# Ears



## Zakia Days (Mar 13, 2009)

My female had a hematoma develop on her ear a few months ago. Vet lanced it and put little plastic stands in there to hold it up. She has since has the stitches and materials removed, but the ear is flopping. It's still lumpy inside (scar tissue/healing). Is there any way I can assist it to standing position? Should I massage it or just leave it be? Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.


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## patricia powers (Nov 14, 2010)

sorry, but i don't have good news for you. had a dog several yrs ago develop a hematoma & had surgery with the same results as you had. more recently had a dog with surgery on the same ear twice. same result. then later she had it on the other ear & i did not take her to the vet. i also have a male who has had 
the same problems & have not taken him to the vet. they eat the same food as all the others, live in the same house & have had much better ear care than the others so the only thing i can attribute it to is a difference in individual immune systems. it seems that once a dog has had chronic ear infections you will battle it for the life of the dog. it does not go away. antibiotics & prednesone further irrode the immune system. even feeding raw does not get rid of it. i agree with those who say these dogs should not be bred and i have not. one common ancestor of these 3 dogs is sagus busecker schloss----for what its worth.
pjp


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## Elaine Matthys (May 18, 2008)

My experience has been that if the ear is floppy post hematoma, it's most likely going to stay floppy no matter what you do. Best bet is to deal with the hematoma as soon as possible with the least invasive method possible, such as using a syringe to drain it. Also watch for allergies and/or ear infections to prevent the hematoma in the first place.


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## Zakia Days (Mar 13, 2009)

So cause of hematomas are ear infections? If she had one I never noticed. There was no sensitivity, no head shaking or scratching. She had a noticeable ear infection at least two years ago that the vet treated. No complications after. I thought they were caused by some form of trauma.


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## Zakia Days (Mar 13, 2009)

Thanks Elaine. I will be sure to be observant and take care of it right away should it ever appear again.


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## Laura Bollschweiler (Apr 25, 2008)

I haven't seen much success with getting the ears upright after a hematoma, etc. there is something like a screen the vet can install (?) in the ear to make it stand. I have heard there is a vet around here that is the go-to guy for this. But I don't know anyone who has actually done it.



patricia powers said:


> . it seems that once a dog has had chronic ear infections you will battle it for the life of the dog. it does not go away. antibiotics & prednesone further irrode the immune system. even feeding raw does not get rid of it. i agree with those who say these dogs should not be bred and i have not. one common ancestor of these 3 dogs is sagus busecker schloss----for what its worth.
> pjp


I have a dog with chronic ear infections. Big fat pain. I got him at just over a year, with an ear infection. Of course I blamed it on the kibble the owner had been feeding. But two years of raw, and he still gets them. I was bitching about it and the owner of his mother (who is new to GSD) said, oh yeah, she gets them all the time! 

Kinda wish I had known that...

Laura


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## patricia powers (Nov 14, 2010)

@ zakia, hematomas can also be caused by a dog itching/scratching from ear mites, but whether its from mites, food allergies, yeast overgrowth or whatever, its seems that once they have the hematoma you can pretty much figure on that ear being folded or completely down. i am convinced that a compromised immune system is largely responsible. their bodies just can't fight off those irritants. two big factors that i think contribute to immune problems are genetics & nerve issues. dogs who cannot deal with stress often develop physical symptoms. i suspect that bloat may also fall under the stress factor. pjp


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## Joby Becker (Dec 13, 2009)

had same thing happen. to my knowledge a hematoma is caused by shaking or scratching, can happen without you noticing it...it is from physical trauma to ear.

vet said 50/50 on ear standing at all, but also that it will never be what it was, and will always be noticeably visibly jacked up.

my dog did not co-operate for even a day, I gave up on idea of attempting it.

I have experience in other breeds for making great ear stands, if the dog is open to the process.

I used mole foam cut to size and shape of ear, and also used stiff wire as a frame to go around it. thinner wire coat hanger is stiff enough without being too heavy, or too stiff, so it can be adjusted..tape wire frame to mole foam securely, then use Skin Bond paste (glue that adheres to skin, from vets office) to glue the entire thing into the ear. the entire surface gets glued to the inner surface of the ear, in your case a hole would probably have to be cut away for the hole in the ear if it is still draining. The wire then can be bent and manipulated in a variety of way to get ear to stand correctly again...if I was gonna try it this is how I would do it, this requires nothing around the head, or outside of the ear for dog to mess up. the entire ear is held up by mole foam, held in position by wire.


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## Nicole Stark (Jul 22, 2009)

Laura I don't know what you have tried to deal with your dogs ear infections but I was wondering if you ever tried to sprinkle a small amount of probiotic powder in the ear? I had a dog with chronic ear infections that I cleared up and then kept under control this way.

I know that doesn't address your original questionbut I thought I'd offer up the suggestion.


