oh so strong they have to be super confident otherwise, but he's living proof that's not always true I suppose. :???::???:


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## brad robert (Nov 26, 2008)

Wow thats an interesting situation and he does seem the paradox to be a little spooky yet strong in bite work or with environmental stuff.I have a bitch who is not interested in people but not spooky just indifferent and really does not like even me to pat her but she is strong in the work and it makes OB easy anywhere because she doesnt want to interact with anyone but me (as long as im not patting her just throwing the ball or tug)because she is a prey monkey and i like it makes training easy


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## Christen Adkins (Nov 27, 2006)

I've seen it a couple of times. I see it as a dog whose drive overpowers otherwise weak nerves. I've seen a few go through hell or high water while in drive, but are sketchy when not revved up.


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## Sara Waters (Oct 23, 2010)

I have had a cattle dog like that. The driviest dog ever and a very good obedience dog, probably the best I ever had but in normal life strange people would sent her nutso. I had to work very hard with her and she did improve to a lot. She died young after taking a poison bait so I dont know har far I would of gone with her on the stranger front. 

I must say if I never have another dog like her I wont be sorry, but her drive and trainability and obedience work were superb, best I ever had. She had amazing focus when working and loved training with me, although the tendency was still there under the surface when in a ring, I could read her like a book in the end, all her subtle body language. Not something that I enjoyed really as despite her good work I could see the real dog underneath and in the end I decided not to subject her to trials. 

She was a relaxed loving dog with the people she knew well.


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## Joby Becker (Dec 13, 2009)

I had a dog or two that just did not like other people, they were not spooky or scared, they would bite for sure though. 

Socially aggressive, dominant, territorial, guardy...

the worst one, people with the same bloodline dogs had all sorts of problems, the dogs were called unstable and unpredictable..

I did not feel that either label fit that dog though. It was perfectly clear to me how the dog would react in almost every situation. He just was not a friendly dog, and did not make friends...he was never spooky, pissy or running away though, even as small pup...


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## Guest (Dec 1, 2008)

georgia estes said:


> Just wondering if anyone elses dog is like this. I have a dog who is not social, he does not want to be touched and he acts weird and scared around people. I'm talking wide-eyed and the I want to get far far away from you look. When I first got him I wanted to get rid of him because he would piss himself and run away from people. (never in bite work, just in social situations) If you saw him around people and didn't see him work you'd think he was a total shitter.
> 
> I have tried and tried to make him more social but he's just not. He has a hair trigger and will bite anyone, any time the word is given. However he is not a fear bite, has never nipped or anything and he is very VERY strong in the work. He is not phased by any distraction, decoy etc no matter how much pressure etc he just bites harder. Mind you this dog is not 2 yet. Anyone have a dog that acts downright spooky and like a nerve bag around strange people but is still a very strong dog and confident in the work? It seems like such a paradox.


 
what are the parents like? Grandparents?


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## Thomas Barriano (Mar 27, 2006)

If the dog likes bite work and doesn't like people?
Have EVERYBODY you know play tug with the dog. If you have to, you start and then hand the tug (with dog attached) to the next person and then back to you and then to a 2nd person and a third. Use the high drive to condition the "fear".


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## Joby Becker (Dec 13, 2009)

Thomas Barriano said:


> If the dog likes bite work and doesn't like people?
> Have EVERYBODY you know play tug with the dog. If you have to, you start and then hand the tug (with dog attached) to the next person and then back to you and then to a 2nd person and a third. Use the high drive to condition the "fear".


thomas, what if the dog is serious in his bitework, and does not want to play tug with others? what you are suggesting could very well be pretty dangerous with some dogs.


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## Thomas Barriano (Mar 27, 2006)

Joby Becker said:


> thomas, what if the dog is serious in his bitework, and does not want to play tug with others? what you are suggesting could very well be pretty dangerous with some dogs.


He's not, look at the video
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-X3UOFT-mlI
The dog just likes to bite and has decent control. I don't see any danger with the suggestion I offered. Georgia can try it or not.
Mach's nicht to me


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## Joby Becker (Dec 13, 2009)

Thomas Barriano said:


> If the dog likes bite work and doesn't like people?
> Have EVERYBODY you know play tug with the dog. If you have to, you start and then hand the tug (with dog attached) to the next person and then back to you and then to a 2nd person and a third. Use the high drive to condition the "fear".


Thomas...this might work fine for some dogs, might not be advisable for others, that was my only point..for the person that just reads this thread in the future...that may read this and try to get their friends to play tug with a dog that will bite them...


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## georgia estes (Nov 3, 2009)

Thomas Barriano said:


> He's not, look at the video
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-X3UOFT-mlI
> The dog just likes to bite and has decent control. I don't see any danger with the suggestion I offered. Georgia can try it or not.
> Mach's nicht to me



Uhhh Thomas I am going to have to disagree here. Yes I have good control (sometimes) but he is a serious dog and I would not advise anyone to play tug with him but me. He loses the 'hey this is fun' and turns it into 'hey F you' really fast. Me having good control over a dog doesn't mean he won't bite a stranger playing with him.


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## georgia estes (Nov 3, 2009)

Just look at the seriousness here when I ask him if he wants to bite Khoi...if that's not a serious dog I don't know what is

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bUFXNZM5-5c


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## Thomas Barriano (Mar 27, 2006)

That's a serous ass killer dog if I ever saw one ;-)


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## will fernandez (May 17, 2006)

I think he saying "I do but I prefer to let my balls sway in the breeze at the moment"


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## georgia estes (Nov 3, 2009)

Sometimes they need to be aired out, you know?


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## will fernandez (May 17, 2006)

Yes as a matter of fact I do....


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## Ariel Peldunas (Oct 18, 2008)

I've seen a number of dogs like this. They have enough prey drive to overcome their suspicion and do well in protection sports but when they are not in drive, they fall apart. The thing about distractions in PSA and protection sports is that they never really force the dog to confront the man and work in defense/fight drive (depending on what drive you believe the dog is working in) which is probably why dogs like this can do well. Although can/bottle curtains, leaf blowers, clatter sticks, etc. can be unsettling to a dog, if they are introduced properly, most dogs can learn to work through them without much issue. If the dog is comfortable biting a suited decoy and is comfortable with any given distraction, there's no reason a dog with high prey drive wouldn't do well in these sport situations. However, when the dog is confronted in a different context with a human that he doesn't perceive as prey, this is when issues arise ...which is what it sounds like you're experiencing.

You weren't really asking for any advice, so I won't suggest any. It sounds like you know the dog you have and are able to manage him on and off the field. But to answer your question, I have seen this before and I don't think it's all that strange. It sounds like your dog's drive carries him through and his prey drive negates any fear/conflict he may normally feel around people.


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## rick smith (Dec 31, 2010)

re: " I have tried and tried to make him more social but he's just not."
.... by doing what, specifically ?
(btw, no need to answer if you aren't open to aadditional ideas since it kinda sounds like you aren't)


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