# Decoy / Helper Training...I Will Pay You / Wilmington NC



## Kevin Rowland (Jun 29, 2013)

I'm looking to receive decoy/helper training for protection dog work. I am willing to pay a reasonable price. I do require references. I live in Wilmington NC. Thank you!

Kevin


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## Michael Joubert (Jul 17, 2012)

What exactly are you looking for? How about we trade, I work your dog/dogs and you work mine. 

I live in Wilmington

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## Hunter Allred (Jan 28, 2010)

Michael Joubert said:


> What exactly are you looking for? How about we trade, I work your dog/dogs and you work mine.
> 
> I live in Wilmington
> 
> Sent from Petguide.com Free App


I'm game. Only 2 hours away


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## Jerry Lyda (Apr 4, 2006)

That is a very good trade off.


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## Kevin Rowland (Jun 29, 2013)

Michael Joubert said:


> What exactly are you looking for? How about we trade, I work your dog/dogs and you work mine.
> 
> I live in Wilmington
> 
> Sent from Petguide.com Free App


That would be fine with me. I'm just looking for some local training and help for my dog.


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## Kevin Rowland (Jun 29, 2013)

It would be great for us all to pull together and help each other.


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## Michael Joubert (Jul 17, 2012)

Hunter I'm game.

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## Michael Joubert (Jul 17, 2012)

Kevin I'm down, I even have a couple sleeves. 

I got a friend in Jacksonville that will be up for it too. 

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## Kevin Rowland (Jun 29, 2013)

This sounds great..here is my cell number and I will check back here daily...
(nine - one - zero)-6-1 -2- 029 seven. Call or text me..


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## Hunter Allred (Jan 28, 2010)

I have several different sleeves, 2 suits, hidden sleeves, a few portable blinds, etc


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## Connie Sutherland (Mar 27, 2006)

Hi, Kevin, and welcome ...

Please don't forget your required intro here:

http://www.workingdogforum.com/vBulletin/f20/


Thanks!


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## Michael Joubert (Jul 17, 2012)

Hunter that's great I prefer suit work for the dogs. 

I have 2 puppy sleeves, a intermediate (Ray Allen), and a hidden. 



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## Kevin Rowland (Jun 29, 2013)

Connie Sutherland said:


> Hi, Kevin, and welcome ...
> 
> Please don't forget your required intro here:
> 
> ...


Got it done


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## Hunter Allred (Jan 28, 2010)

What's everyone's experience level here, and what are you looking to accomplish?


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## Michael Joubert (Jul 17, 2012)

An advanced beginner. Have done some entry level trialing. Looking to have my male bulldog ready to trial for a PDC and possibly PSA I (spring or fall 2014). 

My wife has a dutchie pup that she's interested in doing Mondio with.

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## Hunter Allred (Jan 28, 2010)

What about decoy work? Lol


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## Michael Joubert (Jul 17, 2012)

Again just a beginner. Have mostly done PP scenario work in a suit and hidden equipment. Have used sleeves with a bite bar but would need a refresher on presentations. Not ready to catch a dog on a send need to improve my footwork to keep it safe. 

I'm open minded and want to learn more. I take direction well cause I leave the ego off the field. 

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## Hunter Allred (Jan 28, 2010)

Michael Joubert said:


> Again just a beginner. Have mostly done PP scenario work in a suit and hidden equipment. Have used sleeves with a bite bar but would need a refresher on presentations. Not ready to catch a dog on a send need to improve my footwork to keep it safe.
> 
> I'm open minded and want to learn more. I take direction well cause I leave the ego off the field.
> 
> Sent from Petguide.com Free App


While it would be nice to do long bites more often (presently I'm the only one who catches my dogs) what I need most is more animated, expressive, dramatic helper work... Muzzlework in particular as my past attempts with one dog didn't have enough "convincing" that the muzzle strike was an effective attack by the helper. I desperately need someone not shy to scream bloody murder and in a convincing way when my dog strikes, or counters strongly, or does whatever we were working on at the time. Way to often helpers are indifferent both with the threat and the defeat.