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## Terrasita Cuffie (Jun 8, 2008)

My GSD Ingrid started having chronic ear infections around Age 6. With them came the hematomas. After the lancing, I put something in the inside of the ear and tape it. It all healed but with a sort of crinkle with the ear standing. I noticed her coat also wasn't as thick as it had been--nothing major, just slightly less thick. Vet said it and she was fine when I asked to test her thyroid. After another infection/hematoma bout, I insisted on the test. She was low and after treating the thyroid, no more ear infections or hematomas. The hematomas were always a result at her pawing at her ears.

T


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## Laura Bollschweiler (Apr 25, 2008)

Nicole Stark said:


> Laura I don't know what you have tried to deal with your dogs ear infections but I was wondering if you ever tried to sprinkle a small amount of probiotic powder in the ear? I had a dog with chronic ear infections that I cleared up and then kept under control this way.
> 
> I know that doesn't address your original questionbut I thought I'd offer up the suggestion.


I am game to try. He's had everything else put in his ears. 

What is probiotic powder? I have probiotic capsules. Can I just open one up and pour it in? That will take some skill.

Vet is coming over tomorrow because his ears stink right now. 
I don't know if it is a yeast infection or bacterial or if it matters.

Laura


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## Nicole Stark (Jul 22, 2009)

Hi Laura, it's the same but in loose form. Even on raw he had chronic yeast infections so I'd take about a capsule amount in my fingers, roll his head to the side, and then quickly sprinkle it in his ear. Then I'd massage his ear to get it deeper into his ear canal. Initially I applied a small amount daily until I started seeing improvement then I dialed it back to every few days to about once a week.

I've never tried it but I have heard that the product women use for yeast infections also works on dogs with yeast infections in the ear. Connie or someone else might have something useful to either method.


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## Terrasita Cuffie (Jun 8, 2008)

I was also told apple cider vinegar for yeast infections.

T


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## patricia powers (Nov 14, 2010)

i have used organic apple cider vinegar, both in the ears & in food. i have fed yogurt & put women's yeast products in the ears. it all may help reduce symptoms, but as i said before---doesn't actually get rid of it. i was interested in what someone said about the thyroid. i can see where there may be some sound basis in that. in low thyroid, even humans are suseptible to infections. thyroid controls many bodily processes & certainly could affect the immune system. something to think about. pjp


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## Connie Sutherland (Mar 27, 2006)

_
"I have a dog with chronic ear infections. Big fat pain. I got him at just over a year, with an ear infection. Of course I blamed it on the kibble the owner had been feeding. But two years of raw, and he still gets them. I was bitching about it and the owner of his mother (who is new to GSD) said, oh yeah, she gets them all the time! "_
_
"He's had everything else put in his ears. ... Vet is coming over tomorrow because his ears stink right now. ... I don't know if it is a yeast infection or bacterial or if it matters."_


I would get the dog to a derm vet. 

Derm is a specialty for a reason. It's much too big a field to expect GP vets to know much past the simple stuff, and there is an underlying reason for recurring ear infections.

I've poured a load of $$ down the black hole of derm issues and a GP vet trying everything in his or her ken (years ago), and I know better now. The sticker shock shouldn't keep you from looking at what you have already spent (in money and frustration and dog misery) and ended up nowhere. 

I sympathize to the max, and I offer my best advice: specialist.


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## Nicole Stark (Jul 22, 2009)

Indeed. That was certainly the case with one of my dogs, with the one I mentioned above that wasn't the case. I don't believe I ever got to the core of the issue but I do know that with regular maintenance his ears otherwise appeared to be in good condition, which I was certainly glad for.


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## Connie Sutherland (Mar 27, 2006)

Nicole Stark said:


> Indeed. That was certainly the case with one of my dogs, with the one I mentioned above that wasn't the case. I don't believe I ever got to the core of the issue but I do know that with regular maintenance his ears otherwise appeared to be in good condition, which I was certainly glad for.


Yes. 

But Laura is looking at years' of it, if I'm reading it right, with no improvement.

I feel her pain. :sad:


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## susan tuck (Mar 28, 2006)

Laura Bollschweiler said:


> I haven't seen much success with getting the ears upright after a hematoma, etc. there is something like a screen the vet can install (?) in the ear to make it stand. I have heard there is a vet around here that is the go-to guy for this. But I don't know anyone who has actually done it....
> 
> Laura



PermaStay Ear Implants:

http://www.neuticles.com/permastay.php

I don't know anyone either. You could always call the company for referrals.


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## Nicole Stark (Jul 22, 2009)

Connie Sutherland said:


> Yes.
> 
> But Laura is looking at years' of it, if I'm reading it right, with no improvement.
> 
> I feel her pain. :sad:


Absolutely. I should clarify though, my post didn't quote who or what I was responding to which was Patricia's comments about there being some relationship to thyriod dificiencies.

What Laura describes can be a miserably long road and as you pointed out, expensive.


