# Doing helper work



## Hunter Allred (Jan 28, 2010)

Several times a week after work, and on the weekend... is very exhausting... As I type I'm waiting on my body to loosen up and eyes to finish opening so I can go do the daily grind... Any other helpers in this situation? Does it wear on you? My body is definitely taking a beating. Tips?


----------



## jamie lind (Feb 19, 2009)

Hunter Allred said:


> Tips?


Take your dress off.


----------



## Hunter Allred (Jan 28, 2010)

jamie lind said:


> Take your dress off.


shoulda posted this in the Conflict Free forum eh? lol


----------



## rick smith (Dec 31, 2010)

i've only been catching real dogs for a few years, but i found it just the opposite from what you are saying.

barring a physical injury, i had less aches and pains as i improved basic techniques, since i started out with the mind set i was just cannon fodder

- started going with the flow, got better footwork and stopped trying to manhandle a dog that was often stronger than i was
- also helped to learn how to absorb a takedown when knocked off my feet
- more breaks when it was hot and humid helped a lot too //lol//

no comment on bruises tho 
.... but some people bruise more easily than others


----------



## jamie lind (Feb 19, 2009)

Hunter Allred said:


> shoulda posted this in the Conflict Free forum eh? lol


----------



## Charles Corbitt (Oct 24, 2012)

I've only been doing helper work for a little over a year, but I've gotta agree with Rick. The work gets easier the more dogs you work. If your body is taking a beating maybe you need to hit the health club a bit? 

Sorry couldn't help the last part.


----------



## Joby Becker (Dec 13, 2009)

over time it will take its toll, just like anything else, depending on what you are doing, how athletic you are, and some other factors...shoulders knees and backs seem to be common trouble spots in later ages for some people. ...


----------



## Hunter Allred (Jan 28, 2010)

rick smith said:


> i've only been catching real dogs for a few years, but i found it just the opposite from what you are saying.
> 
> barring a physical injury, i had less aches and pains as i improved basic techniques, since i started out with the mind set i was just cannon fodder
> 
> ...


It gets easier yes, but lets say, doing an escape bite, or working grip... I'm about 140lbs. When 90 lbs is hanging on to me whether im escaping or driving, no amount of technique can make it easy... And while I feel I've gotten very smooth catching dogs in courage tests, when 90lbs sticks to you at 30mph there is still a lot of strain on the body... Do it 20 times in a night and its that much more.

I'm not getting hurt directly, but for example, I've got a knee that's been agitating me... I think mostly from the initial acceleration in an escape. 

I'm actually in great health.


----------



## Joby Becker (Dec 13, 2009)

Hunter Allred said:


> It gets easier yes, but lets say, doing an escape bite, or working grip... I'm about 140lbs. When 90 lbs is hanging on to me whether im escaping or driving, no amount of technique can make it easy... And while I feel I've gotten very smooth catching dogs in courage tests, when 90lbs sticks to you at 30mph there is still a lot of strain on the body... Do it 20 times in a night and its that much more.
> 
> I'm not getting hurt directly, but for example, I've got a knee that's been agitating me... I think mostly from the initial acceleration in an escape.
> 
> I'm actually in great health.


it will take its toll  it gets easier but over time but impacts, strains and loads take their toll...anyone who says different will change their answers when they are a little older 

ankles too, LOL...

even just with sleeve work, injuries will happen eventually as well. suit work more often I think personally...

even without major injuries trauma happens...thighs/biceps get torn up, elbows/knees get crunched and munched on...etc. etc.a nice bite on the wrist or hand tucked in the suit feels great too 

rinse and repeat for 10-15-20 years, and like I said..it takes its toll


----------



## Keith Jenkins (Jun 6, 2007)

You answered your own question. Just like any other phyiscal activity without proper rest between sessions you do not give yourself time to repair and heal. You say you work dogs several times a week plus weekends and IMO here lies the problem. Scale back and give your body a chance to catch it's breath.


----------



## Hunter Allred (Jan 28, 2010)

Keith Jenkins said:


> You answered your own question. Just like any other phyiscal activity without proper rest between sessions you do not give yourself time to repair and heal. You say you work dogs several times a week plus weekends and IMO here lies the problem. Scale back and give your body a chance to catch it's breath.


well, right now its really twice a week total... I do some stuff with my own, or help an individual out here or there... what kills me is when the weather is perfect and everyone shows up except the other helpers lol

Its minor crap too.. like working grip using leather... my hands *kill* after that

I was hoping there were some "eat a banana and a can of tuna before and after" or "mainline a multivitamin that night" type of "it helps" stuff... I don't think anyone can stop the inevitable "my body isn't 18 years old anymore"


----------



## Keith Jenkins (Jun 6, 2007)

Hunter Allred said:


> . I don't think anyone can stop the inevitable "my body isn't 18 years old anymore"


Ain't that the gospel! 8-[


----------



## Mario Fernandez (Jun 21, 2008)

The constant contact and collisions will take you toll no matter what shape you are in. You also have to think smarter when you train. 