I have pretty much all the equipment... Multiply muzzles, harnesses, lines, sleeves both left and right, bite bar and barrel, synthetic and jute, from puppy to trial sleeves, a Belgian arm, pillows, wedges, leathers, a blank gun, platforms, my personal suit (5'8", 135lbs), and a suit for regular folks (6+ ft and ~200 lbs) etc... All in my dog trailer so I'm highly mobile. How about training facilities? I've got access to several places here... It would be ideal to rotate I think. Keep the venues changing

I'm also looking to prep for the PDC & hopefully PSA1 with one or both dogs.

I've got no ego. Il show you what's worked for me, what hasn't, will absorb any tricks and techniques you may know that i don't, or do whatever you want.


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## Kevin Rowland (Jun 29, 2013)

I'm new to decoy work. I'm looking to get trained in a couple of months when work slows down enough to go take the classes. I would love the opportunity to work with you guys prior if you feel comfortable with that...if not I will contact you after the training. Totally your call and I understand either way.


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## Hunter Allred (Jan 28, 2010)

I'm perfectly comfortable. I know what can realistically be done and what cannot with a brand new decoy. Even after training it takes lots of good experience to progress


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## Kevin Rowland (Jun 29, 2013)

Hunter Allred said:


> I'm perfectly comfortable. I know what can realistically be done and what cannot with a brand new decoy. Even after training it takes lots of good experience to progress


That sounds great..I really appreciate the opportunity. I'm free on the weekends anytime after August 4th if you would like to get together. I don't mind coming to you or meeting somewhere else etc...


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## Michael Joubert (Jul 17, 2012)

Everything sounds good to me, let's put something together. At present I don't have a place to work dogs. I think if I work at it I might come up with a place or 2

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## Michael Joubert (Jul 17, 2012)

I can act like a fool if that's what's called for. 

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## Hunter Allred (Jan 28, 2010)

Michael Joubert said:


> I can act like a fool if that's what's called for.
> 
> Sent from Petguide.com Free App


Its the convincing performance that is needed lol. I've had new or non-helpers "try" to posture at my dog and my dog keeps looking around at all the people trying to figure out who the threat is I'm telling her to watch out for lol. A convincing threat can and often is silent and not moving. Hard to explain. I'm sure you've seen good acting and bad acting outside of the dog world.. same thing


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## Tony Hahn (May 28, 2011)

Hunter Allred said:


> ......snip........what I need most is more animated, expressive, dramatic helper work... Muzzlework in particular as my past attempts with one dog didn't have enough "convincing" that the muzzle strike was an effective attack by the helper. I desperately need someone not shy to scream bloody murder and in a convincing way when my dog strikes, or counters strongly, or does whatever we were working on at the time. Way to often helpers are indifferent both with the threat and the defeat............snip.............


Why is this so darn difficult to find???? I even spoke with a guy I know that is an "actor" of sorts. (He participates in plays/productions or whatever you call them; was in those kinds of classes in high school & college, etc, etc.) The guy is plenty athletic and obviously capable of acting, but has no interest in working with a dog. 

I got one guy to help with muzzle work. He's plenty athletic but couldn't (or wouldn't) coordinate his reactions to the dog. Pretty much refused to "act" the part at all. 

At this point I do most of the bite-work myself, which of course means it's just a game with no seriousness for the dog. Still beneficial, but I'd sure like to have someone to both pressure the dog then pretend the dog kicked his ass. 

Good luck to you guys!


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## Hunter Allred (Jan 28, 2010)

Tony Hahn said:


> Why is this so darn difficult to find???? I even spoke with a guy I know that is an "actor" of sorts. (He participates in plays/productions or whatever you call them; was in those kinds of classes in high school & college, etc, etc.) The guy is plenty athletic and obviously capable of acting, but has no interest in working with a dog.
> 
> I got one guy to help with muzzle work. He's plenty athletic but couldn't (or wouldn't) coordinate his reactions to the dog. Pretty much refused to "act" the part at all.
> 
> ...


I think a big part of it is people get so focused on the dog and what they are doing (and avoiding being bitten) that the feedback falls to the wayside.