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## susan tuck (Mar 28, 2006)

Zakia Days said:


> My female had a hematoma develop on her ear a few months ago. Vet lanced it and put little plastic stands in there to hold it up. She has since has the stitches and materials removed, but the ear is flopping. It's still lumpy inside (scar tissue/healing). Is there any way I can assist it to standing position? Should I massage it or just leave it be? Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.


Aside from PermaStay ear implants, (http://www.neuticles.com/permastay.php), there's also a surgical technique called "stringing" which apparently is used sometimes on failed ear crops. You may want to talk to some of the people who have those breeds, (dobies, boxers, great danes, etc.) to get a lead on a good ear doc.. Probably would be the most knowledgeable with regards to helping you get the ear to stand.


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## Laura Bollschweiler (Apr 25, 2008)

Connie Sutherland said:


> _
> I would get the dog to a derm vet.
> 
> Derm is a specialty for a reason. It's much too big a field to expect GP vets to know much past the simple stuff, and there is an underlying reason for recurring ear ._


_

Ya know, that's a good idea. Like I said, vet is coming tomorrow and since he's three she will probably want to test thyroid. She's big on that. I think she's tested every one of my dogs at some point. 

I will ask around for a specialist. Recently someone told me it was the honest kitchen preference that was causing it. According to him dogs don't need vegetables. Didn't makes sense since he had ear problems on kibble before I got him.

The ACV worked. But like anything I've tried, if I skip doing it for a few days, bam. Luckily he's learned to like getting his ears messed with. He hated it at first.

Thanks for the suggestions and I appreciate the commiseration! Poor dog.

Laura_


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## susan tuck (Mar 28, 2006)

Hey good luck, Laura. I've been down that bad ear road too, completely sucks.


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## Karen M Wood (Jun 23, 2012)

Have you tried flushing the ear with "Swimmer's ear" medicated fluids? Sometimes there a big nasty chunk of goo lodged in the bottom of the are canal. Swimmer's ear helps to dry the ear and if you flush the ear and let him shake a lot of times that chunk of goo will come flying out. (usually on you!) 
Something i used on dogs with "Cocker ear" was malasab. It's anti fungal, anti bacterial, and helps to break out the accumulated junk. Because nothing is grosser then a cocker with infected ears.  
I don't know of anything really that will fix a hetoma damaged ear. One of my dogs got one but she had hound ears so it healed normal and was still floppy. But i've seen them get ignored and the ear crumples.

Will a floppy ear kill you? Is it a show dog? Or can you live with he had perfect ears and now one is messed up a little? If it were me i'd not bother it any more. Already had enough damage.
K


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## Zakia Days (Mar 13, 2009)

Karen M Wood said:


> Have you tried flushing the ear with "Swimmer's ear" medicated fluids? Sometimes there a big nasty chunk of goo lodged in the bottom of the are canal. Swimmer's ear helps to dry the ear and if you flush the ear and let him shake a lot of times that chunk of goo will come flying out. (usually on you!)
> Something i used on dogs with "Cocker ear" was malasab. It's anti fungal, anti bacterial, and helps to break out the accumulated junk. Because nothing is grosser then a cocker with infected ears.
> I don't know of anything really that will fix a hetoma damaged ear. One of my dogs got one but she had hound ears so it healed normal and was still floppy. But i've seen them get ignored and the ear crumples.
> 
> ...


Trust me, its no biggie. The dog works just fine, except now when she swims, she swims with her head cocked to that side. I have no issues with it flopping. It just adds to her life story and character. I will love her floppy or pointy. Thanks all for the suggestions and remarks.


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## patricia powers (Nov 14, 2010)

when i ordered dog food last week, i also ordered dr harvey's ear wash. its herbal. i used it yesterday & today on my 2 problem dogs & they seem to be much more comfortable. i won't delude myself into thinking its a miracle or will cure their problems, but if it really does make them more comfortable that's something in my book. i will keep using it for a while & then check back in to let you know the results.
pjp


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## Hunter Allred (Jan 28, 2010)

My bitch has had a chronic infection for a year in one ear... Nothing at vet fixed it. Used zymox off amazon and in one week it's gone, a few months ago when she was under for dental stuff the dr cleaned and analyzed the gunk that was out of my reach and it was completely void of microbes. Haven't had an issue since. Zymox worked a miracle for me. Heard about it from a friend who's Gsd was scratching his ears bloody and bald. Read the reviews as well

http://www.amazon.com/Pet-King-Enzy...?ie=UTF8&qid=1373666476&sr=8-1&keywords=Zymox


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## rick smith (Dec 31, 2010)

i'll add another vote for zymox too
used it on many dogs i've worked with; pricks and floppies 

wish i could get it here locally....and wish i could get our navy base vet clinic to stock it :-(


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## patricia powers (Nov 14, 2010)

i have used zymox, too. it did seem to help make them comfortable, but obviously it did not get rid of the problem as i am still fighting it.  pjp


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