Stretching before training sessions. Use of compression braces for your knee,calf, shoulder, back support KT tape, Chiropractor visits. Soaking in Epson Salt is your best friend. Arnica gel, should buy stock in the company....Use to laugh at one helper who would spray Ice hot before working dogs.. now I am in the situation, I am doing the same things he use to. Sucks getting older. The best thing is rest.


----------



## Guy Williams (Jun 26, 2012)

Mario Fernandez said:


> The constant contact and collisions will take you toll no matter what shape you are in. You also have to think smarter when you train.
> 
> Stretching before training sessions. Use of compression braces for your knee,calf, shoulder, back support KT tape, Chiropractor visits. Soaking in Epson Salt is your best friend. Arnica gel, should buy stock in the company....Use to laugh at one helper who would spray Ice hot before working dogs.. now I am in the situation, I am doing the same things he use to. Sucks getting older. The best thing is rest.


+1. warm up, cool down, stretch, hot bath, massage and an early night. Wow, I am getting old. I make my old man sound like a wild thing!!


----------



## Hunter Allred (Jan 28, 2010)

Yeah I always stretch very good before working dogs... and I have braces for the knees, ankles, and wrists when I need them. 

Does soaking in epson salt really make a difference?


----------



## Tim Lynam (Jun 12, 2009)

Stretching isn't enough. A complete set of warmup exercises before you work is a must. Jumping jacks all the way to 5 wind sprints. I worked a large club and I think the record was 80 dogs on a Sunday. I worked dogs (Ring, PP, PSD) at least 4 days a week starting when I was 35. Until I started completely warming up I was a wreck and usually gassed out after 10 dogs. Never had many aches or pains (besides the bruising :-o) after that. My 2 cents.


----------



## Gillian Schuler (Apr 12, 2008)

Take a tip from Elmar Mannes.

He was around 50 yrs old when I met him for the first time. He was director of a bank.

Someone asked him how he could take on so many dogs at an event. He answered:

I let the dogs work.

I guess brains go before muscles.

I couldn't do it so don't think I'm being big-headded.


----------



## Hunter Allred (Jan 28, 2010)

Tim Lynam said:


> Stretching isn't enough. A complete set of warmup exercises before you work is a must. Jumping jacks all the way to 5 wind sprints. I worked a large club and I think the record was 80 dogs on a Sunday. I worked dogs (Ring, PP, PSD) at least 4 days a week starting when I was 35. Until I started completely warming up I was a wreck and usually gassed out after 10 dogs. Never had many aches or pains (besides the bruising :-o) after that. My 2 cents.


I shall try that... i stretch right now, and get moving around, but not what I would call "warm up exercises"


----------



## Hunter Allred (Jan 28, 2010)

Gillian Schuler said:


> Take a tip from Elmar Mannes.
> 
> He was around 50 yrs old when I met him for the first time. He was director of a bank.
> 
> ...


I assume by that he meant, he doesn't fight the dog constantly... I don't do that myself... a) can't, I don't weigh enough that it could last, and b) largely owing to many years of studying jiu jitsu, I understand the merit of not meeting force with direct force.


----------



## Sue DiCero (Sep 2, 2006)

It is not only the stretching and warm up. You need to do additional exercises that complement and help the decoy work in between. Look at some of the things that some of the top decoys do. Look at Marcus Hampton. Ask him what he does – look at some of the videos that he has posted.


----------



## Gillian Schuler (Apr 12, 2008)

Hunter Allred said:


> I assume by that he meant, he doesn't fight the dog constantly... I don't do that myself... a) can't, I don't weigh enough that it could last, and b) largely owing to many years of studying jiu jitsu, I understand the merit of not meeting force with direct force.


He didn't mean that. Many helpers tend to dance around to animate it.

Elmar told us to stand next to the dog / pup and remain still. He worked the dogs from this position. He is an extremely competent helper and breeder - he has the brains and uses them to work the dogs.

There are enough muscled helpers around who use physical power instead of mental power.


----------



## Hunter Allred (Jan 28, 2010)

Sue DiCero said:


> It is not only the stretching and warm up. You need to do additional exercises that complement and help the decoy work in between. Look at some of the things that some of the top decoys do. Look at Marcus Hampton. Ask him what he does – look at some of the videos that he has posted.


exercises like what? I learned how to catch dogs by running at telephone poles with a presented sleeve and redirecting the impact lol... like that kinda exercise?


----------



## Hunter Allred (Jan 28, 2010)

Gillian Schuler said:


> He didn't mean that. Many helpers tend to dance around to animate it.
> 
> Elmar told us to stand next to the dog / pup and remain still. He worked the dogs from this position. He is an extremely competent helper and breeder - he has the brains and uses them to work the dogs.
> 
> There are enough muscled helpers around who use physical power instead of mental power.


Like I said... 140lbs... I'm not, nor could I ever be a "muscled helper" lol. I think most helpers start by dancing around... over time I've learned much more how to work without all that physical and a lot more mental. I'm teaching a few people helperwork now, and its so hard to explain, in person, with examples even, how to use the mind lol.


----------



## rajajee (Aug 26, 2021)

Hunter Allred said:


> Yeah I always stretch very good before working dogs... and I have braces for the knees, ankles, and wrists when I need them.
> 
> Does soaking in epson salt really make a difference?


I don't think.


----------