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## Jeremy Wall (Jul 21, 2011)

Guys Im interested as well. Have 13 years in Police dogs and training experience. Left Law Enforcement for Contract work - Explosive Detection overseas - and Ive been missing the bite work thing. Would be willing to help as well. Live in Southport, just South of Wilmington. Tied up this weekend but wide open after that. Would love to get a club up and going in this area. No PSA experience but have done a little decoy work over the years. Have lots of areas around here to train. Hit me with a PM and maybe we can set something up for next week.


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## Kevin Rowland (Jun 29, 2013)

Jeremy Wall said:


> Guys Im interested as well. Have 13 years in Police dogs and training experience. Left Law Enforcement for Contract work - Explosive Detection overseas - and Ive been missing the bite work thing. Would be willing to help as well. Live in Southport, just South of Wilmington. Tied up this weekend but wide open after that. Would love to get a club up and going in this area. No PSA experience but have done a little decoy work over the years. Have lots of areas around here to train. Hit me with a PM and maybe we can set something up for next week.


Sounds like we may have a good group going. Look forward to meeting you. 
I guess our next step is to pick a day and a place for everyone to meet.


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## Tim Lynam (Jun 12, 2009)

You have enough interested so maybe you should call in a pro to teach Y'all. Putting on a seminar is always a good idea. The more people to share the costs the cheaper it is.

How about Paul Cipparone? PM him on this board if you're interested. Heck, I'd come down just to see him. I certified National Select in French Ring among other Decoy Certs.

Paul's Credentials:
Actively involved in the training of dogs for the past twenty -five years. I own and operate the Wellington county school for dogs and security dog services ltd. I have bred Doberman Pinschers for nine years and Belgian malinois for eleven years,under the prepit of El Rancho Reg'd
I was among the founding director members of the American Ring Federation (ARF) in 1986 and have served on the board of directors thru the change to the The North American Ring Association (NARA) for ten years.
Training programs involved with :General Obedience, Competition Obedience ,Novice ,Open,&Utility at the CKC level;Tracking at CKC level, Schutzhund I II III , Personal Protection, and Industrial Protection trained dogs.Training director for a major security company in the city of Toronto.
1997/98, trained & handled four Rottwielers to six certificates , including , ZTP,AZTP,three BH and a SchH I high in trial DVG,also handled three Rottwielers to multiple V ratings in the conformation ring, all in a period of NINE months.
1996 - Obtained Ring III on a Malinois trained from a puppy. 1996 - Obtained Ring II on a Malinois -sold to security co. Directly responsible for obtaining several ring titles for other handlers . 1995- Selected North American Ring Sport Association Ringsport Decoy of the year. First North American to receive this honour. Only decoy to be selected to work three North American Ring Championships to date .1990,1991,1995. 1992- Recertified to National Select Ringsport Decoy,responsible to a great degree for the training and selection of three National Select Decoys and have trained or have greatly influenced successfully the training of numerous Regionally Selected and club level decoys across North America. 1988- First Canadian to title to title officially in French Ring Sport for the second consecutive year ,with Malinois. 1987- First Canadian to title officially in French Ring Sport ,Malinois of my own breeding ,and a second Malinois. 1986 High score SchH II Malinois @OG. Ohio Hundesport Club. 1986-Training decoy and training director for high score SchH III GSD OG Ohio Hundesport Club. 1986- Worked as selection decoy for the USA ,SV. Team representative for 1986 Miestershaft. Tested three (gsd) and qualified one.Judge Bernhard Blawath,handler Gerhardt Siegert,Lewiston NY. 1984- Training director Ontario Schutzhund Association DVG. Responsible for numerous SchH titles (25) 1982High score SchH III DVG. 1982 High score SchH I two times. Past president and club decoy,South Western Ontario SchH Assoc. DVG. 1982N.A.S.A. National Championship team qualifier SchH I team championship , high score tracking 99/100. Past president,training director,club decoy,Southern Ontario Schutzhund Assoc.,responsible for nine titles. 1982 Certified DVG Schutzhund trial decoy. 1972 Incorporated Wellington County School for Dogs and Security Dog Services Ltd.


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## Hunter Allred (Jan 28, 2010)

Tim Lynam said:


> You have enough interested so maybe you should call in a pro to teach Y'all. Putting on a seminar is always a good idea. The more people to share the costs the cheaper it is.
> 
> How about Paul Cipparone? PM him on this board if you're interested. Heck, I'd come down just to see him. I certified National Select in French Ring among other Decoy Certs.
> 
> ...


I've got an exceptional helper we could setup a seminar with. He is the person I try to model my helperwork after. I don't like to use names without permission in public forums but he is well known as an exceptional helper

As far as who makes good helpers.... I think you have to have been in a few real fights to know how to do the dance and make it real... you have to know how to intimidate and what it feels like to be scared as well... And how to intimidate because you are scared and unsure if you can win


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## Jake Brandyberry (Jan 24, 2010)

Tim when did you select in FR and what is a National Select FR Decoy?


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## Tim Lynam (Jun 12, 2009)

Jake Brandyberry said:


> Tim when did you select in FR and what is a National Select FR Decoy?


I certified in 1988/89. I was the second to get the "international" level in North America. National Select is the "equivalent" of Level III today. I was certified by French Judge Dattas, then head of the FCI and also Frances' equivalent of our Dept. of Agriculture. He was a tough Judge indeed... I triple esquived a Ring III dog I had never seen before during my selectief and he named a new move he had never seen before that I used, after me (The Lynam Stick Mouth.) Dattas was impressed enough that he did invite me to Decoy in France though. Of course, back then 25 cents and my certification would have gotten me a cup of coffee... Ring was in it's infancy.

By the way, North American decoys have a lot to bring to the table. After seeing my new move, Dattas commented that he had to come to America to see innovation. That tradition continues to this day!


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## Tim Lynam (Jun 12, 2009)

Hunter Allred said:


> I've got an exceptional helper we could setup a seminar with. He is the person I try to model my helperwork after. I don't like to use names without permission in public forums but he is well known as an exceptional helper.


A Helper that also knows suit work is nice to have.

Anyway, I wish your new group the best of luck with your training!!! Great things happen when like minded individuals get together!


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## Kevin Rowland (Jun 29, 2013)

I'd be willing to chip in a good portion for a seminar but I am open to just about any training I can receive and hoping I can help others in the process.


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## Hunter Allred (Jan 28, 2010)

Tim Lynam said:


> A Helper that also knows suit work is nice to have.
> 
> Anyway, I wish your new group the best of luck with your training!!! Great things happen when like minded individuals get together!


perhaps we could get both down and make a full seminar out of it. How far away are you from the carolinas?


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## Michael Joubert (Jul 17, 2012)

Hunter you get my text?

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## Hunter Allred (Jan 28, 2010)

Michael Joubert said:


> Hunter you get my text?
> 
> Sent from Petguide.com Free App


Yeah, you get my msg on here? lol


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## Michael Joubert (Jul 17, 2012)

Replied

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## Tiago Fontes (Apr 17, 2011)

Tim Lynam said:


> You have enough interested so maybe you should call in a pro to teach Y'all. Putting on a seminar is always a good idea. The more people to share the costs the cheaper it is.
> 
> How about Paul Cipparone? PM him on this board if you're interested. Heck, I'd come down just to see him. I certified National Select in French Ring among other Decoy Certs.
> 
> ...


 
This is a great suggestion and a person I HIGHLY recommend. We've had Paul over last year for a seminar and it was a great learning experience. It covered young dog development, drive building, obedience and safe decoy work. 

My group is looking into setting another seminar with Paul by the end of the year. 

Mind you, I'm from Europe... 


Regards


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## Tim Lynam (Jun 12, 2009)

Ya Tiago, he's one of the best. I don't know what he charges because what he taught me was priceless and I'm still trying to pay him back, somehow. :-o They just don't make them like that anymore! A true "Dogman."


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## Kevin Rowland (Jun 29, 2013)

Just keeping this alive...I think a seminar is a great idea.


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## Tim Lynam (Jun 12, 2009)

There's quite a bit of experience with just Jeremy and Hunter. Everyone should be jumping to get this group solidified. Sounds like some great training in the works. Looks like your post bore fruit Kevin!

Good luck and safe training.


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## Michael Joubert (Jul 17, 2012)

I'm working on getting a few venues to use for training. I have a field just looking for an indoor. 

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